Topic: Everything points out to Massively disappointing E3

@MarcelRguez Can I ask where you're getting this info? Because I've been looking for Xeno2 news everywhere and haven't found anything, and I want to follow development along.

This all depends on what you want an expect. I want to see how ports of nba 2k and steep perform on Switch. I would like to see a military FPS shooter. Hopefully pikmin 4 is there. I am doubting smash after them releases so many fighters this year's. Basically my expectations have been lowered to the lowest level.

@Monado_X For A-list games they usually have Treehouse scriptwriting in tandem with the main development and in communication with main development. Previously Xenoblade was treated as B-list but this time it was announced with a console reveal and is very likely A-list. If so, localization is likely done whenever the main game is done. Kimishima doubled down on assuring 2017 worldwide at the last investors meeting, so they seem pretty confident in no delay (which surprised me.) That could change, but Kimishima doesn't strike me as a guy that plays loose with assured statements in front of investors (like Iwata was... ) He's a banker and sticks with facts.

I think people look at the 3rd party culture on other consoles and try to compare Nintendo releases against that unfairly. Nintendo's presentation will include nothing but games Nintendo is publishing, with possibly the exception of COD if they have a contract for Nintendo to promote and possibly some Square RPGs if they're coming to Nintendo platforms. Microsofts show will contain whatever exclusive games Microsoft has lined up. Sony show will consist of Sony games, plus indies that are trotted out on stage to pretend they have a PS4 exclusive only to tweet the next day that it's really multiplat...it will include games that are in the planning stage and might vaporize long before release, and may or may not make it out in time for PS6, and will include games that are not in planning, but will be launching a kickstarter soon so Sony can use their $320M stadium show to ask their audience to donate money to third party developers. It'll be entertaining, but when you parse what goes on at a Sony show, no matter how much of a fan you may be, you realize how much hot air there is out there in that stadium. Sony's a marketing kingpin. Always has been. They're not on that stage to sell you ANY games. Or even hardware. They're on the stage to sell the Playstation brand.

But for ALL of them, anything third party happens at the other company's shows. Not in the Spotlight, or Sony's Flying Circus. If Assassin's Creed: We Remembered What The Game's About Edition is announced on Switch or PS4 it will be at Ubi's show. If Octopath, or DQ11, or Theatrhythm or whatever is announced on any platform it will be at one of Square's daily shows. Somehow people think whatever happens in the 30 minute spotlight is everything Nintendo has, in part because of the WiiU generation, but even for 3DS there were outside announcements.

@MarcelRguez Ah, ok. I don't check Neogaf, so that would make sense, if it were there.

@NEStalgia: Agreed. Sony can put on a show, but there was very little substance last year that wasn't at least two years out. Last Guardian, Horizon got release dates, one of which was delayed, but we'd already known about those. RE VII was a nice surprise, I'll give them that. PS VR is a flop. A re-release of PS1 games, COD is your yearly BS. God of War, Death Stranding, Spiderman and Days Gone, their big titles, don't have any release dates, or windows besides 2017/2018. I don't see them surprising anyone this year, since we already know most of what they're going to show. Last of Us 2, Destiny 2, Battlefront 2, COD, the four games I listed from last year. I don't see them pulling anything else out.

@NEStalgia

Had a long post and closed my browser window.

Short summary.

Your list of games before Jan 1 2018 is false hopes. MANY of those games are not hitting the shelves this year, Xeno being absolute certainty of 2018 or even 2019 release.

Your "rumors" of Fractured But Whole or COD are even larger false hopes borderlining on lunacy.

I do hope that Steep comes but might not. Hopefully it does.

What comes to stealing the thunder from EA and others. You either underestimate the longevity of any news in this world or the significance of the Publishers you mentioned. Thinking that people would be writing and talking about Pokemon at the end of this week still is just ludicrous.

"New" Pokemon mainline games are a big deal. One of the biggest in gaming. But if you read reddit Pokemon subthread or other Pokemon forums you already see that the negativity towards having a) Not real sequel but hashed out cash grabber b) Switch announcement of any kind for mainline Pokemon game is mounting in a large way.

Thinking that this was masterful timing for a direct is wishful thinking. This was damage control just like the online delay announcement.

@NaviAndMii Absolutely. People seem to have the mentality, probably created by the western AAA's that games have a shelf life like films in a theater. It releases and then the next month it's old, in the clearance bin and ready to be replaced. The western model of "games as movies" makes that a reality. But applied to Nintendo that really doesn't work out well. This bucket of 2017 games includes a bunch of games, and they're mostly all huge games, either never-ending online games like Splatoon, or colossal RPGs. Just because they RELEASE all the games by end of 2017 doesn't mean everyone can buy all $800+ of games all at once and have them played by Jan one, ready for more. That mentality is just kind of weird. Most "serious" gamers have huge backlogs as it is. And then complain it's not being added to fast enough.

In my mind I'm linking this mentality to some of the OCD mentalities presented in the achievements/trophies thread. Maybe the thrill is just having more games to collect and check off lists than actually looking for games to play

@Monado_X Not sure PS VR is a flop per se. PS Pro is a flop. VR seems to be as much a success as anyone could have imagined it being....niche...so long as they're making money. If Destiny, Battlefront, COD, Spiderman are all in their show that's pretty awful as all are multiplat. They could tease PS5 but I don't think they will. Some rumors that to me don't seem credible suggested a Switch competitor handheld.....I don't see them dumping money into the R&D for that at the moment. Days Gone and GoW were their heavy hitters last year....I wonder if they'll make it this year. If you're showing the same game at 2 E3's you're doing it wrong. The whole point of E3 was a showcase to retailers, partners, and consumers what your'e bringing out for Christmas. That's all E3 was ever supposed to be. Extending it is one thing, but bringing the same things multiple years is just crazy. But darn, Sony can still make it seem fun, even if it's all meaningless

Death Stranding......I'd be STUNNED if that made it in time as a PS5 launch title let alone PS4. This is Kojima. It'll take 8 years and another $500M before it's ready. All we have so far is a weird nonsensical live action trailer.

@MarcelRguez

Yes.

That is awesome.

It is absolutely not releasing this year.

Absolutely not.

@Timppis I need to ask you a question. It's an honest one. Are you not looking forward to Treehouse or are you not that in to games and you prefer the instant gratification of announcements more?

@Timppis Xeno2 isn't getting delayed to 2019. That's lunacy. They're nearly done with the game, or they wouldn't be recording music and working on localization. And I don't see the list @NEStalgia put out as false hopes. Mario Odyssey is literally finished. They're waiting for Christmas to completely take up the market and to have enough systems out there for it to do extremely well. Splatoon and Arms aren't getting delayed. Pokken and Rabbids make small launches in August/September, when games don't usually release anyway. Sonic Mania hits the summer. Not sure if Forces will make it. Skyrim is a fall release. FE Warriors will hit in September/October. Don't know about COD. Anyway, that's close to a dozen AAA games. Better than anything Sony or Microsoft put out in their first years, and that's only 9 months of the Switch's life cycle. Xeno2 and Forces are the only games I see being delayed, possibly. With recent news, I don't see Xeno getting delayed.

We'll have to see who dominates social media as E3 approaches. Zelda alone stole the show last year and killed everything else once it was revealed. It could happen again. I believe the ARMS Direct, coupled with this direct, was to move things out of the way for the big hitter at this E3.

@NEStalgia I see VR as a fad anyway, but who knows, it may take off. Spiderman is an exclusive, I believe, but everything else you listed as a multiplat is that, despite Sony trying to say otherwise with their marketing deals. Death Stranding is vaporware until I see gameplay. If it weren't for Kojima, this "game" would be buried. I don't see the hype for it.

I see Sony as KISS and Nintendo as Carlos Santana. Odd comparison if you don't really know the artists. KISS is all about the theatrics and the show, but their music isn't that great. Carlos Santana has a quote that says "Kiss are performers; I'm a musician." Nintendo isn't trying to make a scene. They quietly announce their best, and then their fans spread it and it has an effect on social media and spreads like wildfire. They know how to do it and leave most people satisfied.

@Timppis Ok, so you won't believe the people on this forum, nor the CEO of the company, nor the status of aspects of the game from the development team. The company is affirming 2017 worldwide. If there is an unforseen delay that could jeopardize it to early 2018. Where are you getting your expectations of 2019 and your certainty that absolutely everyone from top down is incorrect and you are correct? Do you have additional information about development delays?

COD and Fractured But Whole are indeed vague rumors that may or may not turn out true. COD's rumor came about because Nintendo Account logins can be linked to the new COD accounts. It could be oversight, but it tends to indicated a potential connection. Fractured But Whole is either or based on the rumor. Steep is already confirmed. The rumor says that Steep will be pulled but replaced with FBW. Either way we get one or the other. The issue with Steep is the possibility it's a persistent online world, making it a bad fit for a portable console. But if the rumor is false then that means the original Steep announcement remains in place.

As for Pokemon, it's simply the biggest franchise in gaming. And #2 behind only Mario in total franchise sales. yes, people will be talking about it. Investors will be talking about it a lot. Don't forget E3 isn't a consumer expo, it's a trade expo, for investors and partners first, consumers last.

@NEStalgia Reading that Sony flying circus and assassin's creed bit was hilarious.

@NEStalgia It's obviously worked. Nintendo stock prices have rose to just over $40 a share today, partly because of the Direct, I'm sure. Nintendo hasn't been this valuable since the Wii era. @Timppis They know what they're doing.

@NEStalgia I'm willing to bet his expectations for 2019 are coming solely from Xenoblade X. I've seen a lot of people trying to use that game as a precedent.

Problem is, the circumstances of that game's development versus Xenoblade 2's make it impossible to use the former as precedence. With XCX, they were still learning the ropes of HD development, the game supposedly had a shift in direction mid-development, and they did a TON of experimenting. Xenoblade 2 is a more straightforward story driven game that seems to be a distant sequel to an established game and therefore set in an established world with a less demanding art style.

It shouldn't take anywhere near as much time to develop.

@MarcelRguez

I will bake a cake (delicious) that will say that I was a massive jackass and I humbly apologize to all if Xeno 2 is released this year. This I promise.

@NEStalgia

No. I won't believe them about this particular game because of the franchises history and Nintendos (good) policy of polishing their main line games instead of releasing them as scheduled.

@Monado_X

I have absolutely no problem with the stock price rising. Means more wealth for me But the grim fact is that they take as fast as they giveth.

And businesswise we can't honestly say that Nintendo has always been on money. I do believe that Switch has a good chance of success but this years E3 will not be helping in that.

Except of course for Mario. He's a winner always.

@Timppis That's where I disagree with you. The only people who watch E3 are the most hardcore of the hardcore. Average consumers don't. They don't look at stuff like this, or watch Directs. They see the games online on Amazon or on advertisements, or in the store, and then decide to buy it then. They don't look at Nintendo's E3 performance or "hype." They see games and they buy them. And Nintendo has the games.

cool! i can play free online for longer. and not worry about paid yearly for it yet! (which i am interested in doing.)

that why i keep my expectation low.

you could say the same for other backlash Nintendo Games: Paper Mario: Color Splash, Animal Crossing: Amiibo Festival, Mario Tennis: Ultra Smash., Metroid Prime: FF... the list goes on!

who knows what Nintendo is up to. it could be good. it could be bad. guess will have to wait and see.

A 30 minute presentation is absolutely fine for showing off short, concise trailers! After that, we've got days of treehouse time to have an in depth look at whatever is nearing release! And f it, if worst comes to worst, at least we'll get a shed load of Odyssey footage and details! And that's fine by me.

Has everyone forgotten about the Arms & Splatoon 2 Direct? (not the Arms Direct)
If they did it like that again, 30 minutes would be perfectly fine.

I hope that's the norm from now on. Have two big games to focus, and then run through the rest. That would be nice.