Nintendo has created some truly amazing controllers over the past three decades, from the ergonomic SNES pad with its industry-defining four-button cluster and shoulder buttons to the groundbreaking Wii remote. It might sounds a little like hyperbole to suggest that the new Switch Pro Controller tops all of these in terms of being a pleasure to cradle in your hands (oo-er), but that's certainly the case from our perspective.
An evolution of the excellent Wii U Pro Controller, the Switch variant retains the basic shape and input layout, save for the fact that the face buttons and right-hand analogue stick have swapped positions. This makes the pad feel more akin to the Xbox 360 / Xbox One controller, which is no bad thing in our book.
The face buttons are noticeably larger than those on the Wii U Pro Controller, making them easier to hit, while the shoulder buttons have been redesigned, with ZL and ZR now featuring a "lip" which makes them easier to rest your index fingers on. The Pro Controller is the only first-party Switch input device to feature a traditional eight-way D-Pad, which should make it popular when Ultra Street Fighter II hits the market. We got to play a bit of Capcom's fighter at a recent press day in London and it's certainly works best with this controller. The D-Pad is precise and comfortable to use, and its textured surfaces means that sweaty thumbs are less likely to slip off – a common issue we found with the more shiny Wii U Pro Controller. [Update: Also of note is that the controller has motion control support (like the Joy-Con controllers), HD Rumble and even the ability to scan amiibo. It's the full package.]
The front of the pad features the "plus" and "minus" buttons, as well as "Home" and "Capture". On the top is the USB Type-C charging port, which can also be used to instantly pair the pad with your Switch console. Next to this is the sync button for when you want to pair the controller with another Switch system. Battery life is absolutely stunning; we've been using the controller since the Switch arrived in the office and have only had to charge it once. To cap it all off, the smoky-black transparent casing looks gorgeous, while the slightly textured prongs give more purchase than the glossy ones on the Wii U edition.
The lack of analogue shoulder triggers is a shame, as is the price of the controller itself. Despite these issues, this may well end up being an essential purchase for any self-respecting Switch owner. It's certainly a step up from the Joy-Con + Grip combination; while that's still a great way to play, it's not as comfortable as the Pro Controller and lacks that all-important D-Pad. If you're planning on using your TV as your main Switch gameplay option, then this is a must-have – even more so if you're looking forward to the likes of Street Fighter II.
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Comments 211
I'd give it an 8 or 9/10. Minus marks for no analogue triggers and for putting amiibo functionality in it. Also, no headphone jack. Crazy expensive too.
https://youtu.be/CASGNmf0Pec
no analogue triggers is a huge letdown. one of the best innovations in controller design IMO. really helps with immersion in racing games and shooters. the bigger the triggers, the better!
I'd give it an n/10 where 'n' is my review score because I haven't used it enough to come to an informed opinion.
Let me know what you think in the comments below.
@Sean161 @6ch6ris6 @SLIGEACH_EIRE Another feature that's not talked about in the article, is that it can connect to your PC through Bluetooth for use on there. Similar to the way Xbox controllers have been used.
The only issue for me is the price. I can't drop £60 on a controller.
Just another accessory for Nintendo to make money on.
I am torn as to wait or get one when I pick up my system. The price is killing me! But I do have to admit that it looks mighty comfortable....
@Sean161 I don't think a lot of people worry about that. Most people usually look at the available games, not what triggers it uses.
$70, though...!
Price will always put me off this.
Nintendo : Lets make a really Cheap console, but charge loads for all the accessories you need to play it.
@Bunkerneath @Dr_Corndog A lot is packed in there, NPC scanner, HD rumble, Gyroscope, and the ability to connect to your PC for gaming online.
@Nintendoforlife It has native PC support? That's surprising for that to be available out of the box for a Nintendo controller.
@Ernest_The_Crab I am just as surprised as you are, it's an added bonus for gamers looking to use their controllers on their PC's as well as consoles.
https://youtu.be/y3ofL4lE_ZA
I have tested to play splatoon with it on a preview event and it was the most comfortable controller ever.
@Sean161 There will be some racers, but yeah, probably not any where you can adjust the speed of your vehicle, which is a bummer. I'm just holding out hope that they release a JoyCon set with analogue triggers in the future.
I kniw its been said several times already, but no analogue triggers is simply stupid. Nintendo know that people want GC VC yet without analogue triggers a fair few games will be gimped at best and simply impossible at worst (eg, mario sunshines water spray mechanic). If this controller had analogue triggers im fairly certain i would praise it as the best controller ever made. But as usual Nintendo take one step forward and several leaps backwards.
Anyone waiting for an amateur controller instead?
The controller itself looks really awesome, but bloody hell that price is waaay too steep. I would love to have one, but man, going to stick with the Joy-cons as long as the price stays on that level.
I will say though, whats everyones deal with the price? Its fine! A dual shock 4 is £55. The pro is £60. Hardly a deal breaker for an extra fiver!
@Bengals76 Surely the point of selling anything is to make money on it?
Not that I don't wish the Pro was cheaper - £50 feels more reasonable - but criticising Nintendo for the act of making money by selling things seems to be overlooking some business fundamentals.
Of course, we're not a business, we're consumers. Businesses want our money, we want their products at good value for money; there's a balance.
But demanding that Nintendo simply doesn't make money from its products is perhaps pushing that balance a bit far.
I find it pretty ugly in it's current form. Where's the colour? I don't plan on getting one unless there's an offer on. But the compatibility with PCs is a bonus, so that could help sway me at some point.
Looks cool, now it would be nice if I could actually buy it. Like everything else nintendo puts out its sold out everywhere.
This controller looks stunning every high res picture I see of it. The WiiU Pro was easily the best controller ever made (short of the Wavebird, of course), and managed to best even the X360 controller on account of the dramatically lower weight and long battery life (and the fact that the sticks don't shred themselves in 3 months.) But almost no games were able to USE the darned thing.
This looks better, again, in every way. Too bad they're impossible to find! Maybe I'll be able to sneak in a purchase on the way home on launch day....maybe....
@SLIGEACH_EIRE
Agreed. As a frequent streamer and video uploader, the lack of a headphone jack + the Switch not supporting bluetooth headsets worries me a little.
I'd like to hear how this phone app will work with voice chat and commentary.
@Tuulenpoika A lot is packed in there, NPC scanner, HD rumble, Gyroscope, and the ability to connect to your PC for gaming online.
I find it baffling that Nintendo have only used analogue triggers for one of their consoles, the gamecube. I don't get why they're so allergic to them, considering they pretty much started and standardised every other controller innovation going. Is there a 3rd party patent involved? I'm wondering if there's a licence fee involved or something.
@Turbo857 this is a very I portant point and I feel everyone is avoiding it!
People complaining about this controller being expensive must have never had to buy an extra controller for their Xbox One, or maybe they've forgotten the launch prices of ALL controllers, because even though they are somewhat cheaper now, the official PS4 controllers were of a similar price, and the Switch controllers contain almost twice as much tech, so the price is more than warranted for what you get in return.
It is true that the lack of analog triggers is a big let-down, so that easily detracts 1 or 2 points of what would have otherwise been an almost perfect score for a controller.
And it is indeed possible to pair it with a PC or laptop as well:
@SLIGEACH_EIRE It's really a head scratcher to me. I'm sure i'll end up with one eventually (Specifically for the D-Pad) but why in the world would they not include analogue triggers? Especially at this price point! Glad to hear it is at least a high quality product.
@KirbyTheVampire While that's true, it certainly is a disappointment at this price point. Analogue triggers would have made this feel slightly more premium (My opinion of course) as well as opening up additional options for developers. Is it a huge deal? Not really. But I don't understand why the joy-con/pro controller would lack such a simple feature in the first place.
@Turbo857 You know, that's a good point. I'll miss the headphone jack on the GamePad (and PS4.) I've setup really high quality wireless home headphone systems for my consoles (not quite audiophile grade but close) and they work beautifully so it won't affect me at home, but on the go, BT audio was something I was really counting on getting. I assumed the controllers were eating the BT bandwidth and made it not possible, but now that you mention it, if the phone thing works over BT, that wouldn't be right. Maybe phone just works over WiFi. We find out in 2 days I guess since online gets patched in day 1. So weird we don't know already though.
There IS one issue I hadn't thought of with BT audio. LATENCY. Bluetooth is laggy like crazy, at least A2DP. Vita supports BT audio, and yes, there's latency. In time critical games that's very bad. AptX fixes that (somewhat) but that would mean licensing another codec which Nintendo loathes to do.....maybe we're best with wired cans if we don't want to get killed all the time
Preordered two...
@roadrunner343 Agreed. I really don't see why those weren't included. If it was a matter of pricing or something, they should have just gotten rid of the IR sensor. No one would have shed a single tear over the loss of that.
@ThanosReXXX You just don't understand. All new products must be cheaper than all older competing products. How could Nintendo be so stupid to release a brand new product for MORE money than Sony's old product? That's just stupid talk.
Can't wait for PS5 at $249.99. Can't make it more expensive that Switch will be in 5 years!
@NEStalgia Indeed...
@KirbyTheVampire Yup. I wouldn't think it's cost related either - just look at the myriad of cheap android controllers with analogue triggers. Electronic components are so cheap these days, that I can't think of a good reason to not use them. At the same time, it feels like a very intentional omission by Nintendo, so what do I know =D
I'd like one of these.....not sure when I will get one though. Lack of analog triggers is a head scratcher, Nintendo probably wanted some unity between pro and joy con and on some level that provably makes sense but for some games analog would have been a good option
@SLIGEACH_EIRE Minus for no analogue I get, but for amiibo functionality...?
@KirbyTheVampire
"I don't think a lot of people worry about that. Most people usually look at the available games, not what triggers it uses."
No analogue triggers rules out any car racing games!
My judging:
Shape = 8 of 10
But I want White color.
No analog triggers? What an absolute joke!
I love Nintendo but this is so lame. WOW
@KirbyTheVampire @roadrunner343 Might also have something to do with space restrictions, weird as that may sound. Analog triggers aren't just buttons placed on the outside: there's obviously some tech behind it and there needs to be room left in the controller casing to be able to place that inside. Maybe all the motors for rumble and haptic force feedback and so on simply take up all the space inside already, who knows?
Don't know if that's a possible reason, but until some tech site opens up one of these controllers, we won't be entirely sure. I do think that it could be a reason for the Joy-Con not to have them, since these are pretty small to begin with, so it's actually quite a miracle that it contains the same tech as the Pro Controller.
Pearls of wisdom:
https://www.reddit.com/r/NintendoSwitch/comments/5pbsdu/nintendo_switch_controller_prices_arent_as_bad_as/
How do the buttons feel? I couldn't use the Wii-U pro controller for long periods because the buttons felt like I was pressing against steel. The Dualshock 4 (my current favorite) compared to the Wii-U pro was like the difference between the give of a real keyboard and typing on a tablet's rock hard surface.
@Marshi but DualShock 4 is under £40 on Amazon
@ThanosReXXX A valid point. I've ripped apart my fair share of controllers, and while they don't take up too much space, it is possible they would not have fit in the joy-con. And honestly, I would prefer both controllers have the same features (Even if it means missing analogue triggers) than to only have the pro controller have analogue triggers. But then, why was the Wii U Tablet/Pro Controller missing that feature, where space clearly wasn't a primary concern? Feel like Nintendo just being stubborn to me. Will be interesting to see a complete teardown of the hardware.
The article mentions the benefit of textured grips on the Switch Pro Controller vs the "slippery"/smooth surface of the Wii U Pro Controller, but that's only on the face side of the controller; the underside is also textured, and I have no problems whatsoever holding it for longer play sessions.
Lack of headphone jack, what about maybe those bluetooth dongles that convert any 3.5 mm headphone jack into a Bluetooth headset. That might work for some people! It charges via USB, so you could plug it in to the switchs headphone socket, and also a USB port for power. Might be an issue when not wanting to use headphones as you might have to switch it off/unplug it etc. https://www.amazon.co.uk/Bluetooth-Receiver-Streaming-compatible-Smartphone/dp/B01IOIKLU8/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1488381472&sr=8-1&keywords=mini+jack+to+bluetooth
@roadrunner343 No idea, maybe just because it was an evolution of the Wii controllers, which also didn't have them.
Strangely enough, the first generation of Wii Classic Controllers actually DID have analog shoulder buttons (no triggers), but in the Pro versions, it was removed for reasons unknown.
Old one with analog:
@NEStalgia
Yeah, I understand latency being a reason why the Switch doesn't support bluetooth headsets. But including a share button in Switch controllers that will eventually enable streaming to Twitch etc. without at least including a headphone jack on these controllers is a strange omission.
I'm still excited for the Switch regardless but they should address this issue pretty soon.
@SLIGEACH_EIRE You're taking away a mark FOR including a functionality?
Never found analog shoulder buttons to be of any use, so don't mind that it's missing.
I'll stick with the Joy-Con grip for now... I'll probably be using the Switch undocked fairly frequently anyway, so I'll probably get used to them in no time.
If I do get the pro controller, it won't be any time soon and won't be unless I feel I really need it... I just don't think it warrants the price at the moment.
@Turbo857 Interesting point about streaming. I suppose they figure a long extension cable to the headphone jack would work. Though I suppose more importantly, if you're docked and streaming, setting up a BT transmitter either in the headphone jack or, more likely from your HT receiver/TV probably makes more sense. There's a lot of solutions when docked, though I agree I miss at least having the headphone jack (that was one of my big draws to WiiU & PS4.) But when handheld and on the go is when BT really matters.
@halljames yeah those are definitely an issue. There's two types. There are ones that are just little dongles, but I don't like those for handheld devices. They have a tall metal collar on an extended 3.5mm jack and extend pretty large. It gives much too large of a fulcrum to rip out the headphone jack of the device if accidentally bumped the wrong way.
The other type with the batteries are nice, but then you're back to having a wire running from your Switch to the transmitter at which point, it's probably easier and better to just wear wired headphones rather than have to charge a Switch, BT transmitter, AND headphones versus just charging the Switch, and ending up managing a wire anyway.
BUT I may end up doing that for my bone conductor headphones since I love how open those are for hearing the world around me and they work ONLY in BT.
@SLIGEACH_EIRE Having a personal vendetta against Amiibo isn't a negative point on this controller.
@ThanosReXXX Thank you for reporting the PC support... yeah I have to get one now.
I'm still confused why the left joy con didn't have a d-pad. The points can still be used as a conventional button press in 2-player portable mode.
Everyone's complaining about missing analog triggers, and there's really only two reasons for analog triggers: GCN VC, and racing. I've yet to find other games that have really used them. The thing is the only console that's ever actually done analog triggers correctly is the GCN. And they took a lot of space (remember the deep press, meaning tons of range on the fader?) You have to fit the springs and everything in there to accommodate the range of motion. PS4 and XB1 have analog, but honestly they're useless and might as well not be. They don't have sufficient range of motion and don't really control much of anything. Anyone serious about racing games is going to be using a wheel, and anyone not serious about racing games probably won't notice the difference.
I think analog was the big gimmick for GCN like HD Rumble is here, and it didn't really take off like they hoped so they ditched it. It would be cool to have, but not if it adds too much bulk or weight. Especially in the Joycon. And we wouldn't want the Pro to not be the same as the Joy.
@HalBailman Whoever got stuck with the D-Pad Joy would always have a disadvantage in most competitive games. D-pads don't actuate like their face button counterparts. D-pad got sacrificed for local 2-player. It makes sense, it's unfortunate for some games, but since local multi is one of the pillars of Switch and not too many games are D-Pad dependent anymore except fighting games and older platformers (newer ones are designed for sticks) it was a sensible, if frustrating, tradeoff.
@HalBailman
"I'm still confused why the left joy con didn't have a d-pad. The points can still be used as a conventional button press in 2-player portable mode."
Pressing two buttons simultaneously would be cumbersome.
@BornInNorway81 @chardir Yes of course it is. Now. But how much was it when the ps4 was first released? And how old is the nintendo switch again? Exactly.
I might get it for my PC when it's €25 instead of €70. (Will likely never happen)
Lots of positives and a few negatives for me here. Not having analog shoulder buttons is a big head-scratcher, not necessarily a deal-breaker considering how much of a must-buy I consider this to be. We may not see racing sims on the Switch, but there are other examples where one would need analogs up there. In the end though, I doubt I'll ever miss em, it's just something lots of us are accustomed to but aren't necessary the vast majority of the time.
That aside, having a headphone jack on the controller itself is one of my favorite things about competitors' controllers seeing as how I have to keep quiet during my gaming time so as not to wake the little one.
I've lived without these things in the past and in the end it's not a huge deal to me. I'm still excited about finally getting my hands on all things Switch!
Actually, the GameCube-style Pro-Classic controllers for Wii/WiiU feature the analogue preasure sensative Lz & Rz trigger buttons, but no game really used the preasure sensative part like on GameCube.
Plus pressing them all the way constantly for them to register was kinda annoying.
Is there really no headphone jack? What a bummer.
I've already paid for mine. I was going to get an extra set of Joy-Con but decided I'd go for the Pro Controller instead for two reasons: Reason one being the D-Pad, and reason two being that I'm hoping the cable that comes with it also can be used to charge the Switch. If it does then I think the price is fair.
No analogue triggers is just silly though. It's kinda like Nintendo are like 'well, that's not one of OUR controller innovations so we'll ignore that.'
Also I hope they release a Joy-Con with a D-Pad one day.
I'll pick one of these up when the conroller isnt see through. It's ugly as hell and would love a solid black matte finish or a bright white one.
@Nintendoforlife
I saw the video, which makes me wonder that, if the pro controller can sync with a PC, can the joy-cons? It's certainly something I'll be trying out.
No analog doesn't bother me too much, seeing as I don't play racing Sims, but it would have been nifty. I hear that analog triggers would have used up the battery faster, perhaps they were just trying to make the battery last longer.
I suppose they could always just release ANOTHER controller that has analog, though people would say it was just a way to get more money from people.
@OfNullAndVoid What an interesting idea
@KirbyTheVampire a lot of what we complained about with the Wii U (feature wise) was listened to by Nintendo and fixed with Switch. We need to make more noise about the triggers and External hdd support .
Eshop preview is out Ladies and Gents: https://youtube.com/watch?v=8JV8v7WC6Ck
@Nintendoforlife Loving the shared wallet. I toss eshop cards on my account every payday so this is a great way to have a surprise shopping spree after a month or two.
I got to try one at a convention and I love it, don't care much for analog triggers though. We got them with Dreamcast and GameCube controllers and I hardly ever care for them.
@Ryu_Niiyama Same here, I wouldn't be surprised if an EShop app was created to connect Console, Handheld, and Mobile devices together. Basically being able to buy BOTW on the EShop from your phone. As well as buying Nintendo apps from the shop with Eshop gift cards.
It looks like a nice controller and I did have one pre-orderd, but then I started asking myself why and I had no good answer.
I'll hang on till street fighter comes out (maybe May) and hopefully they will bundle the game with a controller then for a slightly lower price when I will actually need it
Alas, I'm not a self-respecting Switch user. XD I COULD eventually consider this, provided it's usable in tabletop mode, but it's not something I see myself needing most of the time. Still, an impressive piece of tech for sure.
Looks awesome can't wait to use it
@SLIGEACH_EIRE Not that crazy expensive. I mean look at the competition. The Xbox One controllers sell at an MSRP of $59.99 to $69.99 for the ocean blue or crimson red controller only. I'm not comparing the Elite controller here. But these use standard batteries which require replacement cost or extra cost in rechargeable. Sure you can buy the charge and play kit, but that's extra cost further driving up the controller cost.
http://www.bestbuy.com/site/searchpage.jsp?cp=1&searchType=search&st=xbox%20one%20controller&_dyncharset=UTF-8&id=pcat17071&type=page&sc=Global&nrp=&sp=&qp=brand_facet%3DBrand~Microsoft%5Econdition_facet%3DCondition~New%5Efeaturesdynamic_facet%3DProduct%20Features~Wireless&list=n&af=true&iht=y&usc=All%20Categories&ks=960&keys=keys
The PS4 Dual Shock 4 also ranges from $59.99 to $64.99 at MSRP (what we are comparing the Switch Pro controller against).
http://www.bestbuy.com/site/searchpage.jsp?cp=1&searchType=search&st=dual%20shock%204&_dyncharset=UTF-8&id=pcat17071&type=page&sc=Global&nrp=&sp=&qp=brand_facet%3DBrand~Sony%5Ebatterysize_facet%3DBattery%20Size~Rechargeable%20Battery&list=n&af=true&iht=y&usc=All%20Categories&ks=960&keys=keys
I have a few DS4 controllers including the new model and they last around 3 to 5 hours, the Switch Pro controller lasts 40 hours.
In my opinion the though $70 MSRP is a much better value than other controllers on the market today. Plus with features not offered by others like HD Rumble, NFC amiibo scanning, and improved gyroscopes make it a great value for what is on offer.
It's ugly.
i don't care that much about the analog buttons since most of the games i play don't have a reason to take advantage of them. however Splatoon 2 might be able to make use of analog controls.
in terms of the NFC; nintendo could do a lot more with it. one of my laptops supports NFC and so do some smartphones. because of this Nintendo could make their amiibo figures compatible with non-nintendo systems.
NFC also has many other uses in which they should try to take advantage of. i could list at least 10, but i have a feeling that Nintendo will stick with game play functions for the amiibo figures. maybe Nintendo could branch out a bit and use amiibo figures for logon on purposes for the eShop or something.
I hacked one of my amiibo figures a while back and am now using it as a logon method for my laptop.
Hmm that review is way more positive than I'd expect.
A great controller, that I knew. But 60 euros better than a joy-con pair that gives easy access to multiplayer? I doubt it.
Is it really that much better than a default grip?
@SLIGEACH_EIRE Why would you hold the NFC reader against them????
Just because you won't use it doesn't mean other people like myself won't.
The Switch pro controller looks ugly. I don't know why Nintendo insist on bodging all hardware in some form. The Gamecube controller had analogue triggers for FFS and looked awesome!
The Switch pro controller looks crap, just as the Wii version - atleast Wii U Pro controller had great looks to offset lack of analogue triggers!
@Nintendoforlife You can? Where did you see that you can use it on your PC? That's exciting to me
I'll just wait until a coupon deal from some shop pops up - or I'll buy a used one, if anyone should be 'dumb' enough to sell theirs.
That was the problem with the Wii U Pro Controller - it was so great that no one wanted to sell theirs. But eventually I got a new one for 42€ (35€ + shipping).
@ThanosReXXX Well using Nintendo controllers with a PC was already possible with the Wiimotes and the Wii U Pro Controller - basically with any Nintendo (or Sony) Controller that has Bluetooth.
However, usually you had to install a specific Bluetooth Stack for that.
Now, from the looks of it in that video you posted, it seems like that's not necessary anymore. That would actually be a great improvement!
@stevenw45 How did you do that exactly? Sounds like an interesting method to unlock your personal computer or smartphone.
@leo13 Right here: https://youtu.be/y3ofL4lE_ZA
@mainstream05 He hates amiibo...
Any scope for using GC controllers with an adapter? There are those USB ports.
Good review. I'm actually looking forward to trying it when the switch is in tabletop mode. I've always wanted to play iPad with a controller this way but the ones I've tried on the system have been lacking in quality and reliability.
Anyway, bring it on !
if you want to play zelda in maximum comfort this is the pad.
@FierceRagnar Well we don't know that it isn't wire(able.) I.E. if you plug it into the USB on the dock do we know it's still using BT and not USB? They seem serious about the Smash & Splatoon competitions, at least in Japan....it could be something they considered as they did with the GCN controllers for WiiU.
No thanks. Looks ugly and bulky, like an Xbox controller. Also, hate the layout that makes the D-Pad difficult to access.
Aside from the stupid touch pad and options/share buttons, DS4 is the best controller this gen.
@Nintendoforlife THANK-YOU!!!
Now I'm very excited as I pre-ordered a Pro Controller and now I have a second use for it.
@SLIGEACH_EIRE wait, what? How is integrated amiibo functionality a negative?
@Ralizah DS4 is way better than the DS3 was (that thing was awful) but it's rare to find someone that prefers a DualShock over the XBox controllers....they really nailed the ergonomics (unfortunately what they didn't nail is build quality....they're not very reliable long-term.)
@shani
for starters, it seems as though Microsoft made it so that Windows 10 can use NFC as a method. just look in the user account settings and it should be there. if it is not there, than the build of Windows 10 you are using does not support NFC for logons.
I am not sure if you have noticed but some companies are starting to use NFC as a logon option for security purposes. of course then those companies create their own software so that the NFC devices can be used in that way.
as you probably realize amiibo figures are not setup for use with laptops, desktops, or smartphones. there is a way to change that but it requires you to change the driver set of the NFC reader.
of course then i think you may receive a device or whatever for reading/writing amiibo figure data if you have a Wii U or Nintendo switch developer kit.
from what i noticed the NFC reader that is built into my computer can detect the amiibo figures just fine, but cannot do anything with them because of the firmware/software instructions that are built into them.
with being a hardware and software developer i created an application that can properly read and write date to and from the amiibo figures without any issues. from there, i created another application that adds options to Windows 10 so that the amiibo figures can be used to log onto my laptop.
however, the application that i made has a few glitches. the primary issue that i get every so often is a read/write error on the amiibo figures. that may just be a data type mismatch issues due to compatibility issues between Windows 10 and the operating systems on the 3DS and Wii U.
My only complaint is that the buttons should have the Red/Yellow/Green/Blue colors.
@KidRad "This screams sell out in order to appeal to the more so called adult Crowd including PS4 and Xbox One owners."
You mean the owners that we need to obtain In order to keep afloat?? Nintendo can't rely on us to support them forever, they need to appeal to the mass market.
i don't care for analogue triggers. never found them really useful for anything
@6ch6ris6 more immersive in shooters?! have you ever shot a gun? a clicky trigger is a way more realistic representation for that than an analogue trigger.
Does anyone know if the Wii U pro controller is usable on switch? Or a Wii remote? These might be dumb questions but if true I would be so happy since I'd already have multiple controllers already available to use. (Don't really want to spend $70 extra at the moment)
@gloom not at the moment. but nintendo talked about supporting legacy controllers in an interview..so we'll have to see
@KidRad You keep colors to a limit in order to appeal to the most people. What do you think will sell more? A Yellow or Black controller.
Looks and feels like a Xbox controller.
Dpads in the wrong place. Would of been better if they put it where the analogue left stick is.
The GameCube controller is still better
@SLIGEACH_EIRE why deduct marks for amiibo functionality?
@NEStalgia Xbox pads are too bulky for my tastes. I like the more shapely feel of Dualshock pads. DS4 also has WONDERFUL triggers, comfortable analog sticks, and a GREAT D-Pad that is well-positioned on the controller.
What particularly ruins pads like the 360 and Wii U/Switch Pro controllers is the way they position the D-Pad near the middle section of the controller, which makes them uncomfortable to use.
And it's not like I'm unused to this set-up: I owned a 360 exclusively last gen, and also own a Wii U Pro Controller. I just don't find it comfortable.
Too bad the DS4 has a gimmicky, borderline useless touchpad, uncomfortable Share/Options crevices, and has a terrible battery life.
Why are people upset that it's mimicking an Xbox controller? They're doing that because it's a good design. Why does Nintendo always have to be so different in every way? Isn't the very nature of the system different enough? It's like Nintendo HAS to be the hipster of the gaming industry or something.
The D-pad does look a little awkwardly placed, though. Of course, I'll have to wait until it's in my hands to find out if it really is awkward or not.
I'm getting one because I need the traditional controller experience. The only thing I wish is that it had remappable buttons or paddles under the controller. I love them on the Xbox One Elite Controller has that so much that I actually sent my DS4 to be modded to add buttons to the underside. It's not something I expected but it would have been nice if Nintendo had included that. Once you get used to not having to take your thumb off the right stick to reload, it's hard to go back.
Pro-Con on order.
Looks pretty nice, I'll get used to it
Can it emulate an Xbox controller? I love my Wii U pro controller, and I have a Mayflash device that allows me to use it with my PC, both as a standard controller, and as an emulated Xbox controller...hard to beat that!
@MrGawain I'm waiting for an intermediate controller.
@stevenw45 I remember reading about a year ago that the Anniversary Update was going to implement that feature. However, I haven't followed it due to not having a NFC reader at home because, as you mentioned, Amiibos aren't setup for usage with anything else than Nintendo hardware out-of-the-box.
While I am working in IT, I'm not a developer myself, so I can't really help you with the actual debugging (and don't have a dev kit for either of the consoles). But if you need someone to do more extensive testing or to suggest additional features (these are the things I do at work, after all), let me know!
Have you considered putting both applications on github? Maybe other developers might want to contribute as well.
Apart from that, are you planning to put your applications out there for others to use eventually? If so I might even donate a small amount for your efforts... and maybe others would like to do that too? Who knows.
Can you turn on the switch using this controller? I hope so, but I haven't seen anything that says you can or can't.
@Ralizah Interesting viewpoints. You're far from the first DS4 fan I've heard from but it's definitely not the majority group. Most of the DS4 fans seem to be people that love racers or fighting games as the layout tends to suit those games best...given your interest in the D-Pad is so thorough, is it safe to assume you're pretty into fighters? I could see giving the XBox design a pass on that criteria.
To me, the grip moulds on the XBox controllers are (by far) more ergonomic than the DS line, and the stick positions are for most (but not all) genres more ideal (I actually prefer the WiiU "both sticks at the top" to either the asymmetrical sticks OR the both at the bottom design, but oh well...)
The other big difference with DS vs XB controllers sticks is that the DS3 had a REALLY bad deadzone. DS4 improves it a lot, but the XBox controllers seem to have higher height and broadened deadzone with firmer recenter that makes it more controllable with a wider range of motion. I suspect the Joycon are going to be DS3-like (yuck.)
D-pads, though, no argument on that, objectively the XBox D-Pads biggest problem isn't it's location. It's just a terrible D-Pad in every way. I wasn't fond of the D-Pads on either WiiU or 3DS though either. DS4 actually has the nicest these days.
Much of that is subjective. But I'm surprised to out of all things hear you say the DS4 triggers are so good. Even though I prefer the WiiU Pro and XB controllers, I do really like the DS4....coming from the DS3 it's a MASSIVE upgrade and fixed a lot of my gripes that aren't related to the intended design, the one thing that I always cringe when having to use them is the triggers...the feel so terribly cheap and spongy. It feels like instead of springs like the WaveBird there's just a silicone mat at the bottom offering resistance. I haven't looked at any teardowns. I'd be curious what's inside. It doesn't feel like a linear switch (pun not intended) at all.
Agreed on the gripes of DS4 though. The "Options" button and "Share buttons" the ugly and poorly placed touchpad (I call it the "map button" because that's all any game actually uses it for it seems ) and the dismal, dismal battery life. Switch can play Zelda on a 6" screen for 3 hours. DS4 can't even do everything a Joycon can do for much longer than that. And Sony's a leading battery mfr...
My gripes about the XBox controllers are the batteries and the associated immense weight of the thing. Great ergonomics are impeded by heft. And the fact that their analog stick provider is horrible and makes sticks that lose center in months. And that D-Pad....why bother? XBO's haptic triggers are kinda cool though, I'll admit (I don't own an XBO, I do own a PS3, PS4 and X360, so my XBO handling is limited.)
Looks like the D-pad is the only reason to use this on PC over a Steam Controller, but most games where I'd want a D-pad may be better suited for the Switch anyway. I'd be interested in seeing whether the Steam Controller software will eventually support it the way it does the DualShock 4 though.
The Steam Controller has analogue triggers (soft press) that mix with digital (full press). While I almost never make use of this feature outside Rocket League (and even then I never use the analog portions below 100%), their presence hasn't hindered my ability to use the digital parts for any other game. Also includes grip buttons and gyro control, two clickable track pads that can fully replace analog sticks or mice, and insane remapping options, and it supports games that were never considered for controller support. All that for like $50 (not counting sale prices); the only thing missing is a proper D-pad.
Always been a fan of transparent electronics.
I'm buying one this Friday only if I can find it.
I received my Pro Controller and Joy-Con Charging Grip today and I've just opened them, they are really comfortable to hold. Just need the Switch and TLOZ: BOTW to turn up now!
@Nintendoforlife Yeah, but that's still a lot if all I want is a second controller for Smash.
To be fair, Nintendo is in a tough spot with this. Cut out some secondary features to lower the cost, and you have a controller that can't be used in certain games. Offer a stripped-down controller in addition to the Pro, and you risk confusing consumers.
@Sean161 you're serious? Of all the things on a console wishlist, lack of analogue triggers would be a deal breaker for you?
@Dr_Corndog I can see what they are doing though. Nintendo is trying to offer the same experience with Pro as you would get with the Joy cons. Rather than let's say having to turn on a joy con to scan in an amiibo, you can use what's in your hands already. Samething goes for HD rumble, and the extra experience that brings.
@Sean161 it is a shame let's be honest, but any non-Nintendo fan looking to buy Switch will do so depending on which games interest them, not that the controller doesn't have that one input. The real shame is that it makes GameCube VC less likely, but I'm sure they'll release Joy-Con and a wireless GC controller (or make the Wii U one compatible) for those games (extra £££) if they do it.
@SLIGEACH_EIRE priceand no headphone jack really bothers me with this controller
FINALLY a controller with no analog triggers. I hate those things. At no point in the last twenty-five years have I wanted a controller with mushy shoulder buttons, and yet I have to deal with them all the time.
I received my Pro Controller from Best Buy today. It's the most comfortable out of all controllers on the market for my hands. No gripes from me at all!
@Octorok385 I agree on analogue triggers being unnecessary me mushy. It's a completely overrated and blown out of proportion demand. They make no difference to me and I don't need them.
Looks good in the sense it looks like an XB1 pad which is a lovely thing. However being Nintendo it has a couple of baffling omissions. Analogue triggers. I can't imagine playing the likes of the Forza Horizon games without them and being 2017 they're a bizarre thing to leave out.
Likewise the headphone jack. Very handy when the kids have gone to bed. Another daft thing to miss out either to save pennies or because Nintendo-bizarrely-don't realise some people want these things.
@Alfonzo Better than the Gamecube controller?
Looks like I better start saving up! The pro controller likely won't be purchased until sometime after I get a Switch.
@Dj64Mk7 I have never owned a GameCube and there for never gotten used to the controller. I won't compare them due to my very limited experience with both.
@KidRad Ok that's your opinion, but if the majority of consumers do not agree with your opinion. it doesn't make sense for Nintendo to make one right out of the gate.
I intended to get one of these but after seeing the price (at least in the UK) I don't think I'll bother...
Lol at all the people who deride others for complaining about real issues (like left JoyCon dropouts, etc) in other threads, but in this one, plenty of complaining from the same people about a superficial issue (how the traditional controller looks)... 😆
@NEStalgia I actually play very few fighting games. I just think the dualshock's layout (D-pad on top near the edge, with sticks positioned at the bottom) is the only one that allows for comfortable usage of both the D-Pad and the analog sticks. Playing side-scrollers on the PS4 is very, very nice as a result.
The 'sticks on top' design of the Wii U Pro Controller was sort of weird, though. Uncomfortable. Of course, clearly, YMMV with a lot of this stuff.
Speaking of deadzones, the ones on the Wii U GamePad's analog sticks are largely the reason I only play with the Pro controller now. They makes any sort of game reliant on small, accurate movements miserable to play without gyro. I really, really hope the joycons don't have this issue.
The DS4's triggers are second only to the GameCube's triggers for me. Really, really nice. Actually, most of the time when I see people complimenting the controller, one of the aspects they linger on is the design of the triggers.
@Nico07 I've ordered a Pro Controller and your points are fair enough, but MSRP vs actual price is a different matter.
A new DS4 from Amazon UK is £39.60 and an Xbox One controller is £41. Sure, the Xbox One controller uses batteries and neither has motion control, but both the DS4 and XO controllers do come with headphone ports, the DS4 has a touch pad, and both have analogue triggers. The Switch Pro Controller doesn't have a touch pad, headphone port, or analogue triggers and is £64.99...or £69.99 depending on where you look.
@Alfonzo That's fair. How does the d-pad on the Pro Controller compare with Nintendo's past?
I like it I really really like it .
I read a couple comments on here about it missing analog triggers and I can say in my whole life as a gamer I've never used the analog triggers on any controller I've used that has them , it's just my opinion but I think it is a useless feature on the controllers that have them so I'm glad this controller don't.
@Dj64Mk7 The only big difference was that it wasn't moving around like the Wii U game pad. It feels great as you would expect.
@SuperKMx To be fair MSRP is the only thing you can compare controller prices on as the Pro controller is unreleased and therefor all Pro controller pricing so far is MSRP. But as Alex from Nintendolife mentioned in his video on the critics arguments against the Switch, "we don't want to pay a fair price, we want it cheap".
Sure you've listed the cons of the Pro controller, namely no headphone port, no analog triggers, and no touchpad. But let's look at those. Yes, the lack of headphone port is the most critical flaw when compared to other contemporary controllers (for those wanting to game without TV or surround sound). Analog triggers are nice, but really in racing and other games it's typically all or no throttle at all, so the lack of analog triggers is a null checkbox item for some. The lack of a touchpad is completely fine in my book as I have yet to see any type of intuitive use for it in game. Sony's implementation of the feature is grasping at straws for functionality and I would say even less functional than the color light bar indicator, that at least links the controller to the player when using the camera.
This is opinion here, but I would argue that the advantages of the Pro controller outweigh the cons. With Pros being namely top tier battery life, superb motion control (as is needed in games like Splatoon), HD Rumble that adds extra depth to games, and amiibo scanning as an added bonus. I would say it's very possible that Nintendo could add support for bluetooth headsets in a future firmware update, though early indicators seem to suggest that it's not being worked on at this time. And yes, many of us would love for the Pro controller to have a physical headphone port and analog triggers to make it the ultimate controller, but it already is a great controller in most of the ways that matter most.
@ThanosReXXX Right, I think the Wii U Pro controller is an excellent controller and it is typically my "go to" controller when playing on the Wii U. I think the mention of the added grip on the Switch Pro controller just lets us know that the grip is that much better than what Nintendo has offered (which was already very good in my opinion). Though I do think the Wii U Pro joysticks could become slippery in long game sessions if your hands start to get sweaty.
@shani
we are actually passed the Windows 10 anniversary update. we are currently at the creaters update. it should be released to the public soon. the anniversary update does not have native NFC.
putting the applications on github sounds like a nice idea. of course then i have other projects that are of higher priority. they are hardware related and i should start a kickstarter program for one of them.
i finished a few but i need help with getting them to work with modern day technology. one of the projects i am working on is a type of laptop battery technology. one of the projects that i should put on github is this virtualization technology that i came up with. i only managed to get it to work with Windows 2000 and Windows XP.
in terms of the amiibo project; i do not need any help with it at this point since i am only doing work at a basic software level.
after i finish creating my first stable build for my applications that work without any noticeable issues i will post them online for download. and then i will post them on github for some help with creating smartphone versions of the application.
the version of the software that has been created so far only reads and writes to the amiibo figures in a generic manor. i will need help with adding more functionality to the NFC applications.
right now it is very insecure and you can just tap any amiibo on the NFC reader to logon. by the 10th of this month i should have a stable working version with no glitches.
hopefully someone on github will be able to help me make it so that the application can detect each amiibo in a non-generic manor. afterall you don't want the Nintendo fan next to you to be able to logon to your device with their amiibo.
The only real, actual, legitimate issue I have is no headphone jack, which sucks (the first model Xbox One controller didn't have a headphone jack either... just, why?).
Analog triggers mean squat. It's just another one of those features people like to rattle off on a bullet point list that would never actually be used for anything. Not on a Nintendo console (heck, barely even gets used on other consoles with every AAA game under the sun).
Cost is by the books. $65 Xbox One controllers requiring $25 battery packs... $60 PS4 controllers. It may be five or 10 bucks higher... whatever.
But all in all even despite the headphone jack I like everything else. The button placement mimicking Xbox is superb. People can say what they will but anyone who has ever used an X1 controller knows it is hands down the most ergonomic and comfortable controller on the market. Seeing Nintendo humble themselves and admit this design is best is reassuring. Although I do think the joy cons would've been excellent had they placed both analogues on top like Wii U (easier to not reach over the analogues to press the buttons)
@stevenw45 Ah, the creators update! That explains why it doesn't show in the logon settings. Looking forward to the update.
Your other projects also sound interesting. Without revealing too much, what sets the laptop battery technology apart from existing ones? And do you mean virtualization like in a VM?
Nice to hear that you'll post the Amiibo applications online when they're finished.
Heh, of course it should only work with your specific Amiibo and not all Amiibos of that type. ^^ I'm assuming every Amiibo has their unique ID?
I guess those Amiibo-related features should be interesting for others too, you could probably spread the word here in the forums or maybe on reddit (in case you weren't already doing that anyway). Otherwise, just let me know when they're ready.
Pre-ordered! looking forward to this one...
@BornInNorway81 How many games require that? Considering 2 player portable mode will be the least used mode, it's a wrong decision. I'd say 98% of the time players will use the joy cons either in the tablet or the grip - and they won't have a d-pad.
@NEStalgia 2 player portable mode will be rarely used, nor be a serious option either. 98% of the time it's the tablet or the grip. So losing the d-pad is a major sacrifice for such a trivial and casual feature.
@shani
i am not talking about that type of virtualization. the correct terminology for what it is might be different. i am not going into any more details because i don't want anyone stealing the idea from me.
in terms of the battery technology, i found away to make it so a laptop's battery will never die. i figured this out when i was 7 years old but still have a few issues with it. there is more to it than that, but unless you work for me i will not be giving out anymore information about it.
every amiibo does have their own ID. more so referring to what character they are. Mario, Pikachu, link, Zelda, and the others. the information that is saved to them that sets them apart from the others. example: a mario amiibo with super smash bros. data on it over a mario amiibo with mario party data on it.
i have never been on reddit but i guess we can start by spreading the news of this on nintendolife.
Is is worth the price? That's what I really want to know. A lot of people say that "oh but a dualshock 4 is $65 new the switch pro controller isnt so bad" but for me it still doesn't change the fact that it's $70 for a controller which is a lot no matter how you look at it
@stevenw45 No problem, that's what I meant by "without revealing too much", because one has to be careful with these ideas.
Although the battery technology sounds groundbreaking, what kind of expertise would you need for that? I'm currently happy at my job but I'm always looking for future ways to contribute to more independent, innovative projects or to realize my own ideas that I have.
I've only started using reddit about a year ago myself, but it might be a good place to reach a bigger crowd later.
I guess the NL forum would be a good place to start though. Looking forward to it.
the question is, how many 3rd party / indies games wont be on switch because of analog controllers?
not many i'm guessing?
So glad I'm getting one of these bad boys at launch and I'm stoked about the native PC support. Since it's a Bluetooth connection it'll probably connect to both my PC and Shield TV.
@Alfonzo What do you mean when you say, "moving around"?
Looks like a fantastic controller. Sucks that it's a bit pricey, but I'll pick one up eventually. Will definitely want that d-pad for fighting games.
"An evolution of the excellent Wii U Pro Controller, the Switch variant retains the basic shape and input layout, save for the fact that the face buttons and right-hand analogue stick have swapped positions. This makes the pad feel more akin to the Xbox 360 / Xbox One controller, which is no bad thing in our book."
I think you meant to say that it's back to being like the Gamecube controllers were.
@HalBailman It'll be used a lot in Japan, guaranteed. Here, probably not all that much, but success in Japan = more games that we tend to like, so it's not a bad tradeoff for us to include features that make it more popular in Japan and thus more attractive to Japanese 3rd parties.
And here, it doesn't really matter if tabletop mode is used that much. 2-player local coop will probably be used quite a bit by a lot of people, more on TVs here than in tabletop mode, but regardless of if you use the 6" screen or the TV in docked mode, you'd be using the two separate controllers as the majority of "non hardcore" players aren't that likely to buy two sets of Joycons or a Pro Controller, but coop is a big selling feature of the system since few systems promote it.
For me personally, most multiplayer games I'd want to play even in local coop would involve two Switches and two copies of a game, but I'm not most people, and I'm not buying Fifa or NBA
@SLIGEACH_EIRE you would rate it higher if they defeatured Amiibo support? How about you just don't use it, and those of us who want the feature use it since it is available?
@Nintendoforlife kind of begs the question, would an Xbox controller work with the Switch since they work the same on a PC?
I plan on leaving the Joycons always attached to the Switch tablet (except for games requiring separate joycon like ARMs, or multiplayer apps with either split joycon or dual joycon + pro) and using the joycon for portable play and the Pro controller for docked play.
Only announced game so far that seems to explicitly require a second pair of joycon for multiplayer is ARMs. For the rest, two player dual stick with joycons + pro, or two player split joycon, seems adequate.
And while I feel the directional buttons won't be as bad as people seem to think for old school gaming, you're just doing it wrong without the Dpad for VC, 2D indie platformers, or Ultra SFII. So I value the Pro controller over an extra set of Joycon for that reason.
All hail the mighty Dpad!
I just think it looks really bland. Look how iconic previous Nintendo controllers were. Even the Wii U Pro Controller, while plain, was beautifully smooth and distinguished itself from the competition.
Wherever I do get a Nintendo Switch, the Pro Controller is definitely something I'll be getting. Nothing beats playing on the TV with the good ol' traditional style controller.
@Sinton @mainstream05 @tjhiphop @leo13 @RadioHedgeFund @johndevine @Dysnomia amiibo are a SCAM. It's Nintendo's attempt to bleed yet more money from you after the purchase of a game. In fact you don't even need to buy a game. In fairness, Nintendo haven't been as bad as other companies in locking exclusive items and modes behind them, there are exceptions though, Mario Party 10, Splatoon, Mario & Friends: SCamiibo Challenge.
Putting a NFC reader in the controller further increases its cost. Seeing as Nintendo are hell bent on letting your mobile phone use various apps to perform normal console functions, e.g. parental controls, online, voice chat, etc. Guess what other feature most mobile phones have too? An NFC reader.
SCamiibo and other toys to life garbage need to die. They're a stain on gaming.
@SLIGEACH_EIRE your parents never bought you that Lego Blacktron set you wanted as a kid did they? 😉
I like collecting merchandise! Amiibo give us reasonably priced figurines of classic video game characters (and Waluigi) that normally only get released in small quantities by tiny Japanese companies that cost a fortune. Or they look crap like those funko pop things.
I've probably used maybe 3 of them in a game ever. They make nice gifts too.
As for Lego Dimensions? #nostalgia.
@SLIGEACH_EIRE Then it's not the functionality that's a negative, but the cost. It's like giving a minus for cool design, since the controller would be cheaper with a cheap design.
@Turbo857 Surely, if you are a regular streamer, you should at least have a PC with a Capture Card? Which negates the problems you outlined.
Just like the Wii U Pro Controller, it seems Nintendo made a near excellent controller. The battery life is pretty much the best in the business, but I really don't understand why both the Joycons and the Pro controller don't have analog triggers. It seems utterly strange that the mistake they made on Wii U is getting repeated now on Switch as well.
@shani
i am not sure of what kind of expertise would you need for that. i am more of a hobbyist for this kind of stuff.
since i figured the battery technology thing when i was 7, i guess i would put down the knowledge of knowing how to build stuff with legos...lol as well as a basic knowledge of computers and electricity.
@Ralizah Gamepad deadzones aren't too bad. Not great, but not bad. The crimped stick height however reduces range of motion which is the effect you're seeing. Joycons WILL have this issue as they are slightly smaller from all I've heard (haven't held one yet....only 24 hours remaining....) That said, the Vita is playable, and those sticks are horrendous....Joycons shouldn't be anywhere near that bad. That said compared to the Gamepad it depends a little on the centering spring set tension. Gamepad had a pretty snappy recentering, a failing the original X360 controller had too, so the force required to break the inertia of center creates momentum that sends it too far forward, and the reduced pressure to let it move back inward gets overwhelmed by centering tension. DS4 has a looser centering spring, but not so loose as DS3 that had both too short range of motion AND a floppy centering and a huge deadzone to make up for it. (DS3 is really one of the worst controllers I've ever used. It was a downgrade from DS2.) The joycons, despite their limited motion range from reduced height, can be salvaged by an ideal centering tension and deadzone. Fingers crossed!
DS4 triggers....hmh, well, I'll just roll with it. Personally, yuck. They just feel all wrong to me. Spongy, hollow, ick. I can understand racing fans liking them (sort of), and that's what they were designed for (GT). They make for awful gun triggers though. XBox does win that one, and the Gamepad (and it looks like Switch Pro) makes a better "general purpose trigger button" that's neither an accelerator pedal nor hair trigger. I'd rather my Cherry L3 Nozzlenose feel the satisfying click of a trigger, than a spongy semi-linear actuator. Not even a crustacean would build a paintgun with a trigger like that.
As far as stick positions, I always loved the offset X360 design. Never really loved the PS4 design. It's functional, and I don't dislike it, but I don't love it. The Gamepad design was good, but the sticks were oddly positioned a little. The WiiU Pro controller was PERFECTION. Sad to see it go, even if Switch is aping my other favorite layout.
All that said, I still can't see my buying another XBox despite liking the controllers. Haven't seen an exclusive that interests me all generation. Nintendo and Playstation for me at this point. And we'll see about my continuation of Playstation. Love some of the games, but the Switch concept is the system I've always dreamed of.
@NEStalgia I've never had an issue with the Vita's sticks. They're not amazing, but I had no issue playing games like Killzone Mercenary that required small, precise movements.
I hated the triggers on the 360, personally. On a tactile level, they just weren't satisfying to use.
The Pro Controller is definitely an improvement over the GamePad, but the stick positioning was odd, and it feels... cheap. I think it's the fact that it's so light and has glossy plastic.
I'm with you on ditching Microsoft. Japan has rejected them, which means little to nothing in the way of Japanese software support (an area where the 360 was quite strong in its first few years), and they don't have a strong stable of good Western developers like Sony. I'm hanging onto my PS4 because it's getting a ton of nice looking exclusives at this point, although, as I've said before, now that the Switch is a thing, I can't see myself buying any more home consoles. It's handheld, hybrid, or bust for me at this point.
@roadrunner343 These surfaced today and I thought they might interest you. Not the Pro Controller, but it does show that there is indeed VERY little room left in the Joy-Cons to also add extra stuff like analog triggers and what not:
@KirbyTheVampire The comment above this one might interest you as well...
@ThanosReXXX Hmm that does make sense then. I suppose Mario Sunshine on the VC is out of the question, unless they happen to release a Pro controller with analogue triggers, but that seems unlikely.
@ThanosReXXX NSFW tags, man, NSFW tags.
Super cool pictures! I'm amazed, that battery is humungous relative to the controller. It's hard to read the text in this pics, but looks like only 525mah....physically the size makes it seem like it should be bigger. I'm guessing the white thing at the bottom is the HD Rumble servo package.
Looking at the trigger, it looks like the button cap activates a button on a long stem. Is it possible that the stem is pressure sensitive in the way the N3DS Nub/ThinkPad TrackPoint is while not being truly analog? Might be an interesting detail....
@Ralizah KZ was designed with the limited range of the sticks in mind though. Have you tried them with Remote Play (I know, I know, who would willfully subject themselves to Remote Play?) they really show their limitations in games not designed for them.
Interesting, personally I always found the 360's triggers decent. Not amazing, but better than what PS was offering. Strangely I did like the triggers on the WiiU Gamepad more than the Procon. And I do confess, a controller trigger just doesn't get better than XBone. Not a fan of the console, but I have trigger-envy of that console (I guess it triggers me? )
Wii U Pro controller, the weight was always an asset. It's an asset for DS4 as well, but that paper light WiiU pro controller (and endless battery made it kind of seamless.) The weight was wonderful! Yeah, the glossy plastic can go take a flying leap (and did, by the appearance of the Switch Procon) that was a really annoying design issue where the whole area the top of your hand and fingers sit on tend to "catch" the skin. Somehow the Gampad didn't make the gloss seem as awful. The downside is they always look dirty. The upside is they're so easy to clean
Yeah, the 360 had decent...actually less than decent but "ok" Japanese support at launch, and that dwindled fast. I think it started because the original XBox was really trying to cater to the Japan market that was abandoned at the time, and they had the Sega Dreamcast team helping them with the system. Once they found their "Madden success" they seemed to have ignored it. And yep, exactly where you are with hybid/handheld. I'll be playing those PS4 exclusives I want non-stop wishing it was on Switch. I'm going to be so spoiled
@NEStalgia Heh, I've never gotten RP working long enough to really give the controls a proper go. And believe me, I tried. It was a really interesting idea, but it's garbage in execution. Which is too bad, because I really wanted to play Peggle 2 on the Vita (seriously, why release a game like Peggle 2 exclusively on a console when it's pretty much the perfect time-waster to play when watching TV?)
The gold standard for triggers, for me at least, are the ones on the GameCube controller. They're... perfect. They have a lovely spring to them. They're designed to perfect compliment one's index fingers. They're a big part of why I adore that controller, even with its flaws (worst D-Pad ever and fiddly c-stick, primarily).
Xbox 360 had quite good Japanese support at first, and I would argue its JRPG exclusives were the best on home consoles last gen, even if PS3 did get a mountain of mediocre otaku games.
I've seen a lot of bellyaching online about the portability, with people complaining that the Switch isn't just another PS4/Xbone clone that sits in front of a TV and does nothing interesting. I just... don't fundamentally understand that attitude. Perhaps due to my lifelong love of handheld systems? Also, unlike some people, I don't have the time to spend hours sitting in front of a TV every day, so the flexibility of the Switch is like a dream come true. Literally everything I've ever wanted in a console.
I'm still very, very, very excited for Persona 5, but like you said, I would have preferred it on the Switch.
@NEStalgia The pictures are actually bigger than they are here. So, if you want to take a better look, just right-click them and select "View Image" or copy the image link to open it in a new tab.
@KirbyTheVampire I kind of like the idea of a whole range of different Joy-Cons. They can leave out other tech if they need to add analog triggers, for example in the case of GameCube VC, seeing as all the tech currently in the Joy-Cons and the Pro Controller isn't applicable in GameCube titles anyway.
@ThanosReXXX Oh cool, I didn't realize it let you do that. Looking at them more closely I see the "nub" I was referring t is actually just the return spring. Meaning the actuator isn't really visible, just the button cap. That said are we POSITIVE that these aren't analog (in a useful sense?) The lack of seeing any actual actuator is in itself interesting. Looking at that copper-ish split plate below the button cap looks like it slides along it as a rail. If that's a conductive plastic, it's entirely reasonable to believe that it's in fact a capacitive fader (like on an audio equalizer/mixing board) which would be analog input (even if interpreted in digital steps like a modern premium cordless power tool triggers.)
@NEStalgia Could be pressure sensitive, I believe that at one point, Alex Olney also speculated they could be in one of his earlier Switch videos, but seeing as neither Nintendo themselves nor any other media has mentioned anything to that extent, I certainly wouldn't hold my breath for it to be true.
Besides, the only games it will potentially be missed in is in racing games. Other than that, what essential use do they really have? Don't get me wrong, I'm already quite used to analog triggers in PC and Xbox gaming, but still, it never bothered me much not having it on Nintendo's consoles since the Wii.
@ThanosReXXX Far as I've always known the only reasons to care about analog triggers is racing and GCN VC. I imagine most of the complaints are about GCN VC. I imagine anyone that cares much about racing games hasn't bothered with Nintendo in a decade. (Pssh, and you call yourself an F-Zero fan?? )
Analogs mostly get in the way for most trigger uses considering shooters are the standard fare on the other consoles, and like I said above, no gun maker builds spongy squishy triggers with indefinite hammer strike points. That would be a dangerous (to operate) weapon indeed! XBO's haptic triggers get that part the most right.
What I DO find interesting about the joycon trigger though is: IT HAS A SPRING. Why does it need a spring? If it were hitting a capacitive mat, that would be the spring. I thought maybe it was part of the joycon release lever system, but you can clearly see that the spring sits BELOW the button cap, and you can see the pair of springs for the rail release lock mechanism. Needing a spring implies the trigger has a range of motion (NL could confirm this). And a range of motion implies at best that there's an analog fader under it, or at worst, it will be the best feeling digital trigger ever made.
@NEStalgia Seems to me that a spring could simply be for making sure that the button returns to its original position after being pressed: it will ensure a better longevity of the rubber cap underneath. Normally, a button with only a rubber cap underneath is the default setup for buttons, but this could indeed be to make it an even better digital trigger. Some of the classic console and home computer joypads and joysticks in the eighties and nineties also had springs underneath some buttons, and triggers as well, even though all of them were digital.
@NEStalgia But maybe we should drag @AlexOlney, @ThomasBW84 or @Damo over here to comment on that. I hope that if any of them do have the time to post an answer, that they aren't going to crush any of your dreams of having anything more than just a slightly different looking digital trigger...
@ThanosReXXX LOL, yep...the guys playing BotW right now "for work purposes" are definitely going to be reading their inbox to comment on the springiness of button caps
But yeah, it could be just for reinforcement. But given the squishiness of a lot of triggers, even Nintendo's a nice solid spring is a very welcome button feel addition.
Mechanical keyboards feel so good because of the spring feedback after all. Rubber domes just don't have the chops.
@NEStalgia Trying to get what you're saying The triggers have 'give', if that makes sense, in that it's not an immediate 'click'. You can depress the button a little before that final digital input happens.
Erm, does that help?
@ThomasBW84 Haha, thanks for taking time out from "working" (on Guardian destruction) to talk about springs
I think that gives kind of a loose description of what I'm getting at. That does indeed sound like the spring is there for trigger feel and response more than reinforcement of the rubber mat (or could theoretically have pressure sensitivity as a physical if unused ability.)
That's great news!
@Ralizah Haha, yeah, that's the truth! I was so excited for RP at first. Even just around the house, getting to out-WiiU the WiiU was the promise. Instead it delivered stilted framerates, illegible UI's impossible control setups, and input lag that felt like the worst of streamed games which somehow ran slightly smoother ad-hoc than through my pretty high-end wifi infrastructure.... I got my preordered copy of Horizon the other day....looks great...no idea when I'll play with it because of Switch, but giggled when I saw the Remote Play icon on the box....that can NOT be fun....
Yeah, I love the GCN triggers. They do have ONE little issue though. Their range of motion is almost too great. PERFECT for racing, but fatiguing for shooters. It has about the same range as a trumpet valve! But the way the fingers fit into the groove at the top was so perfect it's forgivable.
I like your phrasing of "mountain of mediocre otaku games", I feel like that best summarizes everything I hear in the world of Playstation about how PS gets tons of Japanese support and Vita has "tons of games"....it's all that very mountain. Perfect description
And I'm rig@Ralizah Haha, yeah, that's the truth! I was so excited for RP at first. Even just around the house, getting to out-WiiU the WiiU was the promise. Instead it delivered stilted framerates, illegible UI's impossible control setups, and input lag that felt like the worst of streamed games which somehow ran slightly smoother ad-hoc than through my pretty high-end wifi infrastructure....
Yeah, I love the GCN triggers. They do have ONE little issue though. Their range of motion is almost too great. PERFECT for racing, but fatiguing for shooters. It has about the same range as a trumpet valve! But the way the fingers fit into the groove at the top was so perfect it's forgivable.
I like your phrasing of "mountain of mediocre otaku games", I feel like that best summarizes everything I hear in the world of Playstation about how PS gets tons of Japanese support and Vita has "tons of games"....it's all that very mountain. Perfect description
Total agreement on the hybrid. I don't really get the mentality of not wanting portability. I mean I guess if you're someone that wants ONLY to game in the living room, you might want whichever machine does so the prettiest, but there's already two of those on the market for those people, and the Switch doesn't even give up that much power to add the option of portability. My viewpoint is that EVERY gamer who wants to dub themselves "hardcore" needs the portability even if they don't know it yet. How many wasted minutes are there in a day they could be gaming. They don't even need to stop to get the new can of Mountain Dew from the fridge! Pssh, and they call themselves hardcore!
Poor Persona 5. I'm SO hyped for that game. And yet I've no idea what year I'll end up taking it out of the shrinkwrap because it's not on Switch! I'm still going to close my eyes and believe that a Persona game on a Nintendo system is a possibility.....Q paved the way! I'll buy twice, Squeenix, I promise!
@NEStalgia I haven't played Zelda since writing the review yesterday actually, busy doing everything else!
@NEStalgia It's a shame, too, because if RP had been better implemented, it could have been a game changer. It feels like Sony has been groping for a Switch-esque setup years before Nintendo ever unveiled the Switch, but Sony's hardware just wasn't up to the task.
The Vita, in a lot of ways, feels like a Switch predecessor. Not only with RP, but also due to the fact that most Vita games can be played on Playstation TV. It just... it wasn't built with true versatility in mind.
I'm going to carve time out of my schedule every day to play Persona 5 when it releases, but I can't say the same for 90% of my home console games. I just... don't want to sit in one dark room the whole time. I like moving around. I have a life, you know? With the Switch, I can explore a new location in Zelda while starting dinner. I can explore a shrine and solve its puzzles while waiting for the laundry. I can flesh out the map while watching TV with the family. And, if I get to an important part of the game that demands my rapt attention, I can take it upstairs, dock it, and get the full home console experience. Right now, gaming time feels a bit guilty, like it's something I'm sacrificing family time for. This feels like a device I can integrate into my life, like a good book.
Sorry. Tangent.
Well, even if we don't get Persona (and I don't expect that we will), there's apparently a brand new Shin Megami Tensei game releasing on Switch. God knows when we'll see the thing, but it exists, and that's enough for me.
@ThomasBW84 Haha, of course you haven't, there's also Bomberman and Snipperclips to "work" on
Just poking you, I've lived the reviewer's life many years ago...I know the stresses all too well
@Ralizah "but Sony's hardware just wasn't up to the task." Hasn't that been Sony's mission statement since 1988? It seems like whether it's a walkman, VCR, DVD player, it's always the same story. "It could have been so great, except...."
In addition to the tech (and market) not being quite there for Sony to pull off a Switch (mobile, despite Walkman fame, has always been their ultimate weakness....they can't do small well, and every attempt has been a disaster), I think a lack of commitment to it kept them from having any hope. The Playstation gaming VCRs have been too successful to tamper with the formula, so every time they try at hybridizing they never go far enough and always end up with a half hearted easily ignored attempt. The pictures of Yoshida at the Switch demo kind of say it all with an expression like "this was supposed to be us!"
With Vita, it was supposed to be the "home console you can take with you", but they wanted it to be a PSP replacement, they wanted a DS (then 3DS) competitor, and they released it right as they were ramping up the PS4 that they needed to save the company. It was the inverse of WiiU/3DS. WiiU was thrown to the wolves because it launched just after 3DS and they needed to save 3DS to save the company. Vita was ignored right after launch because they then launched PS4 and needed it to save the company. They didn't even announce the true remote play features until AFTER WiiU was announced. Everything about it felt like "yeah, well, we can do that too! (wait, how can we make this work...?)" It was beautiful hardware without a mission. They didn't know HOW they intended to use it they just knew they COULD use it for lots of great things! Greatness was still awaiting vision. And at some point it got tired of waiting.
You have more resolve than I for Persona. My 2nd most anticipated game of the year after BotW. But if I can't make it my main game I'll get nowhere. I clocked 150 hours over many weeks on TMS#FE....and P5 is much bigger.... I'll play it eventually, because I'm a huuge Atlas fan (but if SMTV comes out in this year in the West too, P5 might have to wait yet longer...) But, yep, that's why I gave up PC gaming years ago...couldn't stand the odd isolation of missing everything else, it sucked the fun out. It sounds like the way you intend to play with it is precisely the exact same way I do and for all the same reasons! And there's probably tons more of us out there, which bodes well for Switch (and maybe changes gears of the whole gaming industry over time.)
I think most of the "I only want a VCR box not a hybrid!" crowd consists largely of those who are either living alone and there's no real interaction with others to worry about (though even for them portability sounds like a good bet since there's so many daily tasks to do!) or are young people, probably school age, who generally come home, hole up in their room, and play games, and someone else takes care of the food and laundry and they're not wasting idle minutes standing around doing nothing while waiting for things. Plus maybe the party-games crowd that is only interested in big-room fun with a bunch of people and sees the hybrid as perhaps too isolated in a sense.
I can still smack Nintendo for omitting wireless headphone support. Grab the Switch, throw on some wireless bone conductors and play and live all at once....would have been great!
Yep, SMT is so different from Persona, but excellent on its own, both SMTIV and SMTIV:A are excellent. But an Unreal Engine based SMT...this is something I have to see! Supposedly it's coming out this year, but that's only confirmed for Japan, so no telling how soon after we get it (assuming they confirm it here at all, but I suspect they will.)
@SLIGEACH_EIRE then again, don't use it. The NFC reader probably adds 50 cents to the controller. I doubt they would be 69.49 without it, so go and play a PS4 or pc game since you don't like a Nintendo at all. Or do you also troll their websites too?
@akaDv8R
I do actually and I use my laptop and capture card when needed (which'll be used to stream Switch until it features a Twitch app). But nothing beats the convenience of using the Twitch app from a console itself imo. Since Xbone and PS4 feature it, it saves the trouble of using an additional device to stream and record.
@ThanosReXXX Thanks for these, interesting indeed. I still feel that had they wanted to, they could have squeezed them in there. Parts are so small these days...
That said - now that I've got my grubby mitts on my switch, I must say I am surprised at how good the triggers actually feel. They have a very satisfying click to them. Much better than the Wii U controllers. So I do think it was a bit of an odd omission, but I am extremely happy with how the Joy-Con triggers feel (I don't have a pro controller yet)
Bought one so I've a different input device (was going to buy another set of joy cons it the disconnecting issue put me off). Decided to buy despite not having high hopes; didn't look great or comfortable. So glad I did, the thing is awesome, really really comfortable. The digital triggers do spoil it a bit and the price is expensive for what it is but I'd def buy again. If u don't mind the price then I whole heartedly recommend it.
@roadrunner343 No, it wouldn't have fitted. There's quite a few parts involved in full analog triggers, because they need more playroom to account for the varying degrees of trigger squeezing, but aside from that, there's not even all that many genres of games that benefit from analog triggers. Personally, I primarily prefer them in racing games, but other than that, a more sturdy digital button will do just fine.
And I can imagine that the ones in the Switch feel better. Just look at the comment that Thomas gave NEStalgia a few replies up from this one, apparently the trigger has a bit of "give" due to there being a kind of spring underneath the button, which makes it feel a little more resistant as it were, you will probably be able to confirm that.
All in all, it sounds like the next best thing after true analog...
And congrats on getting your Switch, hope you have a lot of fun with it.
I will be buying mine somewhere around the end of the year: I never do launch day purchases, on any console.
Just out of curiosity: besides the satisfying feel of the triggers, what are your personal sentiments on HD Rumble? That's the one thing I might have to go and experience somewhere soon, because even though I'm not going to buy a Switch just yet, I can't wait to feel what that's really like.
@ThanosReXXX I have no doubt they could have fit them, especially if they were designed with analogue in mind from the start. I've ripped apart a few controllers, they really do not take up that much space. Still, I will agree with you that it isn't that big of a deal, especially given they are used so infrequently, but I would have loved a Gamecube style analogue trigger with a digital click at the end of the throw.
As far as HD rumble goes, I really can't comment on it. I only purchased Zelda so far (I plan on getting Shovel Knight and FAST soon) and it just feels like normal rumble to me. And honestly, the rumble hasn't seemed to match up too great with what's happening on screen in Zelda, so it feels a little wonky to me. I'm looking forward to playing a game that fully takes advantage of it though.
As far as launch day purchases, this was a first for me as well - I've always purchased things a year or so after launch, but the way Nintendo has been having stock issues lately, I really wanted to get this one now, if only for Zelda.
@roadrunner343 Yeah, I should have elaborated a bit: in their current form factor, analog triggers and their hinges wouldn't have fitted in the Joy-Cons. The Pro Controller might be another story, though, but I'm sure they have their reasons.
And if they were in talks with so many third parties and actually listened to them, as was reported so many times (also here), then it probably isn't such a big issue for them either.
As for the HD Rumble question: I was kinda hoping you had more games...
But I can imagine that Zelda isn't a good example for it, since that wasn't built for the Switch specifically, so they probably just copy/pasted any rumble that is in the Wii U version straight to the Switch version.
FAST just finished downloading and I ran through one track. I think that game supports HD rumble. To me, it just feels like rumble. Granted, it felt good, but nothing earth shattering (to me, at least). Again, maybe there is a better title for testing? I know 1-2 Switch is apparently good for it, but I have zero interest in that, so I can't comment.
Now... sorry to neglect you so soon FAST, but I have Zelda to play =)
@roadrunner343 And like I already said to someone else earlier: they might even develop special Joy-Cons in the future, especially tailored to VC games, such as GameCube. They can then rip out all the HD Rumble stuff and replace that with GameCube triggers and so on.
Probably not gonna happen, but until then, a man can dream...
What actually could happen, though, is Nintendo or a third party coming up with some kind of USB adapter that works on the Switch that enables you to use older controllers, such as the GameCube ones.
@roadrunner343 Can't blame you for not being interested in 1-2 Switch, ESPECIALLY for the price it's going for, but from all reports, it is indeed a great showcase for experiencing all the HD Rumble sensations, so maybe a bargain bin title, somewhere down the line...
@ThanosReXXX If I had to guess, that will happen for GCN for sure. I would imagine the Wii U GCN adapted will be added to the Switch. Likely as soon as Smash Bros is released/ported to the Switch. And I would kill for a gamecube style joycon. I loved that button layout.
@OfNullAndVoid It's confirmed the Joy Cons do work with a PC
@Nintendoforlife
Sweet! Can't wait to try it out on some of my PC games. Of course, if I ever play those again in the foreseeable future Currently my playlist is:
PC: Elder Scrolls Online
3DS: Animal Crossing New Leaf
After I get my Switch:
PC: <- A what?
3DS: Animal Crossing New Leaf <- Can't leave those animals alone for a day
Switch: Zelda, nothing but Zelda...
It's crazy that this doesn't have a headphone jack? $70?!!! How am I supposed to play games on my TV when everyone is asleep? What kind of world are we living in?
@SLIGEACH_EIRE with relation to the addition of an amiibo scan function causing you to fault the pro controller, please bear in mind that the fragmentation of controllers for the WiiU was one of it's downfalls.
If Nintendo had omitted it from the Switch pro controller, they would be getting off to a similarly bad foot with the Switch accessories.
@johndevine SCamiibo seem to be dying, thank God. A lot of retailers are clearing them out and off their shelves and not getting any of the newer ones in stock. It's an added expense for something I've literally Zero interest in. And many others besides. Maybe there could be a revival. Hopefully not. Other games companies are backing away from the toys to life market. It may have just been a fad.
@SLIGEACH_EIRE you didn't address the point.
Where is the taste section. Pls I wanna know if this is good to put in my restaurant.
@Nintendoforlife NPC? Don't you mean NFC?
@Sub-Dominance Took awhile for me to find that post, yeah that's what I mean.
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