Warner Bros. Doubles Down On Its Commitment To Live Service Games

Thwn I will double down on buying games I can play 5 years from now.

Looks like they want to move away from having my money, then.

I can't wait to enjoy these games for many 8 months until the servers shut down forever!

Suicide squad kill the justice league is getting mass refunded, and yet they don’t see the issue?

It seems their latest outings with live service ventures hasn’t been too fruitful for them not sure why they are taking this approach. Hogwarts legacy and the Arkham games of old were sons of their very best. I hate to see them go this route.

Cool, guess I'll keep not buying their games then.

That sounds horrible why would I want to be that involved with a game? It's entertainment, not a job.

There’s only so many live service games a person can reasonably play, and chances are it’s gonna be one of the well established ones instead of whatever new Fortnite wannabe these companies put out.

They’re definitely setting themselves up for disappointment by not realizing that.

They just had an investor call in which they said this year will look much softer than last because last year they released a licensed, single-player action game. I can't imagine how they could've avoided this...
There's zero chance they will get the right message. I wrote them off ages ago, but now I'm expecting studio closures.

I'm going to throw out a highly controversial and radical suggestion to WB: how about they focus on making good games before trying to bleed money out of people.

@sonicmeerkat they see something like Hogwarts Legacy and don't get that HP is a rare example of a property that people base their identity around. No one is walking around like "I'm totally Lin Kwei" or "I'm 1000% Deadshot!" But on Tinder profiles people will say "I'm terminally Hufflepuff!!!" They'll go to the theme park, read the books, see the films, buy the t-shirts, etc etc etc. That's not something people do with every ip. They're going to get people fired.

Guess I’m moving away from Warner Bros. Games

@LikelySatan
If that’s the case WB can easily just put out low effort shovelware because those types of peoples will just mindlessly consume it and do everything possible to justify doing so because their entire identity is built around that IP.

Keep in mind people, these are the same execs that butchered the DCEU. Of course they don't learn. For every fortnite success, there are a dozens of live service failures and they don't care how many studios and developers they toss aside to get to that sweet sweet shareholder ROI

How about don't put your eggs on the live service basket, WB.

Actually. I rather you not engage in the live service at all.

@SalvorHardin probably! I don't care for Harry Potter one way or the other.

The most lamest part about these live service games is that they will eventually become dead forever whenever the time comes. At least with non-live service titles those games could live on forever.

Seems like a funny way to say “buy Hogwarts Legacy now or we’ll make the next one a live service game!”

Just let the western AAA games crash and burn, it's hopeless. I'm okay if gaming only have japanese AAA games (like devil may cry 5, elder ring, armored core 6, etc), western indie games, and nintendo games 😕

@sonicmeerkat Couldn't have put it better myself.

Ooh boy. Not a great sign for Avalanche Software, developers of Hogwarts Legacy. I don’t know how they look at this and see any good sign for what they’ll be assigned, especially when they’re saying Hogwarts Legacy, the best selling game of 2024, was not a great strategy.

Avalanche, had already briefly shut down prior, when having to stop development in Disney Infinity 3.0. The studio would have disappeared had WB not come in part way of Disney Interactive’s closure. So to see them go from a game too big to continue success and just nearly costed the entire studio their livelihood, to exponential success in their contained product, to another potential ongoing project just seems to be a recipe for history to literally repeat itself again.

Even if you spend 8 hours a day playing games and 1 hour of that eight for a different live service game, you'd only have time for 8. Some of these people go to work and leave their brains on the bedside table.

If you build the metaverse, they may not come...

I can definitely see why from a business standpoint they'd want to move in that direction, as it does make a lot of sense to have players continually coming back to something the developers invest so much into. Unfortunately, this approach rarely makes for a compelling single player game, and often feel bloated and purposeless imo. Hopefully companies find a balance to making great games and making a profit, as the industry is definitely struggling and a lot of people are out of jobs.

Genuinely, what is these company’s goals here? I would understand if live service games were the hot new thing and companies were being more experimental with them, but it is clear that they are a dying market. You can’t just make your own Fortnite.

Eh I will wait to see what they make before passing judgement.

I don't have time for more live service games than these.
World of Warships, Battlefield 2042 and Lost Ark.

I stopped playing Destiny 2, RB 6 Siege and The Elder Scrolls Online long time ago as there is no time.

Closest to that I've been playing is Splatoon 3 and even with just that one game I will sometimes feel fatigued because of having to play the game relatively often to complete the catalogue. So no thanks. I truly hope Nintendo isn't going to go that route with many more games either.

Good thing I never had much interest in Warner Bros games to begin with then, hah.

The executives in charge don’t even play video games. They don’t care if the game is good or not… as long as they get your money.

Fine they don’t need my money lol.

Ok... lost my money to. One and done video games are my bread and butter. I will gladly keep buying physical copys of games i like rather than continue to play the same game over and over with different content every month.

They choose chop suey.

It is easy nowadays to play games and not feel like missing out much.

Business is simple. Find out what your potential customers want, see if you can sell them that for a price they’re willing to pay and makes you money.

It isn’t about providing something no on wants. Just like when Warner Bros made a second Aquaman film.

Warner Brothers management proving they're determined to destroy Warner Brothers while making their executives and shareholders a couple more dollars for a few years before it all goes bust.

@KnightsTemplar it's such an insane perspective. They mean "one and done" in that they can only get $70 from someone. Shock horror.

Never paid for a "live service" game, nor have I ever rented a game either, and that is not going to change.

It's crazy to think how much die-hard World of Warcraft fans have paid for their habit over the last 20 years, and that too, like all else, shall inevitably pass (though I'm impressed that it's endured for so long!).

It doesn't seem unreasonable that a large live service game based on the very popular DC universe might have the potential to be a huge gaming hit. But they based it on 4 minor characters the casual fan is barely aware of. Madness to even think who would greenlight such a risky prospect with the budget it got.

So the single player Harry Potter sells 22 million copies last year, the biggest selling game of the year, and thier live service dross of a game SS:KtJL tanks (as predicted by everyone) and their take away is to move away from single players titles to live service ones?

How are these people in a job?

@Sisilly_G You play a game on NSO? Then you've rented a game before.

@IsThis5or6 Technically true, but for some people, the NSO games are just an extra. You might have the subscription just to play online. I'm an avid no-renter always-own person and I have NSO. While I do enjoy playing the old games on my Switch (while I can), they're definitely not why I have the sub.

There are enough so called "life service games" out there. Give me full fat games on a cartridge.

They're have to learn the hard way then, fine by me.

oh no..... so their next game will probably ~ dumbledore kills the hogwart school of witchcraft and wizardry 😂🤣

@SBandy1 and a six figure job at that.

@IsThis5or6 : There are always comments like these that attempt to impugn my stance via a presumptive "gotcha". I didn't stutter. Nor have I ever subscribed to NSO (apart from the occasional 7 day free trial, which have repeatedly done nothing to change my mind).

There are plenty of games that I would happily buy outright if given the option, but as an ongoing rental? Absolutely not. And broadly speaking, I don't think that NSO offers a substantial enough value proposition (outside of a family plan) to make this glorified surcharge worthwhile.

Warner Bros might be the worst game developer out there in my opinion. They killed Mortal Kombat

Sounds like a money laundering scheme to me, honestly.

WB games is going under lol

I am personally always very happy to play the free part of any good live service games. Played Fortnite for hours and never paid a single penny, SUCKERS!!!

Well, that’s the dictionary definition of “a decision made by clueless executives”.
Like, live service can make money, but it is very, very hard to get to a point where it is serviceable in terms of earning money.
So, so, sooo many live service games are dying. Even some that people actually like. They aren’t the ger rich quick ticket execs think they are. Like any game, they need to be appealing and well made, and most importantly, there needs to be people that want to play them.

Which is why ignoring the voices of the people who actually play the stuff is mind bogglingly stupid.

Textbook clueless executive decision

Utter morons. How can the takeout from making the best selling single player game of 2023, the first to beat Call of Duty in like a decade I might add, making well over a billion quid, to be to convert it to a failed live service like Suicide Squad, which has like 400 players on steam.

These execs have never played a game in their lives. I'm just sad that Hogwarts Legacy will be the only good Harry Potter game i'll probably ever play. Let's cherish it. What a crying, crying shame.

Perrette believes it's a "volatile" market.

I guess they have the same idea as that guy that said "people need to get used to not owning their games". I am not gonna waste my time and money on a game i cannot play offline, specially a game that is just gonna get nuked from ever being playable again a year later. No thank you.

WB execs: "EA is cutting back on Live Service and Licensed games? And sunsetting existing games? Double down!! We'll take their market share!"

Everybody else: "They have no market share, that's why they're getting out."

WB is slowly becoming EA

Looks like WB has done a Ubi Soft and Bud Light'd itself. This and the involvement of Sweet Baby in the recent Suicide Squad game have sealed their fate.

Its decisions like these that the company is literally tanking at the moment and other big studios like EA are going through massive layoffs. It’s also a reason why smaller, indie studios are thriving like Larian and older games getting either straight ports or slight remasters are all the rage. They are simply doing games better and in smaller budgets. Budgeting seems to be a big factor in a lot of companies tanking lately. They have the mentality, it seems, that the more they spend the better it’s going to be. Looking at you, DISNEY! The sad part is that they don’t see that they just need to get back to practicality. The more you spend on something the less out of touch it seems to become. No one can dispute that the Lord or the Rings Trilogy will never be topped (I would say in both film and literature) and the entire trilogy was made for less than what a single Marvel film costs and it looks absolutely brilliant. In the same vein I would rather much bust out The Wind Waker than most anything being released today. Nintendo still seems to be in a great spot however and honestly if they were the only ones of the big AAA companies still standing when the dust settles, I think I can be okay with that. I’m just REALLY glad WB got out Hogwarts Legacy and the Lego Skywalker Saga before they started all this live service games BS. They are some of my favorite games (even the sequel trilogy portion in Lego Skywalker Saga is more palpable than the actual films).

"Hey, do you remember that thing that didn't work out well recently? Let's do more of that!" -WB executives.

Huh, so they didn’t learn from the success of Hogwarts Legacy? Typical WB I suppose. Generally I like games set in the DC universe but I don’t want to live there. ESO is enough of a time suck for me. I happen to really enjoy The Elder Scrolls, I can’t say the same for WB’s IPs.

Funny how their last service game justice league has flopped and cost them a fortune (I imagine) yet their latest single player game hogwarts legacy is still in the top 10 a year after its release.

Another suit who doesn’t get it. Shun “one and done” games at your own financial risk.
It’s really not that complicated - it’s akin to how some people prefer to read a book as opposed to subscribing to a magazine.

same wb that allowed a broken version of mk1 for the switch be released in such a horrid state their basically like ea and 2k.

Are focus groups for video games not a thing? Or are they getting people to say they want live service games to mess with them?

And in other news, famous Internet entertainment company Rooster Teeth Productions (which is a subsidiary of Warner Bros. Discovery), has just announced today that they are shutting down, after 21 years of being in business.

That, taken with this report about live services, goes to show that Warner Bros. Discovery is more interested in making money than they are providing good entertainment.

@jorel262 It all comes down to what the shareholders want. And the shareholders are financial groups whose sole purpose is to make as much money as they can. Focus groups, real or hypothetical, can say as much as they want, but at the end of the day, the shareholders hold the real power in the company. To paraphrase Frank Herbert's Dune, "He who controls the shares, controls the company."

I think it is time for Live service games to get rid of the FOMO (fear of missing out) element in them.

For example, make it so battle passes never expire (you can select old battle passes.) And make it so you can always do pass events, etc.

Obviously this is not the only thing that needs to be touched/changed in a live service game. But it is a good step in direction. (Some live service games have done these changes, but they are less known games.)

How about focusing on game optimization instead? Just a thought.

Someone with common sense would see the sales figures of WB's "best selling game of 2023" and think “ooh, perhaps we can keep the money rolling in here with dlc?”

But they dont seem to be willing or able to do that, which seems absolutely absurd - considering how many units it sold!

Guess we can call this Stadia anyone?????

@SwitchForce Stadia is not live service, Stadia is cloud gaming which is kinda like live service but better. There's a minor difference. With Stadia if you bought a rent game in there you could play those games for as long as Stadia remain in existence online consistently. With live service games you pay full price for the game but still had to be online at all time. You can't even play the game for as long as the live service exist cause once the server is full at any one time then you get kick out due to low bandwidth speed or the server just couldn't handle the traffic regardless if the game is single or multiplayer. Then you had to wait for an open server to even get a chance to connect and play again. Long story short one had you waiting (live service), the other don't (cloud gaming). An example of a live service game is The Day After, an example of a cloud game is Gylt.

If you bought into The Day After there's a likely chance you'll have server issue more than you actually get to play the game, if you bought into Gylt on Stadia, you get to play the game every time online. You won't get kick out of a server unless your internet is down or you're offline. Also another reason why cloud games doesn't had server issue like live service games is because of this, on Stadia they didn't just had one copy of Gylt running on their servers, they had multiple copies of Gylt running on their servers so if you can't connect to one version, the bandwidth will automatically connect you to the next available one thus no waiting and no getting kick out. With live service game you only connect to one version of the game which had multiple servers and those server had limited bandwidth connection. Once a server is full, you had to keep on waiting and hope for an open spot. It's basically a waiting game, you're literally waiting for your turn to have fun and you'll never know when you'll get kicked out. Worst case scenario is when they shutdown for maintenance, you get kick out immediately and won't be able to play the game until the maintenance is over.

The problem with moving away from "one and done" games in favor of continuous life-service games is that a lot of people aren't interested in playing games with no foreseeable end that demand an unknown time investment. Every time you commit to a live service game, you're giving up the capacity to play nearly anything else.

@Serpenterror You can't even play the game for as long as the live service exist cause once the server is full at any one time then you get kick out due to low bandwidth speed or the server just couldn't handle the traffic regardless if the game is single or multiplayer.

Here's the elephant in the room you have to pay a ISP to have internet to access such LiveServices and ISP in NA isn't cheap nor is all connections stable unless you have only Fiber then your limited to server connection and how many users use it. People make this sounds simple but fail to tell people you First need ISP before you get any kinda internet or Streaming or Live Service or Online Gaming. Nothing is free here or low cost to use.

In the spongebob narrator voice, "2 investors meetings later..."

WB: were canceling several games and closing several studios.

@acgp yeah man. When they turned the Krypt into lootboxes, changed the store kurrency values to screw over players after reviews hit, had an ad for MKII on the MKXL title screen when II WAS ALREADY INSTALLED, and required an online connection for practice mode progression and towers, I saw the writing on the wall and said noooooope.

@Clammy I'm not even an HP guy, and like .. Quidditch is RIGHT THERE. They could add it to HL as a DLC quest/campaign and also create an online version.

@LikelySatan : Sorry, was purposefully not mentioning "The game which must not be named" (*) on here. Quidditch does seem hard to do. But they have pretty much everything already there to make a load of missions using existing assets.

A simple piece of DLC - That potion which enables you to turn into someone else, and access their dorm rooms, etc. So you can see/interact with other houses you didnt get to see in your initial play thru.

Then add missions off each house to be done while pretending to be that house person (sorry - I dont know the terms, my knowledge comes from watching films with my kids - and watching them play the game).

etc etc.. I mean, Im not a game designer, and I can come up with many simple to develop DLC's and missions which wont break the core game.

Not gonna be huge amounts of work - charge a few $. Reap rewards, rinse and repeat.

Then you have your "forever live" game...

But of course, that's not what they mean, they just mean easy to manage online stat driving borefests, loot crates, etc.

Heck, you could even add "loot crates" in the game as it is.. have an owl do a drop off, etc.

What about some post game missions, where whether you decided to play as good or evil changes the story in them, or opens up different options, etc etc?

Add some new spells/weapon types/costumes/etc.

It all seems very easy to me.. but what do i know?

• • im quite proud of that comment, I still can make amazing dad jokes.

@GEKGanon : yip. Im certainly not. And if I did, I'd only get one of them, I certainly wouldnt "own" multiple games which werent one-and-done.. Why would I? If I'm still playing the first one lots?

Everyone seems to be chasing a golden egg laying goose, without knowing why...

@Serpenterror *was

@SwitchForce Which is why online play on console are ripoffs, you already pay for the ISP for internet accessibility and now you had to pay again if you just want to play videogames using that same accessibility. This also means streaming subscriptions of any kind are also ripoffs, you already pay for internet but if you want more contents you had to pay a sub to get them and the more you sub, the more money you lose. Worst case is that if for some reason you lose internet access, those subscriptions you had not cancelled you still get charge for and on some of those subscriptions, sometimes they hide or block the cancel option so to makes it difficult for you to cancel the service.

@Clammy I don't know HP either, besides some things that I've absorbed from cultural osmosis.

@LikelySatan Autocorrect kept messing with my typing so if you happen to read how strange my comment sound it's usually because of that. Remember every time I mention the word stadium, autocorrect kept changing it to Stadia for some reason. That's why sometimes when you see me wrote Capcom Arcade Stadium, it came out as Capcom Arcade Stadia cause the autocorrect in my phone it kept messing with my typing and I had type Stadia too many times in the past that it remembers that name and usually autocorrect to that. Also sometimes I'm too lazy to fix it.

@Serpenterror oh. Yes, that makes more sense, ha.

So in other words, WB Games doesn't like money, got it!

As if I needed yet another reason not to buy games from them. I'll take one and done games every day of the week.

And once again the late stage capitalism doesn’t even try to hide its ugly self. They just want IP they can use to milk money out of people without having to take any risks.

@Serpenterror to be fair with streaming services you are paying for the content and that’s it. They don’t stop if your internet cuts out the same way your internet won’t stop if all your online devices died, or your gym membership doesn’t stop if you don’t go. You’re paying for access to that content, be it Netflix shows or the running mills at the gym, whether or not you use it is not part of the product and never has been.
They are a rip-off but not in that way.

Game subscriptions the usual reasoning is servers, which do cost money, but then PC games don’t charge so I don’t know. I guess that’s why most also throw in free games. But yeah they feel more a rip-off, especially as PlayStation and Nintendo used to be free.

So their logic is that because their game that was panned partially because of its forced "live" service failed, they should double down on the portion of the game everyone hated. How do these people get put in charge of anything???

Oh well, I've gone almost full retro at this point anyways. I now own ~600 retro classics via Steam, mini consoles, a Wii U library 160 titles deep, and aftermarket development/homebrews. Along with that, I am slowly rebuilding a Steam library of the best from 1977 - 2017. In essence, the industry is pricing and designing themselves out of my budget.