Nintendo Admits It Released A New Model Of The Switch To Fight Piracy

Nintendo shouldn’t have used that off the shelf chip without heavily modifying it for piracy. just sayin.

Pre-2018 Switches have probably just jumped in value...bit like the PSP and Vita with 'certain' firmware versions.

Friendly reminder: a pirated copy of a game is by no means necessarily a lost sale. Jusayin.

Seems like they caught the flaw early on, which is good; but yeah, I wonder how much the older versions of the switch will now go for?

@Damo - did you just accuse a court of extortion?!? ;-p

I don't believe that Nintendo lost "millions" due to some piracy. Sounds like a bunch of fluff to strengthen their case in court.

Well, later adopters got somewhat more battery juice out of that regardless of the other incentives.

As with Vita, I don't expect the CFW scene to truly bloom until well after the console is discontinued anyway.

@RupeeClock what do you mean hardly? it literally was an off the shelf tegra we knew that from the first tear down🙃.

it should have used custom hardware gpu instead of an off the shelf gpu people already knew the architecture for. Sure software was customized for the switch by nvidia but nothing was done to the SoC and that was a mistake.

@Deadlyblack if 100k people each pirated only 10 full price games Nintendo loses $60000000 so idk about that one

@RupeeClock they modified the software but not the chip. The first initial tear down was a basic T210 with a maxwell gpu. Same ones they used on the shield supposedly

@Abweegee you're telling me if I go pirate every switch game right now multiple times I could bankrupt nintendo

Nintendo has had to release a new version of our hardware in response to one of these hacking tools, and this modification entailed countless hours of engineering and adjustments to our global manufacturing and distribution chains and, of course, corresponding resources.

So, just in case anyone thought the latest Switch (or any other hardware product) is released in order to offer better features or additional use cases to us as customers - you can quote a paid agent for Nintendo right here clearly implying otherwise. New OLED screen? That's a sop they're throwing us.

NCL can f*** off. I'll be remembering this when their next hardware is released.

@RupeeClock it was VERY good software customization. That same chip performed way worse on cell phones with better specs so they did some magic getting it to run games like breath of the wild at a good frame rate. I’m just confused on how nobody on both sides thought piracy wouldnt be an issue sooner than later.

@CANOEberry since it says 2018 this is for that switch refresh where we got better battery life not the oled models that came out last year.

@CANOEberry I don't think this refers to Switch OLED, but the 2019 revision with Mariko chip. A minor revision that improved security, but for us consumers the important thing is that it was more energy efficient.

@Strictlystyles @KoopaTheGamer Fair observation, but my point still stands. The increased power efficiency wasn't the primary motivation. Lawyer-san didn't even mention it.

@CANOEberry I think it's best to read between the lines of any sales patter. But they did make improvements to the switch which were a benefit to the consumer, so they are not lying.

@somebread go ahead lmao 💀

@CANOEberry So are you saying that they should've left the security holes in the system? I don't think it's particularly rare for manufacturers to make revisions with minor changes. Sony does it, Microsoft does it, Nintendo does it. And many of these revisions are so small that they aren't even advertised.

@Abweegee Depends, how many of those people would have actually bought those games if there was no way to pirate them?

It's easy to say "Every pirated copy is $60 lost" (Also makes for spectacular claims for damages), but it's not quite that straightforward in real life.

Yeah and the brave attempt at game preservation (which Nintendo so callously refers to as "hacking") is the direct cause of Nintendo's anti-consumer policies and contempt for their loyal fanbase.

I pour one out for Gary Bowser, and for everybody continuing the good fight.

Back up your copies lads, make sure Nintendo can't hoard their legacy content and don't let Bowser's sacrifice be in vain.

Nintendo: Releases a flawed system.

Hacker: Finds flaw and releases the info publicly.

Nintendo: Ugh! This guy made us change everything!

... I'm sure if Bowser didn't find the flaw, someone else would have. This is how the internet works. You can't just throw the law at something that requires engineering. They're lucky someone didn't use it for something worse, like a worm virus.

@gcunit Yes it is. If pirated software and hardware surpass a certain threshold, you educate the customer it doesn't make sense to buy games, if they're free.

Here in Brazil in the Ps2 era, hacked versions of ps2 were essentially the norm, over 80% of the ps2s sold were hacked versions and over 95% of software sold was a pirate copy. There were huge markets in the streets for fake ps2 games. Anyone who had an original ps2 and payed full price for their games was considered an idiot.

All of that to huge losses to sony and developers.

@maulinks a declarative like "Yes it is (always a lost sale)" followed by a condition "if it passes a certain threshold" is literally proving their point though, that the default state is not necessarily a lost sale

I love these articles. Purely for the comments section.

Nintendo didn’t secure a jail term or impose a extortionate fine. The tone of this article is really off. Some guy broke the law, was found guilty in a court, and then punished according to the law.

I have issues with how Nintendo manages their legacy content, but it is their content. I have no problem with any company using the law to protect their products.

Now it'll take them a week to crack the device.

I'm willing to bet that if every government in the world were to legalize piracy, Nintendo would STILL be rolling in the dough. The average consumer (i.e., people like me) is either too dumb to know how to pirate games or too convicted by their conscience not to support the developers.

So they're basically saying that without them we might not have gotten the improved Switch with extended battery life, and since no Switch Pro seems to be releasing we'd be stuck with the original Switch, the OLED (with old switch hardware mind you) and the LITE?

@CANOEberry Nintendo never even marketed that revision to the public. It just came out and people had to discover it was different. They weren’t selling the public that we needed this new device because it benefited us. They never even mentioned it.

@VinylCreep This is the reason I highlighted the OLED model in my comment, not the 2019 revision.

Love that they nailed this hacker and he’s in prison. And I report nintendo privacy all the time. I hate when people illegally use Nintendos copyright and trademark. Even fan based created crap where user makes money by driving traffic to their wed site and collecting ad revs.

@Not_Soos the problem is - as @maulinks said earlier - that once piracy hits a certain level the market crashes. The same thing happened with the DS - in the last part of the DS life cycle every game was a commercial failure because so many people were pirating.

The long term consequences of this can be seen on Android - games are worth nothing so don’t try selling them. So devs who want to make money have to make them freemium.

It’s ultimately a disaster for players.

Cool! Although I buy and play all my Switch games legitimately and own hundreds of games for the console on the eShop, plus have a subscription to the Nintendo Switch Online (w/ Expansion Pack) service and am therefore entiled to play all the classic libraries of games, this news makes me happy to be the owner of two original-model Nintendo Switch consoles. No fancier screen, no better batteries--but no extra DRM or anti-consumer "protections" either.

@RubyCarbuncle I see where you are coming from, but please remember that Nintendo don't decide on the final punishment, the courts do. Also, consider that its designed to be a warning to other people, so a £50 fine & a week's community service would only lead to an increase in piracy as people weigh it up.

The balance theyre addressing is "a lifetime's free switch games for (insert punishment here)".

@CANOEberry But you’re using the previous revision as some sort of evidence that the OLED screen is bull****. Your rationale is out of whack.

$65 million? If only they would spend that kind of money fixing their faulty joycon issue.

@judaspete
I wish they would. Lol.

@nimnio "That's true, but ten hours playing a pirated game is very likely ten hours not playing paid games.

Most people are busy and have only so many hours for gaming. If all your limited gaming time can be filled playing free, pirated games, there is not much motivation to buy them."

In a world of F2P and heavily discounted video games, people who don't want to give Nintendo £60 for a game, aren't going to be giving them £60 just because they can no longer pirate games.

The more likely scenario is they buy something else.

You know what? Until Nintendo provides a reasonable, legal way for us to purchase their legacy content, I will continue to download roms. No, a half-baked online service doesn't cut it. A true virtual console backlog that allows us to purchase and download games, with ALL the titles from NES onward, that is transferable to new consoles so we don't have to keep buying them over and over again. Basically an iTunes for Nintendo. It would print money.

@TexanBanjo
Gary Bowser broke the law. What you call game preservation is actually breaking the law. Gary Bowser made no sacrifice for “ game preservation”.

@somebread If enough people do it enough times, then yeah. Why do you think studios go out of business? Sure, they were able to pay folks while they were working on the game through investments, but what happens when the money dries up and the game doesn't make the sales it was projected to make, thus justifying the investment?

I still use my 2017 Switch and it has been an absolute tank. I had to get the fan replaced (which NOA did for free) but other than that it is an amazingly durable console after 5 years of regular use. Really glad I didnt mod it because I am happy to support a company that made such an amazing product. I don't really judge modding but if you lose online play I don't think it's worth it.

I don’t blame them for cracking down on piracy (it isn’t harmless nor is anyone entitled to a free product) but I always feel this is where hackers spoil it for the rest of us. Time spent on r&d to combat hacking/thieves is less time spent on improvements to better the system. We might have gotten the OLED sooner rather than an in place revision and then the OLED. There is always a cost with security.

@maulinks You're making the assumption that those people in Brazil would have bought a PS2 and all those games if piracy wasn't an option.

For some people, a console may be just about affordable, but they don't bother buying one because they can't justify further expenditure on games. This was me 20 years ago.

But give some of those people the chance to play games for free if they just fork out for the hardware and they'll at least lay down some money.

@Strictlystyles If not mistaken, while the Tegra Chip is used in the Switch the GPU was customized. The Tegra Chip is used in the shield and doesn't have the same GPU specs.

@nimnio I have many hackable and hacked gaming consoles/handhelds, and a PC. I could spend the rest of my life just playing pirated games. And yet I have the motivation to buy and own over 1,000 physical games, including 200+ Switch games (even though I have a Day 1 Switch I could use to play pirated games).

@thinkhector I could be wrong about the shield thing that’s why I said supposedly since I’ve only heard people say it in passing and I don’t know the specific specs of the shield. initial tear downs was definitely an off the shelf tegra. I rember this specifically because there were some discussions about it back then.

There’s a bunch of websites that confirm that
https://www.techinsights.com/blog/nintendo-switch-teardown

@Ryu_Niiyama that’s a good way to think about it. Which is why it’s so terrible that this was such an avoidable mistake in my eyes.

Here in Indonesia, peoples can jailbreak the OLED model and sold the machine with more expensive price.
And thus Nintendo need to fight the piracy.

Well duh it was obvious they only released a revised model because of the bootrom exploit in the og model

@RubyCarbuncle I was thinking about this the other day when I saw something about amber heards lawyer saying she wouldn't be able to pay johnny depp what she's been ordered to pay

@Kienda

lol, "little guy". You really want to make it sound like big evil Nintendo harassed an innocent blue-collar worker. In reality, Nintendo took a notorious criminal to court and he got a fair sentence.

40 month imprisonment isn't a harsh sentence for years of criminal activities. He'll be out long before that.

@gcunit this means a good deal for the hardware manufacturer but not for the software developers.

PS2 was a huge success, but for the beggining of the next generation, considerable third gen support shifted to xbox 360 also for this reason (among other reasons like coming earlier, being cheaper).

@Nintendo_Dandy I don't know in what sense you're using the word "superfluous", but if it is the correct sense, you're just being offensive. Sorry but I'm reporting you.

Also, Brazil had the 6th largest GDP in the world in the 2000s decade, so be careful with your assumptions. Not being US or Europe does not mean a majority of population of poor people.

@gcunit also currently in Brazil the PS4, xbox and switch are huge successes, specially PS4. PS4 is considerably more expensive than PS2 was, the same holding true for games. And pirate games are basically almost no longer available on a widespread basis.

So yes, not saying all, but a lot of those people would have bought a PS2 back then, which holds specially true considering we are in a crisis since 2015 (during ps4 generation), but we were 6th largest GDP in the world by the end of the 2000s (during PS2 and PS3 era).

I'm talking about rich and middle class people, all owning pirated PS2s back then. I was middle class, owned a pirated PS2. I didn't know a single person who owned a "PS2 bloqueado" (that's what we called a blocked, non-pirateable PS2). If you did you would be considered an idiot.

@RasandeRose no, I’m not trying to make out he’s some blue collar worker or a saint.

I’m just saying that it’s quite harsh for him individually to take such a hit when there are far more than him doing this kind of thing, but more than that, Nintendo is notorious for going after real “little guys”. Even fan made projects have been hit with the Nintendo legal hammer.

That isn’t about protecting their business. It is about control and power and it harms their fanbase.

Nintendo needs to lighten up a bit.

The fact that people act like someone who was literally profiting from piracy sound like a victim is just hilarious to read.

My fan in my original V1 Switch was so loud and was starting to make grinding noises...
I'm so Happy I've decided to upgrade to The Nintendo Switch OLED! Best Decision Ever!

@sanderson72 they did, but I didn't sell my original v1 Switch nor traded it in, I destroyed it to prevent hackers from pirating games. One less v1 on the market lmao 🤣

Reminds me of Sega doing something similar with the Dreamcast back in the day. From 2001 onward, MIL-CD support was dropped, making consoles incompatible with CD-ROM discs. However, this happened only months before support for the system was ultimately pulled, being WAY too late.

This is 2022. You can't release something and be like "please don't hack this". You hire a security team to pentest your systems and hardware.

@Strictlystyles I mean it's basically the same. But it's not just right off the shelf. The chip inside the Switch is actually slightly faster (not much but it is). It also has double the ram. More importantly it had to have custom controller to scale the CPU speed when "switching" from handheld to docked.

@Rika_Yoshitake
Hey, don’t call it piracy. Thats way to mean. Use game preservation instead.

@blindsquarel Apologies about my hate speech towards Preservators by calling them pirates!

" Each of the three men named in the indictment faced 11 felony counts, including conspiracy to commit wire fraud, conspiracy to circumvent technological measures and to traffic in circumvention devices, trafficking in circumvention devices, and conspiracy to commit money laundering." - Wikipedia

The last one there in particular is interesting.

@sanderson72 all firmware versions of psp and vita are hackable.

@Rika_Yoshitake
It’s ok, just want to make sure no ones feelings get hurt.
( just to be clear, I am being sarcastic.)

How about not breaking the law?

The irony of some dude named Bowser ending up the bad guy in a Nintendo story…

@Piyo
Nah, making the games available for a price is piracy. Doing it for free is necessary to ensure that the file gets distributed enough to remain preserved.

@thinkhector gonna need a source on that but still stands they used an off the shelf chip that was software customized while knowing people already had that architecture figured out . Bad idea.pascal would have been a better idea but of course money. Was it worth 65 million in reconfiguring? I dunno.

@Strictlystyles Yeah I'm not buying that 64 million dollar number. They also said they updated the firmware to combat piracy. That doesn't cost that much to push out new firmware.

@nhSnork the only way to use a Vita or PSP anymore is CFW, and unfortunately the 3DS/Wii U duo are already there. I see why Nintendo is shutting down the eShops for them, but the moment they start shutting down digital storefronts is when I mod the console to make archival copies of the games I bought (and despite the fact that we are allowed to do that according to US DMCA Title 17, Section 108 Nintendo absolutely HATES us doing it, even though it's been shown that to resell their own games later they have to pirate them themselves).

And now to deviate from the target response and say that piracy doesn't necessarily equal lost sales and might actually help make sales (an example I can think of is I originally pirated Terraria back when it was in 1.2.4 on PC, and since I enjoyed the couple of hours I played the pirated copy I went and bought the game on Steam).

@Piyo that's basically what it's like. I'm a firm believer that once you buy it it is yours to do with as you please.

@Abweegee what a convenient bias for Nintendo and other ip owners: just because I play a pirated game doesn't mean I would buy it if I couldn't

@Aiodensghost I use my Vita to this day (a few latest purchases for it being no older than last summer), not willing to hack it as long as the redownload servers themselves remain online (which Wii shop's example suggests may last a damn good while), not to mention that going CFW on the main unit would effectively lock me out of any meaningful PS4 usage. But I invested in a spare and already hacked unit instead (which, I concur, incidentally rendered my PSP redundant to the point where I moved the whole contents under Adrenaline roof and gave the older handheld away); chances are I'll be eventually going that way with 3DS as well. Switch's region-free nature makes it less topical, but by the time it's off the shelves and the CFWs have gone to town, there may be enough delisted or translation-patched stuff to entice a similar course of action, too.

@Piyo
I understand it can be used for good purposes. But the vast majority of the people “ preserving their games” aren’t doing it for preservation purposes. Not saying it can’t be good, but it is easily taken advantage of.

If only Microsoft had a dollar for each non genuine copy of windows...

@Piyo People, who download illegal copies from the internet, are not preserving anything, especially not "their" games. How can it be "their" game, if they do not own a legit copy? It is annoying that they use terms to give their clearly illegal behavior a legit seem.
Because they have nothing better to give back...like actually pay for the game. Also for mindless sheeps bahha at each other you agreed the to the EULA when you buy the console or games. You gave up all rights you have no say in this.

@SwitchForce
as @Piyo said, the purchase was made before the EULA is agreed to. You can't force someone into a contract after the fact.

@shaneoh Alot of dumb replies. Once you purchase you Agreed to the EULA you don't get to change the TOS. Love how people backtrack when caught dead stop.

@SwitchForce
Who's backtracking? I've stuck to this stance from the get go. I didn't sign anything when I purchased the product. Saying I have to follow a contract I wasn't provided with (or even made aware of) before I purchased the device wouldn't hold up in any reasonable court of law. The fact I hit "I agree" to any ToS when I powered on the switch is irrelevant, the entire contract is invalid.

@cagriggs the fine was only levied because Nintendo brought a civil lawsuit, right? So in that sense, it wouldn't have happened if Nintendo didn't bring the suit, so i think that part is fair.

@SwitchForce i agree, lots of dumb replies. If they have in a license agreement that u have to commit murder, is that enforceable, just because they said it in the agreement, lol? Some of the things they put in there aren't legal. They have an interest in making u think u have no rights & do not own the good that u purchase. Live service games are different, but physical games are considered a good that u own, regardless of what big corporations want u to believe (as evidenced by actual court decisions). But some just believe everything they are told, as evidenced by the last 2 years... I don't care enough to do ur research for u, but u should be more informed about ur hobby, IMO.

@TexanBanjo yup, piracy is good when it's targeting a company trying to axe game ownership.

Microsoft tried this and got ratiod so hard they did a complete 180 and are the best of the three at game preservation.

Nintendo tries to take away game ownership and their fans cheer them on.

@Rika_Yoshitake How excited will you be when Nintendo's next console locks all their games behind a subscription of five year installments of $1,000?

I'm sure you love Adobe just as much.

@blindsquarel you know what's funny? If any other company did a fraction of what Nintendo's pulled during the Switch era, we'd never hear the end of it.

If any other company tried to pull an Adobe with their classic games, they'd get blasted as greedy and controlling until they changed their decision.

Nintendo does just that and their fans worship them.

@ThomastheTankEngine
The majority of the people “preserving games” are actually pirating them. I don’t follow any other gaming companies other than Nintendo, so I couldn’t tell you what they would do. In another comment you say Nintendo wants to take away game ownership. Can you explain how? You can still buy games physical and have them for life. Or by game ownership do you mean stealing the games so you can stick it to the man. I will not deny nintendo does some scummy things. Such as not finishing games. And even taking down scans of a Mario 64 magazine. But I can’t fault Nintendo for taking steps to protect their ip’s and not have things stolen from them. I know if someone did that to me I would take steps to ensure it wouldn’t happen again.

Sure, I'll explain how. And I'm not concerned with piracy, but rather when companies get too arrogant and greedy and need to be punished. Nintendo is just there.

As for taking away game ownership, Nintendo Switch Online. No way to buy first party NES, SNES, N64 games from Nintendo and after the Wii U and 3DS eShop shuts down, all legal methods of purchasing a copy of legacy content will exist only in scalped and aging hardware and dwindling copies of used physical games.

Nintendo fans cheer them on for taking away game ownership, and one could argue that taking away means of purchasing games is "PrOtEcTiNg ThEiR iP". No ownership means no stealing right? How would you like Nintendo's next console to lock all their games behind a subscription service of five year installments of $1,000? Nintendo fans seem ecstatic about this given how much they love it that Nintendo keeps forcing rentals for an increasing amount of games and systems.

@Kienda

He's not some "little guy", he is one of the front figures for one of the most notorious pirate services since the original Xbox-days. Nintendo does send cease and desist-letters toward fan projects, yes. But they generally don't go after them, no.

@Richnj Then if they cannot afford to pay Nintendo £60 for a game then don't play it. Buy a £5 indie game off Steam or a cheap one from Eshop - that IS the whole point. I can't afford a Ferrari so I have to buy a cheaper vehicle within my budget. It doesn't mean just because I can't afford a Ferrari I am entitled and justified to steal one.

@Antares-Scorpius

1) This is an old post. I probably haven't been back on this website since I posted this.

2) It's a false equivalent. A Ferrari is a physical object. The labor and materials alone have a set cost. It also has a value because you can sell it on.

A digital Nintendo game, that most likely covered the production costs within days of sale, only devalues the longer it sits on a digital store. £15 from ten people is better than £60 from one. It doesn't make business sense not to have price drops happen.

3) I never said people were entitled to products. I was making the argument that it's better for both customer and business when price drops happen. If a customer doesn't see value in your product, they'll go elsewhere.

4) You're not stealing it. You're purchasing it at a price that better suits the customer's value of said product or current means (which means more today in 2023 than it did When I made this post). When games are unavailable or overpriced, that is when they get pirated. Price drops will actually prevent theft. Like Gabe Newell said, piracy is service problem.