Nintendo Highlights Upcoming N64 Releases In Latest 'Switch Online + Expansion Pack - Overview Trailer'

The only game that'll convince me to think about it (maybe) is the Mystical Ninja games

Awesome! Loving the Expansion Pass So Far! Games being added is like Christmas 😋❤

It's a good service, $50 a year is literally nothing, most people that complain are teens with no jobs or people who's fav youtuber told them to dislike it like a hivemind.🤷🏾‍♂️

I could probably accept the meagre, drip-fed selection of games if the emulation was any good. Unfortunately, it’s not. Yet, anyway…

@Anti-Matter Technically there is a DDR game on N64.....if you don't mind Disney or Japanese imports.

I believe Japan was meant to be getting Custom Robo 1 and 2 at some point, so be interesting to see if we get some Western Exclusives when the get those, maybe Pokemon Puzzle League.

Cool, been on a 64 marathon recently; beat Banjo and Kazooie and Dr. mario, still playing F-Zero. I look forward to playing these too.

Looking forward to trying Pokemon Snap for the first time.

Hoping to see Waverace 64, 1080 Snowboarding and a few others join the service.

@Arkay I want to have games, not rent them. For me, it is one of the big reasons to not buy Expansion Pak.

@Arkay I agree… and with a full Family Plan it’s $10 a year!! How could anyone complain about the price?

That’s even cheaper than what you would pay for the Mario Kart Booster Pack alone!

@Vyacheslav333 then keep bombarding Nintendo for a N64 Classic. That would be the best option tbh.
However we would be missing online multiplayer.

@fafonio Hm... Maybe, better idea would be to keep bombarding Nintendo for Virtual Console's resurrection?

Where’s Wave Rave 64 you cowards?!

@Matty1988 BEST. INTRO SONG. EVER.

Still never gonna get me to buy without the big hitters!
Goldeneye
Perfect dark
DK64
bad fur day
Diddy Kong racing

@Vyacheslav333 same. don't want Nintendo to be able to take it away from me anytime they want...

@Angelic_Lapras_King
But here is the thing.
DDR on N64 just only ONE game, Japanese version only and the song list + difficulty range was very weak compared with DDR games on PS1 as DDR PS1 games have a lot of mixes (DDR 1st Mix, DDR 2nd ReMix, DDR Append Club version, DDR 3rd Mix, DDR 4th Mix, DDR 5th Mix, DDR EXTRA Mix, DDR Disney Rave, DDR Disney Mix, DDR Best Hits, DDR USA, DDR Kona mix, etc), gameplay and the song list exactly from DDR Arcade + more challenging step chart on Maniac / SSR difficulty.
Let compare between DDR Disney on N64 and DDR 3rd Mix PS1 (My favorite DDR PS1 game).

And looking at the N64 controller scheme, the controller itself was not suitable to play DDR games with four panel model.
The PlayStation style controller was perfectly suitable to play DDR games as I can navigate my thumbs on both side to press the corresponded arrows quickly.
Even there was a DDR style PlayStation controller during PS1 era.

And that's why I like DDR games on PS1 than DDR N64 because DDR PS1 games have the quality from DDR Arcade (and you can make Edit step chart from DDR PS1, save the Edit on PS1 memory card and use it on DDR Arcade from DDR 1st Mix until DDR EXTREME) and the majority of DDR PS1 songs still being featured in the newest DDR Arcade, Dance Dance Revolution A3.

@AhabSpampurse I agree. That song is now stuck in my head. I can’t be bothered to link up my N64 so I kinda want to see that game added.

Just release Mischief Makers (N64) already.

Shake shake!

I think the asking price is a ripoff, but if they put Ogre Battle 64 it would become very tempting.

Maybe the next three N64 were just shown in order: Kirby, Pokemon Snap, Mario Golf. Looking forward to a new batch in June/July

I can’t say the upcoming N64 games really appeal to me much, but the expansion pack value is decent now - certainly for those of us using a family plan.

I hope we’ll see Pilotwings 64, Assault Suits Leynos (Target Earth) on Sega (and it’s prequel Assault Suits Valken/Cybernator on SNES) and wow us with a major licensed game or 2 like Goldeneye or Goonies. Also let’s not abandon the NES and SNES now that all the low-hanging fruit is (mostly) gone.

I take it from the video you can't rewind N64 games but you can for Genesis games.

I'm becoming more interested in the expansion as time goes on but would like some more unique titles we haven't seen before like Goemon. Diddy Kong Racing would sell it for me. Alien Soldier on Genesis was a step in the right direction.

Old request I know, but can we get folders someday?

@SteamEngenius As is, I don't feel the service is overpriced. It would absolutely be nice if you could buy anything instead of renting but as mentioned earlier there are lots of other rental services that cost far more money. The value gain from the service is also increasing rapidly. It'll be interesting to see where it's at 12 months from now. Personally I'm holding out for two things:

• Quality 3rd party N64 games (or Diddy King racing)
• The N64 Switch controller to be in back in stock for MSRP.

As much as I am a huge n64 fan, and look forward to the futute updates, I’m also intrigued to see what future mega drive games come to the service. There’s a plethora of games out there I’d love to replay, and I just hope the MD service doesn’t go the route of the NES and SNES service and become an after thought.

If you have kids and they never played a game with better graphics online expansion is amazing… ill just stick to the most recent iteration of these game thanks

I felt that the NSO Expansion Pack was worth the money for me, but a lot of people decided otherwise.
That's not 'outrage' or 'cancel culture'.
Nor is it such to merely suggest that it's a bad deal in their opinion.

The discussion around this seems remarkably binary and infantile.

Mario party superstars DLC (new minigames),
GBA games or being able to pay monthly and I’ll get it. I’m not fussed about N64 games, can play sega genesis games anywhere, i already bought the ACNH DLC and i got the Mario Kart DLC for £15

I bought the expansion yesterday for Kart - and just going through the N64 games I forgot how legend they were. I never played with the N64 so they are mostly new to me. Well worth the price of admission imo.

Sin and Punishment? I mean...come on. That game is wild!

I am looking forward to the next big announcement. If for nothing else to watch the naysayers squirm more - it is entertaining.

@Franklin I get it though - I was around for the Horse Armor DLC controversy. People feel an oncoming tide is going to swallow them up and their ideals are at stake. Which is probably true - and they will lose for sure - just as everyone did for Oblivion's horse armor which became what we see today.

I still don't like that it's all effectively written with disappearing ink. If for whatever reason Nintendo no longer wants to support the Switch, or decides to depreciate and abandon the service itself, there's nothing I can do and I won't be able to play any of them at all--because there is no way for us to "buy" to "own" any of these games on the Switch.

But I guess in terms of what is currently available... I still think it's overpriced, especially with how much they want for the special controllers. Also, I'd rather spend the $25 for the Animal Crossing and Mario Kart DLC and have a more permanent license/ownership of them (and I did), I don't think they do a damn thing to improve the value of the service.

The only "value" I see is in the classic games, and I see very little value in that considering Nintendo could just end it tomorrow if they wanted. Not that they will--but I have a distrust in having to rely on others to play nice, compared to just owning something and not having to deal with anyone else.

Bottom line: I still think $50/yr is way too much for something that, as good as its classic game collection may be, could be gone in five years. And the overpriced classic controllers and filler DLC do absolutely nothing in my mind to improve that. Nevermind that constant feeling in the back of my mind that it could all be abandoned with the next Nintendo system.

I don't feel good about any of it--just let me buy my damn games outright like I can the DLC and pay a small fee to use actual online services. I don't like the tying/bundling a bunch of crap--different unrelated things--as a service with an artificially inflated price.

There weren’t many n64 games that I’d call must haves. And we seem to be getting a good amount now. I wonder if they’ll announce another system soon?

@UltraZelda64 emulate.

What happened to SNES snd NES games? Are they getting any third party support? It seems to be only 1st party games that are being released.

@Arkay and to add, didn’t try to buy those games on eBay. If you buy all n64 games on cartridges you pay easily more then 10 years of service.

Im enjoying to play all those games in handheld and with the original controller on a modern tv

@MostHandsieBoy

I have no idea what you're talking about,
and from the sounds of it,
I'll be happier not knowing.

@Anti-Matter playing DDR without a floor mat feels to me like… not actually playing DDR.

Anyways I’m sure the real reason for lack of true DDR in the N64 was storage limitations on the cart vs CDs packed with high quality audio.

Kirby 64 is an ideal game for this service I reckon.
Well worth a go, but probably not a game many would want to buy on its own.

@CupidStunt those are the easiest for Nintendo to release. 3rd party games take negotiation. With Nintendo's catalog the path with the least resistance is the easiest one.

@Kainbrightside

Interesting to hear that from someone who's not played F-Zero X before.
The visuals didn't put you off at all?

I love how you can completely take out other racers.

@Lord youll NEVER see bad fur day MS now owns both the company and the ip youll neve see Perfect Darkl either for same exact reason. When nintendo let Rare go to MS the only thing they legally were able to keep that Rare made was Donkey Kong stuff EVERYTHING else Rare made is theirs and whomever owns them.... Goldeneye is another very long shot as theres alot of licensing that would have to happen... DK64 and Diddy kong racing are the only two you mentioned that have any chance of seeing a release...

@Almighty-Koz

Don't Microsoft own Banjo-Kazooie as well?

If they gonna stop supporting this after releasing last 3 games then yeah no reason to buy the this service if they going to be like this. No Smash 64,Wave Race 64 and other games from EA,Capcom and Konami?

The subscription services are still ripoffs and Virtual Console is the best option to play these games. So why not have an option to purchase individual games?

The Switche Online Expansion Pack service is getting more content but I wouldn't go as far as saying improving, I'd say 'more of the same'.

Nintendo are not playing to its loyal audience, the Mario Kart fans that have owned the older consoles and already played all these old tracks.

These fans want new tracks in a new game, with up to date graphics and new ideas.

Nintendo are playing to the new kids on the block with a revamped Mario Kart 8.

While I understand Nintendo is going to put a huge focus on the expansion pass tier of the membership so people will shell out the $50 a year, I don't think the should be completely ignore the people who just want to spend $20 to play online. They should be making more of an effort to add more NES and SNES games to that tier and while the Earthbound games are nice and a huge win, it was still very few and far between on games being added prior to that. I know there's a cost to licensing games, but I think there's more they could be adding too.

@Arkay or people who already game on 3 different platforms, have an n64, or emulate

Still holding out, hoping one day we can buy them separately (probably not going to happen) but until they add another system or 2 don't see the point in paying $30 extra a year for a handful of n64 games...dont care for megadrive or the animal crossing dlc... I'll buy the mario kart dlc outright.... I'm glad people are enjoying the expansion pass for those who committed to it, I still feel Nintendo can do better

@protocol_penguin The emulation on Genesis games is perfect. And the N64 emulator has been patched fixing all of the previous issues (lack of fog, water temple, game crashed, input lag, etc.).

@protocol_penguin IMO the emulation has actually been pretty good. Lots of improvements in the last couple months. My big issue is the button mapping—I guess if you also get the controller it’s not a problem.

That's great.... but let's see banjo tooie, conkers bad fur day, perfect dark, castlevania legacy of darkness, mischef makers and donky Kong 64

@LUIGITORNADO if I had to guess they will announce GB/GBC for the regular service with GBA for the expansion pack this Fall. Just a wild guess though

@protocol_penguin Except it is good. The initial issues were ironed out and each game is near perfect emulation. There is a slight input lag, but that is on all emulators and Bluetooth controllers. Maybe you need to fact-check more before making a declarative statement like that. And by the way, ModernVintage Gamer is an industry professional who worked directly with WayForward on Rivercity Girls.

https://youtu.be/L-fYXwxuFxQ

@Anti-Matter That DDR controller is somehow very frightening to look at.
@Teksetter Not sure if the "low hanging fruit" on NES/SNES is about the obscure games that have been added to NSO, but there is definitely tons more left.

This service is well worth it in my opinion. Replaying LoZMM right now. Classic. And for those of you that want to own the games instead of renting why not visit eBay. An RGB modded N64 looks pretty good if your TV accepts RGB. If not a Rad2x won’t blow the bank. Then get an Everdrive and boom hello happiness!

I would only be convinced if they pull another Star Fox 2 and bring us an unreleased game. Give us the "real" Mother 3 on N64. Give us Ura Zelda and all of the other 64DD expansions!

@Arkay Or people like me who already have other ways of playing these games. Sorry, I don't see paying $50/year to play the few N64 games I already play on my Wii U, and Genesis games I can play elsewhere (officially too, Sega always re-releases them in some form). So far, I've seen nothing that made me want to buy this service.

As for DLC, I'm going to just buy the Mario Kart DLC by itself. Though, waiting since birthday is coming up, and my folks sometimes get me a new game or an eShop card.

This is optional, when compared to the base NSO service which is required for online play in most games.

Why is it taking so long for Nintendo to add games and other retro systems? Even the virtual console added them at a much faster rate. They should at least put GBA and Gamecube on the service.

@Sunsy so you are saying instead of paying the $50 I should just become you and play the games on the retro systems I already own? Why didn't I think of that?

I didn’t get New Pokémon Snap, even though I somewhat wanted it, so I’m happy the original’s getting added. I can test the water and decide whether to spend $80 on the sequel.

However, I’m going to wait a bit more to get, until at least Majora’s Mask and Banjo-Kazoie is on. I missed out on a lot of N64 games.

I might also wait for some more DLC to be added, because I bought ACNH’s by itself, and I have no interest in MK8D.

@ModdedInkling I don't think those will happen. Ura was cancelled pretty early in development because Aonuma felt the team was just retreading ground and Miyamoto agreed. That is why he challenged Aonuma to make Majora's Mask in a year. There are some Ura assets left over, but they are not functional as a game. As for Mother 3... I think there is a demo build of the game, but they struggled a lot with development. Itoi has been rather public with the reasons why we will never see a complete N64 version of Mother 3.

Though I do agree some N64DD games would be nice. Maybe the F-Zero X Expansion or Doshin the Giant, but there are not that many actual gems for the N64DD (most of them are glorified tech demos like Mario Artist). Most of the games planned for it like Pokemon Snap, Dragon Quest VII and Resident Evil 0 were released either on the N64 proper, moved to the PSOne or saved for the GameCube. Not saying I disagree with your sentiment, but there really isn't a finished unrelated N64 ROM, Nintendo is just sitting on like Starfox 2 for the N64.

@BabyYoda71 Banjo and Majora both are released on the Expansion Pack and are AWESOME! Might be worth checking out the released list

@MostHandsieBoy I’m a Canadian jazzhands

Really excited for Mario Golf to release. Loved that game growing up and I’ve been playing the GameCube entry recently. It’s pretty crazy how big of a turnaround this service has become. The added N64 games and Mario Kart tracks really make it that much more enticing.

@Wexter Wait Banjo is? I realized after I sent that that Majora’s Mask was on it, but I didn’t know Banjo was already. The wording of this article confused me I guess.

I’ll still wait, because I’m planning on buying a lot of 3DS and Wii U games soon, so I don’t want to buy this yet.

If Mystical Ninja doesn't make it, I'll be devastated.

Id really like some lego racers for 64, lol

@BabyYoda71 I forget Canada and AUD use the $ symbol.

@MostHandsieBoy I did not mean it that way, I was just saying why I chose not to buy the expansion pack. What I meant was I have a good chunk of these games already, I have no reason to buy the service. Yes, I still play my Wii U regularly in addition to my Switch.

I'd even say, I have the Sega Genesis Classics on Switch. I have Genesis and Sonic compilations from past systems and PC in addition to this.

If you want to pay for the service for these games, that's completely up to you.

@Arkay

I don't have the expansion pass, and don't directly hate having an internet subscription to play online for switch. I have one.

That being said, I hate not being able to get said games as purchasable entries. Forcing me i
to pay over and over again for something I'd just rather own is really insulting in my mind.

I don't like not having the choice.

Anyone know when WR64 is coming out?

@Sunsy that's perfectly valid, my point was directed to those that relentlessly flame this service day in and day out.
@Kiwi_Unlimited I understand that, having choice is always important.

Has playing the N64 games multiplayer online improved at all? I tried Mario Kart 64 online with just one other person months ago, and despite each of us having full bars, it was a bit janky

@UltraZelda64 Let's say you buy the AC and Mario Kart DLC separately... What happens if in 5 years the eShop is gone, you can't redownload your games, and your SD Card corrupts? You lose the content all the same.

Same if you own a physical game that gets lost/stolen or damaged beyond repair. Yeah you have more control over a physical copy, but some things are beyond our control.

Not trying to sway you one way or the other... I guess my whole point is just enjoy the content you want to enjoy, however you want to enjoy it, because ultimately ownership is temporary in almost all cases.

Give me Ogre Battle 64 and Wave Race 64! Also, Diddy Kong Racing would be fantastic. Thanks Ninty!

@Deege

This is why you rip your ROMs, store them on M-Discs, and launch those M-Discs into low orbit to prevent loss due to a natural disaster or theft!

@Deege I agree! People tend to over-exaggerate physical ownership as the holy grail of gaming, but it can degrade and die if the games are not maintained or just natural hardware failure. This is especially true for disc-based games on the PSOne and Gamecube.

I understand people may want to buy the DLC separately, but eventually, the storage device may fail, the store closes, or just simply a company folds and cannot honour previous digital purchases. The latter almost happened with Sony ten years ago when the company was hurting financially and bleeding money (for those curious it was Spider-Man and the PS4 that propped up the company till they turned it around).

My philosophy is just to enjoy your media how you enjoy it and back up your purchases how you can. At the end of the day, all media can and will be delisted so just enjoy it while you can.

I am happy enough with the expansion pack. Value is good now and will probably be even better over time!

@Flem9000 I don't think there will be many more mega drive games with the N64 games its100% profit for Nintendo when they add mega drive games they have to pay sega

Yo they should add Pilotwings 64, I wanna turn the Mario mountain into Wario

@HeyNavComm they will definitely bring wave race, It's still one of my favorite games to this day, The Wave race Blue Storm game just isn't as good as the N64 version, it's like the controls are off or something.

@ggnorekthx Putin would probably shoot it down 😂

@MostHandsieBoy yes soon as punishment is so good, I just wish I could get good at it, also try the version on wii, it is very good too I hope they release it for switch.

Snowboard Kids! A Snowboarding RPG? Wowzers!

Get Rogue Squadron on NSO Expansion, and maybe Nintendo, we might have a deal.

You guys complaining about the price are funny. It's like 2 bucks a month on top of the regular switch online.

@Arkay
I agree. Netflix costs more per year, but most people seem to care less about the MONTHLY cost as they do the ANNUAL cost.

I'm enjoying the service quite a bit. I finally got to play Banjo and Sin & Punishment, which I missed as a kid. Awesome games both, lived up to the hype.

Personally hoping for some out-of-left-field entries — eventually. Stuff like Body Harvest, Robot on Wheels, Silicon Valley, etc. Or — dare I say it — more Rare games, especially underplayed titles like Jet Force Gemini or Blast Corps (though I found Blast Corps really frustrating back in the day).

As far as first-party goes, I'm mostly looking forward to Wave Race 64, because I never played it.

I hope they continue adding DLC packs as value-adds. I own many switch games, but I do not buy DLC, on principle. I like the NSO Expansion Pass though, so allowing me access to these DLC packs ends up being a big bonus.

@Arkay, Why do these comments on basically anything criticizing Switch online always boils to this, " if you can't afford $50"? That's not an argument. You're just implying people are angry cause they can't afford something. That's stupid; that logic doesn't make any sense. Will you apply that logic to anything that you won't buy cause, in your heart, you know that's not worth the money? You won't.

I can rip this service apart right now. And I can afford it.

Goldeneye
Perfect Dark
Donkey Kong 64
Banjo Tooie
Diddy Kong Racing
Wave Race
Pilot Wings
1080 Snowboarding

@MsJubilee because at the end of the day, that's mostly what they complain about? More content (games and DLC) being added almost monthly yet they still complain about the price. Emulation being improved monthly yet they still complain. I've come to realize Nintendo "fans" will never be happy. This coming from someone that owns multiple systems and I also use third-party emulators.

@electrolite77 $10 is a single nice meal. If you don’t find value for a single yearly payment of $10 for, let me just say an online service, let alone free DLC and retro gaming, then gaming is not the right hobby for you.

It’s 1/6 of a single game … for a WHOLE YEAR of online service. That’s 83 cents per month. FFS 🤦‍♂️

Tbh, at that point you’re either just cheap, stubborn, or don’t have enough friends for a family plan.

A WHOLE YEAR…. free DLC to both best-sellers of the console AND 50+ retro games are just icing on the cake. For … 83…. CENTS

@Sunsy I was a stupid boy and gave away my PS2, my Wii, my Gamecube. I thought, I'll never want to play these again.

So dumb. Regerts.

These games look great but I am more concerned with what is coming after because these were already confirmed to be coming, and Nintendo has a history of us waiting long periods of time before they announce new stuff for the service.

Is it Mario RPG in there?

Call me when they add that one and we'll talk

@protocol_penguin it's fine, though.

@protocol_penguin Have you been living under a rock?
The've almost completely fixed ocarina, and majora's mask is objectively the best port its ever had.

@RPGreg2600 well, the price is more like 4.50, but i get your drift.

@KingMike
Actually, you’re absolutely right - there are probably many more unknown, mediocre games on NES or SNES they can still dredge up with little expense. 😅

What I meant by “low hanging fruit” were popular games that Nintendo can add to the service with relative ease or less $$.

The Mother games were nice, but hopefully there are more nice surprises in store.

I'd rather just buy the physical N64 games than rent them indefinitely.

@Arkay Alright. Though, I am critical over the service itself lacking features. Like being able to message others online. Few times my friend would be online, and wanted to play with him, but ended up calling him due to the lack of messaging.

It has more to do with the multiplayer services for me than the classic games both the base and expansion offer.

Honestly, some of the SNES and NES stuff has actually been parts of the base service I like. I play Super Mario All-Stars regularly.

@Suess yeah, for the whole service, but the expansion pass is only, what, 20 bucks extra more per year?

For "free" I may play Pokemon Snap for a little.

@Arkay Compare it to Xbox or Playstation's online service prices and offerings, even if you think it doesn't suck, the price is still a lot if you consider how little actual meat there is to it, it's just 2 DLCs and old games. Hopefully they step up, but i doubt they'll include actual new full games like Xbox

@Arkay "$50 is nothing" actually it is a lot for a subscription that still to this day has no basic voice chat, bad infrastructure, the peer to peer structure, no set free game schedule like ps plus and their 2 free games per month. Cloud backups are pathetic and won't let us backup every game and even some of the games that need it the most, no great sales or deals like Sony and Microsoft do, etc. This price is getting close to Sony and MS services and if nintendo is going to increase the price of their service then I expect all these features. You've completely missed the point of the price. The price increase is only worth it if the value of the service increases. Right now? Not so much

It’s about time Nintendo did a poll to get some feedback on how people feel about the expansion.
Personally I’d like to see the other first party type dlcs get added.
Zelda
Splatoon
3houses

@RadioShadow It's been so long since I have played Mischief Makers, I would love to play it again.

looking forward to Kirby 64!

Would love to see Harvest Moon 64 someday

I'll be interested when they add the 4 AKI wrestling games!

@Arkay
This might be comment of the year candidate here on NintendoLife!

After F Zero X being released that was all I could ask for out of the N64 library. Would love to see the original smash bros on there though, haven’t played that since I had an N64 (so like 15 years ago). The aesthetic of that game really is unique

I'm interested in knowing what 3rd party N64 games are next in the pipeline. I know there aren't a million, but I am curious.

@Hero-of-WiiU thank you, someone has to speak up against the negativity.

@Matty1988 same for me

@Arkay $50 a year is $250 over 5 years for antiquated games rolled out slowly that you can't keep once you cancel. Most people complaining can do basic math.

@RPGreg2600 $30 more. More than twice what you pay for online, cloud saves, NES and SNES just for 64 games most people will play a little bit of once then forget and the ability to rent DLC for games you may not own. If the games are worth that to you then nobody should be able to convince you it's a bad deal but it's going to be hard to convince them it's a good one quite yet.

Pokemon stadium??

I have all the pal N64 games released, all complete in boxes so I have no need for their service and I don't play online games so their offerings really don't cater to me but I'm glad others are getting to play N64 games they might have missed.

Come on, Diddy Kong Racing!

@Freek being able to play N64 games portably and having states are good features only the NSO can provide. Plus I like having all my games stored digitally so I don’t have to carry a bag or case around with them in.

@Bass_X0
Yeah I can understand the convenience of having it all at the ready and on the go but I prefer couch gaming on the big screen with my family.
Having all 244 games in their boxes also looks amazing in my cabinets plus I can go through and pick out a game I feel like playing like I was going to a game store and picking a game but I own them.
We all enjoy our hobbies differently that's why Switch being both a portable and home console works so well.

Just give me Wave Race dangit

@Arkay most people that complain are teens with no jobs or people who's fav youtuber told them to dislike it like a hivemind.🤷🏾‍♂️

You took a poll?

Really hoping Castlevania and Legacy of Darkness come to the service! I already own both carts on N64 but… let me see these through an HDMI connection! I’ll be so happy.

@Arkay Should still be cheaper, or at the very least you should keep the retro games that release perminantly while on the subscription.

@Jokerwolf keeping them would indeed be cool, I agree with ya there.

The people who complain about the price or not owning the games at this point are silly. Emulation is far better now plus there's more games and now there's the Mario Kart DLC and games are being added every month while the price stays at a cheap $50 a year.
And it's hilarious how some commenters say they don't want to rent the games cuz Nintendo can take them away at any point.... Which tells you how much they understand about businesses lol. To the people scared of using streaming services (tho I very much doubt you refuse to use Netflix or any of the variety of other streaming things where you don't own the movies and TV shows) they won't take it away because literally it's their business model. If they take it away they stop making money. How in 2022 do people still not understand how subscription services work lol. The current online subscription makes it so you will never lose the games, the opposite of what these naysayers are complaining about, unlike with the VC where when your system breaks those games are gone no matter how much you paid for them. I guess some people just love to complain no matter how nonsensical their complaints are. All i can say is thank god Nintendo moved from the overpriced VC model to a cheap subscription model. Better for Nintendo and better for us gamers!

Hey, I want to play all of those!

@Arkay
i feel like that's my main issue with the service, i would love if it was like how they handled the DLC for games where it comes with the service but you can purchase the games separate.

(would be nice to have a few options in terms of screen size or changing the borders/help text etc)

there are quite a few games on the service i would definitely buy the hell out of if i could.

@SpaceboyScreams that's only $2.50 a month extra. You can't buy anything for $2.50 these days. I already have every N64 game on a flash cart that I can play on a real N64, but I figured it was worth 50 bucks to have a bunch of other games to play handheld on my switch. Not sure I'll renew next year, but it's hard to argue that it's a rip off.

@ggnorekthx Brilliant, lol

@Wexter Yeah, I agree 100%

As someone who has had their entire video game collection stolen twice and a smaller selection of games stolen on a third occasion... not to mention games lost or damaged by siblings in the past... I'm kind of okay with a temporary digital ownership, as bad as that may sound to some. Especially for the Switch where all you get is essentially a mini SD with the game loaded onto it, and no manual in the box.

It's about damn time. I still wish Nintendo would just let people buy these games and own them, but it's still nice for more people to have access to the original Pokemon Snap.

I really wanna see Goldeneye and also Star Wars Shadow of the Empire as well as Conkers Bad Fur Day and hey how bout some good ole Samus,you know !!!

I'm okay with the cost of things if the release cadence stays at about 1 game per month for the first two or three years. By that point you start running out of good games to release lol. My concern is the N64 set will dry up after all previously revealed games are out. Even the Switch SNES is missing a ton of classic games still, like Chrono Trigger and Super Mario RPG. Let's hope they don't stop with the N64 releases until we have a solid 25-30 titles at least.

@RPGreg2600 You can look at it monthly if you want to see things how banks/credit cards want you to see things. I'll personally take that $500 over several years and invest it in something more worthwhile. If the service looks great a few years from now maybe I'll buy a year and enjoy everything in 12 months then cancel. If you buy now I'll bet they'll have just enough to entice you when that one year mark rolls around. I wouldn't spend a penny on any 64 game that I don't even get to own at the end of the day.

Mystical ninja..I need those feels

@electrolite77 LMAO… thank you for stating the obvious 🤦‍♂️. You just described free will to everybody on this forum.

You just said “you buy it if you like it” in a more complicated and time wasting manner.
Thank you for the life lesson 🤣

Loving the Expansion Pack so far, but Nintendo really needs to put Diddy Kong Racing on there. If they can wrangle approval for Banjo-Kazooie, then DKR should be a snap.

@wazlon There is not the instan rewind like the Nes/Snes/Megadrive, but you can Save the state wherever. A few more button presses/menus or two, but I prefer it to be honest like that. The fact it is a little more hidden away makes me only use them as start/stop points for when I am done playing for the day.
I find instant rewinds make some games not as enjoyable. I am not worried about getting hit or falling etc if there are no stakes. I could always undo it.

By comparison, a game like TJ and E Back in The Groove, which has rogue tendencies, has dying resulting in the deletion of the current play through save file. That keeps you on your toes! Haha.

That said.....I don't know how I ever beat the Donkey Kong Country games as a kid without these!!!

@Arkay,

I live in the U.K and have the family expansion pack for £59.99 per year, which equates to £0.17 pence a day, how people can claim this is too expensive is beyond me.

Of course someone from another region will always state a higher dollar price for the service, but this is usually taken out of context, as when the exchange rates are taken into account everyone is effectively paying the same.

If you want to really turn some heads add 64DD support and release F-Zero Expansion Kit, SimCity 64, Mario Artist and Doshin the Giant.

@electrolite77 extrapolating, you may be using this word out of context. If you are accusing me of commenting on an unknown situation, then that is what you are doing also. I read reviews, comments and others opinions and there is certainly a vast number of dissatisfied Nintendo gamers out there.

And while you might be jumping up and down with excitement at 48 old tracks being added to an old version of Mario Kart over two years, many gamers would rather see a new Mario Kart.

But we all know there will be no new AAA franchise games released on the existing Nintendo equipment.

The fact that you only "rent" the Mario Kart DLC courses instead of own them sours the deal considerably. Makes me just want to buy it outright and never sub to the service. $50 for a handful of Roms and no modern games a la Xbox Gold and PS Plus is putrid.

@fafonio Maybe, idk, read? That will answer your very basic question.

@Arkay "humble" opinion. Throughout half your opinion you brush off those in dissent as teens and people with no jobs. Absolutely nothing humble about it.

@TKundNobody absolutely ridiculous to compare renting roms to paying for the physical cartridge

@itslukec because they're in such large supply 🙄

@Wexter that's not all...you can legally make rom copies of the physical copy.

@RPGreg2600 $2 a month * to rent n64 roms

@BadWaluigi this are 2 options to play the games legally, so it fits. Both have pros and cons sure. But in the end these are the only legal options to play the games.

@electrolite77 To play devil's advocate you could technically get that caviar for $10 and sell it to the table next to you for $60. So it does have value still whether you like it or not.

@TKundNobody roms aren't inherently illegal to have. We have our roms from virtual console days as well, bought legally and converted to roms to be played anywhere 🙂

@SpaceboyScreams Agreed, nor do they have any sense of objective principle. If we just spent "no big deal" $50 on everything each year, we'd be broke. Do they realize Nintendo isn't the only service competing for our subscription dollars? I've got other bills too lol

@BadWaluigi I don’t even know to which post you’re replying to

@fafonio sry, Nintendolife needs to do a better job with this comment section.

Anyway, it was in reference to you saying something like "I don't understand why anyone would complain" when there are plenty of them all over the internet to read.

@BadWaluigi ok, thanks for clarifying. What I mean that I don’t understand is that the cost is literally 83 cents a month. I don’t understand how could anyone complain about that price.

Even just by replying and discussing this, we must have consumed 83 cents of electricity on our bills by now. It’s a measly 83 cents a month for quite some content. It’s peanuts.

I’d understand the frustration if you were paying the same price akin to the Xbox/PS services for less content. But 83 cents USD? Come on!

@BadWaluigi i don't think this is legal nor illegal it is at least a gray area. I excluded VC because the stores are shutting down and not every body is willing to buy a 3DS/Wii U now to get the VC games.

I'd rather play OC on switch than on my N64 (yeah I have a working console and cartridge). Because of HDMI fro. the Dock and handheld mode. Easier to pick up and suspend.

@fafonio Arent PS Plus and Xbox Live Gold $50 as well? I think that's the issue. When you objectively compare the services, there's no contest. There are more modern games offered on those services than the roms Nintendo is offering. Roms that people my age have purchased multiple times already. Also consider the lackluster online features in comparison to the competition. Nintendo said they're charging for online to improve the services...well it's the same it's been since launch.

@TKundNobody there have been court cases affirming that you can legally make backups. It's stated directly on copyright.gov. No grey area. 100% legal.

yes, the convenience factor is a selling point. Personally if I wanted to play a bunch of Roms on my switch if get a cheap Lite, homebrew it, and put my entire library on it, like I've done with my 3ds, vita, RetroPie handheld, and Wii. To each their own. I just don't see the value in it from my perspective. Options would be nice, but this is Nintendo we're talking about.

@BadWaluigi no. Please read what I mean about the 83 cents. I’m not comparing the individual plans from Xbox/PS/NSO.

As I said in my original post. The family plan is $80… which you can divide among 8 friends. That means that instead of paying $50 a year… you end up paying only $10 a year… divided by 12 months… 83 cents monthly.

Then, you get, online, retro gaming and free DLCs.
You can’t compare the Xbox/PS $50 subscription to the NSO family plan for $10.

You end up getting MK8 dlc for cheaper in NSO than buying it without the expansion pack. That’s mathematic value.

So if you're in a very specific situation, it works to that cheap. I'm in my 30s. I don't have a group of Bros with switches to split a family plan with. If they truly intended it to be that cheap for everyone, they wouldn't have created the family loophole and would've simply offered it at that price. You can't cherry pick one offhand scenario and use that exception as the rule lol.

@BadWaluigi dude… Im 35. Age is not an issue. But then it’s something more about getting someone to share the plan with rather than value options.

And I’m not cherry picking. I specifically mentioned that option in my OP and that’s the whole point of this discussion.

There are options if you want to make the most out of your money. 83 cents for the service is GREAT value.

Even if you have only 2 friends with switches you’d still be dividing the cost down to $28 yearly.

@fafonio I'm glad you have 8 other 30 something's to play switch with. I do not. Most of my friends just play other consoles, if anything at all.

I wonder if they will do Turbografx 16 or Sega Saturn in the future?

@BadWaluigi you don’t have to specifically have 8 friends. That’s for maximum saving. But As I said, even if you only have one you would be splitting the cost down to $40.

The pattern that I’ve seen in people complaining about the price is that they often tend to forget or discard the Family Plan when that’s clearly the way to go and best option for maximum value.

@fafonio Not the worst thing in the world. But as someone who already has a library of Roms and has purchased these games on other platforms, it's hard to justify renting them just to play on switch. Outside of that what're the other benefits aside from renting Mario Kart DLC that you're better off purchasing outright, and playing Mario Kart and Smash Bros online with basic functionality (Smash online is a horrible laggy experience, so that's moot) that hasn't improved at all since they started charging for online?

@BadWaluigi I agree with the retro gaming part. I’ve played those games surely the same times as you since we were part of the first generations of gaming. I barely play them on my Switch when I clearly have the superior Classic consoles hacked with all the games I want.

However, online multiplayer in all those retro games is a big seller for me. Then add the MK8 DLC that I know I’m renting… but let’s be honest, Mario Kart is one game that you can throw away once the eventual new entry comes about. So I don’t care to rent it for a year or two until I grow bored from it and play the next MK.

Anyway. Playing N64 portable games like F-Zero or Banjo Kazooie … or being able to use the N64 controller to play them how they are supposed to be played, ufff, is well worth the 83 cents or $2 a month if you’re low on friends with Switch.
By now I just got more value for my money by just being able to play these free DLCs in the expansion pack and online retro multiplayer. Everything else is just icing on the cake.

Btw this topic is extra … but I usually have a good online experience with friends on Smash online… and I have the bare minimum of Mb/s ….. 30 mb/s connection

@fafonio So I think it just comes down to perception of ownership which brings me back to my original argument about choice. While you don't see it as an issue, I absolutely would hate the idea of paying a big price for this knowing it'll be taken away at any point. I still go back and play Mario Kart 64 some times. Imagine going back to play it only for Nintendo to say "whoops sowwy you stopped paying for Nintendo online so now you can't play the game you bought". I want access to these tracks in 5, 10, 35 years. And considering the legs on Mario Kart 8, which has lasted two generations now, that's not unreasonable. This whole "games as a service" model is cancer.

@BadWaluigi yeah but then we would still be talking about the Mk dlc only… since you and I both we own these retro games in other types of platforms.

You can always buy the DLC instead of renting it. But the way I see it is that I can pay a low price and play the DLC until I’m bored of it…. if I’m indeed bored of it 2 years down the line , then I wouldn’t have the need to play it anymore… and since MK has a tendency of throwing a lot of retro tracks in each entry, I’m never missing something. In 5-10 years from now, if by that point, the same tracks are not available elsewhere… then I’d think about owning the DLC…. But as for now, i have no need to own it.

There will always be the option to buy it though. I would understand your point if the only way to play it was just renting it… making it a prisoner of the “games as a service” model.

It doesn’t matter what they add, because I can’t enjoy any of them due to the LACK OF THE N64 CONTROLLER RESTOCK! Seriously, it’s been almost 6 months since they sold out. That’s the question that needs asking! When are the next batch of N64 controllers arriving… in addition I would love Snowboard Kids and 1080 to be added and like many have mentioned, Goemon too!

@johnvboy 17p a day while being subjective does not seen much, but Nintendo does not allow a daily payment.

But to many I will agree, the £60 a year is
affordable like it is to me. But affordability is not and should not be the only reason for parting with your money. Value for money is another reason.

For me it is poor value. I don't play games on line, the N64 games graphics look poor and the added Mario Kart Tracks are for the most part just that old tracks.

So if I were to pay £60 it would not good value for me. But if you got 17 pence worth of game play a day, your the guy it for. 😀

@zool It's 9.5p a day, are you thinking of the family pass?

@BadWaluigi telling me not to be a db then proceeds to be a db to others himself. Classic.
My humble opinion is that you need to not take it to heart.

@Arkay Amen! I couldn't no have say it better!

@zool,

Value is very subjective, and will differ from person to person, the price is 0.17 pence per day, which is awesome value for what you get, and that's based on the family plan, the individual price is much less.

And as you stated it's poor value for you personally, not sure what that means outside of your own circumstances.

How could my opinion about PS1 games vs N64 games got removed and called unconstructive ? 😕
I have some reasons why I choose PS1 games over than N64 games.

@Anti-Matter,

Because it does not have much to do with the article, as it's not likely that Nintendo would add PS1 games to the online service, I liked a lot of PS1 games too, but also loved the N64 as well.

@zool,

By the way it does not even work out at 17 pence a day, it's only 0.170 a day... so people must be very cheap if they think that's expensive or poor value.

@johnvboy Speaking, from a math perspective, the amount of N64 games added in the first year of the Expansion Pass is about the same as it took five years on the Wii to get on VC. If we break that down, if you bought every N64 game on the Wii at either $9.99USD to 11.99USD for a total of 21 titles, if I were lowballing this, that would be $209.99. So far there will be 16 N64 games on the service at the end of the year (possibly more like the often rumoured Goldeneye) which means you're saving $110.00 if you subscribe for a year. Once you add in Mario Kart 8 DLC, Animal Crossing DLC, Genisis games, and any other surprises Nintendo could have, the service is already great value.

Now, if someone already bought these games on Wii or Wii U or still owns the cart and doesn't feel like dipping in for portable play or online play, then that's for them to decide. But, just breaking it down by math, the value is there. Now if you just want N64 games and Nintendo does not add more than the 16 titles we can talk if the value is still there after three years. But, it is very good value.

EDIT: And this is before we calculate maybe splitting a family plan with a friend or family members.

@Wexter,

It's an awesome service and as you say good value, I love the fact I can play games I might not have otherwise purchased, it i havd to buy them individually.

@johnvboy Exactly! Just a year subscription is fantastic value and will only get better! People often forget how much those VC games added up over time and how much this subscription service is saving them. And if this gets carried over to the next Switch, that is just gravy! I cannot tell you how many VC games are rotting away on my old Wii U (I transferred my purchases from the Wii). I barely play it now as my life does not give room for impulse buys of a game I'll barely play outside of an afternoon, plus I split with family and friends, so the cost is barely even noticeable for me.

@BadWaluigi That was kinda the point I was hinting at. Provided you take care to back up your purchases then you're fine. But, I do doubt how many collectors actually do that and just horde away 100s of games for their "value" and barely play them... if at all. I know I did in my late-teens/early-20s.

If Nintendo does as much as they can with this Expansion Pack, not only will the $50 price tag be justified but the Eshop closures may sting a little less. The positive part about the N64 games is that the library is less plagued by shovelware, meaning we won't get things similar to Jelly Boy.

@Arkay I'm none of those things you mention and I don't consider it good value, especially when the basic core functions a gaming service requires are so lacking.
Sure the 'free' content is good, but where is the party, voice and messaging support?

@SmashFan347 Very true! I'm still waiting on Turok 3 (my favourite in the series) and while I can buy Turok 1&2 on the eShop the lack of a native PC port means the Expansion Pass might be the only way I get Turok 3. Plus can you imagine if we get Rage Wars with online play? Please Nintendo!

@robe Not to be that guy, but your issues are with the base NSO. The Expansion Pack is a premium service for those who want N64/Genisis games and bonus upcoming DLC for their favourite Nintendo titles. I've already broken down that value with a comment above so I won't repost. But, the lack of direct messaging and voice chat is hardly an issue as most people have a phone and Discord if they are that serious about playing with friends online. But, that is more an issue with the base NSO rather than the Expansion Pack.

EDIT: Plus have you entered a public voice lobby on PS4 and Xbone? It is the same 13-year-olds screaming obscenities it has always been for the past 15 years. Not a real loss to not have to hear that during a match of Splatoon 2.

@johnvboy forget the daily rate it's not relevent at all. No one budgets daily, and even if some people unfortunately have to budget weekly they would find it very difficult to save much.

And when you add in the Amazon prime, the Netflix, Disney, the Sky, their mobile, value counts and the pennies add up, but for lots of Nintendo players they just see poor value, even some of those that still subscribe.

@zool I'm going to try to be polite because I did not go out of my way to calculate just the N64 portion of the comment above just for kicks. But, if you bought every N64 game on Wii you spent about $200 as a lowball. If you had to buy every N64 game on Switch at $9.99 (probably closer to $13.99 due to inflation and added features) You'd be spending $159.99 on just N64 games... which seems to be the sticking point for a lot of commentators who ignore the Genisis/Megadrive and DLC (plus all the base services you get on NSO). So, $50 (a year) to play bangers like Banjo Kazooie, Majora's Mask, F-Zero X, Starfox 64 and Sin and Punishment is already great value for just the $50? DAMN!

Now, if you're issue is with subscription services that is fine. A lot of people skipped on cable because their cable bill was getting to $45.00USD (for basic cable) to $150.00 a month and they'd still not be able to watch a lot of their favourites whenever they want. If we add in Netflix (let's say $19.99USD if you want the most robust plan), Disney Plus ($7.99USD) and Amazon Prime ($8.99USD for just Prime Video it can be bundled with Amazon Prime if you want to eliminate expensive shipping fees that add up over time) that is still cheaper than cable at $37.00 v. the average of $70.00 for cable a month. It can go higher if you want, but just basic math going pure subscription with your internet bill for a lot of families is very reasonable and in a lot of cases buying a year plan is cheaper than a month of cable.

Now if you don't see that value and that is perfectly fair I think we're all internet savvy here on how to get around such things. And most banger shows are on Netflix, Prime and Disney Plus anyways so you're not missing out on skipping on Paramount+ or the other oddballs. That and if you really want Hulu and HBO MAX won't break the bank for most middle-income families. Most households will probably just stick to Netflix and Disney+ which is far cheaper than cable... so to most of those who just want to play online and get the goodies of Expansion Pack, they see great value. If you don't that is fine we're all adults here.

EDIT: And yes I spent way too much time doing math and internet sleuthing to do it. But, I think the math work I did speaks for itself on this one.

EDIT EDIT: Yes, I understand some people live on tight budgets and cannot afford every service I listed. I'm not trying to talk down to people. If you cannot afford these services I'm not asking you to as at the end of the day value is a perspective. But, I feel for most families ditching their cable bill for even one of these services was a godsend for them.

@zool,

Who sees poor value, you, a few people watching YouTube videos, even at the full price all in one go it's great value.

Not happy with a daily rate, do it monthly still peanuts for what's on offer.

@Wexter my original comment was replying to
@johnvboy about his justifying the yearly premium to Nintendo by breaking the cost into pennies per day.

I was looking forward to playing N64 games but they look terrible and the controls are all over the place. They are well past their sell by date.

The N64 games and the Mario Tracks have been rushed out to add content to justify the price increase of the online service.
If the N64 games were good enough I would pay a small price to download a few but not an on going premium to rent than.

@johnvboy you come across as a salesman from yeasteryear, justifying the affordability of what he is selling by suggesting it's only the cost of one cigarette a day..

@zool, I mean, his point was valid. My point was basically backing up his that the cost is not bad, and even then, your point was to add Expansion Pass on top of the other subscriptions, and I had to outline how BS that was considering most families spent more on cable. @johnvboy breaking it down to pennies was showing how small the payment is if you optimize the family plan.

As for the Mario Kart 8 tracks? The tracks are being released over two years, so it's hard to say they're being rushed. As for N64 games... I kindly disagree as outside of maybe Winback, most of those are banger titles and a blast to play. But that is subjective, and you're using hyperbole to make it sound like you're opinion on them is definitive, aka "they look terrible and the controls are all over the place." As in modern games, don't use different control schemes? Does that mean graphics only matter? I'm a little confused by the definitive language you're using there to dismiss the people here who have never played an N64 game and are in love with the titles so far.

If you're arguing renting v. ownership, that is an entirely different conversation than myself or @johnvboy are having. Your comments are reading as dismissive of the legit points people are bringing up as in your perspective is all that matters. And I think both of us are being rather fair with our points and are not quote "salesman from yesteryear." Attack the ideas not the people.

@Anti-Matter Because this topic has nothing to do with ps1 or dance dance revolution. It’s admirable how you somehow make every single topic about DDR somehow though haha.

@zool,

No, I think the cost of the service in all on go is next to nothing and awesome value.

I was breaking it down to those who stated it was too expensive, trying to demonstrate it's not as much as they think it is.

@Wexter,

Totally agree, and to be honest with some no price would have been cheap enough for the expansion pack.

@Anti-Matter,

By the way not disagreeing with you, just thought that may have been a reason for deleting your comment.

@zool,

N64 games past their sell by date???, what did you expect brand new ones.

I'm so excited! Pokemon Snap was one of my dream ones to get on the virtual. I really doubt we will see it but Rocket Robot on Wheels would also be a phenomenal addition.

I’ll be very disappointed if Pilotwings 64 doesn’t make it

Meh this service still has a long way to go for me, especially the expansion pass.

@johnvboy " what did you expect brand new ones". Ones that had a little work done on the graphics and a lot of work on the controls. Nintendo have had five years to get it right.

@zool,

So remasters of the old N64 games then, from watching comparison videos the online game seem sharper, but were always going to be emulated N64 titles.

@Wexter I would imagine most gamers know whether the asking price is good value or poor value for their needs, and even if they feel it's poor value they may pay that price because they want the on line service, or don't but want to play the N64 games.

What they don't need is patronising, about how breaking down the cost to pennies will create the illusion that the value is suddenly better.

My perspective is my opinion, and I can disagree with yours, that's how things should work.

@electrolite77 ok should I have written, "long time Mario Kart fans don't want any new Mario Kart games. Mario Kart 8 and the 48 old tracks will do and at the end of 2023 give us another 48 old tracks".

Logic should tell you that a good majority of loyal long term gamers would choose a new game with new tracks and a new look, over old tracks tagged on to an old game.

Of course it doesn't have to be either or, but while the Switch is selling Nintendo seems happy to resell it's old stuff to the new kids.

You people don't realize that Nintendo loves to recycle all of their games and resell them to you at full price. Over and over and over again. I gave up on this company a long time ago. I will be the judge of what I consider to be nostalgia. I'll stick with the company that has the games that interest me and are fun to play. Nintendo can take a flying leap.

@Lord Sounds like you just need to get rare replay on xbox

@Wexter,

Awesome point about the Wii and Wii U virtual console service, I also have a tonne of games purchased and transferred, then lost on the service.

And if we are being honest here, the same people complaining about the current online service were also complaining about this too, they were moaning about the individual price of titles, then complained they had to pay a fee to migrate from Wii to Wii U, then eventually losing the games altogether.

The real reason for this however is some have just never got over Nintendo's decision to charge for their online service in the first place, as they feel all this should be free, but even if it was they would still find reasons to complain.

@electrolite77 if the best reply you have is to say you don't understand the meaning of ‘good majority’, then you go on to say .

"You can tell from the long term fans in here who are happy with the tracks."

A good example of 'good majority'.😀

And yes lots of gamers will be happy with what Nintendo has on a take it or leave it offer. But they were not offered a new game.

It is ok to sometimes disagree with what Nintendo are doing, it makes for healthy discussion and keeps them on their toes.

@zool,

I have no issue with people saying the service is not of value to them personally, but quite a few times they do not phrase it that way, they state it as an objective fact, when all of this value or not is purely based on an individuals point of view.

@johnvboy I understand, but that way of looking at it can be somewhat simplistic.
For example. Someone in my family likes playing Splatoon, she subscribed when Nintendo started charging, she also used it to play Animal Crossing for a while last year. She is not interested in nes, SNES or N64 games or any thing else that is included with the subscription.

She has moved on from AC and doesn't play Splatoon any more, at least until the new version is released.

Can she afford it? yes, does she think it's good value? No.

Nintendo adding more stuff to the subscription package to try and justify the price or next price increase shows that they don't think N64 games will stand up on their own merit.

@zool,

I do not think any of these older retro systems would stand an individual service, that ship sailed with the Wii and Wii U, this was the only way to go in my opinion.

The value again based on a persons individual views, I for example think it's awesome value, does not make any of us correct.

@TnightStarsRevolt Is it just me or does it seem beyond weird that there isn't a Lego Racers every gen?

Kart games - biiig sales, Lego games - biiiiiiiiig sales.

Do people not like money now?

@johnvboy you asked this question,
I live in the U.K and have the family expansion pack for £59.99 per year, which equates to £0.17 pence a day, how people can claim this is too expensive is beyond me.

I attempted to give an answer from my point of view.
Expensive and good value and can't afford can get confused with each other. For me it's simply not good value and I won't waste money, and I can see how some gamers see it as expensive. Maybe expensive for what's on offer.

@zool,

Never asked a question, simply pointed out why I could not see why anyone could call the service expensive.

Wasting money is again very subjective, as one persons waste of money is someone else's essential purchase.

@johnvboy exactly so it is not beyond you.

@zool,

" The Switche Online Expansion Pack service is getting more content but I wouldn't go as far as saying improving, I'd say 'more of the same'.

Nintendo are not playing to its loyal audience, the Mario Kart fans that have owned the older consoles and already played all these old tracks.

These fans want new tracks in a new game, with up to date graphics and new ideas.

Nintendo are playing to the new kids on the block with a revamped Mario Kart 8. "

Your comment sounds like very subjective opinions stated as objective facts to me, and suggesting what Nintendo fans want is very flimsy to me.

@electrolite77 anything beyond or between your parameters is somewhere in the middle. Good guesswork.

@electrolite77 I Never understood the double-standard people have regarding Nintendo and I quote "recycling old content" and/or "lazy ports." They complained when Nintendo shuts down a service or stops manufacturing a game, but when they move those same games over to their next console, that makes them lazy or duping us? It does not make sense. I honestly would love the last of the Wii U titles to come to Switch (Xenoblade X and the Zelda WW&TPHD) and Nintendo to continue offering more legacy support through Expansion Pass (maybe Gameboy/Color & Advance games would be nice)... each their own, I guess. I'm just tired of storing games and consoles I hardly ever pull out except maybe once a year.

@Wexter,

It's the usual double standards from some on here.

@electrolite77 not at all. There is always the feeling that you're getting from the reaction of the crowd? Or in this case, reaction from, gamers.
For example, if you ask most gamers what they think about the delay of breath of the wild 2 release you will probably get a negative response from a lot of unhappy punters. A fair assumption.

@electrolite77 @zool

Okay so question. Considering Nintendo consoles have always fluctuated from being top dog to 3rd place, while their handhelds have always sold well... what is the "loyal" Nintendo audience? That is such a nebulous term because it means nothing.

Is it someone who owned both a 3DS and Wii U? Someone who owned just a 3DS or Wii U? Someone who owned a Gamecube, GBA and DS, skipped the Wii, Wii U and 3DS and now owns a Switch? Someone who buys both versions of Pokemon since gen 1? Someone who buys Nintendo merch? Someone who buys Nintendo games and merch? Because I fell out of Pokemon during Gen 4, got the Gen 6 games, skipped Gen 7 then went back to the stuff I missed after loving Sword and Shield. But, I've also owned every Zelda game except Link Between Worlds. I have every Xenoblade, but I skipped Mario Galaxy 2 does that still make me a "loyal Nintendo fan?" I think I am, but there is no way to define it. Some Nintendo fans love Animal Crossing but don't care about Metroid. Some Nintendo fans love Mario but hate Zelda. See how stupid this argument is when the stable of "loyal" Nintendo fan can be so large?

This is why fanboy epeen measuring is stupid. Each gamer has their own taste which has been the point I've been trying to hammer home for what feels like months with Expansion Pass naysayers. If you don't like the service don't get the service. If you like the service get the service. If you think the service can be improved be polite and fill out Nintendo's surveys. The service is not expensive and provides a LOT for the price point even if you might not think it is not enough (by the Monado I've done the math it saves you $100+ easy for the content it provides). But, if you don't see it worth it for your $50 DON'T buy it! It really is just that simple. Arguing who is or is not a loyal fan is a waste of time.

EDIT: And before ANYONE says a loyal Nintendo fan sticks by Nintendo and buys every console and 1st party game then these "loyal" Nintendo fans are rich and really need to re-evaluate their life when they keep buying stuff they hate. YOUR part of the problem.

@Wexter most people understand the meaning of the word 'loyal' to some degree. There have been times when Nintendo had bad as well as good times and during the bad times I thought of getting a playstation but I stuck with them until things picked up and so I'm still here. But this time, these good times for Nintendo started with BotW and fans wanted more open world games, something Nintendo couldn't provide and still can't.The Switch just couldn't run the third party open world games well. But it could port all its previous consoles games to the Switch. The ones us loyal gamers had bought and played. Games the non loyal gamers never player when they deserted the Nintendo.

Last year is the closest I got it to hanging up my Switch for a PS5. Then Oled arrived. The best Oled games seem to be from third party developers. Nintendo games seem to have lost a lot of their appeal: there is enough 3rd party stuff to play on the Oled.
This is an example of loyalty from a fan not so loyal anymore.

@Wexter yep, you're right my comments do apply to the base NSO. I don't agree that my dissatisfaction with Nintendos online service should be limited to the base subscription, although I do understand your argument. The poor online experience applies to both tiers of the service, as I cannot subscribe them separately.
Pointing out that I can use my phone or discord is simply making excuses for them. A Console is supposed to be a simple and holistic experience, if I want to faff about with third party services I'll go use my pc.

@zool That was a ramble. What does Nintendo not "providing open-world games" have to do with loyalty to a brand? That and Breath of the Wild is an amazing game, but the Switch has a number of open-world games even some published by Nintendo like the Xenoblade series or the recently released Legends Arceus. Unless your view of open-world is a singular large map. And what does the Switch OLED have to do with keeping you interested in the Switch? It is a better screen for portable play, but it does not enhance the base-docked experience (and for myself personally would not convenience me to buy over a new GPU or PS5 if I was that committed to buying one before OLED). And are you seriously complaining about Wii U games getting ports to the Switch as a bad thing? The Wii U sold 10million units and the Switch's install-base is 10x the size... So are the "loyal fans" the ones that bought a Wii U only? Your comment makes close to no sense.

Honestly, you've not answered my question though how do you define a "loyal" Nintendo fan? Can you even? From what I can tell you are projecting your personal experience to that of an entire fandom.

@Wexter you ask the most basic of questions, what is loyalty. Define a loyal fan. When I do, you come back with 'From what I can tell you are projecting your personal experience'. You didn't specify which loyal fan.

You sound like the most loyalist of fans, you are on the defensive when talking about Nintendo.

I prefer positive criticism rather than fan adoration.

@zool You want me to list things I dislike about Nintendo? Well, that is quite the list from dormant IPs, lack of sports games that are not FIFA or NBA2K to the lack of 3rd party collaboration on dormant Nintendo IPs, to even the lack of purchasing critical 3rd party studios... I can list those things if you want? I just tend to be rather reasonable with my expectations on what Nintendo can and can't do. And your entire comment thread is not even close to positive criticism. Your criticism amounts to:

1) I don't like subscriptions services therefore bad no matter how much Nintendo adds to it
2) Nintendo does not make enough open-world games so they are not rewarding loyal fans
3) Nintendo takes too long making games
4) I don't like N64 games therefore it is pointless to add them to Expansion Pass
5) Nintendo does not reward "loyal fans" enough (which is rich considering you cannot even define one)
6) Nintendo "recycles" too many older games (aka releasing demanded titles) so bad
7) Mario Kart DLC is rushed... even though its release is being spread over 2 years

I can go on and list more? I've been more than reasonable, while you keep moving the goalpost. I've kept my goalpost rather firm.

@Wexter YOU SAID. "I don't like subscriptions services therefore bad no matter how much Nintendo adds to it."

It would be better if you show where I said that and not paraphrase with your own words. As you do. Look at point 4. You listed, or should I say make up that as well.

N64 was my favourite Nintendo console and games. But I like many reviewers and other gamer are disappointed with the way the games were presented. And they, for me don't add value to the subscription. What you have done is misinterpreted everything.

@zool The N64 is your favourite console of all time? "N64 games but they look terrible and the controls are all over the place. They are well past their sell by date." You literally wrote this! Hard for me to assume it is your favourite console of all time when you bash the system this hard!

And as far as your opinion on subscriptions services "The Switch Online Expansion Pack service is getting more content but I wouldn't go as far as saying improving, I'd say 'more of the same'." And I've read you literally in other comment threads your disdain for subscriptions services and how they are a waste of money.

It is not that I'm misinterpreting you are just all over the place! It is hard for someone to think they are having a good faith argument when you contradict yourself! Plus you keep bringing up loyal fans yet cannot hammer down what that means! You talk about Nintendo failing to deliver when they are doing some of the best software sales of all time! If this were the Wii U generation (I love that system) I'd maybe understand, but saying the Switch is not delivering when all it has been doing is landing hit after hit is disingenuous. Or maybe I'm just interpreting your idea of loyalty to lock away old content behind increasingly expensive proprietary hardware that is becoming harder to own by the day based on your stance on Wii U ports to Switch (a practice Nintendo has done since the SNES). Maybe not to your taste, but it seems the fans have been rewarding Nintendo with some of the best software and hardware sales they've ever had! Maybe, it is not me misinterpreting, but rather you explaining.

I cannot understand what you are even arguing! If it is just the Expansion Pass is not to your taste that is fine! But, when you say the N64 is your favourite console of all time, but have repeatedly disregarded it as yesteryear trash it is hard to take what you are saying seriously.

I've been more than fair and I'm really trying my best to understand you, but I'm at the end of the rope I'm willing to give on this one.

@Wexter I said the N64 WAS not IS my favourite console. Much like watching a favourite old movie, it's not the same years later. N64 graphics have not held up as well as SNES graphics. There is not enough value in the The Switch Online Expansion Pack service for me, if there was I would consider it. And yes I'm not a fan of downloading games, you never own them and subscription is much the same, but if I wanted to play a game that didn't have a physical release I might download it.

You do miss the point of a lot of the discussions. I am not against Nintendo releasing ports, as well as a good selection of new stuff. But while these ports were being released, the new stuff was in short supply. Im sure you must have read the criticism about this at the time, not every one was pleased.

If you don't like the term loyal gamers then substitute if for older, long term, i dont like the direction Nintendo is going, or what ever gamer.

And lastly the Switch does not deliver enough Nintendo games for Nintendo players. I haven't done the maths, but I did read that they release less games for the Switch than the Wii u and the 3ds together.
I feel the same, you look for faults rather than points of agreement. And you fail to understand that Nintendo is not all things to all gamers.

PLEASE! do conkers bad fur day, donkey kong & glover!!

I’m sorry but… I almost read every comment and not a single person mentioned Bomberman 64. You all fail.

Please for the love of God, DonkeyKong 64, the goemon games, Golden eye 007, pokemon stadium 1or2, castlevania and bomberman for that one guy in the comments

@Uncle_Franklin you are correct forgot about them but MS doesnt seem like they want to do anything with it..