Kit Ellis and Krysta Yang have been powering on with their podcast ever since leaving Nintendo last year. In their most recent episode, they discuss what was really going on at Nintendo when the Animal Crossing: New Horizons craze hit.
Tucked away in that episode, however, is a devilish question from a Patreon subscriber — the kind that will get all kinds of burning opinions out there. The kind that fills a lot of people with dread, and others with passion.
The seemingly-innocent question asks Kit and Krysta what their least favourite Mario and Zelda games are. Some answers are less surprising than others, but we're sure someone, somewhere is out there ready to defend their favourite.
Kit went first, with his least favourite Zelda game being Twilight Princess, and his least favourite Mario game being Super Mario Sunshine. Even after replaying it in Super Mario 3D All-Stars, he just felt it "wasn't for me." Both of these games are from the GameCube, too — what did the little purple box do to you, Kit?
Krysta, on the other hand, declares New Super Mario Bros. 2 her least favourite Mario game, mostly for being "super generic." It's definitely a 'safe' Mario game, that's for sure, and our reader list seems to agree with that at the time of writing. Krysta's worst Zelda title, however, might shock you, as it's number 1 on many a fan's list.
Yep, Majora's Mask, now often considered one of the best Zelda games ever, is Krysta's least favourite, with Kit also mentioning it as "low-tier" for him, too. Both cite the three-day countdown — one of Majora's Masks defining features — as a big reason. Yes, it's stressful, and yes, it's definitely a weird Zelda game, but it goes in such a different direction compared to Ocarina of Time, and it gave us Tingle!
Of course, it goes without saying that it's absolutely fine that MM doesn't jive with K&K, but for the Majora's Mask lovers out there it's just tough to understand. Several of us at Nintendo Life are on record for preferring Majora's Mask over the mighty Ocarina, and we put the question of the 'Worst Zelda Game' to you lovely Nintendo Life readers in a poll — Majora's Mask 'won' only 3% of the vote there (in a poll that currently has over 25,000 votes):
You can watch the clip above to see the pair compare and discuss their least favourites, but we wonder what their favourite entries in each series is now!
What are your least favourite Mario and Zelda games? Let us know in the comments.
I'm old, I don't know who these people are...
Removed - unconstructive
Twilight Princess is great, although I can see why so many people dislike it.. Sunshine is really pretty to look at, but far too difficult to get into.
The only 3D Mario I never finished... As for my least favourite Zelda, it's either Phantom Hourglass or BotW. Phantom Hourglass because of the dumb ''returning'' dungeon and BotW because it's just boring. It's not even bad, it's just unremarkably boring.
TP: Haven't played.
Sunshine: ARE THEY MAD?!
NSMB2: Yeah, I can definitely see it.
MM: Haven't played YET.
I agree with Krysta on Mario - NSMB2 is really boring. The focus on coins was a misstep, like yeah it's satisfying to pick up a whole pile, but not satisfying enough to build a whole game around.
As far as Zelda, nothing "beats" Phantom Hourglass and going back to that same dungeon over and over and over. My least favorite by far.
Twilight Princess and Majoras Mask are literally my #1 and #2 Zeldas.
Twilight Princess is probably my favourite Zelda game (imo it's a straight up better version of OoT) and after replaying Super Mario Sunshine in the 3D-All-Stars Collection my opinion on it improved a lot. FLUDD made platforming really fun and the visuals held up really well. Can't say much about New Super Mario Bros. 2 since I am not really interested in 2D Mario games and have never played that one.
Majora's Mask is a weird one though. I personally don't like the 3-day mechanic myself aswell because it really is stressful but at the same time I like the game because the 3-day timer manages to create an amazing world that wouldn't be possible without it.
I agree on Sunshine, just did not like it, maybe because I never played it when it came out, but it just annoyed that crap out of me.
But Majora's Mask and Twilight Princess are AMAZING! They are SOOO dark, especially when you make those creepy statues in MM.
True when I first looked at MM I thought it was stupid and kiddie, with the masks, but then I played it and man was I shocked how good it was.
Can't speak for the two Mario titles - haven't played Sunshine yet and skipped NSMB2 - but I suppose K&K are entitled to their wrong opinions when it comes to two of my favorite Zelda games. Normally I don't care for games with timers, but that never really bothered me in Majora's Mask. Twilight Princess does have a slow start, but IMO it's excellent after the first dungeon.
My answers for both are the NES entries.
I love Majoras Mask, TP is very good, and I genuinely prefer all of the NSMB games to 3 and World. However, whilst I enjoy it overall, Sunshine is easily my least favourite 3D Mario. Too much jank, and reaching the good levels involves persevering through the pachinko, the poison river, the sandbird, and massive amounts of filler. Seriously, remove red coins, blue coins, and the janky nonfunctional levels, and there's only 40/120 shines left.
I agree on Twilight Princess and NSMB 2. Both very uninspired entires in their respective franchises.
Ok I like these two but surely nintendolife can’t make news out of every podcast they release if they start releasing them much more frequently than their once a month Nintendo minute segment.
I strongly disagree (except for New Super Mario Bros 2, I don't enjoy any of the "New" Mario games) but their points are fair enough
To each their own, I guess
Stop giving these guys airtime. It was evident from their show they know nothing about gaming
MM is one of my favorite games of all time! Oh well
I should probably not have to ask myself "who?" every time I see an article about them, but I still do since I don't follow influencers/podcasters.
Their worst Mario choices are interesting because those two games are practically polar opposites. Mario Sunshine is very weird and experimental and almost nothing like the rest of the series, whereas NSMB2 is very traditional and lacking in innovation. Personally I'd take the latter over Sunshine any day - I admire Sunshine's ambition and creativity but it hasn't aged well at all.
Twilight Princess is one of my favourite Zelda games but I haven't played Majora's Mask yet. I'm not sure what my least favourite Zelda would be, maybe one of the NES ones but that's a little unfair as I've never made much progress in either of them. Restricting it to games I've actually finished I'd probably have to say Spirit Tracks, but it's still a very good game.
Who are these people and why are they important enough to care what their opinion is?
Here's my list, for what it's worth:
Best Zelda: BotW (Twilight Princess is a close second for me)
Worst Zelda: Phantom Hourglass - I really enjoyed some aspects, but the controls and the repetitive nature of the Temple of the Ocean King just kills it (I'm excluding obvious entires here like Tri-Force Heroes)
Best Mario: This is a super tough decision... but it's got to be Mario 64
Worst Mario: Super Mario Sunshine... it's a marmite game; you either love it or loathe it. I'm in the latter camp. I hated the mechanics, controls, the layout of the levels & the setting & characters were bland with little variation. It all felt a bit like busy work cleaning up Isle Delfino.
You have to some special sort of vile creature to not like Majora’s Mask.
I stand with Krysta. Of the Zelda’s I played, it’s my least favorite. I beat it and enjoyed it but it’s my least favorite.
Mario sunshine remains the only mainline Mario game ever released that I have not finished. It just never felt like a Mario game. Zelda 2 is rough to play these days. Those are the worst for me.
I agree New Super Mario 2 seemed a lot easier than other Mario games, and is probably one of my least favorite ones. But I did love the coin rush mode. That was a neat little extra that gave me a lot of extra playtime out of it, seeing how many coins I could accumulate and seeing how your totals stacked up against others (especially through StreetPass)
I agree on sunshine, controls are just awful
I never played NSMB2 because it never appealed to me, and I could not get into Sunshine, as hard as I tried. The controls were weird and it felt unpolished.
Their least favorite Zeldas are in my top 4, but I get we all have different tastes. I personally dislike Zelda II, Minish Cap, and the Oracle games. And I have no desire to touch the DS games
I've never had a chance to play New Super Mario Bros 2. I wish they would port it to Switch so I could play it even if it is bad. 😝 I just want all the Mario games on Switch.
People can have their opinions, even if they're wrong.
No one should hate on MM, so good.
I give NSMB2 a little bit of a pass because I get the impression that it was basically a testing ground for what became Super Mario Maker. I don't have any proof of this, but an Iwata Asks does focus on how people that don't normally make stages where given the opportunity to do so.
Sunshine is my least favorite by far. One of the nice things about 64 is that you have a certain amount of leeway to skip stars and stages which does not exist in Sunshine. It's also very buggy in ways Mario games generally aren't.
Phantom Hourglass is easily my least favorite Zelda because of the awful recurring dungeon. The two DS games are so-so, but the Temple of the Ocean King is so bad it drags it down.
What we’re still going to have to hear about these two..?? It was bad enough when they did that vapid show for NoA; now they’re just former PR reps getting coverage…
For the record TP is overrated but definitely not the worst Zelda.
@Jmjfrank Oracle games? 💔 I enjoy both more than TP, personally..
PH is weak but ST is pretty nice too… but if you aren’t into handheld it’s probably not for you.
I very much doubt these are there opinions, more like contrived opinion to draw clicks and likes.
I'll never understand the issues people have with the 3-day cycle in Majora's Mask. If you use the song to slow down time — which isn't that hard to learn, because an unmissable NPC tells you about it 20 minutes into the game — you should have several hours to fool around per cycle. That's plenty. I'm replaying the game right now and, even having forgotten most of the puzzles, I'm still finishing dungeons by noon of the second day. That's not even half-way through the cycle. The game's fame as the most stressful Zelda ever is somewhat unearned, in my opinion. The atmosphere, yes. There's an air of urgency and gloom that's pervasive. But the time limit isn't that overbearing. You just need to set out discrete goals per cycle: do the pre-dungeon quest in one cycle and the actual dungeon in another. You don't need to cram. That's why every dungeon has a warp point next to the entrance. So you can get right into it at the start of the first day.
In the case of Mario Sunshine, I can see why it's difficult to get into that, to this day I still wonder how I got all the 120 Shines on the Gamecube. If you ever intend to play the Switch version, I highly recommend you try to play it with a Gamecube controller.
Haven't played New Super Mario Bros. 2, but I intend to give it a chance before the eShop closes.
Regarding Zelda, I haven't played all of them (realistically it's not a series that interests me that much, unlike Metroid), but I'm gonna say it's Zelda 2, not because it's a 2D side-scroller, but because I keep expecting Link's jumps to behave like Mario's.
As for the question posed here:
Favorite Zelda: Majora's Mask or Breath of the Wild. Least favorite: Skyward Sword (which is still good, but the worst of the "Ocarina but with more errands" era of the franchise)
Favorite Mario: Mario 3, World, or 64. Least favorite: Sunshine (which has good parts, but it's janky, filled with filler, and it misunderstands 64's structure)
I've grown to accept that Sunshine isn't for everyone; while always disappointing to hear, I do not believe it is by any means controversial to dislike it.
Though not perfect, there are many parts of Zelda 2 that I enjoy.
I really liked Twilight Princess, but his points are valid. For me, I like the puzzles.
The Wii controls have not aged well, but I liked that Skyward Sword was a brighter & more colorful game than Twilight Princess.
Sunshine and Twilight Princess are probably my least favourite of the 3D Mario and Zelda games to be fair (so far, haven’t played Skyward Sword or 3D World/Land yet) so I can see why those are mentioned. That said, considering 2D games are being included, I’m surprised only one was mentioned.
Loving the podcast so far, they're really cool people. I agree with MM being Low tier I dunno why it's something about that timer too, and not having stand-out dungeons (minus Stone Tower). Love TP but I get peoples gripes with it.
Obviously Zelda 2 is the worst, but I do agree about Mario Sunshine.
@blodermoder Zelda 1 and 2 are probably the most difficult without using guides.
I agree on NSMB2 and for 3D Zeldas I can also agree on MM. I see why somebody wouldn't like TP, but I would not call it worst Zelda it's more like in the middle. SMS is super divisive and thus I can understand choosing it, but for 3D Marios I still would place SMG worse.
@Tyranexx NSMB2 is definitely the worst Mario game. People don't like Sunshine because it's really hard. And there are about 10 shine sprites that are basically impossible to do, probably because they ran out of development time. Even when you solve them you're not sure what you did. And I cannot for the life of me find the last 4 blue coins. But I think the personality, ambience, music, and the turbo nozzle more than make up for that.
@BenjyK Basically with Majora's Mask, the entire world is a dungeon puzzle.
Sunshine really deserves a remaster...or direct sequel. I just needs a little more polish.
NSMB2...fair. It's fun but nothing special. I'd probably have it at the bottom of my list too.
Twilight Princess I came to appreciate more later on, I don't think it's bad in any way bar that goat opening.
Majora's Mask is my second least favourite. The time constraint just clashes with the need to explore and discover things. Then Spirit Tracks takes worst for me because the traversal in that world was a huge step back being restricted to set paths and then adding further restrictions like undefeatable foes and passengers who want you to go slow? It frustrates me just thinking about it.
But I loved Phantom Hourglass (the repeat dungeon was laoded with shortcuts guys) and Triforce Heroes and would put the latter in my top 5 Zelda games easily. But I was lucky that I had 2 friends who were happy to sit and play it with me every lunch at work for a while, without that I can see why it's so low for many.
@Lord I listened to the first couple of episodes.. they are trying to walk the line between having insider stories of working at Nintendo, not burning any bridges at Nintendo, and not tearing through too many Nintendo insider stories at once, and it's kind of awkward. I don't think anyone cares what they think about PlayStation games, but they don't seem to want to do a dedicated Nintendo podcast, either. It's a pleasant listen but they keep posting user polls asking what people want, and Nintendo content always wins in a total landslide.
@Mr_Nutz I enjoy hearing what they think about games on other platforms. Games are games no matter where they are, who cares what console they played them on.
Majora's Mask is my second favorite Zelda game, tbh.
I never got far into Majorca’s Mask because of the time limits so I guess that would be my default least favourite given it’s the only Zelda game I ever started but never finished. I’m in love with the atmosphere and art that I’ve seen of the game but just found it so stressful to play every time I’ve given it a go.
100% agree with Sunshine. I had great memories of playing that as a kid but when playing it again on 3D All Stars it honestly sucked. Looks and sounds amazing and some shines were fun to get but a lot of the level design was beyond infuriating.
I’m with Krysta. My favorite is surprisingly Triforce Heroes. I’m really disappointed that it didn’t connect with fans, but I understand why it wouldn’t be for everyone.
Wow, TP was my fav Zelda game and MM my 2nd one.
Sunshine has such a nice vibe to it and while I understand the flaws of NSMB2 I actually did enioy playing it.
@Fizza Sunshine is the worst of the Mario games, by faaar!
@Edu23XWiiU You're probably not going to like the one I think is the worst 3D Mario (even if only by a bit).
Their Podcast is really good! They did a lot more than being the Nintendo Minute guys. For instance, Kit and Krysta were in charge of the marketing campaigns for the launch of the Switch and BotW, respectively.
@Fizza Hahahahha we're in opposites my friend. I personally think 64 is still the best 3D Mario game hehehehe.
Hmm, my least favorite of Mario and Zelda...that's tough since generally they're all excellent and have great production values. I guess if I have to qualify such a decision, it would be by which game(s) lost my interest before finishing them, but even then sometimes it wasn't dislike but rather the fact I simply got pulled into other games at the time.
Mario Sunshine was probably the weakest link of that series for me personally. Again, great production values, but the later stages of the game required some insane levels of precision, and the F.L.U.D.D. controls sometimes got in the way of that. In any case, I just lost interest probably 2/3 or so through the game.
With Zelda, it was Majora's Mask, hands down. I realize that many folks adore it, and again, it's a high-quality game with loads of personality, but I fell in love with Zelda for the exploration and (typically) increasingly expansive environments, and personally I prefer to be able to take my time about doing so. Majora's Mask's countdown to the Moon crashing down onto the realm gave it a constant feeling of stress for me, and while the game opened up somewhat as it went on, generally speaking the scope felt far more limited than Ocarina of Time. The Groundhog Day approach began to feel redundant for me quickly, as well. It simply never held my interest through the end.
They're casuals. Of course they don't appreciate Majora's Mask.
::stomps off with superior taste in Nintendo::😜
Here's a really unpopular opinion: Galaxy 2 is the best 3D Mario but Galaxy 1 is the worst.
Also, two of the worst Zelda games are LttP and the original LoZ.
@Edu23XWiiU Whoops, I forgot to specify 3D Mario games (just corrected it there). I don't think 64 is the absolute worst, don't get me wrong!
In regards to overall Mario games, out of the ones I've played, I'm not a fan of the original, NSMB2 or..... World (damn it, why do I always have the most controversial opinions when it comes to Mario?!?).
Least favorite Zelda: Oracle of Ages/Seasons
Least favorite Mario: love them all but agree NSMB2 is super generic
@Fizza Hahahaha I love World, of the 2D ones, the one I dislike the most is the first NSMB, since the other ones have so much more stuff than it, but is not to say it's a bad game. Sunshine, on the other hand, hehehe. I think this difference of opinion showcases how varied and different the Mario games are.
Majoras's Mask is very, very far from a bad game, but it's definitely not better than Ocarina of Time.
I wanted to like Mario Sunshine, but I couldn't. I played it back in the day too, so it's not a matter of experiencing it at the wrong time. Even all the way back to the '90s, I was really sensitive to the common pitfalls of 3D game design. If I had to wrestle with the controls and camera, then I knew I wasn't going to have fun. If I had an N64, I think I would have grown tired of Mario 64 pretty quickly. As for Zelda, I hated Twilight Princess. I remember it was advertised at 40+ hours, which I think was a response to some feeling that Wind Waker was too short. Twilight Princess felt so obviously padded with content specifically to drag the game out. And as far as the optional collecting I only bothered with the easy stuff, so I'm no completionist. By a certain point, it just felt like work. I don't even know why I bothered to finish it. The main highlight of my time with Twilight Princess on the Gamecube was being able to hit the far target in the bow target-practice game on the first try before I even knew there was a scope. So I'm definitely with Kit on his picks and the reasons behind them.
I find MM the hardest game to get into, and through numerous attempts I've never made it more than an hour in. That said, from a design perspective, it's easily one of the best classic Zelda games ever made, if not THE best. How they finished it so quickly is beyond me!
Disagree about NSMB2. As Dave Bulmer would say, the game has earned a place up on the shelf with the good Mario games - which is all of them! Except Sunshine, obviously.
@Effortless-gamer Its funny how in the last article posted about them, I said basically the same thing and my comment got deleted for being "unconstructive".
I still stand by what I said, except for I know who they are now and still don't see why their opinion matters.
@ArcticEcho Thanks to an honest mistake, I was gifted the original NSMB when I asked for NSMB2 for Christmas one year lol. I enjoyed the former and got a lot of mileage out of it.
I've certainly read about Sunshine's problems, though some people seem to really like it. I'll try it for myself when I get to my backlogged copy of Super Mario 3D All-Stars. I don't intend to 100% it, but I do want to give it a fair shot.
My favorite Mario and Zelda are easily Mario 64 and Ocarina of Time. Runners up would be Sunshine, Odyssey, Twilight Princess and Breath of the Wild. While I think there are few truly bad games in either series, Spirit Tracks and NSMB2 are my least favorite.
I can see why Sunshine is poorly received. It definitely has its flaws, but I think it's fantastic once they're seen past.
I get it. Time limits stress me out when I'm trying to puzzle-solve. I have a similar problem with Pikmin. I recognize both as great games, but those time limits stress me out to the point of diminished enjoyment.
After all of these years playing games, it still amazes me that even Mario and Zelda games at their worst are better fhan many, many others.
Even my least favorite Mario and Zelda games are ones I still greatly enjoy.
That really says something pretty awesome about Nintendo!
@Dingelhopper my original account got banned for being "rude" for daring to disagree with a nl staff member about a terrible review they wrote. Lol.
This comment will also probably get removed, so I feel ya.
Twilight Princess is very nostalgic, but I can certainly agree that the game in retrospect isn't that great. I can say the same with Sunshine because both games really feel like a drag if you really want to beat them.
As for Majora's Mask...I believe it was a game ahead of its time, and was only appropriate as a modern game. I'll be blunt - As flawed as the 3DS version is, the N64 version did not age very well. First of all, buying an Expansion Pack alone is likely very expensive nowadays. Secondly, the only good emulation is either NSO + EP or dubiously legal methods. Thirdly, I can't bear slow text and constant pausing. It's a great game, but I do believe we have yet to get some definitive release outside of mods that takes the best of both the original and the remaster.
New Super Mario Bros 2...yeah, I felt like there was absolutely no reason to play that game if the same console had Super Mario 3D Land as well as backwards compatibility with the DS, meaning you could just play the first NSMB game and get relatively the same experience, maybe even more if you factor in mini-games.
It's fine if you don't like open world games i guess.
Worst Mario game: Super Mario 3D World. Its the only one that doesn't use the full extent of its original console's capabilites and it is just short and feels limited in pretty much every aspect of the game.
Worst Zelda game: The Legend of Zelda Breath of the Wild. It just feels like one of those generic Ubisoft games, a big mostly empty world with not enough variety in dungeons and enemies... and a general lack of structure, direction and/or purpose. Nintendo's first attempt at TWO overly expensive limited editions, 4 amiibo figures and the first DLC in a Zelda game (again, a la Ubisoft) coupled with the launch of the console itself... it was just unbearable.
Super Mario Sunshine is honestly one of my favourites.I love the difficulty and the setting (I really love Isle Delfino as a hub) and honestly think FLUDD makes for some really fun movement. Some of the jankier levels can get chuckstered though
@dew12333 What are you on about? They’re not even controversial picks. Their reasoning is all fine, Majora’s Mask is a tough game to get into if you’re not into time management, NSMB2 is generic, Twilight Princess has a pretty empty world/the dungeons are long/complicated at times and Sunshine is notoriously divisive. If they were really going to lie for attention they could have gone for much more popular games than those.
@larryisaman but Zelda 2 and Triforce Heroes exist. Are you saying that these two nobodies (again, who are these people? seriously I'm asking) really like those games better than Twilight Princess or Majora's Mask? C'mon.
imagining a world where everyone saying "who are these people saying this and why should we care" did it on the reviews as well
worst mario is sunshine, for reasons everyone has said by this point, worst zelda is wind waker, for partially the same reasons people have been saying were why BOTW was bad--BOTW's wide overworld worked/was less of a snore due to its more kinetic method of travel and exploration
@tripunktoj SM3DW is one of the longer mario games i've played, are you conflating brevity in replayable levels for a shorter game?
@effortless-gamer plenty of people like Zelda 2 more than either of those games, and I'd imagine there's a fair sect of people who haven't played triforce heroes beyond its demo (myself included)
Still say that Tri Force Heroes is probably the worst mainline Zelda game for me but guess if we're going strictly single-player-only experiences, then I'd say it's a close tie between Phantom Hourglass and Zelda II.
But Twilight Princess gave us the DOUBLE CLAWSHOTS, my favorite Zelda tool/weapon by far! And Malo Mart!
"I don't like this Mario because it's too generic. I don't like this Zelda because it's too experimental."
@larryisaman My issue is that, with the "I worked there" element removed, it's just two people who know about games, talking about games. I can get that anywhere.
Twilight princess is one of my favorites, I just don't get not liking it. I think my top 3 are BotW, Twilight princess, and Wind Waker, in that order.
I agree with them on Sunshine and Majora’s Mask, those were kind of boring. I just hope Nintendo doesn’t get mad at them since they used to run their channel😭
@Mr_Nutz Aye, and with the legendary game developer tag removed Miyamoto is just some guy. What’s your point?
These guys worked at Nintendo for over a decade so have a lot of insight into the inner workings of the company, and as people who had a show that was bound up in what they could and couldn’t say due to its official nature it’s fun to see them talk freely about the products they used to promote. As far as having articles up about their random opinions yeah, probably not important enough for that (though it’s sparked a fun discussion) but I can’t say I’m not intrigued to hear what the faces of Nintendo’s social presence for a very long time have to say about things they were previously held back from.
@Effortless-gamer Might not have played Zelda 2? Might have enjoyed Triforce Heroes a lot with friends (I definitely did)? I don’t know, not my opinions. But it’s not like Twilight Princess is unanimously revered in the way OoT or BotW are anyway, there are plenty of people who didn’t care for it. I love it but I see can plenty of reasons why some might not- same for many Zelda games to be fair.
"it goes in such a different direction compared to Ocarina of Time"
There are many interpretations of different. MM simply didn't resonate with people. Different is not always betters.
" and it gave us Tingle!"
aaaaand that's why it failed..
@somebread the wider Zelda fan base would wholeheartedly disagree on the Zelda 2 statement. Zelda 2 had it's fans. They're wrong. But they're allowed their opinions. Lol. But seriously Zelda 2 is far far FAR more divisive than Twilight Princess.
I'm not even really defending it. It's my least favorite 3d Zelda, mainly because it's so derivative of OoT. But it's still a worthwhile entry into the series with some compelling characters and amazing music.
Mario Sunshine, I kinda get. It has wonky difficulty spikes all over the place and feels rushed out the gate - because it was. And nsmb as a franchise as a whole...just feels bland. I honestly even felt that way about the original on the DS.
Triforce Heroes is another matter though. Unlike Zelda 2 it's near universally disliked. Not because there isn't the potential for a good game. But because of self imposed limitations from Nintendo. Expecting 3 friends to have 3ds consoles and a copy of the game was ridiculous.
Not being able to play with a friend and a random person was just poor implementation of an already mediocre online service from Nintendo
It was either 3 friends or 2 randoms and it sucked because of it. And the less said about trying to play it single player, the better.
If anyone prefers that mess over TP or MM has a very strange taste in games, in my opinion.
I seriously don't get the hate for Twilight Princess. It's a brilliant game. Some say it just copies Ocarina of Time's formula, but it expands upon and perfects the formula, there's much more to explore, the story is full of twists and turns, the music is epic, and we get the best sidekick character in the entire franchise, Midna. Twilight Princess is easily one of the best, if not THE best, Zelda games of all time.
Conversely, I think Zelda II: The Adventure of Link is the worst (not counting the CD-i Zelda games). It can be a very difficult game to master, especially with it's RPG-like leveling system in a series that never had it before and never really had it since, and even then, a lot of the deaths can be really cheap. The knockback mechanic can send you tumbling into a pit that you're jumping over if a flying fish skull (Bago-Bago) jumps up from nowhere and hits you, causing you to lose a precious life.
In terms of Mario, it's hard to say what's good and bad, because Nintendo really puts the time and effort into making those games good. I have a lot of nostalgic value for Super Mario 64, especially the DS version. But I also have a soft spot for Super Mario Sunshine (problems aside), both Super Mario Galaxies (although I like the first one over the second), and Super Mario Odyssey.
But I can definitely see where they would say that some of the New Super Mario Bros. games could be "bad." But they're not so much bad as they are generic to the franchise, and don't do much to move the franchise forward in terms of innovation. Personally, I find Mario Kart 7 to be my least favorite, especially when I have to race again and again to get the coins to unlock kart parts (and since you can only get 40 coins max per cup, and some of those parts cost thousands of coins, it becomes a chore).
The only thing that makes sense is rating New Super Mario Bros.2 as the worst Mario game. Everything else, you saved me a podcast... that I don't watch anyway.
New Super Mario Bros 2 i agree that is too generic,but Legend of Zelda Twilight Princess is a amazing game.
@larryisaman I would much rather know your opinion than these two. And I also took from one of your other comments that they worked for nintendo, I am pretty dam sure they were not in the loop for anything interesting at all.
Majora's Mask is vastly over rated. but I'd say my least favourite Zelda game is Four Swords Adventures. As for Mario, my least favourite of the main series would also be Sunshine.
@AstroTheGamosian I agree. Twilight Princess, especially the HD version, is the most perfect game that Nintendo has developed. It's perfectly made.
@Effortless-gamer Lol that's crazy. It feels like it depends on who's moderating at the time. A while ago I had two of my comments removed in one hour.
None of them were offensive or "trolly" and were just merely my opinions on things but each of them were removed for "not being useful" or "flaming". I still find it really absurd.
@Banjo- Totally. It combines everything I love about Ocarina of Time, The Wind Waker, and Breath of the Wild. Plus, I liked the more realistic graphics while still keeping an anime-like art style.
Of course, I have yet to get the HD remake (I'd love to get one with the Wolf Link amiibo, though), so I based my experience on the Wii version.
Is it odd that I'm a 54 year old Nintendo fan and I have never played a Zelda or Metroid game, even back on the NES...but I guess from videos I have watched, my least favourite Zelda would be Wind waker and my least favorite Mario would be Super Mario World...
Yep, nsmb2 definitely is the weakest 2D Mario since it has a really lazy "hook".
@AstroTheGamosian I got the one with the Wolf Link amiibo 😁. I agree, the game combines everything that makes a Zelda game great and the graphics are gorgeous, the HD version especially. The refined textures and crisp graphics are all awesome. When I play it, I feel that it's the best game that Nintendo has ever developed.
Oh, I absolutely adore open world games; Just one where i'm challenged to explore, you know? BotW didn't exactly give me any incentive to go out and explore, unlike Witcher 3 or Ghost of Tsushima. Even Dragon Age Inquisition was fun to play through, despite it's.. shortcomings. BotW, though, is just a snoozefest and I will never play it again, nor its sequel.
Ummm shrines, towers, side quests, among other things?
I'm thinking you mabye didn't give it a chance.
@Banjo- It's just a shame it consistently gets ranked so low on rankings for Zelda games, whereas Ocarina of Time is usually ranked #2 or #1 (no lower than #3).
Personally, I think the reason why Ocarina of Time is always ranked so highly is because of the nostalgia factor. That clouds people's judgements a lot.
Don't get me wrong: I love the game myself, and it was THE game that made made a gamer for life. But Twilight Princess did it better, and is the far superior game.
I will always rank Twilight Princess #1, and Breath of the Wild a close #2. Maybe if Breath of the Wild had more variety in enemies, proper dungeons, minigames, and special weapons, it would have surpassed Twilight Princess in my book.
@AstroTheGamosian I wasn't a huge fan of BotW. Ocarina of Time, yes, it's a round story with amazing gameplay, places, characters and music. I also love Majora's Mask, much better if you include the side quests in your playthrough. In any case, Twilight Princess is sublime 😊.
And wouldn't you love a The Legend of Zelda game like that Wii U demo?
If I had to pick one Mario game that I could never play again, it would easily be SMB1. I think people feel reluctant to pick it as a least-favorite because it's a "classic" and was a landmark moment in gaming history, but it's clearly the worst mainline Mario game IMO. The acceleration and momentum physics are aggravating, there's no ability to backtrack, there are a whopping two powerup types, springs are miserable to use, and there are several levels (within a pretty short game) that just aren't fun. I'm glad to have played it, but I have no desire to ever play it again.
@Banjo- Oh, absolutely, I would have loved that. I love Twilight Princess's darker, more realistic, art style. I wish more Zelda games were like that.
It's a crying shame that the only original Zelda game in the main series for the Wii U (so not including HD remakes or spinoffs like Hyrule Warriors) launched at the very end of it's life cycle, and was also a launch title for the Switch.
Heck, the GameCube had three (The Wind Waker, Four Swords Adventures, and Twilight Princess), the Wii had two (Twilight Princess and Skyward Sword), and the Switch will have at least two (Breath of the Wild and it's sequel).
@AstroTheGamosian Right, that demo looked like a Twilight Princess sequel 😊. I hope that we get something like that after BotW2.
@Banjo- Personally, I would love a sequel to Twilight Princess. I always hated how Midna shattered the Mirror of Twilight, separating her from the person she loved.
I would love a sequel where Link realizes that he loved Midna as well, and tries to find his way back to the Twilight Realm and reunite with Midna.
There doesn't even have to be a villain per se, or some existential battle between good and evil: just a man on a quest to reunite with someone he loves.
@AstroTheGamosian Midna is a great character. A Twilight Princess sequel would be great indeed, another dark entry, with a villain and malice if possible. I think that one of the things that makes the game extraordinary is the level of immersion right from the start.
@Banjo- As long as it isn't Ganondorf again. Especially considering he died at the end of Twilight Princess. Maybe a mage from the Hyrulean Royal Family who seeks revenge against the Twili for their invasion in Twilight Princess (which resulted in the death of his wife), and manipulates Link to find a way back to the Twilight Realm, under the guise of reuniting with Midna, so he can destroy them all.
But unlike other villains in Zelda, this one can be redeemed, and even strikes up a romantic relationship with a Twili mage at the end of the game.
I like both Sunshine and Majora’s Mask, but they are definitely lower for me too.
@AstroTheGamosian That is kind of interesting 😊.
@Banjo- Oh, there's plenty more where that came from, not just in terms of Zelda, either.
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