The Switch is a transformative product in Nintendo's history. The hybrid console straddles the divide between domestic and portable gaming, giving players the best of both worlds – but it also marks a significant change from tradition; prior to its release, Nintendo adopted a twin-system strategy where home consoles would be sold alongside dedicated portables, like the Game Boy, Game Boy Advance, DS and 3DS.
Some would argue that this shift has been a long time coming; the recently-discontinued 3DS has sold 75.9 million units worldwide – hardly a failure, but a fact which makes it the weakest-performing dedicated handheld that Nintendo has ever released, lagging behind the likes of the Game Boy / Game Boy Color (118 million), Game Boy Advance (81.5 million) and the Nintendo DS (154.02 million). The arrival of devices like smartphones and tablets has certainly changed how people play games on the move, and the Switch has proven to be the ideal solution to this change – from Nintendo's perspective, at least.
However, with the Switch now over three years old, questions are naturally being asked about what form Nintendo's next system will take. Some believe that the company has wised up to the fact that the Switch can enjoy a prolonged lifespan, and could even potentially become the company's version of the iPhone or iPad – a perpetually evolving platform which enjoys regular hardware upgrades and grants users access to their entire library of games.
If that does come to pass, then the question of what shape Nintendo's next console will take becomes less pressing – but it's tempting to ask if the company will ever return to the world of dedicated portable consoles ever again, a market which previously gave it so much success.
For Perrin Kaplan – who spent 16 years at Nintendo of America as head of marketing – the answer is yes, and she feels that the existence of the Switch Lite – a version of the Switch which removes on-TV play – proves this.
Speaking to Gamesindustry.biz, she says:
There is a market for millions who love a standalone games portable system. I'm one of those millions for sure. So, never say never.
Ubisoft's Shara Hashemi is in agreement, and feels that there will always be a place in the market for portable devices:
As a mother to a seven-year-old, I am always reticent to give my iPhone to my daughter. I would much rather have her play on a handheld with selected games tailored to her.
Mat Piscatella, executive director for games at data firm NPD, agrees that portability is important, but feels flexibility is a more vital selling point for any future console Nintendo releases:
The tech is at a place where separating a portable is no longer necessary to have a market viable product. Today's video game consumers seem to be preferring flexibility with content engagement, so I'd expect other solutions to be preferable to a dedicated portable platform. But things change.
Jo Bartlett, former Nintendo UK head of communications and partnerships, feels that Nintendo's unpredictable nature means it's hard to say if the firm will drop back into the world of handheld gaming with a system that can only be played in portable form:
Part of the magic of Nintendo is never being able to predict what it's going to do next, or how it will capture the imagination of gamers, so who knows what it's got up its sleeve?
As things stand now, the chances of Nintendo turning its back on the Switch concept seem unlikely – the console is serving a niche than neither Microsoft nor Sony are interested in challenging – but there are other ways in which Nintendo could create an affordable, robust portable in the same vein as the Game Boy or DS.
We've already seen the firm embrace its past with the likes of the NES and SNES Classic Editions – a Game Boy Classic has been in demand for quite some time, and – if paired with a digital store – could give parents a low-cost means of keeping their youngsters entertained.
Would you like to see Nintendo create another dedicated handheld system beyond the Switch? Let us know with a comment.
I honestly don't get why people are saying this handheld/console hybrid thing is literally going to be their permanent model going forward
Nintendo has been very well known for the better part of close to two decades for experimenting constantly with different styles and models for introducing unique gameplay elements since they completely deemphasized their focus on pushing their consoles technologically post-GameCube. The Switch was a very successful experiment, but it's an experiment nonetheless, and Nintendo's next home console will probably be something completely new as a result. Dedicated home consoles and handhelds were never being eschewed in favor of going all in on this hybrid model. I don't expect Nintendo to go back to making more simplified experiences that fit the handheld model since the Switch proved you no longer have to do that, but the Switch very well proved there's still a divide between those dedicated to playing on the go, and those who prefer playing at home on the TV.
The Switch is probably being positioned to have a long lasting and healthy enough lifecycle because it is a concept that resonates with so many people, and Nintendo themselves know they're going to have to move on eventually
Well, duh! Why pay people to tell us what we know?
I think a better question would be if Nintendo will have a console in the future that isn’t a hybrid handheld system (that will be able to compete with the other modern console specs).
@TheFrenchiestFry It’s because they’ve finally merged their dev studios. It’s a lot easier to deliver a steady stream of quality software for one console than 2.
When the GameCube had strong games, the GBA suffered. When Nintendo moved to the DS, the GC releases tanked. Quiet parts of the Wii release schedule were always busy DS ones and vice-versa. The 3DS went from strength to strength and the Wii U kinda sucked.
If Nintendo did some research and discovered the majority of Switch owners never bother to take it out of the dock (unlikely) they would revert back to a box console for the home but likely have the same chipset and cartridges for a portable.
There is no going back now.
A dedicated handheld with a library separate from another device that can be played on a TV? No.
A device like the Switch Lite? Sure. Why not?
@TheFrenchiestFry Nintendo isn't going to abandon either market, they can't simultaneously support two separate HD systems at one time, they're uninterested in developing powerful hardware (relative to the competition, at least), they merged their development resources, and the Switch approach was wildly successful. There's no other approach that wouldn't be ruinously stupid to even attempt. It's so obvious most of knew what the Switch was going to be before they even officially detailed it.
Don't get me wrong: I absolutely think they're going to experiment with other hardware features as well. But I also think, whatever their next console turns out to be, it'll also be a hybrid. It's an experiment in the same way analog sticks on their controllers were an "experiment."
I dont see them going back to dedicated handhelds and consoles. They are still able to experiment and implement new ideas without leaving the hybrid model behind, just look at Labo and Ring Fit as two example of affordable hardware that allowed them to experiment without having to build an entire system around a gimmick. The hybrid approach provides a solid foundation for Nintendo to then build off of when they want to try out some of their more wacky ideas and once interest has lessened they can move on to the next project without having to support the previous work for an entire generation.
@Tandy255 most people are sure the answer to that question is no.
I don't see nintendo just doing the same thing for the next console. that just doesn't fit with how they've operated for the last 20 years. I'm sure it will be handheld, but beyond that they are very unpredictable when it comes to new hardware.
Honestly if it weren't for a few nagging issues, i would completely switch to the lite. tv play is great, but after 4 years of the switch i don't really see why they couldnt just go all in on a better handheld experience
@RadioHedgeFund The Wii U's problems were beyond way more than just support. In fact, first-party support was also a partial weakness in the Wii U's case because some of the games they produced just came off as extremely lazy, tone-deaf or soulless in the case of everything from around 2015-2016 after 2014 ended up easily being the console's single best year for a lot of people.
And I think you also seem to forget that the GBA did not at all suffer. Despite the strong games the GameCube had going for them, the GC was what was considered Nintendo's first major flop in the home console market not counting the Virtual Boy, and the success of the PS2 despite being technologically weaker than both GameCube and Xbox was what pushed Nintendo to deemphasize pushing their games technologically and graphically in favor of experimenting with different playstyles and types. The GBA sold like 80 million units worldwide by the end of its lifecycle despite its library being filled with ports and remakes of older games. The library did not do anything to slow it down or make it stagnate in favor of GameCube support. Nintendo practically had unparalleled marketshare in the portable games space until Sony released the PSP.
I'm crazy enough to want a dock-able switch lite that can play on the tv.
"Does Nintendo Have A Handheld Future Beyond The Switch?"
As long as there is Nintendo, there will always be a form of handheld gaming. I don't really see me play on my phone when I'm not at home. Phone screens still aren't controllers, and trying to "connect" a controller to them usually doesn't work well.
A dedicated handheld gaming system will always win on that part. I think the next home consoles (PS5 / XBOX Series X) might be the last real "generation" of consoles. After which console gaming will be either incremental or completely cloud based. With a tiny box with cheap hardware at home and streaming over the internet. Even then handhelds would still be preferable on the go (no internet connection) or even handhelds that have 5G built in for streaming. (but as an option)
For me it’s much more convenient than having a console/tv setup. I rarely dock my switch. I think Nintendo fill a big gap in the market here, where Sony didn’t quite succeed with the Vita.
The Vita for me at the time was my ultimate console as it brought the home console experience portably, now we have the switch with Witcher 3 etc, I think this proves a bright future ahead for handheld gaming
a Game Boy Classic would appeal only to nostalgic parents.
If you think a XXI century kid would be even remotely interested in a monochromatic retro handheld, you know nothing about them
@ozwally The Vita was an awesome device, but Sony dropped first party support way too soon.
we don't need tv based consoles from nintendo anymore.
@Crockin it really does make me so curious as to what their next console will be, I might get flamed for this but I think Switch is their best and most innovative console to date, basically the Wii U come to full fruition
@ozwally I think the next Nintendo console would be a one or two screen device. Play on the go on one screen, and play at home with two (your device and on the TV) with wireless streaming from the console to the TV. And, like they originally wanted with the Wii U, you could play multiplayer like this as well. One screen per player, and one TV where it all combines.
I honestly hope that nintendo stays with this formula that they are in with the Switch. The switch has had massive amount of first party games coming out for it, and it's continuing. When they had a console and a handheld, it seemed to be one year focusing on the console and another year on the handheld, with the lesser being left behind. It's nice of them to have just one focus, and the games pour out on it.
I am curious on what they're next console will be, it's going to have to become powerful to keep up no matter what they think. They can't keep having the same amount of process in their consoles with barely any upgrade. Guess we'll see in 2021 when they start to announce it, but I believe that the Switch will be around for more than 5 years, sort of like the Wii was. It's a big selling system and the games are still flying out for it, with certain titles still unannounced. Plus, there's still features on the Switch that they can make money with...why do we still not have themes to purchase on it yet, when it has the Themes setting? Would be nice to find a nice Mario, Zelda or Kirby theme on the system to have in the background!
I will always go where the handhelds go. @sanderev Couldn't agree more still play mine about as much as my switch.
TIL I'm an expert
if nintendo is taking the path of the iphone, ipod, and ipad than maybe Nintendo should make a smartphone edition of the Nintendo Switch. or add cellular capibilities to the Nintendo Switch lite.
The idea of a portable standalone gaming system is genius. Don't get me wrong, I LOVE Nintendo's old consoles where there were features, apps, first party exclusives and the like, but having a HANDHELD system that does NOTHING BUT play videogames, that's so futuristic, and is definitely not something Nintendo has ever done between 1989 and 2015
@TheFrenchiestFry Super Gameboy, Transfer Pak, GBA Player, Link Cable, DS Wireless Transfer: Nintendo had been trying to merge their portable and home markets since 1992. The Switch is the amalgam of 20 years of research and development.
There is no way Nintendo are going back to making separate dedicated devices each with their own library.
I was thinking that maybe Nintendo would release a home console that interacts with the Switch. Use as a second screen or streams. Then the Switch becomes the hand held.
Nope. Switch 2. Switch 3 and so on is the way forward. Hybrid business model is here to stay with Lite versions inbetween which will satisfy the portable only market.
They'd be stupid to drop the Switch branding and do something different in future.
On a real note, the Switch's success concerns me because It's at best a step up from the DS or GameCube. Don't get me wrong, the Switch is an AMAZING console in 2006, but I already had the Gameboy Advance and Gamecube with the adaptor.
I may be asking too much of Nintendo here, but I wouldn't mind if Nintendo's next console was a step up from the Wii, It's almost like that happened in 2012, I feel like there's a lot of potential for a console with features AND first party exclusives.
I love playing iOS, PC and Wii U games on a HD GameBoy but I really do miss the days when Nintendo's consoles had features and their own games
Towards the end of the Switch's life, I can see them releasing another, even smaller, pocketsize, cheaper switch lite to capitalize on the back catalogue, a bit like the 2ds-flat or gameboy micro. If I was an indie dev, I would continue to support that platform for many years into the next generation.
@sanderev I have a vita. It works OK, as a paperweight.
I really don't want them making separate systems again. The quality of such a handheld wouldn't be as good as the Switch's and frankly its not all that great e.g. its chips were old, it lacks decent ram.
Sales are booming. Is this question even worth asking right now, does it need experts to work out. It's ridiculous to be honest.
They'll come up with a new idea or continue with an upgraded Switch Advance next IMO
Yes for me! After Ps Vita i love to play with my switch lite. If no portable, i will stop to buy gaming consoles.My last home console was Gamecube!
Why would they need to create another, separate handheld. If people want that they can buy a Switch lite. The gaming scene has a handheld , it could have another one but with sales still growing, to step away from the Switch model would be pure madness. Switch is here to stay for a very ling time, I am talking 20 years plus.
100% there’s a future for Switch quality stand-alone handheld consoles. I much prefer a dedicate console for gaming, wether that’s at home or on the go. I have 4 kids of varying ages and they use their iPads/iPhones for a good bit of gaming but it’s a completely different type of game than they play on their Switch or PS4. I can’t see them just abandoning a stand-alone machine anytime soon.
I love the hybrid console.
I was always a fan of handhelds, and I got them all.
When the GB was out, I had the GBA and I couldn't afford one.
Same with the Wii and Wii U, I never got those because I had a DS and a 3DS. And for people who live with a minimum wage at those times, I wasn't able to get one home console.
So when the Switch came out, it was like a state of mental peace to only have to worry about getting one console and not having to choose between the handheld or the bigger one.
I would love to have a Game Boy mini though.
Switch bridges both play styles perfectly because it is a handheld with a seamless docking experience that is practically instantaneous. Other versatile products have released in the past, but the key to Nintendo's innovation is the seamless transition between play styles.
It's really just Western marketing that the Switch is a home console first, and also a handheld. In Japan, the marketing is clearly geared toward the Switch as a handheld first, and also a home console.
Growing up as a handheld gamer first and a home console gamer second, I am absolutely loving the fact that Nintendo is releasing their finest AAA games on their handheld system, that also functions as a home console.
A big part of Nintendo’s handhelds is that they market to the demographics not yet in the enthusiast gamer camp. Sony and MS will also lean heavily on games showing sports cars and destructive weapons in their marketing. Nintendo’s handheld’s top selling games haven’t traditionally had either, instead featured more whimsical experiences like fantasy go karting and pokeballs and vacuums.
@TheFrenchiestFry I think this is a different situation though. Since the 80s Nintendo has had a handheld and home console, but with the competition of mobile gaming cutting into the pie, I think this is their solution going forward. They will experiment with how that works, but a hybrid of some kind is their future.
There will be a handheld element to Nintendo as long as they exist, but they may not be "as separate" as it was in the past. Look no further than Apple: iOS, iPadOS and tvOS. Most of the entertainment apps and video games will play across all three devices with no issues. Hardware limitations may come into play depending on the device's age, but everything just works. Apple has added new features to these devices along the way, you can use an Xbox One and PS4 controller with any of them now for example. I could go into a long list, but it's an ecosystem that still bring most of the past with it while moving forward with the technology.
I think Nintendo has adopted this future, where the Switch is the platform where devices will be upgraded and changed every 4-5 years. All software will work going forward, plus new features can still be added as well. Backward compatibility? Won't be an issue unless they move away from ARM and their "Android-based OS", plus the software developers themselves providing support. There's a long game at work with the Switch now that it's a proven success. Just look what they did the original Switch, while performance gain was low end, they added a new processor and bigger battery. Whatever the "Switch Pro" winds up becoming, whether souped-up hybrid or TV only, it'll be in a line up with the Switch Lite and Switch. Keeping the mantra of "play games your way".
@hagemaru, that defeats the purpose of it being handheld-only. It's made in the mindset the owner doesn't want to play on TV at all. Also, I think both the Lite and hybrid system will have another function IF a TV-only model comes into existence.
Have had every Nintendo console and handheld since the Gamecube + GBA generation. I have loved having two different style game experiences running parallel at each time. They always complemented each other nicely. I loved having both Metroid Prime, as well as having Fusion and Zero Mission. It was like having a little handheld SNES with brilliant new game experiences nobody would put on a home console at that time.
Same with the DS - Wii generation and to a lesser extent the WiiU - 3DS generation. I enjoyed both and enjoyed the different experiences they offered, but the lines started to get blurred.
With the Switch, I find I am missing the kind of games which they would put on their handhelds. 2D games, old skool style games, puzzles, experimental games. The indie offerings on the e-shop to some extent seem to fill that gap though, so can't complain too much. Nintendo studios seem stretched to the limit by producing HD games. Even for their biggest franchises now they seem to skip a generation between entries. There is no way they could be producing software for another devise, unless of course they outsourced a lot of development. It's what they did largely for their previous handhelds but they seem not to be keen to do that much anymore.
@TheFrenchiestFry Why wouldn't it be their permanent thing going forward? If their next system is a handheld that can't connect to a TV, then they are taking a huge, embarrassing step back. If their next console is only a console, then they are putting themselves at a disadvantage against Sony and Microsoft.
Nintendo's strength at this point is its handhelds, not its consoles. Part of the success of the Switch is because it unified Nintendo's development; they no longer have to develop games for two separate platforms simultaneously, like they did with 3DS and Wii U. If they split their console and handheld offerings once again in the future, it puts them at a huge disadvantage.
@ozwally i think it's easily their best console since snes. as for what's next, i guess we'll just have to wait and see. i really hope they can catch lightning in a bottle, but that's kinda tough to do two gens in a row. i personally think a super powered handheld would be the best thing, but a lot can happen in gaming trends in the next few years
@GEKGanon It puts them at a disadvantage because they made that choice. It was their choice to deemphasize power. It was their choice to distance themselves from Sony and Microsoft's competitive nature. All of that was their choice. They can reverse that decision at any time and actually start releasing hardware that is on par with the competition again while carrying over their design mentality for their first party software and ability to experiment with different playstyles, and as the PS5/Series X look like increasingly interesting propositions for different reasons, I think there will come a time where Nintendo will have to reconsider how their hardware fares in comparison to them.
It has to be for more of a gaming audience, nothings ever going to beat the ease and convenience of smartphone/tablet gaming for kids
Nintendo will never make a separate home console and handheld ever again. In fact, they have specified in their investor meetings that focusing their software development pipeline around a single platform is one of the main reasons why the Switch is such a success.
Nintendo can still create new experiences on Switch via games that require hardware accessories - Labo, Ring Fit Adventure, and Mario Kart Live are proof of this.
The thing with Nintendo is, if they have a cool idea that fits a hand held, we'll get a new hand held. As is, any handhelds could just fall into the 'Lite' catagory of Switch iterations.
TV and handheld together as it is now. That's the winning formula for the future as well.
And also. All comments are really interesting this time.
Why? They can't compete in the dedicated console space as proved since the poor choices that led them to the N64 and on. The Switch provides something the Twins aren't doing that seems to have caught on. Just iterate faster (say every 2 years) and I think it'd be a winner winner.
The Switch is already a handheld. Why do people pretend it isn't?
@sword_9mm They can compete in the dedicated console space. It was ultimately dumb decisions that brought their cred down. I guarantee you the N64 and GameCube could've easily been way more successful had they not opted for the limiting physical game storage options that also alienated a lot of third party developers who previously showed up in droves for the SNES like Square Enix, Konami and Capcom. That in turn, also resulted in the libraries of those respective consoles to be more limited in terms of variety or diversity of genres, especially in the N64's case.
If they can focus all of their work on games for one system that covers both markets, I don't see why they wouldn't. Still, a Game Boy Micro approach of the Switch would be insanely tempting, I love my Game Boy Micro. But I don't think it CAN happen, some games already have too small text, or using the touch screen already covers up what you're actually trying to touch. Bigger handhelds than a Switch are hardly portable anymore... So it's good as it is.
But since it's Nintendo we're talking about, I'm always open to be surprised by whatever they come up with next, and how they often succeed in making it my favourite system.
@IronMan30 I do agree people keep saying nonsense about the Switch. But the hybrid is a success that they can't accept as reality. As to more horsepower Switch that will happen regardless people seem to think they know better but they don't. Also to note those experts don't work for Nintendo so that should tell you somethings about their so called expertise.
Nintendo's at the moment comes across as more of a handheld console company, and have most of that market. But as the new Xbox and PS5 emerge so the Switch is pushed further back in the home console market.
The Switch Lite is a cheaper and more basic clone of the original Switch, which does the job of playing Switch games without needing a TV, well.
But as far as innovation goes, the Original Switch takes all the Switch credit. Whereas the DS/3ds is true handheld innovative. Pocketable, touchscreen, stylus, dual screen, 3d and a lid.
But that was then. While a hybrid may be the best of both worlds, it can never really be the best of either.
@zool another tool for NintenDoomed fandom. They like to impress by making nonsense statements when their others are lacking innovations leaders.
Nintendo is innovative and has a history of doing the unexpected. If it doesn't work (Virtual Boy; GameCube; Wii U), they simply regroup and try again with something else innovative and unexpected.
@TheFrenchiestFry The N64 was more powerful than the PS1, and the GameCube was more powerful than the PS2. Nintendo still lost out on those two for reasons other than power. Nintendo has no reason presently to do anything like what you're suggesting, because that didn't work for them, as where their present strategy does.
@GrandScribe I don't think Nintendo will ever go to an entire TV only or handheld only platform anymore. I think there will always be a "family" or platform of devices. That are either hybrid (Switch) or handheld (Switch Lite). I don't see a TV only console happening at all. Since that hasn't worked for Nintendo since the Wii days.
@zool The normal Switch doesn't need a TV either.
And yeah there is actually one game that I miss the stylus in. And that is Mario Maker. All other things can be achieve on the Switch lite. For instance you have a case to protect the screen. 3D absolutely didn't add anything to the 3DS (see the existence of the 2DS) And dual screen could also happen for a hybrid console. (like my earlier reaction).
@TheFrenchiestFry 61 million Switches sold since 2017 renders "muh dedicated console space" point moot, especially in light of ARM devices closing the gap with x86 devices as of lately.
I mean, Nintendo is already releasing a new handheld - the anniversary Mario Game & Watch.😄 But overall, beyond compromised yet proportionally cheaper alternatives like Switch Lite (and even that one isn't a pure handheld), I'm not sure what would be the point. @TheFrenchiestFry may argue about the "divide between home players and portable players", but there are still many people who want mobile phones for nothing but GSM capabilities, too, and yet we don't see many mobile juggernauts going back to "less smart" models to lead their charge.
Switch is an evolution, not just an experiment. How do you go "back" to playing games on TV when the hybrid format already plays games on TV? Reaching performance parity with various PlayBoxes on the block certainly doesn't seem like an argument here because Nintendo's home consoles haven't pursued that for over a decade either. Switch has mainstreamed the idea of a console trying to adjust to a gamer's life rather than seeing a gamer try to adjust the hobby to said life. Take the classic reveal trailer - for all we know, its characters may prefer to play Zelda and Skyrim at home on a big TV screen as well, but do their duties like pet walks and necessary travels give a damn? You may find yourself in a different situation for an evening or you may find yourself in different conditions for the next few years, which used to mean no longer frequenting or so much as touching the games you loved to play. The hybrid philosophy of Switch aspires to proof you in these regards within the confines of one device.
And innovations don't dictate abandoning the successful legacy. 3DS didn't need to lose the second screen or touch input to add 3D. Switch's January 2017 presentation itself emphasized how many of the previous hardware highlights it absorbed; some got left behind, but they could always return down the road. I've already fantasized about a successor - an actual one, not what clickbaiters promise every year - that's powerful enough to build in a projector (thus adding a portable "TV mode" to the options), but what if it could also be powerful enough for a TV mode that streams/projects one part of the game to the big screen while depicting a different part on its native, basically resurrecting at least some of the DS and Wii U functionality? Both prospects may seem unrealistic below iPhone tier prices, but it's more fun and practical unrealistic prospects than the 4K60FPS fans keep painting in the mythical "Switch Pro launching Tomorrow™".
And whatever comes for real, we still dare expect the hybrid format to stay because no one can produce a viable reason why Nintendo would feel compelled to abandon it for their next big experiment - especially as their next console has long been confirmed in the process of design and this design is happening in the tune of Switch's money printing. I, for one, will welcome our new "Nintendo Voyager" overlords in 2023-2025.😏
@nhSnork The Switch lite isn't a pure handheld?? You can play it only handheld...
Don’t forget all the naysayers in the past that said Nintendo should get out of the hardware business and only make games (like Sega). I heard people proclaim that the GC, Wii, and Wii U would be Nintendo’s last console.
@AJ_Lethal ARM devices definitely haven't caught up to x86 in terms of support yet. The Surface Pro X from what I heard is incredibly stripped down compared to something like a Surface Laptop considering they tried to position it as a computer but it doesn't even have full fledged support for more than half of the major graphic intensive work related Windows 10 apps, or they're incredibly barebones and lackluster in the case of stuff like Photoshop. x86 is still a vastly superior architecture
@sanderev while it requires a separate pair of joycons and something to be propped against, Lite retains its tabletop mode, something no handheld console will usually give you (I don't count mini PCs). Wouldn't be much of a "Switch" otherwise, after all.
So, anybody here know the technical aspects for a potential Switch 2? Are their portable chipsets equal to say a PS4 Pro or X1X that make sense - cheap, cool, battery powered? I don't think a Switch 2 needs to do actual 4k, certainly not on a handheld screen, but Pro or X1X power would likely let it play most PS5 and XSS games.
Xbox Series S is probably the best match. Though if Switch lasts another 3 years maybe PS5 power would be possible?
@Rez the Vita and the WiiU.... The damned consoles of the last decade... Loved them both.
@nhSnork You also need a stand if you do that. Also it's not advertised as being a "tabletop" console. At all. Sure you can connect a controller to it. But I can also connect a controller to my iPhone. It's the same thing, it's not if you can but it's if you would want to do that. It does not, however, make it any less of a handheld only device.
Wouldn't this make the DS not a handheld either?
Sony abandoned the handheld market. Nintendo abandoned the home console market.
So yes, a maker can just carve a section of the market.
@Agramonte Nintendo abandoned the home console market.
A ludicrous statement and ironic in itself-did someone forget the Switch can Dock and become a Home Console. I guess they conveniently forgot this import feature.
@rjejr The rumors mills state this:
1. 4k (Docked)
2. 1080p (Portable)
No-one said 4k portable.
I wouldn't mind a return to clamshell design with 1 screen
It is the perfect form factor to fit inside a pocket
Well the issue was the stupid cartridge instead of CD and that stupid mini-disc instead of DVD. The power wasn't the problem; it was their awful 'anti-piracy/short sightedness' that killed them in the console space.
They're smarter to keep the Switch brand and just iterate on it (faster, better battery life, better joycons, etc). No reason to try and keep up with the 'moar powah' crowd. I'd wager even if N released a similar powered console as the PS5/XBSX they'd never get back to where they were with the NES/SNES. That ship has sailed imo.
edit: Also remember N doesn't understand how the internet works. You think they can compete with that rag tag service compared to what MS does? Heck even Sony's online is barely up to par; N is so far behind it would be sad if it weren't so funny.
@sanderev no more than Mario Paint made SNES a computer besides a console (speaking of which, iPhones are also palmtop GSM-equipped computers, and I've noted above that mini PCs don't count😉) - we're talking a custom third party peripheral designed and introduced for a specific game, akin to all the Guitar Hero ones. Lite inherits native detached controller support, the recognition for single screen multiplayer and all, from its big sis from the start, to the point where you can even connect a GameCube controller to it. And it's all advertised in the mere fact that it's still called a Switch. Only without docks and TVs, so it's Lite.
As for stands, I'd chuckle it off, but it seems like a disturbing amount of people deem a $5-20 stand purchase necessary with a straight face.😕 Although like I also said earlier, you just have to prop the thing - anything from a couple books to a stable teacup can be a "stand". One SwitchForce video even depicts it propped against a Switch Lite case: https://youtu.be/TM1oPnuNkuA
@SwitchForce I believe that's the rumour mill for next years Switch Pro, I was thinking more down the line, like this article states, for a next gen console. Which some people will probably be clamoring for a 4k handheld even though you'd never notice on a screen that small.
@SwitchForce The Switch will absolutely NEVER run games on 4K, not handheld, not docked. Maybe connected through an external RTX 3080. (DLSS maybe, but never native 4K)
@nhSnork Like he says in the video. It's not intended to play tabletop.
I hope the next Nintendo console has no dock, but instead, comes with a Wireless HDMI plug so you can stream to a T.V. so you can play your handheld on T.V. without docking it. To charge it, you would plug it into a wall socket.
@sanderev Does anyone not read what the rumors said? I guess not...
@NTELLIGENTMAN If you want that go get google stadia and see how far that went.
@sanderev more like not expected to play tabletop much (since most people after that would pursue the flagship model) - but retaining the brand's trademark feature. Vita TV isn't intended to play handheld, and it kinda shows. Switch Lite manages to remain a "switch".
@SwitchForce I don't believe rumors. Also it's basic knowledge. There is currently no mobile chip that would be able to run Switch games at native 4K. Like I said I could see Nvidia doing games at 1440p and then DLSS them to 4K. But native 4K? No way.
Most Switch games currently run at 900p. And you truly think that they would magically all become 4K on a Switch Pro?
It's literally not possible. Even the XBOX ONE X and PS4 Pro don't do native 4K.
@rjejr No one said they wanted 4k portable screen. I see people don't read what the rumors said...so one might want to go and read that again. But likes to jump to wrong conclusion and didn't see what the rumors said.
@sanderev There is currently no mobile chip that would be able to run Switch games at native 4K.
Nor can xbox/psx5 run native 4K. That is the realm of PC gaming Rigs that are SLI/CF at [email protected] They upscale to 4k but aren't true 4K they have neither the hardware or cooling to compare to a single GPU 2030GTX and if it is a SLI 2030GTX forget any xbox/psx comparing.
@SwitchForce PS5 and XBOX Series X are native 4K. They are
comparable around the RTX 2080 in means of raw power. Which indeed does 4K60. Without problem. The Series S is native 1440p, and I think that would be the best the Switch Pro could do.
What the Switch Pro actually needs is more and faster RAM. Otherwise running games at "4K" isn't going to be enough to compete with the next gen. And I could see a "performance" mode being added to it to run games at native 1080p60 docked and 720p60 handheld.
@sword_9mm What's funny about the whole cartridge vs disc thing was that Nintendo knew discs were eventually going to be the way to go, they just thought it was going to take longer. They were convinced the Playstation loaded too slowly, and that gamers wouldn't want to wait for load times. Weirdly though, people were willing to put up with long load times... but now that discs load substantially faster, we're now ditching them to go with other solutions that don't have load times. Its like its coming full circle. lol
I would never have gotten to the end of DQ11 if I was playing it on the PS4...I dont have the time to sit down on the couch for extended periods of time anymore, I have a full time career and a baby
@sanderev so wrong on so many levels. They aren't comparable to 2030GTX GPU card at all. But if one likes that fantasy then by all means go for it.
@Steel76 I hope they make a dedicated handheld again in the future.
That is half true for the way of the gaming to come. People are on the move and want flexibility in how and what and where they game. It won't be just dedicated by a Hybrid just like Switch. The Switch sells for good reason and doesn't rely on a GPU to do but having a more beefier GPU goes along way to insure it stays on top.
@SwitchForce It is a handheld with a stand in the box. And for tons of people who have a LITE, it is not even that. As a home console the Switch can not compete. Why Nintendo did their own thing on the side.
It’s superior in terms of support and at certain high power tasks.
In truth ARM has more development potential long term.
But the Switch, or a future hybrid model, would not work with x86. Power and heat dissipation necessities of modern high power (aka desktop class, like the PS5 and Xbox Series adopted; the current Jaguars were low power, ultra book class processors) x86 processors generate an insane amount of heat. The sophisticated cooling systems of the new consoles and their physical size growth in comparison to their predecessors attest to that. Same goes for their GPU cores. And the high end SSDs. All generate a ton of heat. Not good for battery powered, thin and small devices.
ARM works for the Switch because compared to equivalent power draw x86 processors, it’s absolutely no contest. Look at what Apple is doing with ARM. There is no low wattage Intel or AMD chipset that even comes close to their raw compute power and efficiency.
Ever since I got a Switch Lite when it released over 90% of my Switch gaming has been on my Lite. I simply prefer using it as a handheld, the solid one piece design feels better to me and it's also a right sized handheld IMO, not too big and not too small. IMO the Switch Lite is the perfect handheld that I was dreaming of and I couldn't be happier with it.
Nintendo will continue this way. The world doesnt need another home console from the big N, not actually. Not in this 2/3 years.
World identified Nintendo as the creator of fun games with a very good handheld/home console. A more powerfull version of this console in next 3/4 years will be ok for nearly everyone.
@TheFrenchiestFry Sure, but Nintendo was also always willing to iterate on a winning formula. The gap between the OG Game Boy and the Advance was so huge that they kinda had to shovel the GBC in between, and both the Original Game Boy as well as the Game Boy Color had their "Pro"-Version as well. And what has started as Nintendo DS has ended as New Nintendo 2DSXL. On the home console side they just beefed up the specs in the first place from NES - GCN before they started their "Blue Ocean" strategy and went all in with the Wii after the lacklustre sales of the GameCube.
I imagine the Switch's hybrid model will be around for quite some time. That's not to say there won't be Switch hardware that does just one thing, like the lite. My hope for upcoming hardware is for Nintendo to include support for VR. As for purely portable hardware, I would like to see a clamshell design.
Under no circumstance will the Switch Pro be anywhere near as powerful as an Xbox Series S, even if it uses DLSS.
To all the Switch Hybrid is a winning formula for Nintendo and they aren't going to let that go. They will have a formula with 3 versions.
2. Standard Switch
3. Switch Ultra
4. Switch Ultra 2
and so on.....
No they aren't going to just stay still they will keep innovating the Switch strategy. People keep thinking they are thinking for Nintendo and that is why they don't work and make Innovations like Switch. As to a time line why should they stay with what someone thinks Tech changes on a daily basis so why hamper your Innovations because people think you can't release a updated version in this short of time span. As before they can keep making the others and make a more expensive unit to do more. Why do people keep thinking boxing in Nintendo is making them smarter then Nintendo-of which it isn't here.
@westman98 Under no circumstance will the Switch Pro be anywhere near as powerful as an Xbox Series S, even if it uses DLSS.
Also is to the point xbox, psx less powerful a Gaming Rig with SLI/CF at [email protected] Why do people keep thinking it's just oh my gpu is more then your gpu. Those two consoles are upscale 4k they aren't true [email protected] system. They can keep saying but they are on-board GPU and that more or less renders them less then a separate GPU card and worse in running when compared to two GPU in SLI/CF running at [email protected] And even then those system running fullbore have issues at [email protected] So would people stop making claims that a xbox/psx are true 4k machines.
As they both would utilize the DLSS, deep learning, better shaders with or without rtx would take the bulk of the process while a slight upscaling would happen instead. Such as
576p to 720p,
720p to 768p or 1080p (FHD),
FHD to 1440 (2K),
2K to UHD (Upscaled 4K.)
This allow for more passive cooling; which I believe nintendo would prefer. Their options are limited for the dollar they usually put in to the console. I don't see Nintendo ever selling a console over $400. So yes it is possible tje next one will be a handheld. Also, it is better for Game sizes. I would hate to download such massive native 4k games from a nintendo store. It is better for Nintendo to go Next Gen as themselves than a off-brand X-box or PlayStation.
Personally, I would pay higher than $400, if it included a high end antenna. Maybe Nintendo should invest in an external battery pack that also extends the range of the wifi as a separate accessory to keep the cost down.
A “Switch Pro “will be no where near as powerful as a PS5 either ,I just don’t see it ..But producing “Power House “consoles has never been Nintendo’s strategy in the modern gaming world ..The Big N is more about creating consoles that have a happy medium,meaning a console that is consider “next gen “but at an economical price ..Nintendo is more family oriented and for casual gamers ,than it is for “hard core “gamers ..I mean don’t get me wrong I have always been a Nintendo fan ,since the days of the NES .And I always will be a Nintendo fan ...But now as a middle aged gamer ,the PlayStation 4 (soon to be PS5 )is my main console ,and the Switch is my secondary console ..
Just keep releasing switch 2,3,4,5 etc and I will be happy. remove the tv aspect of it , keep it handheld only, if needed. and I will be glad to buy the new versions. if it becomes simply a console, I am out.
The PS5 and XSX can definitely output games at native 4K60. What you are saying is factually wrong.
I think the Nintendo Switch from of having both Home-Console and handheld one in a single device is a great idea and it makes games more accessible. So I think Nintendo should continue the way of Switch
The PS5 and XBOX Series X are 4K Native consoles ,in the truest sense ..
it will be so dumb if Nintendo don't continue the Switch formula/formats for futures Nintendo consoles, after i played my Switch of extended battery, i can't return to a dedicated home console or Handheld format,if would be a huge step back, if Switch sucessor is a dedicated home console or Handheld, not a hybrid like it predecessor, the hybrid formula/format is the future of gaming, do you honestlly after the sucess of Switch, Nintendo is going back to a dedicated home console like Wii or Handheld like DS/3DS?no they gonna continue improving this formula, until they found another sucefull formula to use it.
@DreamStar compared to a [email protected] SLI/CF gaming desktop/laptop dedicated GPU cards not in the slightest they aren't true 4k.
@Giancarlothomaz they already found the formula and that was called the Switch that can dock and go portable. The WiiU and 3DS was just two parents to the Switch birth. It takes multiple tech to combine into one system to make it work. There are plenty of 3DS/2DS out there right now even though it's no longer in production. But there are games out there that still work and play on them so it's not really a dead system in the sense of Vita dead coffin by Sony themselves.
Well we will agree ,to disagree ..
@DreamStar People keep dreaming xbox/psx 4k but it won't ever come true. Did they say Stadia would be 4K and looks where that went..total vaporware....
There we go... again....
Bring back the Game Boy brand!
@RadioHedgeFund "It’s because they’ve finally merged their dev studios. It’s a lot easier to deliver a steady stream of quality software for one console than two".
Yet they aren't delivering a steady stream of quality software and most of the best "exclusives" are Wii U ports.
@BlueOcean We have to cut the entire industry some slack. COVID has meant a lot of games have been cancelled or delayed and we don’t know what has. Those WiiU ports could have been thrown together at the last minute to plug holes in the release schedule for all we know.
Also there have been 2 WiiU releases this year: Pikmin and TMSFE. Xenoblade doesn’t really count because they updated the graphics, OST and managed to build a whole new epilogue.
@RadioHedgeFund It has been like this since Switch launched. I don't say "ports" as a negative thing (although Nintendo ports are overpriced and there's no cross-buy option) but what I said is true, whether some of those ports are enhanced or not.
The hybrid model is here to stay, Nintendo will never go back to having seperate platforms. A few years from now, we'll probably see a generational leap with Nvidia's latest tech, with some wild Nintendo twist, but it will be a hybrid.
The reason why Nintendo doesn't compete head to head in the home space with Sony & Microsoft is simple: Microsoft is losing $200-250 on each Series S/X they are selling, reportedly, and Sony is also not afraid to lose money on each console sold. Nintendo means to make a profit, and can't meet the price point of their competitors with a directly comparable tech spec. Been that way since Microsoft entered the market, and Sony learned their lesson by charing an accurate price for the PS3 at first.
I thought about this recently and again after the “rate top 50 N64 games” article.
I would really like to see Nintendo launch a dedicated home console again and launch it with the same powerhouse tact they had with the N64.
I recently played Super Mario 64 and Ocarina of Time and they took me back to when I played them on their original launch day. Back then they blew me away and made me laugh at every single game at the same time available on PlayStation; they just even in the same world, never mind the same league.
Nintendo had accomplished the impossible, amazed the world and lead the video games industry into a new era, same era we’re in now. There has been no so significant a forward step in gaming since Nintendo gave the world actual navigable 3D environments with true 3D analogue control.
At that same time, Nintendo marketed the N64 as THE most powerful console and more powerful than the computer that sent a rocket to the moon. They prided themselves on the power of that hardware. Ever since then, they’ve trailed on hardware power every single generation. But they still always dominated the handheld market.
I would like to see the Switch as the new Nintendo handheld arm. So evolved it can be played at home also.
But the home hardware arm of Nintendo has been so quiet and secretive, we honestly don’t know if it’s dead or quietly working away. It would blow my mind if by the end of 2021 we were suddenly made aware of the NES 8. Why not market the fact the my are on the 8 console where PlayStation have only given us 5, and Xbox has done whatever they’ve done with lamest console naming strategy ever.
What if all the games that are seemingly very very quiet for some reason turn out to be quiet as they’ve been redeveloped as full 4K titles for a new hyper powered Nintendo console?
The Nintendo Entertainment System 8 launching with Breath of the Wild 2, Metroid Prime 4, Bayonetta 3, Eternal Darkness 2, Mario Kart 9, and on and on and on. It would be simple enough for Switch arts to also plug into it or share the same eshop for download.
Hardware powerful enough that it also received black ops 5, NHL/FIFA/MADDEN 22, read dead 3, GTA 6, and on and on and on.
I think Nintendo could take a huge slice of the table that they’ve not say at for a very long time just because Sony and Microsoft are getting more and more complacent and offering less and less. Nothing from them is innovative in any way.
@jamesthemagi Reminds me of the GBA SP. Fit perfectly into my pocket and durable without a case. Never had a screen protector for it nor damaged/scratched screen or buttons. Did they even have screen protectors for it?
I'm not a 100% sure, but I actually think it did
You are right thought, not that it needed it
But instead of square I was thinking more of something like the GPD XD
I would like that very much, but shaped like the GPD XD
@jamesthemagi you mean you want it shaped exactly like a 3DS XL then?
But 2 screens are not necessary
@jamesthemagi why are they not necessary? The one thing missing from the switch is a second screen.
I'm not against it
If it has 2 screens, fine, if it doesn't, it is not a deal-breaker for me.
I just want clamshell to protect screen and make it more pocketable
@jamesthemagi I just think the GPD looks like a cheap knock with that much plastic on show in the bottom half. The switch 2 woujd definitely benefit from a clam shell design. It would help protect the stocks and screen when big in use. The joy con sections could still be detachable too. There’s a number of instances where a second screen and touch screen during play feel absent too. Sports games would significantly benefit from a second touch screen to manage teams and strategies during live play without need to pause. Fortnite would also benefit in the same way. Games like Trine and Rayman would also benefit from the interactivity. I feels if it adds something, why take it away?
@Nintengamer I don't mind the "empty" space on the bottom portion as it would have a lot going on in the inside.
Let me explain what I envision:
I would like buttons on the bottom portion of the clamshell just like the GPD, Gameboy Advance SP and DS/3DS. The speakers would be present here to keep the top with thinness bezels possible (factoring portability). A 5000 mAh battery would be housed here too.
I would do away with the dock by directly having an HDMI output on the back of the console itself.
It doesn't need JoyCons attachment at the sides since there are buttons.
To play on TV you would need to buy JoyCons or Pro Controller separately or you could also just use the buttons on console.
The New 3DS does not even have power cord included in box so I don't see a problem with Nintendo not including JoyCons or power cord (as simple USB-C cable you already have lying around is all you would need).
Nintendo can keep this Switch 2 backwards compatible by having a Slot that accepts Switch cartridges and having small wedge on new cartridges, just like DS/3DS.
You could toggle between a battery saving and performance mode, which impacts CPU and resolution, along with brightness, volume and connectivity (Wi-fi/Bluetooth).
Developers don't have to worry about splitting players between base or Pro model.
Nintendo saves money on JoyCons, not having 2 screens, no power cable, no dock, in order to give us the rest of improvements for same price or at most $400.
I understand desire for touch screen capability. I just don't see them being able to implement it with all the stuff I mentioned. If the top screen retains touch like now, that is as far as I see it going. Either way, right now you cannot use touchscreen when playing on TV, but if you can use console, while playing on TV, like I mentioned, that may remedy some of it.
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