Random: Backpack Kid Suing Epic For Inclusion Of Floss Dance Move In Fortnite

"I'm happy to be represented in the game, but I'm gonna sue the crap out of it"

I hate everything about this article.

Not motivated by money, but happy to be represented in the "game."

Shows what we've become as a country. Fartnite.

The plot thickens!

Some family of van Gogh to sue Epic for popularizing color, may as well, right? There is color in Fortnite.

Also may need to get a hold of all the gun designers too.

It’ll be interesting to see if these cases make it to court (my guess is they’ll settle). But just for once I wished the person involved said, “I’m doing it for the cash.” That I could respect

Okay, who will sue next ?

Perhaps the boy is sincere and it is truly his mother pushing for the lawsuit. He could very well have been happy that the dance was represented. The root of all evil is money I suppose and they know epic has a lot of it.

Apparently he wasn't the first one to do this dance. This will be dead in the water.

https://youtu.be/r293CFn84EQ

Fall back, youngin.

Edit: The original original. https://youtu.be/rhaBb36qqGI

Can dance moves be patented/copyrighted?

@Desa

I think so too, I'm sure his mom and manager are more concerned about this than the kid is for the money.

You did good, kid. Keep it up.

@Tsurii Dance is art. Art can be copyrighted.

@Tsurii it is called personality rights. "The right of publicity, often called personality rights, is the right of an individual to control the commercial use of his or her name, image, likeness, or other unequivocal aspects of one's identity."
From Wikipedia. Note that US isn't alone in this.

He didn't make the floss dance, though. I don't see how he has a case.

Seriously, who is this guy?

I wasn't aware a dance move could be copywritten. How can one prove they created a move?

I loved the Fresh Prince of Bel-Air as a kid. I used to watch after school almost daily. It makes me pretty sad to hear that one of its stars has turned out to be so petty.

As for this kid, I have no idea who he is. Nor do I care.

I Get it.
Generation Z invented DANCING!

@Medic_alert stats and where do we find those numbers your using? They do have a right to protect their image as well in the Game Companies. And them coming this late to the process tells a very important thing "GREED" for money. Why don't they admit to that. If that wasn't the case all they need would be a letter stating they don't want money just to be footnoted to the likeness. But I can guess they won't do that.

Think this lawsuit more because of his mom then because the kid itself got a problem with it

I had to Google ‘Backpack Kid’... now I’m regretting wasting my time.

So this "Backpack Kid" is the one to blame for Flossing?
I would've guessed that it was invented by Greg Heffley trying to look like he knows how to dance when he doesn't.

Doesn't the Spyro Reignited Trilogy also depict a character doing the floss dance in like the third game or something?

Unless these people own a patent for these dance moves, I really don't understand how they can sue.

And will JStuStudios sue the backpack kid?

@Seanmyster6 I don't know about Greg Heffley, but I at first thought this was supposed to be the character "Backpack Boy" from Ned's Declassified.

Why does it seem that everyone hates fortnite?
I mean its rather fun, and annoying at other times. But because of this game we finally got something many, if not all, gamers have been asking for.... Cross-platform . Many said it wouldnt be possible, but look at fortnite. But whatever I guess.
On topic- I guess whatever floats your goat. These things only happened because they want some of that easy cash

Well I kinda get it. If someone put in MJJ’s iconic moves (and he was still here of course, estate control means less to me since they didn’t do the work) and didn’t credit him I am sure he has grounds to sue. Dancing isn’t random flailing (well it isn’t supposed to be) as it is often specially choreographed or created by a performer based on their bodytype/style.

These moves aren’t included because they move to a beat, they are included because they are recognized due to the performing artists that created them/made them popular. That’s not to say every move ever is iconic and thus protected but things like the Carlton or the moonwalk or the mc hammer or even moves that elvis did deserve credit and possibly royalties (if they had been contacted or credited I’d bet these suits wouldn’t hold water but I am sure Epic didn’t do that). I can’t speak for meme folks like this kid but performers devote a lot of time and effort to their “brand”. That style is part of what allows them to charge so much (and to earn a living), no different than songs they may or may not sing.

Popular doesn’t mean free use. Plus it can be like trademark defending. If epic steals your brand and you perform later without defending your brand what stops epic from suing you? They have put your moves in their product which they have copyright protected and copyright law can be used against those it should protect because it’s very “fight for it or lose it”.

Well, they are making money out of other peoples 'work'. It's just depressing folk regard swinging your arms about as work.

@Ttimer5 I think because it's cool to hate. Like the whole COD hate crowd.
It's a videogame version of freakin' battle royale with cosmetic-only dlc and no lootboxes and ftp. It should be praised if anything.

That and it probably boosted the Switch in the public eye when it was announced.

I enjoyed it for a while but things like the events that online games have make it more a chore for my preferred playstyle.

@HatosBlack Bit you are aware, that this video was uploaded yesterday?
Just by putting "2011" in the title does not make it "old".

In general, I can completely understand all these Artist. Epic is not even mentioning them in the credits so literally stealing intellectual property. Sure, it's about money, but not because the people want to have a piece of the cake, but because Epic made money with the creativity and art of other people without giving them credit (namewise or Monetary credit).

@moomoo it would be too funny if they dug up the original person who did the dance and paid them instead.

Copyrighting a body movement is just stupid.

I just watch his dance of the first time to see a performance worth legally protecting. What the .... That's it! What a crappy 'dance'. Kid looks bored, moves are weak. Did this go 'viral' Crazy world.

@westman98 A whole dance choreography is copyrighted as soon as it is recorded somehow, as long as there is some creativity involved in making it. A single dance move can not have copyright. It's just like a song, a whole song has copyright, but a movement over a few bars doesn't. This means there are cases that fall on quite wide borders.

These dances are not protected by law as far as I'm aware, so the people trying to sue are just being dumb, and in most cases greedy.

@Strumpan
Given that the Floss is far from being an intricately choreographed dance routine, I think it's safe to say that Backpack Kid is suing Epic just to make a quick buck, and nothing else.

@westman98 legally, yes, but it's extremely difficult and costly as they are so nuanced and vague... I'm not aware of any that have been so far.

Toot toot! All aboard the lawsuit express! Just a load of irrelevant C list celebrities trying to force their way back into the spotlight by taking a piece of Fortnite's success. I really couldn't give a monkeys about Fortnite, I can take it or leave it, but this is getting beyond absurd.

We should be paying attention to actual issues in this world...like soulja boy.

@HatosBlack
we should send all these videos to the creators of fortnite. Just to back them up

So if he going to sue Just Dance as well, because pretty sure the dance is in there.

@HatosBlack

The plot thickens!

"All I want is credit.......for something I didn't create".

Edit: Actually the fact the youtube vid didn't link to the original uploaded video called "potato man", apparently uploaded in 2011 then treat this video with more than a pinch of salt

Hilarious...to claim a dance in a videogame as if you've done the work. They wouldn't even be able to animate a stick figure properly.

Maybe Fortnite could have asked, compensated or otherwise gotten a permission to do this?

Maybe people should be more concerned about Fortnite not giving a crap about copyrights (as was the case with Carlton) or just credit to where it's due?

Anyone blaming kid or Ribeiro for suing is allocating intellectual theft. Unfortunately that is how the world today sees creative work altogether.

Hopefully someone steals something obvious from Fortnite and we can see the blatant double standards from their part.

@Bondi_Surfer amen to that need some extra cash for Christmas lol

If he doesn't want money and is happy to be represented in the game without being credited, what's he suing them for? Is it like a hobby or something? Methinks me smells a whiff of bull-dung.

What a loser. Is it his copyrighted dance move? If not, this case will be thrown out.

Trying to copyright a dance move is like trying to copyright the human body. You just can't do it.

So assuming a single move can be copyrighted, which I think is dubious, how likely is it that a highly coreographed routine for a Katy Perry song saw the kid actually create the move AND retain creative control of the work for something that was being produced for TV by one of musics most famous stars.

Even if the move can be copyrighted, I doubt the kid has any claim to owning the copyright.

@Paraka lol you are funny. A frivolous lawsuit is Definitely about as American as you can get. I'm just glad samba de amigo didn't get sued for other people singing some songs

The artists are right. You can’t just take something that you didn’t create and post it asif it’s Your creation.
Most people here don’t Seem to understanding what creavity is.
Actors, dancers, singer-songwriter etc are all artist that put alot of work, thought into what they do for a living. Then someone comes along, likes what they are doing, steals it and presents it asif he/she created it.
You Guys should go living in China where, what you Guys are saying now (that’s it’s Ok to take what’s not yours), is normal.
Let’s see howlong your business/ creative work Will stay Unique and you can make a living from it.

Wow has this kid got a patent for stupidity. GL with jumping on the bandwagon. If it's not about the money, money, money then why try and sue for it? Just hold yer head up high, proud that something you've done has become famous, and don't be a spoilt brat about it.

@NewAdvent
Phew. Wasn’t sure where you were going with that.

Looked into it a little bit, and it looks like you can copyright a dance.

https://web.csulb.edu/~jvancamp/copyrigh.html

That said, I'm not sure the "originality" aspect is hit. The dances are more "dance steps" than full dances, so there's definitely a lack of clarity on if these would qualify for copyright. It also looks like the dance needs to be a result of independent labor (implied by the source), so I'm not sure if these simple moves qualify. Finally, in Alfonso Ribeiro's case, I'm not sure if he would even own the rights to the dance, or if that copyright would technically be owned by NBC.

It's actually pretty interesting, although let's be honest, it's also quite silly.

@Medic_alert Get out of here with your reasonable experience and educated learn-talk! This is my lawn! This is a place for unreasonable outrage at the expense of sanity. 😉

But yeah, I don’t get what’s hard to understand here.

Sounds to me like it's the mother who is motivated by the money. If the kid is fine with being represented in the game without being credited, but it's the mother who filed the lawsuit, then it seems to me like the mother is the one who wants the money.

this is getting rediculous first someone wants to sue fore a dance they did in a show 30 years ago and has become part of our culture...cmon who doesnt do the carlton when that tom jones song comes on....on top of that now we are gonna sue for swinging our arms behind us like a damn wierdo...thats not a dance its a movement...

@Desa My thoughts exactly. I bet it was all the mother's doing and that she saw those other stars trying to get in on some money. Figured her son had a case and went right along with sueing, even before getting his consent on it.

Hah. The rabbit hole goes deeper

I hate people, that's all.

This is why some kids need a spanking from time to time. And their parents too.

"self-proclaimed creator."

Aye.

@Not_Soos I think Heroes of the Storm has an emote where a character does the move as well (unless they patched it out at some point) I guess having it in fornite has gotten got it the most attention...

@mazzel I shouldn't have to show you a video from 2011 in order for you to see that it's in standard definition at a 4:3 ratio, however...

https://youtu.be/rhaBb36qqGI

I think Alfonso Ribeiro may have a case, but he's JUST NOW trying to copyright "The Carlton". Note that "Carlton" is a character owned by Casey/Warner television. So that may not work.

@SBandy I got you, fam..

https://youtu.be/rhaBb36qqGI

@The-Chosen-one I'm down.

I don't play Fortnite enough, but I think this whole things is super ridiculous.

@Rohanrocks88 epic definitely knows it won’t last forever, which is why push content like there’s no tomorrow.

@30mm yet it’s interesting that none of these artists filed for a copyright until after they found someone with a lot of money using it.

@HatosBlack

Cheers, I couldn't find it earlier. Very interesting!

@Medic_alert I have a degree in law and a post graduate diploma in legal practice while the 95% is an estimation it is well known that virtually no case goes to court any more. It is just too expensive. The 95% was something I was quoted at university."
This sounds fishy already.

@Medic_alert "I'm not sure any of that is relevant to be honest. If someone created something and it meets the basic criteria they deserve to be paid for it and not have their work blatantly ripped off by a big player."
That is so broad anything now can be copyrighted.

@Medic_alert "Edit: a quick Google suggests the figure is 97%"
What quick google search? And what "key words" was used for the search.

🤔I'm going to tell my dental hygienist that I haven't been flossing because I don't want to get sued.

I can't believe how many idiots are doing this. I ran once and you can run on Fortnite. They stole it! I'm sueing!

If it wasn’t financially motivated he wouldn’t be filing a trademark after someone started making money off it

@HatosBlack Thanks for the video!
Aß for "the Carlton", I think the problem is, that the law is not protecting artists enough in this case.
Like for music, you don't need to release your music with any studio at all to make it your intellectual property. You just need to be able to proof that you are the first one to put it in public. I think the same should count for any kind of intellectual property. That's why I hope that "Carlton" will be successful with this. If copyrighting his move is the only way he can get this kind of intellectual property protection, then it is the right way. Aß for the kid, if he is just a copy cat then he should stay silent.

@invictus4000 You never created something, did you?

@gokev13 is someone paying you for flossing?

@mazzel agreed. But Alphonso may be hard pressed himself. Eddie Murphy in 1988

NSFW
https://youtu.be/KsyYuFv5ltc

@Ryu_Niiyama "Popular doesn’t mean free use. "

Sadly, in the Youtube era, an entire generation, who will soon be the majority of the population believes it does. And unfortunately popular justice outranks legal justice in everything but taxation these days.

Want a fiddle? You can really see the orange glow over the Colusseum from here.....

@HatosBlack He often reminds me of Murphy in his Carlton-Role, now that you mention it

@mazzel I'm actually a published author.

@30mm - The issue with that is dance is also an expression in human nature. A "creator" can also own a tribal dance if they "create" it. Even with the vagueness some creatives come up with.

One can even protect a popular quote, or mannerisms. Doubt we all here would be singing the same tune if we saw Bush, or Trump go after SNL and NBC for mocking them with "created" works that get popularized over it.

If it was hugely important they would have attempted protecting the dance long ago, they had a whole year for "Floss" to be popularized by Fortnite before this came up after Epic's major earnings report. If it flopped, I doubt this would been a reason enough to attempt lawsuits over.

This was driven by money, this isnt a creative protecting itself. They want someone else's cherry pie for using their favorite fruit after disregarding the tree they originally grew in a park.

Is "suing Fortnite for dance moves" a meme now?
....
Almost: https://knowyourmeme.com/memes/fortnite-dances

The little backpack dog looks like my dog. Should he sue?

@invictus4000 Yeah, but I'm guessing your running isn't interesting or had much work put into it. Say you worked at it, and your technique managed to become valuable somehow (shave some seconds off world records) and popular and earn someone else millions because they popularized it. That might make you feel a little robbed, right?

@invictus4000 then I don't get your comment you should have more sympathy for other creative people

Especially because Epic also likes to sue if someone is using their game engine without proper contracts.

Fortnite hate is so funny to people who have been around for awhile. Once something hits a popularity threshold there is a minority of people who just can't stand it. Popularity itself is apparently grotesque just check an earlier post. It should mean absolutely nothing to those who enjoy it, the haters have just ruined a potential experience for themselves in the name of having some value as a contrarian.

To balance that a bit: Of course, it's fine to not like something that's popular and it's important not to just follow the mob mindlessly, as well. Loudly dumping on things people like and thinking less of it strictly because it's popular and you don't like it, that's pretty sad as far as I'm concerned. Take it one step further and hating on people who like it means you probably need a good hard look in the mirror.

I'd comment on the copying, but @Medic_alert is more qualified https://www.nintendolife.com/news/2018/12/random_backpack_kid_suing_epic_for_inclusion_of_floss_dance_move_in_fortnite#comment4845200

@mazzel
No, no one is paying me to floss, yet another reason I just can't seem to get in the habit.

@NEStalgia I am just curious as to what the fallout will be in 20 years when the current darlings are up for creative/intellectual property raids.

@HatosBlack I was hoping someone would reference RAW. “Do y’all listen to the lyrics or the beat?” I roll every time.

CAN'T WE JUST HAVE FUN?

I'm gonna make a "popular" dance move on Youtube and will be suing Epic if they add it

(joking obviously)

The kid is happy to be represented in the game...and the reason he's suing is NOT for money? I fail to see why he's suing then.
Also since this seems to be a trend, Epic should start looking into the matter before adding anything else someone might claim as their own and sue for.

The only "backpack kid" I know is this girl that seemed to show up on every dead URL picked up by cybersquatters in the mid 2000s.

@Heavyarms55 Of course, then the question is, when involving a TV show character's actions, did the actor create the move, or did a writer/producer. Kind of getting into technicalities there that may or may not be provable.
That is, assuming a dance move even can be patented.

This whole situation is a perfect "I don't want to live on this planet anymore."

@gokev13 Just an opinion of an artist, who is making music for fun, as a hobby and never intends to enter the big stage or make big money with his music: if someone would use my intellectual property without asking a, crediting me or compensate me and making big money bout of it, I would sue them, regardless if I planned to make money with it beforehand or not. And yes, dancing is also art. Flossing might also be, depending on your floss style

@Kinoen Because the kid is not the one suing. It is his "greedy" mother who took the decision away from him and forcing the lawsuit through his throat!

This kid is way too young to even consider thinking about lawsuits. It's always money hungry parents that take these decisions. Even if the kid doesn't want to.

His mother is practically ruining it all for him, because in no way are they going to win the lawsuit and all that happens now is this kid being ridiculed to eternity over this.

@mazzel

Ha, ha, keep your eyes on YouTube. "Gokev flosses" just might go viral.

I'm just joking around though. My comments were neither for or against the backpack kid sueing Epic games. Just making lame jokes is all. Though I did actually floss yesterday so perhaps some good did come out if it. 😀

@Tsurii Weirdly enough a quick google search make it seem possible. Normally you cant as its just a move not a product. However, you can trademark a name of the dance move and you can patent choreography so with some clever wording an lawyer moved you probably can.

@Medic_alert The only thing I had wrong was the patent. I should have said copyright the dance move an not patent it. You can trademark a name as well as a logo an branding. As per below the product is technically the dance. So they could trademark "Flossing" or "The Carlton" as a name and then copyright the dance associated with it.

trade·mark
/ˈtrādˌmärk/Submit
noun
1.
a symbol, word, or words legally registered or established by use as representing a company or product.

@HatosBlack This needs to be shared, if nothing else to destroy Backpack Kid from taking credit for something he didn't actually create. He's like the Steve Jobs of the dance world. Only, you know, not a marketing genius.

@nintendork64 share away. He deserves NAH-TING!

@HatosBlack That is honestly the problem with most dance and choreography lawsuits. Most people who claim to have invented the dance moves actually stole them off somebody else, they just so happened to be the first person who got famous for doing it.

It is actually ironic how they are seeking a lawsuit since the people they stole their moves from could easily sue them for trying to claim ownership and monetizing it.

@gokev13 or something bad, depends on the point of view

If you ever upload that video, quote me here with the link

if only forshi*e would go away.....thats what i want for christmas santa

"wasn't motivated by money" HAHAHAHAHAHAHA

@tekknik
I agree with you that money is the thriving factor behind this, but that doesn’t change the fact that Epic did something wrong here imo as they are also after money

@Paraka
Yes i agree with you, but why i choose the side of the artist/actors is because epic is charging money for something they didn’t create without atleast asking the people who performend / created it.
At the end of the day both party’s are after the money

@30mm did they? that will be for the courts to decide. they could’ve very well it was assumed released in the public domain given there was no copyright filed.

@30mm - The issue falls part however, because they cannot prove the money made was even from the dance to begin with. The issue isnt siding with an artist when the artist did nothing to protect their creation till AFTER someone made profit that also happens to have something of their in it. To me that doesn't sound like a creator and their creation, it sounds like a leech.

Lol: The more they sue Epic, the better! Making money with stolen goods...

The point is: Those dances (or emotes as they call them) are everywhere, and all the media-outlets call them Fortnite dances. People think they are Fortnite dances, but they all originate from somehere else. Time to come up with your own dances, Fortnite!