Reports that Nvidia's Tegra tech is going to power Nintendo's apparently portable NX console triggered a fairly familiar reaction online yesterday. Perhaps not all that familiar to those of you under the age of 20, but veterans will surely have gotten a sense of deja vu as the "Nintendoomed" brigade unfurled its banners and took to the web in full force. The response was almost as downbeat as when the Japanese giant first revealed the Wii a decade ago; a machine that was almost entirely misunderstood prior to launch but would go on to dominate that console generation.
While we'd certainly be cautious about predicting that NX is going to represent a Wii-style turnaround for Nintendo, it's tempting to wheel out the old adage that the wily firm should never be underestimated. Given that it has chosen to partner with tech expert Nvidia, there's plenty of scope to be optimistic, especially if you've been following that particular company's forays into mobile gaming of late.
Nvidia might be famous for creating monstrous graphics cards for PCs but the company has largely been locked out of the next-gen war due to the dominance of rival AMD, whose tech powers both the Xbox One and PlayStation 4. Many assumed that the NX would follow suit and harness AMD silicon, but yesterday's reports - which through our own snooping we've since discovered to be pretty watertight - now point to an Nvidia Tegra chipset being at the heart of Nintendo's new hardware, which has been described as a portable system with detachable controllers than can connect to your television set when required.
Nvidia has been trying to find a way to expand its business for the past few years and has used its Shield program as a way of attracting attention and potential business. The Shield products released so far - a handheld, two tablets and a set-top box running Android TV - have all be relatively niche affairs, although by all accounts they have sold well enough to satisfy Nvidia's modest projections. However, as many speculated when the Shield handheld was first unveiled back in 2013, these devices are about placing Nvidia's tech in a shop window and touting for future deals. The strategy appears to have worked; hooking up with a company as large as Nintendo will do wonders for Nvidia's bottom line and is a vindication of the years of hard work and research the firm has undertaken of late.
It's important to point out here that despite the "mobile" connotations Tegra isn't a processor you're likely to find in a smartphone any time soon. It's still quite power-hungry despite its small size, and has understandably been deployed in devices which either have large batteries (Shield handheld, Shield tablet) or are hooked up to the mains (Shield Android TV). That will suit Nintendo's vision for NX, which appears to be a tablet-sized device. This should hopefully put aside any notions naysayers might have regarding the system's power, which will be well in advance of any mobile phone you can currently purchase. The Tegra X1 which powers the Shield Android TV is capable of some impressive graphical tricks, and titles such as Doom 3, Resident Evil 5 and Metal Gear Rising: Revengeance have recently been ported to the system. While these are last-gen epics and don't all run as well as you'd expect, they're a considerable step up from what you can play on smartphones and other tablets - and they're not even a true reflection of what could potentially be possible on NX.
For one, Nintendo is understood to be seeking direct access to the chipset rather than running it through an additional OS layer, such as Google's Android. This will ensure that as much performance is drawn out as possible and will give us games that are far more impressive than what has been witnessed on the Shield Android TV so far. It is also speculated that NX will be using the next version of Tegra, the X2 - this alone would be a game-changer given the speed at which mobile processors are improving.
Just cast your mind back to the N64 and Dreamcast era, when the best portable tech could provide was the comparatively primitive Game Boy Color or Bandai WonderSwan. Today, we have mobile chipsets which are rapidly catching up with domestic consoles, and X2 could well be another step closer to gaining a level of near-parity in terms of visual spectacle. In this way, it could be argued that Nintendo is way ahead of the curve in embracing this kind of technology. It also hints at Nintendo adopting the same release pattern as Apple and Samsung - new devices every 12 or 18 months which offer a little more power but maintain support for all previous games. That guesswork on our part, but given that NX is being built on Nvidia's tech - tech which is upgraded on a regular basis and deployed in new products in an almost yearly cycle - then it's a fair assumption to make (also, the fact that Nvidia hasn't announced a Shield device for this year would add more weight to the assumption that NX is using the next-gen X2 chipset rather than the aging X1, which will be two years old in March 2017).
In so many ways, Nintendo and Nvidia's agreement is a match made in heaven. Nintendo is looking for a means to continually maintain its position as a major player in the video game arena, while Nvidia will gain a valuable foothold in a console sector.
While it's clear that the more skeptical of Nintendo's fans might take some convincing before they see the merit of this alliance, the positives are obvious. Nvidia's tech provides considerable power but is aimed at low-cost devices such as tablets and set-top boxes, a fact which will allow Nintendo to hit the kind of price point that makes NX irresistible to consumers. Even if the system only sells to existing 3DS owners, that's a potential audience of around 50 million, surely enough to please Nintendo's shareholders. Factor in the tantalising promise of Tegra X2, the outside chance that some kind of Android functionality will be included (giving the console a massive pool of games from day one) and the rediscovered appeal of local multiplayer, and it's suddenly very easy to become excited about Nintendo's mysterious new machine.
Roll on March 2017.
We can get at least 100 more stories out of this rumour!
Seriously though, I'm looking forward to finding out these rumours are false. Fingers crossed.
Yeah really. This Damien McFerran guy needs to stop treating rumors as fact.
Getting very curious about NX. I hope it's fun and worth it.
I do think this could work well for both Nintendo and Nvidia. It would be foolish to underestimate the potential of Tegra considering the rate at which mobile tech has been advancing in the past few years
You and me both.
Slight error; Nvidia only made one tablet. The Tablet K1 is just a revision of the original. No additional horsepower that I've heard of.
Care to elaborate on 'snooping' @Damo?
I'll be honest and say I'm not sold on it at the moment, don't get me wrong as a handheld it could be amazing but I'm not bothered about handhelds and I really want a great home Nintendo console and this doesn't look like it fits the bill at the moment
Nintendo has worked with AMD since the Gamecube, why would you think they'd switch to nvidia all of a sudden?
I don't know. Until it's confirmed by Nintendo themselves, I'll approach this whole thing with a skeptical mind.
NX better have at least one pokemon game lined up for launch. Smash doesn't count.
'Water tight'! AWESOME! I hope it is the X2 because that would blow my mind. However the concept is pure genius
@Zeldafanforlife Business politics. Nvidia knows their competitor is killing them in the market right now, if they want to get back in the market, they will bend over backwards for Nintendo to do it. That could mean technical assistance, or even price cuts on the chips. If AMD can't or won't compete, Nintendo will go with Nvidia.
I'm not sold that the rumor is true, but I wouldn't discount it just because of history with AMD.
Pokemon snap on eshop doesn't count either but that would be perfect for the Wii u. Wake tf up nintendo! You too Reggie! Jerk!
I'm so ready for this. Great piece.
Grr. Not yet convinced Still trying to hang on for September and onwards to see is rumors are there or not. Even then, My toad senses is getting the feeling we're not getting the full story.
Lol at the people who think Nintendo with nVidia is a bad thing
Everything said in this article reaffirms my feelings that I hope this is not true
@Dakt What bothers me is that they're treating it as if it's all factual :x this 'NX' we're getting doesn't interest me. The Wii U needs a promising replacement.
Blah blah chipset, blah blah os, blah blah etcetera.
But will It have Bayonetta 3 on it and will Zelda BOTW be better than the Wii U one?
Still wonder if handheld is the right way to go when kids play games on their phones these days and to lazy to bring an extra device.
didn't eurogamer also say mother 3 was coming out in the west once... they aren't always right.
@kenrulei 2016 isn't over yet.
hopefully soon we'll know what the nx by nintendo themselves. that said, it's a weird world we live in when a sonic game is confirmed for NX before even a mario title is.
@Dreamcaster-X so you saying if nintendo decided to release it before the end of the year they was right? they could be holding it off for nx, that will sell some systems i guess now i think about it.
@Zeldafanforlife Actually the Gamecube & Wii used an IBM Power PC processor with a GPU made by ATI. The only system they used AMD for was the Wii U.
I agree on NLife jumping on way too many rumours, rather than hard facts. However-
This concept genuinely excites me. It's something new, something daring, and could potentially capture the imaginations of both the casual and hardcore gaming market.
I gotta say- if this turns out to be true (particularly the speculation of using the X2 chip) I will be really very happy. It's got to be better than releasing a third wheel traditional console, desperately trying to capture the Sony and Xbone fanboys attention? Besides, most of those numpties only ever buy CoD, FIFA and GTA. To hell with them, they're idiots who know jack about actual gameplay.
Roll on September!
A bit annoying when people treat rumors as fact, I'll just wait until they officially reveal the console.
These are speculative articles. Do people even know what that means? They NEVER said it was a fact.
Not sure who Damo has been talking to, but I am considering the possibility that he owns Nvidia stock.
While all these rumours may well be true, they all sound good enough and believable to me, they are still just rumours. I really hated that the story ended with - Roll on March 2017. How about - Can't wait until Nintendo tells us what NX is - then, and only then, can we decide if March seems a long way off, or too soon.
Edit - and there are too many errors, like this was rushed and not proofread. Not typos like I make, but autocorrect errors. I'd point them out but not used to this tiny smartphone screen, its killing me.
Lots of sites are confirming this through their own sources. I'll take this as fact now and be depressed accordingly.
First 49ers hired Chip Kelly, then world politics went down the sewer and now this. Truly I have to say to my children that world was better when I was young ;_;
@rjejr It actually says "Roll on March 2017" & that's his personal opinion of wanting to get one in his hands.
I'm hoping that the system is beefed by a supplementary 'home console' element (sold separately?) that's capable of creating more high end graphics, while not excluding those who want to play the games using lower end tech and on the go. Similar to what Sony and Microsoft are looking to achieve with mid gen hardware updates.
I think the release pattern you said in your article is a key point here. Nintendo has always been deeply interested in creating a platform that allows existing games to be directly playable in new hardware releases, thus eliminating the typical game shortage at launch time.
Android games compatibility would help a lot, too.
The Nintendo Shield
You know its slow a news week at NintendoLife when...
"Nintendo NX Deal Is A Vindication Of Nvidia's Shield Program"
But is it really?
I mean, I certainly still don't give a **** about the Nvidia Shield, and I'm sure most other people don't either. So, how exactly is it great news for the Nvidia Shield program that Nintendo is making a console that might be primarily a handheld that can also stream to the TV and is apparently using one of Nvidia's chips?
It's nice for them if the chip is getting use in more technology, but I still see the Shield as a bit of a flop, unless its entire purposes was really to only be an advertising tool and little more. Seems a rather expensive way to advertise your chip though.
It was indeed rumored a while back that Nvidia offered a killer deal to Nintendo out of desperation to get a foothold in the dedicated market.
If fairness to the doomsayers before the Wii's launch, that console did turn out to be exactly the disappointment they were worried about. Yes, it was a huge sales success, but home to far less great games than any previous Nintendo console, and full of shovelware because the mix of the hardware and the casual audience suited that sort of software so well.
@Zeldafanforlife We've done our research. NX will be powered by Nvidia tech, mark my words.
@Kirk Because the whole Shield project was about showcasing the tech and attracting business. This deal will be worth a lot to Nvidia.
@gcunit We've asked the people who matter - can't really say any more than that
@Damo Seems like a pretty expensive way to go about showcasing the tech.
Just make an Ad—saves likely tens and possibly even hundreds of millions. lol
But, joking aside, I do get what you're getting at.
@DarthNocturnal It still counts as two products. The design was slightly different.
@Dreamcaster-X I know, I edited it as soon as I could, but thanks for the heads up anyway.
I still stand by my point though, how can you be excited to buy something in March when you don't know what it is, how much it will cost, or what games will be a available at launch?
We don't know if it's X1 or X2 to start, which will surely affect the price. Will it really all be bundled together - base, tablet and controllers? Why should we buy 3 bases if I want to play on tv but my 2 kids want handhelds?
Even if every rumour turns out to be true, there is still more we don't know than do know. Battery life, weight, size and resolution of the tablet screen. There's a lot to know before I'm in a rush to roll into March.
@Kirk An ad doesn't really convince a company like Nintendo, funnily enough. And the Shield range has actually sold quite well.
@Damo Do you know if the Shield overall has been a money maker for Nvidia?
Or, was it always gonna make a loss as a product, but with the intention of then selling the tech to a company like Nintendo off the back of the product's potential?
I'm not sure I really expect you to know all the details, but I'm curious.
@Kirk Nvidia have said that demand is high for the tablet and Shield TV, but then I guess they would say that. However, you don't continue with a line of products if they're not selling...
@rjejr Yeah, there really are a lot of unknowns and things that seem a bit questionable. It will be real interesting to see how it all plays out, for sure.
@Damo Well if you've spoken to the right people and know so much is it X1 or X2 or something in between? The difference between the 2 chips alone, not counting everything else that goes along with it - battery life, cost - should give people pause, no? We are talking about buying a PS3 or a PS4 in 2017, without even knowing the price.
@Damo I guess they've made enough to keep the product line going for now.
But, this did get a sequel too:
X1 was released last year and was already matched and surpassed by competing chips. NVIDIA has yet to even formally announce a successor, aside from a chipset for cars, for this year which either means they're bailing out of mobile or they're announcing it next year. Either way, even a chip designed and produced this year still wouldn't be more advanced than those in phones you can buy today or later this year. By the time the NX releases, even a chip that was finished early 2017 still wouldn't be "well in advance of any mobile phone". Well, such an SoC would be better than what's out RIGHT NOW, but by the time it releases it won't be that much more advanced than other mobile devices that came out 4th quarter 2016 or coming out later in 2017.
@Damo gonna be honest here buddy, unless there is complete transparency with sources, I aint gonna believe you. While it is certainly possible, and while I want to see everything about this device before making a judgement rather than on what is potentially half the picture, I simply cant believe because someone saying "Trusted sources" means nothing to me. Who are they? I don't know. Could be your neighbour you let look after your plants while you go away, that's trusted to you. But is it to me? No, not really.
As it stands, it might be, it might not be. But without clarity on who says what...pfft. Names man, then we see who is trusted I hope you understand the scepticism.
@rjejr we could be buying a PS3 or a PS4 in 2017. Well, a little above a PS3. As a handheld, that's one hell of a device. As a console, its a quaint little thing aint it?
@Kirk Its funny, b/c I do believe a lot of the rumours. But this article reads like a hard sell in Glengary Glenn Ross.
@AVahne Tegra is more powerful than chips deployed in mobile phones and has higher power demands. Hence the fact that the original Shield handheld - with Tegra 4 - still beats most Android devices in benchmarks.
@rjejr Hey, I actually trust Damien does have quit a bit of info we aren't privy to, in that I expect his sources do have some legit information to share with him (even if not all of it will pan out), but I'm def in interested to hear some actual official info on this thing from Nintendo finally.
@BLPs The thing with sources is that if I said who they were, they'd get fired. We wouldn't post this stuff if we didn't believe it - and neither would Eurogamer.
Let's talk again later this year
@Damo well they shouldn't be talking then. It's on them risking their jobs.
Tbh all the points brought up here made me considerably less excited for the NX. I appreciate your excitement but personally am not enthused by this at all. Ah well.
@BLPs I think you're entirely missing the point here. lol
@Wolfgabe too many hardcore gamers underestimating a desparate NVidia and Nintendo...
this NX will light the charts on fire!!
I'm still not convinced by these rumours, and I'm still not sure I like the sound of them. However, I'll wait until an official reveal before judging the NX.
I really dont understand it, is the NX gonna be just as strong as ps4 or not? Thats all i wanna know.
with all the news the last day or so I didn't acknowledge the fact that the NX is rumored to be tablet size. I hope that it is of the small tablet size. The best thing about mobile gaming and the 3ds is its ability to fit into a pocket. I really hope they nail the form factor.
I believe this, infact a reverse Wii U was my first real NX prediction as Nintendo suffers from supporting 2 consoles at the same time. Am I excited though? Not yet, a console without great software is meaningless and so far we know of no reasons to get NX (Zelda is on Wii U, Sonic 2017 is on XB1/PS4/PC and Just Dance is an awful franchise but if you like it there's virtually every single platform from the last 11 years being supported)
@Zeldafanforlife AMD got undercut by Nvidia
so serious power in a handheld... it'll counter a lot of gamers in general
I mean, they ALREADY OWN PS4 and XBX1
why would they buy Scorpio or NEO?
@phunnbaba but a larger screen means games like SSBNX will become portable advertisements
@BensonUii But Jax is excited about every new console as long as it has new games he wants to play, hes not a great example of purchasing restraint, which many other people are these days.Though he may still be undecided on the PSVR he has pre-ordered, but just the fact that he has pre-ordered it kind of proves my point.
My other point being, its not just about being excited to buy a new console, who isn't?, but by saying "roll" it made the article read to me like - we don't need no official Nintendo news, this here is the real deal, get your pre-orders in now, we speak only the truth. I'd much prefer the article to end with - Can't wait to here the real deal from Nintendo.
"Roll" just conveyed too much attitude, even for me, and I like attitude, where its merited, until Nintendo says so its still just leaks.
@Kirk Don't care if I am. I'll take the role of the opposition here and break my stance briefly here.
If this is the entire thing. If this is it and let's say these people won't lose their jobs and stuff, then I'm out. Let's be honest, this system as it's sold is crap. What do we as gamers gain? A portable ps3. That's nice.
As for what @Damo did regarding sources, I don't care if it's right or wrong. If I was running one of those businesses, I would see this man with his name everywhere talking about confidential stuff. I'd be out for his head, for contacting and getting information locked behind an NDA from people who should know better than to risk their jobs. And theyd lose their jobs too.
Maybe I'm a hard ass. Maybe I don't like the idea of this getting out. Maybe I want concrete information and @Damo sitting with a chirpy smile saying yeah it's true trust me for illegally getting info, really irks me, especially how this site is going live. I get it, clicks = money but if I was on one of these companies I'd be out for blood.
@Grumblevolcano no doubt, this means, tablet devs are gonna be on board, hell, Japan devs will like this (SEGA on board)
the question is what AMD showed to Nintendo in the bidding wars, I mean, they got outbid by NVidia.
@HSuzumiyaVI #73 Well the Scorpio and NEO will be more powerful than NX, I doubt portable nature will be worth sacrificing that to them.
Funny thing is I kind of expected NX would be based on mobile technology. Earlier this year we had some claims that it was going to be based on tech that was beyond current gen, followed by others soon after claiming it was going to be less powerful than PS4/XB1.
The reality is that they were both right: it is based on technology that is more powerful than current gen mobiles, but less than PS4.
Personally I'm resigned to having NX as my 2nd console, so I'm OK with that. I will play the AAA 3rd party games on PS4 and I want NX to give me different gameplay experiences.
Dat optimism... what about battery life, what about ease of development, what about cost? who says Tegra is cheap technology is way more expensive than comparable tech for home consoles
@PtM so... X2 is guaranteed?
NVidia would've had AMD to go against...
but what about the 3 design wins of AMD? unless, the dock is the design win...
@kantaroo however the tech is smart, can work to the metal and produce gems thanks to the mastery of old tech...
so its even easier to code for than PS4 and XBX1
@DualWielding tegra x2 at least is power efficient,
so either this destroys Polaris 11 or something else is going on...
@samuelvictor its most likely X2+
NVidia were DESPARATE!
@HSuzumiyaVI #83 I think X1 is more likely, Nintendo is always of the view that price is more important than power.
@Grumblevolcano Nintendo owns the handhelds, 60 million to 3ds vs 40 million to ps4 and 20 million to xbx1
stop thinking like a hardcore gamer...
@BLPs No BLPs runaway, save yourself!
I know it's a bit better than PS3 and probably a bit better than P4, either of which is truly great on a handheld, if the price is right, but only 1 really ccuts it for my tv. What's better for Zelda Wild on my 52" 1080p tv, Wii U or NX? I'm not a handheld gamer, I can wait on NX until after I finish Zelda Wild if its better on Wii U. And thats why Im not ready to roll into March 2017.
Now quick, run away, I'll summon you when we get news, not leaks. Maybe on Twitter though to save you from here.
How about this idea: what if the base unit that connects to TV is based on X2 but the mobile is X1? Games would come in two sizes like is the case for iPhone and iPad.
Are we sure the base unit is a dumb terminal? Will it have any CPU or GPU of its own? Or RAM?
Will it improve the quality of the pixels?
@Grumblevolcano that makes no sense, AMD was undercut bad by NVidia... on the bidding.
Good Enough. At first it Nvidia thing scared me, but proof positive the current chips handily surpass last gen's big boys and probably can beat Wii U now is encouraging. The potential for getting the next gen chips is even better.
I still have questions of course, but right now it's more about company practices than the console itself. Like, where does Nintendo stand in regard to my download catalog?
@HSuzumiyaVI how do you know its power efficient if it's not even out
@Alshain01 that means Polaris Vega level GPU...
@DualWielding the prototypes devs have have built in fans with X1
X2 creates less heat. common symptom of power in efficiency...
@Rect_Pola Digital will transfer over that is all... unless NNID isn't used...
@kantaroo that makes 0 sense, its better to have an X2 in the unit over the SCD.
the SCD might house a Polaris chip...
and X2 is likely ARM64 which is closer to parity with X86 architecture.
@Dakt Perhaps, but it's pretty major news. This is a realgame-changer for NX.
@HSuzumiyaVI The 3DS came out nearly 3 years earlier than the XB1 and PS4. Not a realistic comparison. As for your other comment sure it makes sense. Think about Nintendo logic, if AMD was selling powerful chips for a certain price and then Nvidia sells less powerful chips but for a massively lower price then Nintendo would choose the less powerful ones.
@Captain_Toad of course, the leaks are based of prototypes.
not the current dev kits
@rjejr Ta muchly love
@Damo "Later this year" as in "September", or just "later"?
I'll no doubt buy it whatever is is so this is all fairly academic, to me. I am curious to finally see it when it's revealed though. Presumably we can expect first party content to come at a much faster rate now that development resources are not split between two platforms; good times ahead, hopefully.
Is this going to make it more difficult to port over other games from other systems if it's as powered or underpowered as it is?
Essentially, I'd love to not miss out on titles like the Witcher III or Dark Souls III or Overwatch. I feel like going underpowered again (which the digital foundry video implies until the end where they suggest the possibility of another chip) will ensure another drought from big 3rd party releases.
@kantaroo The rumours never discuss the base enough for me. I've thought about X1 and X2 together, or an X1 in both like how Nvidia's dual video cards work in SLI. Nvidia makes the X1, why not have it work in SLI mode for tv?
Also, the N64 pak doubled the RAM to get higher res. Maybe the base can double the handheld RAM so a 540p handheld can do 1080p on the tv.
Base matters, cost of the base matters, bundling or selling it seperatly matters. Need more leaks.
@Grumblevolcano actually, that wouldn't make sense, the wii U is dead and the NX now needs to carry that torch with being a hybrid. likely that AMD was unable to supply a win on the hybrid front,
and what if the NX is multiple form factors?
despite that, NVidia was showing something state of the art.. so power = XBX1 is false, this isn't stock chips... these are semicustom and modern chips don't follow the (power is everything ethos, they are resource managers the devs just wont be able to strong arm the NX at all.)
@televisions not really, ARM64 and X86 are easy to port over,
the whole reason PS4 and XBX1 went X86 over ARM was that ARM64 didn't exist.
@BLPs So, you're telling me that if NX offered an experience something like this you'd consider that worthless or whatever:
http://www.inceptional.com/2015/06/26/heres-the-gist-of-my-idea-for-nintendos-nx/ (just my own idea for what it could be)
Dude, based on what we know it will almost certainly be the most powerful dedicated handheld console ever made, with potentially some very unique hardware features, and there's a chance it might even go beyond just what the hardware is doing too; as in, the firmware and software might offer more than most people imagine too.
For a handheld, which is basically what this thing is if the rumours are true, I don't see how that can possibly come over as a disappointment to you.
WTF were you expecting from a new Nintendo handheld console?
Now, if Nintendo markets this as a new home console, even though it's actually a handheld, then I can see how you could easily be disappointed, because then it really would just be another totally underpowered home console with a gimmick.
So, maybe it's more about how you personally are choosing to see this system than what it actually is and what we're actually getting—if the rumours are accurate—possibly.
And I don't care about all the leaked corporate info stuff.
@rjejr as always, THE VITAL INFO IS NEVER LEAKED...
@BiasedSonyFan unless the opposition is mobile...
then having X2 makes sense and its even stronger than current gen consoles, geez no one seems to understand that a modern architecture are smarter, efficient, and optimized vs brute force inefficient chips used in XBX1 and PS4
this all reminds me of Geno's rumours.
@HSuzumiyaVI All Nintendo needs to do to get Wii U owners on board is cut off their supply of games which they are doing (Color Splash is the only game to Wii U in 2nd half of 2016, Splatfests are finished over half a year before NX launch, BotW delayed to release at same time as NX, etc.)
@Kirk that makes sense, the handheld is on par or greater than a PS4 so if Nintendo has a console (base station)
you get the picture.
@Grumblevolcano which is what Nintendo is doing...
carts hold more than the wii U BD so its an evolution hell, imagine 64GB carts...
@BiasedSonyFan I'm talking about Mobile.
@televisions its a handheld, what do you expect...
@HSuzumiyaVI What are you talking about. Did you quote the right person?
Where did you hear that AMD got undercut by nvidia? You just pulled that out of thin air.
"new devices every 12 or 18 months which offer a little more power but maintain support for all previous games" If this happens,I'm going to spit in NIntendo's face and buy a Playstation 4.
@Grumblevolcano re post #72 "a great console without software is meaningless"
Sign me up! (that's sarcasm, at the entire tone of the article, not at you)
@Alshain01 yes, I did, NVidia outbid AMD so... that's it.
I'm just going to chuckle at everyone freaking out over the idea that the NX might use a chip with mind blowing graphics that are only ever so slightly less mind blowing than their competition, then go back to playing games on my backlit original Game Boy.
The Shiekah Slate in the BotW footage is likely similar to the NX handheld. I have sources.
@Zeldafanforlife no i didnt, you remember the site called Semi accurate? well, its a paid subscription site talking about Nintendo's next handheld bidding war.
@HSuzumiyaVI It's sounding like you're pretty desperate, that you were hoping for hardware that would rival PS4 and XB1. Giving nonsense as a way to hide your anger with the reality that Nintendo is infact making another unpowered console if you look from the home console side of things.
@HammerKirby go ahead, I dont care
if you want to act like that please leave...
as for me, I've given up on modern gaming...
I won't believe anything until I hear it from Nintendo.
@Grumblevolcano personally I find the idea absurd, but you know graphics whores common sense is something they ignore...
I'm like sorta sick at all these rumours but rampant speculation is fun I guess
i mean, every one is doing it... I'm just shooting down the cynics that's all.
@The_Dude_Abides it practically has a handheld base... and Nintendo rarely change the handhelds BC for the hell of it...
I hope 2TB SDXC is supported on NX
@HSuzumiyaVI I still have no idea what you are talking about. If you are replying to something I said, you are going to have to be more clear. Your two lines in two replies now don't seem to correlate with the one comment I made.
@samuelvictor I've given up all hope for modern gaming so the NX is just what I need, and I suspect with a booming retro games market will buy the NX also,
its a handheld basically.
@Alshain01 "Business politics. Nvidia knows their competitor is killing them in the market right now, if they want to get back in the market, they will bend over backwards for Nintendo to do it. That could mean technical assistance, or even price cuts on the chips. If AMD can't or won't compete, Nintendo will go with Nvidia.
I'm not sold that the rumor is true, but I wouldn't discount it just because of history with AMD.
what I was referring to
@The_Dude_Abidesi'd likely wont care... region locking is gonna be decided unless there's legal issues.
Pokemon, Monster Hunter, Yokai Watch.
It's exciting because
A) New console means new games, and new games are exciting (also worth noting new Nintendo games are particularly exciting)
B) New console means new innovation not previously available, and change is exciting. Stagnation is dull
C) Assuming it's true, the idea of playing games on a handheld as powerful as one of the current gen home consoles is extremely exciting. And getting both handheld and console in one purchase is exciting too. And the fact handheld games will be playable on console (like Pokemon and Monster Hunter) and console games will be playable on handheld (like Mario Maker or Pikmin) is doubly exciting.
So ya, I may have an itchy trigger finger with regard to preorders, but that doesn't mean I'm automatically excited for what I'm buying. With NX, I'm legitimately excited.
@HSuzumiyaVI Ok, well I don't know what you were trying to say then. I'm sorry, it's just not clear. You mentioned something about Polaris and Vega, as far as I know those are stars.
@SharkAttackU nice touch, I prefer that design over the wii U gamepad.
Even though I am still quite opposed to this for several reasons, unless hands on experience will convince me otherwise, there do seem to be some misunderstandings as to how good or powerful this hardware really is.
The Doom BFG edition demo didn't do it justice. The Shield handheld (which has a Tegra X1) can stream Full HD PC games from this generation at 1080p 60fps with no noticeable lag, and it can also play them directly via the Shield TV. It is important to note that both devices have an Android layer running alongside the games which especially impacts the Shield TV (since streaming works via the PC, so no issues there), but from what is reported now, the NX won't use Android, so it can run and be programmed on bare metal, meaning a considerably larger portion of juice can be squeezed from it, meaning that on the NX, games could indeed look quite a bit better, making the "near Xbox One" specs for the handheld part pretty believable.
As for how that could look, in this X1 presentation, fast forward to 6m40s see Unreal Engine 4 being rendered in real time with full effects switched on:
(that one's for you too, @samuelvictor)
The explanation of all the effects follows right after the demo, and for the interested people that want to know more about the chip itself, just watch the entire presentation.
And remember: that is last year's X1 chip, the X2 is supposed to be considerably faster and have more graphics capabilities all while being more energy efficient due to using FinFet technology and as such, you could be thinking of a handheld capable of graphics near the PS4, which is actually quite insane, in a good way, if you take a minute to let that sink in.
I did that as well, and that part of it I really like, but I do need to know more about the wonky sounding detachable controller parts and the home base, although from what I've read, it also has some internal hardware that may be used for upscaling and/or other extras.
@HSuzumiyaVI Fair enough, personally I'm of the view that as long as a system has lots of great games, it's power doesn't really matter. My main concerns regarding NX are about software, get the feeling they're not going to make much if any new games for the NX launch window (just rely on the fact that the Wii U sold very poorly so create lots of Wii U ports).
Have you seen the comments in the articles for this on other sites? Complete doom and gloom because it basically guarantees underpowered console when compared to PS4/XB1/Neo/Scorpio.
@Ephidel don't forget Splatoon, SSB NX.. with wireless pro pad link up...
NX with steam app would solve a lot of the 3rd party problems.
@Alshain01 polaris Vega is Polariis 10 GPUs by AMD
what Scorpio was rumoured to have.
@Grumblevolcano but heres the thing, NEO is not the PS5
people have gotten sick of modern gaming and became retro gamers.
so the landscape has changed, hell, consoles might lose to mobile chips after all...
@samuelvictor actually, it was more the problem with ecosystems, plus the NX will attract PS4 and XBX1 gamers if they think Scorpio and Neo is not for them.
@IceClimbers I was thinking of that exact same rumor...
@The_Dude_Abides its also a legal minefield
and when you talk business anti consumer gets trumped by legal fees, fines persecution and even the possibility of bans.
@ThanosReXXX with a fact CPU the NX will run better than the base PS4 with many 3rd part releases.
@BiasedSonyFan don't forget, there was a change of plans in a holiday 16 release to a march 17...
likely X2 is incorporated because they wont need to cool the chip vs the X1 prototype dev kits.
@The_Dude_Abides its a poor escuse but it also has some serious implications.
@HSuzumiyaVI huh? I'm confused by this comment.
@samuelvictor what gets me is what was AMD's bid?
NVidia X2 with a fast Cpu means "Near Neo" power
don't forget, new chips can do more with less CUs
and Bayonetta 2 was running on a WII U, not PS4.
People are ignorant though. And will doom and gloom Nintendo regardless.
People were saying how 3DS was the worst platform ever and total failure etc, until it started selling well and people shut up.
They did the same for Wii U, and were all too happy to see its demise. A lot of gamers have fanboy mindsets and it makes them feel good to downplay Nintendo and spin their products as weak sauce.
Had Sony announced the most powerful handheld ever created, that also plays games on console, people would be bowing down in droves proclaiming the most amazing device ever, predicting super high sales and endless possibilities.
So I pay no mind to that doom and gloom stuff. Objectively this will be an incredible leap for handheld gaming. Even if it couldn't dock as a console, even if it was handheld only, it's still an amazing piece of tech and anyone who truly loves power as much as they claim to, should be groveling for a handheld that's on par with current gen consoles (even if it's the lower end, that's still incredible for a handheld)
@HammerKirby ""new devices every 12 or 18 months which offer a little more power but maintain support for all previous games" If this happens,I'm going to spit in NIntendo's face and buy a Playstation 4"
what do you expect? I told you I don't care plus, spitting in Nintendos face is disrespectful to our gaming heritage...
then I told you I've given up all hope on Sony and XBX gaming in general so that's it.
@BiasedSonyFan it doesn't mean its not being used...
its a rumour given way too much credit...
@JaxonH it means I wont be needing a console at this moment, Neo and Scorpio are more rehashes.
@ThanosReXXX the Geno rumour?
@BiasedSonyFan those cards cant work in the conditions mobiles can and fans would need to be added making it more bulky.
I just realised something. It's a long shot, but it could mean something.
Remember the new slogan animation? The animation features a slate with buttons. Like a Wii Remote, but with a similar layout to a handheld. It's very similar to the whole "detachable buttons" gimmick that's been rumoured.
Also, "There's no play like it" could represent the uniqueness of the device.
I don't know. Wild speculation.
@Zorox88 indeed, a Steam app would solve many things.
I've noticed that a lot of people are saying that the NX's graphical power could potentially be less than Wii U...however I think they're forgetting that Breath of the Wild is going to be on both platforms. I just couldn't imagine their new hardware having a scaled down version. That should alleviate those worries, no?
@Inkling when I saw the mock up drawings I thought of the animation, well, Play Anywhere is a better tag line than "what will U play next?"
@jerSLater999 and add Project Sonic, X1 is Xbox 1 level X2 is PS4 level. and with a fast Cpu can pull out games designed for the PSNeo.
@HSuzumiyaVI scratch that,I'll spit in the face of MODERN nintendo. Not Pre-NX Nintendo,where they used to actually make great hardware and not a glorified tablet.
How nice would it be to hae a console with no moving parts!
This sounds awesome for just an handheld console the power and graphics will be amazing and plugging n playing on the tv brilliant but as a home console hybrid it's not powerful enough with only able too play last gen style games sounds like Nintendo is going backwards for the home console market but definitely forward for the handheld market I still think Nintendo is going down the two console route with a home console and handheld console working together.
C'mon guys, give a break, NL staff keep this site running through the worst years of Nintendo (end of Wii era and last year), so let they talk a lot when something nice appears.
Don't be so rash, and if you don't want read about it just don't click.
@HammerKirby whatever, you stated your opinion now begone...
unless youre here to watch the hysteria over a handheld...lol
@Damo Waw- that's an awfully commited statement to make! Let's just hope Nintendo aren't pulling the old Switcheroo on your sources
I admire your certainty however.
@HammerKirby haha- this guy..
@BiasedSonyFan not really, I use Pokémon Go so it works out better for me, plus imagine smash bros nx on this thing...
@johnodaz that would be the dock...
And as I said in the other article, Tegra X2 would be the holy divinity of portable gaming.
299,00 portable hybrid, tegra X2, 3 ~ 4 hours of battery, only one controller, with the possibility of 3 more, cartridges 32gb but with possibility of reach 50gb in special games, more than 10 exclusives in the release window, from classics as DK and Mario as long forgotten franchises. The third support it'll be Monster Hunter Generations Ultimate and No More Heroes 3...
Am I day dreaming?
@HappyMaskedGuy well, I had to call him out for disrespecting gaming history...
plus we are all talking over a handheld that's insane, I hope the screen is = to a tablet screen, I want something for Smash fans to see while I get beaten or beat them n.n on NX
having these tablets with stands means current gen power on the Go!
Now youre playing with Portable Power!
@HSuzumiyaVI Agreed. And I can just imagine how nice it will look on the small screen. Although were losing the "glasses free 3d" (so the parents can buy NX for their kids, also the cost factor), I have a hunch that these games will look amazing. I am a bit biased towards handhelds though so that may be playing into my excitement for NX haha.
@jerSLater999 yeah, I started liking the "worlds most powerful handheld" and the ads of the 80s where the NX is on par with the PS4 on the GO!
Now you are playing with portable Power!!
*if its X2 well, its pretty insane to think...
@HSuzumiyaVI I'm genuinely hyped by this news. Anyone who expected +PS4 power was bound to be disappointed, but tbh, how many PS4 games have you played that made you say 'WOW'??
I'm convinced I accidentally bought a PS3 with delusions of grandeur.
@BiasedSonyFan likely Mobile chips are improving and mobile devices are eating into the Japanese Gaming industry.
@HappyMaskedGuy but, if NVidia was desparate, Nintendo claiming world wide powerful handheld on par with current gen consoles. that's some serious Nintendo Power!
@Frank90 only you can know the answer to that- in your heart.
@Frank90 its the gallant return of the Nintendo entertainment system.
@HSuzumiyaVI Nintendo could genuinely be running out the back door with the cash whilst Sony and Microsoft are passed out on the couch.
It's exciting. Could well explain Nintendo's secrecy.
@BiasedSonyFan "Do you think this console would cost the usual $300-$400 USD?"
I think 250 is their sweet spot so 299 is likely their deal.
@HappyMaskedGuy it all depends on the efficiency and if XBX1 specs are revealed at X1 X2 are gonna do some serious marketing on its own...
no more bulky systems for high end current gen consoles.
Nintendo is really hitting it where it hurts.
Well, might as well dive into it with both feet now, people.
Here's an in depth comparison between the Nvidia Shield TV and the PS4:
And here are a couple of current gen games running on the Shield TV, and once again: remember that this is on the Tegra X1 and with an Android layer, so expect better from the NX, even if it isn't going for the X2, since it won't be hindered by Android.
(I did put some Android games in there as well, though. Just for comparison)
Metal Gear Rising Revengence:
Borderlands: the prequel:
Resident Evil 5:
The Witcher 3:
Super Mega Baseball:
Batman: Arkham Origins:
Ultra Street Fighter IV:
All running at a steady 1080p/60fps
And it even runs GameCube in Full HD, so that might be a good reason for Nintendo to consider GameCube VC:
Super Mario Sunshine:
Wave Race Blue Storm:
And here's a complete run through of the interface, games and apps and upcoming games:
Nintendo might not incorporate this menu, but this is all just to give you all an idea of the power and speed of the Shield.
I'm going to mull all this over right now, and process my utter annoyance at the fact that a dumb, a-technical person like Emily Rogers might actually be right, and I might even come to accept and enjoy this...
Graphics power certainly won't be an issue, as all these demos clearly show.
I find it odd how every time a rumour breaks, we have a brand new machine. Right now we have an Nvidia Shield with a Nintendo logo on it.
@WiltonRoots only this time we got a PROTOYPE
"You haven't even seen MY TRUE FORM!"
Nintendo, Now you're playing with Power!
@HSuzumiyaVI Haha I miss that old tagline. With all the Nintendo nostalgia in the publics mind this year, they should definitely use it again. After many years of portable LCD games, 1989 really did feel like I was "playing with portable power." But you're right...this would be an absolute milestone in handheld gaming. And I can't see Nintendo alienating their "at home" fan base, or what little remains of it in this gen. They will make it work imho.
@BiasedSonyFan more likely = to the PS4 in price... when Neo is released. maybe less.
@jerSLater999 I'm already sold on the tagline but this one really sticks!!
People need to understand. The era of Nintendo consoles is over.
Let that sink in. Breath in... Now out... Ya.
The era of Nintendo consoles is over. They have been largely unsuccessful for decades, and it's time to focus on a single platform hybrid. Thankfully for all you console players this is not just a handheld so you will still be able to play games on the television, but people need to get over this whole "if it's not as strong as a PS4 the games will be horrible and I simply cannot enjoy them" attitude. As if the power level of that console is some magical threshold where games suddenly become good.
We are potentially looking at the most powerful handheld platform in existence. That is mind blowing. This is not just a little step up from the 3DS. This is literally bringing current generation console gaming parity to handhelds. Wow is right.
That alone is enough for me. But the fact is can dock to play on the TV also? Oh pah-lease... You had me at hello.
@HSuzumiyaVI sorry, what do you mean by prototype?
@JaxonH unless you realize the Dock IS THE CONSOLE...
Nintendo: Now youre playing with portable power!
@BiasedSonyFan @HSuzumiyaVI It'll cost far less. The prices for the current Shield are here:
Far less for the base unit. The 500GB model is $299.
@BiasedSonyFan I said PS4 what price do you think Neo will be?
That would be interesting.
@WiltonRoots the leak was based on prototype dev kits, meaning the current dev kits are under NDA.
@ThanosReXXX its gonna be an impulsive buy every where in the west, or USA. in Australia, mobile reigns pretty big.
@JaxonH Now you're playing with portable power!
splitscreen multiplayer will love the NX
@HSuzumiyaVI Wow girl, you sure are racking up your comment count...
@ThanosReXXX I have a comment count?
strange, where are all the gloomer and the Nintendoomers?
@Alshain01 AMD is certainly NOT killing Nvidia when it comes to its Graphic Cards. AMD recently announced their latest GPGPU, which will cost around £300. Nvidia then went and stumped them by announcing the GTX 1080, 1070 and 1060. The GTX1060 gives 980ti power for the same price as AMD`s latest offering, which is still using their old architecture. Nvidia has a brand new architecture, and their X2 chip is rumored to be nearly as powerful as a GTX980. If they code to the metal, that could easily go up to matching the 980ti, which is much stronger than both The Xbox and PS4.
@akaDv8R this exists?
Well just made an account just to say my two bits.
Yesterday when the rumours hit I was overly worried, but thinking things through this is just the same Nintendo we have seen over the last decade, a company thats trying to do its own thing which is not necessarily bad but I wished devs and gamers would give it more chances.
Power wise it seems the system is at least more powerful than the WiiU, that's a given, when has ever been a console less powerful than its previous interation?
If the X2 chips are true then it means the mobile set of the gaming device might be as powerful as a PS4 which is amazing.
Imagine if the "dock" (I don't consider it a dock, it's a computing device which will power up the mobile component, just like it happened with the N64 and the removable RAM) gives even more power, then it might be true that NX is on par with the PS4, hitting the Neo.
This can be only true since Sonic 2017 is coming to all platforms, which is a good sign. Also remember that Square-Enix said Dragon Quest XI is coming to NX.
Since this is a hybrid, it means that handheld and console comes to the same system. Good, now I can play monster hunter on the go and when I want to see it big screen, I can do that, I can play bravely default 3 just the same and finally Pokemon on the big screen.
Then it comes to homeconsole component, if the mobile is as powerful as a PS4, that means I can play breath of the Wild on the handheld component, which is awesome
And the chip is freaking Nvidia, these guys make good stuff; what's happening with Nintendo and the chips is that we are suffering from Comfort Zone complex, since everyone went AMD this gen, going elsewhere is outside the zone, that's scary stuff.
And no one has said that the Tegra chips are hard to port, no one said Tegra chips don't support unreal engine 4 or the other engines that "matter"
My truest concerns are: price, battery life, social media (that's a given today) and if I can have the option to use a pro controller when I'm home.
If this is like a tablet, guess what...it's the only tablet you can play Nintendo games on, and if it support mobile gaming...kaboom! Parents will want it, it plays Nintendo games and Pokemon Go on a single unit.
So I will stop getting scared and hop off the "powerhouse" wagon now and be more open minded about NX, it plays Zelda...that's the only thing that matters to me right now.
@akaDv8R the X2 is as powerful as the 980 edition of Nvidia? you gotta be kidding
@CidMaik I hope we can get a better battery though. just like 3DS and the game pad.
but 3d on the 3ds made the 5 hrs feel like 3...
@BiasedSonyFan Well, actually it is. The X2 is expected to fall into the same price range and if the rumors about Nvidia wanting to get into the console business at any cost have any merit to them, then Nintendo will have made a VERY good deal with them, and obviously also because of the numbers that Nintendo will have ordered from them, which will be FAR in excess of what Nvidia themselves would produce for the Shield.
@CidMaik " X2 chip is rumored to be nearly as powerful as a GTX980. If they code to the metal, that could easily go up to matching the 980ti, which is much stronger than both The Xbox and PS4."
I might believe that had I remained content in the PS4 level power trip I had,
Nintendo: Now you're playing portable power!
GCN Mk2 confirmed
But doesn't this mean that with a completely different chipset to the current gen PS4 / Xbox One, we'll get another generation where third parties won't want to port their AAA games over the Nintendo's awkward new box? Again?
@HSuzumiyaVI Of course you have a comment count, well at least in this article, and on your profile page you can also check the number of comments you've made up til now.
I have no idea what you mean by the gloomers and Nintendoomers bit...
@ThanosReXXX I believe this on the basis that GTX 980ti is 5TFlops
@gaga64 ARM64 and X86 aren't that hard to code for over PPC.
@ThanosReXXX I got timed out, so I get there was a limit.
@gaga64 No, it won't. The Nvidia Shield runs almost straight ports of PC games, so porting them over to the NX if it is using this chipset will be a cake walk.
@BiasedSonyFan wasn't that the plan with the X2 instead?
@HSuzumiyaVI Wut? You make me think I'm on some kind of drug. Comments #230 and #233 make no sense to me at all, sorry.
@gaga64 Remember all games are made first on PC and then downgraded to fit the consoles.
Games can be easily ported to Nvidia as well, just like they do on PC
@HSuzumiyaVI Well I don't know about that, but that's perception xD you play more than you actually think you did.
As for battery life, the 3DS and the gamepad are said to have real good battery life's. Mine lasted for hours but I didn't use 3D, the volume was mid and the light was at its lowest.
So I believe Nintendo will follow suit with this.
@ThanosReXXX I believe this on the basis that GTX 980ti is 5TFlops I believe you on the X2 specs
plus I was saying I got timed out...
At this point, I just hope the price isn't too expensive.
@HSuzumiyaVI The comments still make no sense, sorry, since I can't see anything in my own comments that would relate to your responses. I never mentioned anything about Tflops or you being timed out.
Maybe you confused me with someone else you wanted to reply to?
@ThanosReXXX My friend owns a Shield TV and it doesn't/can't play games like Witcher 3, it streams them. It's not that powerful tbh.
Also, it certainly doesn't play every game at 1080p 60fps, MGR runs at 720p at 30 with lots of dips.
What is your source?
@BiasedSonyFan Driving up consumer demand is no reason to also drive up the price, and you have to combine the X2 being in the same price range as the X1 with the bulk deal, in which case it wouldn't matter all that much if they'd buy 10 million X1's or 10 million X2's...
Middle aged IT Sales & marketing professional here. I know my IT component prices...
@HappyMaskedGuy Hhahaha you sound like a Persona npc (or maybe I just stop playing P4Golden a little)!
@ThanosReXXX I'm drowning toward it!
Just to clarify "if it's not as strong as a PS4 the games will be horrible and I simply cannot enjoy them"
I think peoples concern on the power front has to do with porting 3rd party games (Assassin's Creed, COD, etc.) over to the NX. With this point of view, the NX will just be another Nintendo box. I think that is their logic with the argument.
I could care less myself. I am just not convinced Assassin's Creed, COD, Etc will ever sell too good on a Nintendo console due to the typical target demographic and the content of the games. I actually prefer the NX to be just a Nintendo box or better yet hybrid system.
@ThanosReXXX no I found out I had a limit by being unable to post on this website.
your reasoning on the X2 is correct though...
@Dislikesfats Yeah, it streams them, but it still works like a charm, and that was my point, although I could have added that to the clip, but you can see it runs well and you can access all functions from the Shield.
But the X2 will be more powerful and as both explained in my own comments as in the original article here, the NX won't have to bother with the Android layer so it can get more power out of the chipset because it can get closer to the metal.
@Frank90 Too much sinking then...
@HSuzumiyaVI Ah, okay. Well, I didn't even know there was a cap on the number of comments we can make, so I learned something new today. You certainly were doing your best in making the most comments in this article...
i heard the X2 was based on pascal architecture.
I'm becoming really irritated now more at Nintendo i'm sick of them being so damn childish this thing is out in march and we don't even have a name SHOW THE DAMN THING
@carlos82 I understand your point but I'm pretty sold at this point. This could be the console that finally breaks the balance between the home and portable parts of Nintendo. For instance, in ssb4 my friend has a Wii u and played that version, but missed out on Magicant, Gerudo Valley, Reset Bomb Forest and other stuff too. This could change gaming and become what's next as far as letting you play where portable and home unite into one
@Frank90 Thanks. One more C.V attribute for me!
@PK_Boss11 true, and if X2 is in it, then it will be above par the PS4 and double as the worlds most powerful handheld.
@HSuzumiyaVI A good tip might be to @ multiple people in the one comment but split it into multiple paragraphs, that way you won't hit that wall...
@WiltonRoots I'm fin with the wall. but thanks for the advice.
I may be wrong, but didn't Nintendo say a year or so back that they were working with AMD for the graphics chip? They pretty much always have. A Tegra powered tablet console will be expensive as crap. Doesn't sound like what Nintendo would do.
@nridgedrummer they got a design win for the handheld... according to semiaccurate.
@BiasedSonyFan Nintendo wants profits and wants to undercut the competitors
@ThanosReXXX Thanks for the tech explanation/demonstration. I like having a basic understanding of how things work. Appreciate the links.
@Sakura even though, Blunty claimed on you tube that eurogamer is saying the same things before the wii U...
but there is something missing...
@BiasedSonyFan I'm not saying they would leave potential profits on the table, but even at the last financial meeting, Kimishima stressed the point that they wanted the NX to remain affordable, so I'm not expecting it to be expensive.
And maybe that means we will have to settle for Tegra X1, but that would still make it the most powerful handheld in the world and well above a portable Wii U and nearing the Xbox One.
The base unit could then have some additional hardware to upgrade the graphics for a better big screen experience, so all in all we Nintendo gamers will probably be just fine once we get over the initial shock over it not being AMD box nr. 3... (as I myself admittedly also had to do)
@Sakura You're most welcome.
My two cents - as a portable, the rumors sound wonderful, and a perfect succesor to the 3DS.
From the point of view of a home console, it doesn't convince me. It is going to be a Nintendo box again?
While I love Nintendo games, skipping third parties games that caught my eye is annoying.
@HSuzumiyaVI Absolutely, And before Nintendo talked about the idea of 1, you're NX and your Tablet and phone all connected together is the gimmick. People go nuts over Pokemon go and find out they only have to pay $150 to either play an updated version NX app with new exclusive Pokemon, or have the real game on NX and use tablet and phone play to draw people in who aren't familiar with some of Nintendo's work
@PK_Boss11 Nintendo NX handheld is definitely revolutionary
but while Nintendo is NDA devs on NX its clear the vital information is omitted...
@Luna_110 its a handheld first, console second plus X2 is likely in it,
From the Eurogamer/Digital Foundry article:
And here's some light reading with schedules on the Tegra X2 and related chipsets and technology:
@ThanosReXXX theres no question that it wont be a powerful handheld, and the fact the NX is mostly in secrecy hints that we haven't seen the rest of the NX after all, the base station
but one thing is for certain, we are playing with Power! Portable Power!
@JaxonH Well I am excited for this and I like the basis of the leaks, but right now I'm more focused on finding out about the console and the dock than buying it. I have a need for knowledge that supersedes my need for gaming.
And if people are upset Nintendo has to take some of the blame. They told us Zelda Wild would be on NX, so people assumed home console, and they told us "different graphics" so people assumed better. And while we can fault people for jumping to conclusions, we have to acknowledge Nintendo was being obtuse on purpose to keep people guessing, so it isn't entirely their fault if some people guessed NX would be graphically superior to Wii U, which it might not. Or it might. But Nintendo's silence on the matter gives people reason to be annoyed in my book. Nintendo could at least say "handheld" and stop saying "platform" all the time so people wouldn't expect a PS4, then surprise people with the tv out dock. Unless it's an NX and it is PS4 power, but despite this articles assurances that we know what NX is, we don't, because X1 power is noticeably different from X2.
So I get why people are upset. I'm not upset, but I'm not pre-ordering until I have facts, not leaks, and I know the price. And I can't really guess the price without knowing if it's X1 or X2 and if it's bundled or not.
So I'm excited, but I want to know more. Preferably facts, not leaks.
yeah I agree with you there, here's hoping
@rjejr X1 is near Xbox one level
X2 is ps4+
one user claims on this site that its a GTX980.
which is = to Polaris 11 GPU.
also, I understand there is not much nintendo news but this is getting a bit much... like other members have expressed I feel like this is an advertisement more than another article....
This rumor does have legitimacy though.. for AMD only announced 3 new semi-custom builds for this year...
I feel bad for Nintendo to be honest.
With the modern world, everything these days is so divided.
They are damned if they do, and damned if they don't.
You have one camp who wants a high end machine, a clone of PS4/XBone which plays Nintendo games.
Then the other, who wants innovation, new ideas, being prepared to let the spec slide in favour of originality.
Then you have people who want something else entirely.
I just feel from my stand point, all I care about is decent Nintendo games coming out.
I don't particularly care what they look like, as long as play great and are fun.
I would be even happy if they just turned around, and said, look where just going to release all our previous/current systems rolled up into one, and develop for all of them to give everyone what they want.
8bit,16bit, 64bit, Modern let's keep everyone happy.
As for NX portable idea, I'm not sold.
I want a machine to be purely a home system.
I don't want to play it on the move, I've got a 3DS for that.
I don't want to look at a small screen, I want it on my TV with the volume cranked up, and my seat pulled close so it's all I can see.
I also worry about the fact, if the NX is a portable, can you imagine if you broke that thing on the move ?
It's not going to be cheap.
That's going to put a lot of parents off if you ask me.
It's a pain in the ass enough not being able to get a replacement Wii U tablet, let alone even thinking about taking an NX out on the move.
The bottom line for me is, I just want great Nintendo games.
High quality games which are fun and innovate.
Whatever NX is I'll be getting it, but they need to get back to basics and think what makes Nintendo great.
Fun, Originality and bringing people together.
@Madder128 the 3DS is getting replaced as well, so there is no choice. its the NX from now on... and I'm fine with that.
@Madder128 what is also irony is that the NX if fun, is original and above all else, social, now you can play splitscreen multiplayer smash NX and other amazing opportunities.
@HSuzumiyaVI I don't have a problem with 3DS getting replace. I'm all for a new Nintendo handheld.
I'm just not entirely sold on this hybrid console/handheld NX Rumours.
@BiasedSonyFan that's why i said 299 instead of 250 because an X2 will be higher than a PS4.
@Madder128 then expect the rumours to sound more uniform as they always do, but I'm sold on the concept and the spectacle.
@rjejr Rest assured that Breath of the Wild on a Tegra X1 will look quite a bit better than on a Wii U, so no reason for "fans" to be mad at Nintendo for that at all.
PlayerEssence has already debunked this EuroGamer rumor:
@BiasedSonyFan And that could be where the infamous SCD's come into play...
If a home base can improve quality on a big screen, then there should not be any issues with making more add-ons that connect to the home base to give it even more oomph than it already has...
Nintendo may sell the consoles at marketing cost and make the profit with the games.
@ThanosReXXX i watched this guy 3 times while i was replying to the NL comments...
its correct that the rumours are quite interesting but if EG did journalism, they would've included X2 which is even stronger than X1.
in fact, AMD likely didn't have a mobile Polaris out yet, but as we say, "There is more than meets the eye."
Emily Rodgers likely used info from prototype dev kits, likely Sega's is the fabled X2 processor... all the big 3rd party have dev kits that are stronger than X1
lets be honest, Project Sonic can not run on an X1.
@Frank90 they may be looking to optimize the form factor...
@HSuzumiyaVI I'm still waiting to see SuperMetalDave's take on this. He will probably post a new video tomorrow. I did send him a PM asking him what his thoughts are and if he would be disappointed if this is going to be it, since he is rooting for a x86/Polaris-like architecture.
And like PlayerEssence, he too has sources and has spoken to developers at E3, so now I guess it is going to be a matter of who's sources are more reliable/reputable...
Either way, having looked into it myself now since these last few comments, I'm not worried about the power level anymore; even with Tegra they can still get into the same ballpark as the other two.
You can skip the "d" in Emily Rogers' name...
@ThanosReXXX i will, its clear the vital info is what is missing, we are hearing what a dev kit can do, now imagine a full blown product, the handheld line shall rule forevermore!
NINTENDO! NINTENDO! NINTENDO!
It is also quite feasible and inline with previous speculation that the NX is the first hardware release in a two stage process.
With the NX being the future of Nintendo mobile gaming, and a second hardware release being the actual Wii U replacement.
it would seem odd for Nintendo to completely shut down one of its two hardware streams.
@ThanosReXXX , thanks for posting those videos! X1 or X2...I don't think I can tell the difference between gamecube and wii u games anyway, so these types of graphics on a handheld is very good. I wonder if Nintendo held back N64 and gamecube games to whip them out on the NX. Do you think the eshop will migrate over to the NX?
@CidMaik , I had a few days to think about this too, and feel the same way. I'm starting to think this handheld will be the core, with that base being upgradeable, sort of like a pc.
@Cyberbotv2 look up the Power Book Duo, an apple Ibook that could dock with a computer shell and power a PC.
@Alshain01 killing them in the market? NVIDIA owns 80% of the ENTIRE GPU market!
Lol i kinda like that name tho Nintendo shield.
And i would like Nintendo use their old slogan in commercials 'now your playing with Power'
@HSuzumiyaVI "X1 is near Xbox one level
X2 is ps4+"
Well then Nvidia should go back to the drawing board for X2, b/c it doesn't seem different enough for a new chipset that comes out 2 years after the old one. Near X1 to PS4+ sounds like a step up in CPU speed, maybe more or faster RAM, or more GPU pipelines, not an entirely new chipset. PS3 to PS4 sounds more like reality.
@rjejr its rumoured that X2 will be powerful and potentially GTX 980 level
@Peach64 Any popular console that sells 100 moon or more will have shovel ware. PS2 has even more shovelware. Phone have even more again.
Wii also had more must own games than any other console in its generation.
@MrGawain a Tegra X2 powered NX would be as powerful or more powerful than Wii U AND be portable!! This means upcoming handheld and console games would be one in the same. How is this not a good thing? I'm excited! Shoot.. if the NX does all that AND supports Shield game streaming and/or Android TV I'll buy it on day one! I doubt it would support Android though.. it would basically compete against Nintendo published games.
@HSuzumiyaVI "its rumoured that X2"
Oh great, now we are talking about rumours of leaks? Might as well just go ask Magic 8 ball at this point. Hey Magic 8 Ball, will NX use an X1 or X2?
@ThanosReXXX Playeressence is starting to grow on me. Jet Set Ray-deeee-ooooooohhhhhhhh!!!!!!
Will NX have a 2nd screen? I know they castrated the interactive map out of Zelda Wild on Wii U but it's still there in the pause menu. I'm not playing Zelda Wild w/o a touchscreen map.
@rjejr your loss i guess, plus, this is a semicustom bid, if AMD failed on outbidding NVidia its clear X2 is going to be in the NX, as a fan doesn't help form factor...
@BiasedSonyFan i wouldn't think so... but i will repeat that we are missing a vital bit of information on the NX.
@rjejr No, the NX version of BOTW wont have a interactive map like the wii U version would, but i suspect that if you pair the gamepad with it it might work.
@rjejr Yeah he is, isn't he? Although Dave is still the most no-nonsense Nintendo related vlogger in my opinion, so I'm curious to find out what he thinks of this.
As for your comparison of X1-X2 with PS3-PS4, that is not how that works. First off, the X2 is in the same family of architecture, and the PS4 is not the same as the PS3.
Second, it's a combination of factors that makes the PS4 much more powerful than the PS3, and those are significantly different from the PS3.
You should see the X2 as a new and improved version of the older model, not as an entirely new piece of hardware. The architecture is the same, the way it works is the same and the chips are basically the same, only improved on several fronts, but not in the order of 4-5 times better, like the difference in consoles is.
The exact specs of the X2 will first be revealed next month at the Hot Chips conference, so then we can make an actual comparison, if the rumor is still applicable by then.
But I think it will be pretty safe to say that the new Tegra chip will simply double the performance of the old one, and maybe it will also add some new functionalities or effects, but don't expect a generational jump like in consoles.
@BiasedSonyFan But besides the perceived value, do you think that $400 constitutes affordable? Mind you, I myself am a firm believer of the concept that if the console offers enough, that people are willing to pay for it, but in this instance, I'm specifically looking at it from Nintendo's and Kimishima's perspective.
They have always kept prices reasonable, and from what they have said so far, the NX isn't going to be any different. And it might just be that a lot of people will think that $400 for a console/handheld that is less powerful than a PS4 just isn't worth it, so they better bring their A game and make a hell of a campaign around it, so that it's clear that come March 2017, the NX is the system to get in line for...
@Cyberbotv2 Well, probably in some shape or form, but obviously it will not be like the Wii or Wii U eShop. It will more than likely be styled according to the new website and the new console operating system, unofficially dubbed "NinOS". Other than that, it's really anybody's guess.
Or maybe EuroGamer will be able to tell us more...
@rjejr No idea about the second screen, since the controller goes into the dock when playing on the TV, and when playing on the go, you also only have one screen.
@ThanosReXXX If this thing is being sold as a handheld first, console second, then they need to keep the price down as people will expect handheld pricing. $250 is probably the ceiling.
@IceClimbers i'd say 299 is where Nintendo will head though, unless X2 was undercut for NVidia to leverage over AMD.
@ThanosReXXX SMD64 will hold on till Nintendo speaks as will Playeressance they both want a home console instead of a Handheld that may change over time, but i see the NX console as being the 2 part of a onboard GPU and HDD essentially the SCD.
@BiasedSonyFan right now, we have to wait till we get more news....
@IceClimbers I never said any different, I am the one that keeps throwing Kimishima's words in everyone's faces...
@HSuzumiyaVI Apparently they have some valid reasons to stick to their guns, so I guess all we ordinary people can do is wait to find out who is right, and in the meantime just speculate the heck out of it to keep ourselves busy...
It's official now the mad titan and the anime chick runs this comment section. My god
@BiasedSonyFan Well, considering that the base model X1 that is inside the Shield can be manufactured for less than $125, the other components such as the mold making up the total amount of the price, I can't see the X2 being that much more expensive considering it is in the same family and according to Nvidia themselves also in the same price range.
And even if it would be more expensive, it would at the most probably be somewhere around a $40 to $50 difference, because of it being newer and more powerful.
@TwilightOniAngel Well, it's kind of late over here, so the only place I'll be running to in a minute or so is my bed...
@TwilightOniAngel P.S. Nice background banner...
@TwilightOniAngel you know it n.n
@ThanosReXXX its almost noon where i am so i'll be "monitoring" this comments for at least 6 hours...
@ThanosReXXX "The exact specs of the X2 will first be revealed next month"
Oh. My. Freakin. Gawd. Now there's something else I have to wait to read about? Just kill me now.
@ThanosReXXX "when playing on the go, you also only have one screen."
Yes but that is easily faked. Do you know that the 2DS is only 1 screen w/ a piece of plastic covering the middle?
Here's a new Level 5 game side by side, 1 screen tablet, 2 screen 3DS, same thing. It's the real reason why the controllers come off the ends, so we can hold the tablet that way, it would be too awkward otherwise.
@HSuzumiyaVI Two separate console's i meant.
As a shield tablet and shield TV owner, this news makes me very excited. The shield tablet doesn't even run on an X1. It runs on a k1 and still delivers PS3 quality graphics. Rest assured, that even if the NX is running on an x1, the games are still going to look fantastic.
People in these comments are way too concerned over power, imo. The 3ds is easily my favorite console this generation. It runs console quality games in 3d and utilizing ancient tech. The games are what matter. If the library is anything as good as the 3ds, I'm golden.
I see a lot of potential with the NX, including the possibility of mobile vr (like Samsung gear vr) and 3d games. These are exciting times to be a Nintendo fan.
All Nintendo really needs to do is secure all those 3rd party developers who have been developing content for the 3ds. That will ensure a steady flow of content. While I see some multiplatform games definitely coming to the NX, I don't think a console like this would really benefit from having all the same games as PS4/XBO. Better for the NX to have it's own unique library, similar to 3ds or any other mobile console.
@HappyMaskedGuy great comment!!
Hello... Nintendo is NOT over yet.
I don't care if underpowered or not. I don't judge by ultra HD graphic.
As long there are some games like NDS or 3DS library (cute games, colorful games, girlie games, unique games, etc) that's fine for me and i like that a lot. Especially, Animal Crossing NX that will be on NX. (I still wait for further information, hopefully my wish granted).
Oh...one thing. I'm not a BOY gamer that just only interested by Violence, Mature theme, FPS, etc. I'm kind of ....GIRLIE gamer that like cute, whimsical, colorful, goofy, cheerful, relaxed, kid-friendly, family oriented games. So what ? I still enjoy my Cooking Mama games and try to play Style Savvy Fashion Forward for next upcoming game. I'm a male but interested with some girlie games, even for male player it will called that cheesy or meh.
@HSuzumiyaVI Are you a robot?
More rumblings from our Ubi insider see previous posts. It is understood that the new nintendo console is NOT using the X1 or X2 chip or parker by Nvidia. instead there are solid reports of a custom build at work. which funnily enough is code named Tegra 'Next' yes Next as in NX next!
Also there is said to be connectivity of sorts using a side read/write system. Though not sure our source is suggesting a camera or sensor system that can transfer data using radio waves. A sort of mash up of nfc Amibo and sensor bar to locate or control "other" objects.
News on that front is incredibly thin as it being being very closely guarded. But it would seem as though the new nintendo machine is a remote or several for something. Our guess is the sides could possibly become room sensors for immersive vr or at least some form of surround sound system hence the wave format.
There is more trickling through the net but very slowly. Apparently the power source isn't too cheap and they have it at about $11 alone this will not be as cheap as you think.
Lastly Ubi is working on no less than 3 games for launch 1 is a new IP of an old idea. I asked if it was something like Prince of persia and got told 'correct setting' but that was all I got.
What on earth are you talking about?
I never said "Nintendo is over" and I never said anything about the games you like to play.
Maybe you should go re-read my comment. I said the era of their consoles is coming to and end. Not their handhelds, hybrids and other devices. And it is. Their consoles have sold like crap for decades, so it makes sense they would integrate dual functionality.
As for all that rambling on about what games you like, I have no idea what you're talking about or why you're telling me. I have no problem with what you play. You like game X, Y and Z? Awesome. Good for you. Idk what am I supposed to say?
@BiasedSonyFan It might be a rarity but you're not going to tell me that if people can get something for $200 - $250, that they are going to pay $400 for it. In general and/or for the most part, people are cheap skates, myself included. If I have the money and if I think the value is there, then I'll buy it, otherwise I'll wait until it gets cheaper or comes with extra games...
@rjejr Well, if this all falls through, then you won't have to wait to watch or read anything whatsoever. Speaking of which: is it a bird? Is it a plane? No, it's SuperMetalDave64 to the rescue!!
Interesting video that you posted, and I agree. It could easily be done like that, but you do have to have a decent sized screen, so it depends on how that will turn out. Guess we'll just have to wait for the official news. Stay alive, it's just one more month...
@BensonUii interesting idea, and could theoretically be the case, except for one tiny part of information in the patent, that speaks of daisy-chaining a number of SCD's locally.
It would look very strange and would probably not be feasible, to connect multiple docks together, unless the SCD's come in different form factors. Someone in the comments section underneath the video I posted here came up with the same idea, by the way, so it is apparently an option that more people are thinking about...
@rjejr And for good measure, let's throw in PlayerEssence's follow up video:
@HSuzumiyaVI Fair enough, glad you like it.
Nvidia?! Cool! I look forward to seeing more news on this partnership.
@HSuzumiyaVI " @rjejr its rumoured that X2 will be powerful and potentially GTX 980 level"
Yeah, finding that hard to believe really.... Don't get me wrong I really hope it is but cramming the power of one of last years/seasons top GPU's into a handheld seems like wishful thinking.
Ow, i see. Sorry.
I'm excited for this. If it fails it fails.
I feel the success of the NX comes down to whether or not it's using the X1 or X2. This needs to be a system that can last 5-6 years (please please please be the X2).
@ThanosReXXX Awesome links!
It's going to be a customised chip from Nvidia. Nintendo will never use an off the shelves chip.
All these news are still unconfirmed by Nintendo, there's more than 6 months to go before NX came out. Anything can happen, the X1 chip is just a placeholder for the dev kit. Who knows? Maybe Nvidia challenged by AMD chips in PS4 and XB1 decides to make a low-power 1080 GTX for NX? They wouldn't want to lose face running against AMD on rival consoles.
@BiasedSonyFan Obviously all within reason, of course so realistic numbers. But if they can manufacture it for around $200 and as Kimishima said "will make the console affordable yet not sell at a loss" then that could be any amount from the base price to $300, so they could either break even on the hardware or make a bit of a profit, but realistically, they would never double the price, just because some consumers would be willing to pay for it. $400 simply isn't affordable, both of itself and in comparison with the competition.
Some consumers are also more than willing to pay $200 for a sealed copy of Metroid Prime Trilogy, but they are hardly representative for the average consumer...
@PlywoodStick You're more than welcome. Anything to keep the rumor/hype train going...
I call BS, I think this was just a way for Eurogamer and any bandwagoners (including NL in this case) to drive up clicks. (And boy, did it work...) Contradicts the Wall Street Journal articles (and Nintendo isn't going to feed them false info). The Tegra X2 devices will likely cost more than $300-$350 when they release, probably more like $400-500, which is outside of Nintendo's traditionally desired base price range. NVIDIA is not going to practically give away their latest system on chips to Nintendo all of a sudden to make NX a $300-350 base offering with Tegra X2.
NVIDIA has a long history of giving others the shaft on deals, price fixing, monopolistic practices, and forcing users to upgrade to new hardware to get the best performance from their newest updates- they're not as scalable to multiple pieces of hardware as AMD's updates. Doesn't match Nintendo's tech business model, it's too anti-consumer. There's other options out there for decent ARM chips.
Not to mention Tegra X1 is going to be extremely outdated by 2017, is only a 1 teraflop SoC, and does not get any use outside of NVIDIA's proprietary devices. So basically, if this is turns out to be the NX, it would be like Nintendo trying (keyword: trying) to follow in the PSP or Vita's footsteps with a relatively powerful portable console for the time, with maybe some Nintendo-esque gimmicks and mobile features tacked on. Doesn't sound like something that's worth the absurd amount of time it's remained completely hidden from public view. Not at all.
So yeah, I'm definitely going to mark Damo on his word here to bring up later, when the real deal is revealed. I don't buy this latest round of rumor mill fodder.
People trying to rationalize Nintendo using the more powerful chip. Nintendo isn't "playing with power," anymore, and I guarantee they will be using the X1 or a modified version of it. They don't play the power game, they like affordable consoles. A wii u on the go is pretty neat despite the specs not being great if you hook it up to use it like a regular console. A NX with Wii Uish power for 199.99 is a pretty good deal.
In regards to Nintendo rumors I usually suggest believing the ones about how "weak" the new Nintendo system is as Nintendo consoles lately have been very weak and time and time again, whether about their online or w.e, we've been shown Nintendo doesn't really care about what people think, they'll march to their own drum for better or worse. This way you'll be pleasantly surprised. Sure, it's a pessimistic way of looking at things but then again, Nintendo had all of one game last e3 announced and we got a few other surprises we didn't expect.
@PlywoodStick My issue with the whole rumor is that it feels so similar to the previous rumor we had regarding the NX controller. Where a picture of the controller 'leaked' and the whole internet was going crazy over it. With multiple news sites reporting on it, claiming that their sources confirmed it. Supposed leakers also confirming that it was the NX controller, and multiple sites dissecting the apparent technology that the controller will have. The only differences, in this case, are that Eurogamer started the rumor this time, and overall, they have even less evidence to back up their claims than the previous rumor.
So, I'm also unsure about this whole rumor thing.
@JpGamerGuy90 If Nintendo is going for an outdated processor circa 2017, especially an ARM processor, there's other options than just NVIDIA. That's the elephant in the room here. There's no major incentive for Nintendo to go with NVIDIA in this case.
@-Red- Well said, we should only heed the words straight from the horse's mouth in this case.
Breath of the Wild is coming to NX, so we can be sure console will be at least as powerfull as the Wii U. And I'll say it's very unlikely that Nintendo would release a new console without improving a least a bit the power of the previous one, I think it's a given that NX will have more power than Wii U.
Regarding PS4 and XBone, I think we are beyond that discussion now. We can all agree that Nintendo is not interested in competing with them. And it does not have to be interested. Their strength is in innovation.
@BiasedSonyFan I can see where you are coming from, but I keep coming back to Kimishima's official statements, and personally, I can't get past that in any logical way. The Xbox or the Playstation are irrelevant since Nintendo isn't looking at them to set a price point for their hardware.
And to reverse your statement about the X2 being revolutionary: imagine that I as a sales person in a video game store would have to explain to the customer that this console has such a high price tag because it has this newer chipset in it, which makes it groundbreaking. He or she probably wouldn't care and go for the PS4 or Xbox One since those will be reduced in price by the time the NX is released, and the price point of the NX would probably be walletbreaking for them...
And remember: the Wii U was already perceived as being too expensive for what it offered, so that is also still in the collective mind of the consumer, which is why the NX has to come out with a really great console at a really good price point to entice the crowd again to grab a Nintendo box for all (or part of) their gaming needs...
Oh man, N-Gage, the greatest portable games system to come from Finland. Also a system that requires you to remove the battery if you want to change your game cartridge. Never owned one myself but tried it. Had fun with it but also laughed about all the design choices.
Funny, it seems that we are going to get a system that is less powerful than the current gen and that is also a homeconsole portable hybrid and I´m still excited about it. Maybe it´s time to become the ultimate master race member: Nintendo & PC master race.
On the other hand, PS4 has some nice exclusives too. But if I bought that system too, I wouldn´t have time to finish those gems I own on my PS3.
@BiasedSonyFan Here's a brief explanation of why people have assumed since last year that AMD would once again be a manufacturer for the GPU (or perhaps an APU, given AMD's current direction) on Nintendo's home console component of NX:
If Nintendo wanted to match the Tegra X2's performance on the portable component of NX, while maintaining the possibility of a semi-custom system on chip, it would seem closer to their usual business and tech models to go with something like this:
If Nintendo opts to have a weaker portable component closer to the Tegra X1 in performance, they could do what they did with the 3DS and commission a Japanese company like DMP (Digital Media Professionals) for the GPU, and just use a standard ARM processor and coprocessor array for the CPU. That would probably end up being a much better deal for Nintendo than acquiescing to NVIDIA on all of their stringent demands.
Another reason that NVIDIA chips would not be used in NX is because of NVIDIA's upcoming proprietary CodeWorks for Android system. If NX is going to work with mobile titles, and uses NVIDIA's proprietary chipsets, then Nintendo would be forced to play by NVIDIA's rules for software usage and publishing with every single mobile game. Doesn't sound like something Nintendo would go along with. Neither the Eurogamer nor other bandwagon articles (like this one) acknowledge this crucial point.
@Luffymcduck We actually sold it in the Gamestation I used to work in. Which corporate idiot decided that was a good idea
@Luffymcduck @Kirk I know someone who actually bought an N-Gage. Yes. That's right. ACTUALLY owned an N-Gage. Didn't just look at it in Electronics Boutique or where ever and thought to themselves, "Well, that's... interesting." Actually... bought one.
Imagine trying to control games using the classic style phone's vertically aligned 0-9, #, and * keys... The result is exactly what you'd expect.
I´ve only played the N-Gage version of Pandemonium on the system. Numbers 5 and 7 were kinda like A & B on GBA. Those numbers are coloured in orange.
@Luffymcduck Lol, imagine trying to play Tomb Raider on that thing...
@PlywoodStick That person was probably committed to a mental hospital shortly after, I expect.
I surely don't want to be part of the "Nintendoomed" brigade, in fact I despise people who before every new generation argue that Nintendo is doomed and going down without having any clue.
"It's important to point out here that despite the "mobile" connotations Tegra isn't a processor you're likely to find in a smartphone any time soon."
That's just wrong. Tegra already exists since 2008. It has been used in a lot of Smartphones and Tablets since then.
Here is a list of only(!) the most recent devices that use Tegra and it's three pages long.
Any why are you painting Nvidia Shield as a success, when in reality it's a complete failure? No one buys that stuff. Not only have I never seen (or heard or read of) anyone who owns a Shield, it's so obscure that you won't even find it in any electronic retailer like Saturn.
And why are you hyping Nvidia Shield's graphical prowess so much when it's actually weaker than the Wii U? If I didn't know better, I would say that they paid for this endorsement (which is something Nvidia in fact does).
Just take a closer look at the comparison videos (MGR, [url=https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qm16p4qYjF4RE%[/url]) you yourself linked in the article and you will see the muddy textures in the background, you will see that it has only half the framerate of the Xbox 360 (and the Wii U is supposed to be on par with the Xbox 360), and just an overall impression of outdatedness... it looks like a mobile game, not a console game.
I'm not someone who believes in the mantra of "the next generation has to be more powerful", I already had my suspicions that NX would be on the same graphical level as the Wii U because of a few statements of Nintendo officials (it's not the predecessor, Zelda: BotW looking the same on NX etc), but using Tegra would be a step backwards.
And since when do we take rumours as straight facts? You claim they are watertight but you provide no proof. There is no official announcement of a partnership between Nintendo and Nvidia and yet you present it as if it was already confirmed. Just look at your headline.
I'm sorry, but this whole article sounds like a big ad for a product that is evidently a big failure. I'm really disappointed with the lack of journalistic standards shown here. I just really hope that these rumours are false as they always are.
@shani That's right. Nvidia paid for every word of this feature. I'm writing this comment from the driving seat of my gold-plated, Nvidia-branded Ferrari.
MGR looks less than great because the port wasn't fantastic AND it's having to run through the Android OS layer. Coding directly to the metal would give much, much better performance, and if NX uses X2 as some think, then performance will be even better.
Regarding Tegra, none of the X series has been used in a phone - just tablets and set top boxes due to power demands.
And Shield is a failure purely cos you don't know anyone who owns one? I know several people who do, so does that mean it's a success? I doubt Nvidia would keep producing these devices if they were losing money, and besides that, the whole range is the company's way of putting itself in a shop window to tout for business, which it would seem has worked.
When we report on rumours we always make sure we list the source if it hasn't been verified by ourselves personally. In this case I've been able to verify the report with several different people, and I'm 100% sure it's legit.
Let's talk again later this year and if I'm wrong, I'm wrong.
@Kirk Nope, but he developed a strange fondness for throwing knives, breaking benches in half with his BMX bike, and other sorts of... destructive habits. And he was my childhood friend. So it didn't take long to connect the dots.
The nvidia x1 is a placeholder. Why does no one pay attention to the past?? Before the 3ds came out eurogamer reported the EXACT SAME THING about the 3ds. Their trusted "sources" told them the dev kits had x1 in them, and we all know that didnt turn out to be true. Same site, same scenario, same likelihood that this is real. Its a placeholder. AMD has in recent investor briefings said they have secured 3 semi custom design wins. We know for sure ps4neo is one of them. Scorpio is probably number 2, and in my mind, without a doubt NX is number 3. Nvidia has not recently posted any profits or forcasts that suggest they are about to start churning out millions of X1's or even X2's for Nintendo. First off if they were, they would have to be semi custom, because Nintendo isnt just going to drop the consumer chip into their hardware. And secondly this is THE SAME SITE THAT MADE THE SAME MISTAKE before the 3ds launched! They literally thought the x1 would be the chip in the 3ds. Why did they think that? Because it was a placeholder in the dev kits, and the devs spilled the beans to "trusted sources". This rumor means nothing. And all these sites reporting it as fact instead of a rumor are going to look pretty stupid in a few months. But hey, that didnt stop eurogamer the first time, and nobody seems to remember they were wrong before about the 3ds. History always repeats itself.
@DarthKlarc AMD first announced their third semi-custom design win last year:
But then again, AMD also stated that the third win would extend beyond gaming, whatever that means:
So yeah, we'll see what happens, but I agree with what you're saying.
@Damo: Ok just to be clear, I didn't mean you actually have been paid (otherwise I would've left the "if I didn't know better" part out), I just meant the overly enthousiastic tone of the article comes across as if it were sponsored (and sadly, there are reports that Nivida uses dirty tricks like paying companies and developers to drop AMD support, for example - so sadly, paying for positive articles doesn't seem that far fetched). But I like that you responded to that with irony - it shows that you definitely have not been paid by anyone else - and it made me smile.
Ok, you meant the X series, I didn't know. In the article - and the sentence I quoted - you just said Tegra. And that's what I meant you were wrong about - that Tegra (not the Tegra X series specifically) isn't widely used in smartphones and tablets.
You can still be right about everything else, of course.
It's true that coding directly to the chip, without the OS layer, does increase performance. And yes, X2 is probably better than X1. That might all be true. But it's still a mobile graphics processor. Whatever they do, X2 will still be a small chip that can never come close to what a PC or dedicated console can do.
Of course I didn't mean that Shield is a failure because I don't know anyone who owns one. That would be silly, I'd never do that.
But what I did mean - and I'm already someone who knows and spots new devices and tech trends a lot earlier than others - is that you don't see it on the streets, like you see Smartphones and 3DSs on the streets. It's not established in the mainstream. Ask anyone on the street and they don't know what it is. You don't see it on the stores. No tech site constantly writes about it. And they would, if it was a big success. it just doesn't generate enough buzz as a niche product (and trust me, I know about niche products, I often used certain technologies before they were established).
At this point, Nvidia Shield is even less known than the Wii U. And the Wii U is already a niche product, many people still don't know what a Wii U is or that it exists.
And about the rumours: No, I trust you when you say it's legit, I'd just like to see the proof.
I'm not totally against everything what you wrote in the article, I just don't understand the enthousiasm for Nvidia Shield and Tegra. I would've expected a more critical article about their weaknesses. Because the track record of Shield and Tegra is not so great so far. Tegra X2 would have to take a galactic step forward to change that.
@BiasedSonyFan If the other consoles offer more games and are cheaper, then they will still be a viable option, like it or not. And taking into account Nintendo's third party woes, that may well become a thing. What I'm trying to get you to see is that the majority of the people buying consoles won't give a damn about the number of TFlops or if it's X1 or X2. They just want a nice game console with a good selection of games that is affordable or good value for money. That is basically all I am saying.
As for the price point they agreed upon with Nintendo: it's been rumored that the executive management ordered a team of representatives to go out and win a console bid after Nvidia's loss of previous gen console orders for the GPU's. They had to win at ANY cost, and that kind of coincides with this article:
I didn't post the original article, since that requires you to subscribe.
@DarthKlarc Nobody, really? I'm hurt...
I even posted the evidence of what you're saying here.
@ThanosReXXX So this information was originally "leaked" through a random speculative tech blog, coming from a post that's only accessible to subscribers:
And that site is a division of:
Their disclaimer on the NX/Tegra post: "Charlie Demerjian and Stone Arch Networking Services, Inc. have no consulting relationships, investment relationships, or hold any investment positions with any of the companies mentioned in this report."
A random company of 1-5 employees in Minneapolis, MN gaining secrets to Nintendo's upcoming tech choices, while having "no relationship" with them? Hah... Sounds REALLY fishy to me.
Well, even giving them a slight benefit of the doubt, that would be pretty uncharacteristic of NVIDIA's current direction. Their current plans are aimed solely towards enthusiast markets, not the mainstream markets that Nintendo targets. Conversely, AMD is mostly targeting the mainstream market at the moment, which aligns more with Nintendo's business strategy.
NVIDIA is not going to practically give away their Tegra X2 chips, which are likely to be used in $400-500 devices. They're not going to practically throw away resources just to get an in with Nintendo. If the NX's portable component has specs closer to Tegra X1, it would be more to Nintendo's benefit to just do what they did with the 3DS: use standard ARM chips along with a GPU from a lesser known company like DMP (Digital Media Professionals) instead of a giant like NVIDIA.
I can't see NVIDIA's proprietary CodeWorks development platform meshing well with Nintendo, either. Nintendo didn't give in to the terms of EA's Origin, and I don't think Nintendo would give in to the terms of NVIDIA's Codeworks either. AMD doesn't require servitude to a proprietary platform, making them a more friendly partner for console manufacturers.
@ThanosReXXX okay so a few ppl in all of this traffic. What the fugh ever. A few people arent loud enough to be heard over all this nonsense. Why are all these sites reporting this as fact? I dont get it. They are usually pretty critical of rumors. Damo says he has confirmed with multiple sources but they could all just think its an x1 or x2 because it IS in the dev kits, but not the final product. I just can't believe Nintendo is stupid enough to call 2 already used ideas by other companies "a new way to play" and "a complete departure from the Wii U". This HAS to be bullpoop. Theres just no way Nintendo would contradict themselves that badly. Or is there?
@DarthKlarc - please stick to the site rules and avoid using profanity. Thanks.
@PlywoodStick Hey man, don't shoot the messenger. I know full well that it is just a rumor, so it is not like I posted my own opinion here. I also explicitly stated that.
But beside that point, don't think that these things don't happen. Let's just for argument's sake suppose that this is indeed true:
Console bids cost A LOT of time and money, and if you're in, then you can earn A LOT of money, so you could imagine Nvidia losing A LOT of money when they were turned down for the next generation by Sony and/or Microsoft because they chose to go with another party.
That would certainly make any manager worry about his companies extra income going south, so that would certainly have put some stress on certain people to try and get some of that revenue back. If taking a hit on the wallet first is what it takes to get back in, then you can bet your @ss that 9 out of 10 companies are fully willing and able to take that collateral damage because they understand that the long term return on investment will be far greater than this hit they will have to take initially. So what it basically is, is an investment for the future. And if that is to the satisfaction of both parties, then that partnership could also extend into the next generations of consoles to come.
Obviously, this is just a theoretical example, but it definitely isn't outside of the realm of possibilities.
The price of the devices the X2 is going to be used in, says nothing about the X2 itself, which according to Nvidia itself, is going to be more or less in the same price range as the X1, so if Nintendo could get a deal for the X1, then they could also get a deal for the X2. But in the end it's all rumors and theory, a GAME theory...
@DarthKlarc The hell if I know, man. I agree with you but since Nintendo is still keeping it quiet, we can do nothing but sit through what will probably be yet another month of rumors before we finally get to the official reveal in September. And here's hoping it's going to be the beginning of September, not the end...
@PlywoodStick That site is not the source these reports, I know that because I've spoken to the guys at Eurogamer AND other high-level sources.
But please do "mark" me on my word "to bring up later, when the real deal is revealed".
@shani Plenty of tech sites have covered the Shield range - it's just gaming sites that have ignored it. Check out the big tech / mobile sites and it's pretty clear that tech-heads know the brand and know the devices (and probably own one). The Shield TV has widely been recommended by several sites as the best Android set-top box on the market. What you have to keep in mind here is that the competition in this sector is massive - you don't get console-like sales from these devices - so the expectations are much lower when it comes to what's a success and what isn't. Nvidia has said several times that the Shield range has sold better than they expected, but their projections will surely be quite low as the marketplace for these things is swamped right now.
But we're getting away from the point here - the Shield range was never supposed to be the next iPad / PS4 / DS. Nvidia is in the business of making chips and the Shield project is a way of showcasing the power of their tech. Clearly Nintendo is impressed enough to take the plunge.
@Damo Thanks, I'll look it up on some tech sites. I didn't know the market situation that well though and I definitely didn't know that Nvidia had such low expectation themselves, that puts it into a different perspective. I'm also sure they'll make more money with conventional graphics cards in the foreseeable future.
I always considered Nvida shield and those set-top-boxes to be marketed towards casual gamers/users. Not that I have anything against casual gamers or users, I'm just not one myself and therefore don't like the oversimplified approach that much, I prefer the exact opposite.
When I see those Android set-top-boxes, my first thought is "I can do that with a Smartphone (+ Bluetooth Peripherals and a TV-Out-cable) or a Rasberry Pie (or a PC or Laptop with a Steam Controller or a Wii U...)".
I don't mind setting things up and spending time with the configuration. I like it complicated.
But I'm aware that's not the mainstream user and I acknowledge that casual users have other demands (from my experience with friends, relatives). It's generally a good thing, because it makes technology more accessible to everyone, as long as it doesn't dumb down things too much.
I'm looking forward to what Nintendo (an apparently, Nvidia) has in store for us, as long as it's accessible and still very enjoyable for me (e.g. as the Wii was) and not emulating the gaming sector on smart devices I'm ok with it.
@Damo I was just referring to the NeoGAF post's source that T-ReXXX linked. As others have said, Eurogamer pulled this same stunt before. They claimed to have "reliable, high level sources" which "confirmed" that the 3DS would use NVIDIA Tegra... And then we learned the real specs. It's a tired, recycled tall tale at this point. Fool me once, shame on you. Fool me twice, shame on me.
@ThanosReXXX No harm meant, that was just my way of reading into it...
I just don't see NVIDIA, a giant, putting themselves into a position of weakness just to eke out a business relationship with Nintendo, who they are practically never associated with. Not to mention, they would turn around and make all kinds of demands through GameWorks for Nintendo to follow, which I doubt Nintendo is keen on.
Some people buy phones outright, but not all. Plans and contracts are still preferred by most end users, particularly when that deal ends with a new phone.
You had my interest until the part about 12 to 18 month cycles.
Texting, calling, instant access to social media.
The NX won't have these things.
Nintendo has shortchanged gamers with media options for 4 generations now.
Tons of things need to change for Nintendo before gamers would ever invest in their devices the way they invest in iPhones.
Benchmarks don't tell the whole story. Any "tech-head" familiar with Android would tell you that. Or at least most of them. I have a Shield Portable, and while I still love it, my old Nexus 5's Snapdragon 800 (stolen) still beats it in performance. NVIDIA's chips are usually pretty good aside from their heating issues, but they aren't an insurmountable wall for everyone else.
@diwdiws @akaDv8R I was specifically referring to the console market. Nvidia owns 0% of GPU's there (unless you count SHIELD, but I don't). No one is arguing their abilities in the PC market, that market has no bearing on consoles, so why would I be discussing it here?
Actually, it was Eurogamer / Digital Foundry which debunked the Tegra / 3DS report:
The Italian arm of Eurogamer appears to have reported on the original report:
If fact, it seems that all EG ever did was report on the Tegra rumour, not actually claim it was 100% fact:
@johnodaz well, as for the handheld the Nvidia chip is tegra based what people might not have noticed is THIS
this was posted about 2 days after the Semiaccurate Paid subscription fiasco with NVidia gaining a win with Nintendo.
well this lost article claims the "NVIDIA Tegra processor" EG thought was an X1 is infact "PASCAL BASED" in fact, ArcadeGirl64 (Emily Rogers) is seen tweeting with a user that claims Pascal Tegra.
so all those who like POWER!! and efficiency the chips are State of the art just might not be X2 but likely a variant... considering this is 16NM.
@BiasedSonyFan Yeah, guess we'll just going to have to wait and see, but most people really don't care about the innards of a console, or any device for that matter, as long as it does what they expect it to do, and a little bit more to bring a satisfied smile to their face.
It is exactly how I sell my products and services and it simply works, so although it is my opinion, it is also from experience. Only the dedicated gamers care about the numbers, and these you find here. The other types of buyers probably also won't bother signing up to a game related web site...
@Damo Wouldn't call that debunking: they just reported on what others had already found out. And the article you linked to is the EXACT article that so confidently states that Nvidia will provide the hardware for the NX, not in theory (although the headline says so) but as if it was all but confirmed. And it certainly wasn't the Italian arm of EuroGamer either.
"Both Sony and Nintendo are deep in development on a new wave of handheld devices that look set to deliver a substantial amount of gaming power in a pocket-sized form factor.
Speaking under conditions of anonymity, further credible sources from within the mobile graphics industry have provided Digital Foundry with further background detail on the raw technical capabilities of the new hardware. These sources, intimately involved with the alliances and deal-making within their sector, effectively confirm the reported allegiances between Nintendo/NVIDIA and Sony/IMG, but also provide a fascinating insight into the kinds of devices the new handhelds will be, and the power levels we can expect."
"Assuming a late 2010 rollout for the new machine, it's fairly easy to peg which iteration of the chipset will find its way into the DS successor's make-up: Tegra 2 will be well into production, and looks like a very useful piece of mobile 3D technology.
So, how does the Tegra 2 we expect to see in the new Nintendo handheld stack up? Let's just say that it is a significant improvement, and a colossal jump in performance compared to the current DS.
Regardless, there's no doubt that the new Nintendo unit will have a useful graphical power boost over what's been seen in the currently available Tegra devices
What is also important to point out is that NVIDIA is effectively licensing its Tegra IP to Nintendo and the platform holder is free to adapt it in any way it sees fit."
They just made a rather big mistake, and they quietly backpedaled, without acknowledging their blunder. They just wrote another article stating it isn't Nvidia, as if they themselves have never speculated that it was, so they just ignored their own errors. It's pretty obvious.
@HSuzumiyaVI sounds good have too wait till its revealed too see what its all about. I am more bummed out its a handheld come console rather than home console come handheld but that's minor details tho.
The games at release will sell or sink the NX. And Zelda won't sell it if it can be played on the Wii U as well.
This is all still conjecture. As @ThanosReXXX so eloquently put it, the devil is in the details. Not to mention, I just cannot see Nintendo be willing to abide by NVIDIA's proprietary Codeworks platform. It gives too much power to NVIDIA to really be seen outside of the PC space, especially now that the Shield line is dead.
Edit: oops, old article
@PlywoodStick Old article indeed...
I had to check twice if I saw the date right, and then I thought: "wow, he must REALLY have a backlog of unread articles if he is still commenting in this one".
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