Virtual Console Reviews - Best of 2008

Woot SMRPG deserved this!
Other than that, I found this to be a bad year for VC in terms of first party.

Super Street Fighter II should be on here. That was all I got aside from SMRPG. Pathetic year for virtual console.

Sweet list you got there. At least one game that I own, and two that I really want to own! I don't quite agree with #1 and #5(would've knocked them off and bumped the rest up, adding on Super Street Fighter II and Samurai Shodown II), but hey, we all have our own opinions. For me, this was a pretty great year!

Nice list, even though it's a little short. Still eons better than Wiifanboy's.

Don't worry. This was just a year end wrap up. We'll have more Top 10 lists in 2009.

I don't agree with anyone who thinks this was a bad year for the virtual console, but I do agree that this is a bad top-5 list.

I'd have to keep the first and the last place games from your list Corbie. But I'd swap out the heart of the list:

5. Samurai Showdown II (While Secret of Mana probably belongs here, I'll avoid loading up on RPGs and it seems like a great fighter ought to be in the mix somewhere......... probably as Corbie felt a great shooter needed to be in the list )
4. Phantasy Star IV
3. River City Ransom
2. Super Mario RPG
1. Mega Man 2 (I was extremely tempted to also put SupMarRPG here too, but I'll go this way just to be different, yet I'd say equally true)

I'd like to have pushed Super Dodge Ball into one of those slots, but I'm afraid I can only let my partiality run away with me so far.

But in contrast to the highlights, I'd also like to state something I just noticed a little bit earlier....... this was also the year that the limited number of game release slots were filled by TWO Sonic the Hedgehog 1s and TWO Sonic the Hedgehog 2s........ .....with many other important games not even having a SINGLE release yet.

@Captain_Konami

Oh yeah, Super Dodge Ball, that was it! Screw Street Fighter, I would've put Super Dodge Ball on that list, probably #4 or #5.

I'm glad to see Star Parodier on the list because it was by far my favorite downloadable game this year. The list seems pretty fine too (since I'm looking to possibly buying Lords of Thunder), but I would have to strongly disagree with SMRPG possibly being the best VC game. It was good, but nowhere near deserving of that title. Oh well, lists and lists, and lists are arguable.

Hmm, looking at this past year, overall my best games would be LostWinds, Orbient, Bomberman Blast, Kirby 64, and Star Parodier.

@Mickeymac:
Heh. It does have that pure simple fun value. I guess I could pretend it's a fighter and plug it in in place of Samurai Showdown II. I mean after all it does have people beating each other into another incarnation by knocking them into walls, uppercutting them into the sky, and smacking them around the world.

@Captain_Konami

Yeah, it is a ton of mindless fun, but I'd say leave Samurai Shodown on there, it deserves it - one of the best fighters I've ever played, although I'll admit, I haven't played the VC version.

Is this a hybrid consortium commune generated list from among VC Reviews folks, Corbie?

You oughta post your list as well then, down here in the free for all rabble posting section.

@Corbie

Yeah, if it was your list, Phantasy Star IV, Lords of Thunder, and Star Parodier would've been a little higher. And Doremi Fantasy...actually, I'm a little surprised to hear that this isn't your list. Now you got me curious: what would your top 5(or 10) be?

Where's Secret of Mana!?!? =O

It's worth noting that I did have some say in what was on this VC-Reviews Best of 2008 list. Okay this would probably be my own personal Best of 2008 VC list...

1. Lords of Thunder
2. Star Parodier
3. Super Fantasy Zone
4. Metal Slug
5. Samurai Shodown II

@Corbie

Wow, I am a little surprised by your list. Sort of - I new from your previous posts that you really liked Lord of Thunder, Star Parodier and Samurai Shodown 2, but I didn't quite realize you liked Metal Slug and Super Fantasy Zone so much. Now I want Super Fantasy Zone even more!

Super Fantasy Zone is one of those imports I bought on a whim years ago and fell in love with. It's a simple shooter, but it's quite challenging and a nice change of pace from the standard shooters out there. In fact, other than Panorama Cotton, it's one of my favorite Mega Drive imports I own.

As for Metal Slug, I've always loved that game. It was actually the first game I bought for my Neo Geo Candy cabinet when I first bought it 8 years ago. Ahhh the memories.

@Corbie

Yeah, I can understand that. I've never played Metal Slug 1, but I did try the third game in the series, and it was pretty fun. I would've bought it too, but I didn't like how I needed a vehicle during a boss fight, yet once the vehicle was destroyed, I was dead in the water, since the vehicle never respawned, and the main character was too slow to get away from the boss.

Also, I've played games that imitated Metal Slug gameplay-wise, and they were all pretty good, soooo, I guess Metal Slug is pretty damn good.

Wow! I only have 1/5 (SMRPG). I'll have to try some of those other games after I clear some of the games from my holiday collection. Time to get jiggy with it and see if anyone can guess which game I'm clearing off the list first. There's a hint...

@Corbie - I got my 360 and downloaded Ikaruga, and it is difficult! I've enjoyed the first level, though; I've tried to beat it a few times, and I've died at the final boss (I think) every time. I'll keep trying, though. Maybe I can find another shooter that's a little easier on XBLA or maybe that Thunder game on the list (forgot if it's Lords or Gate). Any easy-ish recommendations? I suppose I could always just muscle through Ikaruga like I have through several Mega Mans (which I've found are comparitively as difficult, at least so far... lots of trial and error).

@Clayfrd

I recommend Alien Hominid HD, 1942: Joint Strike, Assault Heroes, and Aegis Wing. To be honest with you, none of the XBLA shooters are really all that easy, but since you were able to get to the last level of Ikaruga(there are 6 levels), those games should be a cakewalk in comparison. Except for Alien Hominid, but I recommend it anyways, since it's awesome. Actually, it's not that hard, but it certainly isn't a cakewalk, even in comparison to Ikaruga.

On the VC, I recommend Star Parodier and R-Type III, since they're easier, but not too easy. I haven't played Lord of Thunder(will as soon as bro gets off the 360), nor Gate of Thunder, so I can't tell you how easy they are, but from what I've heard, neither of them are that easy.

Trigger Heart Exelica is a fairly easy shooter on the XBLA. As for VC shooters, Lords of Thunder and Gate of Thunder are both quite easy on their normal difficulty settings.

I'm about to buy a Japanese Xbox 360 console due to the large number of Cave shooters coming to the console this year. Might save me some money and keep me from having to spend $1700 on a DeathSmiles arcade PCB.

As the article gives me free reign to be condescending, I will do so:
Why is there only ONE game on this list that deserves to be there? Yes, I'm feeling abnormally self-righteous as I type this, but the lack of Secret of Mana on this list seems entirely inexcusable! I'll moreso forgive the lack of StarTropics, since people don't seem to realize how great those games are in general. I shall now give my top five list, which I'm sure NOBODY here will agree with:

1. Super Mario RPG The only thing this article's list got right, as I'd easily call it the game to get if you were for some odd reason forced to choose ONE VC game to get for life (and shame on the jerkwad forcing you so to do!).
2. Secret of Mana A classic action RPG, and far and away the best game in the series (that's been released in America, anyway, no claims on SoM 2 or whatever Japanese 3). A highly noteworthy release from Squenix, and HOPEFULLY a sign of more classics to come.
3 & 4. StarTropics & Zoda's Revenge I can't really decide which fits in which place, so I list them strangely instead. Obviously, I'm just a crazed fan of the games, but this is MY list, so nyeh.
5. Kirby 64: The Crystal Shards A classic, and one of my favorite N64 games ever. I love the power combining mechanic, and the music is GREAT!

So as I said, this list will no doubt be VERY unpopular. Oh, well. I'm feeling snarky tonight, so what I say is what I say. At least I thought of Kirby 64 for this list. Originally, I'd put Clu Clu Land in that space until I could find something better on the games list.

@Corbie

I forgot about Trigger Heart Exelica, and no wonder why: I blazed through the demo, and I suck at shooters!

@Stuffgamer1

Super Dodge Ball.

What in the world?
I don't like this one either. lol
I guess I'll make my own.

5.) DoReMi Fantasy
4.) Star Parodier
3.) Star Tropics
2.) Mega Man 2
1.) Secret of Mana

@AlexSays

Wait, StarTropics came out this year? Well, then I guess my list is as follows:

5. Super Dodge Ball
4. StarTropics
3. DoReMi Fantasy
2. Lord of Thunder
1. Star Parodier(best damn shooter I ever played)

Honorable Mentions:

Super Street Fighter II: The New Challengers (got me into fighters).
Samurai Shodown 2(played the Xbox version, which, oddly enough was identical to the VC version, and it was absolutely magnificant, one of the best fighters I've ever played!)

I downloaded Star Parodier, SMRPG, and DoReMi fantasy the day each was released - and I don't do that often

Okay, I downloaded Lords of Thunder, and it took almost 15 minutes! longest download I ever ran into - even Sin & Punishment didn't take nearly as long. Oh well, I play it in the morning.

I think Star Parodier was great!
I own three of those 5, but I guess I won't download the other two.

Interseting selections for 2008, though mine would look more like this:

1 - Secret of Mana (how did THAT evade the list?!)
2 - Ys I & II
3 - DoReMi, like you guys said
4 - Phantasy Star 4
5 - Mega Man 3

I'm hoping that 2009 would blow the stocks off this year in more ways than one - happy new year

Add me to the list of people surprised by the lack of Secret of Mana! Especially with the overhyped Super Mario RPG sneaking into number one.

I'm still waiting for the first Phantasy Star; come on Nintendo/Sega!

my top 5 games this yr not in order
splatterhouse 2
earthworm jim
double dragon
vectorman
mario rpg
HAPPY AND HEALTHY NEW YEARS EVERYBODY!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

how bout top 5 worst games for 2008
donkey kong 3
operation wolf
kings knight
enduro racer
space invaders the game

Not having the nostalgia for Super Mario RPG, I didn't think too much of it. Sure its great but it also seems very short, basic and lacks depth. All of which is found in my personal favourite game of 2008, Secret of Mana. Might get PSIV on a collection next year.

Would have to disagree strongly that Mario RPG is "the best VC release period". Even as a European who appreciates getting to play it for the first time I can see that its a quite basic RPG that while laying the groundworks for what was to come doesn't do anything special by todays standards.
Although I havn't downloaded it yet due to a large backlog I'm also suprised Mana didn't feature.
Top marks to DoReMi though, this is exactly what the VC should be bringing us games few of us know about that are hidden gems. Got it for my secret santa (thanks Tull) and I don't think I've played such a creative and genuinlly original and intersting platformer since Super Mario World.
My biggest dissapointment of the VC 2008 has been Sega's VC team still churning out those awful 50hz bordered PAL conversions.
It means I'll continue to avoid buying megadrive games in 2009 wherever possible. A shame as , with it being a machine I never owned it could have become my favorite VC machine. Same with the Neo Geo.
Runner up for bad news has to be Hudson planning to abandon the VC. The TG16 has been one of my most enjoyed VC channels due to running 60hz and having a catalogue of titles that were practically all new to my eyes.

@Kelvin, #30: You're my new best friend.
Seriously though, SMRPG was fun for its time, but how it overshadowed SoM is something that heavily surprised me. I can't go wrong with the staff's selection of shooters though, though whether we disregard those or not depends on one's passion for the genre.

I agree with that. Too many shooters made the list here. But knowing how you guys are it didn't shock me too much.

My biggest dissapointment of the VC 2008 has been Sega's VC team still churning out those awful 50hz bordered PAL conversions.

As it once was, so shall it continue to be. They were like that originally so thats what we get.

So glad to see Lords of Thunder get some props and make this list. It deserves to be there. I would also throw in Mega Man 3

Hm... Pretty good general top-5 list. It's a slow day today at work, so here's mine

Top 5 :
5 : River City Ransom
4 : Mega Man II
3 : Startropics
2 : Phantasy Star II
1 : Secret of Mana

Low 5 :
5 : Operation Wolf
4 : King of Monsters
3 : Donkey Kong 3
2 : Boogerman
1 : Space Invaders

@39, Kultist

What's so bad about King of the Monsters?

The weird thing is that Star Parodier, though being one of the best 5, has a bad first impression. Most gamers want a super-cool and destructive battleship that oblitherates demoic aliens, not some cutesy kid's shooter. (No, I am not bashing Sstar Parodier; I did not even play the game. I was just taking some guess.)

In Puerto Rico, kids get gifts in Epiphany. When I asked my other brother what Virtual Console game (Wii Shop games are the most affordable ones) he wanted for Epiphany, he replied with Super Mario RPG. Keke...
(By the way, I already have 1,500 Wii Points to buy Final Fantasy Crystal Chronicles: My Life as a King as an Epiphany present to my other brother. I just hope I can get a Wii Points Card in time...)

As it once was, so shall it continue to be. They were like that originally so thats what we get.
Its still stupid and utterly pointless. Especilly when you consider that many SEGA VC titles are seen on retro compilations that can run in 60Hz...the VC costs lots of money per title (30 games for $30 or 1 game for $8) so it needs to deliver and well...it isn't.

As for games. Mega Man is a word that comes to mind. Possibly Secret of Mana but it is a tad glitchy and has that first gen SNES fuglyness to it I guess I would throw Super Mario RPG out of the list (Paper Mario is the better Mario RPG by far), move everything up by one and put a Mega Man game there.

@marktheshark
Bah, never liked King of Monsters back then, I tought it was a rather bad fighter. It was fun trashing buildings for about 3 minutes, then it got old. Not enough characters and not enough moves made a bad button masher IMO.

@Mickeymac: I know nothing about Super Dodge Ball whatsoever, but it hardly sounds like something I'd download. In my experience, Dodge Ball video games always SUCK! Like I said, that list was simply my point of view. For some odd reason, I was expecting a larger backlash than I got for it, really. Meh. shrugs

VERY good list Corbie and the rest of the staff
Replace Lords with MM and I agree 100%

I'm suprised by the lack of SoM, but I cant say Im dissappointed. Im not a SoM fan.

My list would be:
5 - Sonic The Hedgehog 2 (Master System) - Just because it is hard.
4 - Metal Slug 2 (NeoGeo) - Minus the 'not much' slowdown, my favourite Metal Slug game, next to Metal Slug X.
3 - Super Mario RPG (SNES) - I'm not the greatest RPG fan but Super Mario RPG is one of the greatest RPGs I've played. The timing system makes battle more fun!
2 - Puyo Puyo 2: Tsuu (Mega Drive) - One of my favourite puzzle series and I was so happy to buy the Japan only sequel.
1 - Earthworm Jim(Mega Drive) - Groovy! It might not be the best game in the world but it is good just for being a funny game to play. Plus it's a freaking worm in a space suit you play as!

"feel free to be as pithy and condescending as you'd like to be. We can take it."

<cracks knuckles>

Game of the year features are always fun. Most of the games I download are new to me--sort of "new-old" experiences--so it's kind of strange to see comparisons to what I got around to in their times to a couple of imports.

I visited PSIV briefly, lately, and man, the translation--in all of its cheesy, grammatically-challenged glory of the time--manages to be endearing. And how could you not get hooked in the prologue that beings "Somewhere in space . . ." (man, does that narrow-down the general location)? Really, the story is excellent, especially with all the ties to the previous games, quite possibly the best example of a continuous storyline across multiple RPGs. Yet again, the battle system is rather disposable, but good "dungeon" designs.

I'm kind of surprised to find out that somebody out there likes Super Mario RPG even more than I do! The best game on the Virtual Console? That's saying an awful lot. The other four I would somewhat consider underdogs, and seeing Star Parodier here is giving me a tiny push toward getting it (the only one of the five I don't have).

My Mega Man "bias" is through the roof (though in my mind, I think I can make strong cases for them), as MM2 is pretty much my favorite game ever, with 1 and 3 not too terribly far behind. But as for the downloads that were new experiences to me this year (without trying to strain my brain to compare them with decade-old ones):

(1) Ys Book I & II (by about a mile)
(2) Lords of Thunder
(3) DoReMi Fantasy
(4) Bio Miracle
(5) Mega Turrican (strangely, I enjoy this more than Super Turrican)

Old ones:

(1) Mega Man 2
(2) Mega Man 3
(3) Super Mario RPG
(4) Mega Man
(5) Phantasy Star 2

I have 3 of these already and was already planning on getting the other two. Cool! Can't wait to see what we'll get next year

I like GofT more, but whatever

Gate of Thunder came out in 2007.

Great to see DoReMi Fantasy on that list =).

Actually i own 3 of them, but like "Sharecrow" i was already planning to get the other two.

Great year and great VC-games. I hope that next year will be even better.
My Top 8 (PAL Games):
1. Phantasy Star IV: The End of Millenium
2. Ys Book I & II
3. Secret of Mana
4. Mega Man 3
5. Super Mario RPG: Legend of Seven Stars
6. Castlevania III: Dracula's Curse
7. Shining Force II: Ancient Sealing
8. Phantasy Star II

@ Bass X0
"As it once was, so shall it continue to be. They were like that originally so thats what we get"

Then how do you account for the fact that SNES and the majority of N64 games have been fully or partially optimised. Honestly, don't be so accepting of the crud they try to give you.

I don't mind admitting that I've given up on the VC as ever being what it was made out to be. I really wanted to be able to get rid of all my carts (not to mention playing games on a modded xbox emulator) and have the games handily available on the Wii but the memory issues, PAL conversions, interface and generally slow release schedule are making me give up on it. I'll still pick up the odd hard to find, otherwise expensive game but it's back to ebay and the orignal carts with a 60hz switched SNES for me from now on.
Somehow I don't think I'm going to regret it.

Boo, SMRPG is lame:(
If SMRPG got first Boogerman should've got 2nd since it comes close to SMRPGs mediocrity.

Top 5 VC games:
5: Mega Man 2
4: Secret of Mana
3: Ys Book 1 and 2
2: Mega Man 3
1: Super Mario RPG

@bahumut zero
love your avatar man! Geno was such a badass in SMRPG lol

DoReMi deserves more attention. It is by far one of the best platformers on VC.

uh how and why? theres so many better platformers on the VC than that!

GRAMMAR/SP NAZI: it says "combing" instead of "Combining" in the Lords of Thunder section.

@shadows262

But none of them are as unique and charming as DoReMi Fantasy, plus, it does have some solid gameplay and great level design. Really, there isn't anything negative I could say about it. If you ask me, it's the best platformer on there.

@mickeymac

uh i dont know bout that, actually i think the sonic the hedgehogs beat that by a mile when in comes to uniqueness, charming, solid gameplay, and level design. And same here on there isnt thing really anything bad to say.

0/5 for me!

I never have any wii points most of the year anyway

@shadows262: Thanks. Geno is awsome. If only he was in Brawl, that would get him the attention he needs. I read somewhere that next to Sonic though, he was second most wanted character. Maybe Square-Enix wouldn't allow it?

@Digiki: You're just askin for it aren't you cracks knuckles

Also, has Vc-Reviews done a Top 10 for 07 and earlier? If so can somebody link it to me, I want to see the winners.

@Mickeymac. I haven't played Doremi, but there's NO FREAKIN' WAY it's better than Super Mario World.

I say once again, good list! It should've been a top 10 though, as there was a lot of awesome games released this year, despite what many have said.
Sadly, I only have 2 of these games: SMRPG and PSIV on the Genny Collection. The other 3 games are top priorities for me, so I'll be saving my points!

Digiki. SMRPG REALLY ISN'T THAT BAD!!

Also, Happy New Year, everybody!

for me ......
5.castlevania 3 dracs curse
4.super mario rpg
3.ys 1 & 2
2.phantasy star 4
1.secret of mana
......happy new year

pokemon puzzle was cool 2.......cloysteeersss

@Ricardo91

Opinions are opinions, and in my opinion DoReMi Fantasy is better. No by much, mind you, but still, it's better. However, It's only #1 until Sonic & Knuckles gets here.

In other news, I just played Lords of Thunder, and it is absolutely magnificant!

i prefer super mario world to do re mi. but both are cool

@Rexy, you're welcome!
@DigiK, I think Super Mario RPG is certainly better than "lame", but it's acquired something of a legendary status over the years which I think makes people rate it higher than the game itself deserves. It should have been brilliant, but it was just plain good. A solid four-star game, but nothing more, and certainly not one of the best of 2008.

SMRPG is amazing. I loved Paper Mario , and I was expecting the same thing in SMRPG. But I loved the fact that it was more like a traditional RPG (ex. ALL your stats level up each time). Even though I played PM first, SMRPG was uber.

Plus, it had Geno. Whats there not to love

@bahamut zero
your welcome
I'd rather have Geno on Brawl than Olimar or R.O.B.
Square Enix should've conributed a character(s) in brawl like konami did with snake. Square enix should put Cloud and Geno in brawl but they probably wont knowing square.
(honorable mention Vincent Valentine)

@shadows262

Konami only contributed Snake because one of the more influential persons happened to be a fan of the series(although I'm sure there was money involved at some point). Besides, Square-Enix has their own fighting game with all their characters, and they can make a hell of a lot more money off of that.

Same reason I want a Japanese 360 Corbie Especially for Raiden IV and Fighters comp

I hated Secret of Mana and SMRPG as they are both quite boring to me. Phantasy Star IV is okay though. Best game this year was probably Metal Slug IMO.

@ Diebythesword - Yeah I forgot to mention Raiden IV. That's on my wish list as well as Dodonpachi Dai Ou Jou and Ketsui. I just wish the US 360 was region-free. I just bought the Ibara PCB kit for my candy cabinet so I'm a bit strapped for cash this month. Maybe next month I can pick up a Japanese 360.

@mickeymac
Because one of the more influential persons happened to be a fan of the series-
What? Does that count for Sonic also?
Yeah...i dont think so. Konami wanted to contribute Snake into the Smash Bros. series(because maybe they`re a fan of the series?).
@kelven
the only reason it would get a “legendary status” is because of all the RPGs that came ahead of its time(or before it) and just werent as good or just sucked!

The thing I find interesting about this list is I've played three of those games: PSIV, Lords of Thunder, and Super Mario RPG all for the first time this year!

Kojima and Sakurai are close friends, Kojima wanted Snake in Melee, but Melee was already to far in develpment, so he's stuck in Brawl.

And SMRPG just has outright TERRIBLE gameplay, outside of battles its tolerable, but once battle begins the snoring ensues shortly after.

I can give a negative about DoReMi, it wasn't translated (which doesn't really matter much since it's a platformer, but it's still a negative )

Sonic has poor gameplay, after the first two zones of most of them it becomes a run for 10 seconds then hit an enemy/spike/wall and repeat

@shadows262 you're going to have to play some of those rpgs you're so casually dismissing, because you're way off with that. There are far better rpgs out there than Mario, which is nowhere near as good as the best of the releases from either of the parent series, and yet is considered some perfect hybrid.

@Kelvin
Yeah there are far better RPGs out there like the Final Fantasys and the Tales series. But it is way better than a lot of RPGs out there also like Dragon Quests, Lost Odyssey, most fire emblems, and Chrono Trigger...well in my opinion.
And if it was not as good as you say it is then how in the world did it spark 1 of Nintendos better series Paper Mario!?

lol at Final Fantasy's and Tales being better than SMRPG but DQ, FE, and CT aren't.

Now I'll get serious (inb4whysoserious) and say that SMRPG is probably(keyword) the worst RPG I've ever played.

I have 2 of those games on the list, I'll get 2 more eventually, and might pick up Star Parodier sometime anyways.

@Mickeymac- I'm afraid you misunderstood me, but I can see how since my wording was bad. By final boss, I mean the boss in the first level of Ikaruga, not the last level. Anyway, I'll definitely take a look at some of those, and thanks for the list.

@Corbie - Ibara PCB..nice. I heard the PS2 port wasn't "arcade perfect" but I definitely gotta pick it up Yeah I wish the 360 was region free too, too bad these Cave ports aren't on the PS3 as the PS3 is region free. And Dondonpachi rules. Cave rules

@shadows262

Wow, I gotta say, even though I hold The Mario RPGs to a godly height, even I wouldn't put them above Chrono Trigger. Dragon Quest, sure, I never found that series very enjoyable, excluding the excellent Dragon Quest Monsters. Hell, I'd even say that they're better than Fire Emblem(I always felt that perma-death thing was a bit too harsh). But Chrono Trigger was a work of sheer...well, actually, I mostly liked it because I was able to come up with a hilarious story for it while I was playing it. Without the hilarious story that I made up, it would simply be "okay".

I only ever played Tales of Symphonia, and honestly I don't even consider it an RPG, it feels more like an action game with obnoxiously long cutscenes about a story I could care less about - basically it's Final Fantasy, only with the battle scenes replaced with a fun action game. Now all they have to do is remove the rest of it, and you would have my definition of a great Final Fantasy game.

@Clayfrd

Yeah, I tried the demo of Ikaruga, and I could not beat that boss, not even on easy! Now, if you're really looking for an easy shooter, go with that one Trigger Heart game that Corbie suggested, I tried it was a piece of cake, so long as you keep your wits about you. But if you're looking for fun-but-fairly-challenging games, I'd suggest those would be some good ones to try.

Edit: Hey, does anybody know how many stages Star Parodier has? 'Cause I'm stuck on the 6^th level, and I really hope that there anymore stages after it. Don't get me wrong, it's been a ton of fun so far, but level 6 is about as intense as I can take, and it would only get harder if there were any more stages.

Edit again: Whoa, Wall 'o Text.

I only ever played Tales of Symphonia, and honestly I don't even consider it an RPG, it feels more like an action game with obnoxiously long cutscenes about a story I could care less about - basically it's Final Fantasy, only with the battle scenes replaced with a fun action game. Now all they have to do is remove the rest of it, and you would have my definition of a great Final Fantasy game.
I love it! That's how you state your opinion. The overly sarcastic and obnoxious atttitude, powerful.

But you don't like the main DQ games? . And permadeath is cool since it makes it unique and you can just start the chapter over, it's not like it autosaves whenever someone dies, that'd be evil.

Greatest RPGs ever:
1.Tales of Symphonia
2.Chrono Trigger
3.Final Fantasy I
4.Final Fantasy VI
5.Paper Mario
6.Pokemon Gold
7.Fire Emblem
8.EarthBound
9.Mother 3
10.Fire Emblem: Path of Radiance

(An RPG being where you grow levels so Zelda and Castlevania don't count.)

@Digiki

That's what I don't like about perma-death: I have to start the whole damn chapter over again. I prefer Shining Force, where I can actually end a battle with a few casualties, and not having to worry about being short some men later on, since I can just bring them back to life at the of the fight. Also, combined with the Egress ability, the game actually becomes easier the more I have to restart a a battle, since they keep the experience they gained during the battle, even when they die.

@beastman

Good to see Final Fantasy I above Final Fantasy 6, I actually find your list pretty agreeable. At least, I find it more agreeable than any other "Best RPG" list that I've ever seen.

@mickeymac
ya man I like your opinions!
Dragon Quest is okay at some point and now Square Enix is making Dragon Quest X for wii(I found this out on 1up.com) I might give it a chance

@beastman93
Your forgetting Final Fantasy 7

@beastman93 - I love Tales of Symphonia. It's one of my most favorite games ever. I don't know that I would call it #1, but it's up there. Good list

Oh, and happy new years y'all!!!

I agree with a lot of the comments regarding Mario RPG here - it's a solid RPG that's been horrendously overhyped over the years, and doesn't realy belong on the list at all, especially not at first place.

Mario RPG better than Phantasy Star 4? Utter bollocks, I say.

(Paper Mario was way way better than Mario RPG, too. And yes, I played Mario RPG on an emulator before Paper Mario came out)

Ahhh, RPG talk, here I can fit in.

SMRPG is slightly overrated, but its still amazing. it's not as overrated as the mediocer FFVII.

Happy New everyone!!
I hope for the best for wii this year and hopefully Nintendo and other developers step up and make more hardcore games for Wii and the Wiiware service!
(btw make them good hardcore games. little peeve i have is were the wii is gunna get a hardcore game and it ranges from so-so to complete crud)

I hope we get the Dragoon Quest games on the Vc this year (its 09 now). Square has been milking FF 1-6 to the point where it's just insane. Now they're remaking DQ 4-6, but what about the first three? Those should be on the Vc.

My top five of 2008:
5) Wizball
4) Marble Madness
3) Super Mario Kart
2) Super Smash Bros
1) Super Mario All-Stars

Yes, that was sarcasm.

In all, I think this was a pretty bad year for the VC compared to 2007. I only downloaded 3 VC games in 2008 (Kirby 64, Mario RPG, and Mario Golf), verses 11 downloaded in 2007. Hope 2009 is better, start by giving us Castlevania 3 on Monday.

RPGs:

#1 Final Fantasy VII--I just love the controversy surrounding this game, like how some people whine (one of those whining about whiners ironies) about the main character, and yet he's pretty much the most well-remembered protagonist in RPG history even ten years after it came out, as evidenced by the popularity of its recent spin-offs. I remember how naysayers thought everybody would forget about this game after the hype and technology wore off. They didn't--ten years later they even bought a ridiculous shooter called "Dirge of Cerberus" just because it had a little something to do with FFVII. For all the nitpicks (some arguably deserved), the sheer sincerity and ambitiousness of FFVII keeps me from second-guessing my favorite RPG.
Final Fantasy VI
Chrono Trigger
Panzer Dragoon Saga--Sega's best RPG hands-down (so sad, hardly anybody got to play this)
Xenogears

And then . . .

Suikoden 2
Final Fantasy VIII
Final Fantasy X
Dragon Quest VIII
Vagrant Story: Matsuno's masterpiece, IMO

Otherwise, I actually do think the best RPGs on the VC are Super Mario RPG and Ys: Book I & II by a fair margin. Phantasy Star is mostly awesome but a little more spotty, especially the battle system, to which I say "good riddance," not sorry they didn't show up ever again (is anybody?). And the overall gameplay (dungeons and exploration) can feel drawn out and sometimes even plodding . . . but that's the worst of it--they're otherwise excellent, unique, not to be missed.

Panzer Dragoon Saga...now that is one overrated game,, in my opinion. I only keep mine because it's so hard to come by. I think I've played it once in 5 years. I still rank Chrono Trigger, Lufia 2, and Final Fantasy X as among my favorite all-time rpgs. I'd also give a nod to Terranigma and Xenogears as well.

As for the Super Mario RPG/Paper Mario/Mario & Luigi argument, I think it generally comes down to which one you played first. Most people that were gaming when Super Mario RPG first came out, generally prefer it to this day. Likewise with the Paper Mario and Mario & Luigi series. I love the Paper Mario and Mario & Luigi games, but I don't put them anywhere in the same league as Super Mario RPG. Not even close really.

@Corbie: I thought Terranigma was a Europe only game?
And whats Lufia 2, I honestly never heard of it.

Also, can you recomend Ikaruga for XBLA?

@Corbie

I've heard people here and there talk about Lufia 2 being great. I touched on an emulation briefly and nothing really came of it. Likewise for Terranigma. O.O I really need to do something about this . . .

Super Mario RPG does belong in the first spot indeed.But Mega Man 2 should have been number 2, Everything else looks right i guess.

I'll agree Corbie, you can't compare it to the other Mario RPG's because this is a real RPG, yes the others have elements but this one is the real deal, I played all the other Mario RPG's before this one, Paper Mario and Mario/Luigi series, yet Super Mario RPG is my favorite. It deserves #1.

@Wolflink22: I think MM games weren't on it because they were already in Europe last year.

where does secret of mana go then?

and Ys Book 1 & 2?

I played Secret of Mana on cartridge last year before it was released on the vc.

I feel Mana shouldn't be on the top 5 list for 2008 vc releases. I have a problem with the game without using other people to control the other 2 characters in the game. The A.I. is very limited when it comes to getting around corners. This means you must constantly backtrack and try to get your teammates around whatever obstacle is in their way. I had to do this several times during the game.

Okay, since folks are sharing RPG favorites, and that is one of my favorite genres, I'll go ahead and put mine out there. Roughly in order:
1) Dragon Warrior VII
2) Tales of Symphonia
3) Dragon Warrior II
4) Shadowhearts 2
5) Final Fantasy X
6) Shining Force (haven't played 2 yet)
7) Shadowhearts
8) Skies of Arcadia
9) Jade Cocoon 2

Number 10 is a multiple way tie. There's a bunch of RPG's that are in process for me and others that I haven't gotten to (or finished) that I want to. I don't get to play as much as I'd like to but you know how it is.....

@ Bahamut ZERO - I agree that Dragon Warrior 1 - 3 are excellent candidates for the VC. For some reason, Squenix seems to be resisting doing that because the VC has been around for awhile. I'll get them for sure, though, even though I've beaten 1 and 2 many times and 3 once. Good stuff....

Terranigma was a Japan/Europe release, but I had someone do a custom SNES cart for me that removed the region boot check so I can play it on my US SNES system. As for Lufia 2, it's one of the greatest rpgs ever made, in my opinion and one you should definitely check out.

Ikaruga is a fantastic (and brutally difficult) shooter. Be warned, it's tough. That being said, it's one of the best shooters out there and a very good port to the Xbox 360's XBLA.

@Coribe: Wow. You editied a cart. Your dedicated man
I'll see more about Lufia 2, but two question (heh. I made a pun )

1. What system is it for?
2. DO I have to play Lufia 1 to understand the story?

And thanks about Ikaruga. I'll probably get it after Geometry Wars 2, Banjo-Kazzoie, and Pac-Man CE.

@ Bahamut ZERO

Here is the answers to your questions:
1.) Lufia 2 is for the Snes.

2.) You may want to play Lufia 1 after you play Lufia 2.

Lufia 2 is a prequal to Lufia 1. Lufia 1 takes place about a 100 years after Lufia 2.

The story line of Lufia one had references to Lufia 2. The first 2 lufia games had a tie in with each other.

It appeared that Taito developed Lufia 1 with the intentions of making Lufia 2 a prequal.

I am willing to back up my statement if I am asked to.

Meh, I might as well put up my list:

1 - Every Mario RPG except SMRPG
2 - Almost every Action RPG I've played so far
3 - Chrono Trigger
4 - Penny Arcade Adventures
5 - Pokemon Gold
6 - Dragon Quest Monsters 1 & 2(both rock!)
7 - Digimon World 3 and DS(both also rock!)
8 - Final Fantasy 1
9 - Breath of Fire II
10 - Ys Books 1 & 2.

I suppose a more accurate one, though, would be this:

1. Paper Mario 2 tied with Mario & Luigi 2
2. Paper Mario 1 tied with Mario & Luigi 1
3. Kingdom Hearts 1 tied with Kingdom Hearts: Chains of Memories
4. Tales of Symphonia
5. Seiken Densetsu 3
6. Terranigma
7. Soul Blazer
8. Secret of Evermore
9. Illusion of Gaia
10. Xenogear tied with Brave Fencer Musashi.

@7th lutz: Gah. I sold my SNES 10 years ago. It always seems to come back to bite me in the butt
@Mickeymac: Which DQM? My favorite is Joke rfor the DS.

@Bahamut ZERO

Both of the Gameboy games. I never played DQM Joker, but I hear it's not as good as the Gameboy games, so I'll wait until it's cheap before I try it out.

Joker is great, but isn't magical like the first one (never played numbuh 2) I loved my Blizzardy, Kingleo and Ironturt , too bad Ironturt took way too much time and effort to become a beast.

Since top 10 rpgs list are being made, here is mine is in any order:

Lufia 2
Chrono Trigger
Final Fantasy 6
Xenogears
Dragon Quest 8
Skies of Arcadia
Final Fantasy Tactics
Lunar: Silver Star Story
Suikoden
Dragon Warrior 7

@ Bahamut Zero - I had a guy do me a few carts. He put the english translations on the actual carts so I could play them on my SNES. I have three of them: Terranigma, Star Ocean, and Seiken Densetsu 3.

I'm also pretty fond of the Dragon Quest Monster titles as well. While I still think the first game is the best, I did enjoy Cobi's Journey and Tara's Adventure, not to mention the very well done DQM: Joker title. I didn't really care for Caravan Hearts much, but it was a nice attempt at trying something a little different.

@Mickeymac: DQM series is great. My favorite is Joker because it isn't as hard to capture multiples of the same species. In the origional I had to use 15 of the best meat just to get a slime

@Corbie: You had a guy. Like a freind, a buisness, or some random dude? Plus, Caravan Heart? I heard about that somewhere, but I have this feeling it was Japn-only....

@Bahamut ZERO

Yep, Dragon Quest Monsters: Caravan Hearts was Jap - only.

Not a bad list, although i wouldn't say it was a great list, apart from SMRPG. It should have been better. I'm not saying the games on here are bad but i just feel there should have been even greater games released.

Any videogame with Caravan in the title will be Japanese.

@ Bahamut Zero - I met a guy online that produced these custom SNES carts and sold them on ebay. I traded a few items for three of the carts. Then he ran into some legal trouble regarding the carts and quit making them. That's really why I've not sold the ones I have. Plus the Star Ocean cart is insanely difficult to produce with all of that soldering. Needles to say, I keep them under lock and key.

And yes, Caravan Hearts was a Japan-only DQM release. It's just as well as it didn't feel much like a DQM game anyway.

@Corbie: It's nice to see someone so dedicated he'd buy imported and tinkered carts off the VGB (Video Game Blackmarket)

Anyway, back on topic, I bought DOReMi. Amazing platformer. One of the best 2D ones out there. I thank Vc-Reviews for helping my Wii Points find a good home

After reading folks' RPG lists, I'm realizing how deprived I've been. As such I'm not feeling "worldly" enough among RPGs to put up a "best" list, so I'll just put up a favorites list (in no meaningful order):

Final Fantasy (enough story to carry the lack of character depth, one of my favorite story twists, thought/imagination provoking)
Final Fantasy X (A bit mainstream, but classic FF: interesting characters, poignant story, expansive travel, beautiful graphics)
Final Fantasy IV (My first reaction: Cecil?? What kind of a name is Cecil?! But the way they presented the "Mirror Fight" was so evocative and meaningful for an early gen RPG with rather limited graphics .....AND the fact it cost me $70 of my mom's money back in the day makes it memorable just for that)
Final Fantasy VI (Strength and weakness in Locke Cole, so many fully developed characters, multi-character live time maze fights, one of the great freaky villians of all time)
Final Fantasy Tactics (the amazingly subtleties of the characters and their interplay…… and contrary to popular opinion the dialogue was inspired and readily understandable even when misrepresented. “I'll see you later. Stay alive till then.” )
Saga Frontier 2 (Loved creating techniques by chaining the right basic move sequences, stumbling on Kitchen Sink early on was a rush)
Legend of Dragoon (In my presumption I'm a bit surprised this name hasn't come up yet. For me it's among the most enjoyable in button timing combat RPGs I've played, if a bit limited in equipment and in-between stories)
Lunar Silver Star Story (My first exposure to quality song vocals in an RPG)
.

And on the topic of modded carts, I'm in eternal awe and appreciation of those who are dedicated enough to gaming, and to my all-time favorite game format, to hardwire reprogram them. I'm not surprised they ran into legal issues though, just based on Nintendo's own reaction to Game Genie back in the day......heh heh. What a stupid attitude to be so proprietary about game design once it's sold and out the door in the hands of the gamer. It's not like the gamers will be able to mass produce altered games in any impactful quantities or anything........ too lame.

All right people talking my language. RPG's are my favorite genre as well. Here's my list that's not in order.
Final Fantasy VIII (I liked this one better than VII)
Final Fantasy X
Final Fantasy IV
Dragon Quest VIII
Kingdom Hearts 1 or 2
Super Mario RPG
Chrono Trigger
Dark Cloud 1 or 2
Tactics Ogre: The Knight of Lodis
Final Fantasy Tactics Advance

You know, reading all these lists makes me realize something:

Square has a monopoly on RPGs.

I can't even remember the last decent RPG I played that wasn't Square made (exceptions are Mario RPG series). If only Square had some competition. That way us, the consumer, could have a wide variety of RPG styles to chose from with all of the titles still being great. Plus, with competition, Square would be forced to up the quality of its game. For example, note how much better Square was when it was Squaresoft, not Square-Enix. That was because they were competiting with Enix in Japan for title of RPG god.

That's just my opinion. Thanks for reading this post and not falling asleep

Everybody keeps putting down Super Mario RPG and its sorta annoying
@everyone at VC Reviews thank you for putting such a masterpiece of a game at #1 because it deserves it
@bahumut zero
square enix either makes FFs or turn based crap!

@shadows262, you do know who produced Mario RPG right?

Also, I'm not sure anyone apart from Digiki is really "putting down" the game. However, there does seem to be a healthy number of people who don't think it's worth the "10/10 gr8test game evar!" nonsense which seems to follow the game around. As I mentioned before, I'd give it a solid 8/10, but I'd much prefer to be playing Chrono Trigger or Phantasy Star IV.

@shadows262

You know, I actually say you're right. The only game that Square-Enix made that sticks out in my mind is The World Ends With You, most of they're games have ranged from "horrible" to "alright", nothing like in the old days.. Now, if he were talking about Squaresoft or Enix, then I would have to strongly disagree, since, in my mind, their most memorable games have been the non-Final Fantasy games(esp. Enix, since they didn't make FF games).

@Kelvin - I think Bahamut was also referring to the Paper Marios, which were made by Nintendo in cooperation with someone else (I forgot the company's name, not Square).

I like SMRPG, but I don't think it deserves to be #1 either. #2 or #3 maybe, but not #1. That spot should've gone to Ys I & II or Secret of Mana IMO. Speaking of which, why aren't either of those games on this list?

@Shadows. You mean modern Square-Enix, or back when it was 2 separate companies? If you mean the latter, I could name 10 games of the top of my head that counter that theory, including SMRPG.
If you mean the former, I can kinda sorta agree with that. These days, they're good stuff is mainly ports of older games and FF/DQ games, with most of their newer properties being pretty mediocre.

@Clayfrd. That company would be Intelligent Systems. I think.

Enix is the bestest. Dragon Warrior 3 (GBA) pretty much perfection, way better than Dragon Warrior Monsters which was also beyond phenomenal.

As much as I like Kefka, I'm astounded that I've never heard anybody point out his similarities to "The Joker." Gets a laugh (a famous, digitized one) out of killing people and destroying things and everything, a clown with white skin and green hair . . .

Nice to see appreciation for DWVII here, too.

There are many great classic games still to come on this great platform...they just need to shake this habit of one game per week! They should make that the VC's New Year's Resolution: Better games, and more of them!

@Dragon Warrior VII: Heh, I just got through watching some YouTube of the Ultimate Deity fight in it. You gotta have some love for an RPG that has God shakin' his booty as a stun technique.

And that darned Kefka laugh.......not exactly high quality vocal audio, yet just that perfect balance of annoying and freaky. Kefka was not exactly the most deep villian of RPGdom, but he certainly was iconic. And yeah Cally, he was that exact same brand of maniacal self-amusing cruelty as The Joker. I can see The Joker poisoning a population just because it's the convenient way to go.

@Clayfrd I was responding to shadows, rather than Bahamut.

Ummm... Where's Boogerman?

@mickeymac: No, I was saying Square-Enix is terrible and the both Squaresoft and Enix (seperate) were great.

My top 10 RPGs.
1. Pokemon Gold
2. Dragon Warrior 3 (GBC)
3. Chrono Trigger (although I haven't played it all the way through yet)
4. Dragon Warrior Monsters
5. Paper Mario
6. Fire Emblem: Sacred Stones
7. Tales of Symphonia
8. Final Fantasy 4 Advance
9. Breath of Fire 2
10. Final Fantasy: Dawn of Souls (FF2 specifically)

I don't own a PS so the only PS RPG I own is FFVIII, fun but didn't hook me and I never got too far

Even if SMRPG isn't the best game on the VC, I will agree it's the best RELEASE; It had everyone up in arms one way or the other. Don't know if my Top Ten would include two shooters... But considering everything that was released in 08, that's probably a fair list

I only have DoReMi Fantasy and SMRPG tho...

personal top 5 VC releases of 08
(released in NA sometime in 08)
5. Space Harrier
4. Mega Man 2
3. Super Mario RPG
2. Metal Slug 2
1. Secret Of Mana

@Bahamut ZERO

Um, that comment was directed towards shadows262, I was pretty much agreeing with you.

@mickeymac: Oh. My bad

@ricardo91
i mean the later square-enix because all they make are FFs and DQs and nothing really “new” and “innovative” and thats not really too good in the sense of in a couple years from now we all are gunna get sick of it all, just like we did with game franchises like Dynasty Warriors and 3-D Sonic adventures!

Its pretty much FFs, DQs, and turn based crap for Square Enix

Me and my friend launched our new gaming website, GamingRA! We post short reviews on games for all platforms! look at the contact links at the bottom of the site for suggestions and games you want us to review! Spread the word!

gamingra.weebly.com

@gamingra
nice website!
great reviews too! Im actually thinking bout joining you site.
I was thinking bout making my own review website myself but i never had the time.

@Moderators

Is shameless advertising against the rules? I can never quite tell.

@GamingRA

I'm fine here, thank you. Really, I'm trying to limit the amount of review sites that I go to.

Well, at least it was on topic and not at all self serving.

And really encouraging me to believe that they must have a great site since they don't need to rely on things like word of mouth, but rather just spam discussion topics on competing sites instead.

But in spite of all these things indicating a high quality website, I think I'll pass on it. (And just post a sarcastic message instead)

I bought DoReMi

@Mickeymac. Technically it is, but the admins let this guy get away for some reason.

@GamingRA. Sounds good. I think I'll check it out later.

@Bahamut ZERO #124: Squenix doesn't have a total monopoly just yet, but its competition isn't HALF as rich for marketing. Atlus is a great company to check out for a variety of RPG styles (check reviews, though; some of them are crap, but most are great). Watch out though, as they're infamous for small production runs of games (get it when it releases or have a hard time of it later). Persona, for example, is building quite a following.

NiS America is also pretty good, trending more towards strategy RPG's than Atlus (though they have some too).

XSeed is also pretty good, having put out Brave Story on PSP (one of my favorite PSP RPG's), Shadow Hearts 3, and others, and currently working on the upcoming Avalon Code for DS.

And Squenix isn't really as bad now as most people seem to think, imo. The World Ends With You DEFINITELY stands out as their best work especially recently, but the entire Kingdom Hearts series is great (only the first was made pre-merger), and The Last Remnant doesn't deserve the bum rap it's gotten in reviews (I quite enjoy it, but STRONGLY recommend installing it to your hard drive to play; it helps avoid frame rate issues). And I'm a fan of some of their remakes, like the great job they did on FFIV DS, and Chrono Trigger, of course. They also revitalized (or vitalized, you might say, given the low sales of the original PS1 game) Valkyrie Profile, with a new game upcoming for DS.

I'm not trying to defend the company blindly, mind you. Their painfully slow VC releases remain a major concern (four games in America after TWO YEARS? For SHAME!), and this new trend towards multi-system games worries me (games, especially RPG's, are usually better polished when made specifically for ONE system, not to mention the umpteen DVD's FFXIII will require).

While I'm droning on and on, I'll put in my two cents about Mario RPG series'. I played SMRPG first, continuing on through time as they released. I place Mario & Luigi as my favorite, just because I LOVE the wacky humor of it (and its stats were closer to real RPG's than Paper Mario). I also love Paper Mario, and SMRPG, of course. I'm not sure which of those I'd place where on a list, only that Mario & Luigi (the first one; second was good, but prefer Superstar Saga) goes on top. And I love them all, leaving none completely out of my interest.

I also agree that SMRPG, just like any other game with its level of hype, is somewhat overrated. People with a natural affinity for its weird sense of humor will appreciate it far more, and of course you have to be okay with its battle system and overall ease.

Other RPG's I'd put somewhere in my favorites list (not even gonna TRY putting them in order!):
Skies of Arcadia Legends Simply amazing game, whose only real flaw is insane difficulty of finding "discoveries" on the world map without getting horribly lost (this problem is mostly cured with an excellent walkthough available on GameFAQs).
Chrono Trigger Also overrated to a point, I suppose, but I'm a fan of time travel, and the music is above top-notch.
Soul Blazer I love the way the towns come back piece by piece. It's a (very) primitive Dark Cloud (kinda sorta almost...whatever)!
Lufia 2: Rise of the Sinistrals Way, WAY better than the original, its main problem is the horribly glitched dungeon towards the end of the game (can't really see ANYTHING). I hear that problem was fixed for the European release, so I'd GLADLY pay extra for an import just to get the fixed game if it ever hit VC. While I'm on this game, I agree with 7th lutz. Lufia was definitely designed to have a prequel from the start (unusual though that is), as evidenced clearly by the fact that the game STARTS with the final battles from Lufia 2. But Lufia 2 had a better battle system, sweet puzzles in the dungeons, and more to make it the best in the series, PERIOD.
Breath of Fire 2 Best in the series that I've played, though 4 might be better (barely played the start of that one). Anyway, it had an unusually advanced story for the time (evil church passing off for good is still pretty uncommon now), improved on the first game's battle system, visuals, sound, and EVERYTHING a lot, and is basically just awesome. Capcom should make more RPG's.

I'm sure there are more, but this post has gotten WAY THE HECK TOO LONG already. If you read straight through, you get the "why on Earth did I waste my time with Stuffgamer1's massive post?" award! Which is worth...nothing. Enjoy!

Meh, I never cared for Valkerie Profile, and in my opinion, Kingdom Hearts 2 was awful. And I didn't think Last Remnant wasn't all that great -- too many technical problems, and a battle system that gets old too fast to really put up with them.

@Mickeymac: Well, like I said, the technical problems can be minimized by installing the game. And I quite like the weird battle system, so that's not an issue. But "Kingdom Hearts 2 was awful"? I'm not sure I can let that go, even with an "in my opinion" disclaimer... Eh, just kidding. I think you're CRAZY (especially since it sounds like you did like the first, or you wouldn't need to specify which was "awful"), but whatever.

In other news, I made a GRAVE mistake when listing my favorite RPG's earlier: I FORGOT TO LIST EARTHBOUND! I'm sure some people wouldn't care about that, but to me, it's a HUGE oversight. But rather than try to hide my shame with a post edit, I'll just tack it on here. So...
Earthbound Also over-hyped in a way, I must admit (even though I made it VERY clear that I'm a HUGE fan already). It's great for being modern, and very funny (if you don't like comedy in your RPG's, steer clear), and I like the battle system (rolling HP is cool, and there's nothing wrong with the basic system at all). Of course, this leads to...
Mother 3 I've played a good chunk of the fan translation, though I didn't finish it yet (waiting for the awesome guide to come in first...it's just my thing). What I've played so far, though (partway through Chapter 7), is AMAZING! Better story than Earthbound (more real, but also quite sad in parts, and it's QUITE a social commentary, too) and an interesting new rhythm-based add-on to the classic battle system (timed button presses that change depending on the BGM? SOLD!) make for what WOULD have been the best GBA game ever made if it'd been officially released in America.

Okay, maybe that'll cover it. Honorable mentions include Secret of Evermore, Illusion of Gaia, Secret of Mana, Shadow Hearts, Dark Cloud, and more (which, by definition, aren't honorable "mentions" as I didn't "mention" them by title, but I don't care).

@Stuffgamer1

Yes, as a matter of fact, I loved Kingdom Hearts 1. It wasn't too deep, yet it wasn't too simple; it had a good mix of RPG and Action elements (you aren't going to get far unless you use the right mix of regular attacks, special attacks, blocking/dodging, and magic); it had great levels, memorable enemies, and nice platforming sections. I especially liked the look of it which was a nice mix of Disney and Final Fantasy artstyles, especially when it came to the Heartless(bad guys), and the music was wonderful. Actually, the only bad things I can really think of were that the camera, while tolerable, certainly could've been better, and that story, which, for the most part was really good, had a horrible ending( but that's where Chain of Memories came in, which gave it the proper ending it deserved). Oh yeah, and that lousy rail shooter minigame they made you do between levels, I absolutely hated those, although eventually you get the warp drive so you don't have to do them anymore, but then I have to ask "what was the point of putting them in the first place?".

As you can see, I have an unrealistically high opinion of Kingdom Hearts 1, which was why I was so disappointed with Kingdom Hearts 2. It was too simple, as well as too easy, and battles seemed to rely too heavily on mashing the X button; the camera had gone from "tolerable" to "horrible", and I actually gave motion sickness. The levels were dull and linear, and almost devoid of any platforming. The look became too anime-ish, and the enemies looked completely out of place from their surroundings. Lastly, it had a horrible story, and ruined the ending in Chain of Memories.

It did do some good, I suppose. For instance, it actually improved the rail shooter minigame to the point that it was better than the main game. In fact, I actually spent of my time playing the random minigames than I ever did with the main story.

Well, there's my impossibly long rant about Kingdom Hearts. Actually, I kind of glad I got that outta me, had the anger bottled up for far too long.

Oh, and I did list Kingdom Hearts 1 as my third favorite RPG of all time, so I think that gives you an idea on how much I liked it, as well as explaining why this rant was so long.

I loved both 1 and 2 and hated the card game in COM.
Kingdom Hearts Birth by Sleep is looking better than 358/2. In graphics and story wise anyway. imo.
Level 5's White Knight Chronicles is looking decent, but they should be making Dark Cloud 3.

This list sucks!(IMO!!!)
mine would be(IMO!!!):
5.Zelda Ocarina
4.Zelda ALTTP
3.Super Mario World
2.Super Mario RPG
1.Super Metroid

@MetroidMedia

Only one of those games came out this year. This list only covers the VC games that were released in 2008.

@Bendover83

I liked the card game mechanics for a little while, but it ended up devolving into button-mashing once there were too many enemies for you to effectively use a special attack( about halfway through).

As for the new ones, there's almost zero information on either of them, so I really can't make any sort of judgment just yet.

And personally, from what I've seen and heard, I'd say White Knight Chronicles seems pretty dull. Dark Cloud 3 would probably be better.

well I dont know.
And I know i made 3/4 of my list SNES games. but the SNES was that good of a system.
and I personaly think ALTTP is a better Zelda game than OOT
though I think Super Metroid was the best game of all time. but i know 5-3 are too famous but I love them. and i dont want a list like:
5.Super C
4.Gradius
3.ActRaiser
2.Gradius 3
1.Contra 3
dont get me wrong i love shooters like Contra 3 and Gradius 3. but games like those get boring to me.
ActRaiser got boring realy fast(IMO).
And though Super Mario Bros. 3 was good I thought World was better.
and I dont want to just stack up a list of RPGs. though it would be easy it would be a bad list. the SNES had TONS of RPGs.
Super Mario RPG
Final Fantasy II(IV)
Final Fantasy III(VI)
Final Fantasy V(Japan only)
Crono Trigger
Secret of Mana
Earthbound... thats just a small few. WiiWare SUCKS!!!! well I like Mega Man 9, Tetris Party and DR. Mario online RX.
but thats 3 out of 40 or so titles. I mean COME THE F*CK ON!!! MAJOR LEAGUE EATING?!?!?!
10$ TO POP BUBBLES for 5 mins. IN A GAME CALLED "POP"?!?!? WTF?!?!?!!?!?!
The big reason Nintendo is making bad games is because they think our taste of games has changed from jumping on goomba heads to POPING BUBBLES!!!!!!!!
and for the SEGA Genisis?
well I dont like that system at all.(IMFO!!!!!!!) but its better than poping bubbles!

@Mickymac
oh sorry. lol

@MetroidMedia

'salright. Also, it's funny, your second list, while excellent, also consisted of games that came out last year, save for one.

@MickyMac
well I did it by accident.
but Wii Ware came in 08...
am I the only one that thinks WiiWare sucks?
oh and what 2nd list? the shooter and RPG one? I wasn't making a new list... read it again

@MetroidMedia

No, but personally I love it. Sure, not everything that's released is great(nothing's perfect, after all), but so long as there are a few titles worth playing, that alone makes the service good.

@MickyMac
well I guess
but still! I think the list should have stuff like MegaMan 2 or 3, Secret of Mana.

@MetroidMedia

The shooter one, those are some quality games! As for your other list, I'm glad to see somebody list Final Fantasy V - I haven't played it yet, but from what I've seen and heard, it seems fantastic!

As for Mega Man 2 & 3, and Secret of Mana, meh, personally, I wouldn't have put them on the list. Most people already got all the MM games on the Anniversary Collection. I couldn't get into Secret of Mana, and I find that there are far better RPGs on the VC, such as Ys Books 1 & 2.

its pretty good.
and I said I love Shooters but they will get boring for me. but i play them a twice day or so.

Yeah, I never really get "bored" with a shooter, usually I just get too frustrated, either because I'm stuck, or because it something about it is particularly annoying(like the roulette-style power-ups in Blazing Lazers).

YA that. I mean I want to play it but not that part. I want to skip all Anoying parts... but I got REALY bored with ActRaiser. It was a fun game but too hard and I didn't like it. (IMO)

@ Bahamut ZERO "Square has a monopoly on RPGs.":

You don't play many RPGs, or?

@ Super Mario RPG: I don't think it is overrated. I just think some people complain about it because there are other RPGs they like more, but that don't have to mean that SMRPG isn't great.

That reminds me, I never did get around to Actraiser. Another game on the waiting list, I suppose.

@ness

Actually, I found SMRPG rather frustrating, mostly due to the isometric view, and the timings for attacks were all over the place - I was beginning to think it was simply a random critical hit that I was getting rather often. It was funny, which, honestly was all I was expecting to get out of it, but it simply wasn't worth the frustration. I gave up after the first major boss fight.

@mickymac
Waiting list?

@MetroidMedia

A backlog, if you will. It's not like I have the time or money to get every game I want, so I simply put them on a list and hope I get to them someday.

@Mickymac
oh... ok sorry
but lets just hope 09 brings games such as Yoshi's Island, Smash Bros. Earthbound(soon i hope) and Majoras Mask.

@MetroidMedia

I doubt we'll see Yoshi's Island and Majora's Mask this year, due to emulation difficulties, and I'm beginning to think we won't be getting Earthbound at all. Super Smash Bros., however, is pretty much assured, seeing as how Japan will be getting it this month.

@Mickymac
ya well I can only hope.
sorry to ask another question but what do you mean by emulation dificulties?

Squenix puts out some quality titles, IMO. I think the worst thing Square ever did was lose Sakaguchi to go form "Mistwalker." I get the feeling of one missing the other a lot.

@ Mickeymac: "I doubt we'll see Yoshi's Island and Majora's Mask this year, due to emulation difficulties"

Yoshi's Island and emulation difficulties?

@ MetroidMedia: Super Smash. Bros. comes out this month in Japan, so it shouldn't take so long to get to America and Europe.

@Ness
I don't like SMRPG because the gameplay is an abomintation, other than the battles it's okay, I'd give it maybe a 6, like Mickey said he dropped out after the first major boss, the combat gets boring a bit before then. And every RPG I've played is better than SMRPG by a lot.

@ness 166: No. RPGs is actually my favorite genre, and a good 80% I play are RPGs

@Mickeymac 162: I personally love FFV. It's one of my favoorite games of all time, and, next to FFVI, my favorite FF. It has the best battle system I've seen in an RPG, and is loads of fun. Just don't expect a great story. It's decent, but not quite up to FF standard.

@cally
other than FFs, DQs, and Kingdom Heart what quality game(s) has square enix released recently(past 3-4 years)?
@ness
it should be here by march or so...hopefully

@ Bahamut ZERO: Did you play Skies of Arcadia (Legends), the whole Tales of - series, Star Wars: Knights of the Old Republic, Baldur's Gate, the Persona series, the Elder Scrolls series, Mass Effect, the Pokemon series, the Phantasy Star series, the Breath of Fire series, Golden Sun I & II, Grandia II, the Fallout series, Diablo I & II, Fable I & II, ........ ?

If yes, then i understand your comment "Square has a monopoly on RPGs" less than before.

@ Digiki: The gameplay of SMRPG is different and not so typical for the genre, so you can't compare it so easily with other RPGs. I think that is the main reason for your disaffirmation.

@ness: First, when I say RPG, I refer to JRPGs. Second, yes, I've played most of those games. And third, I use "monopoly" lightly. Sure, I know there are other fine RPGs out there, but what I meant by "monopoly" was sales and popularity wise (not quality). Square probably makes as much money as those guys combined (minus Pokemon and a few exceptions). When Square anounced FFXII the internet was ablaze, but when Pesona IV was announced (no matter how good of a game it turned out to be), there wasn't nearly the same reaction. If you can prove me wrong, then by all means, do, just know I often joke and exaggerate on forums, so don't take me literaly when I say monopoly.

Good stuff, can't complain about the list. Ofcourse people will say it doesn't fit them. But hey it's just HIS opinion. Can't argue with that.

The only game I've been waiting for so long to get is Super Smash Bros.

It's the game I've played the most of all games. Still fun, like it better than Brawl.

No.
I do not believe SMRPG deserves to be that high.
It's a good game, but...

SMRPG doesnt deserve the first spot theres way better games then that.

@iggy
then what does deserve it?

@Shadows. "Then what does deserve it?"
Secret of Mana.

@Mickeymac. Actraiser is pretty good. It's really short, and I have barely touched it since I beat it, but it's a fun game while it lasts.

Also, since when does Yoshi's Island have emulation difficulties?

@Mickeymac #152: I don't understand your complaints about Kingdom Hearts 2 at all, ESPECIALLY the camera, which was VASTLY improved according to everyone I've ever heard compare the games except you. Still, you're entitled to your opinion, and I feel no need to start an argument that would just end poorly anyhow.

@Mickeymac #167: The timing is usually very precise, actually (excepting Bowser's spiked chain chomp, which I have occasional trouble with). You probably just didn't understand the system right, as it takes some getting used to. I've been playing SMRPG for YEARS, so I've got most of that stuff down to a 100% success rate (not exaggerating, with the aforementioned chomp being the only exception).

@shadows262 #177: I already mentioned (within a VERY long post you may not have read) The World Ends With You, which received high marks across the board for originality and fun. There's also Valkyrie Profile and Star Ocean to consider. Surely you must like at least ONE of these!

@Bahamut ZERO #179: About half the games on ness's list are JRPG's, you know. And I think it would've been best if you'd never used the word "monopoly," as it confused people. To the extent that you mean it, I agree. They DO have almost all the power in JRPG marketing. But if you're a REAL RPG fan, you'll keep your eye on other companies too, making it matter very little.

@Ricardo91: Nintendo has claimed difficulties in emulating the Super FX chip introduced in Star Fox, which was apparently also used in Yoshi's Island. Whether this is wholly accurate or not is for you to decide, though I vote not (it can't be all THAT hard, and Nintendo seems to take any excuse to NOT release quality product lately).

@ Bahamut ZERO: Well, how should i know all of these points if you didn't write them down before?

And for me, the popularity of Square was already better in the past, especially after the many ports/remakes and only few original games in the last years.

@stuffgamer: Yeah, I probably shouldn't have used monopoly. It was a bad choice of words. And about half on his list not being JRPGs I noticed that, I just felt it would have been a nice way to gert rid of half of his list (instead of saying "By the way, don't count Mass Effect, Elder Scrolls, KOTOR, etc."). I keep my eyes on other companies of course. But I don't like Strategy RPGs (I don't know why truthfully ), so most of the RPGs I play aren't fabulous. They reach the level of great, but not magical. Maybe I was just venting off some steam that the RPG genre isn't as good as it used to be. I could always count on Square, but after X, everything went downhill. Who here can honestly say they felt emotionally attahed to Vaan in XII? Remember back in the 16-bit era when all kinds of companies were pumping out amazing, timeless RPGs every month are so? I miss those days

So in conclusion, I find modern-day RPGs lacking in that special magic that they used to, aiming for the moon but only hitting the stratosphere (with the ocassional mesosphere and thermosphere of course).

@ricardo91
haha-no nah i dont think so
secret of mana is good and prolly one of the best vc releases of 2008 but still not better than super mario rpg
@stuffgamer1
valkrie profile is a game ive never played before but i heard it sucked and it never intereseted in it and star ocean is cool but not the best

"I could always count on Square, but after X, everything went downhill."
.
"So in conclusion, I find modern-day RPGs lacking in that special magic that they used to..."
.
These rather sum up my feeling about modern day RPGing. I broke in with Square and even though other makers are matching up alright these days, the level of current RPGing to capture my imagination has faded drastically. Still some gems here and there, but far fewer than in the past and easily not hitting the heights that were hit Once Upon a Time.

If I were to guess, I'd say it's a flavor of an epidemic that has hit most genres of console games (though with RPGs being the most dependant on story and characters, it shows the issue most glaringly), that being a leaning on the crutch of advancing graphical capability (remarkable abilities with 3D texture mapping and polygonal smoothing, as well as excessive flash-and-dazzle, as examples) while profoundly neglected game depth, control quality, character depth and style, among other valuable intangible game elements. Some games do better than others, but most all fall short of the mid-line standards set in past decades of gaming (which I suspect plays a solid part in the increasing presence of "classic gaming" consumerism).

Oh well. The rarer the gems, the more precious ........ I guess.

I find that we are in a time of sequals and copies. Every FPS is trying to be like Halo, all we seem to be getting are sequals (Halo 3, Mario Galaxy, etc.) etc. And new, origional games don't do well (Okami, Psychonauts, etc).

@Captain Konami: Glad I could sum up your opinions. You also sum up the rest of mine quite well.

@190: Yes but you can't deny alot of those FPSs are great. And Mario Galaxy was not a sequal to my knowladge ... unless you mean its a mario game.

I can agree with Halo 3, but Super Mario Galaxy is unlike its predecessors in terms of the concept, so i think you can't call it really a sequel.

Oh, of course they're not bad. Some of them are awsome! And by sequal, I meant another game in a series. SMG is my favorite game of all time, and certainly was different than its predaccessors, however it wasn't "sheer origionality". I'm talking new IPs like Mirrors Edge and de Blob.

@Ness
SMRPG is so typical RPG, if you time your attacks and not magic or defence, it plays exactly like any other turn based RPG, except a lot slower, and with mostly ugly bad guys.

I love Paper Mario because it has lots valuable differences compared to other turn-based RPG's.

@Digiki: SMRPG is defidently more typical RPG than Paper Mario, however it's still quite different thanks to the timed hit system.

Yet, everybody is eentitled to their own opinion so.......

@ Digiki: "SMRPG is so typical RPG, if you time your attacks and not magic or defence, it plays exactly like any other turn based RPG, except a lot slower, and with mostly ugly bad guys."

Yeah, but i meant the gameplay outside of the battles.

....Secret of Mana is keeping me occupied...stupid moving wall towards the spikes...grrr...

huh? but that was an easy boss for me this time. but then i do use the "tactic" of spamming the right magic until the boss dies.

I'm done wasting money on virtual console games...

"other than FFs, DQs, and Kingdom Heart what quality game(s) has square enix released recently(past 3-4 years)"

That really narrows it down! Off the top of my head . . . um, Valkyrie Profile 2, The World Ends with You, Star Ocean: First Departure, Rocket Slime (a spin-off of the DQ series but not related) . . . some of the Chocobo dungeon games were pretty decent, I hear (again, spin-off to FF but not part of it). I could probably think of more if I did some research or had a better memory, and I'm sure people have varying opinions about what I just listed.

Again, I feel Square suffered from losing Sakaguchi-san, and his work (Blue Dragon, Lost Odyssey) was also good but could have been better with some of Squenix's people helping out. To me, it's like seeing part of Final Fantasy VI-IX go one way and the other part go the other way.

Wow, 200 freaking posts! I would personally put Megaman in that list but I'm in love with Capcom so I'm probably a little biased

As for the RPG discussion, I find the 16-Bit RPG's to be the best of the lot. There was no real need to put flashy special effects in RPGs. Square totally Star Warsed Final Fantasy. As much as I loved FFVII, it took WAY too long to do anything. As half the time you're using your most powerful summons, and more than half of them take more than a minute to perform, flashy special effects ISN'T what I need in an RPG.

EDIT: KABOOM!!!! Kirby's Dreamland 3 on the VC this week, NICE START TO THE YEAR!

Okay, now I have a firmer understanding of where people are coming from. If you want a truly AMAZING game to combat the SNES classics for "best RPG," then Squenix only has one that would fit imo: The World Ends With You. The only other one released this DECADE would have to be Skies of Arcadia Legends. Add in Mother 3, but that wasn't a legit release. Most of my favorite RPG's are from the SNES, too, if you check my lists above. I understand your point better now, but that doesn't mean that today's RPG's are HORRIBLE, just a bit less inspired.

@Bahamut Zero #187: Yeah, right, who was attached to VAAN? The way that game worked, there was no need to be. I was attached to Balthier and Ashley. Not to say I didn't LIKE Vaan and the rest of the crew, but those two stand out. I'm well aware I liked FFXII more than most people, anyway, so I doubt these statements mean all that much to you.

@Bahamut ZERO #190: I love BOTH of those new original games you mentioned! Going further on, it seems to me that new IP's are starting to stand a better chance in the market again. Mirror's Edge did pretty darn well, I believe. And with "sheer originality," I guess you're right. TWEWY and SoAL were both unusually original for their genre, and that helped a LOT! What we need to do is get the word out about the original games and get people to buy those instead of horrible rehashes. It's not easy, but it's worth it.

"The only other one released this DECADE would have to be Skies of Arcadia Legends"

Interesting. I thought Skies was good, if kinda slower than it needed to be (like, since you give your whole party commands before a turn, why can't they act all at once like in Suikoden?) I couldn't observe I anything about it that hadn't been done even when it originally released, 2000. Some elements are clearly borrowed from Panzer Dragoon Saga also, like the ship battles, and fully-rotatable camera in towns. The floating Islands concept didn't make it too terribly different in all practicality than just sea-faring, really, and that was done in an old anime called "Castle in the Sky." Crew collecting? Again, Suikoden. To be sure, it was all done VERY well, but I can barely think of anything about it being all that original.

It's disappointing to find out that so many of the new projects aren't turning out so hot, like Infinite Undiscovery, Tales of Symphonia 2, or The Last Remnant. Contrary to my expectation, I'm actually enjoying Crisis Core a lot.

@Cally: Okay, well, I've never played Suikoden or Panzer Dragoon Saga, so I wouldn't have known about them. What about the SP system, though? Did one of those games have THAT, too? The weapon element system seems different from those of other games, too. Maybe I just haven't played enough other games (the right ones, anyway, as I have played a LOT of RPG's) to makes connections, but Arcadia is VERY unique among the games in my collection. If nothing else, it put its elements together VERY well, and surely that counts for something.

200 comments...... And with 90% about RPGS.....

Awsome

@ Ness
Outside of battles SMRPG is tolerable and actually enjoyable at times, but it doesn't come close to making SMRPG a great, or even good game, I'd say it's fairly averagish and I'd give it a 6/10

What's funny is just how varied the opinions are on the various rpgs. It's like me and Earthbound. I find it to be one of the most boring, bland, uninspired rpgs I've ever played. In fact of the 30+ SNES rpgs I own, I'd rank it in the bottom 5 easily. Yet there are TONS of people that adore it.

@Corbie: Well, to be honest, the gameplay of Earthbound ISN'T anything special. But you obviously have no sense of humor if you can't appreciate the quirky writing that makes it a true joy to speak to EVERY NPC EVERY time you play the game. Then again, you like Conker, which I found EXTREMELY distasteful, so it's safe to assume right there that our senses of humor do not mesh very well. Ah, well. Just remember: Nobody remembers Earthbound for the gameplay, but for the writing and setting.

@ Digiki (#206): Different person, different opinion^^.

But if you look at at the average reader rating, you see that SMRPG is one of the highest rated games on the website, so i think SMRPG did something right^^.

@ness

Either that, or a lot of people gave it a 5-star rating before even playing it, just because it's Mario RPG, because it was a Mario game in general. I mean, it had been in the coming soon section for a while, and, if I remember correctly, it had almost 100 ratings before it was even released.

Now, certainly a lot of people who played it enjoyed it, but still, being the number one rated game on the website isn't all that impressive when it's a Mario game. Not to me anyways.

If it wasn't Mario, it wouldn't be rated nearly as well, and I'm positive about that.

And I'm guessing EB will be like DQ, just with worse gamplay but a better story.

@Digiki: Earthbound's gameplay isn't any worse than Dragon Quest. Given the cool rolling HP thing and lack of random battles, it's actually a bit better. Not earth-shattering, but good.

I also have to agree about the rating of Mario RPG, but that mostly goes back to the story, AKA the reason it's a popular game. The story is funny. It'd be far LESS funny without Mario in it. If you get a bit further into the game, Bowser actually gets some of the best lines in the game (and quotes a Haiku right towards the end...weird!). Again, the gameplay could be better, but it could be worse, too. People look at all aspects of a game when reviewing it (at least, the GOOD reviewers do), not just one. A game "greater than the sum of its parts," you know?

Still, I, for one, respect your opinion. Just please don't needlessly bash the game that so many people were so happy to finally get on VC.

@ Digiki: As Stuffgamer1 said, SMRPG without Mario wouldn't be the same because the whole humor wouldn't function. And this isn't a little part of the game.

@Stuffgamer1

I don't want to take away from Skies of Arcadia. It's a great game, gorgeous and immersive (reminding me of PDS somewhat). The SP system can be seen as basically shared MP in any other game's definition, except that it is recharged by turns and a "focus" command in addition to items. Both of those things DO sound familiar to me . . . can't place it in as many games as I should be able to. The ability to switch elements of the weapons was cool, though. Switching weapons mid-combat . . . I think FFX did that, for one, but indeed, experimenting with weapon elements was a very cool idea.

You might enjoy the Suikoden games a lot. Looks familiar, plays really different. Suikoden 2 is HARD to come by which is a shame (to me, having the single most impactful story in a game). Grandia(s) is another one that's been raved about as having "the best battle system ever," and it's just a highly enjoyable (and mostly light) adventure story too.

I missed a few important 16-bit RPGs, for sure--Earthbound, Lufia 2, Terranigma, Soul Blazer on the SNES, and Shining Force 2 on the Genesis most notably--but my deviant opinion is that RPGs saw their most inspired developments in the 32-bit era.

@Corbie
Yeah, there's so many aspects to RPGs that any one thing can go right or wrong to make or break it to different people. Paper Mario usually had me bored to pieces with its simple, simple, simple . . . everything. And unlike PM2, didn't do ANYTHING meaningful with the Paper gimmick. But, I wonder, I went in with the wrong (and sky-high, thanks to SMRPG) expectations. A lot of people dissed Final Fantasy VIII while I was absolutely loving it. What's more, they're huge time investments . . . and you never know when you've wasted your time on one or passed up one you would have really liked. Oh, the sleepless nights! (Suikoden was awesome, and I was barely interested before I got it).

@ Stuffgamer1 - The humor in Earthbound is more quirky in nature than anything. While I found it funny for awhile, it got old quickly and lent itself too much towards the gimmicky nature of the game. In all honest, the scratch 'n' sniff was the best part of Earthbound for me personally.

And I'll take the 16-bit rpgs over any rpgs from other eras any day. There were a handful of 32-bit rpgs that were memorable, but not even in the same league as a Chrono Trigger, Lufia 2, or Terranigma, in my opinion. In fact, I can't think of more than 5 rpgs I've truly loved since the 16-bit era.

@Cally: Okay, fair enough. I think the way that I compare games is different than most people, because I prefer NOT to and to simply let a game stand on its own merits. As that goes, Arcadia is truly AMAZING!

I plan to get Suikoden on PSN sooner or later, and I fully expect Suikoden 2 to be made available there eventually as well.

It has been my experience (with movies more often than games, but some of both) that sometimes going into an experience blind can be the best thing. It has no expectations to live up to whatsoever, so you can just enjoy it for what it is. This gets costly if you're not careful though, and I have been badly burned by this practice before (young kid stupid enough to buy Loony Tunes Racing on GBC...gag). I would recommend finding your own ways to learn limited amounts of info about a game, enough to know that you'll probably like it, then be blown away by how great it is.

@193. Bahamut ZERO: Oh, I understand.

@Corbie: I agree. Secret of Mana is my favorite RPG of all time, and I've neverplayed Chrono Trigger but it sounds brilliant! And if Zelda's are RPGs then that makes 2 because I F***ING LOVE LINK TO THE PAST!

not my five this year
i would have pick
sonic the heaghog
secert of mana
super mario rpg
devil world
earthworm jim

Dude I just gotta admit that this is the worst list i have seen ... * : No, it isn't, this list is the top 5 games in *THEIR opinion.

... here are the real top 5 games of virtual console 2008: Again, O-P-I-N-I-O-N-S. These are the top 5 in your opinion, everyone's lists are going to be a least slightly different.

I am pissed off and have been for sometime now the Wii virtual console release games this year and last year SUCK! They only release one game a week two if you're lucky and it's always some stupid crap you couldn't give me for free. So many great Nintendo games out there to re release but yet they are going to release this garbage they call a video game. UGH!!! It sickens me! Who in their right mind would want some game called uncharted waters no one in the US has ever even heard of!?

People have heard of Uncharted Waters before. Its just you that hasn't.