Topic: Zelda's Wii U-Turn to NX

@DefHalan:

As I've said from the first page, the only 3 things I am concrete on are that I believe the NX is atleast a home console, is coming in 2016, and that Zelda U is coming to it.

Sure, other topics come up, and I talk about them like anyone else. Like the "hybrid" topic. The reason it seems to you that I don't know what I want? Cuz I don't care if it's a hybrid. But the topic pops up so sure I say what I've heard and what seems possible.

I also don't mean to be rude, but you often say I didn't know what you meant, when you often don't know what I mean. And you tend to think your opinions are everyone's opinions. So, as this discussion winds down, I'll answer a few of your points:

"You talk about the advantages of having a portable that can play home console games but say you have no interest in a portable at all."

I don't have to have interest in a portable to recognize there could be advantages to one to many people. Again, this is because I recognize that not everyone shares my opinion.

"You say things are possible because someone told you it is, while people have researched it and know about Game Development tell you it isn't possible."

Again, you seem to not listen to what I was saying. I have watched many youtube videos on the topic, read many articles, etc. So while you present what I believe as "someone told me this" and those who take an opposite stance as "those who have researched it and know about Game Development" (which, in turn, slyly implies whoever told me this is NOT well researched and familiar with game development), you have no proof that they have researched it anymore, or know about game development anymore, than the videos and articles that indicate it IS possible.

"We ask you questions about how this type of device would attract consumers to both sides (portable and console) and you only describe how one side will be attracted to their side."

I don't know how much clearer I can make it, friend. Some people like home consoles. Some like portables. Many like both. This is common sense, what are you asking me to explain to you? You want me to explain to you how a device that caters to 2 markets, will attract both those markets?

You are right that it is a one sided discussion. And that is because you think your side is the only side.

@LetsGoRetro:

I feel like I have asked pretty open questions. I don't really have an idea what the NX could be, but I do have an idea of what it can't be. I don't really have opinions to think that my opinions are everyone's opinions.

You said "I'm just going by what I've been told: That it's possible. I don't know how hard it'd be, but some seem to think it's a plausible scenario." This doesn't tell me about any research that might have gone into your point of view. It literally sounds like you heard it from someone and assume they are correct. While I work in the industry and Skywake has explained from a technical stand point that "scaling games" isn't going to work or at least will be requiring a lot more work from developers, so they probably wouldn't be interested in the platform.

Some people do like Home Consoles, Some like Portable Consoles, Some like both. The problem is that with a hybrid device you have to sell people only interested in a Home Console a Portable Console and people only interested in a Portable Console a Home Console. I have asked how are they going to do that? What features will benefit those people? Why would someone interested in Home Consoles spend (guessing the price here) $200 more for the NX compared to just buying PS4 or XB1 for about $300. Why would someone that is interested in a Portable Console want to spend $300 more for a paper weight?

You go back and forth on whether the NX would even be a hybrid device or if the devices would be sold separately to avoid answering certain questions.

It is difficult to have a conversation when answers are avoided and the product we are talking about is changed. This is why I said it feels like a one sided discussion, because I try to discuss something and you change what we are discussing. If you want to have a discussion about what the NX is we can, we just need to actually discuss it and try not to change what it is we are talking about.

@LetsGoRetro: I understander you thoughts and opinions, @DefHalen You guys keep asking why you need/want a portable device is its not essential in my opinion as I agree a lot with what @LetsGoRetro is saying, if you sell them bundled together and when I say together I don't mean like putting a Wii U and 3DS in the same box, But if they actually working together in some way whether is can be used as a controller or you can stream the handheld games to your tv with the help of the console, whatever. It open up the market to people who would really use handheld, like I have said before I personally wouldn't used the handheld but that doesn't mean my partner or cousins wouldn't love to used it, I could just send them to another room. Also all my friends who own Wii U's don't used handheld but I reckon if they bought a NX and it came with that feature they might used it. Now before you say why would they do this its just going to make it more expensive? These are my thoughts, If Nintendo market it right and it actually has heaps some benefit people will buy it. I not rich in many means but personally don't see the difference between paying $450 for a new console or $600 so price wouldn't be a deurtrent. Like I said before I don't feel the gamepad is essential for the Wii U I don't even use it. Nintendo could have just made bundle with only pro controller and made it heaps cheaper, but the way they marketed made me want it. What would be the point in making a controller for the NX with a screen if it doesn't have some "new feature" it would just be a waste like the gamepad.

@haigh1011: "if you sell them bundled together and when I say together I don't mean like putting a Wii U and 3DS in the same box"
That wording is a little confusing but I think I know what you mean. You just want to be able to stream games from your Home Console to your Portable. I agree, I think that would be a worth while feature and it probably will be in those next systems. I don't think it will open up the market for people, but it would be a useful feature that probably wouldn't be too hard to support.

What I mean is the Wii U and 3DS are 2 different console and they don't work together in any way, so like you were saying it would just be putting the prise up for no reason

@DefHalan: Curious. What makes you pretty sure about what the NX "can't be," as you say? Do you work in the video game tech field? Honestly, I'm curious.

Right, just when you said they would be bundled, but then not sold together is the weird part. But through the rest of your explanation, I think I understood your point. You meant they would market them together with their shared features but sell them separately

@rallydefault: I have worked QA for a couple of companies, working on just about every system. I also have a degree in Game Design and am trying to learn certain engines and make some indie projects. So I feel like I have a good understanding of the industry.

Also, I wouldn't say that I am guaranteed to be right. Nintendo could possibly make a hybrid system where you can play Console Games on the portable. I just think that would be way to expensive both from a production and consumer standpoint to make it possible. So when I say can't, I guess I really mean highly unlikely.

@DefHalan: Yeh and theres a bundle option where you get both, I just thought if the handheld also works as a controller when you have mate over you bring your handheld and you can play 4 player NX. From what you wrote above sounds like you know your stuff, I like to hear your option because if i don't i'm just sitting wanting the NX to something that quite possibly is a pipe dream if you know what i mean

I'll make this simple point again. I don't think of two different things that work in the same ecosystem as a "hybrid" device. What this describes is something more like having an Apple TV and iPhone. You can buy one or the other without ever having to care about the other. Just because they share an ecosystem doesn't make them a "hybrid".

When it think of a hybrid I think of something that does two things in one package. Because that's litterally what a hybrid is. A hybrid car isn't an electric and petrol car in the same carport, it's an electric and petrol car in the same car. So I would describe the Wii U as a hybrid because the portable component requires the console to function. I would describe the Steam Link as a kind of hybrid because the console component requires a PC to function. I would not however describe the PS4/Vita as a hybrid because you can use either one without the other.

As I'm also the one under interrogation here I think it's worth me answering this. I will admit that I don't have any formal qualifications in computer hardware outside of one six month entry level unit on hardware engineering. But what I do have is a degree in Computer Science of which that hardware engineering unit was a part of. I'm also an enthusiast who reads hardware specs of various things for fun. But I guess on a games forum even just that last bit makes me more informed than most

@haigh1011: I don't really know what the NX could be. I like to throw around the idea of a companion device to a Home Console and a Portable Console. A Micro Console that would play smaller eShop releases, have apps like Netflix and Hulu, and allow streaming from the Home Console or Portable Console to a TV. So you could play your Home Console, that is in the living room, in another room, like the bed room. With the portable streaming, you could either stream the game to the TV or do Download Play on select games.

With this idea, I also stated that basically every Home and Portable Console would have this Micro Console built in giving developers a base spec/universal unit to develop for, if they want. If they want to use the more power or unique features of the Home or Portable Console then it wouldn't be on the Micro-Console. It would give a reason to own the system and create a more unified ecosystem for Nintendo. I would guess this Micro-Console would be about $100.

Others have pointed out how it wouldn't be needed, but I like to keep imaging being able to stream my Home Console games to any TV in my house, with out having to move the system itself. Holding out hope lol.

@DefHalan:
I think I've explained a few times why I don't like your theory. Though at least it's never because of technical issues because a products like that are already on the market. I'd argue that the Apple TV is such a device and so was the PSTV. The Nvidia Shield is a similar kind of device and the Steam Link is kinda similar in some respects. These devices exist. The issue I have is that I can't see why I or anyone else I know would want it.

For starters I'm probably one of the more vocal supporters of game streaming. I love the Wii U's off-TV play feature because sometimes I'd rather play the game on a portable screen. I love Steam's in-home-streaming because sometimes I'd rather play the game on a TV and not my monitor. But even as a huge supporter of this idea I've never been playing a game on one TV and wished I was playing on the other.

The second point I'd make is that this idea doesn't offer any new content to existing users. It is not an upgrade from either the Wii U or the 3DS. Yes the ability to play VC and indie titles is a nice feature but I can already do that on my Wii U and to some extent my 3DS. Even services like Netflix are nice to haves but are far from the sort of thing I'd buy another box to sit under my TV for. You can get a Chromecast that'll do that job for next to nothing.

As for my theories well, they're pretty boring. I would assume that Nintendo will continue to have two hardware tiers. A portable line and a home console line. I can't see them having a third line in the middle and I can't see them merging the two into some kind of hybrid.

The portable line:
I expect will be a fairly standard product without much experimentation. I would assume it'd look somewhat like the 3DS in order to maintain backwards compatibility. They'll push the spec up and probably have enough horsepower to expand the VC. They'll definitely include the existing platforms plus SNES and they'll probably expand to GBA, N64, DS. The selling point will be graphical improvements and new content.

The home console line:
In the most basic sense I'd expect it to be like any other home console. Optical drive, internal storage, controllers ect. I could see Nintendo doing something highly experimental but I wouldn't expect things like VR. They could potentially continue with their Wii U GamePad experiment although they may just support it as an optional accessory. That said I don't expect backwards compatibility with the Wii U or the Wii but I do expect ports. Lots of ports. I'd expect the VC to expand to include Gamecube, 3DS and maybe the Wii. The selling point will be graphical improvements and new content.

@skywake: Yeah, we have had long conversations about this. If you don't mind I would rather not go through it again lol

@DefHalan:
At least your theory is both technically possible and somewhat unique. Most theories from other people are complete fantasy and my theories are basically "it'll be a more powerful version of the same thing".

If you had asked me before the DS launched what I thought it'd be I would have probably guessed everything.... except for the second touch screen. I also guessed everything about the 3DS except for the 3D. And from memory my predictions about Wii U were simply that it'd be a HD version of the Wii. Same thing again, better visuals. Although with the Wii U predictions I did say that they'd keep using flash for storage (correct) and that they'd go back to cartridges (wrong).

@DefHalan: Whilst I don't think that the idea of a micro console would be hugely popular, I wouldn't be surprised if they tried something like that. Still, I do not think that that is what the NX is or that we're getting such system this year. If they're going to do something like that, it will be after the release of their new handheld and home console.

@skywake: I wasn't "interrogating" you - I don't remember talking to you in this thread for awhile, @skywake, lol But thanks nonetheless.

Thanks to both for admitting that we're really all just enthusiasts. Let's please just keep this in mind.

@Octane: Well, one thing about a micro console is it could see more frequent releases. They could release the first version this year, then the next two years they could release a new home and portable, then the year after that they could release a slightly improved micro console.

Did we ever say we weren't?

You act like it, man. You act like. You don't have to "say" anything.

I don't see how I do. Maybe I act very passionate about gaming industry stuff, but that is because I am.

_{Also I may not count as an enthusiast because I am financially invested in the Game Industry, since I am employees in it, but I still try not to let that affect my interactions here, I try to only let it inform my discussions, if that makes any sense.}