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Topic: The Nintendo Switch Thread

Posts 63,861 to 63,880 of 64,463

FragRed

Has anyone played Klonoa on the Switch yet? I have it on both Switch and PS5 (physical) but have heard it’s not great on Switch which is a bummer be I bought it on there for portable play.

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HotGoomba

@alexwolf I think a eight year gap isn't the craziest thing in the world. The Xbox 360 was on sale for eight years before the Xbox One released. The PS3, Xbox One, and PS4 all lasted for seven years before their successors released.

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Grumblevolcano

@HotGoomba Kinect and PS Move (both in 2010) were kind of a Gen 7.5 (Xbox 360 and PS3 were Gen 7), not in terms of power but more that new hardware changed the game lineup rather dramatically.

Grumblevolcano

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Magician

The five to seven year console cycle hasn't been a thing in decades. The PS2 wasn't discontinued until twelve years after its launch. The X360 and PS3 both ran for almost a decade themselves. We got nine years of support for 3DS. And we're only into year six of the Switch.

Prepare to strap in for at least a few more before we get a Switch successor, folks.

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Ralizah

@Magician In fairness, almost every device is supported for years after a successor releases.

@FragRed Seems fine to me. Native-ish resolution, decent load times, etc. The framerate hangs out around 50+ fps most of the time.

Nintendo Switch FC: SW-2726-5961-1794

Ryu_Niiyama

Yeah I don’t understand why even day1 adoptees are expecting like a four year cycle or something. That’s one of the best parts about console gaming unlike mobile. I’m not a fan of the mid gen upgrades though. Like slim it down, increase hdd space but don’t change the performance specs of the machine family. Hence why I am sitting on my Ps4 and xbone. Waiting on the day i can walk into a store and walk out with both the twins. Luckily for me no games that I really want have come out as exclusive yet. So my old twins (especially with gamepass) work just fine. Optimize and push for well made games. That is all we really need.

Edit: Welp was able to get a series x.

Edited on by Ryu_Niiyama

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Ninfan

I have a physical release of a game and when I try to get gold points to for it, it says cannot collect points for this software yet. Why not yet, the game is only released 3 months on eshop and physical ?

Ninfan

HotGoomba

@Ninfan Because Nintendo Gold Points redemption is a joke, especially for physical games.

@Grumblevolcano Sony barely supported the PS Move, at least to the extent of the Kinect, so I don't think fully agree with those add-ons being "Gen 7.5". But the Kinect definitely brought back some light into the systems, even if it was short-term.

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JaxonH

It's time...

Untitled

@Ninfan
A lot of physical games do that for some reason. It's only 1% back on physical anyways, so you're missing out on 20 cents to 60 cents, depending on the game. It's annoying but not a big enough deal to ruffle my feathers.

@HotGoomba
While gold coin redemption for physical games is half baked, the redemption for digital is absolutely phenomenal. 5% back automatically, with some games promotioned with even more gold coins? That's money in the bank.

Buying eShop cards from eneba gets you at least 10% off (13% off last 2 times I bought), with 2% back from using my CC to make the purchase, with another 5% back in gold coins when spent on the eShop... that's basically 20% off every single digital game, day one.

Back in the day when BestBuy used to have the Gamer's Club Unlocked membership (GCU) it was a $30 membership fee to get a 20% off discount on all physical games. Now granted, it also worked for amiibo at the time, and any game/controller "bundle" would typically also qualify (like Mario Party bundled with a Wiimote), but still. This is basically just as good as GCU, but for digital games, all without a membership fee.

I love it. The gold coin program is by far the best rewards program of any of the major platforms. MS and Sony have okay membership programs, and Steam's sucks with just SteamShop points good for avatars and emoticons and stuff. I wish every platform would just give you 5% back on every purchase.

Edited on by JaxonH

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NeonPizza

I just tried out DOOM eternal on Switch, docked with Pro Controller gyro controls....And good lord was it an eye sore. The choppy 30fps, Low resolution, fuzzy downgraded & battered visuals make it an absolute nightmare to the eyes and for that it's not even worth trudging through imo. On the flip side, the Pro controller Gyro aiming worked really well and kicks analog stick aiming to the curb.

Unfortunately ,ID Software got lazy and never bothered to make Doom slayers in-game gun animations have three demensional movements to accomedate the motion/fluidity you get from motion aiming, like we got with Samus's Arm cannon in metroid Prime 3 thanks to the wii remote's motion pointer controls...which looked amazing and super realistic vs the out of date dog sh** clunky flat robotic jerky moving hand/gun animations you'd get in every first person title that used an analog stick, including the Prime 1 & 2 on Gamecube, with a GCN controller of course. Instead, with DOOM Eternal on switch, when using Gyro, the guns move unrealisticly and flat, it's basically what you'd get with a mouse I guess. You by pass the tank-like jerkyness that you'd get with analog stick aiming in favor of smooth aiming animation but that's about it. And of course as expected, you're dependent on jusing the bottom right analog stick which is also used for aiming in conjuction with gyro aiming which i dont like.

I've always prefered to use the wii remote, like in MP3(advenced setting) and aiming towards the corners of the screen to smoothly and quickly move the in-game camera. It makes for a seemless more inuititive non-desruptive immersive experience, vs Pro Controller or joy-cons(especially) Gyro which again, pretty much requires you to turn the screen with the bottom right analog stick. When that happnes, you have to stop using gyro aiming at that instant, so you're basically toggling between two forms of aiming. I mean, you can't properly do both at the same time simotaneously otherwise it will feel super awkard and there's no need to with a wii remote & nunchuck since the Wii remote + sensor bar operates perfectly as a second analog stick.

Anyways, the PS5 & Series X version run at 120fps, look gorgeous and hits 1800p on series X(1584p on PS5) with 120hz enabled....But no Gyro aiming, unless you opt for that Nexus controller which is only compatible with Series X outside of PC. Seems like the way to go if you want the ultimate DOOM eternal experience on you TV.

Playing DOOM Eternal on Series X cranked to 120fps with a Wii remote + sensor bar would of made for one hell of an expereince, but alas.

Edited on by NeonPizza

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JaxonH

@NeonPizza
Doom Eternal actually has a remarkably stable frame rate.

It's pared back visually and only outputs at 720p docked, but framerate is excellent. Far improved over the original Doom 2016 Switch port, and even that was playable.

Handheld Doom Eternal on Switch is chef's kiss. Especially on Switch Lite where the smaller screen hides the lower res. It's so fast in motion you don't even notice. I've never played a more exhilarating portable game than Doom Eternal on Switch in handheld mode via gyro aiming.

Edited on by JaxonH

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NeonPizza

@JaxonH
Well you've got to keep in mind that we're running 30fps on sample and hold displays, and OLED is the king of motion judder for below 60fps content. The motion in Eternals case is packed with so much blur and choppyness that i personally find it unplayable. The resolution looks lower than a Wii game, it's like they had to Blur or fuz out the games visuals to compensate for it's demanding graphics. i mean, if you were to play Metroid Prime 3 for the Wii on a good CRT display with a component connection it would look super crisp locked in at 480i and 1 million times easier on the eyes as it runs at 60fps, with zero judder and you wouldn't have to deal with any motion blur. night and day. I know I'm repeating myself about prime, but wow, what an amazing expereince that was back in 2007.

You had to of played it on a high end CRT with a component connection. Zero latency vs even the 16ms i got from my LED & PLasma in Prime 3's case(you need every single ms when it comes to motion controls) made Prime 3 control like a dream on the CRT. The two HDTV's couldn't keep up. They were compormised, but still playable, but didn't leave the same impression, not even close. You and i both have an LG C1 that's rocking 13ms. If that 13ms were none existent and the Pro Controllers latency was just as low as the Joy-cons(It's actually 13ms higher. eek), Nintendo switch games including those that boast motion aiming would feel so much better without the 26ms added. but alas.

And I'm not saying DOOM eternals frame rate on switch is unstable, i'm just saying it looks horrific, imo, compared to playing it at 60fps, again when docked.

And just for kicks, i forced an artifical 120fps into Breath of the Wild the other day and it felt like i was almost looking through a window into the gaming world, with exception of no stereoscopic 3D lol Butttt, artifiically forcing 120 has it's compromises like motion artificats, jerkyness and sky rocketing the latency to unplayable heights. Still, it was pretty unreal. Going back to 30 felt choppy and unatural, but you adjust. BOTW is still a beautiful looking game, even running at 30fps. The in-game camera moves a lot slower than Eternals, so you're not smacked in the face with as much judder or blur. It's acceptable to my eyes

To run every game at 120fps, with glasses-free stereoscopic 3D(Without any compromises made to brightness, color etc) with at least 1080p would be a dream for modern console games on OLED or QD-OLED. Native 4K would be ideal, to bypass upscaling, and also allow you to sit closer to soak in every little detail, but alas that demands a lot of horse power combined with 120.

Edited on by NeonPizza

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Ninfan

@Anti-Matter do switch releases on Play-Asia, have an English language option in the settings ?

Ninfan

Anti-Matter

@Ninfan
Not every Japanese games have English language option, depend on who is the developer.

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JaxonH

@NeonPizza
I mean, to be fair, comparing to 60fps or 120fps is always going to seem lacking by comparison. And Switch just isn't the device for that. I think most people (myself included) aren't nearly as sensitive to image as you are, to the point they're always comparing to 120fps and referencing CRTs and talking about motion judder, etc.

So while I acknowledge perception is completely subjective and your experience is of course valid for you, the way it was said just came across as declarative, kind of as if, "that's just what it is, it's bad" and I don't think that's the case.

Compared to other 30fps games, I'd rank Doom Eternal on Switch in the 90th percentile for smoothest experience. The motion blur helps with that (in my subjective opinion).

But ya, I just noticed the vast majority of your posts talking about 120 frames and CRTs and all this other stuff most people just don't care much about, so while your experience may be useful for others who share your enthusiast ideals, I don't think it's going to serve as a very reliable indicator for the majority, which is why I wanted to share my experience with the game, as I feel my tolerance and expectations for performance is much more closely aligned with the average Switch owner.

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skywake

@Ryu_Niiyama
To be honest I think you're completely misunderstanding where I'm coming from. I am a developer, although not a game developer to be fair, and obviously I'm a tech enthusiast. So sure I'm coming to this from that perspective, more power = more possibilities. But to be blunt that's also the reality of the situation here, and good sales/business management has to understand that reality

At the end of the day we're talking about a platform to deliver games. That's all this is. The more compelling games a platform can attract per dollar the more attractive it is to a consumer. And because specs grow exponentially there's always this elastic band that's being stretched every day after launch. Go too early and you miss some of what you could've milked out of it, wait too long and it snaps like it did with the Wii -> Wii U transition. That's the balance these platformers have to make. And it's not easy

Basically game platforms have three main phases. Early on they're super compelling for developers primarily. Solid power, great raw value but the platform maker isn't making much of a margin and the library is pretty small. And from a developers' perspective even if the console bombs you know in the first few years there will be dedicated fans who will still pick it up. A couple of years after launch the hardware isn't quite as good value on its own and developers are starting to hit limits but the library has grown to make up for it in the minds of consumers and the margins are growing. There you hit your peak, when it's most attractive to consumers, which for the Switch was clearly around 2020

From there you enter the third and final phase. The hardware is really starting to show its age so developers are looking for the next thing. Both because other platforms give them more flexibility and because we're at the tail end now and you don't want to launch in trash time. Hell, at this stage the platform holder would be literally telling developers about their next thing. So announcements dry up for consumers. Also for consumers hardware generally has advanced by like 8x/$ so they're looking at other products that run rings around your platform. Does it immediately stop sales? Well no. But it does kill momentum

So when I look at the Switch now? I see a platform that's firmly in the third phase. Which means they need to release new hardware to keep the momentum going. This is why we got the OLED model, and also why we got the New 3DS when we did. Because new hardware? Well that changes the equation, especially if it's a dramatic upgrade at a point where they've already squeezed all they can out of this platform.
Untitled

So yeah, of course I want new hardware because I'm a techie and I like shiny things. But that doesn't mean it doesn't also make sense from a business perspective. Because like it or not, Nintendo is in the business of selling shiny things. They want to catch the eye of people who are, frankly, far less interested in Nintendo's core IP and far more interested in the raw value of the hardware than I am

Edited on by skywake

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HotGoomba

@JaxonH Ok, maybe I was a bit strict when it came to Nintendo Gold Points. Mostly because I get physical games.

@Slowdive Great, now I can play a mediocre experience on Switch!

@NeonPizza I'm ok with 30fps, but from what you're saying, it might not be the case for you because you have, what I'm assuming is a 120hz TV, which from what I heard doesn't handle 30fps and 24fps content well. Is that the case, because if it is, it might be the TV smoothing the frame rate, which I think isn't great for Switch games. Or it's the opposite, I don't know, I don't have a OLED TV, I don't even know what I'm talking about lol.

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skywake

Magician wrote:

The five to seven year console cycle hasn't been a thing in decades. The PS2 wasn't discontinued until twelve years after its launch. The X360 and PS3 both ran for almost a decade themselves. We got nine years of support for 3DS. And we're only into year six of the Switch.

Consumers don't look at it like that. For the average gamer the upgrade path would've been something like PS2/GBA -> Wii/DS -> PS3/3DS -> PS4/Switch. PS2 sales peaked in 2003, Wii sales peaked in 2008, PS3 sales peaked in 2011, PS4 2017, Switch 2020

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StuTwo

Switch is definitely into its late mid-life. The promise of a couple of big, highly anticipated games to anchor 2023 (BoTW 2 and MP3) means that it still has relevance and a hook for the enthusiast crowd but that will begin to fade as soon as BoTW 2 is released. The clock is definitely ticking and they will need to talk about a successor next year (even if they can't release it).

I expect that Nintendo will continue with the Switch into a "late phase 3DS" style strategy to move the console into a budget space pitched at younger players. I think we'll see some relatively low cost, low effort ports of 3DS and Wii games (particularly thinking of things like Kirby Planet Robobot, Woolly World, DKC:R, Mario Galaxy 2, WW & TP HD etc.) and possibly other things that target a broad "blue ocean" audience (Nintendogs Switch surely?) or are straightforward to make (Oracle games in HD) or both. They've cultivated this install base - it is time over the next 12 months to harvest that yield in a way that they kind of fumbled with previous consoles like Wii, DS and 3DS then the console can become a budget gateway into the Nintendo ecosystem for a further 2-3 years.

I think the Switch will be far more successful in this role than the Wii, DS or 3DS ever were for a whole host of reasons.

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