@Snaplocket Removing entire gameplay mechanics (Fire Emblem: Fates) and changing entire storylines (Tokyo Mirage Sessions) in games don't count as "minor edits." And, frankly, "minor edits" don't belong in the M-rated games like Fatal Frame 5, which sanitized the costumes (both in the game and an unlockable one).
Many other games published by Nintendo also got hit with censorship (although usually not as major). It was ridiculous. Hopefully the American branch has gotten the memo to not alter elements of the games in the localized versions as well, although, if push comes to shove, at least the Switch is region free, so people can bypass the censors entirely if they wish without having to purchase entirely separate systems.
This shouldn't be as much of an issue now that Japanese devs are being advised by foreign branches about the content in their games, though. Everybody will get one version of the game. Which is how it should be, considering Nintendo's brand appeal is international.
Currently Playing: Metroid Prime 4: Beyond (NS2); Corpse Factory (PC)
@Snaplocket They're not "making a mountain out of a molehill." You want content arbitrarily censored in your games, and others don't.
Nothing disgusting about the petting feature. It was funny and a great use of the 3DS touch-screen. What's disgusting is literally tearing creatures apart in games like DOOM, but I don't see people like you railing against it. I also don't want that content censored for other people who happen to like ultraviolence.
And one could do any number of terrible things without anyone else being disturbed by it because it never came to light, so I'm not sure I see the relevance of that comment.
I want the game as envisioned by the game designer, not the sanitized version that was changed because somebody at the Nintendo Treehouse has different values than I do.
@MegaTen In terms of censorship, I do agree with that. Sadly, localization tends to put a wedge in that, though Nintendo seems far more open to that this time, so hopefully it'll be left alone.
@Ralizah But then they'll argue that it had to be done because of localization. So far I know, only companies like Xseed will give you the product that wasn't changed for the sake of localization.
Censorship is removing content for the sake of limiting artistic vision and/or ideas. See: Soviet Union and general non-socialistic ideas.
Localization is adapting a product for another audience. This can be done for multiple reasons. See: Fatal Frame and "cleaning up" costumes for underage girls.
@Caldorosso-E But then you assume that this "other audience" does not understand what they're buying. These games are niche, they come from Japan, they'll be bought by those in the know, or people will know. Most of those who want it do not care to have it "adapted" to them. In fact, they want it the way it was intended, as it was originally. To then "localize" it is to ruin it for them.
a: assumes that there is a pure artistic intent. In many cases in the video games industry the 'artistic intent' is to create a work that is as profitable as possible.
b: not something that exists in isolation.
For instance the HBO show Deadwood was heavily 'localised'. They set out to use the original authentic swearwords that would have been used in the real Deadwood in the 19th century... but they realised that words like 'god damn' that would have been shocking at the time are completely quaint to a modern audience. So they swapped out for words that have a similar impact to a modern audience (and the end result is the most god damn sweary programme ever put to TV).
So to bring this back to video games - in Japan to a Japanese audience dressing a 13 year old girl up in a bikini may have a different set of connotations and elicit a very different response that it would if you showed the same thing to a Western audience. It's no longer the reaction the original artist had intended anyway and it has to be changed just to achieve remotely the same effect.
@Caldorosso-E But then you assume that this "other audience" does not understand what they're buying. These games are niche, they come from Japan, they'll be bought by those in the know, or people will know. Most of those who want it do not care to have it "adapted" to them. In fact, they want it the way it was intended, as it was originally. To then "localize" it is to ruin it for them.
I don't think my explaination of limiting information for the sake of ideas or for the sake of selling a product assumes that certain parties are ignorant of their purchases' content in other cultural contexts.
If I did make that assumption, I'd be a case of selling to a general appeal or to a niche audience. In the end, what we call "art" is intended as a product, not a statement on anything vastly important to be included in all contexts. The games in question were intended for a Japanese audience, not an American or European one. Localizers have to weigh the wants of a few dedicated fans vs. potential new purchases, which is no easy task that I make no claim to have a mastery over.
@StuTwo For underaged, sure, but this usually doesn't stick to "just" underaged. Just look at Tokyo Mirage Sessions, which they censored the living hell out of, that's something just unnecessary.
@Caldorosso-E I understand your point, but they've made their decision with the art-style and how they're designing the characters. Those off-put by that, are probably already getting the message and won't be buying it.
@Caldorosso-E Using "localization" as a euphemism for censorship doesn't change what it is, though. If you're altering content because you feel it's objectionable, or that people would find it objectionable, that's censorship. You're not helping them to appreciate the content more or bridging a cultural gap, you're just imposing your values on them.
I knew there would be a Direct and I am hyped for it! Nintendo always does a November direct worldwide and has done since 2012. Usually they only do 1 though in November for everyone. And with December not as frequent this is probably our last Direct of the year.
Enjoy the show folks! Hopefully it is a corker of a Direct! (Please make Amiibo or at least use them...)
A good example of a change made for "localization" purposes: in Akiba's Beat, there's a group called "KKK Witches." In Japan, this is understood as a joking reference to a Japanese company. I think we can all agree that this meaning would be lost in the West. The change was made with the intent of helping the Western audience better appreciate the humor and style of the game.
Removing skimpy outfits is never "localization." It's censorship. I can understand changes like that in games like XCX where Nintendo doesn't want a higher age rating, but there was no excuse for it to be present in an M rated game.
And please, let's not act like sexualized female teenagers are seen as unacceptable in the West. A younger teen like the XCX example? Sure. Older teenagers dressing in skimpy clothing is a time honored tradition in horror media, though. So why the changes to Fatal Frame?
Because the localizers disapproved of the content and wanted to impose their values on their audience.
@Ralizah Hmmm, I wonder how this will turn out for Xenoblade 2, considering it's rated 12. We've seen things so far, but I do think they'll give it their "localization".
@MegaTen I remember my brother and I getting a SNES during Christmas way back when, and that's how I started. People with disorders tend to gravitate towards gaming, or so I was told, and we both fit into that category.
Reminds me of the Gamecube days, Ahhh, Double Dash. It was so much fun smacking people off the tracks back then
@Ralizah The people carrying out the localisation of Japanese videogames are probably the biggest weeaboo's on the planet. Not to generalise but they're probably the type of people who have at least one full shelf of anime involving tentacle rape. It's not about them imposing 'their' values...
...it's about them being professional about their job and understanding the differences between how something will be understood and received in the West versus how it will be understood and received in Japan. They also have to understand what things can cause controversy.
Saying that a game is intended only for a niche audience and therefore shouldn't be judged by mainstream moral-ethical standards won't stop a sensationalist journalist or politician running with the headline "Nintendo sells Harvey Weinstein simulator in game aimed at children" when they find out about the 'touching' mini-game in FE.
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