Topic: Super Mario 3D All-Stars

Up to 75 Shines in Sunshine (which is slightly higher than the number of Stars I got in 64). I'll probably get a few more before putting it down, but I'm really itching to move on to Galaxy.

Besides, it's not like 64 where there are entire worlds I didn't really engage in. Most of the Shines left I believe are busywork stuff like Blue Coin Shines, 100 Coin Shines, and the Red Coin versions of the FLUDD-less levels. Sure, I haven't tried some of the infamously irritating challenges, like the Lily Pad Shine, but if I'm not going for 100% anyways why put myself through those?

For me busywork is talking to A and B backtracking areas like an errand boy. Super Mario Sunshine has no busywork at all. The blue coins are hidden items, there are only 30 per course and most are easy to find. The red coins are presented as a challenge. In the first course, you have to carefully navigate the higher areas and in the second course, you have to navigate between obstacles while riding a blooper. Super Mario Galaxy is not even about platforming most of the time so comparing both and favouring Super Mario Galaxy tells me more about a person's genre preferences than about the quality of each game. People that don't enjoy Super Mario Sunshine don't enjoy platformers.

NOTE: I agree with the video above from start to end, everyone should watch that video and think about what the Nintendo of today is doing with their games and with their fans.

@BlueOcean Yeah I don't think Sunshine has backtracking. If any of the games have backtracking it'd be 64, having to get to the top of the course 3 or 4 times. Why is Super Mario Galaxy not a platformer to you? It seems to check off all the boxes in my eyes

Sunshine definitely has it's quirks, but overall I enjoyed it. Nice platformer.

lol

Of the three games in the collection, SMG is the closest one to being a pure platformer. Very little of Sunshine's exploratory/collectathon elements.

@App Thanks for linking the video, in between.

Super Mario Galaxy is technically a platformer and even has some classic sections but they are quite limited and most of them are horizontal. Most of the time, it's more a linear action game where you just run following a path whether it's on tiny planets or from one launch star to another, hitting enemies in the way until you find a bigger enemy. It has the fun and thrill of action games but it's not a real 3D platformer.

@BlueOcean That's what a 3D platformer is in my book. It's not as open as Sunshine was, but you were still visiting the same place multiple times to retrieve different stars, which is what Sunshine did. Just with Shine Sprites

There wasn't that much 2D sections. Aside from Dreadnaught and Dusty Dune almost all of the game was 3D.

@App The worlds are linear and spherical/horizontal and platform skills are not required. Just compare the first two courses of Super Mario Sunshine with the first galaxies of Super Mario Galaxy 😂.

If this was directed at me:

1. I'm by no means saying that Blue Coins can't be/aren't fun to collect, but they're clearly there to pad out the runtime since Sunshine doesn't have as many worlds as 64, so they needed some other way for you to be able to reach 120 Shines. This isn't a knock against the game BTW, it's just an observation. Maybe "busywork" isn't the right word, and "padding" would be more appropriate.

2. I was clearly specifying the Red Coin missions in the FLUDD-less levels, and not Red Coin missions in general. Maybe a bit unfair to lump them with Blue Coins as "busywork" or "padding", but they're still not new experiences unto themselves, rather a twist on an already completed challenge, so I don't feel too bad about skipping some. In general I actually enjoyed Sunshine's main Red Coin missions moreso than 64's, precisely because they were usually laid out with a specific challenge in mind (such as the Blooper Surfing), rather than oftentimes just being a scavenger hunt.

3. Never explicably said I liked Galaxy more, just eager to get to it since it's the only game in the collection I haven't touched yet (at least not in years, as I played the Wii version over a decade ago).

@BlueOcean Well when you put it that way i can see the difference. But like you said comparing both games is futile. They're both unique and original in their own ways. I would argue that platforming skills are required however. It's by no means hard and not even close to being more difficult than Sunshine, but there is still a level of skills you need to have to grab certain stars.

@RR529 Just to add to your Blue Coin comment, they're only there if you're going for 120 Shine Sprites. So the Shines you get from the Blue Coins don't count toward simply beating the game, only the first seven episodes of each world. That's my main problem with SMS, honestly. It's still a very good game, no doubt - I just wish the progression was just getting a set amount of Shine Sprites, like how every other game did it with say, Power Stars from SM64 and SMG.

@RR529 Only the part about "busywork" was directed at you, the part about Super Mario Galaxy was obviously not because you didn't talk about Super Mario Galaxy, that's why I didn't mention your "name". I see what you mean but I have to disagree about the red coins challenges in the secret levels of Super Mario Sunshine. They are a different kind of challenge because you have to cross levels in a different way. A perfect example is the first secret level of Gelato Beach, why would you bother going to the sand blocks at the sides if not to collect red coins? Also, the way you play the level is different because you have FLUDD the second time. Yes, they are using the same level twice but the secret levels are short so it's not really padding but an additional platforming challenge that you can beat in around one minute if you're skilled. It's insignificant padding compared to Luigi's quest in Super Mario Galaxy and the green stars "quest" in Super Mario Galaxy 2.

@App I agree, they are both good games but playing Super Mario Sunshine again after many years, I can clearly see how the platforming skills are required right from the start and how Super Mario Galaxy gameplay was changed drastically to something more horizontal/spherical, linear and action-oriented.

As for Super Mario 64, I believe that starting the level for each star is part of the game design, you start at the start (ha!) and go to different places of the course each time depending on your objectives. Yes, you have to climb the same mountains several times but there's so much freedom and Mario is so agile that I never saw this as a negative thing.

Good morning
i join this forum because i have a problem with this game and i hope you can help me.

It's about Sunshine
I have 58 Stars and i defeat Shadow Mario in every World except Ricco Harbor.
And Ricco Harbor has a problem.

I want to get five star in level, episode 5 "Gooper Blooper Returns"
For going to the helipad and defeat blooper i must use different Fluud (rocket fluud) and it is under the helipad.
But i can't use it, because the game said to me it's an Hologram yet.

Any Solution Please?

Thank you very Much

(Sorry for my bad english)

@ux2x100, you don't need the Rocket Nozzle to get to the helipad. Just get up on the rooftops near the area where you first fought Gooper Blooper and you should be able to access a path that's close enough to the helipad that you can hover to it.

@ux2x100 In order to access that the rocket nozzle, you need to unlock the rocket nozzle for that level first. You can find it on the suspended platforms above the water. It's in the opposite side of the map of where the Gooper Blooper fight was. If you collect that one, all the other rocket nuzzle boxes become available.

rocket nuzzle... heh

But yes Octane is correct, you can get to the helipad without the nozzle, however, if you do want it for later levels it's where he described it at. The turbo nozzle is found in episode 7 in the first boat you see.

@Octane @RR529

Thank you very much it works and i finish the game.

I'm sorry but Super Mario Galaxy is almost pure platforming. Aside from 3D World I don't think any other 3D Mario game has you leaping from one platform floating in space to the next or leaping over timed obstacles as often as the Galaxy games. They are almost the very definition of twitchy platformers taken into 3D. I think the platforming in Galaxy is technically tighter and more challenging than Sunshine in terms of what it's asking you to do (but clearly much easier to perform and much less punishing).

Sunshine - by contrast - often plays like a very basic third person shooter. Especially early on in the game. As a platformer it is less linear and designed to encourage you to "find your own shortcuts". This is nice - and massively under-rated - it's something that not enough games have really explored since Mario 64 opened up the possibilities. Some platformers have gone down that route but it isn't a core part of the platformer experience.

Of course - such labels don't really matter too much. Ultimately you either enjoy the game for what it is or you don't.

@StuTwo I couldn't disagree more but I have already explained why.

@StuTwo Yep. The Galaxy games are both pure platforming, where you run and jump to clear set obstacles. Sunshine is more of a exploratory playground: you get a bunch of environments that are open-ish and allow you to poke around, and platforming comes naturally as part of the exploration. Odyssey took that even idea even further by increasing the scope of the environments and putting more of an emphasis on smaller collectibles as opposed to one central thing in each environment. Although Odyssey also has more segments designed around the idea of linear platforming challenges as well, so I'd say even Odyssey qualifies as more of a pure platformer than Sunshine.

Funny when you think about it, the "pure platformer" sections of Sunshine are easily some of the most disliked.

They want you to do in one go what future games would give you 2 checkpoints for.