"Slaves, obey your human masters with fear and trembling, in the sincerity of your heart, as to Christ." (Ephesians 6:5)
"Slaves are to be submissive to their masters in everything, and to be well-pleasing, not talking back ." (Titus 2:9)
"Slaves, submit yourselves to your masters with all respect, not only to the good and gentle but also to the cruel. " (1 Peter 2:18)
While it is true that there was slavery in those days, isn't there still slavery today? When you go to work, who are you under? Your boss, of course (unless you are the boss). There is a servant-master relationship there. The servants were looked after though, by most masters, but the point was to obey them while in that position, as to Christ, knowing that those 'masters' also have a Master that they will have to answer to. Circumstances like having an abusive dad, or being a slave to a cruel master in this world are unfortunate, but they will all answer to God one day.
Moses says: "Now therefore, kill every male among the little ones, and kill every woman who has known man by lying with him. But all the young girls who have not known man by lying with him, keep alive for yourselves." (Numbers 31:17)
This only applied to the Canaanites in regard to the little ones. Their crimes were so awful, that God, who is the Lord of all life, has every right to take it when He deems good. Instead of my own apologetic (mine has basically mirrored the following), here, read Matthew Henry's take on this: 31:13-18 The sword of war should spare women and children; but the sword of justice should know no distinction, but that of guilty or not guilty. This war was the execution of a righteous sentence upon a guilty nation, in which the women were the worst criminals. The female children were spared, who, being brought up among the Israelites, would not tempt them to idolatry. The whole history shows the hatefulness of sin, and the guilt of tempting others; it teaches us to avoid all occasions of evil, and to give no quarter to inward lusts. The women and children were not kept for sinful purposes, but for slaves, a custom every where practised in former times, as to captives. In the course of providence, when famine and plagues visit a nation for sin, children suffer in the common calamity. In this case parents are punished in their children; and for children dying before actual sin, full provision is made as to their eternal happiness, by the mercy of God in Christ.
"If any man takes a wife, and goes in on her, and detests her, and charges her with shameful conduct, and brings a bad name on her, and says, 'I took this woman, and when I came to her I found she was not a virgin..." (Deuteronomy 22:13,14)
"But if ... evidences of virginity are not found for the young woman, then they shall bring out the young woman to the door of her father's house, and the men of her city shall stone her to death with stones..." (Deuteronomy 22:20,21)
You skipped a bit here... oh well. If the man was found to be lying... but in this case, she is found to not be a virgin, she had dishonoured her family and the man. Also, this was to discourage promiscuity (fornication), and basically the lusts that war against the soul.
Wasn't Hitler Catholic? He took the message a bit too extreme IIRC.
Hitler was used as a puppet by the Vatican. The system of Roman Catholicism has never been biblically justified (just using a coating of Christian symbology as its veneer). But that's another topic.
I'd say that my life as an Atheist is a lot better than my life as a confirmed Christian was - the process works both ways. Religion can oppress people and alienate them from their families if they don't accept what their parents have accepted. I'm not saying religion is bad, but I am just saying your argument works both ways here.
If this is what you believe to be true, then I can say nothing else.
@Nanaki: First off, the stuff from Numbers and Deuteronomy you quoted isn't meant to apply to us anymore. It's from the OLD Testament, pre-Christ. The stuff about slaves, if taken in context, is shown to tell people how to deal with the circumstances they found themselves in at the time, and NOT to condone slavery as a way of life. And there is a correct state of marriage according to God's word that puts the man as the head of the household, with his wife for love and support. There's nothing wrong with this, and even the strongest feminists in my church respect this fact.
See, that's another thing: The world is approx 4.5 billion years old, so the old testament was predominant for a massive amount of time (assuming that God created the world and man), so the turnabout in his message is a relatively short time ago. And still, there are places in the bible where it goes strongly against out conventional norm of society in the New Testament.
As for a man's proper place at the head of the household, I think notions like that aren't there to be blindly accepted.
Well, this topic has gone off the tracks rather abruptly. I knew some people would have to start having religious discussions eventually instead of simply answering the original question and moving on. Oh well, it was interesting while it lasted.
"The government of the United States is not, in any sense, founded on the Christian religion."
I was born and raised Methodist Christian, but like grenworthshero, I had a hard time actually believing what I knew. This changed when I went to a non-denominational Bible-beleiving church with a friend one day, and I've been going there ever since, finally a true born-again follower of Christ.
Nathan obivously knows what he's talking about, and I back his statements up fully, save for the Miriam slip in his first post (shoulda been Mary). Kizzi has also said some real truths.
Here's something to think about: Look at current events and politics world-wide. Which religion is under the most persecution, and having its rights attacked at every turn? Christianity. You're not even allowed to pray in school anymore, but people of any other relgion can do whatever they like uninhibited. This is, to me at least, a clear attack of Satan.
I'm glad to see that you are a Christian too,Stuffgamer1! I'm a Christian,too.
@Kizzi,Stuffgamer1,JTCPingas09,Nathan,and everybody else who is a Christian on Nintendo Life. I would like to talk to you guys privately about Christianity,please send me an email. My email address is in my signature.
@Kizzi.....I believe in Creation but I also believe that once we were created there has been a process of natural selection. Survival of the Fittest. I believe that creatures do change such as the humans pinky toe barely used, .... coal plant blacked out the woods with burn coal causing the woods to have a black coating on them and the white moths actually adapted and their color changed to black to survive, etc. Life has its unique way of adapting, growing. Everything does....... Even the gaming industry. I mean seriously in just twenty years look how far its come. Its astounding. Thats human adaptation to changing enviroments. In short I just think life is simply amazing. I do believe there is a higher power (God) that rules but I'm not completey blanking out that people and creatures changes because simply science shows that it does. (for the recored I really dont think we evolved from apes, thats just absurd)
All very sound and not absurd...The Bible itself holds two stories of creation...Creation where God formed Adam from the Earth and breathed into him life...The laid Adam down, put him to sleep and pulled a rib and made Eve...There the story of evolution...God created the Heavens and the Earth, the birds of the skies, the fish of the sea and the beasts of the fields...The God chose man and rose him up from the other beasts to hold dominion....There are a lot of contradictions and the interpretations and translations are hard to see...Adam and Eve were the first two humans in the story of creation, and they populated the Earth, yet they another translations and verse says that the two only had two sons, Cain and Abel...so it is tough...I think one should see the work of what they believe in everyday...When you see good, when you see bad...
there's also the fact that non-christian peoples also came up with morals and codes of law all on their own that were/are totally viable. they (the different moral values) may seem strange to us because we were not raised in the same manner or environment, but that doesn't automatically make them any more or less 'bad' or 'wrong' in and of themselves.
God did give us our morals. He gave them to us through our conscience. He also wrote down the ten commandments, but not everyone knows them. Everyone has a conscience. When you lie, steal, covet, etc. your conscience tells you that what you are doing is wrong. Every person has a conscience, but they don't always follow. You know when you feel horrible after commiting a sin, that's the guilt of your conscience.
Nanaki wrote See, that's another thing: The world is approx 4.5 billion years old, so the old testament was predominant for a massive amount of time (assuming that God created the world and man), so the turnabout in his message is a relatively short time ago. And still, there are places in the bible where it goes strongly against out conventional norm of society in the New Testament.
How do you know the world is 4.5 billion years old? Where you there?
@Danny August: Adam and Eve lived hundreds of years. I think it is safe to say that they had more than two kids. Cain and Abel were just the only ones that were told in the Bible. Plus, God said go multiply on the earth. I think he would mean more than 2 people.
there's also the fact that non-christian peoples also came up with morals and codes of law all on their own that were/are totally viable. they (the different moral values) may seem strange to us because we were not raised in the same manner or environment, but that doesn't automatically make them any more or less 'bad' or 'wrong' in and of themselves.
God did give us our morals. He gave them to us through our conscience. He also wrote down the ten commandments, but not everyone knows them. Everyone has a conscience. When you lie, steal, covet, etc. your conscience tells you that what you are doing is wrong. Every person has a conscience, but they don't always follow. You know when you feel horrible after commiting a sin, that's the guilt of your conscience.
you may believe that way, but I do not. i believe the conscience is a result of living in social groups, of society; society tells you that what you did was wrong, and thus the inklings of shame appear within because, as humans, we have the ability to remember what we have done, we can think about it and the consequences of our actions from multiple angles, and we can empathize with all involved, for good or ill. when you lie or steal as a child, your mother or father admonishes you and tells you that you have done something to be ashamed of, that you have hurt someone else, and that stays with you for the rest of your life. nothing wells up from within as your conscience until society or natural consequences (i stepped on the frog and now the frog won't play with me anymore, why won't it play with me? perhaps it's hurt... i shouldn't step on the next one) come in to put it there.
BEST THREAD EVER future of NL >:3
[16:43] James: I should learn these site rules more clearly
[16:44] LztheBlehBird: James doesn't know the rules? For shame!!!
@TheBlackDragon: How does society determine what is wrong? How do our parents determine what is wrong? We all have God's moral code written on our heart, and it is called the conscience. That is where all the moral laws come from.
Hmmm....Am I the only one wondering if it isn't the time to close this thread before the shit really gets kicked up? Everyone has discussed things in a fairly civil manner so far, but its only a matter of time until someone starts flaming another. I mean, this is a video game site, right?
"The government of the United States is not, in any sense, founded on the Christian religion."
"Sun worship is fairly simple. There's no mystery, no miracles, no pageantry, no one asks for money, there are no songs to learn, and we don't have a special building where we all gather once a week to compare clothing. And the best thing about the sun, it never tells me I'm unworthy. Doesn't tell me I'm a bad person who needs to be saved. Hasn't said an unkind word. Treats me fine. So, I worship the sun. But, I don't pray to the sun. Know why? I wouldn't presume on our friendship. It's not polite."
Nanaki wrote See, that's another thing: The world is approx 4.5 billion years old, so the old testament was predominant for a massive amount of time (assuming that God created the world and man), so the turnabout in his message is a relatively short time ago. And still, there are places in the bible where it goes strongly against out conventional norm of society in the New Testament.
How do you know the world is 4.5 billion years old? Where you there?
How do you know God created the world... were you there? Seriously, I nearly didn't even bother with this one - I only did because I felt the need to point out how puerile such a point is.
I can't believe that the earth is only 6,000 years old. All that documents it is a book that was written over 4,000 years after it allegedly occurred. Truth being told, we'll most likely never know till the day we die, so there's not really much point debating what we've questioned and looked into many times before this.
But, it has been pointed out that this is straying from the topic, so I'll desist with this debate before the topic gets totally derailed.
@Nanaki: I like debating, and I mean no disrespect. I want to say this though, you didn't answer my question. But to respond to your statement, I know the earth is only thousands of years old because you can find it in the bible, which has been proven accurate many times. There is no historical evidence at all that backs up the therory that the earth is billions of years old.
I know the earth is only thousands of years old because you can find it in the bible, which has been proven accurate many times. There is no historical evidence at all that backs up the therory that the earth is billions of years old.
@Nanaki: I like debating, and I mean no disrespect. I want to say this though, you didn't answer my question. But to respond to your statement, I know the earth is only thousands of years old because you can find it in the bible, which has been proven accurate many times. There is no historical evidence at all that backs up the therory that the earth is billions of years old.
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