Topic: The Ethics of Emulation and ROMs (edited)

Video game rentals are legal in my country (Canada) and illegal in Japan. Would it be ethical to find a black market game rental shop in Japan and rent a game? And if I rented a game in Canada, would it be Canadian ethical but Japanese unethical?

The same moral arguments against game rentals can be made against emulation or against reselling games. The thing is, media companies influence legislatures to make these laws and we have an inclination to see the law as being rooted in morality. Some might think a law is right simply because it is the aw. While others might see the law as wrong but see the act of obeying the law as moral. Emulation is legally grey because scummy corporations have paid politicians to make it legally grey and the question of ethics follows with it.

You don't have to base your ethical beliefs on that.

To be honest, the problem I see is that the copyright system doesn't work so well with programs and video games. It's a "one size fits all" type of deal that is the problem. My personal solution is to make the copyright of the code (not the assets, that's a different kettle of fish) have a copyright term of 25 years, with one renewal.

(And for the LOVE OF GOD, STOP SAYING DISNEY BROKE THE COPYRIGHT SYSTEM! I know Disney has done some less-than-ethical things in the past and present, but abusing their power to keep Mickey Mouse out of the Public Domain isn't one of them! The modern copyright system is based on the ideals of Individual Intellectual Property.)

I’m having deja vu right now

@Eel So you've been to this place before?

@SeantheDon29 that person above said the same thing, nearly word for word, in the previous page of this thread.

@Eel Hm, a paradox, perhaps?

I have resorted to emulation for PSP and only PSP... and I feel slimy-er than normal

Bit of a necro thread but it's an interesting discussion that's probably more relevant now than it ever has been. Between the Steam Deck and the increasing exposure various android and windows portable "Switch clones" are getting as a result.

Of course the Nintendo official point of view would be that any unofficial emulating of any games is wrong. I think most of us can probably agree that that point of view isn't particularly solid and probably pushes things a tad too far. If Nintendo had their way you'd wouldn't be able to use anything from flashcarts to things like the Analogue Pocket. I think we can agree that is.... way too far....

On the other extreme some people draw the line at "no longer (easily) purchasable". Which is a view I have some sympathy for but am not entirely sold on. With this mindset you'd argue you're justified in downloading a copy of F-Zero X or something purely because there's no way to pay Nintendo for a copy of that game currently. Which is probably fair but it can also change. Eg Klonoa would've been in this status up until pretty recently, at what point was it not? Announcement? Release? If you "pirated" it before the announcement should you ethically be buying the remaster now? Gets a bit tricky. I don't agree with this position

I think the safer line is probably ownership. If I physically have a copy of Skyward Sword on Wii I think it's kinda hard to argue that I shouldn't be able to rip it using a Wii I also physically own to emulate it on a PC using official Wii controllers. But there are blurry lines here also. What about Metroid Prime Trilogy which I brought on the Wii U eShop and can't (or can't be bothered working out how) to rip? Am I justified getting that iso from some shady website? What about the GC versions? Am I justified getting the original MP GC iso so I can play using a GC controller given I brought the Trilogy on Wii U?

And you might think yes to all the above, you might not, but how much further does it go? If I'm paying for NSO+ Expansion can I ethically get those SNES/N64/NES/MegaDrive ROMs to run on other hardware? I'd argue no, because I'm paying specifically for a service on a Switch. Can I ethically get the SNES ROMs for games I have on the SNES Mini? I'd argue yes, because while technically I purchased a limited licence I did effectively purchase ROMs and a device to play them on. And that's about where I draw the line personally

@skywake yes!

Nothing wrong with emulating games, but you should only do so for games you already own.
I prefer to play older games on emulators cause of the resolution bump.

I don't really use emulation as I'd often just buy the console the game came on, be it a 3DS or a N64, so it's hard for me to care that much about Nintendo's official stance against emulations. It does kinda feel like piracy in a way after all since you're literally playing their games for free, therefore stealing from them regardless of your reasoning.

I personally use roms I've extracted myself from my own GBA and DS cartridges, in part because their hardware is aging and I want the originals to last a bit longer.

I don't find much enjoyment in downloading them, since I feel it cheapens the experience. So I limit myself to those ones that come from "my" games... Your mileage might vary, but that sense of ownership remains for me, they're extensions of the cartridges I have in my shelf.

That being said, they do not replace the originals. It's more of a convenience.

I have a save file for Deca Sports DS forever saved on my PC... I've truly used all emulation has to offer.

I fully agree with the statement above.

I would add to that, I don't see harm in "playing for free", games that are not currently available for sale in the marketplace (abandonware). For example, I wouldn't look down on anyone playing Mother 3 right now.

But yes, generally, if you want to play then you should pay. When I was a kid I had a bunch of game systems (that was my big Christmas present every couple of years), but I barely owned any games. Occasionally I would help on my friend's paper route when he couldn't, and mow rich people's lawns when he couldn't, or go through the couch cushions, to get the $3 or $4 to rent an NES/SNES game for the weekend.

Now, many decades later, with the Switch is the first time I've truly owned a library of games, and am supporting the games industry single-handed.

With the full 3ds eshop shutdown, does anyone have a suggested way to play 3ds games that have been missed — preferably on the 3ds? Asking for a friend.

@Tott yes it’s very easy, you see: first you visit eBay and find a listing for the game or a 3DS that has that game

@Eel
This is very difficult if the game was never distributed physically, or had DLC that is no longer available for purchase.

@Tott I suppose this could/will be extremely difficult - depending on physical distribution numbers etc...

Probably the closest way to get to 'where you want to be' is investment in a SteamDeck and going down the emulation route.

(nb I'm certainly not advocating such, as I'm aware of the murky morality around this suggestion, but am purely presenting an objective means of accomplishing the goal)

@Tott a flash cart is probably the 'easiest' method if you still want to use the 3DS - assuming you can find one as they are not as popular as they once were with the likes of the DS. Modding the 3DS with custom firmware is probably the 'best' way, but would be a little trickier - although you can find step-by-step guides online.

@Tott Modding your 3DS with custom firmware would probably be easiest. I can't provide links here obviously, but I did a quick search on Reddit and found a step by step guide and I did mine easily with no previous mod experience.
The subreddit also provided a link to a site that has virtually all the 3DS software preserved for download via QR code using the 3DS camera.