To celebrate the 35th anniversary of The Legend of Zelda, we ran a series of features looking at a specific aspect (a theme, character, mechanic, location, memory or something else entirely) from each of the mainline Zelda games. Here, Kate compares Skyward Sword to a corridor, or something...
Skyward Sword. A two-word title that strikes fear into the heart of many. But worry not, my dear Zelda-loving/hating friends - I come to ‘bury’ Skyward Sword, not to praise it. Some of our Zelda essays have been about how much we love a particular game, and don't get me wrong — I am a Skyward Sword apologist — but this is not one of those essays. I want to talk, instead, about an interesting feature of the most divisive Zelda game - its fascination with liminality.
Ah, liminality: the friend to all university essay-writers and pretentious games journalists alike. The term comes from the Latin for "threshold" — limen — and that's exactly what it means: a space between. A liminal space is the threshold between doing something or being somewhere, and what comes next, a space that — perhaps unsurprisingly — can elicit feelings of excitement, reverence, trepidation, or fear.
It can be a place in time — a sunset, for example, which is a liminal space between night and day — or a literal place, like a waiting room, a car park, or a hallway. It can even be a feeling that's hard to pin down, a feeling as though you're stepping from the past into the future, like when you take your final exam in university and you think to yourself, "wow, I'll never have to write another essay ever again," and then you write 2,000 words on liminality in video games even though no one asked you to. Something like that, you know.
Zelda games are full of liminal spaces. The Temple of Time is a big one — the threshold between child and adult, mortal and divine, loud and quiet — but the smaller, less obvious ones are just as beautiful. There's the Kokiri Forest, the last monster-free area in Hyrule, where the Kokiri remain in the perpetual state of childhood, like Peter Pan. Later on in Ocarina of Time, Dampé mans the creepy graveyard, and eventually even crosses the threshold between life and death himself, becoming a ghost like those he guards.
In Minish Cap, the portals to the world of the Picori are perfect liminal spaces: hollowed-out stumps and pots that shrink Link into mini-Link, a transformation which takes place in a perfect sunbeam, almost like a temple. And then there's Majora's Mask, a game so dang obsessed with liminality that it would be easier to find an example within of a non-liminal space.
But we're not talking about Majora's Mask today. We're talking about Skyward Sword, and you already know my feelings on it (it's good, actually), so rather than making an impassioned case for the game that we'll all presumably be replaying this summer, I want to talk instead about how Skyward Sword uses liminal spaces to kickstart the legend of Zelda that we all know so well.
We begin Skyward Sword with a story of good vs evil. A disembodied voice tells us the story of demons plaguing the newly-born world: "The earth cracked wide and malevolent forces rushed forth from the fissure." Alright, that's pretty darn liminal - the forces of evil create a literal passage from the realm beneath to the land above. But then, of course, to protect the humans of the land, the goddess Hylia sends them up above the clouds, to Skyloft - a place neither on land, nor truly belonging to the sky. Since then, the Hylians have dwelled there for ages, and the legends of the world below have been lost.
So, immediately out of the gate, we have three realms: the place below, where evil lives; the place above, where Skyloft is; and the place in-between, the land that would become Hyrule. But perhaps this is a good time to pause, and discuss why liminality matters, and why it's used so heavily in Skyward Sword and all other Zelda games.
Placing the players in a liminal space is not just about creating the feeling of unease or of anticipation, but of telling a story of transition.
Many heroic legends (and stories in general) are about transition. Becoming a hero is far more interesting than already being one, after all. Liminality and legend go hand-in-hand, because both are all about rituals - the ritual of becoming, the ritual of discovering, the ritual of moving towards the next thing. Liminal spaces set the tone for something big happening, while you're still in the deep breath beforehand.
Being in a liminal space, like Skyloft, means that you don't belong - you're only there until the next thing comes along. It's that sense of not-quite-belonging that drives Link on his quest - things cannot stay perfect and idyllic when you're only halfway to the goal. Either you change where you are, or something will change it for you.
Because liminal spaces are often things like waiting rooms, petrol stations, and that bit right before you fall asleep, they often come with feelings of nervousness and tension. There's a sense that you're expecting something to happen, because while you wait, you're suddenly made vulnerable. That tension can be leveraged into a cool story very easily. The most exciting thing a game can offer is a vast unknown, ready to be plundered for its secrets and mysteries, just slightly out of reach - and Skyward Sword's expanse of clouds that hide the earth are exactly that.
Link himself is on the verge of adulthood, as he usually is in Zelda games. He also has really creepy lips, but that's not relevant to the thesis of this article, I just wanted to mention it. And, because I've really got to drive this point home, his day begins in a nightmare - and dreams are a liminal space between awake and asleep, where you are both at once.
Let's skip forward a little. Link travels beneath the clouds, and lands himself on the world below, where monsters (which have conveniently evolved to require slicing in a particular direction) abound. Even further into the story, Link will break through the boundaries of clouds elsewhere to find the hidden Isle of Songs, the boundaries of the spirit world to enter the Silent Realm, and the boundaries of time itself in Lanayru Desert - all as the embodiment of evil, The Imprisoned, attempts to break free of the boundaries of its cell. And what are boundaries but (you guessed it) liminal spaces that exist to keep two things separate?
Every obstacle to both Link and Demise — the game's Big Bad — lies between them, before they even know it. Every time Link breaks the guard of Ghirahim, or opens a new door, he moves closer to Demise. Every time Demise breaks free of the seal, or attempts to destroy the Gates of Time, he moves closer to his goal of obtaining the Triforce, but unknowingly closer to his final, impassable hurdle: the Hero, Link
(And, by the way, the Triforce itself exists as a whole triangle broken up by a lovely liminal space right in the centre. Also, the Goddess Harp that's instrumental — ha — to the plot? An interesting choice of instrument - perhaps one of the very few that are played by strings between something, rather than on top of something. This theme goes deep. Or maybe I just have a fine-tuned sense of how to stretch out an analogy.)
It's all Matryoshkas within Matryoshkas, all the way down to the heart of it, the heart of every Zelda game: the final battle between courage and power, light and dark, good and evil. There are liminal spaces between the two in life, of course — the grey area where people are neither wholly good nor wholly bad — but Skyward Sword, like all Zelda stories, and all heroic legends, is about breaking through all of that and discarding everything grey until there are only two truths left: the Hero, and the Villain.
So, there you have it. Skyward Sword is all about breaking through boundaries, dwelling in the spaces in-between, and the tension of transition. Perhaps some of you are thinking, "this essay is a little more than a janky motion-controlled Zelda game deserves," and you're probably right - but, let's be honest, games journalism is most commonly just a big ol' nerd writing about beautiful toys for grown ups, and we take what we can get.
As an entry in the larger series, Skyward Sword itself is a liminal Zelda game: it's very few people's favourite, but it's certainly not the worst; it came at the very tail end of the Wii's lifecycle, just as Nintendo was about to transition to the Wii U; and, what's more, it was the game that came right before Breath of The Wild's open, borderless world. Skyward Sword is full of limitations, gates, doors, hurdles, and boundaries, and that's a large part of the reason why people don't like it. But it's also what makes the story so quintessentially Zelda, even as it throws a lot of convention out the window - and what made Breath of the Wild feel so unusually, unexpectedly free.
Comments 74
I feel like I’ve learned something today.
Good Lord that read like a top class review. Educational as well. Makes me want to play the game again. Thank you for the great read.
I was in the camp that liked Skyward Sword and was grateful for a game that actaully used wii motion plus. Loved the art, settings, music as well as the gameplay. I am looking forward to the Switch version. Minus the wii motion control, being HD and playing on handheld it will defo feel fresh enough. It's been years since I played it also. Underrated for me.
And this coming from a big Zelda fan.
Unless this was your first Zelda as a child and nostalgia strikes hard for you, this is the worst 3d Zelda miles away. Not bad, just the least good. The same happens with the oracle games for me. Maybe not that good for everyone, but as my firsts, I have them highly ranked.
The most disappointing, limited areas of any zelda. When I realized it was just those 3-4 settings, I remember it feeling soooo deflating
Lolol the Lil Nas X comment.
That was a very nice read, with solid explanations, good humor that doesn't overstep its bounds,and a thoughtful tone.
Very interesting read. Looking forward to playing this again. Like Majora’s Mask it offered a fresh take on the series formula that was, I think, well executed.
@KateGray I’ve also observed for a while the liminality of Skyward Sword’s game design too, being between Twilight Princess and Breath of the Wild in terms of traditional, linear elements, freedom and combat.
As an aged, irredeemable nerd myself, I loved this article. Utterly fascinating angle to look at Skyward Sword (and really any number of adventure games).
My favorite point in any adventure game or RPG game is about 25-30% in, when you’ve powered up enough to make decent progress, but still anticipate so much more greatness to come.
Transition is a concept with which I’ve been intimately acquainted these past few years, and it’s SO UTTERLY TRUE that it can be a time of vulnerability and fear, as well as excitement. But the hope and anticipation for journey’s end makes taking the plunge worth it.
Thank you for that reminder, Kate. I’m absolutely loving your work here on NL.
💖🤩
I honestly never liked the gameplay due to the linear world and the overworld not being interesting. Plus it was annoying how mych Fi just pointed out the obvious..
I like skyward sword for the lore, but the gameplay just isn’t for me.
What an incredible read. So, the town centre in Ocarina of Time is a liminal space? Everything seems to freeze and time stands still.
Fascinating.
@GrailUK
You needn't have looked it up in the dictionary. You already knew the word liminal as part of the word subliminal, which means "under the threshold" (of consciousness).
@GrailUK yeah, that's a good one! Also, its function as a crossroads between a bunch of other places, as a meeting place on your way to somewhere else - it's liminal as heck. As a result, it has that weird sort of in-betweeny feeling, and even when it's not full of zombies, there's something unsettling about it... like it doesn't quite belong!
@Teksetter somewhat appropriately, I turn 30 this year. 29 is probably one of the most terrifying liminal ages to be! But I hear the other side of 30 is more fun
A wonderful, thought-out piece indeed! I'm in the camp who likes Skyward Sword, though I do acknowledge (like most games) that it contains some flaws. The story is amazing, decent music, (mostly) fun dungeons and bosses, some neat/awesome mechanics were introduced, and SS Zelda is one of the best interpretations of the character. Sure, the world is pretty gated at times, but to me it felt way less empty than Twilight Princess and even sections of BotW.
🙌🏼🙌🏼 Another real top class read. I’m getting used to this quality now!
@KateGray Another member of the "Soon to be 30" club, huh? I'm trying to make the best of it. It's just a lame number, after all. XD
@Tyranexx Time is a construct!! But also I would like some nice presents to make up for the trauma
@KateGray
My older daughter just turned 10, so definitely those decade markers really are liminal points when you can’t help but think about your life.
Kate, even if all I know of you is what you’ve written on a video game website, I can still confidently say: You rock this much at 29, you will continue to rock righteously in your 30s (and well beyond)! 😎
You make me wish I could go back in time and tell myself to try those creative writing classes, that it’s ok to be yourself, and that one day video games would be cool and not just for the boys! 😊
Jesus Jones I wish I could use words like this and be eloquent and stuff. I would feel like I could take on the whole world. Can’t wait for skyward sword again. Wish I could have my bird and fly in other Zeldas. Great work Kate xx
@KateGray Yeah...that would be the pre rendered backgrounds haha (ahem). I totally get what you mean! Thank you for your articles.
@TheWingedAvenger Yeah, good call! I have to say, it's not something I appreciated before. If I'm honest, I don't think I could without it taking me out of the moment (if you know what I mean.) but definately something to reflect on!
@KateGray Presents, good company, and a little cake and ice cream do wonders to help with aging trauma!
@Controller-Drift I disagree. Skyward Sword has the best soundtrack (first time a full orchestra was used and not as minimalistic as Breath of the Wild), some of the best characters and great dungeons. My least favorite 3D Zelda is Twilight Princess. It looks drab and gray most of the time and gets a bit tedious after a while. The only reason I finished it was Midna. Also Zelda has practically nothing to do in the story. In Skyward Sword on this other hand she is an active part of the narrative.
Gameplay wise I have only two complaints.
1. There is way to much hand holding
2. The motion controls. While I had no huge issues with them, they weren't ideal and I can totally understand if someone is turned off the game by them.
Beautifully written, a fun exploration of thought:)
@Controller-Drift
Oddly for me it wasn't my first, but it's top 5 material for sure. Definitely beats out BoTW for me, so I'm for sure in the minority. The music, graphics, story, Lanayru(?) Desert with the time crystals, the forest that floods, the floating sky islands, the upgrade system, there's so much about it that I love. Probably tied with OoT for 3rd place
This article is everything that's wrong with English literature courses. 2000 words of nothing. What point or takeaway is being made here, other than "look at me flex"?
Edit: I don't mean to be nasty, I appreciate something more than the usual news retweets, but this is just, here's a word, look at me use it.
This is, by far, the most pretentious piece of horse manure that has ever been posted on Nintendo Life and that's saying something.
Seven paragraphs of meandering nonsense before getting to anything resembling a point. It comes across like a pseudo intellect discovered a new word and decided to use it as much as possible tobtry and convince everyone that they were making an intelligent point.
It's Skyward Slog, the second worst Zelda game of all time, no lofty vocabulary could possibly shine that turd.
@countzero
I agree with a lot of your post, but Twilight Princess is 🤌 Beautifully somber game. For me it goes Wind Waker, Twilight Princess, OoT, Skyward and Minish as my current top 5. But the series as a whole is so awesome that my rankings fluctuate constantly
I love this game, but it brings back sad memories of things that was happening in my life at the time of its original release. I have it preordered, but Im wondering if I have the heart to see it through again.
Ah, liminality: the friend to all university essay-writers and pretentious games journalists alike.
Now, now, @KateGray, you didn't even name yourself "THE QUEEN OF GAMES" this time. Credit where credit is due.
@KateGray Turning 30 this year too!
I gotta say, Skyward has to be my least favorite 3D Zelda though.
@VR32X I hope you're doing better now.
@Northwind Americans grade things on a 1-100 score too...
@Ambassador_Kong @N64-ROX Could be wrong, but I feel like you missed the entire light-hearted silly tone of the article. To me, it seemed like Kate knew full well that it's a highfalutin trip she was taking the reader on and gave plenty of hints at the get-go. It had a little bit of substance near the end, yes.
And just because you can define almost anything as liminal if you move the context of what is before and after, does not mean that stories and other media can't lean on the qualities of being in-between.
One point, not made — or I didn't notice — is that experienced Zelda players might find the broader story itself liminal because of their knowledge of how the story in other Zelda games play out in later chronology and the inevitability of how it concludes.
I learned a new word today.....
Whilst these Zelda pieces are interesting, I would love for each of the writers to write a jokey and most amusingly savage review of a game they didn’t like much or just has potential for hilarity. I always found brutal reviews the most fun to write. I’m still giggling about links big ass lips.
@Northwind I graduated with a 2:1, and quite frankly I was lucky to get it! I spent most of my time hanging out in the university newspaper offices and putting off all my essays until the night before deadline.
It wasn't until third year that I realised that, since I liked writing, I could just write an essay in my voice rather than trying to emulate a style. That was my first (and last) 80 - I wish I'd tried it earlier 😅
@Ambassador_Kong @N64-ROX I mean, I was definitely aware of how pretentious it is to use a twenty-dollar word for the entirety of an article, yeah. I mention that a fair few times in the body of the piece, after all. But sometimes it's fun to look at something from a new angle!
And I'm definitely not trying to show off - I explained what liminality was at the start, because I wanted everyone to follow along with what I was saying!
EDIT: also I didn't do English Lit, if that makes a difference 😅
@Controller-Drift
"Unless this was your first Zelda as a child and nostalgia strikes hard for you, this is the worst 3d Zelda miles away. Not bad, just the least good. The same happens with the oracle games for me. Maybe not that good for everyone, but as my firsts, I have them highly ranked."
Nostalgia aside, it's still my favorite Zelda besides BOTW. Questioning people's tastes is ok, but assuming right away that they are nostalgia biased is not honest. As long as i have actual arguments to defend my tastes, you can't assume that i'm biased without even hearing about them.
There's a part of context in my affection for the game, because yes i was young when i first played it, so the all "Zelda for dummies" idea did speak to me specifically. Outside of that, i do have a ton of points that are still valid to this day, because i kept wondering for years why i had so much fun replaying this game again and again without getting tired of it when so many people seemed to dislike it.
I’d never heard of the word ‘liminal’ before. I love reading these sorts of deep takes on the video games that were so memorable to me. An unusual feature for Nintendo Life. Keep it up!
Why'd you have to insult my hairstyle lol? Also wonderful article, I've never paid too much attention to liminality in games, but I may now.
Skyward Sword was ruined by mandatory motion controls. Why obliterate a Zelda game by making adults wave a control back and forth thousands of times just to play the newest Zelda (at the time). Motion controls are a gimmick and bring the value of a game like Zelda down to zero, since you can't turn them off. I got the gamecube version of Twilight Princess originally and I basically never played SS because of motion controls, which is why I am super excited for the Switch re-release of it.
To sum up, motion controls are the worst and Nintendo ruined about 7 years of games by forcing them into places they didn't belong.
And good god people!, if you didn't know the word "liminal" before you read this article, then you need to spend less time playing video games and more time reading, because it's not that rare or complex of a word.
@Lanmanna I am. Thank you. During that game’s release, I was getting medically discharged from the USAF, and had my heart broken several times over. That game was an escape and I 100% it. I’m now a civilian, married, with two jobs. I hope this game feels like the first time and I can make new memories with it.
I have to say that I did like the literary perspective in this article. Kate mentioned somewhere above that games journalism is just about nerds writing about their toys. I like that she provided a more thoughtful perspective by exploring liminality. We see that game designers put in this effort when designing a game, so it is nice to see a bit of deconstruction in video game journalism. More "literary critique" articles like this are something I would welcome.
We can explore anxiety of modernity in Kafka, the pressures of socialism in Kundera, but why not various (applicable) themes in video games? They are an art form to a certain degree and some games can bring to light understanding of topics like liminality--which Kate has done here.
Either this is a huge coincidence or content-related advertising has grown very sophisticated. Either way, this is the most liminal cat I have ever seen:
The cat does not truly exist within the woman, nor in the outside world. It exists only in the transient space betwixt woman and world, trapped eternally in the liminal plane of fabric that binds it - neither in, nor out, but perpetually between. The illusion of it emerging from the shirt only heightens the sense of disparity between the wearer’s inner self and that which they project into the outer world.
You may think, “it’s only a T-shirt”, but is a T-shirt itself not in fact the most liminal of all spaces? A boundary between society and self? A skin we change at will. Both a canvas for self-expression, and a cloak to conceal our true, naked forms. Functioning as if a part of our very bodies, and yet casually removed and replaced at the whim of the wearer.
Our clothes are who we become, as they in turn become a part us. An ephemeral epidermis; changing with the ebb and flow of the seasons and the fickle fancies of fashion. Ultimately dispensable, yet an indispensable part of our identity. The shape-shifting frontier of the self. Liminal in every sense.
/Hastily submits liminal cat T-shirt thesis 20 minutes before deadline in bleary caffeinated stupor/
@KateGray your 30s are just like your 20s... but with more cash (hopefully!).
I like the article; I’ve always found the clearest threshold in Zelda games is Ocarina’s transition from childhood to adulthood. Link travels to a world of harsh realities after gaining the master sword, the same world he is used to is now darker but still recognisable. In fact there are several conversations with NPCs prior to this where they talk about him being ‘a real man’ or ‘to take responsibility’.
I also like the theme that we never really grow up (adult Link had a grown up body but mentally hasn’t aged) which is apt for any Nintendo fan with nostalgia, as we still enjoy the games from our childhoods but now have to deal with adult responsibilities.
I played Ocarina for the first time when I was 16 back in the 90s so it really resonated with me back then and it is still by far the best Zelda IMO. Yes, Breath of the Wild has more impressive mechanics and a great open world, but it lacks the heart and soul found in Ocarina (but is fantastic in its own right).
Keep up the good work!
@Classic603 I think the main issue is how I played it. I first played the Wii version on the WiiU and then a few months later Twilight Princess HD came out and I played it again. I finished it twice in one year, which means it can't be that bad, but I definitely had less fun the second time.
@screechums I don't agree that the motion controls added nothing to the game. I think the idea of having different ways of attacking with the sword was great, only the execution wasn't great. I'm curious about how the non motion controls will work in the remaster and if the motion controls are any better with a Joy Con.
Edit: PS: Being the "worst" 3D Zelda is still better than most games
@screechums
So basically you're making fun of younger people who don't have the same culture as you, while at the same complaining about a gameplay that you can't deal with because you're not able to adapt to a new gaming paradigm.
Some people didn't manage to use this control scheme properly because they just waggled trying to replicate the awkward E3 moment from Miyamoto, and thus gave up not even halfway through, blaming the controls instead of actually trying to understand and master them without having a preconceived opinion about them.
Literally all the people that i've seen complaining about this control scheme are men who are 25 y.o. or more, usually in their 30s or 40s, that tells something.
@screechums Over 40 and always have a book on the go as well as a video game. I read a wide variety of books as well. I can't say I have come across the word. I also was actually "relieved" regarding the control scheme, strangely enough, as there was a good game bar wii sports resort which used the wii motion plus control scheme well. The Switch experience will be different so you may like it better (?).
I remember how several reviews at the time said it was maybe the best Zelda game ever, and how they wouldn't want to return to playing it without motion controls... And at that time, I agreed. It has one of the best casts of characters, a change I'd love to return to, in any Zelda game. Even the titular Zelda is more human than ever. Maybe not as big a role as in Spirit Tracks, but it's debatable how "human" she is in that game...
I welcomed the changes, and loved how there was not a moment where it didn't feel like progress was being made (part of its linear design from puzzle to puzzle or fight). Only sad how I had to use the cutscenes to quickly figure out a puzzle while ignoring what Fi said, for it to still be kind of a puzzle, not just a task.
I may even dock my Switch to replay it with motion controls, while I almost always play handheld. And docking it and plugging my tv back into the wall and all that, may get me back into Ring Fit as well.
@screechums And yet, I thinks the game benefited from them. Several genres did even, and still do, like the console 3D shooters (gyro aiming on Switch) and racing games (we all probably tilted our controllers in sharp turns anyway, pointless as it was). I got used to playing shooters with controllers, but I wouldn't want to go back without gyro aim. Whenever I play a PSVR game, I love it when they make the best of every motion. Sure, it's not as easy to pick up and play, that's definitely true. But once you're installed, it's easier to get into it and to control it precisely... Until something fails and you're pulled out of the experience entirely by lacking technology. That's another point against it. But calling it entirely wasted when they experimented and delivered some fun, great, and lasting results... I loved the Wii, as a main console, for "hardcore" gaming.
@countzero well said
@Shambo agreed 👍
I’m 37. Gaming since I got the NES at 5 years of age.
Upon reflection, Skyward Sword is my favourite Zelda.
When I played BOTW, I was in awe, adored it (still do), and it was my new no.1. Since playing it through 3 times, I’ve realised that, as others have said, it’s an incredible video game, just not an incredible Zelda game. I think that holds true. BOTW has wonderful exploration, and is its big selling point. But unlike most Zelda games, I never really had those big moments of “s#it yeah, look what I’ve just accomplished” after demolishing a dungeon. BOTW had no dungeons. The Divine Beasts should barely be in any dungeon discussions. It was a semi interesting twist, but a let down.
Personally, Twilight Princess is my lowest ranked 3D Zelda (but still great!). Kinda feels like many were clamouring for a grown up, adult-looking Zelda game, and lapped it up regardless. For me, it just felt like a more polished Ocarina of Time with a few more ideas. Enjoyable but a stopgap expansion.
Skyward Sword?
1) best story of the series.
2) best music of the series. The MUSIC. Go listen to the OST.
3) arguably some of the best dungeons of the series.
4) Motion controls: I genuinely enjoyed them and had no issues. Others did. I have a theory. By and large, younger generations are represented more online. Gets less and less the older you get. All the people who were children in 2011 probably DID have some trouble with the SS motion controls because it required some finesse and wasn’t simply a TP wagglefest. Those kids now have the largest voice online, 10 years later. While I know there are people my age and older that also had trouble...anecdotally, most of us around my age weren’t bothered by it?! A then 27yo adult isn’t going to have the same struggle as a 4-13yo. It often required patience...ie. not a kid thing.
5) That Impressionist art style tho... HANDS DOWN THE MOST BEAUTIFUL.
Thank you for listening to my TED Talk.
@KateGray @aaronsullivan
You're right of course, the whole point of this was to just play around and have fun with language.
Maybe I'm just a jaded guy who did take plenty of English courses and is getting flashbacks. I'll chime in again the next time I want to mention how much the N64 rox.
been seeing more of Kate Gray's posts here recently, and i gotta say im impressed. I've found all the articles that i've read by her to be quite entertaining and/or educational!
You have a great authorial voice, Kate! keep it up
@Callisto4081
Waggling a video game control is a pretty pathetic element to consider a part of your culture. And you can consider it an opinion because I'm older than you if you want, but the bottom line is that you are in a tiny minority if you think video games are better when you have to wave your arm around like an idiot all day just to play. If anything the motion control scheme should be optional, not mandatory.
I could so easily turn this back on you and say that the younger generation is just too ignorant and gullible to see that motion controls injected into games like Zelda is just a marketing choice to support the gimmick system the Wii was to begin with. Why do you think no other company followed them into that ridiculous trend, and why the Wii U pretty much got rid of motion controls entirely and Nintendo has been re-releasing all the old motion control titles again without the same control paradigm? You sound like a crybaby talking about "oh it's just men at such and such age who complain." This weak and disgusting new trend of trying to group yourself in as some kind of victim and me as some kind of aggressor insulting your "culture" because I criticized something you like. In my opinion, games that force you to wiggle around all day are for rubes, sorry you're one of them.
@countzero
@Shambo
@LEGEND_MARIOID
to you more moderate objectioners, I have a different response. If you liked the motion controls, then ok that's fine. but to take a game like Zelda and tell everyone, "hey, if you want to play this game you MUST wiggle your arm hundreds/thousands of times even though since '86 you've been able to pleasantly sit down and use a controller and just explore and enjoy like a normal game" I think just sucks. To me it's just a gimmick, like the stilus was for the DS. Phantom Hourglass and Spirit Tracks were so annoying having to use that thing to draw movement on the screen. Those gimmick controls should be optional, that way you can just choose if you want to do it that way. Not everyone just swallows all these bogus and cheap marketing ideas without complaint. Some of us just like to play a game like normal.
@screechums Sir, this is a wendy's
@VanishStampede
hahahahahaha good one
@KateGray - The other side of 30 is about the same for a little while, then towards 40 it starts to all go downhill.
So you have that to look forward to... enjoy it while you can. Not that life becomes terrible as you close in on middle age - but to quote Canadian prog-rockers SAGA "Although the reasons always change, there will never be days like these again."
@KateGray Oh dear Kate, dreading 30. Enjoy the twenties while you can, all will be downhill from here.
Until your kids reach an age where they can play couch co-op games with you. Then it's uphill again.
@screechums lmao
Did you even see speedrunners on that game ? You don't see any waggling. You exactly prooved my point by showing that you don't know what you're talking about. The Wiimotion plus uses gyro technology, thus can not identify the device's position in a 3D space, but only its orientations (i.e. only rotations matter). Therefore, quick and precise wristle strikes are much more accurate than wide waggling that makes you looke like an idiot, as you rightfully pointed out.
As a kid, i knew nothing about the techno involved in these controllers. I just tried for myself, and figured out on my own that this way of playing the game is way more efficient. Anyone can do it if they're open minded and are willing to try new ways of playing their games.
You can call this a gimmick if you want, meanwhile i never felt as much immersion and fluidity when switching between my different items and gear in BOTW that i did in SS.
For your knowledge, i have a great respect for gaming culture as a whole and its origins, and happen to play and appreciate retro games every once in while. I don't need to pretend that games or other medias that i don't like aren't worthy of being cultural objects because they just are, that's a fact.
I'm also not trying to do a generalization here, many older male gamers who are open minded and patient have proven my point wrong. It is just a social observation that i made : all people (or a very large majority) complaining about this control scheme (and really the Wii in general) are old male gamers, which doesn't mean that all of the old male gamers population tend to do that.
@Callisto4081
Of course I haven't seen any speedrunners. Why would I waste a single second of my short life in this world watching someone else play a video game, let alone someone who runs through it as fast as possible just to beat some arbitrary record that has no meaning whatsoever. There are far too many books to read, foods to cook, and women to meet for that. I like to play games occasionally, but I'd rather be hit in the face with a frying pan than watch someone else play them even for a second.
My original point was--and sorry if it seemed harshly stated--that gimmicks like that should be optional, not mandatory. Call it an older man's opinion if you want, I can almost guarantee I'm in the majority on that one, and I think that's obvious. I have no problem with you enjoying what you enjoy, I just don't want to be forced to do it too.
And this "way more efficient" statement you've made, you kids and your hyperbolic comparatives and obtuse use of language; it's like I'm living in a Kafka nightmare on these comment boards. Efficient means least amount of effort/energy expended to accomplish a goal. Motion controls are literally the exact opposite of efficiency. Just say you like it if you like it, because there is just no way you're going to make a valid case for it being better. And mind you, it's virtually absent from games now, which means the industry didn't find it better either. Buy a VR if you like it, just keep it out of Zelda.
@screechums It's not absent, just not promoted as heavily as before. Ask Splatoon pro players to play without gyro, they'll laugh hard. Basically any shooter on the Switch becomes way more intuitive with this technology.
And again, it's factually true that SS can be played very efficiently without much effort. I did my last playthrough chilling in my chair without mooving any part of my arm above my elbows, going through several hours long sessions with ease, and i don't have that good of a physical condition.
You're in the majority because people with influence didn't know how to play the game properly, thus spread that the control scheme sucks, establishing the game's bad rep. The vast majority of the "majority" that you mention either didn't went more than 15-20% into the game or didn't play it at all (and don't want to because they assume the game's bad based on its rep). Two days ago, i found someone on YT who tried to argue about the game's level design being bad without having touched it even once, his opinion was just based on random criticisms that he heard here and there.
Given the game's sales, a vast majority of the fanbase didn't even play it, because of what i mentioned prior + the release context and mandatory Wii motion plus accessory that some people didn't have. I've seen so many people in YT comments about SS HD saying "Only Zelda i've never played, i can finally experience it."
........
Ok...how many people are gonna be triggered?
I probably already made a comment on here, so I guess I'll put out something different. Skyward Sword walked so Breath of the Wild 2 could run. Skyward Sword had a lot going for it. Too much to the point where one concept of the game completely took away from what people wanted the game to be. Ultimately, Skyward Sword still ended up retaining one factor, and that was boasting an effective story. That's why I love Skyward Sword. It's almost like a cinematic video game, and for Zelda standards, the only games that rival this are Majora's Mask and Age of Calamity.
Played back when it came out and loved it wasn’t too hot on the motion controls but they were ok. Was looking forward to playing on switch lite but couldn’t play at all, u had to flick the right stick for the sword and I didn’t want to cos they are delicate! Also anyone who can pull off those left right left moves consistently deserves a medal in my opinion xxx
I didn't play Skyward Sword until the Wii U, as I was one of the weird people who didn't get a Wii. The good news, however, is after I learned the greatness of Nintendo, I got to really enjoy Skyward Sword. You can definitely jot my name down in the "pro-Skyward Sword" side of the debate!
Whenever I read something by Kate, I wish more things in the world were written by Kate. Great voice
Skyward Sword and Twilight Princess are the worst Zelda games. Windwaker that came before them are much better.
Nintendo was aware of this, at the Game Dev conference they said BotW uses Cel Shading because they felt that Windwaker stood the test of time because of that art style.
I enjoyed Skyward Sword. Having never finished it on the Wii. It’s been a treat to play. Was it a better remake than Twilight Princess or Wind Waker? I would say no. I’m kind of mad at remakes in general because I get burned sometimes. You pay full price for a game that doesn’t really have any extras. Link’s Awakening one of my favorite games in my childhood , took me a measly day and a half to complete. I just purchased Pokémon shining diamond and although not a Zelda game the remake is rather bland. I don’t even want to finish it. I could of plopped a DS cartridge in my 3DS and could’ve played through it. At least I got my long lost Jeraci.
I think I’m getting off topic but you get my jist. Is Skyward Sword my least favorite Zelda game. Absolutely not. As far as Zelda games go here is my list :
1. Breath of the wild
2. Wind Waker
3. Twilight Princess
4. Ocarina of time
5. Majora’s Mask
6. Skyward Sword
OK let me scratch that Skyward Sword is a great game it’s just my least favorite out of the 3-D Zelda games. It all boils down to the controls.
I have to say, i usually don't agree with Kate's reviews that i have read, therefore I have started not to read them on games I'm interested in, especially that i know i will like (I'm only saying this to make what comes next that much more meaningful, not to hate), but this was a magnificent article. I really enjoyed it, great job!!
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