Soapbox: Modern Zelda Bosses Are Getting Harder, But They're Nothing Compared To The Oldies

The bosses in Tears of the Kingdom are a real stand out of the game for me.

Unskippable cutscenes are a problem however that make attempting them more tiresome than need be.

Majoras mask final boss was always so odd, which was the point but, I wasn’t ready for how odd it was going to actually be lol.

I have beaten all the regional phenomena and the only hard one was queen gibdos which may be a new least favorite boss fight of mine. Mostly due to my own stupidity I died a lot. Still doesn’t hold a candle to Vaati in minish cap. That boss doesn’t mess around.

I haven't beaten TotK yet but all the bosses in BotW were super easy. I had time to take selfies with all of them. So far it's been the same with TotK. (common monsters are tougher in Tears I think).

Not a complaint. I still love it. I really enjoyed the Colgera fight even though it was barely a challenge. Just a lot of fun. Hard doesn't always equal good.

I replay ALttP a lot and yeah, Mothula is hard. I think I'm pretty good at that game but Moldorm and Helmasaur King still fill me with dread. I quit my second playthrough of OoT back in the day because Bongo Bongo was driving me insane. The difficulty of the OG NES games goes without saying.

Things were tough back in the day, I tell ya. You kids never had it so good.

"I absolutely do not want the next Zelda game (whatever that may be) to require me to pour hundreds of attempts into a Gohma-like boss just to keep up with the punishing #gudgamer mindset that worked so well for the likes of Elden Ring (which, coincidentally, I really enjoyed)"

Might be missing something, but I don't see how that's considered a coincidence. Maybe it's dry sarcasm.

I found the bosses in Tears of the Kingdom to be pretty easy, especially Colgera, but maybe my experience isn't representative of the average player. For the most part, I didn't bother with the Regional Phenomena until the back half of my overall playtime so I had tons of equipment, buffs, and upgrades at my disposal.

The bosses are no harder than previous Zelda games. It's just more people are playing these games then ever before. Expect these "difficulty complaints" to increase year upon year as gaming expands further and further.

Are the bosses to get easier or is just us, after YEARS of gaming, to be too "good" ?

Great, let's shout for the harder bosses! Make them fun again, make defeating them an actual reason for joy, not the "uh huh" that is being served to us!

If you can beat a boss in 5 attempts, it's not a boss. (Sorry, Father Gascoine, you were just a bit too slow).

Mantis Lords from Hollow Knight, thanks for the fun

The difference is that the old bosses were somewhat difficult, but once you'd gained the skill and learnt how to do it, you knew how to do it again. In modern Zelda - and it's been this way since Skyward Sword, I'd say - I can muddle through but I never feel I've mastered it.

@CorvoRevo no, the bosses (and the rest of the games) are much easier now because the devs think we all have less than 5 braincells. Either that or balancing a game so that it's fun to play is too expensive.

If you boot up an old game, you'll notice how it was meant to be a fair challenge right away.

I've played almost every Zelda game on release, and honestly ... other then a HUGE difficultly spike in Adventures of Link, I don't think the game have ever really had any real noticeable variation in difficultly.

I think a lot of the "Back in MY DAY, the bosses were HARD, not like kids today ..." nonsense comes from ... well, that just being a thing old people like to say about literally everything. At the same time, if I was 8 and there was no internet and no way to get help other then hoping there are some tips in a monthly publication ... I bet BOTW and TOTK would be SUPER HARD.

Memory is weird and subjective. Don't get me wrong, a lot of games in that era WERE hard as balls, but it's important to remember why. They had to be. You could beat them in 20 minutes if you weren't dying every 10 seconds. But for games like Zelda and other games that already provided gameplay much longer then was expected, they didn't need to ramp up the difficulty. But we keep hearing "old games are hard", and our mind starts to create a narrative. (1)

That's not to say there weren't some SLIGHT variations in difficulty. But I really think the idea that Zelda games today are easier then what came before them is completely blown out of proportion. I spent a week trying to defeat Shadow Link when I was ... I don't know, 10? But if I was to play that game today, I could look up the fact that you can just kneel at the far left of the screen and beat him without taking damage. I might even figure that out myself, given I have 30 years of video game troupes to draw on and a strong understanding of game design fundamentals that comes from playing them for so long.

That just wasn't the case back then. Everything was new. Information and practice makes games a LOT easier.

1 - It's also kinda important to remember that if Nintendo felt a game was too hard they simply didn't release it overseas, and when they built a game for international release they made sure it was pretty easy. Before FF7, it was the belief of most Japanize developers that only children played games in the west, and that western children were really, really dumb.

I’m not sure if I’d class the older games’ bosses as hard, necessarily - but you did have to trial-and-error your way to figuring out how to hit their vulnerable spot, and it could sometimes take a chunk of time to do that. I haven’t died at the hands of a Tears of the Kingdom boss yet (although I’ve had to run from a couple of mini-bosses due to being unprepared). I don’t think it’s because I’ve gotten better at figuring out the weaknesses over the years, I think it’s because the bosses’ weaknesses are easier to figure out/they just have a lot more weaknesses… but that said, Tears has a whole lot more content than the likes of Skyward Sword or A Link Between Worlds, and if I was having to take several tries to progress I think it would put me off… I guess what I’m saying is that this balance of boss difficulty works for me (not that I’d hate a more challenging boss rush mode or something, a la Skyward Sword 👀)

And that's why I skipped as many fights as possible and gave up on the game after finishing the last temple. I'm not interested in stressful boss fights, so I'll wait with finishing Zelda games until they add easy difficulty modes (so probably never).

I disagree bosses are not getting harder especially when you can just pause, heal up and gain both strength and defence buffs that makes everything easier

ToTK is much harder for me than the older Zelda's. 2D Zelda's had better temples and puzzles, but 3D Zelda games had tougher bosses. And ToTK bosses are a struggle for me. Well except the wind temple, that one was simple. But the water temple boss was an absolute pain for me

Botw. An open world adventure game, with some optional shrine puzzles along the way. I completed it and only did about 50 shrines.

Totk. On the other hand is essentially 50% adventure and 50% puzzle.

My experience so far with Totk is that the Zelda adventure is let down by the puzzle element. In Totk the puzzles have taken over and detracted from the adventure. They have become essential to advance.

Nintendo changed Fire Emblem Three Houses by detracting from the original concept of the game. They have done it again.

And how many gamers who have completed the game can say hand on heart did not cheat. Not many I would guess.

Zelda games have never had hard bosses. They’ve always been more cinematic than difficult. And that’s just the way I like it.

I don't know about bosses, but I never felt I mastered Lynels in BotW.

I can't think of a Zelda boss that was genuinely difficult, in any Zelda game. They're always a big set piece (not that I don't enjoy them)

@TheBigK Colgera is a piece of piss. You can literally just shoot arrows at the underbelly sections in bullet time, and it only
takes TWO arrows for each section.

King Gleeok is frustrating though, the final phase is like whyyy

The 2D games are by far the hardest Zelda games to me. In TOTK the only difficulty is the beginning of the game but once you have a few hearts, upgraded armor and a couple fairies you're pretty much untouchable. I think I only died a few times in the first couple hours in and then 80 hours later I have yet to die again.

...I'm sorry?

Guess I really don't get this one... One of my big gripes with TotK (and BotW as well) are the dumbed-down bosses. Especially in TotK, you are basically permanently in godmode with all the items and skills. You can pause and heal at any time, and can carry unlimited fairies and potions.

Zelda enemies, both boss and common, always have been kind of like little puzzles; you only were able to beat them easily by figuring out their gimmick. This idea also almost completely disappeared from TotK and BotW.

They sure aren't getting harder...

I thought the wind temple boss was quite difficult. Of course, I was underprepared for the battle. Only after helping my son beat the boss did I learn you could also use arrows :/

It's just and ye olde gamer, old gamer, geek dad gamer thing to say. The bosses are just as enjoyable now as before for me. Just in different ways.

@zool Zelda has basically always been celebrated in large part for its puzzles (temples) so it makes sense that they'd capitalize on it the way they have been and I can't imagine many people consider it any sort of step back. In fact they've been about puzzles way longer than they've been about exploration considering every game before BotW was essentially on rails. Fun to discover things of course but not done via any sort of "exploration", rather led from a to b.
The vast majority of the 30+ million who play this game won't ever know about any of the cheats. I personally knew of the duping but never cared to cheapen the experience for myself.

I'm just glad we aren't at the Wind Waker / Twilight Princess levels of ridiculously easy combat any more. I love those two games but they do not have any challenging enemies whatsoever.

I'm currently playing Aeterna Noctis and just finished Souldiers now those games are hard.
I play Totk for a more relaxing pace, it isn't a hard game compared to others I'm currently playing.

@SpaceboyScreams dungeons/Temples and Shrine puzzles are not the same. Temples and Dugeons puzzles were an intricate part of the game. Shrine puzzles are more clinical, and put there to make the game longer.

There are dozens of you tube channels showing the solutions so cheating is easy.

Typical Nintendo, fix something that's not broken.

They're fine, I think they're better than the stuff in the pre botw 3D Zeldi games, just in general though most of the Zelda bosses are more for the spectacle than the gameplay.

Can't say for Tears (don't care to play it) but Breath of the Wild had the most eh bosses, the designs were boring and they blurred together, the fights were really eh. The puzzles before them were more engaging then the bosses themselves.

When I see old Zelda bosses I go ok what pattern do I need in this cool setpiece. If other games I go oh hit it till it dies right that's boring. Other games can do it too but I always appreciated that about Zelda when I 'get to those points' I suck at the console ones and got through the DS entries so eh but still.

Any games that had some good uses of the tools to teach you and if they wanted to use a boss I'd gladly want to use those tools to beat the boss whether strict uses of a pattern or not then just hit it generically wow how boring because to me the 'you can use anything' isn't exciting when they don't have enough going on that's intriguing to use any option when it's not really any option.

-I can't use the environment to defeat them,
-I can't distract them,
-I can't use a grapple hook to get on them scripted or not at least some sort of 'throw at them,
-tie to the ground or just get on top of them',
-throw something at them that's very particular (among a number of other possibilities).

Players are stuck with whatever ranged/melee and magic they allow me to use how rivetingly unengaging of 'choice'. I'd take a tower defence fight then those. Hence I liked the Sunset Overdrive tower defence segments over the actual bosses (besides yes grinding on rails) but I mean doesn't more 'input' or dynamic or whatever else of 'actual choice' then 'doing the same thing you have the whole game with weapons' sound more compelling to me it does at least.

Games don't push mechanical depth (same as we see the same animations than more organic ones unless it's motion controls trying to and with some alright to sometimes awkward execution but they are trying after all with something different) that I'd like so when I see pattern based stuff I'm at least happy enough they have something planned same with linear games the pacing and 'exciting' things to see happen the open worlds are usually pretty boring so I seek the exciting shrines and other stuff instead then the 'yeah it's pretty normal' quests and other stuff I never care about at all even if scripted it's better than hitting bosses generically with nothing really going on to heighten it.

I love how people say souls all the time for difficulty, put in perspective Ninja Gaiden, more harder, more movement needed to beat them then souls games, requires more skill. Anyway back on topic.

The side bosses outside of the main Ganon ones they were interesting designs and still basic of hitting them till they die even if you can likely bring over materials with your items, use bombs and more then the strict ones of Ganon minions or whatever so they did have more interesting use cases you could fight them with at least.

But I don't know while sure the others in past games are very 'work out how to beat this stage of the fight with this temple/dungeon item you acquired and did puzzles with' and the set pieces they were more exciting to do then Breath of the Wild's hit them with anything who cares approach and pretty average set pieces especially after doing the puzzles in them (and the same Sheika look the Shrines sure there was tons and it made sense for them to be that way I'd say but the insides were varied enough in the layout/goal of each puzzle to be distinct and memorable but the 'main' dungeons yeah that's a bit underwhelming) which was boring and lacking challenge.

Just whatever arrows/whatever melee you had (and hadn't broken yet) as you couldn't really bring the materials to those locations, sure you have the items with bombs and maybe soem thing you could do but your not using the gate to open with statis in one of them to hit the boss or lock them out/put a distance between you or something, you know more interesting uses of the environment (I don't expect like traps or tower defence but still) and your not using your fire wind up drafts in those locations either you have to be inside the structures and of course you can't do the item use of pushing rocks, using statis or other draggable materials (again the statis use of the gate) and so on that you could beat the outside bosses you can't do that in the strict locations of the Ganon minion/forms, whatever they are boss ones.

BOTW was a walk in the park. It was made by a Nintendo that was still trying to woo casual gamers, making inoffensive games that anyone and their grandma could pick up and play.

TOTK is not one of those games, if you are not a gamer, it will kick your ass.

@piecez not convinced, I don't expect gloom hands to easily kill me, but guardians had beams of death (at the beginning), the 360 degree heads to target you, and gloom hands eventually leave.

@zool They're not the same but they scratch many of the same itches in their functionality. People who picked up old Zeldas liked using their brains, and the shrines make you use your brain. A puzzle is a puzzle.

Yeah I think you vastly overestimate the amount of people who are nerdy enough to look up cheats on YouTube. I'll bet less than 5% of male players and .05% of female players will ever bother. I'm sorry that you broke your own experience by making the game too easy for yourself but anyone with any sense could have told you that that's what cheating does.

The reviews would indicate they did just fine.

Except for the final boss the TotK bosses were very easy. But they had great designs.

Mucktorok: He was just annoying.
Colgera: Cool boss, but easy...
Queen Gibdo: ...Annoying...
Gohma: Was fine.

Definitely not the hardest bosses in the series...if you they're hard, go play Majora's Mask and get back to me after dealing with Gyorg. lol

For me, 3D Zelda bosses from Ocarina - Skyward are generally way easier than the 2D bosses (with a few exceptions, like Demise being very tough and all Minish Cap bosses being pretty easy, including Vaati).

I think TOTK and BOTW’s bosses bring the 3D boss difficulty back up to where games like ALTTP and the Oracle games were. Especially when considering field bosses like Lynels and Gleeoks who are much more of a challenge than most Blight Ganons.

Of course this is all relative based on how talented specific players are at certain skills and whether you over/under level yourself in BOTW and TOTK.

@Joeynator3000 Funnybhow different our experiences are. I found (the second phase of) Armor Ghoma and Queen Gibdo way harder than Gyorg. The fish hits like a truck but its pattern is really simple & easy to exploit, and it telegraphs its big attacks. Both those TOTK bosses have a few different patterns and attacks that fill the room with different obstacles to avoid while doing a decent job of concealing their vulnerable spot.

So far it’s goldilocks difficulty to me. Nothing except armored lynels feel like damage sponges (I hate damage sponges as that is no substitute for good AI) and if you use meals and fuse properly everything else is engaging but not hard. Plus you set your own difficulty with earning hearts and upgrading armor. I don’t know if I consider the older bosses harder because I was younger and more impatient. So I didn’t pay as much attention to patterns when I was like 8.

The bosses are great, and really fun, but They are really easy. I can’t even think of a Zelda boss I’ve ever struggled with honestly

@HeadPirate

Many games were made more difficult for the western market, as renting games was a thing, and they didn't want people beating a game in a day.

@MythTgr huh? Zelda is one of the most popular and accessible series ever. Literally designed for anyone to pick up and play. Maybe Zelda 2 is an exception, but the majority of Zelda games are very casual friendly. Even my mom played the original one on nes and had never touched a video game in her life.

The final battle in TOTK was pretty intense. I beat it on my first attempt, but that was only because I went in with a crazy amount of meals and I was downing one every ten seconds or so

Moldorm! One of the best.

I didn't think any of the bosses in TotK were that hard. shrug

I can barely manage to kill Lynels in TOTK. Without the lock rune, they're so much harder to kill. I killed my first blue yesterday, but even the red one gave me a good beating.

I can't even touch a Gleeok yet.

I wish Lynel fights got more difficult. Still the same they were in BOTW. Armor doesn't even change anything.

The final fight was also pretty easy. Gleeoks are a slight challenge at least.

Gloom hands.... gloom hands...... and then phantom ghanon. I almoat had a hearth attack when these hands coming for me out of nowhere (first time) in a dark place jhahahab. I was calling the triforce of courage, but it wasnt enough 🤣🤣🤣

@Sisilly_G

Lol i still avoid the gleeoks 🤣

Id rather face the demon king than a gleeok 🤣🤣🤣

@xmkbest
If you are skipping as many fights as possible, than how would you ever properly learn the games mechanics?

Sounds to me like you made the game more difficult for yourself in an attempt to avoid difficulty.

I have only beaten two bosses at this point, but those were the easiest part of the game by far.
I found simple bokoblin camps to be more difficult than them.

@SuntannedDuck2
The bosses in totk are a lot more like classic Zelda bosses though, so BotW is not really comparable.

I do mostly agree with you on your points though, the only reason why this didn't bother me in BotW is because that was only a small fraction of the game as a whole and I loved the rest.

Also agree with your point on Souls games. That game makes me think most people never actually played a hard game before that.
That is not to say Souls games are "easy", but it's not super hard either.

Ive beaten all the regional phenomena and i agree that the bosses are a major step up from the dreadful ones on BOTW. I wouldnt say any were really hard but they were all enjoyable. The dungeons are also alot better despite, for me not beaing as good as other mainline zelda titles.

I think the water boss in majoras mask or the thunderbird shadow link of Zelda II are the toughest.

I found final ganon pretty easy, but I had tricked myself out pretty well. I ate a lot of gloom recovery and heart recovery meals. And I love the psychological damage of his life bar. I was laughing out loud as I fought him.

Haven’t tried a gleok. Only got through 2 lynels in the colosseum before abandoning. And there was a random lynel in the depths wearing armour that I just abandoned.

The gloom hands aren’t too bad if you have arrows with ?sparkle fruit or bomb arrows and can get some space, but normally they crowd you to death more than anything. But yeah I still avoid gloom hands if I can.

I must confess to having silver bokoblins just completely murder me countless times too

I want to point out that controls and tech limitations are also part of what made older games harder.

I really liked the balance this time. I did die several times with most of bosses, but the difficulty didn't feel extremely frustrating, which is a very good thing.

I want to point out also that since Skyward Sword, difficulty has been modulated to he just challenging enough (contrary to how easy twilight princess was, for example). I think making the fight satisfying is what is important.

I guess if they open a new game + or something it should absolutely make it very noticeably hard. I am happy with the level achieved.

Aside from Adventure of Link, Zelda games haven't ever had especially difficult bosses.

@JohnnyMind I know, didn't expect that they would pack such a strong punch. I went out of curiosity to the underworld without preparing for it, I was smoked by the first group of bokoblins.

@Kirgo Ok cool didn't know that. You can clearly tell I know nothing about TOTK I've seen hints of stuff but nothing about bosses so that's cool to know.

It was a fraction of the game yes. The only issue I'd say is because they are the main goal. Of course you can do tons of other things but for the 'main ones' it did seem odd and their weight seemed kind of lacking, but the others in the rest of the world were in comparison were good not even counting past games at all.

They are hard but I think it's many people don't have much other games of reference in comparison which does make souls comments of 'hard' kind of hilarious to see and eventually tiring and even for that type of combat or others in the genre or other genres difficulty scale. I mean even some JRPGs but really hard boss fights from certain eras.

@ComfyAko lol, the evil nintendo employee bites you dude ? XD

@CorvoRevo I'm sorry but I have absolutely no idea what is your comment referring to. Could you explain? Honest question