Microsoft Has A "Very Good Relationship With Nintendo" But Isn't Making Any Promises Moving Forward

I still can’t believe that Banjo & Kazooie became playable in Smash Ultimate. Even if Microsoft doesn’t offer much else for competing consoles, I’ll always be grateful to Phil Spencer for allowing that to happen.

Pretty Sure he said Rare Replay in the works for Nintendo switch.

Translation
"We love the Nintendo community's money, but please also buy an XBOX Series X|S"

And I said: okay.

@sanderev Nah, they just want to run Gamepass on the Switch like on the PS5.

If the Halo games ever come to a Nintendo platform I'll eat my Mario underoos.

@KnightsTemplar Rare Replay would be huuuge on Switch! Seems like a no brainer.

@Kalmaro True, but that doesn't make it less true

Can you imagine the freak outs if Microsoft ever ran Nintendo’s online service?

@ecco6t9 That would be awesome. And they could. Since also PSN might go to Microsoft Azure. Switch online on Azure would be really sweet.

Something like, say, a Banjo Kazooie game would make sense and might even shift more copies on the Switch because of the difference in audience. Microsoft aren't stupid.

But literally everything Microsoft is doing, from xCloud to buying Bethesda, is to build its Game Pass userbase. They've surely already had the Game Streaming on Switch conversation with Nintendo.

They are just saying they are pulling back from publishing games on the switch to have more exclusives and justify the existence of their consoles.

If the series X/S fails, they'll come back to Nintendo. At least Phil has some respect for Nintendo

I think they'll keep giving us ports... just not every port.

We are NOT getting Halo: Infinite or Elder Scrolls VI, of course. But the third Wolfenstein is probably a lock, as is any new Minecraft or Ori content that comes our way.

(Could also see them port over legacy titles like the Halo games from Bungie as separate eShop releases.)

I would love to see the Switch considered an unofficial handheld Xbox in a sense, at least when it comes to Microsoft's support.

BANJO and kazooie one the nintendo switch plz I don't even care if they emulate like 3d all stars I just want to play them on the switch!

Game Pass is probably the most consumer friendly move made in this industry.

Perhaps it's always been their plan or a result of being in third place. Either way, it's gamers who win.

Stop with the PR BS and admit everything you’ve done is for game pass, they want it on Switch, they want to assimilate everything into the highly volatile world of games locked behind a subscription service that can pull games out at at any moment with their ultimate goal of these games only being available through cloud streaming to achieve the ultimate control which they were denied to do with the Xbox One.

They promised Xbox Live on Cuphead, and over 1 year later it's still not added.

IMO they shouldn't...they are a company that needs push a new system...When Nintendo pushes a more power system maybe they will get 5 years old games that are side scrolling games...

Xbox really has a lot of momentum right now. Glad to see after their disastrous console generation.

@SalvorHardin Means nothing changed since 1980's.

Rental video stores had movies removed all the time to make room for new movies, or were removed because noone rented them anymore.

It's the same on Game Pass mostly. Games noone plays is removed there too, because they can't keep funding a developer if noone wants to play their games.

If you had to choose between rare replay on the switch or rare games on a N64 mini, which would you choose?

Btw, I think there there is a chance at both once the hardware for a N64 is affordable.

@geordie
That’s window dressing they aren’t don’t this out the goodness of their hearts for the consumer, it being so obviously unsustainable is an enormous red flag. Their ultimate goal is raising the price waaaaay up while locking games behind it which is something they obviously won’t be able to pull until 2-3 more years of baiting people.

@Ventilator
Those rental stores weren’t buying out giant movie studios.

Thanks for banjo in smash!
Eventho i hope to see more in the future *coughing.. killerinstinct.

MS convinced me already to buy the series X.

Dear Phil and Doug..... do you guys realize how hard you would steam roll any and all competition for the foreseeable future by allowing Xbox Live / Cloud access on Switch and vice versa? Holy crap, I, among many others, would LOVE to access even just past Xbox titles on switch, like Fallout 3/NV, or past Nintendo titles on Series X.....

@SalvorHardin I were only talking about rentals and not bying companies.
Nothing changed on the rental front except for that you get far more value for the rental money now than you ever did in past decades.

@KnightsTemplar

Switch isn't powerful enough to emulate Xbox 360 games, so forget Rare Replay port.

@Ventilator The contract of rental was way more straight forward then any streaming service that comes these days. Yeah, you get more for your money but you don't get to choose what it is you pay for specifically and even if the rental store planned on moving out an older game or movie, then they had to wait for you to finish your rental period. Imagine getting halfway through a game on game pass or such before it is removed and becomes completely dysfunctional.

As long as physical copies of games exist, I won't have anything to do with online gaming at all. If we ever get to the point that everything is locked behind a subscription, I'll continue to be satisfied knowing I [already] have 35 years worth of a library of MY OWN games that I can play anytime I want.

It's a shame gaming for everyone isn't sustainable lol.

I'll gladly settle for N64 games (from brands owned by Microsoft) coming to the Switch at the very least. There are many who would support the same.

Still waiting for that Master Chief fighter reveal for Smash Bros. Ultimate. He's one of the few truly iconic and universally recognizable characters not already in the game in some form already. It makes too much sense not to happen.

Just give us Rare Replay already Phil! Come on, it’s a no brainer!

Good relationship now, but might not be in a few years....I wish Gamepass existed 6-7 years ago. The reality is my backlog is my Gamepass for the foreseeable future....

MS wants to sell Xbox, so they're doing what they can to attract people to the ecosystem. Exclusives do that, so I don't expect or begrudge them for keeping games there. It's really that simple.

@Ventilator I hope that was sarcasm because if you think Switch can’t emulate 360 games... then LMAO.

@Dm9982 that's the problem. I strongly suspect it's Nintendo preventing gamepass from coming over.

It would:
1) expose the flaws in their online infrastructure even further
2) expose the deficiencies of content provided by NSO
3) reduce their cut from digital game distribution
4) require complex legal agreements about revenue split, and lifetime return. Acquisition is the most expensive part of sales. Nintendo will want a lifetime stake in that customer, xbox will want a switch only stake

Would be cool, but I think it's extremely unlikely

Its a bit of a nonsense statement really isn't it, how do single player games for example benefit at all from Xbox Live? Whilst many gamers still want to buy their games making Gamepass largely irrelevant to them. I have Gamepass because it cost me £1 but I've still bought more games for Xbox than I've played on that service this year

Just say you want to make exclusives for yourselves so people buy your consoles

Makes sense. They want everyone on gamepass and that ain't gonna happen if your glued to a switch.

@sanderev Yeah, because Nintendo certainly don't expect us to buy proprietary hardware to play their games

The Xbox series S looks nice for a 2nd room but I can't get that as well as a switch and a ps5. Xbox has always been 3rd choice for me, so I have never owned one.

@fafonio considering you need a pretty beefy pc to even emulate 360 on pc, no, a switch can't emulate 360 games

You dont seem to understand that emulators have extra overhead from pretending to be a console it isn't

The reason we got Cuphead, Super Luckys Tale and the Ori's on the Switch was because they didn't really find an audience on XBox, and fitted better into Ninty's ecosystem- they're essentially indie titles anyway. We aren't getting Halo or Forza because of this.

Will MS keep funding these sorts of games if they aren't popular enough on XB? Dubious.

In contexts like these, you don't get to expect anything - each new port is up to both parties and can only be a nice surprise. Although as someone keeping his fingers diligently crossed for Dishonored franchise on Switch, I do want to hope that GamePass won't somehow become an obligatory contract clause for the games that have already been multiplatform for years prior.😏

@Kalmaro
I wonder if he tipped his hat about the new Nintendo Switch coming out by that comment (in relation to its hardware upgrade being able to handle gamepass library)?

@Doktor-Mandrake the Rare Replay emulator runs on the software. You’re not running the emulator within the hardware and consuming specs.

Two different things. If you think Switch can’t run the 360 games included in the collection, you’re totally wrong.

@Ventilator I'm not even going to research on this and just go off of logic. If the Switch is able to handle a port of a PS4/Xbox One, how would it not be able to emulate PS3/Xbox 360 games? I hope you were joking.

X-Cloud for the Switch, Nintendo gets a load of Titles and Microsoft a portable Device to use their Ultimate Gamepass

@shazbot Yeah, but a man can dream! Lol. Would be epic, if extremely unlikely. Could you imagine the shockwaves that would cause? Internet would probably implode for a day or two.... Zag would be shivering every time he visited Asphodel! 🤣

@NathanTheAsian Emulation is totally different than a port.

You need a Xbox One to emulate Xbox 360 and that barely worked without alot of struggle. You even need a powerful PC to emulate it.
I hope you don't think Switch have the same hardware as a Xbox One or a gaming PC.

@fafonio What you are saying is that Switch have the power of Xbox One?
360 emulation were hard even on Xbox One.

@Jayofmaya Third party games on Game Pass usually stay there for 1 year. Some even longer, and some shorter depending if people play them or not.

I would say 12 months is enough time to complete more than 50% of a game.

@Ventilator
But that's where there would be no point in emulating Xbox 360 games if you could just port it. Of course, I'm well aware that the Switch is not as powerful as an Xbox One or a gaming PC.

@KnightsTemplar really??!!!!! I’d flip for!!!! Source?

@fafonio software physically needs hardware to run, please explain to me how you run software without hardware, you are wrong, emulators DO use your hardwares resources

Secondly, you said 360 games, not rare replay which uses Microsoft's own emulator specifically made for Xbox One, not Nintendo Switch.

@NathanTheAsian They could port the games instead, but if they wanted to port them they would already have done that instead of emulating them on Xbox One. Porting all the games would cost too much money and were not worth the effort. Especially since it costed only 30 bucks for all 30 games on release.
If you badly want them, you can get Xbox One 2013 model for cheap nowadays. Then get a Game Pass sub as they are included there too.

Kameo on Xbox 360 is one of the best Rare games ever made btw. and still looks great even 14 years after release.
Kameo were a big loss for GameCube...

@KnightsTemplar
When did he say this?

@NathanTheAsian You should 100% research it, a port and emulating specific hardware are two different things entirely.

Infact maybe you should go look at what type of CPU you need to run ps3 games on PC since you mentioned ps3 games as well

If Rare Replay gets released on Switch, I hope Donkey Kong 64 is added.

Nintendo have already shown they're interested in streaming games to Switch. But they can't do it outside Japan. Once Xbox have cracked game streaming I think Nintendo will want a piece of that for selected games. Nintendo will enjoy annoying Sony by doing this. That could be an awesome link up. More likely than game pass on Switch as Game Pass is likely too generous for Nintendo's taste. I do find it weird Xbox have never tried to create a handheld xbox console, but I guess the intention is that once phones are good enough and streaming to phones is good enough that phones will become the Xbox handheld console. It will be an awesome day when that is common!

do they ever make promises?

Yes Phil, we will be buying your Xbox Series X.

At least I am, after the support they've shown Nintendo, as a Nintendo fan, I'd be a fool not to support Microsoft as well.

Hope someday in ONE console with joint forces

They want Nintendo as their complimentary device. NSO is hot garbage, so XBox Live/Gamepass/xCloud would actually have a lot to offer many a Switch owner. Done right, with proper advertising, it could benefit Nintendo just as much. Buy this cool little handheld and you not only get Nintendos games, but also Halo and everything else Microsoft is offering.
Microsoft seems to be doing everything right currently and poising themselves well with an entire ecosystem across whatever platform people want to use it on, instead of the 90s console war Sony is still stuck in. The 90s console wars were fun, I admit, but I prefer this modern take of getting along that Microsoft is pushing.
I've always been a Nintendo/PC guy first, but the way Microsoft has been lately makes want to try out their gamepass on my PC and check out their ecosystem.

@GrailUK maybe they mean sustainability as in their not interested in actually signing a long term doc instead of giving Nintendo an occasional hookup

If game pass was on Switch, I'd get a XSX / Switch combo no question. But alas

I'm glad MS brought Cuphead, Ori, and Minecraft to the Switch. Anything more would be gravy.

Maybe if Nintendo were making bank off switch hardware I could see this happening, until then, how many people would buy a switch and only use it for gamepass, not ever even buying a switch game🤔

The genius of the Switch is that Nintendo no longer competes in their space. Going forward, people will own an MS, Sony, or PC and a Switch. Nintendo will have a lower price point and portability they can't match (and aren't interested in).

I think its good they arent making promises because if they do, people will be like, "OH MY GEE MASTER CHIEF IS IN SMASH!!!" And then sakurai would be pressured into putting master chief into smash because microsoft made a promise.

It’d be great to see N64 Rare games on switch. I have been tempted to buy a current XBox One just for Rare Replay, but haven’t been able to justify it. Maybe if I can pick up one used really cheap after the new one comes out.

It seems like it would be a good move for both companies to get the N64 Rare games on Switch. I bet they could charge a good price for them. I know I’d pay $60 for just the N64 Rare games.

It seems like they wouldn’t have to put a lot of resources into getting the games on the switch either since they already have an N64 emulator. I remember reading that Rare games had their own GPU microcode or something since the stock GPU microcode had some issues. I read it in an article that was comparing PSX to N64, but Wikipedia also has a section about it: https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nintendo_64_programming_characteristics#Microcode. If for some reason Nintendo’s emulator doesn’t already support that there may be some work there.

@Dm9982 TBH, the only way I see that happening is if they buy nintendo... Though it would be awesome to see gamepass on switch.

Access to full eco-systems? Uhhh...ok then. Well, it was still nice of them to share some of their stuff for a bit anyway. And I don't expect them to do this forever, (but rare replay woulda made sense to offer up.)

@MarioBrickLayer Rare Replay on Switch. I have no connection to N64's Rare and I am not loving DK64 on the U.

@Ventilator Switch isn't powerful enough to run a collection of 8bit, 16bit and old 3D games that were originally on Nintendo systems? I'm going to assume that's sarcasm.

I love Game Pass PC, it’s brilliant so if it came to Switch, I’d be interested.

Microsoft's end goal is to drown everything with Game Pass, if it came to Switch and PS5 there would be a point where people buy fewer 1st party Nintendo and Sony games because they're not in Game Pass eventually forcing those games in Game Pass resulting in Microsoft owning everything.

An ugly future for gaming awaits if Game Pass infects PS5 and Switch. Sony's not helping the situation by making PS5 games $70 which will drive even more people to Game Pass.

@Tempestryke It's not about power. Rare Replay literally uses Xbox 360 backwards compatibility versions of the 3 Banjo games, the 2 Perfect Dark games, the 2 Viva Pinata games, Kameo and Jetpac Refuelled. It can't even come to PC in its current form because Xbox 360 games aren't playable on PC via backwards compatibility.

Personally I'm more than okay with the support they have given nintendo, they didn't have to do any of it.

@status-204 That depends on the person. Some people like owning and replaying games, while others will trade in that game for another one, or updated version. That gamepass would suit them the most.

Me personally I used to worry about owning my games, and I still do buy them. However unless you have complete access to your library(physical or on steam) once the generation gets too old you could possibly lose access to those games.

I’d just like to see Killer Instinct on the Switch

I wish they would make promises, so much potential can come from this!

I think Microsoft could make some good money just porting they're older games to the Switch, and it makes for good marketing as well.

what if they brought the first 3 Halo or Gears games? I think they would sell good and I believe some Nintendo fans would then be looking at maybe purchasing the new Xbox system.

I definitely wouldn't mind more collaborations between Microsoft and Nintendo in the future myself. It is good for gaming as a whole, and I love that their company ideas align. Even if nothing else comes out of this, I am still happy with what Microsoft has shared thus far.

Lame. Corporate speak for: Nintendo can take a hike, buy our wannabe PC-console thing.

@graysoncharles
If you didn't see my second comment, I already acknowledged the difference between ports and emulators.

@Doktor-Mandrake Like I said, I'm okay with it. I even have an XBOX Series X on pre-order and can't wait for it to arrive here.

@status-204 Sounds like a 'you' problem if you want to be emotionally affected by that.

Microsoft should release most of their games on the Switch simply to get Japanese gamers to play their exclusives. The Xbox One sold terribly in Japan and if Japanese gamers are introduced to their exclusives on the Switch they will buy the Series X.

@Grumblevolcano Sure they can't. rolls eyes

Care to explain to the class the exact circumstances of how the entire switch fanbase all suffers from mass hallucinations of playing and owning ports from the 8 bit days to modern day while your at it?

Its a port collection. Many of those series have been on Nintendo systems. It can be done, if MS so chose. I simply don't think they will.

@Kalmaro Yeah, it's pretty obvious that Phil Spencer's dream is to get Nintendo and Sony to buy-in to Gamepass and freeze out Amazon, Google and Apple.

Just give us Banjo-Kazooie and Banjo-Tooie for Switch already! It would be perfect cause they could port the original N64 versions with all the Nintendo easter eggs.

Um, what are the odds if Phil is planning to buy out Nintendo?? 😓

@Parmandur What scares me the most is that I'm not too sure I'd be against that.

I could see Nintendo allowing game pass at some point of they continue focusing on handhelds. Cloud is emerging and it's going to devour the value in the market of dedicated handhelds. Nintendo could lose their niche. Making a Nintendo handheld that's still a handheld but also a cloud gaming client partnered with ms may be more beneficial then trying to compete in the phone arena, or trying to reenter the power console business.

As cloud streaming and dedicated controller accessories for phones evolve, Nintendo needs to find a way to keep dedicated handhelds relevant. Or they need to go "blue ocean"again and try to invent a new market as a "third pillar" to transition from handhelds to something new. Or do both until they see where the winds blow.

@fanguy slim to none. Nintendo is cash rich. Buying out cash rich companies is almost never beneficial. Can't finance cold hard cash. That's why Nintendo stockpiles cash like that. Makes them an incredibly unattractive buyout target and keeps them independent.

Game Pass on Switch would be an instant buy for me. We can only dream.

@shazbot Yeah, and that’s what I was thinking, a shared cloud experience. Switch having Game Pass and Xbox having NSO basically - and as much as I love NSO, it would have to be boosted in order to be equal with Game Pass. It would have to be an equal value situation where both companies stand to make pure profit.

But given the complex nature of that beast, would be extremely unlikely. Especially on Game Pass side. I’d bet more than half of NSO games were licensed and published by Nintendo, so they still own the licensing to em, whereas Game Pass is probably more like 20-30% owned by MS.

Nintendo (and Sony) would lose too much money from 3rd party software sales if they put Game Pass on their platforms. Less people would buy 3rd party games on Switch, and they'd just use it as a device for Game Pass. So I don't see Game Pass coming to Nintendo (or Sony) platforms.

I don't think MS is playing around anymore. After the Bethesda acquisition and the growth of Game Pass, I don't think they will even bring games like Minecraft to PS5 and Switch 2 anymore (only via backwards compatibility, but we'll see).

Their goal is to bring their games to as many platforms as possible, but I don't think that will include closed platforms from Sony and Nintendo; intead I think they're more focused on supporting their Xbox consoles, PC and phones, smart TV and other less powerful devices (via xCloud streaming).

@Kalmaro If it happens, I'm in, full on. I haven't had an Xbox in a while, but Gamepass is a tremendous idea. With Nintendo content, with cross system play, it would be a no-brainer.

@yuwarite If they get enough of a cut, it might be to their advantage to sign on to Gamepass. With Microsoft, Sony, and Nintendo first party titles, Gamepass would be a must have for gamers, and all three could profit, without Sony or Nintendo having to develop their own world-class internet infrastructure.

@Slowdive Where do you get all this false information from?

All I can say is xbox is more or less the far 3rd leg here. They can't make sales in Japan of all places. GPU doesn't makeup for poor sales figures.

Why is it that everybody, especially Sony fans for some reason, always seem to conflate Game Pass with streaming, and declare Microsoft is trying to take away game ownership even after MS has said GP subscribers buy more, not less, games, the subscription itself coveys discounts on purchases, and ms didn't even have a streaming platform until recently, and that's mostly viable as a game pass add on?

How does nobody get that game pass is a digital replacement for Blockbuster, not a streaming alternative to game buying?

@SwitchForce Even Sony has been declining in Japan. It's a weird market. They prefer smaller and more mobile devices. Things like xboxes and playstations are just dying out there.

Xbox has been a failure there, but it's hardly an easy market as your implying.

Pretty sure I remember Xbox execs saying the same thing before unveiling and launching Ori 2 on Switch.

@Tempestryke Since when were Xbox 360 a 8-bit or 16-Bit console?

@Ventilator The good news is that the games could potentially still run on another type of emulator specially for the Switch. So a “port” or a different version of the game could still happen with all those glorious and previous NES games.

@Magrane The problem is that Switch itself isn't much more powerful than a PS3 and 360, so emulation is impossible unless you want a unplayable slideshow on 360 games. There is no other kind of emulator, because Switch is way too weak to mulate last gen consoles. You should look up emulation and see the real requirements.
Emulation is not what you think at all.

You can't even emulate Wii U, Xbox 360 and PS3 properly on a 1000-1500$ PC.
Microsoft is not gonna care about Rare Replay on Switch either way, because Xbox One Series X launches in 3 weeks.

Switch can't emulate Wii U either as they have about same power which makes emulation impossible.
Microsoft owes nothing to Nintendo, because Nintendo never gives anything back to Microsoft.
Switch can only emulate the N64, Arcade, ZX Spectrum and SNES Games from Rare Replay at full speed.

I have followed Emulation since Shapeshifter came on Amiga, then MAME on PC in 1996.
It took over 15 years until a PC could even emulate 3DFX Arcade games, and requires is good gaming PC to run those old games today.

@geordie

Yeeeah, I don't see the whole being in 3rd place of an imaginary toy war as being any real factor. I don't think that they give even a smidge as much about that when they're making their decisions. I mean come on dude, these are the same dudes who rolled out of the bed one day after a weekend night bender & decided to buy Bethesda with the change in their pockets from the night before. They could easily wrap this supposed "war" & any chances of missing a 1st place finish up with their cheque book.

@NEStalgia

Honestly, that's just the kind of crap that they do man. Don't worry though, as soon as they (sony) start doing or offering them the same thing, they'll fall in line & suddenly see the light & "get it".

Well, I'd get Xbox Game Pass on the Switch...

Pretty sure that xbox if they could would put gamepass on the switch. They just want people using their eco system. Also pretty sure it's nintendo that doesn't want that just like apple doesn't want that.

How did that relationship work out with Sega? It was the kiss of death.

@Nintendo-or-Noth pretty sure windows ce powering Dreamcast didn't kiss Segas death. Pretty sure it was releasing 3 consoles within a few years, flipping off most of their retail partners and 3rd party publishers with Saturn's "surprise" launch, getting undercut by Sony, twice, and competing against the ps2 juggernaut after all that. Sega killed Sega. They were already dead before Dreamcast launched. They launched it anyway, but it needed a miracle to sell the numbers needed, wii numbers, to resurrect their broken hardware division.

@NEStalgia @NEStalgia Your pretty sure windows CE wasn't the kiss of death? Seriously? It was the prime exploit to get around the gigadrive security method and the root cause of it failing.
Doesn't strike you as odd that Peter Moore helped kill Sega of America, make room for the Xbox in the marketplace, and has a golden parachute over at Microsoft?

I mean, I'm all for good relationships between big companies. But Nintendo kinda protects their ecosystem a whole lot, so I don't really see them sharing what Microsoft would want (i.e. titles), which is probably what the issue is. Nintendo's happy to run Microsoft games on the Switch, but isn't eager to share theirs the other way. And I don't really blame them.

@Nintendo-or-Noth except that wasn't Segas actual problem. They went into DC with little consumer faith, little retail support and nearly no third party support after their prior antics.

By rights there never should have been a Dreamcast at all. They were in such a bad shape from the hole they dug, they knew DC couldn't sell in the required numbers. They did it anyway to go out with a bang. The broken security was irrelevant for an already doomed console vendor.

@NEStalgia you do have a point.

I bought a dreamcast and it might have been my favourite console. That said I do just love arcade games.

It was my first and the last Sega console. You always remember your first.

@NEStalgia You do not know what your talking about but sure like to sound like you do. I HATE people who spread dis-info. The dreamcast set preorder records, and after launch set entertainment records. Heck, it even made it into the guiness book of world records. Retailers loved it. Snoopdog rapped about it. It was a big deal. I bought one on launch along with a line around the block. Major publications site its piracy as what doomed it. All because of windows CE. Its a FACT, not my opinion.
The dreamcast had the best line up, 2k sports, acade faithful ports and built-in modem. Even the web browser was cutting edge. The dreamcast still holds up nice today and in someways had a technical advantage over the PS2.

@Ventilator No, my point is, what if you START the game on the 11th and a half month? Then you won't have time.

@Nintendo-or-Noth You're so busy taking past me you're not processing what was written.

I never suggested sales were poor. I said they were in such a hole after Saturn, and their previous missteps, and yes, retailer and developer problems after thoroughly screwing them the previous generation, that they needed a miracle if Wii level numbers, or rather PS2s numbers, to pull it off. Dc didn't merely have to be successful, it had to repair a decade of debt almost instantly to be able to continue operating. It wasn't possible, and they knew it. But it was a heck of a way to go out instead of fading away with Saturn.

The piracy was a final nail in the half sunken ship, only.

I'm not saying it wasn't a great machine, simply that piracy or not, that ship was listing hard before the dc ever got shelves. They didn't need ms to sabotage them. They did a fine job all on their own.

Also remember, they helped design the og xbox, and remain a close partner with ms to this day. Not exactly a bad blood scenario. PSO2 console exclusivity is a heck of a gift for an enemy...

If Microsoft could get X-Cloud onto the Switch it could be a good way to convince people to get an Xbox and maybe break into the Japanese market too. Technically it's already possible to do if a Switch is running Android. I use Gamepass Ultimate on Xbox, PC and can access X-Cloud on virtually any Android device; it's good to have options.

I'd be happy with a port of Rare Replay even if it omitted the 360 games, although hopefully they could switch in the N64 version of Perfect Dark.

@CaPPa I feel that is Microsoft's goal is to turn X-Cloud and Gamepass into the "Netflix of gaming" but, there are several key hurdles they NEED to overcome.

1) Gamepass needs to be popular on PC and needs to offer something Steam cannot. I feel it is doing an okay job at this and the only problem is to access Gamepass you need to access it through a Microsoft service. They need Steam integration as that is the current de facto PC storefront and launcher.

2) Xbox as a brand needs to recover. The 360 was gaming in the seventh generation. While the Wii captured the imagination of the casual crowd the 360 was the hot and hip console that gamers loved with innovative features that are now industry standard. But, ultimately lost a foothold against the PS3 and sat in a slim third place. Now the Xbone did end up selling around 50-ish million units on the estimate but compared to the Switch which has dwarfed its total sales in half the time and how it lost tens of millions of units sales compared to the 360 that shows a shrinking market interest. The Series X/S has to capture back the 30 million lost consumers if they hope to make Gamepass and X-Cloud the gaming service. However, with a complete apathetic east-Asian market and the Playstation 4 cementing immediate success for the Playstation 5 and without a radical shake-up Nintendo did with the Wii and Switch, MS will have to sell the Xbox brand hard!

3) They need to get onto Nintendo hardware. This I feel is what Microsoft is currently doing by having Nintendo gamers get a taste of what their 1st Party offerings are like. That and with Nintendo fans loving Bethesda titles like Doom, MS needs to keep that momentum going to convince them to go Xbox as their secondary console compared to PlayStation or to find a way to offer X-Cloud on Switch. This I feel will be if Microsoft can strike a deal with Nintendo to offer X-Cloud as the base of Nintendo's future streaming service.

4) They need to overcome a hostile Nintendo on devaluing their software. And I don't mean 1st party titles I mean 3rd party titles. Gamepass has a lot of overlap with Nintendo's 3rd party offerings so unless MS plans to give Nintendo a cut it is just simply never going to happen. And forget Gamepass and X-Cloud ever being on a Sony console while Sony is trying to push PS+ and PSNow. This I feel would be a long-term goal if it is even possible... granted at one point seeing Microsoft titles at all on Nintendo consoles were a pipedream so I never say never on matters like this.

These I see as the ultimate hurdles Microsoft faces to overcome this consistent shrinking interest in their products compared to the Japanese Two (Sony and Nintendo). Now it is possible for them to do it as Nintendo did a major rebound with the Switch, but that was at the cost of their dedicated handheld division. Microsoft does not have that luxury Nintendo had of being the handheld kinds of the past 30 years and seems to be on a trend of being the permanent place of 3rd place unless there is a radical shift in purchasing taste on the NA consumer base.

@Wexter
I think that there could be a shift coming with Xbox for the next gen, they are making all the right moves and the Series X is a much better designed system than the PS5. It'll still be a close race between them and Sony because they lack any stake in Japan; but the Switch releases may have helped a bit there.

I can't see Gamepass making it to the Switch now because like you say Nintendo wouldn't want it to undervalue their software, plus they are taking small steps with cloud based games.