Video: Digital Foundry Takes A Technical Look At Zelda And Mario Odyssey In VR

Proof that you can't just split the screen with a fish-eye lens and call it VR compatible. Very bummed out by the lack of effort they put in the Zelda update, and if it was good I may have actually tried Labo VR.

Why would you want to play a third person game in vr anyway?

I played yesterday for the first time MARIO ... my eyes hurts so bad !!!! And MARIO VR took me 5 min to finish it lol

I own PSVR way better

@J-Plap lol that’s what I said n everybody was disagreeing with me talking about Astro bot blah blah blah blaahh

Technical point, it's not motion sickness, it's simulation sickness. Similar but works kind of in reverse.

Why you didn't talk about the fiasco of Digital Foundry's analysis of Darksiders on Switch, when they were showing supposed footage in Portable mode, and a CIRCLE BUTTON appeared on the screen?

biggest problem for me is the camera movement.
head tracking camera controls need to be centered in or behind the camera to feel natural, but botw has it centered on link.
I have no nausea problems with the framerate or resolution, just the camera.
if I sit still and only use the right stick to control the camera there's no problem.

I’m glad I held off getting the vr kit I didn’t think it would be great but Nintendo usually have this magic that makes things like this run really well with what they have but everything I have read has been pretty negative

For me it was neither the resolution nor the frame rate that made me sick in BotW VR, it was moving in the world that did it, the discrepancy between what I was seeing and what my brain expected. When I stood still and just looked around it was all ok.

@Edu23XWiiU is that for real and is the video still available. Darksiders is actually pretty good on switch not nearly as bad as some reviews have made it out to be

I actually enjoyed playing around with the Labo VR kit, and didn't experience any motion issues. Maybe if BotW we're structured around VR options from the start it could be better, but as is, it feels more like an afterthought.

The potential is there, but I think we're going to have to wait for the "Switch Pro" before they can really contend with the current VR offerings on the market.

I tried BOTW for a few minutes and thought it was awesome. For anyonw who wants to give Zelda and Mario a shot without the full price set, a standard headset will work. I also tried a few of the minigames in labo VR and they were great! It's on my wishlist of games I want right now.

@Broosh No amount of effort could make this any better. BotW always struggled to maintain a consistent 30FPS. The system is too low powered and the screen is too low resolution. This was just a terrible idea from the start, and should have never been released.

@J-Plap Third person games can be amazing in VR. One of my favorite experiences was Lucky's Tale, despite not being that great of a platformer. The sense of scale, being able to look around freely, behind objects, etc... was really enjoyable.

I like Zelda VR. It’s just blurry. I like aiming the bow where I’m looking. I wish it were clearer, but I don’t think it’s a failure. The Labo VR kit I actually really like and think it’s awesome, full stop. Absolutely packed with neat content. I would also play more Mario, the idea was keen, but oh so slight.

I’ve never been interested before, but this got me looking at Sony’s offering.

@Ayye-ant well that's because Astro Bot is bloody brilliant as is Moss but these are smart enough to give you a real presence in the game as opposed to just being the camera

I would say when Sony VR which is considered a success despite only 4 million or so sold out of a 94 million user base,Nintendo would be wise to stay clear.

Funny how people view success or failure...Nintendo's online has 9 million subscribers from a 34 million base,and the internet posting forum minorities consider it a failure,but the very same people seem to think Sony's VR penetration is a success.

Labo VR is great for what it is,a cheap add on feature for Labo,we knew right from the start that with a 720p screen we had to temper our expectations slightly,and this product was never going to be a direct competitor to Sony or a P.C based VR kit.

@johnvboy it's all relative. You're also stating numbers for totally different things.

@Trajan,

Nothing to do with being relative,VR is only appealing to the core market,and even the PC based versions are struggling to deliver on their VR future predictions.

I had some issues with it (I think it was the low & unsteady frame rate), but, I'm a little shocked he just skipped right past inverting the camera. He spends time complaining about not looking where you want to look, and then finds the option, and skips right past it.

Oh, and swivel rocker office desk chair ftw.

@Gs69 @Edu23XWiiU
That's a "fiasco" to you? Boy, must you lead a privileged, protected, care-free life. Not a life that would enable you to survive in the real world, but still... But yes, they did indeed make a mistake there.

I didn't even notice when I first watched it, but watching it again, it is at 6:15. Putting this small error (and off-topic issue) into perspective: They did capture some footage from the original PS3 version for comparison and showed this, too. In in the YouTube comments they admitted that they've made a labeling error for the scene in question. This doesn't change what they say about the quality of the Switch port though, and I couldn't find anything wrong with the other footage of Switch docked and portable modes. It looks and plays great apparently.

@J-Plap why play games?

@JunkRabbit it certainly not a fiasco to me I really don’t care either way just wanted to see it for myself and besides I’m enjoying darksiders on switch

@Gs69
Yeah, sorry, first part was addressed at Edu23XWiiU, wanted to keep you in the loop is all. ^^'

@JunkRabbit no worries lol I was a bit shocked I wasn’t complaining about the game I think it’s great and to be honest I think people take too much notice of frame rates and such if someone enjoys a game then fairplay

You know what's better than watching that video, to me? Playing BotW in VR.

@Dellybelly also add to it that Super Mario Maker 2 is coming with a year of NSO apparently.

@Dellybelly,

My main point still stands,VR at best is very niche,and in it's current format which requires a headset that cuts you off from your surroundings is a hard sell for anybody but a tech minded person,sure the masses will have a go with it at a party or friends house,but I just do not see them rushing out to buy one.

@Dellybelly

"PSVR success or not success is based on comparison with other competitors like Vive or Oculus, not on how many PS4 owners bought PSVR"

So based on this comment how do you judge it's success or failure?,the PC versions are selling very low numbers which surprises me considering the hardcore PC building community,the Playstation VR leads the way with pretty low numbers based on it's user base...so still very niche at the moment.

@johnvboy I agree it does not yet have mass appeal, but in the niche market of VR, Sony's headset is really killing it thanks largely to its solid software lineup. Honestly, I'm shocked that they've supported PSVR as well as they have. Comparing PSVR to PS4's install base is the wrong comparison. Success, like happiness, is about expectations. NSO, for example, is performing well below expectations. On the other hand, expectations for PSVR at launch were that maybe this thing sells a million units. Maybe. Fast forward to today and it's done 4 times that. No one suggested it wasn't niche before, but the fact that it has 4 times the appeal than was expected despite its flaws is a sign that the market might be both larger than expected and capable of growth. VR has some major problems right now, but the more of those problems that become moot, the faster that part of the market will move. It's going to be interesting to see what happens, that's for sure.

@NoxAeturnus,

Some great VR apps for sure,but hardly killing it sales wise,it still looks like once the hardcore market buys the product the masses are still staying away.

Perhaps both Sony and Microsoft will need to consider VR inclusion with their next consoles..but of course this I feel will not happen because of cost.

@JunkRabbit It's a great game and a great video about the game. Digital Foundry does amazing work evaluating games. It's also good that they admit mistakes when they occur!

@johnvboy But it IS killing it sales-wise. You're too fixated on the overall numbers sold and the fact that it doesn't have mass appeal. Mass appeal is not the only measure of success. Yes, it's a niche product, and those numbers are not comparatively high, but it's four times less niche than anticipated, and that's kind of a big deal. If I own a small business that makes buttons, and I expect to sell one million buttons at $1 each, and I instead sell four million buttons, my company is 4 times more profitable than I expected even if my competitor is selling 100 million buttons. That's a sales success - in fact it's a huge sales success. This is a small sideline business for Sony, and it's four times as lucrative as they initially expected. I'd say that's killing it sales-wise.

I’ve put some time in it and would say it’s a great free update.
Mario was good a totally different experience from zelda as the mini games were made for it. Was a fun 10 minutes.

Zelda, even though all reviews were bad. I tried it and is a lot of fun. Just toggle of the head tracking and use it as normal controlling the camera with the right stick. After some time or playtime you can slowly put in motion tracking and experiment with the settings. It’s something I will try and come back to. It’s a great option to have and it’s free. A must for zelda fans

I hope they add Labo VR support to more games. Luigis mansion 3 pikmin 4. Everything

I'm looking forward to watching this video very soon. I have enjoyed Mario and Zelda in VR, briefly. The Labo VR kit is pretty damn amazing. I've had lots of fun building and playing it. Breath of the Wild is too choppy for me. I always play it on my smart TV with motion interpolation to make it appear 60 fps. Luckily the input lag isn't very noticable when doing this in this game (it almost always messes up racing games, for example). In VR I prefer to just walk around slowly to keep it from looking too choppy. Flying the glider kinda works too, since scenery isn't moving by very quickly. I'd like to have a strap and have the ability to detach the joy con. They should release a patch for Mario Kart 8 so we could play it at lower res, but still 60 fps, in VR while using the Labo vehicle steering wheel and pedal.

Simply awful to the extent where its pointless. I've got pretty decent VR legs and rarely get any sickness. Got Labo VR and played Zelda VR on my PSVR today also. The main problem is that the screen isn't in a locked position. I can't even read the text on the corners of the image as every time I adjust to view it the entire screen moves with me. Only way to play this is if you can lock your head into position and not move an inch. Shame you can't disable the gyro and lock the screen.

I think that if you change the sensibility of the camera on the game it could get better. I haven't tried yet but it is by defult on like normal and it can go like 2 levels down to very slow or up to vert sensitive

@J-Plap 3rd person VR games are something you have to try to see the appeal. It's like playing with an animated puppet. The whole thing feels magical when done right, like in Moss and Astro Bot. It's especially great when you get to interact directly with these characters as a persistent character in the world alongside them.

It can also heighten your emotional state with the character and create greater empathy. Hellblade in VR is a very different experience than it is on a screen because you don't just watch and play Senua through the struggles she goes through; you are suffering at the same time. Also, scale and depth perception is still intact and so you get to see these enormous scary-as-all-hell beasts in Hellblade.

@johnvboy 4 million for a 90+ million userbase. Except you're missing one very vital detail. This is gen 1 technology running on gen 8 consoles. The first generation of consoles never went past a million sales.

VR is mostly within expectations right now, and it can only grow at this point now that games are getting bigger and better, and standalone headsets are releasing.

You determine the success of a VR product right now based not on it's userbase penetration, but on how many units you expected to sell and the user retention rate, which has been doubling each year at least on PC.

"VR" barely works on far better hardware as it is. I don't think anyone educated in the matter expected this not to suck.

I mean if it's a similar technique that we saw in the 3ds then it's trash. The 3D slider lived in perpetual off position because the 3D was an atrocious migraine inducing feature. Just another in a long line of forced gimmicks that uneccesarily increased the cost.

Hopefully they can realize what a wasted effort this is and double down on some real game releases. But I doubt it. So many numpties buying cardboard goggles.

Y'all are so focused on Labo VR for BOTW but have you considered using a Wii U emulator and modded version of BOTW for VR? We already have a first-person mod.

@Itzdmo Never had any issue with stereoscopic 3D in my life. Movies, Virtual Boy, especially not 3DS which worked great. Labo VR is like looking at a 3DS screen point blank while drunk and spinning around in a chair however. Feels bad, physically, mentally... spiritually.

@Braok There isn't VR support (yet) though. It's just stereoscopic 3D without head tracking.

VR will keep getting better and see stronger sales because it offers a unique way to play games; everybody sees real growth potential in this market, which at the moment is relatively unexplored. And that's exciting. Studios can create VR games and truly stand out, which is harder to do on the traditional medium when competing with big studios and their big money, but even they will eventually start taking note. When you have software as strong as on PSVR already, and a lineup of upcoming games to truly get excited about you know it has been a success.

What I think will be holding VR back, though, is that it is such a personal experience that cannot be as effectively shared with others as traditional gaming (you can't even properly describe it to anyone who hasn't tried it). Once they crack that somehow, to a satisfying degree (the reality of it and people's perception), sky's the limit.

One of the golden rules of VR is that you never, ever, under any circumstances drop below 60fps (and ideally 90fps or higher) as it causes near instant motion sickness. Zelda is limping along at 20-30fps, and at an absolutely brutally low resolution. I know this is a cheap device, but for VR to actually work it has some limits.

A missed opportunity linking VR on Switch with LABO.

Oculus Quest is #1 on Amazon Japan right now - something LABO VR didn't manage even with the "Nintendo" brand on it, 8miilion base and dirt cheap pricing.

This is not the VR implementation a $300 Switch should have.

@DartBuzzer,

The hardcore console market is around 160 million units,which does not increase generation on generation,it of course generates more profit,but this is due to more DLC.

VR will remain niche until it changes it's current format,which will only ever appeal to the likes of ourselves,so how you think this will grow is beyond me.

@johnvboy How I think this will grow is pretty simple. It will adapt and change. There are lots of breakthroughs that will fundamentally change the technology coming to 2nd gen headsets in a few years. Once those are in standalone headsets for the accessible mass market audience, then it will take off easily. I'm willing to bet the VR market will be 5x bigger than the console market in 10 -15 years.

@NoxAeturnus,

I will guarantee you the major players in VR will not see it as the success they first thought it would be,just like TV manufacturers were surprised when 3D in the home never took off.

And when you consider how that was so easy for the masses to adopt,ie wireless glasses to wear,rather than a fully wired up VR rig,you see exactly what mainstream VR is up against.

@DartBuzzer,

We will see,but don't gamble your life savings on it fella.

@DartBuzzer,

I don't think you get it,which is exactly the same way I can't see why most people do not adopt this tech,but this is because I see from a very gadget orientated way of thinking,so it's an easy sell to me if Nintendo were to make a Sony type VR system.

My boss at work is a perfect example,got an VR system for his birthday and was blown away by it,so much so he brought it into work for everyone to have a go,a week later he is selling it on E-bay,for the masses after the initial gimmick wears off..they are left with something you no longer want to own.

@NoxAeturnus,

So you are saying that Sony see it as a niche product that they thought would only sell very low numbers,but in fact still ended up selling low numbers that was was more than they thought they would sell in the first place,but they are very happy because they have made more money than they initially projected.

Sounds reasonable

@johnvboy What system did he even buy? Do you know what games he got for it?

@DartBuzzer

I think it was an Oculus but can't be sure,and of course I am pertty sure he never played anything like some of the top Sony games on it,but the fact still remains the masses don't seem to buy into it.

This is of course not a major issue as consoles are hardly mass market but still survive and make money each and every generation,I would however worry for something that was niche within this though.

I hope Luigis mansion 3 comes with a VR mode or mini game at least

@J-Plap You didn’t find Moss to be pretty amazing?? We are on different planets.

Went to Lurelin village, wandered to a nice rocky place, then whipped on the headset.
I stool still, simply taking in the view for a good 10 minutes or so, watching the lovely skies, the star field, the sunset and sunrise, and the waves crashing beneath my feet.

It was a much, much better experience than actually trying to play the game with the headset.
Just relax, and enjoy the scenery!

Well, that was to be expected. Ever since VR released, it was made clear you need a system that keeps a MINIMUM of 90 fps. Otherwise most people are likely to get a headache.

@Edu23XWiiU when does that happen? The only circle I saw was for the PS3 comparison.

EDIT: I was replying to you when it came up on the screen 😂😂 they admitted therr was an error when labelling so that's that lol.

I understand why everyone is talking about motion sickness. I felt a bit sick after playing with minigames on Labo VR but nothing with Mario. I have yet to try Barf of the Wild but I'm not really looking forward to it.

@johnvboy looks like you're not allowed to dislike VR either. Some of these people are so easily triggered it's ridiculous.

@gamer95 "What if we will be part of concerts of your favourite bands, or maybe take a walk through New York, Paris or London streets?"

Nothing will replace doing those things in real life. The price of a VR kit could pay for me to have a real life experience. No frame rates, no specs, no headsets, no crashes.

@johnvboy

In response to #53 - 3D TVs aren't the worst comparison, except I would argue that they were poorly supported. There was one "killer app" (Avatar) and everything else largely failed to live up to that. VR is already in a better position in terms of software support. I think a better comparison is motion controls. Pre-Wii, motion controls certainly existed as a tech-savvy novelty, but they weren't exactly setting the world on fire. No one saw the Wii coming. So what happened? Nintendo solved just enough of motion control's issues and packaged it properly to turn a novelty into a mass market. Early adopters were largely the Nintendo faithful, who then showed it to non-gamers and non-Nintendo players, and it took off from there. When someone does something similar for VR, I think it has the potential to be the next Wii - an overnight success - but I agree with you that won't happen with the tech as it currently stands. I don't really expect any of the PC headsets to do it, but a second generation PSVR might do it with the right lineup of software. If that doesn't happen, the market can still limp along for quite some time on the backs of tech enthusiasts - if that happens as you seem to be suggesting, VR won't really go anywhere. Either way I'm really interested to see how the market evolves.

In response to #56 - Yes, that's what I'm saying, but without sarcasm. The fact that it performed above expectations shows there's an opportunity in the market. I think a PSVR 2 release is guaranteed at this point. And it doesn't have to be a whole lot better than the current PSVR to maybe tip the tech into wider appeal as long as it has some great software. Which I think is likely. PSVR is currently a training and experimentation ground for some devs, and they'll largely be looking to leverage that experience with the tech in a less crowded market. Again, it's a really interesting emerging market, and however it turns out I'm enjoying watching it unfold.

@Gs69 It was man. I watched the video the day it got released, that's why I don't trust their "analysis" anymore.

@JunkRabbit It's weird that they apologized, and I don't think that was a confusion at all, just poor editing. It's a fiasco because they try to be the eminence of graphics and performance analysis, who knows how many times they did this "mistake" with other Switch and Xbox One games.

@JSG87 How many more times they did those "mistakes" in the past, that we don't know? Don't trust those guys.

@J-Plap
I guess you haven't played Astro Bot...

@gamer95,

No I have never liked VR even before Nintendo and Labo got involved,it does seem like Neogaf on here sometimes though,they were acutually warned about negative VR posts...not now of course when it's not the success they thought it would be.

@WiltonRoots,

People are very easily triggered,and rarley like the truth.

Which I get becase they themselves like the tech,and for them anybody suggesting that the sales of the format are not exactly stellar,is like suggessting it's a waste of time,which I am not.

@NoxAeturnus,

VR will still have a place,and who knows where it will end up with the right support,but if it continues to be niche that support could be lacking.

As for 3D on TV's I think the format had tonnes of support,hell they even modified Blu-ray players to give proper 1080p 3D images,which on my projector look amazing..but still seems hard watching movies with glasses.

@WiltonRoots That's a pretty silly argument. You get one trip, or you get infinite trips for the same price using VR. VR cannot live up to the real thing, obviously, but this isn't the way to compare the two.

Hell, the way VR should ideally be used for virtual trips is when you don't have the time or money to go somewhere. If you do, then fine, go there for real. But most people do not have the time or money to go to many trips, events, concerts. What if I could attend a concert every other day with someone who lives across the planet and get all these crazy trippy visuals along with it? In VR, you can get the true intention of the artist conveyed because you can travel into their soundscape.

@DartBuzzer There's no reasoning with you so let's just leave this here. You can't accept some of us don't give a toss about VR. Don't waste your time typing out another response to me. Find someone else to try and convert.

@WiltonRoots No one is saying you need to go buy a headset now, but you seem to be against the core idea of VR to such a point where even a perfect headset in the future will not please you.

What is VR? It's connected human experience. If you dislike the concept of VR, then you ultimately dislike life experiences. The tech has a net improvement across every human life on this planet, and so once it's refined enough and cheap enough and comfortable enough, there shouldn't be anyone actively against it.

It's funny really. You're all about seeing things and experiencing things with people, are you not? I remember you saying something like that. VR is an enabler for that in a big way. What happens when you want to reach someone that you literally cannot be with in real life because of distance/time/cost. You'd absolutely want to meet them in VR using your ideals, because it's the next best way to socialize. Please don't bring up phonecalls/texting/facetime as I hear that argument over and over and it's irrelevant because those are entirely inferior forms of communication.

@DartBuzzer Seriously, you're like a borderline stalker. Drop it. Seek help.

@gamer95 Someone who enjoys life over video games. Enjoy your weekend.

@WiltonRoots,

You have to like VR as it is the future,and of course even if it ends up on the scrapheap like 3D,then it will be your fault because you did not support something you did not like in the first place.

@johnvboy Hahahahaha you're right, sorry guys, I like VR now.

@Dellybelly why thank you. Are you implying that we are one and the same?

@Dellybelly,

No issues buddy,thank you for thanking us for complementing each others comments.

@WiltonRoots,

People are so nice on here,nice,really nice.

@johnvboy Yes, rather pleasant. Would one like a cup of tea?

@WiltonRoots,

And some biscuits old bean...