Nintendo has finished its Xenoblade Chronicles 2 Nintendo Direct, and it had a couple of surprises thrown in for good measure. Perhaps unsurprisingly, but still new for the series, is the announcement of an expansion pass.
The pass will have a relatively hefty price (EU below), but include five sets of content. When the game lands this'll just be 'helpful items', but a new quest will arrive in January with regular updates through 2018 that'll culminate in new story content in Autumn / Fall 2018.
Also confirmed is a rather quirky crossover with The Legend of Zelda: Breath of the Wild, in which you can do a new quest to get a Rex outfit for Link. It arrives this week on 9th November.
You can see the video for these announcements below.
Are you looking forward to the Expansion Pass for Xenoblade Chronicles 2?
Not in love with the expansion pass.
Hmmm like the Breath of the Wild Pass I can wait until the final segment of content before really worth getting as only interested in story content. I mean thats basically what expansion packs were in the day.
not intrested, ps not intrested in the game either.
Really wish they would put this together as a 4 player online with voice chat adventure.
Woah, what do you mean it's €30? It's around €20 in Japan. That's not a price jump, that's a 50% increase.
This is a neat bonus I definitely was not expecting.
I want to buy it now!
Not really a fan of expansion pass, but hey, Breath of the Wild was awesome even without it, and I doubt Xenoblade 2 is going to be any different. I'm sure the game is going to be massive as it is.
Also, so incredibly glad to see Japanese voices being Day One DLC. I'm so glad they listened to the feedback.
That collectors edition looks delicious. I look forward to playing this eventually.
The game looks interesting but some of the creepier character designs put me off a little. I'm going to wait to read some reviews before I rule it out altogether.
Welcome to the world of season passes Nintendo fans.
Also, that Zelda crossover reminds me of Monster Hunter World crossing over with Horizion Zero Dawn
Yay for expansion pass. BOOOOOOO at the price. £20 is pretty much my upper limit for any expansion pass so this will definitely be a wait and see, particularly as the game will be massive anyway.
Rex Outfits for Link
My reaction = Huh ?!
Brand New Story contents
My reaction = HUH ?! WHAT ?!
Xenoblade 2.5 ??
Eh, it'll propably take me 100 hours just to clear the main quest, I'm not too good at these games.
Guessing $30 for US then? Hopefully not more than that...
So excited for the game. The expansion pass is fine, I will buy it once I get a clear picture of the extra story content in about a year time haha!
I was hoping for a rex amiibo to go with my shulk one but I guess that isn't happening. No amiibo support at all again ):
The Breath of the Wild costume is pretty awesome. I love synergy between Nintendo franchises.
It looks like they're doing expansion passes right. A story expansion.....about a full YEAR later?! That certainly smacks of new content, not disc locked, day one content. I'm glad to see Nintendo's doing it correctly. Seems more like the old school "expansion packs" for PC games that used to be boxed retail released that required the original game and were somewhat cheaper than a full game, more than the typical "season pass" and all the connotations that implies.
Btw, i still scratched my head because i still don't understand about the Battle , Character developing, Ability system , etc.
Too complicated to be understand quickly.
I have played some simple RPG games like Final Fantasy series, Miitopia, Portal Knights, Fantasy Life, Kingdom Hearts 1 + 2, but never experienced yet with sooooo.... complicated way to play RPG games like Xenoblade 2.
Also, i felt Xenoblade 2 emphasizing on so many Giant monsters, felt much like Monster Hunter series, unlike Xenosaga or Xenogear. Speaking about "Xeno" brand name, where is the Giant Mecha to ride ?
Pass? Will pass, thanks!
I may not get the game now, and it was my candidate for GOTY, even after playing Zelda and Mario, b/c JRPG are my thing, and that ND was about as JRPG as they come.
But having gone through a year long wait on the FFXV season pass, still waiting on episode Ignis, I just don't like plsying games that long. Start, finish, move on.
Add to that the extra cost. They are already selling a $100 collectors edition, for that much money you should get the season pass. Or at least offer a discounted bundle if they want my money in autumn 2017 for a story that comes out in autumn 2018.
For those who don't follow Sony, Horizon Zero Dawn has $20 DLC release today, and in December you can buy the Complete Edition where you basically get the DLC for free. So waiting until then may be the way to go.
Only problem is I just spent $405 on the Switch Mario bundle to play XC2, got Zelda on Wii U when it released, so Switch will kinda just be sitting there for awhile if I wait.
EDIT: I've read elsewhere the SP is $29.99 US. That's half the price of the game for what will likely be 10% of the content. 😠
One thing that makes me not as worried about the expansion pass price is that given that it's Xenoblade Chronicles, it'll probably offer a lot of content for that price. (It just seems likely that an expansion for a Xenoblade game would be quite big)
Let’s see what we get as a whole new story with Zelda first.
Personally I'd like to play the Base game first before I decide if I want even more of it.
Price seems hefty, but I also feel like that Autumn DLC could end up being like what "The Answer" was to Persona 3. Maybe a bit unfounded, but I've got a vibe.
I'd like an expansion to Xenoblade Chronicles X to explain what the hell happened at the end?!!
The game looks amazing, Zelda crossover looks nice but I'm disappointed about the news of an expansion pack.
@Sammus2 Mind your language - Octane
@Undead_terror Rejoice! The official press release also mentions the Wii U getting the Rex outfit side quest.
I guess it wouldn't really be a thing that exists without some sort of Zelda crossover.
I love the game i'm getting this December. The DLC doesn't bother me at all, that's a thing for Fall/Autumn 2018 to see if it's worth it or not.
Hard pass. Nintendo getting too greedy with these expansion passes lately.
Yes, welcome indeed! And it's about time too. Expansion passes and DLC should be developed for every great game. I love it!
Been buying season passes on other consoles for years. Was wondering when Nintendo would finally start expanding their amazing games with additional content. They're late to the party but, better late than never.
Same for collector editions. Glad to see them finally offering collector editions and controllers for more of their games. Just wish Odyssey got a CE and DLC. Oh well.
No intention of getting Xenoblade, just not my kind of RPG....excited for another costume sidequest in BoTW though! 😅
Looks decent. Considering Monolith's recent track record of Xenoblade and Xenoblade X the main campaign will contain more than enough content on its own. So my guess is that I might pick this up when I wrap the main game (in about a 75-100 hours over the span of 4 months) and get this for the second play-through.
They have come a long way since the first Xenosaga game that is for sure.
Nintendo, unlike other companies, doesn't really do "complete editions" unless porting to a new console. Pikmin 3 didn't get one, neither did Smash, or Mario Kart 8, or Zelda BotW, or Splatoon 1/2, or Mario Golf World Tour.
Just get the game. You will never see a complete edition for this game. Ever. Even Zelda likely won't see a complete edition, and if it does it'll be years away.
Surprised they're going to support the game well into 2018. Earlier this year new artwork leaked for their next game with a very different setting. Great studio, always hard at work it seems.
@Galenmereth Do educate me on selling data over the internet, kind stranger
@JaxonH ...I'm honestly not sure if that's sarcasm or a true statement
That expansion pack seems expensive.
@Sammus2 The profanity tho
@Oubie I was just going to ask about the Wii U getting the Rex quest. Thank you for the clarification.
This will give me another reason to jump on "Breath of the Wild" this weekend. I'm finishing up with what I want to play of "Odyssey" right now. A third run of "Skyrim" will start next week, before "Xenoblade 2" launches.
@JaxonH Well considering your previous post was - Welcome Nintendo to the DLC party - doesnt it logically follow that if Nintendo is jumping late onto the DLC bandwagon that it will then jump late on the Complete efition bandwagon? I mean how could they put out Complete editions when they didn't do DLC before, amirite? MK8D was a complete ed, SSB4 will get one as well. Not saying it will happen any time soon, but I'm staring at a screen that says $89.98 on my TV right now, in a way that IS a complete edition, isn't it? Just need that bundle to go on sale for $60.
Interestingly there is NO season pass on the eShop, game is $59.99, bundle is $89.98. Guess people getting the game on cart have to wait.
I may still get the game, $48 on Amazon helps, but I need to vent first. But $30, yowza, it's a long single player game already. Probably half of that $30 should be in the game slready, like that Hero's Path green line in Zelda, EVERYBODY who paid $60 should have that. But they take stuff out to pad the DLC package. I can just play the FREE Zelda DLC quest for Rex s2 outfit instead.
And the Zelda BotW Explorers Ed, while not containing the DLC, is a re-release with extra swag for $60, so it's a step in that direction. Not saying XC2 complete will happen, but it could.
Reminds me of the expansion pass for Zelda. While I'm shuddering a bit at that price, at least it includes new story content next year (again, just like Zelda's). So I'll probably get the expansion pass since I'll likely get eShop cards for my birthday/Christmas.
Explorers Edition is case and point. Even when they could have done a complete edition they chose not to.
But hey, if you wanna skip every game you want that has a DLC pass... you do you.
@cfgk24 I like this comment.
@JaxonH "Pikmin 3 didn't get one, neither did Smash, or Mario Kart 8, or Zelda BotW, or Splatoon 1/2, or Mario Golf World Tour."
Those Wii U games never got complete editions b/c they hardly supported Wii U as it was, only 14m sold, why bother? And besides, don't you think they were saving those Complete Editions for Switch? Wii U has been dead for what feels like 2 years now, it didn't get any support, certainly wasn't getting bundles.
Switch is getting it all, ads, games, ports, even Zelda Explorer ed. Know what isn't getting Zelda Explorer? Wii U. I can't make it any clearer than that.
Will Rex' outfit be available to the Wii U version of BotW?
@JaxonH I might do me, I'm spiteful that way.
How CAN Explorers edition possibly include the DLC when Champions Ballad isn't even out yet, no date even, and this edition comes out for Black Friday? This edition is a way to sell the DLC, get the game box on retail shelves. Give people an incentive to buy it on Switch if they already own it on Wii U. I looked into it, I have a thing for maps, but I don't have 150 hours to play it again.
Don't be surprised if there's a Zelda BotW Complete Edition next holiday, XC2 complete the year after that. Nintendo is catching up, Kimishima is a businessman.
Yet between 3DS, Wii U and Switch there isn't one single example of a complete edition from Nintendo. Only one game ported across platforms with added modes and content. Even if they did, it would be for a big hitter like Zelda, not Xenoblade.
I can't make it any clearer than that.
@rjejr Xenoblade Chronicles 2 was going to be the tipping point for me to move to Switch, but stumbling into a SNES Classic has changed that. For grins I put the NES, SNES, and GB homebrew stuff I liked on there. I am seriously debating on putting the 2600 homebrew stuff there too purely for the heck of it. There wasn't many decent SMS stuff and I haven't really looked at the GBA homebrew to be honest.
I was surprised by the number of NES and Gameboy stuff out there. Retroid, Blade Buster, Alter Ego, D-Pad Hero, Tecmo Bowl 2018, a bunch of stuff from Mojon Twins, Wonderland Dizzy, Mystery World Dizzy, Star Heritage, MazezaM, Skipp & Friends, and UWOL are average if not good homebrews. There are few more that I haven't tried yet, but honestly I am mostly playing FF VI right now.
@rjejr Nah... I don't see Nintendo releasing GOTY editions unless they release a Player's Choice version or they release such versions as a GameStop exclusive.
@rjejr I mean...you could just buy the base game now and ignore the Expansion Pass. Nintendo has previously commented on their DLC practices; they don't start new content til the base game is done. This isn't stuff that was ripped out to sell later.
I will agree that the Hero's Path should have been included as a free update. That would have been nice.
I’m all for extra content for XC2. One question - I assume it’s a yes, but it’s not explicitly stated anywhere - is the new outfit for Link coming to Wii U owners of BOTW?
Hah. £26.99 is £10 more than I paid for the XC1 entire game
@Lord I've been wishing for a Multiplayer Xenoblade since I fell in love with the original game!
I just read on Twitter that there's a press release saying that Rex' outfit is coming to the Wii U version of BotW!
My normal response to DLC is, "I'll play through the game, if I finish and I want more then I'll be more than happy to buy it. If I finish and feel satisfied then I'll leave it alone and save my money."
With Mario Kart 8, I wanted more and bought the DLC, with Smash Bros for Wii U, I was satisfied and didn't buy any. With Breath of the Wild I conquered it and wanted more story (as soon as it releases I'll buy it).
However, the original Xenoblade Chronicles is my all time favorite game and watching that Nintendo Direct this morning I got more of an original Xenoblade Chronicles vibe than I did a Xenoblade X vibe so I just may break my rule and buy it day 1 this time.
They crazy. I only care about extra story content - not paying half the cost of the original game to get it.
This is some Activision level greed right there.
Sure, always wanted to pay 45$ for an expansion...
There's a couple character designs I really dig in there.
Would have been better off if they waited a month or two after release to talk about expansion passes.
The game isn't even in anyones homes and they're talking about adding content to a game none of us has played yet? It'd be more suiting AFTERWARDS because then MAYBE people will be almost done with the core game and would be like 'hey, this is cool because I loved how final and finished the main campaign was! At least I get to continue to journey well into 2018!', but talking about new content for a game we haven't played yet is...pretentious. Especially with that horrible looking price tag. Bleh.
@rjejr Gotta say I agree with you. Nintendo is late to the party on almost all things. Just because they're late on DLC doesn't mean they won't cozy up to complete editions and micro transactions in the future. Near future, possibly. I was half-worried they were gonna make the Core Crystals into a loot box system.
Now Link can look just as derpy as the XB2 kid. Nice.
Also...I'm kind of hating all these expansion passes.
I'm all IN. For this and Justice League.
Couldn't one just buy the japanese season pass?
@Galenmereth Just so you know, I've read the links you posted and I understand a bit better why is unwise to make a direct 1:1 comparison. That said, I want to point something out that I think you're overlooking: this season pass doesn't exist in a vacuum.
The price of BotW's season pass in Japan is ¥2500. Its price in the West is $20/€20/£18. Compare it to the retail price of Xenoblade's: ¥2778 in Japan, €30 in the West. See the difference? I'm not seeing how such an increase can be justified just behind market fluctuations, especially since Zelda's season pass wasn't released that long ago. So, the way I see it, either those extra taxes (besides stuff like, for example, the 21% VAT we have here in Spain) were close to zero when Zelda's was released, or they weren't but Nintendo was making enough profit with the pass for them not to matter. Doesn't seem like they're willing to do that with this one.
I first thought the difference in price between both exists because of localization costs, but Zelda's DLC will also include new story content, with its voice-acting, subtitles and all. So yeah, I see no justification for how wildly both scenarios differ.
@Aurumonado Don't forget BOTW's getting 4 new amiibo this month. If this game does well, maybe they'll add amiibo later on to work with the updates.
Season pass, launch-day DLC, can't buy individual packs, announced before the game is even out.
And people say I'm unfairly negative.
This is worse than the Switch tee.
I'm not too happy about them announcing a $30 season pass before the game is even out.It's especially frustrating because Nintendo almost never sells complete editions of their games. In addition Rex's costume looks terrible. It's even more apparent how ridiculous it looks when it's put on another character like Link.
Well I'm glad Link doesn't get the Pyra outfit lol
Not sure why people are so upset over the DLC. It seems like more content than the BotW pass and it's pretty common practice nowadays to announce DLC before the game comes out. It lets people know that even after they finish the game they can enjoy even more if they want. (Kinda funny how people were upset when Mass Effect Andromeda cut their DLC plans).
And at least Nintendo is good about paid DLC being made AFTER the game is finished, so those who don't get it aren't missing anything from the main game.
Pre-ordering DLC's, people please don't encourage this behavior by buying Season Passes. I swear there is a defense force for everything.
Uh...so was this the biggest news that came out of the direct? What a letdown.
Wow looks even better than expected, nice! Looking forward to this.
Picking up Skyrim over this
Are the outfits for Link free?
Damn more stuff to do in zelda^^. I hope i can 100% it until XCX 2.
I think i will buy the season pass day 1. Im also optimistic it will be worth the price. Season pass over amiibo any day.
@JaxonH Before I forget, finally hit 11 days on Switch w/ Mario, you were right, yesterday it said "10 days", today it said "30 hours or more". Not exact, but 30 hours or more is a lot better than "11 days" would have been.
Alright, gotta get back to my inbox to catch up.
I have nothing against this expansion thing. But I will not buy it because I don’t have enough time to finish the main quest. This expansion passes are for those young gamers who have more than enough time and energy for games. So I’m happy with my collectors edition.
That English narrator sounds strangely similar to Elma from XCX.
@Darknyht "but honestly I am mostly playing FF VI right now."
My son and I were just going over all of the games we could play instead of XC2. He's only 15 so it's a way long list for him, I have a couple of dozen PS1 JRPG on disc. My list is shorter, but tomorrow in the mail I am getting on PS4 Rise of the Tomb Raider, Uncharted Lost legacy and 6 Kingdom Hearts games, plus the Horizon DLC released today so I can finally start playing that.
I'm not a big fan of anything retro, my son got the NES Mini for Christmas last year but passed on SNES Mini as we already owned most of the ones he wanted on Wiiware so he figured that $80 could be better spent.
Lots of games in the world looking to be played, nobody really needs anything Day 1.
@MarcelRguez So what, the Switch is region-free.
If it's 20€ in Japan I'll buy it from the Japanese eshop. ^^
Well, given the pricing of the CE and DLC here in Belgium, I'll be spending €120 in total on Xenoblade Chronicles 2. I'm sure it's going to be worth it though.
@JaxonH "I can't make it any clearer than that."
Yet another Jax comment for the memory banks for when the time is right.
You're probably right about XC2 not being a game they'd do a "Complete" edition for, but Nintnedo always comes around to the dark side eventually. Do you remember when Iwata said games on mobile would benefit the company in the short run but kill it in the long run so he wouldn't do them? Or Sakari saying no DLC for SSB4? A complete edition of something is only a matter of time. Who knows, maybe they'll reissue ARMS or Spaltoon 2 when they are done supporting them.
But I'm probably waiting just the same. Even if they dont' do a complete ed for XC2 the game and or DLC will be on sale, I'll get the $90 for $50.
@JaxonH Email I just got from my wife
"Yeah, we can wait on that one till they come out with the complete edition. 6 Kingdom Hearts games should keep us busy."
...I think I'll stick with BotW's season pass when I get a Switch.
@Indielink "This isn't stuff that was ripped out to sell later."
I don't mean to say this is on disc and locked, I'd just rather play a game when it's done, way too many games these days get better - not just w/ DLC but w/ patches and updates - after they've been out awhile. They spread out stuff for this game over an entire year, to me, it makes sense to play it all when it's done, rather than in drips and drops. I HATE that about FFXV.
@GC-161 "as a GameStop exclusive."
Don't even joke about that. I think I'm 1 of the people who spent $70 on a not used not new copy of XC there.
That expansion pass seems rather expensive. I'm also not keen on the expansion pass model, I'd prefer to be able to just buy the new story and skip the other things.
@Operative2-0 "Core Crystals into a loot box system."
There were several times I typed "Loot boxes" into the live feed but I never hit the button. Of course w/ a $30 all-or-nothing season pass for a $60 game w/ a $100 collectible set they don't really need loot boxes.
They came pretty close to already having "loot boxes" w/ their 6 pages of 75c Mii skins in SSB4. Though that wasn't pay-to-win, just pay-to-skin. 6 pages of Mii skins tho
I'm sorry, but that armor is the most hideous armor I've literally ever seen. It's awful. I would rather wear pretty much anything else.
@shani I thought of that too, but unless you also buy the Japanese version of the game, I doubt it will work.
See, I believe the DLC has to match your version of the game no matter what. Even when you "de-activate" the region-lock on Wii U or 3DS via homebrew, a European game won't recognize the DLC you install unless it's the European version as well. Not sure if it's still the case on Switch, but I'd bet it is, sadly.
I'm not interested in the game but it will hopefully sell well. I wish Mario Odyssey got a collectors edition with cd and book though...
I do like that they have a years worth of content drops.
@MarcelRguez TBH I'm fairly certain it should work.
So far every game I bought on different Switch eshops was just the same version as in my other eshops.
E.g. I bought NBA2k18 from the US eshop and Mario Odyssey from the South African eshop and both games show up as 'bought' in the German (or really any, even the Japanese) eshop.
Because that's what region free should be like.
If the main game is identical, the DLC should work with any version.
I don't think retroactively deactivating the region lock of previous consoles via homebrew achieves the same as having a system that works without region lock by default.
Keep in mind that because there was a region lock by default (on Wii U & 3DS), the game files were probably different and therefore incompatible with each other (even if the region lock was lifted retroactively), but now that there is no need for different versions, there shouldn't be any incompatibilities.
As a general rule, I only buy Switch games from the cheapest eshop in the world. You can easily save up to ~20€ per game.
@rjejr For all intents and purposes, the game is done. This is just a chunk of the team making more stuff beyond that.
@shani Maybe you're right, but I was under the impression that the files were different still, your device is just "compatible" with all different versions of the game. A good test, if it can be done, would be to update your USA game from the German eShop and not from the Switch's home menu (from the menu, you don't know if the system is pulling the update for the USA version after recognizing the title's ID). Don't think it can be done.
That said, I guess it does make more sense for all the files to be the same if the device is region-free anyway.
Anyone know if the Special edition of the game has the expansion pass included?
It’s ugly, to be honest.
After watching the Direct I must confess I’ve lost all my interest for the game. It seems like a confusing game and I deeply dislike the combat. Specially I don’t like how the characters seem to be hitting air instead of an enemy. This Direct left clear that Xenoblade is not a game for me.
I don't like this trend at all. People need 90 $ to buy the game+the pass. It should be something like 15 $ euro more maximum.
I think you'd be better off staying a generation behind. Just buy game of the year editions five years after they release (and the original Xenoblade 2 copy 5 years after it releases when you realize they never actually made a game of the year edition for it, which they won't because Nintendo is not going to give anyone incentive to stop buying day one).
That, or finally let go of the compulsory need to have every bit of content related to a particular game. Play the main game and ignore the DLC entirely.
And besides the fact we can look at history and see that Nintendo does not do game of the year editions despite having released DLC for years now, besides the fact they won't want to incentivize people to stop buying day one, there's also the fact that this particular game is already 13gb and there's only 14.9gb usable space on a 16gb cart, and I can guarantee you the DLC will be more than 1gb. And they are not going to double their cartridge costs to the super expensive 32gb versions just to include DLC. We already see they took a game series that was 22gb on Wii U and made sure the sequel fit on a 16gb cart. You can be sure there's a reason for that. The only time I see them using the large carts are for compilations that need it or where the main game itself needs it.
Link is wearing clothes from a game Tetsuya Nomura did partial character design for.
What a time to be alive.
Hmm other than the new quests and the new story I'm not too fussed about the rest of the content on offer there. I'm sure the story content will be worth the price alone though
Hm... No. This is a misuse of the term "expansion pass." If you want to see it be used correctly, see Witcher 3, et al. This is indeed an example of the dreaded "season pass" that is used so often in the console space. By comparison, most of this sort of content would have been free to download with the purchase of the original Witcher 3 release, and the new story content would need to be significant (see Hearts of Stone, Blood and Wine) to warrant the term expansion. Don't pay for this XB2 season pass.
@JaxonH Isn't Mario Kart 8 Deluxe basically the complete edition of MK8?
Ya we went over that already. Pretty much said the only example is one where the game was ported across platforms with new content added.
@rjejr "I don't mean to say this is on disc and locked, I'd just rather play a game when it's done, way too many games these days get better - not just w/ DLC but w/ patches and updates - after they've been out awhile. They spread out stuff for this game over an entire year, to me, it makes sense to play it all when it's done, rather than in drips and drops."
That's how you know right there it's actually a "season pass," not an "expansion pass." True expansion packs are big content dumps, season passes are trickled down content. The key is the $30 price point which doesn't match the total content additions, that's how you know something's off.
@JaxonH That's a first party example, but there's also things from third parties like Rayman Legends: Definitive Edition and Disgaea 5 Complete, right? Those are complete editions, it's even in their names. Besides Super Mario Oddysey, which is the first system seller for the NS that stands on it's own, NS has been banking on ports, definitive editions, and definitive continuations of titles from previously released consoles. So that trend is likely going to continue. I wouldn't be surprised to see a BotW Complete edition next year to push it further as an evergreen title.
You should really go back and read our conversation
We were discussing the likelihood of Nintendo releasing "GotY" editions for Xenoblade 2
3rd parties have nothing to do with anything. Nintendo historically does not do complete editions. Is it possible? Sure, anything's possible. But if you want to make a prediction grounded in the evidence of historical data, then the answer is unequivocally no. It is not likely. And if there were to be an exception, it would be a Zelda or Mario long before it would be Xenoblade.
@JaxonH I did, and I would say it's got a fair likelihood. Monolith Soft isn't really known for that sort of thing, but then again, they aren't known for having monetization of additional content for individual titles either. They're not locked into a limited print run situation like with the original XB, nor will they be contending with a nearly stagnant user base pool like with XBX. Not to mention, XB2 seems to be more commercialized than past entries, so Nintendo will likely push this one as an evergreen title. The fact that there are complete editions being approved for third parties to go ahead on proves Nintendo is open to the idea in some capacity, and titles like SSB4 will probably also rerelease as a complete edition ala MK8 Deluxe.
I mean, you're free to believe what you want. But there's no arguing with historical evidence and precedent.
Nintendo didn't just start releasing DLC yesterday. They've been doing season passes and DLC for years now. And they historically have not done complete editions. They just haven't.
And the reason they don't is likely the fact their games hold value over time. Unlike 3rd parties they don't need to do package deal rereleases as excuse to sell their games full price again. Their games stay full price as is.
Not only that, but it would forcibly devalue existing copies without DLC. Not only that, this DLC will be more than 1gb and they're not going to double cart costs to 32gb to include DLC to sell full price when their game is already selling full price. And they're not going to start giving people inventive to not buy day one. An exception once or twice? Sure. But even then, countless games they've released DLC/season pass for that never got any type of complete edition.
And again, there's just no precedent. You're free to speculate all you want, but history tells us otherwise. Logic tells us otherwise (in multiple respects).
@JaxonH Nintendo has been breaking precedents in more ways than one over the past few years. I still remember when people used to say, "Oh, Nintendo wouldn't do this or that style of monetization, this is why I like Nintendo and I dislike x or y company for doing it." And then the "This is how is it now, just accept it" articles came. Nothing is sacred in Nintendoland anymore.
Sure, but not in every respect. There are still tons of things they don't do (micro transactions, digital deluxe versions for $80, etc)
So saying "well they've broken other precedents" doesn't really say much aside from putting it in the realm of possibility. Which again, sure it's possible but that's a far cry from likely.
I am a bit confused: Do I need to do a certain quest in Xenoblade to unlock a new suit for Link in Breath of the Wild? Its that how it works? Oh I just realized: The first content NOT for the Wii u version. Its only clothes, but still...
@PlywoodStick "that's how you know something's off."
1 debate I've managed to avoid is "season" vs "expansion" pass. As somebody who never games on PC - which is where I believe all of this nonsense started - I just see a "pass" as a pass, and have focused my attention on the "pass" part. To me, the whole idea of a "pass" in gaming is too offer you a discount when you purchase a bunch of items at 1 time, probably in advance. Something like the Telltale games which arrive in 5 parts that are $5 each, 5 x $5=$25, but when you buy the "pass" you only pay $20. (And nobody ever calls part 1 a "Complete" game.) Nintendo likes taking away that option, going all or nothing these days. Pikmin 3, MK8, SSB4 had options. Pikmin 3 and MK8 even had some good options, SSB4 never had a pass b/c it would have been $99 for a $60 game due to all the Mii skins and looked ridiculous. So you're on your own for "Season" vs "Expansion", there's only so many fights I have the time to lose. And I need to spend some of that time deciding what to play now that XC2 is on the back burner for another year. Which means I'll still be waiting less time to play it - 2 years - than Zelda BotW which took 3.
@JaxonH Several of the Pokémon spinoff titles (Candy Crush, meet your sibling Pokémon Shuffle) and Fire Emblem titles (everything from map packs to Summer Scramble fan service DLC) have micro transactions. Fire Emblem Fates had an $80 limited edition, physical only special edition with both Conquest and Birthright paths on one card, and Revelations path download access when it became available, which was never given a reprint run. And of course, Amiibo are limited stock physical incarnations of DLC/micro transaction keys. (But at least the figures are nice.)
@rjejr Over the past year I've just hit a point where games from that era is just hitting that sweet spot, along with some newer indies with similar vibes. It's been years since I played through Final Fantasy VI, and I am attempting to play through it with some self imposed restrictions (limiting Esper usage).
Some of it is that I just don't have as much time (or budget) for gaming as I once did. There is also a part of me that wonders like the Yacht Club team did, what could have been had the NES, SNES or any other system of the era continued a few more years.
That's... Not the same.
Maps are actual content, and we were fortunate enough to have options to buy separately. It's not the same as selling weapons in Fire Emblem for $1.99 each.
Trying to spin it as if Nintendo does microtransactions is more than a stretch.
@rjejr Nope, the season pass trend started with consoles:
@JaxonH Paying for individual pieces or standalone packs of extra content is a micro transaction, by definition. For example, the Streetpass Mii Plaza games that cost money to download are instances of micro transactions. The primary difference between a micro transaction and an expansion is when a conglomerate of many different pieces of content form a cohesive whole, and are organically integrated into the existing product- that's an expansion, rather than being a tertiary addition like a map pack.
Not even Link can make that costume design work...
If you asked anyone whether buying actual new maps of content was considered "microtransactions" they would tell you no.
Even if you technically classified it as such, it is not the same thing as selling armor and weapons for 99 cents each. Maps are actual content. Real additional content to play. That is not the same.
Equating real, actual maps to play as the same thing as nickel and dime microtransactions meant to bleed the player with near worthless content like guns, armor, weapons and costumes.... is a stretch only meant to serve an agenda of spinning the narrative as if Nintendo is no different than Take Two or EA.
@JaxonH "I think you'd be better off staying a generation behind."
I try to do that, but with the PS3 and PS4 it's actually hard for me to keep track of which is which, as I think every PS3 game got a PS4 port. And some PS2 games got PS3 remasters and then PS4 remasters, like Kingdom Hearts 1 - 6 (that sets needs a name) which is arriving in the mail today. I've never played any of the handheld KH games so I decided to replay thru 1 and 2 among the other 2 and watch the other 2. Which is why I waited 3 years to buy a PS4. I bought the Switch for Mario and XC2, but had I known about the season pass 2 weeks ago I may have said Switch for Christmas 2018 like my wife said we should. I only talked her into it b/c we are traveling so much this holiday, and I didn't know what else to get the kids as their big family gift, it was either Switch or PSVR, and since she wanted XC2 I won her over. But even after all that last night at dinner she said to wait on XC2, she said FFXV ruined it for her, going back every few months for bite size snacks, watching the game slowly evolve for the better - did you know they just recently added in a bestiary? My family likes bestiaries like I like maps.
I do think you are being a bit funny and extreme w/ the 5 years next generation joke. 1 year usually does it. Sometimes they even make it easy for me, like Rise of the Tomb Raider only came out on PS4 a year after Xbox in a complete ed, so that was an easy no brainer. The Witcher 3 and H:ZD complete games were released soon after the last DLC. Personally I would have waited on H:ZD but my kid got it for his birthday. Watched the opening last night, man that game looks good, even in 1080p. Made me think about 4k and HDR. Not enough to get it, but it made me wonder. Game is going to look stupendous updated on PS5.
As for your edit, still don't understand why you are so adamant against Ntinedo doing something new when they've been doing things they've never done before for the past 5 or 6 years now. Kimishima will do what he thinks makes business sense, and if he sees Complete Editions as a money maker he'll do those also. They've been doing Nitnedo Selects and Players Choice for years now. Doing them as complete editions going forward makes perfect sense. Animal Crossing: New Leaf: Welcome amiibo was a complete edition of sorts, even if the update was free it was still a new area for the game, the RV park. If you owned the original game AC:NL you could download the update for free, or you could buy the complete game on cart. So Nintneod has done it already, just with a free area rather than paid. But they made an entire NEW cart, sold as a NEW game, including the update, explain that away.
And don't worry about the cart size, they can include the base game on cart and have the DLC as an additional download at no extra charge. I paid $380 for a Switch and Mario bundle and I had to download the entire Mario game. And if you look on the eShop you'll see a bundle for XC2 and the season pass for $89.98, so it is bundled in a complete edition already. All they need to do in a year is drop the price $10, call it "Complete", and there you have it.
It'll take 2 or 3 years, but it will happen again, AC:NL:Wa and MK8D won't be the last. ARMS Complete and Splatoon 2 Complete are likely candidates whenever they finish updating them. If you need a logical reason to do it, Kimishima will do it b/c it's a way for Ntinedo to get retailers to make retail space on store shelves, when they don't want to stock 2 year old games they can stock newish games. There is no reason for Nintendo to have "Nintnedo Selects" copies of Splatoon 2 and ARMS on store shelves and NOT have them all on cart day 1. That extra content won't take up much room. And it's free anyway, so no money lost. If they want to keep calling them Deluxe rather than Complete I can live with that. Old game in a new box with extra content and a descriptor is close enough.
You can think of 100 reasons why it would make sense, and you might not be wrong, but there's no getting around the fact it's something they currently don't do and historically haven't done.
@JaxonH There are many different types and degrees of micro transactions, not just one or a few. Pay to Play mechanics like those seen in Pokémon Shuffle are just among the more insidious ones.
Honestly... When Nintendo offers things like this, or charges money for individual characters in SSB4... This is really not so different from EA or Take-Two sorts of business practices. Five years ago, I would have said the difference between companies like them and Nintendo is night and day. Now? The differences are certainly there, but the usage of modern gaming business practices is becoming increasingly similar from an objective standpoint. The result is no different in that regard just because it's Nintendo doing it.
@PlywoodStick Looks like I assumed season passes were around in the 90's with add-on content for PCs games such as Total Annihilation. Guess "free" was all the rage back then so nobody needed to buy passes.
I still feell ike Blizzard single handily invented expansions though, with all of those Warcraft games back before Wow.
So yeah, pass discounts might be a more recent console invention, but I still feel like the extra DLC got it's start on PC.
Items and features available by microtransaction can range from cosmetic (such as decorative character attire) to functional (such as weapons and items)
It is made clear that actual new content to play such as story content, maps, levels, etc are not grouped in under the "microtransaction" umbrella. Content may be sold individually like maps or levels, but it's new game content to play and therefore does not constitute a "microtransaction". Microtransactions are defined as outfits, weapons and items sold in the game which already exists. The existing game facilitates small purchases of items and weapons and outfits to use in said game. New content such as maps and levels are just flat out new content to buy and play, cannot be twisted into pay to win, and only add to the game.
Characters are a grey area. I'd still say even characters are not microtransactions.
It's not ok "just because Nintendo is doing it". It's ok because it doesn't fall into said definition. If Take Two was selling additional maps or levels nobody would care. But they're not. They sell haircuts and in game shoes with virtual currency.
@Darknyht Budget and Time are the twin cruel mistresses of life.
Well unless your Jax, he has them both tied up in cages in his basement.
@JaxonH I sense I'm wearing you down, and also distracting you from more serious discussions, so I'll let it go.
If it makes you feel any better I know there won't be an "XC2 Complete". JRPG never have Complete editions, they always have stupid names like XC2 International Edition or something like that. Well technically FF14 DOES have a Complete boxed edition but I don't count those online FF games anyway. "XC2: Blade and Driver Ed." maybe? It won't be a Select game either, JRPG seldom are. Poor poor XCX.
@rjejr JRPG's have frequently gotten complete editions over the years, they just tend not to show up in that way outside Japan. For example, the Shin Megami Tensei Nocturne we got in the USA is actually a localization of the "Maniax" (Complete) rerelease edition in Japan.
Fully fledged expansion packs got their start on PC, to be sure, but the DLC model as we know it today has it's beginnings with consoles. Paying for "games as a service" goes back to the Sega Genesis Sega Channel, and DLC exclusive content as we would recognize it today was available on the Satellaview SNES satellite service, and was originally planned for the N64DD with things like the F-Zero X map creation tools and Ocarina of Time Gaiden dungeon changes.
@JaxonH The DLC Mii outfits in SSB4 are basically the same thing as what Take Two does. It's just selling reskins. I suppose some things could be interpreted as being different by semantics if you apply such an incredibly narrow definition (which is far from all-encompassing), but those DLC reskins plainly fall under the definition you refer to.
@PlywoodStick " they just tend not to show up in that way outside Japan"
I'm guessing Japan gets a whole lot of things we don't get with a lot of those series of games. And I'll give credit to any company who comes up w/ a stupid name for their complete edition, Complete is kinda boring. DArksiders had some good ones, Warmastered. though that was more of a remaster than a collection. Nothing ever goes away these days, the gaming landscape is filled with undying zombies. GTAV is never going away. Neither is Minecraft. "Gaming as a service". That phrase seems to have just started yet I hate it immensely already.
items, some quests and a blade are microtransactions
the last is brand new story content, which is the only thing worth.
"face powerful enemies in a new challenge mode" WTH?!!!
for half the price of a 100+ hours game? prfff no.
what's next lootboxes?!!
@kotag Naw, Nintendo's saving loot boxes for the next gen of Pokémon!
@rjejr @JaxonH both of you made excellent points and at the end of the day its all subjective and ultimately we are all going to buy XC2...some sooner rather than later. Ninty NORMALLY doesnt do GOTY edition releases but they have done so randomly in the past so its a maybe but highly unlikely. I remember XCX had DLC in japan and then all that DLC was included in the NA/UK for free on disc so yeah anything is possible and to each their own if u get it launch day or not but i believe the bigger question is will Persona 5 beat XC2 for my game of the year! Ive logged in over 150 hrs in BOTW and 20 hrs (394 moons) in Odyssey and beat both and while both are incredible games Persona 5 on my PS3 blew them away but thats just my personal preference and the only real contender is XC2 because regardless of the expansion pass (more XC2?! hell yeah sign me up!!!) im buying it day 1 on GP! I still play XC yearly just because its my 1 game of all time so anything i can do to support them in giving me more Xeno content and/or another sequel its a done deal for me and no one is going to change my mind ;p
also rjejr just b/c u didnt like the Wii U final releases doesnt mean there werent any my friend...TMS #FE is JRPG gold whether its ur cup of tea or not if u love JRPG the gameplay battles and dungeons here far exceeds the jpoppyness which keeps u away and no ur not too old but u are stubborn...nonetheless TMS #FE is a GEM that i hope gets a sequel on the switch and Color Splash...well being a ninty fan is great but the community animosity really sucks especially when they dismiss good games for petty reasons like Federation Force...but like u said my friend ur one and done when it comes to games and games with a great deal of investment may not be for you anymore but for me i would be because i would rather play a few quality memorable experiences than to play a quantity of “yeah ok sure they are good” games but apples and oranges or should i say DKC tropical freeze and Jax and Daxter LOL!!!
@rjejr "Gaming as a Service" and "Software as a Service" are two terms that give me great pause. It should honestly scare us more than it seems to. Game, phone, entertainment, and social network designers are intentionally designing their software to get you addicted, to give you that need to constantly check in. It is the long term consequences of our society that really worry me, as I don't think having a majority of society unable to focus on anything for than a few seconds is good. It is too easy to forget hard lessons from the past because they can't be explained in 280 characters.
@Darknyht "Software as a Service"
Yeah, that one is kinda scary. It's like - here ya go Skynet, the nuclear codes you asked for.
It's ok though, this year is the year of Linux on the desktop. For the 15th year in a row.
Nice word. Yeah, I have a certain look that I prefer, everything else gets skipped. That Persona 5 game is all the rage over on Pushsquare, and that other series, TMS maybe? But I just can't get into them. Paper Mario Color Splash was really good - the first 2/3 I got to play before being stopped cold on the "guess them all' matching game.
I'll play XC2. When it's done. Not like I'm hard up for games, here's what I got in the mail today. I think it's about 200 hours worth.
Old enough and last gen enough for you @JaxonH ? Don't worry, I'm trading in U:LL when I'm done, it's more of a rental.
@rjejr lol that sounds like a good reason to not rush but for me when it comes to Xenoblade im in day 1 and everything else gets placed on the back burner
Thanks to Tokyo Mirage Sessions #FE (my GOTY 2016...krazy right) it made me want to try out Persona 5 and cant believe ive neglected this series all these years...so much so i bought Persona 1,2 and 3 on the PSP and P4 Golden on the Vita. i know i went a bit krazy but great games are great games regardless and im thankful i can get a chance to play them now for the first time and P1 has not disappointed especially with that fresh jpoppy sdtk! its insanely catchy battle theme and boss battle are sweet!
oh and i have yet to start Ys 8 Lacrimosa of Dana on my vita as well...so like u my friend i have many games to catch up on with hundreds of hours of greatness awaiting me and thats without a PS4 LMAO!!!
and at the end of the day i will put them all in the waiting room for some Xenoblade Chronicles 2...ive been listing to some of the songs from XC2 on youtube and man its great to have the old team back from the original sdtk...this has been a magnificent year for gaming for me and December 1 cant get here soon enough LOL
@rjejr Yeah, unfortunately it is the "Year of Linux" in the form of software as a service: Chromebook/Android.
@Darknyht Chromebooks and Android tablets are the last bastion of defense against MS and Windows so I can't fault them too much. Apple is it's own gated community watching from on high, they're no help.
At least the angry mobs seem to be having some affect on EA, that can't be a bad thing. Only EA could screw up a guaranteed easy profit machine like a Star Wars license. SW fanbois are almost as bad as the Apple Kool-Aid drinkers.
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