Video: Digital Foundry Tackles the Native Resolution and Framerate in The Legend of Zelda: Twilight Princess HD

Good. I'm glad it's 1080p. Welcome to the elite 1080p club, TPHD!

I should not be this excited about a game I've already beaten.

I always remember TP fondly, but when I actually play it, I don't enjoy it. Don't think I'll double dip on this one.

I guess I won't be picking this up after all, even though I was still on the fence. 30 FPS sets off my simulation sickness and makes me feel very ill after about an hour of gameplay. I believe it is a rather rare condition, much like low FoV sickness for some people.

60 FPS should be standard in 2016 anyway, but sadly it isn't.

Though I'm surprised it is 30 FPS. Am I the only one that can barely tell a difference between this and upscaled Dolphin TP? It must have been an engine frame rate cap they couldn't work around.

THIS IS NOT A REMAKE IT IS A REMASTER. Just like Wind Waker, however as opposed to a few shaders, this time it is higher res textures.

Why do journalists continue to use the wrong terminology and technical information, all of which spreads like wildfire amongst the console masses. I know the need to type fast, but a few checks wouldn't go amiss.

As for the Smash Bros ERROR. Wii U runs full 1080p60, 3DS is 60fps with 30fps.

Please fix accordingly! Lol. 😁

I'd be lying if I didn't wish this game was at 60fps. HD is fantastic but a smooth awesome frame rate of Twilight Princess would have been my ultimate dream. 30fps is fine but after playing several 60fps games, its a bit disappointing going back to 30fps. Im not a framerate nerd or anything but it is something everyone will notice at one point in there gaming lives.

It looks like they'd have to do a lot of additional work to get the game to handle being at 60FPS, as the core original game animations and engine were designed to run at 30 fps.

@liveswired If you plan to stick around the site, expect to see a lot of those sadly. Just earlier they called "Red" and "Blue" from the Pokemon manga "Ash" and "Gary" which is a rookie mistake. Especially for Red.

Well, if they did upscaling THEN people would be entitled to throw all the hate towards them, because it would be one of the laziest ports.

However there is no surprise in framerate and goys expecting or moaning about it not being 60 frames are ignorant.
This game couldn't work in 60 frames without MAJOR overhaul.
Physics (would be screwing up all over the place), animations, combat etc. would have to be reworked and with the amount of work needed to do that it would end up as a remake.

Why is this game 30 FPS? Sony made the 3 Uncharted games 60 FPS in the collection for the PS4 which has more going on in the screen than this. What's Nintendo's excuse?

@ZAZX Actually, when they first came out there wasn't a clear distinction between the games and the show that there is now. A lot of people named them that back then.

@IAmDeclanJay All I can say is don't fall for the numbers game.

Having been in gaming for a long time I can tell you now that 30fps is much better for this type of game. Action arcade games are suited to 60fps.

30FPS provides a more grand, epic, realistic, visceral feel with physical combat. 60FPS offers that arcade, light twitch movement.

It's just one of those things. The same goes for cinema 24p being far superior to 48p, why? 48P looks fake and cheap.

In fact with many games, it's all down to the numbers, believing that a higher number is better when the truth is that it is all down to the consistent delivery of frames, controller response and game engine. If DF said it was 60 everyone playing would believe it. The placebo effect.

@Dave24 It depends heavily on the engine and competence of the developer. Unless you have direct information about Twilight Princess's engine you'd like to share, of course.

Some developers are moronic and hardcode their physics to 30 FPS, such as in the title Need for Speed: Rivals. Some only tie specific things to the frame rate, such as in Dark Souls: Prepare to Die edition. If you uncap that using DSFix, you may clip through the ground when sliding down ladders, but that's it. And then you have developers who know to future proof their engine/game and do not hard code a lower FPS cap.

Nintendo may have pulled an oops and tied physics to the frame rate considering how old the game is, or this may just be a lack of power and prioritizing graphics over game play.

People are still in an uproar about this game?
Geesh...

@TwilightOniAngel This was a quick 6 month hack together by a small, little known studio on the cheap.

Uncharted was the result of a 12 month project by the technical wizards of Bluepoint software.

Sony respect their IP, Nintendo don't however and are willing to charge more than the original release. Just look at the terrible emulation on Nintendo VC.

@liveswired Okay, stop. Just, just stop. You have no idea what you are talking about. The movie example has NOTHING to do with video games. Movies fill in the blanks with motion blur and you are not controlling what is on screen. Reaction time isn't important.

Games are not movies, plain and simple. They aren't even CLOSE to movies.

Edit: Also, this:

The argument about ~24FPS providing a "better cinematic experience" is completely made up. The film industry adopted 24FPS as a standard because back in the 1930s, higher framerate films took up too much physical film and lower framerate films were difficult to synchronize with the audio. Games don't need framerate caps because frames are generated in realtime as many times per second as your graphics card can handle, displayed to the screen, and then removed from memory to make room for the next frame.

Edit2: Also:

Researchers at the University of Massachusetts have determined through observation that not only is the difference noticeable, but player performance increases logarithmically up to 60FPS (logarithmically means the largest increases happen early on and begin to taper off, see rough example here). Unfortunately, they didn't test with framerates over 60, so we can intelligently theorize (but not scientifically prove) that this also applies to framerates beyond 60. They also concluded (since the curve is logarithmic) that framerates lower than 30 get almost exponentially worse, which is unfortunate because almost every "next-gen" demo so far has shown to dip as low as 10-20FPS while rendering heavier scenes.

Source for that: http://web.cs.wpi.edu/~claypool/papers/fr-rez/paper.pdf

Just trying to clear misinformation here.

@TechJunkie69

Ah, I was not aware. Though it would be beneficial to any journalist to have up to date information about their topic. Then again, you have to balance information with time, to have your article out while it is still relevant.

As long as it's perfectly locked at 30 fps, I'm fine with it.

wasn't that great the first time round, better off playing it on dolphin than shelling out on this. i won't be playing it again either way.

@liveswired You have no idea how much time, money, or energy was spent on this port. Do not post your baseless speculation as fact. And how is Tantalus/Straight Right any less known than Bluepoint?

30 fps vs. 60 fps does not bother me at all. Why does it bother people and expect 60 fps to be a standard?

60 fps will never be standard. No matter how powerful the hardware, developers will always choose pushing more graphical fidelity (even if it's not noticeable to the average human eye) over performance and resolution. Resolution is also prioritized over performance. The only exception to all of this is with fighting games, where 60 fps is necessary.

Don't know why people still can't seem to understand this.

@Yorumi No, the Wii U certainly can do that. The thing is that Twilight Princess HD is a quick remaster done by Tantalus intended to fill a release schedule. 60 fps wasn't prioritized, therefore it's not 60 fps. Simple as that.

@liveswired You're giving the big N excuses fam.

@liveswired Nintendo don't respect their IP?! It's like the most protective company out there. Thank goodness for the Zelda CDi games.

@Yorumi It's not exactly a Gamecube game anymore once you update most of the textures and lighting, and run it at 1080p.... Also, it DOES maintain 30fps for 99% of the time, and then only dips by a few frames. You can't say it's no longer 30fps because of that. We would then have to say that a 60fps game doesn't exist because they can all be pushed under 60.

@Yorumi Again, framerate wasn't prioritized. Not really an excuse, as it should have been prioritized considering it's a remaster, but obviously this wasn't the case.

Better idea: Get the game on Dolphin, install the texture packs, and it will look better than anything this remaster could possibly hope to be.

Wind Waker HD was locked at 30 as well, so I don't know why people are surprised by this.

@SupremeAllah Can confirm. It's downright beautiful that way. People look down on emulation but emulation often offers a better product than the companies do. Fan devotion is a thing.

That and all emulation isn't piracy. You can often use your perfectly legitimate game that you purchased with emulators.

@ZAZX : 60 fps isn't even standard on PC, PS4 and Xbone either.

I agree.. 30 fps is so 1990's.

I really wish it was 60FPS. Oh well...

Such a lazy port was seriously considering getting this but to only run the game at 30fps is just lazy the Wii U could easily run it at 60 was also planning to buy zelda wind waker HD but as someone mentioned thats 30fps no thank you. Or maybe I'm wrong and the processor is too weak to deal with the higher res textures as the processor is slower than the 360s which is an embarrasment in it's self.

@Tank207 WWHD was released at the time when Nintendo's games usually ran at 30fps. It was until 3D World came that buttery-smooth 60FPS came packaged with Nintendo's games... well, most of them. XD

@Ventilator Well, PS4 and Xbox One I agree with.

PC, however... Anything you want is standard. Unless the developer makes a bad port and caps their game at 30 FPS you can just lower your graphical settings and get 60. It's how I game without simulation sickness.

We haven't even played TPHD and many of you are convinced already of the quality of this port. FPS is just a number until you play the game. None of the 3D Zeldas (unless you want to get technical with ALBW) have been 60fps. It's likely that getting TP to run at 60fps could mean significant changes to animations, physics, cutscenes, and overall gameplay. It's not some trivial alteration with %100 absolutely positive benefits, particularly if the result tarnishes the classic feel whatsoever.

Most everyone lauds the previous Zelda remakes (OoT3D, MM3D) and remasters (WWHD), yet they were all 30fps with significant drops (especially WWHD). So far, TPHD looks to run more smoothly with less substantial drops. The amount of effort and resulting quality of work by Nintendo and Tantalus remains to be seen.

At this point why don't we let the game get released before jumping to conclusions and/or calling out the development process as lazy?

Can't wait to finally play this!! Never did pass the game

Looks gorgeous, can't wait!

I've pre-ordered it & I'm counting down the days!

REALLY I DIDN't know that this remaster wasn't going to be 60fps, pathetic all games play/control much better with a 60fps framerate and if anyone thinks that a remaster from an older game is OK to be anything less than 60fps you truly are clueless.I mean how many games now have we seen come out and been given the remaster treatment to 1080p/60fps and they're ALL run much better for it this is shockingly lazy and slack.

Terrible journalism. I can't even fathom how you can claim the game is locked at 30fps and also that there are occasional frame rate dips in the same article.

Same sh*te, different day!!!!!!!!!

@Yorumi to be fair, remove the included amiibo, the game is $47.

The game doesn't look THAT bad. It actually looks quite good given the amount of time spent on it. Though I will say it's not quite the leap that the Remastered Wind Waker was... But I'm sure a lot of that has to do with TP not aging quite as well. Also it being 30fps I couldn't really care less about. Honestly I prefer it, being it was the original framerate anyways...

@TwilightOniAngel
Yes because Wii U has the same graphical processing power as the PS4.

Can I whine about you guys a little? Those dips are nothing...the game is a very sustainable 30 FPS....60 fps is not needed in every game....splatoon, Mario kart, halo, call of duty...all are games that need to run at 60 frames....does anyone know what fallout runs at? Most of their games shoot for 30...and most of their games have major dips....are you guys just to young to not look past numbers? If I toss in my snes or n64 would it be unplayable to you....does a persons slightly elevated blood pressure mean they have high blood pressure if they are excited and in the back of an ambulance? All I am saying is for this game...when you are playing it...you won't notice...it looks fun, it looks better than it did...remember, Nintendo gave us wind waker because the upscale really did it well....I'm looking forward to the improved version of this game...it never had the chance to age as well as wind waker....I just wish people would put all this console bull crap to the side and enjoy these games we love together...and enjoy talking to each other about it...anyway sorry for slight rant...I guess I went and got old

Comparing 1080p Wii U games with the PS4 is kinda pointless considering PS4 games are far more demanding. The PS4 or XBone will chew up this Twilight Princess code and spit it out. That's the reality.

For me, personally, I would have preferred the game with Xbox One 900p resolution and a better frame rate but that's just me. I am happy with 30fps (I am a frame rate junkie. On the PC I always take 60fps at medium settings rather than 30fps at high or ultra) as long as there is not the jittering that was sometimes present in WWHD.

@Splatburst It doesn't matter the uncharted games if you played them. Has alot of things happening on the screen and they can still get 60 FPS on all 3 games in the PS4. This game has nothing on screen. Just an empty world, you occasionally fight like 4 or 5 enemies at a time. So you're going to tell me they couldn't do 60 FPS for a game that has nothing happening in the world?

@rishisquid I kinda get that. The first time I played it I was snowed in for days and had to skip work; it was complete bliss. I tried going back to it about 18 months ago and it just felt a bit lacking. I'll probably still pick it up, because I'm weird and obsessive, but here's hoping I enjoy it more when it looks all sparkly.

While I would've rather have 60fps, 30fps is far from a deal breaker for me. I can't wait for March 4th!!!!

Uhhhh I thought Wind Waker HD was 60fps while playing it...

If its like Wind Waker I'm all ok with 30fps

@TwilightOniAngel
If it's easy why wouldn't they? We know nothing what's going on behind the scenes. But we love b*tching because we can and because we hate Nintendo right? And we hate the amiibo too.

@Splatburst "If it's easy why wouldn't they?" One cause they were too lazy. two cause they needed to release this game quick so they can get you people to buy it. Third this is a cash grab if you're to blind to see that then i don't what to say.

And why you bringing Amiibo in this? It's not even about that. No one here is even talking about that. Or let me guess you don't like people saying mean things towards your precious Nintendo. Cause Nintendo is perfect in your eyes right? Jesus

What's the excuse to stay at 30fps again? Because improvements were minimal comparing to what WWHD did to the original version.

@Yorumi do we know enough about developing to know if it is lazy? I mean for real? How big is tantalus? I know they did funky barn. I just kinda got on a rant that 30 fps was the target those drops aren't really drops...not significant anyway..was it ever any doubt that it was going to be an upscaled port? Is the real problem expectations? I never expected it to be at 60... I did expect 1080 though. They have added things to the game, tried to improve the experience...it will be fine...I did read the comments....I heard whining lol...but again I'm prob just a grumpy old dude now...but at least everyone is passionate about it.

Booo, again.

@TwilightOniAngel
Lazy? Why would they be lazy if Nintendo is paying them? You see that's your problem. Calling Tantalus lazy when you don't even know what process they were using or what timeframe they need to complete the project.

And my precious Nintendo? I like Nintendo but Wii U is my first console since owning a Famicom back when I was a kid. I came from PC gaming and you're implying I'm a Nintendo fanboy? Okay.

@Yorumi
Lol yeah they are stingy with those prices for sure...always bugged me a little..I'm with you dude, those games are some good work, full remakes in some instances. Maybe it's all about the price...something faithful to the original was prob still the goal..for whatever reason you want to site. Filling out a release schedule on a dying system...that I have enjoyed so much...I was only asking the developing question cause I have no clue...I played baseball for to long and have spent the last 10 years of my life riding a fire engine or in the back of an ambulance...when you are a part of some peoples worst moments or sometimes final moments, I can get aggravated when people worry so much about things like frame rates. But I do appreciate the education it's all in text form, nothing I type is with a real negative tone....it may sound like it though. I try not to blindly defend a company and series I love...but it is known to happen

@Splatburst You're giving them so many excuses it's sad. And yes it is lazy. What they do? Up the graphics? WOW! But they can't work on the FPS? Really? Lazy! Sony can do it,but Nintendo can't? This was a quick cash grab. That's why they needed to hurry up with this.

And advice for you and many people on here. I don't care about your gaming past. Why? Cause that's not what were talking about! God i hate it when Nintendo fans bring up their gaming past like it means something nowadays. Acting like its stop them from being bias.Cause it doesn't

Seems like a very clean port with improved textures, shadows and lighting. I doubt the audio has really been tweaked from it's original synthesized mix, but I'm sold.

@Yorumi @TwilightOniAngel
I thought I was bringing my past to imply I'm not a Nintendo fan as you think I am. But whatever. Carry on b*tching on every TP HD article. It's good for you.

@Yorumi I forgot all about the master quest cd, that thing was awesome

@Splatburst Last reply to you.If Sony can make 3 games run 60 FPS. Then Nintendo can do it as well,But they didn't and that's lazy. And i will always say that and i will always criticize Nintendo. If you don't like it? Well i don't know what to say.

Oh "If it's easy why wouldn't they? We know nothing what's going on behind the scenes. But we love b*tching because we can and because we hate Nintendo right? And we hate the amiibo too." Yeah this doesn't make you look like a fanboy right?

@TwilightOniAngel lol it's okay dog, don't buy it if you don't want to.

I'm a huge frame rate nut, so the 30 frames-per-second is a bit disappointing. That being said, 30 frames per second is never a deal breaker for me. When I get immersed into a game, I tend to overlook visual issues. Hell, Wind Waker was 30 fps and it didn't bother me at all. I do think Nintendo could have hit 60 frames-per-second with this entry, and the fact that other companies are able to hit this objective with their games is a bit sad. All of the main divisions at Nintendo are probably too caught up on the NX right now, though.

Reading these comments, I thought for a moment I was at IGN. If it bothers you so much, don't buy the fennekin game. Do we have hear the same negative magical fire foxes from you people day in day out?

@Yorumi you actually think Nintendo told this developer to do a bad job of this port? Are you for real?
why do you bother?

@Yorumi I don't agree with any of this by watching a YouTube video, I'll play the game first and decide if the framerate cause the gameplay to suffer (which it won't)
Even if this was the greatest port in the world, you'll still find something to complain about!

@Yorumi what are you bangin' on about? Making up lies? You've lost me.
If you are referring to me saying you complain, I hardly call that a lie, I didn't say you complain about every game, but you are well known for your negativity on this site

@Yorumi I think there are other things besides just graphics that they did. While the new textures and resolution are awesome, the more important things are the other new features. We have gamepad support (a lot of people hated the waggle controls). There is gamepad inventory/map and gyroscope aiming which are awesome Zelda features. I have loved this on each one of the other re-makes. They added an item to make the Poe quest easier. They reduced the number of tears you need to streamline the game. They fixed the issue with the rupee-chest with full wallets. They added a hard mode available from the start, to add a challenge for those who find the game too easy. The one disc has both standard and mirror layouts so it adds a new level of re-playability that you wouldn't have had unless you owned both GCN and Wii versions.

I totally understand the pricing complaints when comparing it to other companies. If you already own a previous version, it's understandable. I have played the originals but do not own them. Just to put it into perspective, to buy a used copy of Wii/GCN version of this game, it costs 29.99 at GameStop. $20 extra for the additional features and resolution seems worthwhile. I am sure I could get it cheaper on eBay or something, but I would rather get a new copy that looks and plays better.

@Yorumi They're likely asking for more because of the large number of gameplay adjustments. It isn't rare to see a remaster of a game where beyond the graphics they just go "oh yeah everything else is fine just leave it" and just release it the exact same way as before. Whereas we've already heard of the myriad of gameplay improvements and tuning Twilight Princess HD is getting along with the graphical update those gameplay adjustments will mean a lot more in the long run.

Final Fantasy is a good example to contrast, I liked the games but they actually ported FF1, FF2, FF6 without giving a crap about the gameplay or existing well known issues. FF1(PS1) still used the agility of not the character choosing escape but the 2nd character in the line up to escape battles, the Intelligence stat literally had no impact on white magic meaning a White Mage's curing spells are no more effective than a Knight or Red Mage using the same spell. FF6(PS1) left in the evasion bug where evade does nothing and magic evade stat works for both enemies physical attacks and magic. The blind status effect literally does nothing, Vanish-Doom was there to trivialise the game. The later GBA releases fix these things but keep the graphics the same, then the PSP releases of 1 & 2 update the graphics but keep the gameplay the same...

It's silly to compare beautification ports with maybe a slight gameplay adjustment or a couple new features slapped ontop of an unchanged skeleton to ones that actually try to refine the original product across the board, something that requires extra work but the players would appreciate in the long run.

A lot of people are pretty bummed that the game is 30fps rather than 60, but I'm fine as long as it stays at a steady framerate for the most part.

@dabaumer lol

It's a total rip off even if it was 60 fps anyway as the games 2 generations old as it was mainly designed for the gamecube. So even with revamped visuals it should be released at a budget price of around £19.99 but to release it at only 30fps aswell just adds insult to injury. Hell even in the case of windwaker HD that still hasn't even reduced in price yet it is still a fully priced retail game even though it's been out for 3 years now. If Sony can release a Trilogy of games at 1080p and at 60fps why cant Nintendo do it for just one.

@Yorumi input frames per second and graphical frames per second are two very different things. Input fps is usually much much higher.

@Yorumi You're missing the point here. In a perfect world, yeah I'm sure Nintendo would take their time and do this project the justice it deserves. Does their massive back catalog of games not imply this already??

But stop to think about the situation they are in. These development decisions need to be made VERY FAR in advance. Nintendo obviously thought the Wii U would be faring better than it is currently, and they probably hoped the 2016 release schedule looked a little more full. The reality is that Nintendo really needed something to fill the '16 release calendar. I'm sure TP was a project they wanted to remaster at some point, but found themselves in a situation dictated by time. In fact, I look at this as a POSITIVE from Nintendo, not a negative. Would you rather the Wii U get pretty much nothing in 2016?? I know I would feel pretty burned by that. The dev teams are stretched super thin right now holding two platforms up by themselves with hardly any 3rd party support. Let's not forget how many teams have been moved or partitioned to NX development.

At the end of the day, let's be happy with the fact we're getting TP released this March. I think the improvements are okay. I 100% agree with you that there could have been more improvements such as FPS and the like. But to say that this wasn't accomplished because they are LAZY??? Ha, it's quite the opposite. There is a lot on the plate right now for one company to be juggling. At the end of the day, they always think about their fans and always aim to please them. It doesn't happen all the time, but I will say that I like to think that Ninty thinks from the gamer's heart regarding business decisions.

@Ootfan98 so you don't like reading people's comments about reasons why they don't like something you like? That makes you feel offended and angry?
I am sick of people thinking they are the arbiters of good taste and get so defensive over their views when someone else has a different one, no matter how they describe why they do t like something.

I'm not a fan of 60 fps, Wolfenstein gave me a really bad headache. Just like Hobbit movies with their u higher framerate I wonder if it's that uncanny valley thing?

@MadAdam81 No offence squire. I've no problem with genuine objections / complaints, but there are some that complain on every single thing no matter what, and if that how you are, I do question why people waste their time and don't move on.
What tipped me over on this particular article, is when someone says that they think Nintendo told a developer to purposely make a bad port. Really?

@Yorumi lol, making lies?
Ok, Let's be honest, you do complain a lot, and most of the time it's constructive, and understandable, but it is mostly negative.
But your comment tonight was smacks of Anti-Nintendo, along with others. That's where I perhaps went OTT on my comment, but that 1st comment was not addressed to you personally, although it was your comment that triggered it. You could have ignored it, like everyone is telling me I should do with opinions that differ to mine. Fare enough.
Do you wanna leave it there, or do you want to continue?

I never noticed any frame rate drops in WWHD it's smooth as

People can actually notice the difference between 30fps and 60fps? I can't at all. I think this is all just a stigma that stems from humans always wanting the very "best" of something, whether that very best is useful and noticable or not.

@liveswired
This is a video game, not a movie.

I don't want to watch a movie, I want to play video games. You're using the exact same stupid excuse Ubisoft made when they were lazy to make most of their games 60fps

30fps is lame; I'll stick to playing the game on Dolphin.

why not offer a 720p 60fps or a 1080p 30 fps? I would think it's possible unless somehow the engine they are using isn't able to do it..

@Ventilator

You do realize that many of the NES and SNES games were 60 FPS right?

@BlatantlyHeroic

It is harder to tell if you don't have anything to reference is but if you look for it, yeah, it is quite noticable. Even more so if you go back and forth between 30 FPS and 60 FPS

@Yorumi Resident Evil for Xbox One & PS4 is also 1080p/30fps with framerate drops.

@TwilightOniAngel Because 30 fps is perfectly adequate for many games. Zelda is historically 30 or even less with ALBW being the only exception.
Hell, even Uncharted 4 will be 30 fps, just like the previous 3 games.

@MadAdam81 High action games rely on 60 fps to give the player better reaction speed but most games (including zelda) are fine at 30. A ton of people in this comments section sound like complete liars the way they make claims about frame rate as if they even know what they are talking about.

@Dave24 Well using an upsampler to increase it to 60fps would work, though it would require that much more computational power

@ZAZX If you haven't already, you should look up Xenoblade with the HD texture pack. The game already looked good, now it looks insane. Better than Chronicals X.

Zelda had the benefit of a 4k texture pack. I don't think there is one for Xenoblade yet but as it is, the texture packs out there are insane. You can check them out on youtube (even though the quality of youtube videos are crap, even if you set to HD)

I've said it before and i'll say it again: either buy the Damn game or don't. Stop being so cheap and so whiney.

@liveswired ; @TwilightOniAngel also of note, ps4 is much, much more powerful, 8 cores vs 3, 8gb ram vs 2gb.

This has been my bug issue when Nintendo this go around... They are unwilling to keep up with competition in regards to power.

@ikki5 NES and SNES are interlaced output 30 fps. Sorry but this is an incorrect analogy... I get what your saying and I do agree, but the comparison is flawed...

This is why I refuse to buy a PS4. In this day and age there is no excuse for the PS4 to lack a bread drive. I mean, a $15 toaster has TWO bread drives and the PS4 has zero. They are just being cheap and lazy. The technology exists. I'll stick to using my Wii U to play video games.

@BlatantlyHeroic it's really easy to notice the difference: play Mario kart 8 in single player, then play with 3 or 4 player, instant drop to 30 fps

@Yorumi Please give some examples on some graphics hardware that does not have performance issues with full screen HD alpha blending.

These sections are for complaints. If the game would run at 60 fps, the "why isn't it 30fps like the original?" crowd would be here instead.

With all the videos that has been released of TP:HD so far without lots of people objecting to the frame rate makes this comment section kind of silly. People see a number, then they starts to complain.

@Yorumi
Why would they sell it for 20$? Easy for you to say because you don't run a videogame company. If I run Nintendo, why would I bother to make a remaster on a console with small userbase and sell it only for 20$? SMH. If it's not worth for you as a customer, don't buy it. That simple. For many of us, TP HD is well worth our 60$ because it'll play better than the GC or Wii version. Of course you can continue complaining in every TP HD article.

@ZAZX said:

" 30 FPS sets off my simulation sickness and makes me feel very ill after about an hour of gameplay."

What? ...Is this a joke?

Do you realize that the majority of console videogames are 30fps for the last generation or two?

Did you know that TV in North America was 29.97 FPS in broadcast until very recently? (25FPS in EU) Were you aware most films throughout motion picture history run at exactly 24 FPS...?

Do all those things give you "simulation sickness" or is it some weird phenomenon that only makes people feel funny after playing Nintendo games at 30FPS?

If that's true...what a shame you can't watch any movie or television show from before the mid 2000 decade...hmm?

So excited to play this game!

@ikki5 : Yes. Even Commodore 64 games ran at 50 and 60 fps which is older than NES.

@ZAZX : Thats true. The first thing to always turn off is shadows. Shadows is always a system hog, and don't add anything to the gameplay.

@TwilightOniAngel to be fair the PS4 is a bit more powerful than the Wii U, add to that the fact The Uncharted trilogy is one of the best remasters we've ever seen.

@Yorumi I have the Resident Evil collection and as @DarkJamD said it is 30fps but 60 wouldn't benefit this type of game, especially with fixed camera angles and slow action. However a lot of work has been done, more so in Zero with environments been built in 3d to replace many of the pre rendered ones. Also the 2 games together cost £25 which is where Nintendo is going wrong with this, selling it at full price.

I doubt 60fps would have made a huge difference to this game, it would have been nice but the game needed other things not all of whixh have been adressed. I do wish we have have got improved character models and particle effects (check out the N64 flames when the castle is on fire) and how about just dressing up these huge empty spaces the games has. Also maybe add some frames of animation to Link so he doesn't look so jerky all the time. One thing that did make me laugh was at the beginning of the video, Link's lantern is used to cast his shadow even outside in bright sunlight.

Basically it comes down to price, if this was £20 to £25 I doubt many would be complaining about the quality of the remaster, myself included. It's not the best we'll ever see but not the worst either, for me personally I just cannot see why they are trying to seel it at full retail when most other developers wouldn't.

Happy enough with this. Looking forward to playing this again.

Articles like this make me wish there was an ignore feature on this site. It brings forth those same annoying, obnoxious people every time. But whatever.

On topic:

• 60 fps should be the standard nowadays (cmon, its 2016)
• this game should be 60 fps, it's a remake of an older game on a newer system
• 30 fps is not unplayable although some people think it is
• I had this game preordered since preorder was available and I'm still looking forward to it. It's my favourite Zelda game

The FPS is certainly not a deal breaker for me. The price though is. Not interested in the amiibo. Around £25 and I'm in.

@ZAZX I'm right, you're wrong. It's funny to read comment about clearing 'misinformation' considering that you reside in the home and current world leaders in mass distribution of misinformation. If you are going to 'quote' please do not use either Wiki or a 'US' source.

If DF stated a game running at a stable 30FPS was 60FPS you and many others would agree.

It's all down to consistent frame delivery and the game engine.

30FPS is much better for this type of game. That is the real life fact. You can just as easily have a game run at 120FPS with terrible controller response and stuttering.

30FPS provides a visceral impact that 60FPS cannot provide.

@ACK Considering Wind Waker was done in 6 months and judging by the announcement from Nintendo and visual fidelity on display I believe it is safe to assume that a similar budget and time restriction was placed on this.

Common sense would say so. Nintendo were stuck for a release with the Zelda U delay, TP would be a cheap plug.

@MajinSoul No, 60fps should not be the standard these days. 30fps suits certain styles as does 60fps.

People have become caught up in the numbers game. Consistent frame delivery is much more important and the game engine.

@Ventilator No they didn't.

@ikki5 OMG, just stop. These old games were not 60FPS, framerates as we know them were not a consideration in those eras.

@Nintendude789 Don't be so silly. NO, no and no. 60FPS suits the likes of Mario Kart, Mario, arcade. But for a big game like Zelda? 30FPS every time - if gives a sense of physical motion and impact that 60 cannot deliver.

We have too many kids these days following the 'bigger number' must be better mantra. This is all driven by capitalism and the CPU, GPU industry and their desire to push PC gamers to purchase more expensive hardware on a regular basis. Plenty will disagree but it is a proven fact that higher numbers do not equate to better experiences in all aspects of life.

The most important aspect of any game is consistent frame delivery, the game engine and controls. 60FPS isn't a magic 'fix'. You could play a 120FPS game with terrible controller response and stuttering. It's all down to how well the developers have coded the underlying technology.

30FPS gives TP its feel, look and visceral impact. I've been gaming on PC since the 90s, I've been using dolphin for the past 5 years and running TP at 1080P with some impressive texture packs.

The problem we have here is that there are too many who conform to what they are told on big sites and 'research' articles who are all PAID for by someone, and push an agenda.

I love being a gamer, something which I've been doing for the best part of 3 decades... I also used to enjoy reading articles and keeping up to date.

However I find myself avoiding the comments section on articles these days as no matter the article they all seem to decend into a pointless numbers game! Prime example on this article there is a comment stating the wiiu processor is weaker than the 360's, I can only assume this is an assumption based in numbers on the respective Wikipedia pages.

I will continue gaming and enjoying the games I enjoy regardless if platform or numbers and I'll be getting the TP HD remaster

You guys make me laugh. Knowing the people that are working on this project, and some of the difficulties they are facing working with the original source code and assets... All I can say for now is that none of you have any real idea.

You also haven't factored in the input changes, gamepad integration, miiverse, amiibo, and any new content that may be added.

You'll be shocked if you find out how much work this "cheap" project is, or how much money Nintendo are putting into it.

I'm going to contact the developers and see if I can get an official comment on the 60fps issue.

@electrolite77 Yes, I agree.

The game is a huge graphical remaster. This was far from just a resolution upgrade. Geometry, textures, lighting, shadows, polygon fixes and increases on certain objects, and yes of course going from 480p-1080p. Not to mention the many gameplay changes we've heard now and will discover as we play the game. I don't know what people are wanting to see, but it's harder not to notice how big of a improvement the graphics are.

@Cathousemaster

What exactly is the issue? That it isn't 60fps? The console club needs to know that 30fps is frowned upon in the PC gaming world because it's very hard to achieve a smooth framerate at 30fps because of the massive fluctuation of fps. 30fps on consoles is usually when well done buttery smooth. It's not the framerate but the consistency of the frames that matter the most.

@Cathousemaster There is no frame rate issue. The game is 30 fps by design. It's not a shortcoming. Zelda does not, in most cases, benefit from a higher frame rate.

@SmithJurd I went on a little rant like this yesterday...the game is meant for 30 fps...that's perfectly fine...I get the price complaints....but it made me wonder if gamers today would find my classic games on my classic systems unplayable....but if you think about them growing up on Captain Price instead of King Koopa...COD needs 60fps....heck I played tons of quake 3 arena, which is and prob still is faster than anything these kids play....I'm ranting again...yes they look at the numbers to much...I'm stoked to play the game again, my Wii version was played so much by multiple people it flat out no longer works...and I like the Nintendo box my WiiU has become

I seem to remember Aonuma commenting on why Zelda is still 30fps but can't find it unfortunately... The only reason ALBW was 60fps was due to the 3D...

Numbers hold no interest for me I'd rather gameplay, playability and, heck, entertainment!.

But its not just frames its resolution, GHz, install base, sales, etc... Why do people get hung up on this? Why not enjoy the games you enjoy on the platforms you enjoy them on? Why waste time arguing with people over arbitrary numbers?

Yes Wii U install base is not great but I enjoy it, could care less if others don't

A GameCube game. A GameCube game. And it can't run at 60 fps. I'm baffled honestly. Emulators can do it but somehow these developers can't. At this point it's just a cash grab to sell Amiibos.

...? 30 FPS isn't good...? What world is this? So many games are 30 FPS and 30 frames is not only totally playable, but is still a smooth looking game. Is it as smooth as 60? Well, no, but it's a stable 30 frames for the majority of the game and, like I said, is still perfectly playable.

And in my opinion, 30 FPS doesn't automatically make a game better (nor does it being 1080p for that matter). If the game is good, it's good. If the performance actually struggles, that's when it's a problem for me.

Haters gonna hate ;O; the original game was 30 fps, most 3D Zelda games, in fact all 3D Zelda games are 30 fps. I don't see what the big deal is.

@MajinSoul
"30 fps is not unplayable although some people think it is"

If 30 fps is not playable now, why was it playable before?

@liveswired

Um... yes, a lot of those games were 60 fps. I don't exactly know why you are getting mad at me as I was just pointing that out because someone said it isn't the 90s. lol

LOL these butthurt comments.

I'm going to buy a thousand copies and fill my tub full of Wolf Link Amiibos. I will then cackle maniacally as I play TPHD on my GamePad, whilst relishing in the non-moving water, duck-faced Illia, and pared-back-lighting-in-that-one-part-with-the-tree. All in a glorious 30fps!

I have no idea why people are getting so bent out of shape over this game not being 60 fps I mean sheesh, way to make a mountain out of a molehill... Either way if you don't feel it is worth the admittedly high price then don't buy it. That's what I am doing and you may find it saves you alot of time instead of typing and complaining.

Honestly, Half of the comments on this section sound like 5 years old trying to out do each other. Everyone's talking like they know everything about the game and like they were experts on the topic. People, instead of complaining, vote with your wallets! Don't like the price, Fps, or whatever? Don't buy.

It's kiddies who don't understand why 60fps was demanded for pc games and competitive games. They saw the bigger number and thought it was necessary for everything. It was always demanded for competitive games, and games that function with a mouse. The console players just adopted that mentality not realizing what it was meant for originally. For console single player games, there's no need for 60, especially since it's demanding on hardware. For competitive games, 60 should be the standard for all platforms. That's pretty much the way it is now so...

@ikki5 I'm not getting mad, it's just the way the text came out typing on my phone. Lol. But no, old 2D games have nothing to do with FPS. They were based on parallex scrolling.

The issue lies in that all gamers here arguing that 60FPS is inherently better is because they are getting MIXED UP with 60Hz. Pretty typical really considering most Wii U gamers, including the ones arguing on this article thought all Wii U games run 1080p60 native up until the last year.

In that case I will agree that many old games were 60hz not 60fps.

For all the silly little nitpicking on here from the 60FPS is better, when in fact pretty much the 60 crowd are getting confused with 60Hz.

Eurogamer put 30 v 60 FPS (not hz) to the test in 2014. They determined along with many experts that FRAME PACING and consistency is better. As I've also said before PC's in general can't handle 30fps simply because developers fail to add a framelimiter in for gamers who want to lock to 30FPS this results in inconsistency in frame pacing, stuttering and response thus contributing to the whole ridiculous 'master race' debate. Consoles actually handle 30fps with ease, in effect PC games have to hit 60FPS to feel the same. That is one of gaming's biggest achilles heel. Gamers don't see past a single number forgetting that there are many parts to a massive equation. It's like buying a Ferrari without an engine.

http://www.eurogamer.net/articles/digitalfoundry-2014-frame-rate-vs-frame-pacing

@liveswired sounds to me like you're the one doing all the nitpicking here buddy. Perhaps you should have a lay down?

@liveswired

It's not that PC games can't handle 30fps with ease. It's that games are built and optimized for consoles (especially first party Nintendo games) and they are built with 30fps in mind. The whole game is built around that. PC games aren't ported or optimized for a particular fps as some people play at 30, 60, 120' or even higher. Some PC games made for PC have less of this issue, and very good ports, but in general it's always been an issue in the PC gaming world. Unless one wants to spend a lot of money on a g-sync monitor.

@Mazz0928 you have to be joking? The PC gaming community? PC games are the worst for disregarding a constant framerate because the hardware is variable... If someone has an issue with frame rate the answer is for them to buy a more expensive rig. And this is why it's locked at 30fps ... Because it's better to run at 30fps 99% than 60fps at 60%.

For PC games the latter is acceptable, because users can vary resolution, detail and hardware. You can't on a console... The experience is the same for everyone, and 60% at 60fps and 40% at 30fps does not cut it.

Flowerworks runs at 1080p 60fps on the WiiU ... Because it hits it 99%.

@Mazz0928 I've been playing the witness on PC, which is strange for me as I never, ever play PC games. The gfx card is a few years old, but still pretty good... And on high quality I get between 1-5fps. On lowest settings probably 10-30fps.

That game has zero regard for attempting to hit a constant frame rate... Zero. If only it could do 30fps locked

@Cathousemaster

I'm agreeing with you, I think just the way you worded consoles handle 30fps with ease confused me a bit, but I agree that while PC hardware can produce more powerful graphics and gameplay. The fps is generally unstable no matter what locks one chooses. I have a gtx 770, so I normally hit up to 60 fps on current games, although the recent ones have took another leap and I may have to upgrade soon, and I've been a PC gamer for years. So yea, I know about the experience. The whole point is that console games are entirely built around 30 fps, so while PC may be able to get higher fps, a lot of times it's not as smooth as what a console achieves with stability, barring some games specifically designed for pc's, and some good ports.

@ZAZX This is the first time in my life I've ever heard of such a thing as simulation sickness, let alone low FoV sickness.

Got any in-depth info on those? You've piqued my curiosity...

@Yorumi You hit the spot.

If this had been a 50 bucks collection, bringing Twilight, Ocarina and Skyward Sword. then it is worth it.

I didn't know that it was at 30fps, so I was really looking forward to it, since I have never play it before. Also, I feel that a lot could have been done with the enemies characters as well as some effects (like the splatter when you kill an enemy, for starters). The ground looks fantastic as well as the shadows and lighting.

Waiting for some video of actual gameplay and NL's review before parting with some cash.

@Action51 It's not a joke. And I've never had a PlayStation or an Xbox. A good majority of Nintendo's games are 60 FPS and I mostly PC game where I can lower my settings to achieve 60 FPS.

Simulation sickness is a real, honest thing. A lot of people are set off by it with low field of view as well.

Also, I don't watch Television. Never have, never will for that exact reason. That, and because most of it is garbage reality shows nowadays. I'm also not a movie person for this exact reason.

@smashbrolink The frame rate sickness is extremely rare, I'll admit. However low field of view sickness is more common than one might think.

http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showthread.php?t=464152
Several commenters suffer from FoV sickness here, for example.

As much as I hate to cite Kotaku as well, I am a bit restrained for time right now.
http://kotaku.com/5869607/how-motion-sickness-can-ruin-games-and-the-meds-used-to-fight-it

Though if you want someone more credible, John Bain (Total Biscuit) suffers from it too if I recall. I'm pretty sure he calls it out on some of his port reports, Grand Theft Auto V being one he complains about low FoV and simulation sickness.

@liveswired I apologize for actually backing up my claims, unlike you. Unless you have actual sources for this nonsense?

Then again, I have a sneaking suspicion I'm feeding a troll with you.

It's a little disappointing it doesn't have a few extra new details besides the amiibo, and my biggest want (besides the removal of Lakebed Temple, of course, lol but realistically here..) was for them to remaster the music.

Other than that though, it looks like a good port for those who have the Wii U and want to play Twilight Princess for the first or even seventh time, now in HD with Amiibo features. Not bad, Nintendo.

Also 30fps is pretty standard, you know. Besides fighting games, that is.

@liveswired Why must you end your question with a period instead of a question mark? I understand the need to type fast, but a few checks wouldn't go amiss.
Pot.Calling.The.Kettle.Black.

@Zibene999 Ditto.
It look like a decent port at this point (besides the whole frame rate dips thing), but I still think it should be less than 50 bucks. I know that not everybody have a amazing computer, but this is really just a Dolphin texture pack with a price tag attach hat you can easily emulate with a good enough computer.

@dabaumer "when you are a part of some peoples worst moments or sometimes final moments, I can get aggravated when people worry so much about things like frame rates"

Spot on there bro...people would think those frame drops were the collapse of all humanity.

@liveswired Excuse me for asking this, but what is wrong with you?
I'm not someone who's easily fooled by higher numbers, but what you're implying is just wrong.
No game "suffers" from having a higher framerate. Yes, 60fps are more important for fast paced games like Splatoon, Smash and MK8. But you seem to misunderstand something very basic here: 60fps doesn't mean that the animations of a slower-paced game like Zelda get sped up. If anything, they will either look smoother or you won't see a difference at all. But it literally (in the original sense!) can't make anything worse. It's as if you would propose walking through the real world while constantly blinking, because otherwise with the full "framerate", your experience of the real world would be ruined. That's just nonsense.

The same goes for movies HFR movies. That framerate of 48p is just more natural, it's a lot closer to what your eyes/brain experience when you see the real world. So if anything, 48p doesn't make those movies look fake or cheap, it makes them look more real. So as long as there's nothing wrong with your body's optical perception, I'd say you're just too used to see 24p in movies. Therefore, if a movie is looking more real due to 48p, you - oddly enough - perceive it as "cheap", because apparently, in your perception movies aren't allowed to look like the real world.

I even second you regarding the remaster/remake distinction, but your other post is just totally nonsensical.

With the same models, the improve textures really only show how awful some of the models look. It's really out of place in some places where there is high res ground textures but no foliage. Should have waited until NX to remake this one.

I think that some more cinematically rendered games, like Mass Effect, actually look better at 30 FPS, and I intentionally lower the frame rate in those cases, because I feel that 60 FPS in those cases makes movement look too "smooth" and "animatronic."

Twilight Princess is not one of those games. It definitely looks better at 60 FPS (although it runs fine at 30 FPS), and the Dolphin HD versions also have better lighting, foliage, groundwork details, architectural details, and potentially better character texturing. It proclaims this as being a rush job to not even accomplish what was done by unpaid volunteer hobbyists on Dolphin years ago. The only redeeming factors now for buying this version, instead of just buying an older version and playing on Dolphin with HD mods, are Gamepad support (if you like that), Miiverse support (if you like social aspects invading your single player games), and Amiibo support (but only if you buy into physical DRM). Or, of course, if you don't have the equivalent of a modern $500 PC gaming rig.

Also, 1080p is nothing to get excited over at this point. One of the three Dolphin HD versions can now be cranked up to 4k with 8x multi sampling anti aliasing, that needs to be seen in person to be believed, and I suspect the other two will eventually follow.

@Cathousemaster The Dolphin HD mod projects made by unpaid volunteer amateurs had trouble working with the game's code and assets too, but not having access to the source code and assets didn't stop them from essentially outdoing the raw presentation of paid, full time professionals.

Surprised how much butthurt piracy apologists I'm seeing here. I highly doubt 99% of people supporting dolphin dumped their own bios into the emulator, which is the ONLY way it's legal (along with a legal copy of the game...which usually does not include fan based mods--though it can with dev support...which is not Nintendo) I'm tired of people who are like: fan project was better I'm cool because I can steal when I don't like a product I'm smarter than people who actually support IPs they like My tongue went numb trolling people online so it's just hanging out now .

If you don't like it, it's fair to leave legitimate criticism or don't buy a product, but entitled piracy elitism is pathetic and one of biggest blights on any gaming community.

Two generations ago?
Really?
So the Wii copy I'm looking at right now doesn't exist?
Good to know.
I don't think anyone expected this to look like a game made from scratch for the Wii U, but based on the comments, that's kind of what it seems like.
Last of Us, Uncharted Collection (removing the multiplayer was nice of them), FF X / X2, DmC, DMC4 and alot of other games are barely upressed on the PS4 and still sell for new game prices. Or is 70$ reasonable for some upressing and half of the content?
MC Collection couldn't fix any problems and neither can this?
Color me surprised.
People are literally the worst part about gaming, the way fans are literally the worst part of professional sports.
Hate the product, support it anyways.
Buy a system and expect every game cater to your sensibilities and tastes.
And worst of all, hear about some product and complain about it like you HAVE to buy it.
Let's buy a giant crate of handguns and point them at one another. Then whiny, spoiled, smug, self important brats will know what it's like to really have a gun to the head.

Not sure if anyone gets this, but getting upset this is 'wasting resources' or taking them away from another game is idiotic.
3rd party.
Remaster (not remake).
You can throw a billion dollars and a hundred thousand people at a project, but making something of quality still takes time.
Everyone wants the next Zelda now and can't be bothered to breathe before berating a game like Fallout 4 for bugs.
I have to respect the guys that write for IGN, Gamespot, Nintendolife and other game sites. Dealing with people, anonymous, priviledged, annoying people that jump to Wikipedia and Google just to try and make others feel like trash, would make me want to kill other people.
Consoles don't fight console wars, corporations don't fight console wars. Materialistic snobs with nothing better to do than crap all over one another fight console wars.
How any 'real gamer' functions socially is beyond me. I sincerely hope my son never takes an interest in gaming. I hope for more for him than that.
Screw all of you.
It's this kind of garbage that makes me hate gaming, loathe people and pity society for having to endure this kind of stupidity.

The reason the game is locked to 30 frames per second is because, like Wind Waker, the game's logic is hard-coded to the framerate. Yeah, it's a terrible way to design the architecture of a game, but making it go at 60 would have involved remaking the game from scratch.

Come to think of it, I think a game that was remade from the ground up would be more worth the $50 asking price, at least. Especially for a remake of a game with a $20.00 MSRP.

Let's not fling insults to other users, even if they're in the wrong.

~Waluigi

I'd rather it run 720p60 rather than 1080p30, but I'm happy either way. Totally triple dipping on this.

I'm impressed it's running in 1080p. Yes, Twilight Princess HD isn't exactly a visually demanding game, but it surely took some effort to make the original game's old engine run in such a high resolution with a relatively smooth framerate.

@ZAZX Thanks for that; I didn't really realize how important FoV was in games until I saw that gif showcasing the various amounts of it, from 55 all the way up to 200.

@ZAZX -

1) Never watched television or a movie
2) Never owned a CRT TV
3) Never owned a console prior to the mid 2000s decade...
4) Never watched the vast majority of Youtube videos which run at 30fps

So basically, there is a super-limited spectrum of stuff you are able to experience across all media?

All this to attack a 30FPS framerate on a Nintendo game? I applaud your dedication to attacking this.

UPDATE:

"Gamecube definitely wasn't my first console (That'd be N64, though I played my parents' NES and SNES before then) but I remember going to Walmart and seeing the display for it.
And I saw Mario Sunshine on display. Sweet Arceus, I was taken aback. I needed. I wanted it. And you know what? I don't regret it to this day. The Gamecube was awesome."

Quote: ZAZX

Wait a second! All those consoles played at 29.97FPS (US NTSC) or 25 FPS (EU PAL)...so did those games give you "simulation sickness"?

Ooops....looks like you've been busted.