@EvilLucario @Agriculture
No offense, you two. But you're each a little late to the conversation. Instead of piling on, you can feel free to reel back the pages and read what I already said. Should answer all of your questions.
@isturbo1984 can you even define the "industry standard" though? Is it supposed to be big budget busting games that spend more money on graphics than gameplay, play more like a movie than a game, and are typically boring and buggy? At this point the xone and ps4 are just incredibly expensive PCs.
Don't get me wrong there's plenty of areas that I think nintendo could improve on. But I also don't think sony and microsoft necessarily set the standard. There's nothing wrong with focusing more on gameplay than graphics. Having reasonable budgets, and quicker development times are much better. That said nintnedo could show a lot more creativity and more ambition. They could be more open and more consumer friendly. There's areas they need to work on but simply cloning another console isn't it.
Like I told the +1Jokers, I already defined the industry standards in previous posts with other people. I can't keep repeating the same points for the next guy to ignore and demand I repeat it. This really wouldn't be a problem if you all used the quote feature.--That way the cliff-notes are all present.
But I don't see your point of denying Microsoft and Sony lead the console industry standard. When people coin phrases like "HD Twins," while meant to be condescending, there is a bit of a double edged sword that comes back and bites the fanboys in the rear. The phrase itself is acknowledging that those two consoles are doing something Nintendo doesn't. I don't need to make the argument there, you already made it for me when you use that phrase.
Now we're in debunk territory. Now the name of the game is debunking what Nintendon't and explaining why it isn't significant or valued. Thus, the change of the narrative. The topic isn't whether or not PlayStation and Xbox is better than Nintendo.--That is not an argument anyone on a website called 'Nintendo Life' can realistically have, lol. And I'm not going to get accosted for having non-fanboy views on a platform-specific site any more than I have to by letting you change the subject.
So if Sony and Microsoft aren't leading the console space with standards, who is? Just Nintendo? Wouldn't they have to first release a console in order to do that, or do you expect me to pretend the Switch isn't a handheld?
I don't know where you want this conversation to go. You're kinda ll over the place with your "disagreements." Please use quotes next time. I'm not going to respond on point having to go back and read what was already said for a point of reference.
"The Skeleton King, secret, post-credits 'true' final boss"
-Eldin Ring leaks
People with big egos arguing about toys because a particular philosophy of toy making they've built their identity around disliking is suddenly popular
@EvilLucario @Agriculture
No offense, you two. But you're each a little late to the conversation. Instead of piling on, you can feel free to reel back the pages and read what I already said. Should answer all of your questions.
I have my own definition of industry standard, which is how new AAA releases are speced. I don't think those games are the best games ever made, far from it, but I do think the Switch will not succeed long term if Nintendos games lack all of the expected technical specifications of other AAA games.
Breath of the Wild is a great game, but as many people pointed out, it felt empty, especially in the towns were NPCs just stand there not interacting with anythings (the closest thing you'll get is a character walking towards where they're supposed to be). Nintendo is definitely resting on it's laurels if they think that will fly when all their completion have living worlds were characters are voice acted, interacts with the game world and have good facial animations.
I would like to point out that the idea of a single player open world game having a living, breathing world is mostly not that true. At least out of games trying to be even 1/4 as ambitious as BOTW is in terms of sheer size and content.
I'm not saying those aren't issues necessarily, but the emptiness part is subjective and disputed by plenty of people (including people who specifically complain about emptiness in other open world games). But none of that matters regardless, as long as it appeals to the large amount of people it did while getting critical acclaim, and as long as no one comparatively mainstream makes a version of it that's widely considered better.
I enjoyed the emptiness of BOTW, made finding interesting stuff all the more enjoyable. Its a different way of looking at an open world game than cramming stuff in every five feet.
@isturbo1984 I don't care enough to go through a bajillion conversations and keeping track with everyone.
Besides, the only standards in consoles are to just make good games and market the best. Xbox One has good services like backwards compatibility and free cloud saves but they have **** for all exclusive games, so they're falling behind to where even the Switch is catching up extremely quickly, which built a great reputation around its games despite lacking a lot of these so-called "industry standards". PS4 only got really good starting 2016, but having good PR like advertising no used game restrictions, having exclusive stuff on PS instead of Xbox (which Microsoft leveraged during the 360 era) like with Destiny, and hammering in the "oh, it's 1080p on PS4 but *****y 720p-900p on Xbox One" deal everywhere you went helped them out drastically in the early days.
Both Microsoft and Nintendo tripped over themselves in the marketing department which crippled themselves. You STILL have people thinking the Wii U is just an accessory, and the Xbox One never recovered from the Kinect/used game DRM debacle. Nintendo fared better with games and still had some greats like Smash and Mario Kart (even if they were iterative sequels, they were still really good games), but Microsoft basically crapped the bed with canceling a bunch of games like Scalebound and Fable and releasing some average exclusives, even with much better press now.
And that's just current gen. Past gens success were determined by pretty much two things only: the games and the marketing. It's why the PS1, PS2, and Wii all succeeded. And why the PS4 is winning now. And why the PS3 managed to turn itself around after the crappy launch and first few years to eventually outsell the 360.
Besides, if you want to talk about "standards" then why can't my consoles run games at native 4K, or downgrade to 1080p with 144fps like I can and do with my current PC? Higher framerates above 60fps are slowly but surely becoming a stronger standard, 4K is going to become a standard soon, why are my consoles still at like 1440p 30fps?
The answer: because no one really cares as long as it's good enough and enjoyable. It's why the Wii and Switch were/are so popular.
The only standard where Nintendo really legitimately sucks at is online.
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@EvilLucario @Agriculture
No offense, you two. But you're each a little late to the conversation. Instead of piling on, you can feel free to reel back the pages and read what I already said. Should answer all of your questions.
I have my own definition of industry standard, which is how new AAA releases are speced. I don't think those games are the best games ever made, far from it, but I do think the Switch will not succeed long term if Nintendos games lack all of the expected technical specifications of other AAA games.
Meh. Its succeeding now and it already lacks more than a few "expected technical specifications." No reason to think the Switch boat will fall off the map suddenly. At least I don't.
"The Skeleton King, secret, post-credits 'true' final boss"
-Eldin Ring leaks
But I don't see your point of denying Microsoft and Sony lead the console industry standard. When people coin phrases like "HD Twins," while meant to be condescending, there is a bit of a double edged sword that comes back and bites the fanboys in the rear. The phrase itself is acknowledging that those two consoles are doing something Nintendo doesn't. I don't need to make the argument there, you already made it for me when you use that phrase.
The problem is the word "standard" implies something a little more permanent than what the consoles do. You seem to define it mostly in relation to the console with the most users. So when the wii was crushing the ps3 was that the standard? In gen 5, 6, and 7 the weaker hardware crushed the competition so was weak hardware the standard? This is the first generation since the early 90's in which the most powerful hardware also has the most sales.
I think it's a little hard to say for more than 20 years strong hardware wasn't the standard but now overnight it is. You could make more of a case for something like achievements but much of what you say is standard I would argue isn't.
No, I'm not implying the console with the most unit sales defines the standard. Because that would just be PlayStation this gen with the PS4.--And I'm not arguing the PS4 does things best at all. I'm arguing that when we talk about Nintendo on an island of their own, that also puts all three other major platforms on a continent together. One cannot reasonably sit there and say Nintendo is doing things better than all three of its competitors combined. Disagree if you would like. But again, if you really disagreed with me, you wouldn't attempt to move the goalpost by claiming the problem is now with the word "standard."
I'm fine with you disagreeing with me and debating those differences. But the longer we further in this back'n'forth, the more it seems your brain understands my side, but you just won't allow yourself to approve and consent. My least favorite arguments/debates are with people who are arguing with themselves, using me as a soap box.
Meh. Its succeeding now and it already lacks more than a few "expected technical specifications." No reason to think the Switch boat will fall off the map suddenly. At least I don't.
Last quarter the PS4 sold nearly double as many PS4s as Nintendo sold Switches. Nintendo need to do everything right in order to once again compete in the big leagues. I think they can do that, and if they play their cards right, in the next generation we could see a more even distribution of market share.
Honestly, it's impossible that Nintendo sells 100 million Switch like they expect, they won't oversell 3DS either. I was checking VGchartz and while Mario Kart 8 has sold a bit more on Switch than on Wii U, other ports have not. At this point Switch is more successful than Wii U and it's quite popular in Japan where all handhelds are but still a thousand miles away from the huge success some people and Nintendo suggest.
Pokemon will sell well and probably boost hardware sales a bit but the Pokemon craze is more fragmented now than when XY were released. It's not going to work for Switch as it worked for 3DS.
Last quarter the PS4 sold nearly double as many PS4s as Nintendo sold Switches.
A source and region would be nice. No doubt the PS4 is generally moving more units but it's not double the Switch. The numbers I've been looking at have the PS4 currently getting ~40% of sales, Switch ~35%, XBOne ~15%, 3DS ~10%. PS4 is ahead but the Switch is pretty damn close week on week.
Honestly, it's impossible that Nintendo sells 100 million Switch like they expect, they won't oversell 3DS either. I was checking VGchartz and while Mario Kart 8 has sold a bit more on Switch than on Wii U, other ports have not.
Not sure what you're talking about. From Nintendo's own figures released about a month ago:
Super Mario Odyssey - 11.17m (3D World moved ~5mill)
Mario Kart 8 Deluxe - 10.35m (on Wii U it moved ~8mill)
The Legend of Zelda: Breath of the Wild - 9.32m (WW HD moved 2m, BotW did 1.3m)
Splatoon 2 - 6.76m (the original did 4.7m)
Xenoblade Chronicles 2 - 1.42m (Xenoblade on Wii U was ~800k)
Donkey Kong Country: Tropical Freeze - 1.40m (1.7m on Wii U, on Switch it almost hits this in a month)
Mario Tennis Aces - 1.38m (Ultra Smash did ~500k)
Come on people. If you're going to talk trash bring the goods.
Last quarter the PS4 sold nearly double as many PS4s as Nintendo sold Switches.
A source and region would be nice. No doubt the PS4 is generally moving more units but it's not double the Switch. The numbers I've been looking at have the PS4 currently getting ~40% of sales, Switch ~35%, XBOne ~15%, 3DS ~10%. PS4 is ahead but the Switch is pretty damn close week on week.
82.2 million - 79 million = 3,2 million PS4 sold last quarter
19.76 million - 17.79 million = 1.97 million Switch sold last quarter
This is for all regions and mean Sony sold 1.23 million more PS4 than Nintendo sold Switch. They were only 740 000 consoles away from selling twice as many PS4 as Switch.
Um... This is getting out of hand. Should somebody lock this topic? This is getting us nowhere. All this arguing about which console is better is getting ridicolus, no offense, but shouldn't we have both? Like like all consoles instead and complaining about which is better?
Um... This is getting out of hand. Should somebody lock this topic? This is getting us nowhere. All this arguing about which console is better is getting ridicolus, no offense, but shouldn't we have both? Like like all consoles instead and complaining about which is better?
It's a relevant topic. I like the Switch better than my other consoles since the ability to take it with me is incredibly valuable, but I want to convince people to hold Nintendo to a higher standard.
Um... This is getting out of hand. Should somebody lock this topic? This is getting us nowhere. All this arguing about which console is better is getting ridicolus, no offense, but shouldn't we have both? Like like all consoles instead and complaining about which is better?
It's a relevant topic. I like the Switch better than my other consoles since the ability to take it with me is incredibly valuable, but I want to convince people to hold Nintendo to a higher standard.
Even if you didn't like Switch you are not doing anything wrong.
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Topic: Is Nintendo resting on its laurels?
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