To be clear: one home console Mario Kart per generation is the norm.
Yes, but this generation is NOT the norm in a few ways. For one, they had two Mario Kart games per generation and it was 1 handheld game and 1 console game. Now we have one device that is both handheld and home console. Furthermore, the Mario Kart game we did get is a port, something we've never had from a Mario Kart game. So expecting a second Mario Kart is perfectly reasonable and by not having one the output has decreased.
They've been willing to have multiple if they have enough ideas for a second one. And I can easily see them having enough ideas for a second Odyssey game.
I'm really not seeing the lack of mainstream first-party blockbusters. They're just also catering to the larger niches in their fanbase, like Xenoblade fans, Fire Emblem fans, etc.
Key word is recent. We've had a lot in the generation as a whole, but what about the last few years (from 2020 on)? Aside from Pokemon, what have we had in terms of blockbusters? Basically just ACNH and Splatoon 3, with TotK coming in May. That's not a good output for the last 3 years.
@Bolt_Strike Out of interest, I am sort of curious about what sales threshold you would say constitutes a "blockbuster." Like, I see people treat Zelda as this massive property, but, historically, many games in the series haven't sold insanely well. Usually in the 4 - 6 million range. Which isn't all that far off from the 3+ million sales the last Fire Emblem game enjoyed.
We'll set aside BotW, which outsold previous games to an almost absurd degree.
@Bolt_Strike Out of interest, I am sort of curious about what sales threshold you would say constitutes a "blockbuster." Like, I see people treat Zelda as this massive property, but, historically, many games in the series haven't sold insanely well. Usually in the 4 - 6 million range. Which isn't all that far off from the 3+ million sales the last Fire Emblem game enjoyed.
We'll set aside BotW, which outsold previous games to an almost absurd degree.
At least 5-10 million. Zelda still manages to get into that range fairly frequently whereas games like Fire Emblem, Pikmin, Xenoblade, and (as much as it pains me to say it) Metroid have not and are more B, maybe even C tier franchises. 1 or 2 million is not hard to achieve on the Switch, there's dozens of games that have sold 1-3 million so that's not very impressive (also not a very high attach rate on a console that's sold over 100 million units).
Between 1986 and 2015 apparently only three games in the series managed to fall within that 'blockbuster threshold' you mentioned.
So, hypothetically, if Monolith Soft and Intelligent Systems started turning out games that sold 5+ million units per entry (very possible with Fire Emblem, at least), you'd become more okay with the attention Nintendo is giving them?
For Nintendo, it matters because of profitability. For us, it matters because the fanbase as a whole is more likely to be satisfied with a high selling IP than a niche one.
According to who? Tastes vary from person to person, it sounds like you're trying to speak for the whole Nintendo fanbase which makes no sense.
Also even for the niche games like Xenoblade and Fire Emblem they are still profiting considerable so I don't get what you're trying to say.
I mean look at how many people are complaining about "NO GAEMZ!" despite this year being packed with titles. Individual fans have different preferences, but when you aggregate them all together the higher selling IPs are going to matter more when it comes to fan reception. The dedicated fans of the niche IPs are going to be happy, but they're going to be drowned out by the "NO GAEMZ" complaints of the fans of the popular IPs.
Again based on what? Those people complaining about no games are a vocal minority at best, the reception for the recent releases is still positive and the games have still been selling well.
You actually think Nintendo is going to pay attention for some people whining about games they don't like?
They can't always release those big games but it feels time for those games and they're MIA. No one was complaining about not having 3D Mario or Mario Kart in 2019 or anything because Odyssey and 8D were too new then but now those games are much further in the past.
It's time for them based on what? You seem to just be complaining relying on assumptions and thinking you speak for all of us which isn't making sense.
We definitely aren't getting a Mario Kart 9 looking at the sales of 8dx and the dlc alone, Zelda is for next year, I guess maybe another Mario is up for debate but even then I wouldn't say its necessary like you're trying to make it out to be.
As always Nintendo is smart for doing a blue ocean strategy. Mario, Smash and Zelda aren’t the end all be all and many of Nintendo’s “niche” franchises catch the customers that would walk otherwise. Animal Crossing, Xenoblade, Fire Emblem and Kirby cover a wide range of demographics and even games like Bayonetta and No More Heroes are important because they signal to hesitant devs that money can be made on the system.
Over-reliance on Mario and to a lesser extent Zelda is why many devs that weren’t mad at Nintendo during the 90s ran for the hills. It’s why the 3ds had such an insanely diverse library because devs didn’t have to worry about getting crushed under mario’s boot (as hand held mario games while good aren’t the same as the console ones before switch ) and Nintendo has wisely either spread out releases, pumped up 3rd parties (what PS1 baby thought Squeenix would return to the fold this hard?) boosted smaller or new IPs to maintain content and diversity, leveraged DLC all the while releasing some of the best entries to many of their most famous IPs. It’s a fantastic strategy that accounts for people that buy a few games (most consumers) with long running content and enthusiast folks with walls of games. They just had to find the marketing hook with the hardware to do it and it’s been great.
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Still more than what the likes of Xenoblade and Fire Emblem have been putting out. Even before BotW they were selling twice as much as the niche franchises.
So, hypothetically, if Monolith Soft and Intelligent Systems started turning out games that sold 5+ million units per entry (very possible with Fire Emblem, at least), you'd become more okay with the attention Nintendo is giving them?
Yes, then it would be more worth investing in. I don't expect either of them to get there until at least next gen though. Sequels on the same console have a tendency to sell sells than the originals, so you would need Three Houses and XC2 to hit that 5 million mark and neither of them are anywhere close. Engage and XC3 are probably going to do slightly worse and remain in niche range.
According to who? Tastes vary from person to person, it sounds like you're trying to speak for the whole Nintendo fanbase which makes no sense.
You don't really understand macroeconomics do you? No, every single fan is not going to be satisfied and they never will be, but they can satisfy as much of the fanbase as possible by targeting the bigger fanbase.
Again based on what? Those people complaining about no games are a vocal minority at best, the reception for the recent releases is still positive and the games have still been selling well.
You actually think Nintendo is going to pay attention for some people whining about games they don't like?
Sure, all 1-2 million of the niche fanbases are happy with the releases they had, but the other 100+ million? They're the ones crying "NO GAEMZ!". They're waiting for Nintendo to move on to something more popular. And it's hard to tell for sure, but it doesn't just seem to be a vocal minority (and when you're talking about 100+ million people that AREN'T in these niche fanbases, that makes sense). The reception for the Directs in general recently have been meh to bad. Fans are upset that there was no E3 Direct this year to announce new games that they actually care about.
It's time for them based on what? You seem to just be complaining relying on assumptions and thinking you speak for all of us which isn't making sense.
Based on the amount of time since the last entry, it's been 5 years and for insanely popular IPs like Mario and Mario Kart you would expect work on the next entry to begin shortly after the previous one releases. Your flagship franchises typically do not go this long between entries.
not sure if it's nintendo i'm frustrated at, or it's just that i'm ageing out of games - like people age out of being interested in modern music. it's so rare anything on this site or a nintendo direct excites me anymore. but first party belters like major mario and zelda games do still excite me. nothing much on playstation or xbox does... so the real lack of 1st party nintendo games in recent years really frustrates
Based on the amount of time since the last entry, it's been 5 years and for insanely popular IPs like Mario and Mario Kart you would expect work on the next entry to begin shortly after the previous one releases. Your flagship franchises typically do not go this long between entries.
Previous generations of Nintendo Hardware did not lean so heavily into DLC, or have the flood gates open for content (there are literal Hentai games on the eShop), so I think we are seeing things like 48 courses being added to 8 Deluxe to give an insanely good seller more reasons to come back to it while they wait out this consoles life cycle
To be fair, Nintendo have released two new Mario Kart games this generation. It's just that they're Home Circuit and Tour.
As for Fire Emblem being niche, need I remind everyone that Heroes has brought in revenue over a billion dollars and has had more than 11 million downloads. It's perhaps unique among Nintendo's franchises in that it's been more popular on mobile than on consoles but that breakthrough hit that takes it to the next level on Switch may just be around the corner.
You don't really understand macroeconomics do you? No, every single fan is not going to be satisfied and they never will be, but they can satisfy as much of the fanbase as possible by targeting the bigger fanbase.
And they aren't satisfied now? Where is your evidence for this?
Sure, all 1-2 million of the niche fanbases are happy with the releases they had, but the other 100+ million? They're the ones crying "NO GAEMZ!". They're waiting for Nintendo to move on to something more popular. And it's hard to tell for sure, but it doesn't just seem to be a vocal minority (and when you're talking about 100+ million people that AREN'T in these niche fanbases, that makes sense). The reception for the Directs in general recently have been meh to bad. Fans are upset that there was no E3 Direct this year to announce new games that they actually care about.
This is yet again another baseless assumption from you. You're assuming that 100+ million people are outraged at the direct and that there are "no blockbusters" coming out and another assumption being that they aren't satisfied.
Sure the direct didn't have the best reception but that doesn't prove that fans aren't satisfied with the whole year, the games that released have had positive reception.
Based on the amount of time since the last entry, it's been 5 years and for insanely popular IPs like Mario and Mario Kart you would expect work on the next entry to begin shortly after the previous one releases. Your flagship franchises typically do not go this long between entries.
So another assumption on your part and probably just your personal dissatisfaction.
I wouldn't expect work on a sequel for Mario Kart at least considering we're in the middle of the expansion pass and have minimum a year and a half, Mario is up for speculation I guess.
Also no this waiting time in between mainline games is completely normal
Ocarina of Time - Wind Waker: 4 years
Wind Waker - Twilight Princess: 4 years
Twilight Princess - Skyward Sword: 5 years
Skyward Sword - Botw: 6 years
Mario 64 - Sunshine: 6 years
Sunshine - Galaxy: 5 Years
Galaxy - Galaxy 2: 3 years
Galaxy 2 - 3D World: 3 years
3D World - Odyssey 5 years
So to reiterate this waiting time is normal it's just you.
I think Nintendo are just trying to cater for everybody for one of Nintendo biggest selling consoles of all time.
Only so many games and projects you can work on at a time really, plus the fact we don't know what the plan is going forward bar Zelda.
You would suspect something Mario or Donkey Kong related is coming for when the movie comes out. I think that gets announced with a movie trailer.
Such a let down that last Direct, even more frustrating because we hadn't had one in so long.
Best thing about it was the N64 Games and they are nearly 25 years old, plus behind a paywall.
Hopefully some big hitters coming next year, but like others have said I think some are being saved for a new console. That probably wont be out till end of 2023 or 2024.
We could get a year of Zelda, Mario/Donkey Kong and even Metroid next year you never know.
If that's the case then why come out with Splatoon 3 and TotK? Those are sequels to big system sellers and yet they saw fit to release a sequel (and in fact the decision to release Splatoon 3 now looks really sus considering how similar it feels to 2). Why are they so willing to release sequels to Splatoon 3 and BotW but not to MK8D or (so far) Odyssey? They're being very weird and inconsistent about it.
The truth is that with Nintendo they usually make sequels when they feel like they've got compelling ideas for them*. It can be as simple as that - they had ideas for another Zelda that could be done on Switch and they felt it would be profitable so they've done it.
Not to bring the point back to Mario Kart but - this generation Nintendo has done plenty of things with Mario Kart, experiments within Home Circuit and Tour (and some of the other ideas that have been added to MK 8D) have tentatively pushed at what the game might be - even if you might not be a fan of the complete experience of any of the games. I can certainly see Nintendo planning future Mario Kart tracks in the way that Tour tracks are planned with one course that has 3-4 variant routes around it for instance (or combined so each lap is different as in the DLC). I can also see them building on the idea of a track editor like in Home Circuit.
*Splatoon is a special case. I think they jumped early on Splatoon 2 to hit the launch window and - ultimately - the things they needed to do next required such major back end work that it wouldn't have worked as an expansion. Plus competitive online shooters have a different lifecycle expectation.
Wow... Some people here hating niche IPs, huh?
I hope Nintendo never listens to that personally. The fact that they support more niche IPs is a big reason why I am a fan of them. If all they had were the franchises that sold 3-5+ millions on the first try then that would be borring.
Also really limiting since... you know, a franchise can actually GROW? This mentality is what killed franchises like Dead Space. It was selling great for a new IP and could get profits with some planning... but NO. It couldn't do just that apperantly.
And let's not forget that even sucessful franchises can have a poor selling games. Even some big franchises that are now Nintendo mainstays have lower selling games, like how poorly in comparason games like Animal Crossing City Folk and even Zelda Skyward Sword sold, both in the Wii a 100+ million unit console. Should Nintendo have thrown out those IPs right there because of that? I know hindsight is 2020 but now we know it would have been a stupid move after seeing how much BoTW or New Horizons sold.
Besides, the more focus on sales and nothing more is how we got stuff like the Wii U.
"The Wii sold so let's do that again ignoring all the context!", "Let's do Wii Sports, WIi Fit and Wii Party on the Wii U with very similar names! Surely it would be 20+ million at least!"
It's also one of the reasons why the late Wii-DS and early WiiU-3DS era felt so underwhelming for me. Sure, Xenoblade was released arround that time (on the west) but their big games felt so been there done that. So many 2D platformers just because New Super Mario Brothers sold a lot so everything had to be a 2D platformer now (but somehow no Metroid, huh?). It made the library so samey and safe. And this is where the mentality of not having more niche games and games that are not 10+ million sellers eventually leads.
And sure, you could say that there has been "a long time" since big sellers like a 3D Mario (which, fun fact, it usually sold less than a 2D Mario), Zelda and the like. But that's because those games are massive. Nintendo probably wants them at a good time. They don't want to undercut sales of the eisting BoTW and Mario Odyssey but also has to take into consideration the fact that they have another console after the Switch. Niche games usually don't suffer that much from that so they can be placed much easier.
@StuTwo They released Splatton 3 to take advantage of the growing Japanese popularity. It all made sense to me when the release weekend sales numbers from Japan came in.
Here is one thing for me.
While peoples keep complaining the lack of games like zelda / metroid / fzero / etc, I keep busy looking for niche games, far away from this silly argument about lack of this zelda games, that metroid games, those Splatoon games, blah blah blah.
I'm already satisfied by niche 3rd party games like Youtubers Life 2, Epic Chef, Dodgeball Academia, My Universe games, Cat Quest 1 & 2, Yonder the Cloud Catcher Chronicles, Pocoyo, My Little Pony, etc.
The first-party output is especially disappointing given that Nintendo can now focus on only one console. Back in the day, when there were both home consoles and handhelds, nintendo released more exclusive games.
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