Good lord! Is this the state of animation these days? Sigh...The Simpsons. All the rest are mostly disgraceful.
Just watch Regular Show, Adventure Time, and Sym-Bionic Titan, then come back. Mad, Generator Rex, Phineas and Ferb, and Fish Hooks are good too
I don't know about Mad, Titan or Rex, but the rest of those are absolutely horrible. Especially Adventure Time. It is ridiculously stupid.
I think Cartoons have to make full use of their medium to be worthwhile. The Golden Age of animation is really the only age I care about. That's when being a cartoon was actually about being a cartoon. Characters stretched and flattened, and much of the humor came not from the writing, but from the hilarious things the animators were able to do with the visuals. The Simpsons and Family Guy are pretty funny, well written shows, but as cartoons I think they're pointless. The shows you mentioned above--ESPECIALLY Phineas and Ferb--are all examples of things I hate in modern animation (except adventure time--that show actually has some good things about it). They're run not by animators, but by hack writers. They're lazily drawn, lazily animated, characters are constrained to pre-set proportions and a stock of pre-animated facial expressions.
...can you tell this is a sensitive issue for me?
This makes no sense at all. Are you suggesting any cartoon show should apply unrealistic physics and logic just because it can? Are you implying that Simpsons should have rather been a live-action show? I can't describe how much I disagree with your opinion. If you actually took some time to think about it properly, you'd have realized that the Simpsons actually benefits from being a cartoon show rather than a live-action show; e.g. all the times Homer gets injured, all the stupid stunts Bart pulls off, etc. In live-action so many of them would only be able to be pulled off with special effects and they would probably still look extremely clunky. Plus, consider all the physical restrictions. If Simpsons wasn't a cartoon, they'd have to switch out the actors for pretty much the whole cast every few years. In addition, would Bart be allowed to show his naked butt into the camera if Simpsons wasn't a cartoon?
In addition to that, you are also pretty much labeling Anime (except for super deformed ones) as completely pointless. In a lot of Animes, the animation is a very important aspect and the animators put at least as much effort into it as your "holy cartoonists".
Just because their doors don't bend like rubber when slammed, they aren't any less worth in my opinion.
Hey, cool your jets man. You're complaining about things I never even said. I like Family Guy. I love the Simpsons. They use their cartoon mediums to get away with situations that would be impossible to to with a live action show, sure. But come on, you can't tell me that they're well animated shows. Matt Groening admits it himself. I don't think every cartoon has to be animated with bendy, stretchy physics--you can break the rules if you do it well, right? The writing is great, the stories are great--I just wish they would put more care and craft into the animation itself. All of the characters' animations, right down to their walking cycles to their mouth movements, are completely restricted by a pre-set stock of facial animations and movements. That's just lazy, and as an artist I don't know how you could get any satisfaction out of that. That's what I was saying.
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If you pay attention to most Japanese animation, you'll notice they have a very stylised sense of timing, movement and shape. I think their animators do an excellent job. They do deform, stretch and blur during movement, particularly in action scenes. They most definitely don't restrict themselves to strict proportions.
By that token, they almost always do a hack job with mouth movement and repetitive motions (like walking or hair blowing in the wind), although I'm pretty sure that's usually out of budget/scheduling concerns rather than laziness or lack of talent.
@Kid_A: Well, you did say that cartoons have to make full use of their medium to be worthwhile.
Sean Aaron ~ "The secret is out: I'm really an American cat-girl." Q: How many physicists does it take to change a light bulb? A: Two, one to hold the light bulb, the other to rotate the universe.
Good lord! Is this the state of animation these days? Sigh...The Simpsons. All the rest are mostly disgraceful.
Just watch Regular Show, Adventure Time, and Sym-Bionic Titan, then come back. Mad, Generator Rex, Phineas and Ferb, and Fish Hooks are good too
I don't know about Mad, Titan or Rex, but the rest of those are absolutely horrible. Especially Adventure Time. It is ridiculously stupid.
I think Cartoons have to make full use of their medium to be worthwhile. The Golden Age of animation is really the only age I care about. That's when being a cartoon was actually about being a cartoon. Characters stretched and flattened, and much of the humor came not from the writing, but from the hilarious things the animators were able to do with the visuals. The Simpsons and Family Guy are pretty funny, well written shows, but as cartoons I think they're pointless. The shows you mentioned above--ESPECIALLY Phineas and Ferb--are all examples of things I hate in modern animation (except adventure time--that show actually has some good things about it). They're run not by animators, but by hack writers. They're lazily drawn, lazily animated, characters are constrained to pre-set proportions and a stock of pre-animated facial expressions.
...can you tell this is a sensitive issue for me?
This makes no sense at all. Are you suggesting any cartoon show should apply unrealistic physics and logic just because it can? Are you implying that Simpsons should have rather been a live-action show? I can't describe how much I disagree with your opinion. If you actually took some time to think about it properly, you'd have realized that the Simpsons actually benefits from being a cartoon show rather than a live-action show; e.g. all the times Homer gets injured, all the stupid stunts Bart pulls off, etc. In live-action so many of them would only be able to be pulled off with special effects and they would probably still look extremely clunky. Plus, consider all the physical restrictions. If Simpsons wasn't a cartoon, they'd have to switch out the actors for pretty much the whole cast every few years. In addition, would Bart be allowed to show his naked butt into the camera if Simpsons wasn't a cartoon?
In addition to that, you are also pretty much labeling Anime (except for super deformed ones) as completely pointless. In a lot of Animes, the animation is a very important aspect and the animators put at least as much effort into it as your "holy cartoonists".
Just because their doors don't bend like rubber when slammed, they aren't any less worth in my opinion.
Hey, cool your jets man. You're complaining about things I never even said. I like Family Guy. I love the Simpsons. They use their cartoon mediums to get away with situations that would be impossible to to with a live action show, sure. But come on, you can't tell me that they're well animated shows. Matt Groening admits it himself. I don't think every cartoon has to be animated with bendy, stretchy physics--you can break the rules if you do it well, right? The writing is great, the stories are great--I just wish they would put more care and craft into the animation itself. All of the characters' animations, right down to their walking cycles to their mouth movements, are completely restricted by a pre-set stock of facial animations and movements. That's just lazy, and as an artist I don't know how you could get any satisfaction out of that. That's what I was saying.
Animation = $$$$. You might get away with taking care with every little element in a Pixar movie that will make upwards of $400 million, but a TV show that needs to put out 20+ episodes a year simply can't afford to do that.
"The government of the United States is not, in any sense, founded on the Christian religion."
@Kid_A: to add to what Ravage said now, you also said "...as cartoons I think [shows like The Simpsons and Family Guy]'re pointless." granted, whether or not they have any kind of point content-wise is up to the viewer and their particular tastes, but I agree with Faildude regarding animation vs. live-action -- if they were not cartoons, I don't think they'd be half as successful as they are now, as they wouldn't be able to pull off all the crazy stunts and escapades packed into each episode if they were live-action sitcoms. there's no way they'd be able to pull together that kind of a budget, and some of the things they feature are downright impossible IRL.
i think what i'm trying to say is that i feel there's a place in this world both for cartoons as an art form and cartoons as sitcoms. both are worthwhile.
BEST THREAD EVER future of NL >:3
[16:43] James: I should learn these site rules more clearly
[16:44] LztheBlehBird: James doesn't know the rules? For shame!!!
@Kholdstare: Hell to the yes! I've missed almost this entire season, though (caught the first episode and that was it)... I can't wait for the DVD, i hope it (and another album, plz plz plz) comes out around xmas just like seasons 1 and 2 did so i can beg Santa for it again >:3
BEST THREAD EVER future of NL >:3
[16:43] James: I should learn these site rules more clearly
[16:44] LztheBlehBird: James doesn't know the rules? For shame!!!
@Kid_A: to add to what Ravage said now, you also said "...as cartoons I think [shows like The Simpsons and Family Guy]'re pointless." granted, whether or not they have any kind of point content-wise is up to the viewer and their particular tastes, but I agree with Faildude regarding animation vs. live-action -- if they were not cartoons, I don't think they'd be half as successful as they are now, as they wouldn't be able to pull off all the crazy stunts and escapades packed into each episode if they were live-action sitcoms. there's no way they'd be able to pull together that kind of a budget, and some of the things they feature are downright impossible IRL.
i think what i'm trying to say is that i feel there's a place in this world both for cartoons as an art form and cartoons as sitcoms. both are worthwhile.
I said exactly that in my response. Obviously the Simpsons and Family Guy couldn't work as live action. I just wish, especially considering the ridiculous amount of money those shows make, that they would put more effort into the animation. That's all I'm saying.
Blog: http://www.sequencebreaking.blogspot.com
3DS Friend Code: 2277-7231-5687
Now Playing: Animal Crossing: New Leaf
I mean really, the artists must be bored out of their minds limiting themselves and repeating the same crap.
no offense, but cry me a river -- y'know, that's why it's called 'work'. It's not really necessary for it to be fun or not-boring, and if you're too bored or unsatisfied with it, you can always leave and go do something else. :3
@Kid_A: you're still complaining about the consistency in style and 'quality of animation' though. To me, it's not laziness at all -- they've obviously put a great amount of care and effort in putting forth a completely homogenized visual experience for their viewers so that people know exactly what to expect from each new episode every week. Considering I grew up through the 80's and 90's, when half-a**ed hand-drawn animation pretty much ruled the day, there's no wondering anymore whether the characters will actually look like themselves/like they did last week or how many active characters we'll be able to see moving in one scene -- the kind of visual consistency we can expect nowadays really amazes me. having grown up when i did, to me, shows like The Simpsons and Family Guy are incredibly well animated. :3
BEST THREAD EVER future of NL >:3
[16:43] James: I should learn these site rules more clearly
[16:44] LztheBlehBird: James doesn't know the rules? For shame!!!
Lol I love when characters look totally different in the next scene though. My favorite is Goku is on EP 103, 14min and 45 seconds in, animation strip 3.
I mean really, the artists must be bored out of their minds limiting themselves and repeating the same crap.
no offense, but cry me a river -- y'know, that's why it's called 'work'. It's not really necessary for it to be fun or not-boring, and if you're too bored or unsatisfied with it, you can always leave and go do something else. :3
@Kid_A: you're still complaining about the consistency in style and 'quality of animation' though. To me, it's not laziness at all -- they've obviously put a great amount of care and effort in putting forth a completely homogenized visual experience for their viewers so that people know exactly what to expect from each new episode every week. Considering I grew up through the 80's and 90's, when half-a**ed hand-drawn animation pretty much ruled the day, there's no wondering anymore whether the characters will actually look like themselves/like they did last week or how many active characters we'll be able to see moving in one scene -- the kind of visual consistency we can expect nowadays really amazes me. having grown up when i did, to me, shows like The Simpsons and Family Guy are incredibly well animated. :3
Of course I'm complaining about the consistency in style and animation. But you're also clearly confused about what I mean. Every artist has their distinct visual style, but that doesn't mean the characters will look completely different from one week to the next. Each animator has distinct things that he or she is good at. Some are really great at obscure facial expressions, some are good at movement, some are better at complex construction or poses. The problem is that modern animated shows don't use their animators' talent like this. Everybody is constrained to drawing a certain way, so you don't see any interesting facial expressions or movement for any of the characters. And it is a problem is the animators are bored out of their friggin' minds animating a show--sure, animation is hard work, but it should at least be satisfying. Animated shows can't exist without animators, and if the animators are uninspired and depressed it's not going to make for particularly inspired or satisfactory work. Look at the amount of detail and craft that went into this: http://2.bp.blogspot.com/_mJ4lc_Q9Q6k/RhWqXVkZIRI/AAAAAAAADKA...
I mean come on, Family Guy! I'm not saying The Simpsons and Family Guy aren't funny--they're both hilarious--I just wish the animators would try harder to be creative.
I cannot stand Family Guy, American Dad, or The Cleveland Show. I saw through their 'method' sometime ago and whenever I watch, this is ma face... stupid manatees
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