Nintendo: Wii U GamePad Is The Only Real Innovation This Console Cycle, But We Didn't Showcase It Well Enough 

Zombiu and of course the artstyle games are good examples of what it can do.

MH3U OMG all of your info on the lower screen with nothing but the gameplay on the TV. Beautiful it twas, I wish more games had done that.

Oh really? I'd have never guessed, Nintendo. /sarcasm

Typical PR Yada Yada Blah Blah we already knew about.
Though Star Fox Zero's use of the GamePad, especially when even more fleshed out, will be... stellar (Heh.).

I'm not really sure how it's innovated? Maybe if he was trying to claim the off-TV play I could see his point, although PS3 was doing that with some games before the Wii U, and the Wii U still can't do it with every game. A touch screen his hardly an innovation these days.

For the first six months I was giving them the benefit of the doubt, that the games that really used the gamepad were coming, but for a long time now it's been obvious they created the gamepad to try and seem different, when they never had any games in mind for it. Even the 'best' examples don't really need a gamepad. I find it really hard to believe anyone at Nintendo seriously thinks the games coming out now "really leverage the power of the gamepad".

I'd much rather they focused on innovating with software, and not hardware. Innovation in TV and movies movies does not come from improving DVD players, and innovation in literature does not come from finding a new way to read a book.

I always thought it was 'Arwing'

The gamepad is awesome. The haters just don't wanna admit and blame it for the console's low sales.

For all the bashing the gamepad gets from some people you can't really argue against what Scott is saying seeing as the Xbox One and PS4 are essential the same console as their predecessors just loaded with more features. That is in no way a bad thing because it clearly is working for them as it has brought them quite a bit of success in combination with positive press and support from the many third party studios out there. Nintendo doesn't have that option right now so the only way to get their console into everyone's minds is to offer something that the competitors can't, though that didn't work out so well with the Wii U. Hopefully the NX doesn't repeat the mistakes that the Wii U did.

The one thing I did like about the gamepad was the gyro aiming/camera controls. Being able to use the 2 sticks while aiming the camera is great. I got so used to it in Splatoon that I found myself tilting my PS4 controller for camera control while playing Witcher 3 without even realising it. Arkham Knight would have been even better than it is with gyro camera controls too imo

Innovation is great and all, but if your marketing campaign is pathetic (non-existent)... well, we all know how well that's worked out.

I'll give you that it's the only real innovation, and yes, Nintendo really dropped the ball on using it. Problem is, it's just not a hugely appealing thing, even when used well. I love it, but as a supplementary rather than primary feature. I bought my Wii U to play Nintendo games, not because the Gamepad wowed me.

". I think those types of experiences may help us propel the system to new heights."

New heights? Like 13 million life time sales?

I agree. I just love my gamepad, whether it's Off-TV play or map/inventory management on a 2nd screen (MH3U and Wind Waker were really improvement with the gamepad)

Oh of course the ability to play actuall different screen multiplayer games locally, if the other stuff hadn't of been gimped Wii U would have the best version of BLOPS 2.

Oh and the great simplicity but awesomeness of something like the drawing game in Warioware. Many hours of fun were had playing that with family.

The main thing for me is how I barely use my PC to browse anymore, much better than on the Wii but never talked about that much.

Sadly because people suck it will most likely be abandoned and won't function with the NX. Which means the Wii U will be the only console from this gen I will still have hooked up years from now.*

• depending on space.

@Ichiban
Best gamepad feature ever.

Biggest failure, no option to use game pad screen in local multi-player races instead of traditional split screen, really Nintendo!

@SetupDisk Can they really fully abandon it considering you need it for backwards compatibility with Wii U and DS games?

@Peach64 I was actually hoping for more use for the GamePad.

To make a point, I'll use something like Wii Music. It could've been a truly powerful tool, imagine Mario Paint-style composition using the GamePad.
Or, I can use Pilotwings. Modern commercial aircraft are complex to the point where a controller can't hope to even get close to enough buttons to control something like an A320, or an E172. Again, the GamePad could do this with its screen, not to mention its gyro controls.
Or, I could do Battalion Wars or Pikmin. Except, I can now look at TWO places at once! In an RTS!
Or something obvious like Pokémon Snap (or a Fatal Frame HD remake), or that golf game in Wii Sports Club.
Or something touch-focused like a new Osu game (iNiS has gone mobile, though), a new Trauma Team/Center (ATLUS?), a new set of card games referencing Nintendo's origins?
Or a shooter using it as a reticule and a map? Something like Code Name: STEAM, or Valkyria Chronicles (SEGA?)

I know they shouldn't hire me, a lot of these ideas aren't exactly profitable, but someone like me thought of this many ideas to utilize the GamePad in ten minutes, you'd at least think that Nintendo gets it.

He's right! But sadly, the majority just did not want the gamepad, myself included. I much prefer the pro-controller, just like the ds4 and the Xbox controller.

Gamepad didn't work, time to stick with that works next time Ninty.

The Wii U is actually the only console still hooked up in my house. Reason being that the extension cord we used got fried during a storm...

If I can't pull off-TV play with a home console, comfortably, I won't buy it. The Wii U, oddly enough, convinced me that handhelds are for me.

So much wasted potential. All I want is an incredible cricket game with asynchronous multiplayer.

I hate to say it, but the gamepad really isn't that innovative as it had been around for years since before the Wii U and used to play games so... Some of the games were a bit innovative with how it was used but that kind of died after the first year, if not before.

Please no forced Gamepad controls for Star Fox!

In my opinion, the gamepad really is the only mark of innovation made this gen. Sony and Microsoft certainly haven't even tried to do anything new or creative (save for the VR projects? but they're not even public yet) to change how we play but at least Nintendo is putting in the effort. Successful or not, it never hurts to step outside of the bubble and see what works and what doesn't. Small steps make big changes afterall.

Definitely looking forward to seeing what Nintendo does with the NX.

yeah...no. Its the DS idea only on the big screen. Sorry Nintendo, but this innovation can easily be ignored for the NX. Nobody will miss them. Like motion controlls you abandoned.
You know what in this day and age really is an inovation people enjoyed? The share button. And that's on PS4. This will be remembered this generation. Love it or hate it.

Nintendo sure is confusing. NOA seems to have given up on the Wii U, yet he's talking about Super Mario Maker and Starfox....uh, what? Where's the Super Mario Maker Amiibo bundle? Console bundle? Where's the new unified account system and Club Nintendo? And Reggie mentioned they were transition. Moffitt almost sounds like there is no NX, or he doesn't know about it...which sounds more plausible.

Gaming is predominantly a relaxing experience for me so i love to lie down on a couch or in bed and not have to keep my head up and focused on a tv. I know it sounds lazy but i don't know if i can go back after chilling out with ds/3ds/gamepad comfort over the last 5 years.

@TheWPCTraveler
That is being used in the new Fatal Frame at least.

The gamepad is either a love or a hate it seems. I love it. I really want it as my controller going forward but I don't think it will be the main for what's next.

Public perception isn't good for the controller though.

@Mr_Action
Maybe but in one of the things I have read the NX is supposed to co-exist with the Wii U and 3DS which MIGHT mean no BC.

I prefer suspend/play and a share button.

Splatoon just wouldn't be the same experience without it.It could easily be played on the other consoles with a few workarounds and would still be a great game to play regardless but without the Gamepad you would be missing a part of what makes it that extra bit special.I'm sure Starfox will be the same once we get the hang of it.The Gamepad might not be hugely innovative in it's features but when used right it can definitely make a game better than it would be without it.It'll be a backward step if they abandon it for the next gen.

@TruenoGT if it could be played online it would be played all the time by me. It's a big enough seller,

Gamepad was a brilliant idea, loads of people posted superb uses of it in video gaming at the E3 that Wii U was unveiled.
The fact that only Nintendo land and a few other games even 'scratched the surface' of those ideas is what is telling.
The SDK simply wasn't good enough and other developers had to 'bolt on' the second screen functionality because their own engines were geared for a single view experience.
Nintendo rushed the launch hoping calling it Wii was enough to make it sell initially, then once it had 9 million sales, developers would create proper engines to fully utilise the gamepads functionality in all those 'awesome' game concepts.
Instead it sold 3 million, no interest, no funding, no development of better creation tools. Nintendo had to get it to 'sell' so fell back to tried an tested (like every 3rd party 5 years prior).
Essentially the Wii held off Nintendo's slump. This is their slump. They need to invest in powerful software creation tools (they always have and never actually been in a position to do it until wii).
They have hopefully realised this, whatever NX will be they need a strong SDK and good communication with western Engine creators (Epic, Crytek, ID), without that, they'll be in a similar situation unless it's using what they've now built up for Wii U, made available to devs.
Unity for example, was a step in the right direction, but Unity is only good at certain things (sick of side scrolling platformers using Unity, it can do a lot more than that but barely anyone has the gumption to utilise it), a lot more Game engines and tools need to run and interface with the hardware smoothly.

The gamepad discussion has been beat to death both for and against views. That's the risk taken with an innovative feature paired with an otherwise perfectly standard product like a home console - when the innovation fails, it steals the whole show. But Nintendo needs to continue to take innovation risks as that's its key in a market that has such a wide audience

Oh Scott. I'm starting to get really annoyed with his recent quotes.

Nintendo failed to realize that the only thing gamers wanted was a Pro controller and HD franchise installments. The GamePad was great for two things in my experience: ZombiU and Off TV Play. I actually don't play Splatoon as often as I would if OFF TV Play was an option. So I play COD more often instead while the wife enjoys her shows.

Oh, actually I'll give credit where it's due: the non-gaming applications of Wii U are a treat with the GamePad. But it's a Nintendo console. I expect their main input device to be seamless with my gaming experiences.

@FargusPelagius

I agree with much of what you say, except for:

"Essentially the Wii held off Nintendo's slump. This is their slump."

Nintendo has been in a slump since the N64 era, unfortunately.

@FargusPelagius I think it's less about the SDK and more that devs weren't willing to (re)design games just for Wii U's gamepad.

Using gamepad in Unity is super-easy and Unity is very flexible - certainly you can make far more than just side scrolling platformers. There's clearly a failure of imagination on the part of devs, as well as a failure from Nintendo to the reduce risks of attempting something creative / different with the gamepad

@OorWullie

"Splatoon just wouldn't be the same experience without it.It could easily be played on the other consoles with a few workarounds and would still be a great game to play regardless but without the Gamepad you would be missing a part of what makes it that extra bit special."

I'm curious, what exactly did you feel the GamePad achieved with Splatoon that made the experience so "special"? I feel as though the ability to "hot jump" to another player via the touchscreen could easily be re-mapped to the D-Pad. Then they could scrap the silly "Boo-yah" and "C'Mon!" commands no one ever uses.

Honestly, Splatoon would be amazing with Wiimote pointer controls.

@JamesCoote
They'd have been willing if it had sold the 9 million Nintendo predicted. Nintendo's lack of marketing and relying solely on it being called a Wii is the reason 3rd parties wouldn't pump any more money into the development tools, the returns were not worth investing in. Especially as 3rd parties were all doubling down on current franchises at the time. They are 'now' pushing more new franchises after PS4 an X1 got better sales.

I've felt the same after owning a ps4 and xbone. The gamepad, for my money anyway, is by far the best new thing from this generation. Just the off TV play does it for me to be honest.
Having said this, in nearly all other aspects the wii u is third best and I feel Nintendo really dropped the ball when it comes to other things like online stuff etc.

My main gripe with the gamepad is that I feel Nintendo designed the gamepad in a vacuum without thinking of how the games benefit, instead betting that developers will find ways to use it to its potential in the future. This, I feel, is totally at odds with the Nintendo philosophy whereby they created a game but needed to rethink the input method in order to do the game justice. Miyamoto said something similar about this desired order where the game comes first (he was speaking in reference to super Mario 64).

The fact that Nintendo themselves haven't been able to consistently use the game pad in meaningful ways just goes to show how difficult it can be seeing as Nintendo are probably the best developer out there. Still, give me off TV play and Nintendo's superlative software and I'm happy. The wii u may not be a hit but man, it's got some awesome games and that's what matters the most to me.
Someone on these forums (sorry, forgot your tag)did make me think though when they said the wii u is like the Saturn for Sega and the nx will be the dream cast. I really hope this doesn't come to pass. People around the industry mock Nintendo quite openly these days (fallout 4 guy at e3 was the latest I recall) but without Nintendo, à lot of magic and innovation would be lost..

@gatorboi352
They had a huge pot of cash from DS and Wii. I assumed when they boasted about all the 3rd party support for Wii U they had spent some of that pot on securing Game engine compatibility and extra development supporting 3rd parties to 'grab' support. In a similar fashion to Sony an MS paying for added support during the last two generations. They used mother/father companies money to 'invest' in the industry taking a hit. Nintendo just made a 'hit; with wii so the assumption of a 'reinvestment' in the industry makes sense(to secure the company's space and future). Except it never happened.

I hope they utilize it in future consoles. It would be weird to play Splatoon 2 without the gamepad.

The gamepad was a decent idea, but there's very few games that make good use out of it. Most games I've seen that use it could easily incorporate the information displayed on the gamepad on to the main screen instead.

I just feel like the gamepad was ultimately pointless and apparently so did many developers (including Nintendo themselves in the bigger scope of things — Tropical Freeze literally made the screen black if you weren't playing off-TV). They could have done the same thing by having the 3DS as an intergratable controller.

Oh, it's just this guy again.

Yes, people will take a second look at Wii U, then wonder why a 3 year old system is still $299 even though it gets almost zero big AAA games, then they'll remember NX is coming b/c Reggie said so at E3, and then they'll continue to not buy Wii U.

New hieghts? I wish the guy would share what he's smoking rather than what he's saying. Maybe if it's $199 on 9/11, but Nintendo doesn't seem to be in any rush to sell the system.

@rjejr
I actually agree with the view that the Wii U was priced outside of it's market. A lot of people who own Wii's (practically every second family in the U.K) looked at wii U didn't quite 'get' what it was an thought, I AM NOT buying a slightly upgraded wii for £300 (wiis were £130 at this point an second hand £50).
This wasn't helped by store staff not knowing what it was, no idea what games were out on it (yes it had CoD and Mass effect from day 1) an no must see title. Nintendoland was massively underplayed (Rayman demos but NOT Nintendoland?) and under marketed, even the box wasn't that great.
It all adds up to a marketing and awareness failure of the highest proportion. Literally no one had even heard Nintendo were releasing it, an those that did also knew of the 'wild' speculation of the £99 Xbox1 rumour (subscription console) that never materialised ha.

@gatorboi352 Haha i know you're having a laugh. But Metroid prime for cube. Mario galaxy for wii. And is it zelda u or x for wii u? Kubrick took longer durations for masterpieces than them

@grumblebuzzz I agree. They took something that would have been a separate optional device any other previous gen and forced it into being the main input device thinking it would "force" adoption rate. And failed.

I just always felt like I wasn't quite using it right; a big ass 6 inch touch screen right in the palm of my hands and I'm spending 90% of my time looking AWAY from it at the TV. Not to mention extended play sessions sucked with it. Pro controller is where it's at, I hope the NX expands on it.

I'd like to state that Nintendo tried but failed this time. The other 2 consoles just remind me that the Last generation was actually a more upward thinking and good looking one despite the underpowered overhyped HD revolution. I mean why on earth have we all taken back wards steps in online? 16 an 20 player? WTF I was playing 32 and 64 player Unreal tournament 2004 back in the day (over a decade ago).
Even PS3 managed to get 64 players running well (60 resistance, 8 player co op, 64 player MAG). An now we have a huge back step to 6v6 an 10v10, numbers a PS2, GC and xbox could handle, yeah Innovative Online my arse.
Wii U should have stolen that space, but again it can only pull off about the same. It's a joke this Gen with online so far to be honest.

Nintendo is way off base. I am getting very frustrated and Nintendo not using the money to push graphics and processing, but instead putting a cheap screen with a cheap touch screen on the controller, necessitating a huge battery, and all sorts of other costs that need not be there, I sure hope they do something different with the NX. Also, I have yet to find a game on the Wii U which is funner because of the touch screen, I honestly find it a nuisance in some games.

They didn't market the gamepad at ALL. If they would have maybe people wouldn't have taken almost a year to realize the Wii U was a different system than the wii. The main games I can think of that used it the best were ZombiU, Pikmin, and NintendoLand. All other games may have used off TV play or the touch screen but how was that different than pointing and clicking with the remote? The HD graphics were enough but when the main selling point isn't a selling point we basically got an upgraded wii. Innovative ideas are what keeps nintendo from needing a graphic powerhouse system.

Kind of stinks that they are just now figuring out their own console after almost 3 years of it being out. If more games and companies leveraged it, it could have been a lot better than what it was. Especially since a lot of first party games will be missed this cycle that could have done something with it (battalion wars, fire emblem, metroid, zelda). I just hope they plan marketing BEFORE they release the NX, otherwise nobody will understand that either.

@tysonfury It is. They got it wrong.

Just PR blabber.

The games that should be on the Wii U aren't there.
How about an RTS or a TBS or some sort of world building game? They would probably translate very well and be amazing on the system.

I've had my Wii U for two years now. I didn't mind the gamepad at first, but now I just find it incredibly annoying.
Wish they would stop "innovating" and use that money on improving the system's power and making games instead.

@Splatburst; You guys are absolutely right about gamepad aiming being a great use of the gamepad. But I most amazed when the gamepad offers a first person view (Nintendoland featured this to an extent). To me, that is a virtual reality feature (without wearing unsightly and cumbersome headgear), but I never hear "virtual reality" used in describing the gamepad, perhaps another PR oversight.

Nintendo should have really made a NintendoLand2 with more "asymmetrical" multiplayer gameplay.

For the last year every second weekend, I play Nintendo Land with friends. There is so much potential for local multiplayer and Nintendo didn't use it.

@gatorboi352 The gyro controls mostly,without them it wouldn't be the same but it's together with having the map in your hands to keep an eye on what's going on and plan your next move that adds an extra layer of immersion for me.It's nothing huge but it's better because of it.I agree it would also be amazing with the Wiimote but that would mean having a big map on the screen at all times and with all the colour on screen it wouldn't be easy on the eyes.For me,it's one of those rare games where the hardware,controller and game truly seem made for each other.

"Wii U GamePad Is The Only Real Innovation This Console Cycle, But We Didn't Showcase It Well Enough " You think Nintendo? You tried to do a new gimmick and it failed. Let's see if you try that again with the NX. Third times the charm?

Nintendo- does not need 'secret sauce'; Nintendo- needs to go back to serving meals that customers want. Nintendo- stopped being intelligent and started becoming 'creative' some time ago. (No wonder there are actually little games that I want from the Nintendo- Café, most of them sequels of giant IPs.)

@Peach64 so ebooks and streaming services changed nothing?

@MarkyVigoroth they have always done this. The famicom had speakers in the controllers that responded to sound.

@OorWullie I think with Splatoon it would be fine to have the map able to be toggled on and off the TV screen with a button. The whole "it wouldn't work without the gamepad" argument doesn't make sense to me. The parts when you have to look away from the TV to touch the gamepad screen (super jumping and ink striking) have always felt clunky to me anyway because that leaves the player defenseless while they look away; not something you really want to happen in a shooter.

A lot of the mainstream games that people acknowledge don't take full advantage of the Gamepad, yet there is quite a number of mid to low stream games that does make use of it. Games like Game and Wario, The Wonderful 101, and Wii Fit U to name a few make great use of the Gamepad but most just look for and listen to the big name games. Then again they didn't promote those games with Gamepad use as much or at all.

I do tell you one thing. Sony and Microsoft systems are so similar, I'm considering getting a gaming desktop to play games released on those systems but not Nintendo like that Naruto fighting game they had on sale last weekend on Stream.

Kind of and not really. Nintendo,all your fans want is a powerful console with no gimmicks, or atleast a console that makes them optional. I liked the Wii and all when I was a kid, but now looking back at it and knowing about the Gamecube, the gamecube console wise, to me seems better, and that had no gimmicks (besides small disks). If they do make gimmicks with the NX just make them not so forced, I mean have you seen what Microsoft tried to do with the Kinect? Not many people wanted it, so they scrapped it, and ever since that, Xbox Ones have been selling, unlike the Wii U. Plus the Wii U has barely any ads on TV that I see besides splatoon e.e. And the idea of it all kinda doesn't work. You have to ignore the TV (the biggest screen in the house, with most of, if not all action happening there) to look down and do something completely small/pointless. The only time I actually used the gamepad for something useful is off-TV play, and in Wind Waker.

I love the gamepad. It is surprisingly comfortable and ergonomic. It will be great for when Xenoblade X comes out for the map and works really well with ZombiU and Splatoon. Even if it's not used for gameplay it is a great controller to use

couldn't care less about the GamePad. Bring back a Gamecube style comtroller with an additional Left shoulder button, bigger D-pad and maybe's pointer and that's it.

@FargusPelagius I've always thought price was a large determining factor in the Wii U's death by a thousand paper cuts lifespan. It's all related. Wii sold really well, $250 w/ Sports, going against $600 PS3 and $500 Xbox360. It was almost an impulse purchase for everyone, such a great deal. Then Wii U launches at $300 w/ no game, or $350 w/ game, vs similarly powered $199 PS3 and Xbox360 and $99 bright red Wii Mini which Ntineod launched in the US about the same time, even bundling Wii Mini w/ Mario Kart Wii. A year later PS4 for $400 and Nintneod counters by discontinuing the $299 box and lowering the $349 to $299. MS launched X1 at $500, almost immediately dropped Kinect to get to $400 (like Nintnedo did w/ 3DS $249 down to $169 which saved that system) and then lowered X1 again to $350. Meanwhile Wii U sits at $299 2 years later. Maybe the Gamepad is worth $100, maybe it isn't, but consumers don't shop in vacuums, price matters.

Wii sold well b/c it was cheap. PS3 sold poorly at the start b/c it was expensive, but Sony continued to lower prices. Wii U sold poorly at the start b/c it was $100 more than Wii, PS4 sold well at the start b/c it was $200 less than PS3. 3DS sold poorly so they dropped the price 30% and then it sold well. X1 sold poorly at $500, better at $400, even better at $350 (not counting Japan of course.) Wii U should have been $249 last Christmas, $199 this Christmas. Nintneod figured it out w/ 3DS, but not w/ Wii U. MS figured it out w/ X1 pricing, Sony w/ PS4 pricing. It's all related.

@BinaryFragger The fact that NX got more time in that E3 Nitneod Direct than the Zelda U game means Wii U deserves to fail. The only thing worse than Zelda U's omission was NX inclusion. Put them both together and it's pure lunacy. The fact that they didn't mention Zelda U b/c it was so far out, but Reggie did mention NX, well draw your own conclusions.

He's right. It really is the only innovation this gen. The rest is more of the same: add some better graphics or more online stuff but that's about it.

I would argue that nintendo bit off more than they could chew, and that the gamepad could be the most innovative gaming technology EVER. Just underused.

It's a cool device for a few minutes, but Nintendo's just spewing PR bullshit right now. It's not as innovative as they love to say it is and what usefulness it could've had is wholly wasted maps and tiresome minigames.
I mean, like, where the fark is Endless Ocean for Wii U (heck, where's Endless Ocean 3D for that matter)?

I can only think of ONE game that can take full advantage of both the gamepad and the Wii U's very limited graphical and computational horsepower, and that would be an Endless Ocean game.
And while I'm at it, the only game I think that could make full use of the 3DS's 3D screen, it's now often ignored touchscreen, and it's extremely limited graphical and computational horsepower would be an Endless Ocean. Even better, now that New 3DS exist it could be an exclusive game for that to make handling such a game a bit easier on the handheld.

Anyway, for all the "innovation" that Nintendo loves to brag about, the Wii U (and 3DS) is still just wasted potential.

And honestly, I find the touchscreen in Vita more useful than the one on the gamepad with the touchpad sometimes being used for convenient shortcuts or "innovative" gameplay like in Tearaway. Also the Dualshock 4 (I don't even have a PS4) is better designed with that touchpad looking to provide a lot of convenience.

It took 3 years for Nintendo to figure that out? Seriously you guys don't surprise me at ALL. I've always said that Nintendo could of done wonders with the game-pad. But unfortunately they themselves didn't know what to do with the Wii U. Like some people here said they should of sold it separate and just added the Pro Controller. We'll see in 2016 if they learned there lessons.

It is indeed extremely innovative and immersive. The reason that it wasn't used enough is the 3rd party abandonment. Most of the best uses come from games that typically Nintendo doesn't make - things like Arkham City and Mass Effect 3, and ZombiU, that used the gamepad magnificently. But then they neglected it. It was the same way with the Wii Remote. We got things like Resident Evil 4, and MadWorld, and Force Unleashed, but not much else like that later on, and Nintendo doesn't usually make these action/shooter games really.

The Gamepad isn't innovative though. The only thing remotely new was off-TV play. But the touch screen is the ancient single touch technology the DS used at a standard def output despite the Wii U finally being HD. The thing was outdated by a lot upon arrival. As much as Nintendo uses Gunpei Yokoi's ideals of using outdated hardware to make magic at a cheap price the Wii U wasn't cheap. The iPad and other tablets had already been technologically superior and one cannot tell me that Nintendo's R&D department couldn't have seen that coming. I wish Nintendo had foregone the Gamepad, continued utilizing the Wii Remote and its extensions and bumped the Wii U's power to at least sit close to the competition. Nintendo did themselves in this generation and it won't be pretty if the NX cannot deliver something that can entice anyone that isn't a Nintendo diehard.

@Peach64 I assume you haven't really played many Wii U games? Otherwise I don't understand how you could come to a statement like "Even the 'best' examples don't really need a gamepad." That's so untrue!You really don't know what you're talking about, just making an argument for argument's sake. Those games wouldn't be possible without the Gamepad! Affordable Space Adventures, Splatoon, Zombie U, Splinter Cell: Blacklist, Nintendoland, Mario Maker, Starfox, just to name a few.

@Splatburst Yeah man, totally! The Gamepad as a second screen is such a great addition to gameplay! How can they not see it?

SO much potential LOST!

Asymmetrical play has so many functions! And very few developers used it. So much potential lost.

I love the gamepad, and hope that it will be useful on the NX too, if that system doesn't already have some upgraded version, I hope we'll be able to keep the WiiU gamepad as a second one on the NX maybe

I could be sarcastic and award this guy a big dòh, or at the very least say "well, if that's so then you should have put a hell of a lot more marketing behind it" but those are reactions in the "way too obvious" category.

The next bit is quite a slab of text, so feel free to skip if you're from the TL;DR generation or if you're willing and able to be objective, join in and read on...

Looking at it objectively, he is actually right. Like @uhhhhhhhh and others have already said, the GamePad does offer a break from the norm and has added value IF implemented the right way, so I'm not talking about maps here. Also handy, but not really the wow factor to sell the device with.

In my humble opinion people being negative about the GamePad either don't really take the time to get familiar with it, were negative from day one so never really gave it a fair shot or lay emphasis on rather silly negatives, like having to look down/away from the TV, which isn't necessary AT ALL if you hold the GamePad in the right way! (if you sit close enough to the TV, it's almost like having a huge DS)

Let's put aside all the obvious things like sales figures, marketing and it not having been used enough. From that starting point you can objectively try to judge if the options it could offer would make the GamePad an added value and as such indeed be an innovative device.

Off TV Play being the most obvious, but that is also the easy way out, much like putting a map on the screen and it isn't implemented well enough since for it to be a decisive factor, it should be offered in ALL games.

What is left is local multiplayer without the need for split screen or two TV sets (also much more fun since you can see the despair on the other guys face better if you win), asymmetric play were you could either implement it to help other players (Mario, Rayman) or it could also be used to put up hurdles and give them a real challenge, such as changing the conditions in Need for Speed Most Wanted U.

Then we have the panorama view option, which was shown off in the earlier E3 demo, but besides an interactive Street View game it has hardly been used. It could offer some interesting gameplay options, though, and some of that seems to be implemented in the new Star Fox, but it could do a lot more. And then there's the overall added value of NOT having to pause your game to have maps, stats and so on on your screen. If implemented well enough, it truly does add to the immersion of the game.

Those (and some more that I will spare for now) are my two cents.
No need to debate these points on account of them not being used, since that is glaringly obvious, the premise of my two cents was just to show possibilities and go from there to decide if the GamePad is innovative or not.

And the possibilities show that on paper, it definitely is, regardless of what people think.

Don't like it? Fine, play with the other controllers or sell your Wii U if all it does is gather dust. And some misunderstandings: a gimmick is something added for the sake of being added and not offering a single added value whatsoever, and that is not what the GamePad is.

Some people also royally fail to grasp the meaning of the term innovation:
Innovation isn't decided by the technology that is used to offer that innovation, like @FJOJR seems to state. Innovation is decided by the manner in which ANY technology is implemented, regardless of it's age.

So basically, you could even do innovative things with a model T-Ford if you'd wish to do so...

The fact that the GamePad is sub HD and has a "single touch" screen (that's called a resistive touch screen, by the way) takes nothing away from the possible gameplay mechanic options. Making the controller screen HD would have ramped up the price even more back when it was manufactured and making the screen capacitive wouldn't have been an added value at all.

Current day resistive screens are simply more suitable for gaming, as is also the general opinion if you do a quick search online. Capacitive is less precise for quite a few gaming mechanics (and even for browsing, unless you zoom in first to be able to touch the right link without making a mistake, depending on the size of your fingers/hands), so there's a larger margin for error, feedback is buggy at times or over-sensitive, more reflective screens, so inferior in certain conditions, less durable, slower response time etc.

And pinch to zoom wouldn't really be an added value in gaming, other than zooming in on a map, which is usually done by using a button anyway...

@Avahne Endless Ocean on 3DS? Where can I preorder? Also like your idea for a Wii U version. The GamePad could be used both as a camera and a flashlight, much like in ZombiU.

I love the gamepad, I was unsure about it until I got my hands on it and it just seemed such a natural progression of the DS/3DS into home consoles. I guess after years of playing Nintendo's dual screen family, it felt so natural having the second screen for maps, inventory, etc. Also using it as offTV screen when the main TV is in use it is a great bonus. Finally playing local multiplayer on two separate screens is a blast. Feels like online but sat in same room. Racing games and FPS are great multiplayer in the two separate screens.

@Yorumi Yeah and Zombie U will be total crap without the gamepad. It's what makes this game so immersive and this is very important for a horror game (otherwise it won't cause any fear in you). SP: Blacklist also won't be as good without it's great use of the Gamepad, oh and I forgot Need for Speed Most Wanted U! The devs put so much effort into this. I don't know what "um, little big planet" is supposed to mean? Starfox... seriously? Your statement is like saying "yeah, in 1995, there were mobile phones, too" when someone tries to point out what a modern smartphone can do. Lol. Starfox Zero is totally different, not only (but also) because of the motion steering, but because of the dual-screen setup. That will be totally immersive, more than any Starfox game before!
And Splatoon needs the motion control, but it needs the Gamepad also for the map. That's a point many people seem to underestimate. It plays a huge part in Splatoon, consistently looking down on it for a splitsecond gives me an overview of the current circumstances on the battle field. That's part of why this game doesn't need voice chat.

So in reply to your statement: Yeah, a man with only one foot can probably walk some way, with crutches maybe. But it won't be the same as walking with two feet.

Well maybe, but still doesn't take away that this gamepad gives the gamer a handicap. The L and R buttons are not fast enough. You really have to stop for a moment and concentrate on the buttons. On the little gamepad everything goes much smoother and faster. For a gamer that's just no go. I didn't like the gamepad because of that

To be honest, most of the Gamepad's "innovations" aren't really that innovative. Using the second screen to display maps and inventory is something the DS invented nearly a decade prior. Games like Nintendo Land and Mario Party 10 use the Gamepad in somewhat meaningful ways, but they aren't exactly very good games. The rest of the Wii U's lineup doesn't use the Gamepad at all, for all intents and purposes.

If it ain't broke don't fix it.
I mean, assymetrical gameplay is sometimes cool, but it makes things unnecessarily complicated for the developers and for the players. Think about all the time it took Nintendo Land's developers to think of all of those complex minigames. In all that time they could have just made a much better standard game. And it makes it complicated for the players too because it's the kind of game where half of the time you're just trying to figure out the controls and the fun fades away quickly. Just my opinion though

Innovation? PSP did that earlier with PS3. And if having a second screen on your controller was supposed to be innovation, Dreamcast did so with VMU back in 1998, which was used to display general game information on a LCD monochromatic screen such as life bars, maps, tips etc, at the same time you had to look at the TV screen.

Even the DS had the dual-screen concept (with also one being touchscreen) almost a decade earlier... and DSi also introduced cameras. In my opinion, this concept worked so much better on DS.

I can't seriously understand what's so innovative about it.

@Yorumi Oh I do, but I find most of them inferior. Aside from Nintendo I play a lot of PC games, so none of those things are new to me. Sure, there are several games with a Level Editor or Mod Management, not just small platformers, but some really big games that easily exceed Zelda in their proportions (Far Cry, Fallout, etc). And yeah, I know the Mario Hacks.
But you can't compare all that PC content with what you find on a (Nintendo) console. There are no Mods, there are few games with editors.
I just watched some videos of LBP and it looks alright, but not really intriguing. It reminds me more of Yoshi and Pikmin than Mario.
I know Blacklist was a port. That doesn't change the fact that having the Gamepad to use your different tools in a more-immersing fashion is a huge plus that the other versions lack. I was never really into Splinter Cell in the first place (although I know it since the beginning) but Blacklist was able to get my interest because of those things.
You still don't get it, it's not just about the motion or controls, regarding Starfox. It's about the whole experience. About getting sucked/immersed into that world.
And regarding Splatoon, I don't know how you could prefer a map on the main screen? That was always bugging me in so many games, it just distracts you unnecessarily. I like to have my main gaming screen clean, just like my Desktop (until Win7, shortcuts were in Rocketdock, now with Win10 I just have all of them in the new start menu). Oh and I forgot to mention that in my previous post: Of course the Mouse is the #1 shooter control method. But motion control is the first method that actually comes very close to it. I never got accustomed to the twin-stick shooting method, although I tried with GTA V and Red Dead Redemption on Xbox 360 (played the full singleplayer campaign for both). But it's just heavily inferioir. But when I played Red Steel and The Conduit on the Wii, it opened my eyes! Finally there was another control method that was fun, immersive (which the mouse isn't) and somewhat manageable/precise. Of course, the Wii U gamepad is much more precise and that's why I'm saying motion control came very close to mouse control. If I had the option, it's likely that I would play Splatoon with the mouse. But I think I would miss some features and maybe go back to the Gamepad, at the very least occasionally.

I hope this gen shows Nintendo that sometimes, people prefer evolution over inovation. With games like Halo 5 and Uncharted 4 selling consoles before said games are even out it shows that most people just want a great looking game that runs well and plays well, using a traditional controller. Let it be known that I love my Wii U and the games are fantastic. But the gamepad, whilst I enjoy off tv play, really hurt the Wii U's sales due to how expensive they had to sell the system.

@Yorumi Yeah, that's why I only look away for a splitsecond. Or more precisely, I look at the Gamepad from the corner of my eye, so that I don't really have to look away from the main screen.

My point in general is simply that the options the Gamepad offers can enhance the gaming experience or even bring something completely new. Aside from off-TV-play (which I also enjoy), it can be more immersion, useful controls/information display or a completely new gameplay element, like assymetrical gameplay. I'm actually looking forward to the colour control mode of Runbow, for example. Also, the experience Affordable Space Adventures gave me and several of my friends, was something totally unique, new and unknown before.
I'm not saying some of the things the Gamepad is used for wouldn't be somehow implementable without it, but it would take something away from the experience. Something that I would miss. And I certainly wouldn't play any shooter without motion control (on consoles).

Anyway, I don't think we will come to an agreement on that and that's fine by me, everyone is entitled to have a different opinion.

Is this guys on drugs?

“…with Super Mario Maker it shows you how magical it is to create levels with that Gamepad. It's so easy and intuitive.” Nobody is buying a Wii U, especially now, to create magic.

“…we are continuing to show the promise of the Gamepad and, candidly, early on we probably didn't showcase the promise of the Gamepad as well as we could have.” Glad you guys finally figured out to showcase a dying system.

“As developers have gotten more comfortable with the technology, now you're seeing games that really leverage the power of the Gamepad. I think that will invite people to take a second look at Wii U.” No other developers outside Nintendo funded ones are getting comfortable with your technology and people have taken 2nd and probably 3rd looks and still said nope.

“I think those types of experiences may help us propel the system to new heights.” And I think you are dreaming.

You know Nintendo, if you'd have made Metroid Prime 4 you wouldn't have had this problem. The Gamepad is pretty much begging for a new Prime game.

I think at the end of the era, when the Nintendo WIi U is as old as the Dreamcast is now, it will be remembered much the same. The gamepad was never fully used to it's potential, even by Nintendo. Just some of the games I couldn't understand why they were not on the console.

SimCity, The Sims, FTL, Sanctum 2, Magic the Gathering, Torchlight, Worms, Dungeon Defenders, Uno, Hasbro Family Game Night, Monopoly, Assassin's Creed: Rouge, King's Quest reboot, Command & Conquer, Total War, Football Manager, and I probably could go on for a while.

Needless to say there were a lot better games out there that Sega, EA, Ubisoft, and Activision could of brought to the table or revived and found success on the console. Instead they wanted to have the Wii U be exactly like the other two.

@Yorumi "the biggest problem is all the specifics you list." and "When you go on to list used for it, it's seen as fairly limited."
That's why I specifically stated: if seen objectively. A console designer cannot (and should not) keep in mind that some people live in houses the size of a castle or the size of a sea container, so they take an average.

And then you'll also have the whiners that say that although what I stated is possible, it is still awkward because "it's too hard to hold up the GamePad for that long because it's too heavy".

Those are either people that hardly do anything to keep themselves in any reasonable form or shape (you certainly don't have to be a body builder to hold up the GamePad. Personally, I found it to be surprisingly light, especially for its size) or don't know how to quickly switch their view from one place to another. I wouldn't feel comfortable at all stepping into a car with people like that...

"A panorama view isn't really that much different from normal camera control." Yes it is. Camera control is exclusively limited to the in-game field of view, while panorama view can show you images of what could otherwise not be seen on screen, ESPECIALLY at the same time, so you could look in all directions, such as the various demos demonstrated and have additional views that you otherwise could never have without taking away from your main view, unless you add an extra screen in screen on your TV, like the rear view mirror in a racing game.

The rest of what you said is also more opinion than actual facts (I mentioned the local multiplayer to show that it is a better option than having to go split screen as we had to do in the N64/GameCube days) and that it's just like a light gun (which is a very bad comparison because you could hardly play any other type of game with it, which the GamePad can) or flight stick is because no one makes use of it, so it is lack of implementation, NOT innovation and that is just the point I am trying to convey:

I would like for people to think about this without opinion and without looking at what has been done with it so far, because that is indeed way too little and that would automatically mean a negative judgement.

So, it's not that I don't personally agree with some of your points, I was just trying to make a list of the options/potential of the GamePad and go from there. So, if you like a "what if" list. Not a "what has actually happened" list. Potential is connected to the former and in reality, the GamePad never truly fulfilled that potential, but for a few exceptions, even though it certainly offers it.

I like the gamepad, off-tv play alone is a huuuge plus imo. It's also very comfortable.

But for game ideas it is very underutilised yes.

As I don't own a Wii U, this shows one of the reasons why. It's a good console with some nice games, but some of those games lacked the use of the Wii U pad that I was expecting. I have played my friends Wii U and it was nice, and the off screen use was cool too. Just more features for the game pad would have really done it for me.

@Yorumi No no no, you're still not following me. What if as in "what if the potential of the GamePad was fully utilized" not as in there is actually only a handful of games that I can play with it so far.

Take the premise of the GamePad and go from there, anyone should be able to come up with something interesting that it could have been used for which would also genuinely add something, making it worthwhile, innovative and truly fulfilling its potential.
So we're talking theoretically here, not actual situation.

And how many people want (or are able to use) a second screen? I would say everyone that has a DS or 3DS, or at least a lot of them.
And cost is another factor that has nothing to do with potential, which is all I'm talking about.

Light gun again? Really, really not comparable. One is optional, the other is part of, one is limited to one type of game, the other has so much more potential and could be used for many other things. Good luck trying to play Mario Kart or a Smash Bros with a light gun.
Making that work, now THAT would be a gimmick.. (Mario Kart with arrows on either side of the screen, and then shoot those to make him go in that direction. Oh, the horror... )

@TheRealThanos Imagine playing Smash Bros with a DDR pad. Actually, I wouldn't mind doing that just for laughs.

@Legromancer agreed. Enjoyable and doesn't get in the way if you don't want to use it.

@Yorumi I'm sorry my friend, but you are once again mixing in opinions, amongst others by saying mouse is superior. while technically and factually, moving a mouse or a handheld screen is equally fast and precise, so that is just what you think, not what is fact. And camera movement by means of a regular joypad is controlled by a stick and that has travel, so it is considerably less direct than pointing a wiimote or indeed a GamePad at where you want to look.

It really is very simple: take everything that Nintendo initially offered as uses for the GamePad, add things that other people have said over time (both professional media as well as a lot of people commenting on this site and others) and you could literally come up with a truckload of uses for a GamePad with a touch screen.

Simply thinking of it as a giant DS already makes it a whole lot easier, since that obviously has displayed its potential in a more than adequate way. Now add to that list your own (objective) ideas of what it could be used for, and there you go: a ton of potential.

Yes, it hasn't been used and it's been sorely undermarketed, but that is besides the point, same as if somebody likes certain options or not. Potential doesn't judge, it's just available options regardless of opinions or feelings.

@IceClimbers I once had a sensor mat for playing ISS on GameCube. Worked in conjunction with the controller. "Move your feet over the sensors to score in various ways". Fun indeed...

@IceClimbers Found it!
http://ecx.images-amazon.com/images/I/5177YTRQCDL.jpg
The controller connected to the dongle which is at the bottom of the picture, so you moved with the controller and actually had to use your feet to shoot.

"Moffitt feels that developers within Nintendo have now gotten used to exploiting the controller..."

See, that's the problem right there. That's fine for first-party (it's not really not but...). If I were the head of a non-Nintendo studio, we'd already be (amongst other things): doing logistics to see if our game is financially feasible; planning and research; development and programming; blahblahblah. I would NOT want the additional concern of exploiting a gimmicky hardware quirk. Gamers (non-Nintendo) are just fine playing awesome games on systems that don't have weird, oddball designs; gimmicky quirks; and one-off accessories that only work with a single game (something else Nintendo is notoriously known for). I'm positive if Nintendo came out with a system that had a regular controller; an internal hard drive; an account system; third-party support; robust online & services; and HD, not one Nintendo fan would be begging for them to bring back the gimmicks they seem so intent on forcing these days. Nintendo needs to STOP trying to be different: YOU'RE NINTENDO — YOU'RE ALREADY DIFFERENT!

@Yorumi Man, you sure are determined to make this harder than necessary, but I'll give it one more try.
The DS comment was meant to ADD to the whole list that Nintendo mentioned in the beginning (and YES, they never fulfilled but again: NOT the point)
And concerning GamePad vs Mouse: depending on what mouse you use (and apparently the user) that is definitely up for debate. Mouses come in all sorts of shapes, sizes, dpi and quality. I can easily hold up the GamePad and move it just as quickly to a point on screen as I can point my mouse to a point on my PC monitor. Also, if you are sitting at a normal distance away from your TV, the distance to move from one point to another by pointing at something is relatively the same as moving a pointer on a monitor.
The mouse is arguably slightly easier because of the always visible pointer, which the GamePad doesn't have in every game, that's all. I don't have shaking hands and as already mentioned have no trouble at all holding the GamePad up for some time. And shaky hands would also affect mouse operation, methinks...
You should also make it an equal battle, so rest your elbows on your lap or a flat surface and then point the GamePad to compare it with a mouse, which is also not controlled by holding it in the air, so you are always supported by a desk.
And people are in my opinion a lot smarter than you seem to give them credit for (for the most part anyway) and it was more a question of marketing the hell out of all the options and how to use them than anything else and then it would have been clear to all but the most illiterate person, so Nintendo is definitely at fault there. It's something that still irritates the hell out of me to this day, as a sales & marketing professional myself, to see how they royally f***ed that up...

I like the gamepad. Off screen play is great. Little man can play minecraft on my 360 while I play on the Wii U. Yes it could do with more range. I would love to play in another room. And there are some class games which use it - Nintendoland probably being the best.

@Yorumi Why do you keep missing the point? If I need to explain in another way, please let me know, I know intentions or thoughts can sometimes get lost in translation when a stranger has to interpret what we type so there's a really overwhelming feeling on this side that we are completely talking past each other instead of communicating.

I can't stress this enough: the whole point of my original slab of text was to exclusively sum up the potential and then judge that as either being innovative or not, besides if people like those options or other colored opinions.

It also doesn't matter one tiny little bit for the point I was making if that potential has been fulfilled or not, so whether they did or did not deliver is totally irrelevant, so can we please not dwell on that part?

Also, I wasn't talking about using GamePad or Wiimote on PC, so I have no idea what brought that on....

Let's try a different comparison: If a car offers you both city and off-road capabilities but you never take it off-road, does that make it a bad multi-purpose vehicle? No, it's either bad marketing, bad implementation or bad judgement on the part of the buyer, although I almost hesitated to mention that last one since that may become a hook for yet another irrelevant objection...

As for the dual screen part: I was only talking about the Wii U. And the DS has been VERY widely adopted, so saying that has not delivered is more than a bit off the mark...

In many ways we are already using dual "screens" since we've been born, just not in the specific way of a gaming device, but it is easy to adapt; it's what people do once something is widely accepted, so all they have to do is get it right next time.

And people use smart phones, other types of touch screens, VR is becoming a thing so gyro will become more mainstream, and in certain industries those things are already widely used and accepted. And what one person finds meaningful and the other does not, is once again nothing more or nothing less than a personal opinion and so irrelevant to obtaining an objective view on a certain point.

@Yorumi I should have just asked if the potential was there, which also negates it being used or not. The answer, by the way, is a resounding yes...

@Yorumi And I could give a rat's @ss about most people* What people feel or think doesn't matter for the point I am making; that's once again opinion and not true objective reasoning where potential and/or innovation is concerned. If some object or service brings something new to the table, it is innovative by definition, the degree is irrelevant.

(* that was a bit rude, but this has been quite a discussion... No offense, though. I like a good brain squeezer every now and then... )

Sorry Nintendo, but let's be real. The gamepad was definitely NOT an innovation. I still believe in you though.

As good as Nintendo has proven to be developing for less powerful older tech. Part of my thinks they do the gimmick route and weaker tech hardware because they'd be exposed trying to develop on something as powerful as the PS4. They've always had the luxury of fans saying how good they do with limited resources. If you actually gave them resources they'd have to produce something on par with the better studios. Maybe, just maybe they aren't up to the task. They've made several great games on the Wii U but not a single one has been visually impressive. Sure, considering the hardware it is. But that's what I mean. Built in excuse. There's no excuse for Star Fox looking like a PS360 game.

Nintendo is so outside of the videogame conversation right now. Gamepad offers nothing new or exciting to gameplay. The Starfox example is pathetic.

I was playing Destiny on the PS4 over the weekend. A game considered a bit mediocre by most. And it still feels more innovative than anything Nintendo did this gen. And I love nintendo's IPs for life.

@Al_Godoy Honestly? A first person shooter wrapped up in a MMORPG? It has EVE Online (published in 2003) written all over it, mixed with a little Mass Effect and obviously a dash of Halo. It adds next to nothing to these other concepts, so you could hardly deem that innovative...
As for Star Fox, I don't think it's fair to judge a game that you haven't played yet. By several accounts it is truly a case of trying it and getting to grips with the controls, which also doesn't seem to work in short sessions, like initial previews (also on NLife clearly showed). People that had more time to play seemed positive for the most part. To me it also seems underwhelming right now, but I'll reserve final judgement after a test run.

Maybe next time try to develop games for it, dear Nintendo...

Ppl don't care about innovation (aka. Gimmicks) they just want a normal, simple controller with a powerful game console, and lots of games to choose from to play, not hard Nintendo, why can't you just learn this?!?

@Yorumi I would change "is" to "looks" underwhelming, to which I agree, as you can see in my previous comment. But no amount of trailers or Let's Plays can give you a complete impression, so you need to play it yourself to be able to form anything even resembling an informed opinion.

Previews, reviews and professional opinions online or in magazines are only meant as an aid, not as a "we decide for you" type of thing. I'll judge for myself. I can try in a shop so there will be no risk of a bad purchase.

And what is "a bunch of time"? Let's say it takes me about 10 - 15 minutes to really start to get into Star Fox (or any other game for that matter). Is that really so damning? No, it isn't. I've been gaming since the 70's (1976 to be exact) and there have been tons of games that took me way longer to master or even get to grips with.
Sure, the preferred choice would be an "easy to learn, tough to master" game, but game mechanics suddenly shining through because of practice/persistence can definitely also be a very nice thing.

And besides the added GamePad aiming controls, the game is almost the same both in aesthetics AND controls, so if you don't want to use the zoomed in aim feature of the GamePad, you could still fly and shoot with your Arwing in the regular way....

@Blastcorp64 You mean SplaTWOon?

@Yorumi I have no idea, but from indirect experience I honestly can't (and won't) judge adequately enough. I've seen game videos of games looking truly amazing and as a result I had high expectations sometimes, only to have those smashed once I actually played those games.

@hYdeks People actually do care about innovation, as long as it's an innovation that speaks to them, otherwise they are very quick to judge, point fingers and scream gimmick, much like you just did.
In fact the two are related, but are not the same: An innovation improves or changes a pre existing formula, while a gimmick on the other hand is simply a hook to reel in attention that is seldom innovative but rather flashy or cheap.

That doesn't equate to the GamePad: it isn't cheap, and a lot of time has gone into making it ergonomic, easy to use and what not. They failed to convey all the different uses in the right way and their marketing campaign was a disaster, but that is a totally different topic.

I wholeheartedly agree with you that the GamePad has prevented the Wii U from being more powerful and (maybe) having more support from third parties, but Nintendo has gone the power road before on more or less equal terms and that has hardly done them any good, which is what led them to the whole Wii concept in the first place.

Funny thing is that to truly come across an innovation as a developer/designer, you are bound to run through some gimmicks along the way: throw some ideas at the wall and see what sticks...
Want to know what a TRUE gimmick is? Curved TV's. Ars Technica wrote a truly scorching an nail-on-the-head article on that:
http://arstechnica.com/gadgets/2014/01/whats-the-deal-with-curved-tvs/
Personally, I would even go so far as to say that it isn't just a gimmick, it's a frickin' scam. BS in HUGE, neon-lighted capitals, in UHD...

@TheRealThanos
Well holding it normally at an angle is okay. The problem is when you hold at eye level. It's not a matter of strength, it's just that it hurts because of how torque works in physics.

Not to mention little kids might have a harder time carrying it. What, you saying a six year old needs to work out more to play splatoon?

The gamepad just needed to be a bit sleeker, like maybe PS Vota sized and I think it would have been alright

@TheRealThanos
I think had Mario Maker or Splatoon been a launch title, the Gamepad wouldn't have been as big a problem.
Another problem I've noticed a lot is that the games that use the pad a lot take away from the aesthetic of the game. Canvas Curse has a beautiful art style but because you spend all the time looking at the less powerful gamepad, you can't enjoy the HD

@electrolite77 Ok I meant not possible in their great form. It would be kind of a downgrade.

The gamepad is my favorite controller of all time. The TV button has made the gamepad my family's remote. It still has the same controls as the other guys. The joystick placement is better. The ABXY buttons are better than those weird shapes. The motion controls are awesome. I haven't even mentioned the second screen yet. Most of the time my family's tv is occupied. It helps remove screen clutter and the touch controls are a plus. I don't understand any of the complaints of it. How on earth would it of held back hardware potential. And I think I must be a bodybuilder compared to the people who complain about its weight.

@amiiboacid
Well it means that the system in practice has to multitask in running two games at once. So maybe that.

And the weight issue, when tilted down near the lap like a normal controller is not bad.
When at eye level for Splatoon, torque increases the perceived weight. Not to mention little kids have issues as they're weaker

The GamePad is an incredible controller, imo the best ever made.

For everyone saying 'it's not innovative because the PS3/Vita was doing offscreen play' or 'the DS had touch/2 screens'; then you've really not played games that use the GamePad to its full potential. Admittedly there aren't many games that actually do, but when you see something like Lego City Undercover's scanner featuring motion and virtual views it is clear that the GamePad is doing things that no other system can.

Battery life can be an issue (although not for me as I have the extended battery) but it's not that bad, especially when compared to the DS4 that has no screen and still has a terrible battery life.

Everyone has their opinion of the Game Oad, and no opinion is lees valid, or more valid then the next. Personally, I think Nintendo spoiled us with off-tv play, full size maps and inventory's etc.., without having to pause the game first.

As for 'NX'. I have no idea what it is going to be, or what innovations it might or might not have. One of the most important things Nintendo needs to do is to make sure it has x86 architecture. This alone, will make it a lot easier, and less expensive for developers. They can still do their own thing when it comes to control systems, how you interact with the console and with its games, but do not be so different that you give it your own OS that devs would have to learn. History has shown us, they really are not willing to do this in any big way.

Also, give more support, more agressive advertising, and try and help with publushing costs, for Independent Developers. The Wii U has had some of the best Independent games out of the three consoles, and Nintendo needs to keep these devs, and encourage them. They may be small companies at the moment, but a lot of them will go on to be the next big developers, and Nintendo needs to be ready, and in a position to purchase these companies.

List of games that actually used/will use the gamepad in a profound way:

ZombiU
Mass Effect 3
Deus Ex Human Revolution
Assassin's Creed III/IV
Splatoon
NSMBU
StarFox Zero
Splatoon
NintendoLand
Mario Party 10
Darksiders II
Resident Evil Revelations
Monster Hunter 3 Ultimate

The gamepad is indeed the most innovative peripheral this generation, just poorly marketed and incorporated. Developers are thinking way too much inside the box, but whatever keeps the bankroll rolling suffices for them, apparently. ZombiU was a risk, but it was the most satisfying zombie game I've ever played, and it came with a peripheral that was a core part of the console to begin with. I didn't have to dump $300 on a visor and motion controllers to have the full experience.

VR hasn't truly arrived, not yet anyway, and Project Morpheus and Hololens are nothing more than useless gimmicks that do nothing to actually change console gaming as it stands already. Nintendo beat Sony to the punch with the essentially first-person headset, and Nintendo and Sony both beat Microsoft to the augmented-reality mechanic through the 3DS and Vita.

Let the naysayers say what they want. There's no denying that all Sony and Microsoft have done is plagiarize what Nintendo pioneered. Microsoft essentially stole the GameCube controller layout and both Sony and Microsoft plagiarized the wireless controller (Lest we forget about the WaveBird).

Well, they have to reach out to that "casual" crowd somehow.

@Mona-Reggie No, I'm not saying kids should go to the gym. But they could for example sit on their knees (or on a chair) and lean the Pad (and rest their arms) on a table, if the game needs you to hold the GamePad up for extended periods of time, which isn't the case in most games. It might be true for Splatoon, but I would have to take your word on that, since I haven't played it yet.

I can agree with you on Kirby and the Rainbow Curse (Kirby's Canvas Curse was the DS game), where to me it feels like a great idea gone slightly pear-shaped. Obviously the game is inspired by its DS counterpart and it works just fine there, but on a big screen they should probably have changed the ratio of GamePad gameplay vs the TV part to maximize the benefit of the game being in HD. But you know, hindsight...

@CaPPa @amiiboacid some nice, factual and positive additions to emphasize the value of the GamePad, thumbs up.
@akaDv8R "History has shown us, they really are not willing to do this in any big way." That is a bit skewed: we all know very well that if the Wii U would have been marketed better and would have sold way more than it has now, it wouldn't have mattered one bit if they have a different architecture or not because with a larger market share for Nintendo, third party developers/publishers could have financially justified putting in the extra time to adapt their game towards the Wii U's "exotic hardware" because they would have had a better chance of making some actual money on Nintendo's console.
And exotic hardware isn't even the case: in parts it is very similar to the Wii and it also shares some traits with the Xbox 360, except for being GPGPU based, whereas the Xbox 360 was CPU based.
Developers not taking enough time to optimize towards that is the very reason for all the lousy last gen ports, besides the money issue. So, in short: if they could develop for the Wii or Xbox 360, then they are more than capable of making games on Wii U. It is simply a case of probably not being able to make a decent profit, and even risking not getting a return on investment, and time is also money, so you either end up with half-hearted attempts or no third party support at all anymore.
If Nintendo had sold double the amount of Wii U's, I can guarantee you that there would definitely have been more third party games.
@kensredemption "The gamepad is indeed the most innovative peripheral this generation, just poorly marketed and incorporated." Yes it is, thanks for that level headed addition to the discussion. Also, Splatoon must be a hell of a great game for you to mention it twice in your list...
You could of course replace it with Project Zero, and add Rayman Legends and Lego City Undercover while you're at it. Personally, I would even add the Batman game as an honorable mention for implementing some inventive uses of the GamePad as well.

@kensredemption So, what does casual crowd mean to you? Folks that game on MS&Sony systems have quite the large genre of games to choose from. Software sales are healthy on those platforms.

I always thought that the casual gamer was the majority of Wii owners. The people that never picked up on console gaming before that system. The people that bought the system and where more than happy with the pack in wii sports game and did little to support all the software said system had. The same people that left nintendo in favor of smart phones and tablets and never looked back.

Yeah, I'm still on a high from Nintendo Land. Splatoon and Affordable Space Adventures are the latest proven showcases for it. All these naysayers naying about the GamePad, it just amuses me. I know it failed to attract for many reasons and the whole Wii U saga was mostly a disaster from the outside, but it has delivered over and over for me and mine. (I've stated similar sentiments a dozen times here, but another won't hurt.)

Great observations by:
@rjejr
@TheRealThanos

@Superryanworld The casual gamer isn't something that suddenly sprang into being with the launch of the Wii: in the seventies there were also casual gamers. For me and many others it simply means someone that likes to play games but doesn't feel compelled to do so for the largest part of the day or week, so they won't really miss it if they can't play, but definitely do enjoy a game when they have the opportunity to play. Most of them also aren't really good in games, or only in one or two categories because when they play games, they mostly go back to what they know. In comparison you have the hardcore gamer, which (contrary to popular belief) has nothing to do with playing only "mature" and/or brown-greyish shooters and what not, but is simply a person that invests a lot of time into gaming, knows a lot about it, is good at it and possibly has multiple consoles and maybe even a gaming PC.
Most of this I can share from experience because I have all these types of people around me and I myself started out as a casual gamer, because I only played at my cousin's house and at a friend's before finally saving enough money to buy me my first home computer and after that the first console I bought was an N64. So, you can imagine that I only played games a couple of times a year, during holidays, birthdays and sleepovers. My parents never bought me one (save for a Pacman LCD game) because they were of the opinion that if I wanted a more expensive toy/device, I had to safe the money myself by means of allowance and money for chores, birthdays and report cards... Yeah, those were the days...
@aaronsullivan You're welcome.

Really Nintendo? I hadn't noticed. Perhaps instead of just saying you failed, you redirect a couple million to the marketing department to promote the damn console.

@aaronsullivan and thanks for reading it all, if you actually did...

@TheRealThanos Haha. Well, let's just say I started skimming once Yorumi got involved.

@aaronsullivan Yeah, that will do it...
But seriously: I have to say that I enjoyed sparring with him and reading his comments in general. More often than not they are quite level-headed and offer some good points. He also gets a little flak every now and then, but heated discussions will bring that out in the best of us...

@TheRealThanos Curved tvs? You've been busy today. Can't say I've read all of it, but you did leave out the letters HD back there somewhere when discussing the resistive screen on the Gamepad. (Well maybe you didn't, but it reads better when I put them in.)

@aaronsullivan I don't recall writing anything good today but thanks.

Anyway, I had a funny experience at Target today. The blonde woman in the electronics section saw me and shouted out "Hey, we got those things in." Then went behind the counter and held up one of those Splatoon water pistols. She said they got them in Monday. I just laughed and told her I didn't have my receipt w/ me and walked away. I can't believe they got them in. But thanks again for mine.

@kensredemption

Umm, think you're forgetting a few games there. Nindies exist, and people such as Curve Studios are absolutely genius with GamePad usage.

@rjejr Care to elaborate a bit on the "leaving out HD" part? I'm not following but off hand I would say that I didn't mention it in relation to the GamePad because it isn't relevant since that has a 480p screen.
As for curved TV's: have you read the article and/or do you agree? Or do you actually have one and have I now touched upon a delicate subject?
(by the way: the only reason I even mentioned it was to give an actual example of a device that is MUCH closer to being a gimmick than the Wii U or its controller will ever be)
And the Splatoon water pistol story? Okay, totally lost... must be an in-joke for people that actually play the game...

@Ryno I was going to reply, but then rembered I already did back at #48. (That's comment number 48, not hash tag 48.) I'd copy and paste it, but doing that on my tablet is such a pain.

No Wii Mini or Wii U in Target today, and a lot of DS and Wii games had clearance stickers on them, made me wonder if they were getting out of the last Gen business? Or just making room for Lego D. The 3DS cabinet was nearly empty as well.

@rjejr
That's crazy that it took that long and she remembered. You probably should have taken one. Oh and it was post #70 You've stated these things before but that was your most refined yet.

@TheRealThanos I'll copy and paste the sentence later when I'm on PC, went something like "If the Gamepad screen had been then it would have been even more expensive." And it looked like HD should have been between "been then".

I know what you meant about the curved tv, but it looked really off topic glancing over 100 comments all at once. Too rich for my blood, my 6 year old 52" non-3D (talk about failed gimmicks) non-curved non-smart 1080p TV is hanging in there. I'll read that article later though.

The water pistol comment was meant for aaron. Target gave out a free themed water pistol when you bought Splatoon, which I did 8AM release day. My Target never received any. aaron sent me his for my birthday gift.

@aaronsullivan Ah that post. I was thinking about my original post 48 where I was just being my usual jerk self. I really like Nintendo Life, but I think this was the 3rd article in a row based on that guys 1 interview w/ The Examiner. I appreciate the business sense of milking it, but my initial reactions tend to be a bit obnoxious.

I think that lady remembered me b/c I was in there looking for it about 5 times over 2 weeks. And she sees me in there a lot w/ my kids, women like guys who shop w/ their kids. Not like, like, I mean I'm not a jerk when my kids are around. Actually in real life I'm a pretty nice guy, I reflect on personal interactions much more than my blank wall typing.

I think 'creative' is a better word than 'innovative'. 'Innovative" means "creative" + "popular among people". I do not think the gamepad is a really popular device.

@rjejr Well, you must REALLY be a very friendly and sociable guy if you think that those little pin pricks you give in your comments sometimes equate to you being a jerk. I could quite easily make a list of people more deserving of that title, although some of them are either gone or don't feel the need to join the comments sections on NLife anymore.
And in this case your irritation was warranted, because this guy is just spouting whatever the hand that feeds him tells him to, I just picked out the one partial sentence that had some merit, but in the context of the whole he was talking out of the other end...
As for the question I asked you earlier about the HD thing, that must have been my first comment on this article, and specifically this piece:

"The fact that the GamePad is sub HD and has a "single touch" screen (that's called a resistive touch screen, by the way) takes nothing away from the possible gameplay mechanic options. Making the controller screen HD would have ramped up the price even more back when it was manufactured and making the screen capacitive wouldn't have been an added value at all."

And you were right: I forgot to put in HD, so I've corrected that now.
Also, you'll have to excuse my confusion at the whole Splatoon water pistol thing. First of all it wasn't for me, but I was just curious. To add to my confusion: I don't know how it is back home in the States nowadays, but over here in the Netherlands they have a lot of "dumb blonde" jokes, so my mind was going in the direction of "the blonde shop assistant thinks that the downloadable gun is actually a real water pistol". You can have a laugh at my expense if you will. Or I could tell you some dumb blonde jokes that are actually good/funny...

@GreatPlayer Erm, no it doesn't. The very definition of innovation is one that I already previously mentioned:
An innovation is something that improves or changes a pre existing formula.
From the Merriam-Webster dictionary:
Full Definition of INNOVATION
1: the introduction of something new
2: a new idea, method, or device: a novelty

As you can see, no distinction is made about public reception or popularity, because something new or unseen is that by definition, regardless of what the public thinks or feels. It would be very presumptuous to say something isn't innovative simply because a person doesn't like it, since that in no way equates to it not being something new or being implemented in new ways, to be a little more specific to the topic.

@TheRealThanos Didn't mean to come off as pedantic by correcting you - I think my mistypings of Nintnedo are near legendary status on here - I was just trying to show that even though I didn't read all of what you wrote, what I did read I was paying close enough attention to that I noticed that. And yes, that was the spot I was referring too, sorry I didn't get on the PC earlier to find it for you myself. Not that it mattered, everybody knew what you meant, it was perfectly understandable as it was.

I really really need to stop referring to women by hair color, not a very good thing to be teaching my kids - both sons. ugh, that's going to take some doing. Not quite Trump territory, but I've always known it's wrong.

@rjejr No worries man, I didn't perceive it like that at all, so no toes stepped on as far as I am concerned.

And as for blondes, well, they have had that mixed reputation of being dumb as well as being bombshells for as long as I can remember. Same as "the fiery redhead" and "the sultry brunette". Or something to that extent...

I think it will be hard to get rid of that yourself: we're both well over forty, old dogs and all that, but it should be easier to not learn that to your kids, same as you don't discuss certain things in front of them or (hopefully) not swear in front of them, if ever...

As for your mistyping of the leading topic on this site: I have to admit that I'm more or less used to it now, although it still baffles me to a degree how you manage to only misspell Nintendo, and not all the other words in the sentence, and therefore I can certainly imagine how some new subscribers would look at it...
Trump? Yegh... It's too bad that ugly a-holes like that always manage to come into money instead of the thousands of hard working people that actually deserve it and do have a brain that functions and are able to make complete sentences without insulting half of the nation...

'R Wing'? Seriously?

Anyway, I am surprised how much I grew to love my little gamepad, even refusing to play my Wii U until I had fixed the screen after it fell off of my desk even if some of my games would still work without it. It's my preferred screen for GBA VC games, and I still love the games that put your inventory on the gamepad while the main action is on the TV. (Shantae Pirates Curse and Windwaker are sterling examples) The asymmetric gameplay that the gamepad afforded me was second to nothing I had ever played, and because of it's simple brilliance will likely live on in my household as a go-to system long after it has been taken off store shelves and put into other friend's closets.

It's just a shame that it took this long for developers to really tap into what it could do, but I figure we still have a good year at least of interesting examples of what makes the system unique.

The only game that uses the gamepad well is the minigame Gamer. NintendoLand uses the gamepad but I do not think it really adds much to the fun experience to the existing game.

@GreatPlayer No, the difference between creativity and innovation is that innovation is a stronger version of creativity. Creativity is something new and original. Innovation is something new and original that changes an established convention.

@TheRealThanos Thanks for the history lesson. I was throwing casual gamer around just like a fanboy label. I think I have a better understanding of the term now.

@aronatvw ???

if I think I know what your asking for, Sonic & Sega all stars racing transformed offers that, also you still can in mk8 but you'd be seeing both screens or more on your pad I think... With sonic you can have up to 5p at once and not limited to 4p. JS

@Superryanworld You're more than welcome. I may be well over forty and slightly insane, but every now and then, something that's actually useful erupts from my brain...
I can understand where you're coming from though: the context of the words sort of changes through the years either because of misunderstanding, misuse or simply because it actually does mean something else nowadays.
Another example is next gen; throw that into a conversation and entire battles over what it actually means are unleashed. Is it simply a word to designate the next generation of consoles or is it a console that has had such a significant upgrade that its features (and most importantly of course: its graphics) are truly groundbreaking aka "next gen"?
Take your pick...

the gamepad is great zombi and the wii u version of deus ex really showcased what it can do. people need to stop trying to keep things so stayle and looking down on it when something new is tried. I love seeing new innovations like the gamepad plus off tv play is great

@Peach64 are you not getting confused the ps 3 never did of tv play the ps 4 did with the vita and what came first ps 4 or wii u so no I thing Nintendo were first

Gamepad in game design terms was the only innovation. It created the opportunity for asymmetric local multiplayer and for 4 dimensional single-player. The issue is that kind of game design takes serious chops and all the game design professionals left video games for board games. The people that are left are great at rehashing old designs or limited real-world simulations, but don't have the ability to innovate game design. Nintendo Land and Scribblenauts were amazing games, but no one is buying them because the vast majority of video game consumers aren't gamers, they are escapists. They want their interactive entertainment experiences to be immersive enough to remove them from reality. The popularity of VR solutions reflects that attitude. NX might be popular if it is a low msrp per unit product environment that is geared toward games as a group activity. If it tries the high-end graphic powerhouse console approach with "life style" feature they will just split the existing market and while better than Wii U sales it will not offer the success of Wii.

@darth2d2 You could have easily left out the last bit, since no console is going to do better than the Wii, because that was indeed a marketing fluke, or a surprise attack, if you will. Other than that, you bring up some interesting points and I do feel like an escapist sometimes, starting up a game to play away all the frustrations of another day in the real world...

@TheRealThanos. Don't forget that gaming happens outside of a TV. I would say that a sports enthusiasts, like people that do fantasy/simulated sports management, are hardcore gamers. I think hardcore gamers are those that look at a game analytically instead of as just a form of entertainment. I work and am friends with a lot of analytical gamers and we spend half our time discussing the balance and design of everything from Splatoon to Baseball. Casual gamers are in it for entertainment only, right? They are also in every type of game. The people playing mini-golf and not keeping score are casual gamers and consume games as a source of entertainment, not for competition. Skyrim is a casual game because it doesn't demand that you practice to accomplish. It may not have to be mature, but a hardcore gamer invests time because hardcore games require time. Hardcore gamers are a different type of consumer in general. My favorite example of hardcore gamers are the Games Workshop guys. No matter how acceptable wizards, vampires, or WOW becomes those guys at the table playing Warhammer 40k arguing about mechanics are as hardcore as it gets.

@TheRealThanos. Hahahaha, indeed it will be hard to repeat, but I wouldn't call it a fluke. It hit all the points that we have so far been able to identify as increasing dopamine and serotonin responses across a majority of people. Simple muscle movement controls combined with games that encouraged positive and structured group activity, often with mechanics that raised heart rate. In the states the Wii was replaced with a game we call Bag-O or Cornhole. It is similar to how my parents played horseshoes or bocce ball. It is a gaming concept that is reproduced successfully, albeit in different mediums. If Nintendo could make a Wii that you could use in the sunshine that would hit the endorphin trifecta.

In other news, water is wet, and Meowth really hates that kind of water.

@darth2d2 Besides all the slightly too much for me analytical way of looking at gaming, we actually agree on casual and hardcore, because I said the same things in general, only without all the fancy words. I already have to use way more of those than I like when I'm at work, so I like to keep my hobbies simple and relaxing, so I would have no interest whatsoever in discussing "the design and balance" of a game. Just thinking about it already makes me tired.

To me it's all about playing the games and being on sites like this. When I discuss games with my friends, we just talk about what we like or don't like and what games we play at the moment or what games are coming up. Most info on the latter comes from me. (we're all over 40 and I'm practically the only one that watches the E3 live as it happens, to name but one example)

But back on the part where we agreed: I said casuals only game every now and then or game to have some fun and are either not that good at it (or maybe only in a few types of games) and hardcore gamers invest way more time, know more about it and are generally quite good at it, so yeah, like I said: we actually agreed for the most part.

FYI: I'm a sales & marketing professional and from that point of view, at the very least sales-wise, the Wii was definitely a fluke. No one thought an SD console with motion controls was going to perform that well against two HD consoles, so it was kind of like dropping a sales bomb.

Never heard of Bag-O, but then again, I haven't been Stateside in over 20 years and I've been living here for more than 35 years now.

The main thing that bothers me about the gamepad is the inability to turn the screen off. That makes no sense for games that actually utilize it, zombiu for example (One of my favorite games of all time by the way - just needed a little polishing for the sequel that unfortunately isn't going to happen). But games like New Super Mario where the main screen is just cloned. I can turn off my tv if I want to play on the gamepad, but can't turn off the gamepad if I want to play on the TV. Which is all the time - the TV screen is superior quality and resolution. Also the gamepad doesn't work reliably far away, so I can't play in my bedroom across the house, defeating the purpose.

Too little too late. NX has been announced, so the only thing that will convince people to invest in a WiiU at this point is a major price drop. If people didn't buy a WiiU for NSMBU or or 3D World, Mario Maker isn't going to sell it to them. I love Star Fox, but I also have to agree that it's probably not going to be a system seller.

Personally, I think they gyro controls are going to be a bit too complicated/imprecise for Star Fox. And looking at two screens wastes time when I want to shoot the baddies as quickly as possible - so it seems immersion is a tradeoff for gameplay here. I'll give them a spin, but I'm not optimistic.

Unfortunately, I DO love the gamepad, mainly for off-tv play. I hope that feature doesn't die and the gamepad is usable on the NX (though I appreciate devs don't want to waste time on a feature perhaps few will use). I love it for VC games especially, so if at least those retained off-tv play on the NX, that'd be sweet!

@TheRealThanos Ahhhh, yes that is understandable. When considering market trends with the then established demographic I can see the Wii as a fluke. The Wii almost begs to be redefined as a different type of product all together apart from video game consoles. The design emulated the experience a person has with games at an amusement park with your motions being restricted to above the waist, but it's electronic nature expanded content and convenience while reducing price. It really was more electronic amusement than it was a video game console. The PS3 and Xbox360 were stuck as video game consoles in public perception even after the introductions of Kinect and Move partially due to the price of the systems and partially due to their initial dedication to their established demographic. I think the Wii U is under performing because it was Nintendo trying to usher their new electronic amusement consumers into the video game world. I don't think you could reproduce the Wii success without expanding on the peripherals in a non-traditional direction. The Gamepad is too much of a "hey I am a video game console" message. A headset isn't really socially acceptable enough for the Wii consumers either, but maybe a holographic system like the ones they have in Japan instead of a TV would test well with groups. Either way I think Nintendo was intentionally on to something with the Wii, they just had a hard time abandoning their video game roots and took a step back with the Wii U. The data was there to support the Wii, it was just abstract and buried. When boardwalks were popular in the US in 80s and 70s the largest attractions where the rides, then the amusement games, and then the arcade. Disney probably makes more money today in theme park goods and services than they do in video games and arcades. People like feeling that they are being social and active. If they can do that in the comfort of their own home, especially with alcohol or their children, then a quality product providing that will sell. Bag-O by the way is a backyard amusement that involves throwing a small bean bag into a hole from a distance. It, like the Wii was once, is now at almost every large gathering I go to and has a propensity to be enjoyed in tandem with alcohol. Fortunately it doesn't end in broken televisions.

@darth2d2 Funny thing is that you say that motions were restricted to above the waist, but it is even more minimal than that: Wii tennis can easily be played sitting/lying in a chair and only flicking your wrist and most games, except for some Motion+ games, can be operated in a similar manner. ReviewTech USA once made a nice video about that.

If more people had known that, it would have saved a whole lot of TV sets or dislocated shoulders from swinging the Wiimote WAY too wildly...
(and apparently none of these accident prone Wiimote swingers have never heard of the wrist cord. I never had an accident with a Wiimote.)

And Bag-O: now that you've explained it, I do know that game, the name just didn't ring a bell. As for party games and alcohol: I know beer pong...

As for Nintendo: here's hoping that the NX truly will change things for the better for them. I think they absolutely deserve it, being the last true console manufacturer/game designer there is.

@TheRealThanos I also hope they turn it around. Fantasy Flight games are doing well enough keeping my friends around, but I would really like something that requires less space and set-up time. I am hoping NX starts with a reasonably priced portable that will double as controllers for a later home console solution. Gaming is in desperate need of a hardware ecosystem. If all else fails Razer is supposed to give me a deal on the Forge because I have an Ouya, but I would much rather have a solution that comes with Pokemon.

@darth2d2 Besides the fact that we still need some more info to truly determine what NX is or what the next big thing at Nintendo will be, I strongly feel that it will not be a handheld, for numerous reasons.

You'll hopefully forgive me for not writing down that whole story again, but if you're interested to find out and see what info I used to come to this conclusion, then read on from my following comment on another article.
https://www.nintendolife.com/news/2015/08/3ds_can_last_for_another_two_to_three_years_in_the_west_saysnnis_america_boss#comment3131309

In it, I discuss the very same topic with another member and I have sorted out everything we know so far and ruled out some improbabilities to reach a single conclusion.

You can skip through the comments to just pick out mine, but it is also quite interesting to read the discussion in its entirety.
If you do, let me know what you think about it. In my experience t's always interesting to exchange ideas.

@TheRealThanos I agree that the NX project is an ecosystem of products, much like Apple has done. I am not discounting the possibility of Nintendo smartphones in the future. However, I don't think they will use X86-64 architecture. X-86 is an extremely power hungry architecture. They have come about as far as they can with removing the south bridge and adding cache to the CPU. Outside of that issue X-86 is also a poor choice for communication between devices. X-86 was built to be a modular architecture, but that is about it.
The move to X86 for Playstation was really about pleasing the high-end consumers while making it profitable for publishers. They have already spent 60 million on the new Metal Gear. Imagine trying to sell a venture capitalist the idea of "I want to spend twice the budget of the original Toy Story to make a product for a market of about half of the size of the family movie market." Microsoft and Sony were forced into X86 because rising costs demanded publishers found a way to maximize the potential market for investors. Now publishers can publish on Steam, Xbox1, and PS4 with minimal additional investment in porting. They can also inflate their potential market numbers with investors. Obviously the smart investor knows that users are shared between the 3 devices in most cases and the market is roughly the same size. Initial hardware sales for Sony might seem promising now but it will slow down because content production will slow down. Konami is about to exit the stage, Sega's strongest sales were in mobile games, THQ folded, Deep Silver now only has Saint's Row performing, Focus Home is making smaller games, City Interactive is taking a beating, Crytek's Warface is under performing, Capcom is struggling to make something other than Street Fighter, which leaves Ubisoft, EA, Activision/Blizzard, 2K, and Warner Brothers to carry the financial burden of content production for PS4 and Xbox1. If I am an investor I see more potential gain in Mobile Software IPO than there is in existing console publishers. Even some developers are seeing better sales on Google Play than they are on X86 systems. The developer of the game Sproggiewood sold more copies on Google Play in one week than he sold for the months his game was on Steam. When I see Sony brag about Towerfall (a game written for Android) and Kickstarter campaigns I see a company searching for content wherever they can find it. It is clever, but often clever is what is left when the best options are off the table.
From a sales point of view, when Playstation did so well growing with PS1 and PS2 on a RISC instruction set, then Apple repeated that success with RISC on a smartphone, and tablet and smart device gaming is competing (in some opinions winning) for highest installed user base for gaming devices then the obvious move for Nintendo is to stick with RISC, but probably move to ARM or ARM-compatible and away from PowerPC.
Backwards compatibility between X86 and RISC requires emulation, which you may think is an option, but emulation is a time-consuming proposition. Honestly I think backwards compatibility is dead. Gamestop's opening of retro game sales is a sign that the market has reached the age of nostalgia. The youth don't get it and the elders will pay for it. Emulation is a middle-ground that will have limited uses. It is like companies that sell Kit Cars, build-a-car kits that are emulations of classic cars. It is a niche business that focuses on providing product substitution for products that have an increasingly low supply. If the cost of buying a working SNES and Final Fantasy 3 cartridge rise too much some people may be willing to pay for an emulation, but more people would be willing to by a remake that is made from the ground-up with prettier graphics or more features. The others that can afford it will spring for the value of nostalgia that the authentic product provides.
Without the worry of backwards compatibility and with the market supporting mobile (just the very mention of it raises their stock prices) then the logical business move for Nintendo is creating a gaming platform that works with mobile as directly as possible which means they cannot move to X86. X86 to mobile doesn't just require porting, it often requires writing entirely new code to handle new user input. X-86 is also a headache when trying to make a portable solution because it is incredibly inefficient.
Nintendo will probably try to make an ARM-compatible system that gives the developers the option of using traditional controls, touch controls, or motion controls. Foxconn doesn't make AMD-propriety systems and I doubt they would make the investment to tool their shops to make them. If Nintendo uses them like it is rumored then Nintendo is sticking to RISC, but probably not PowerPC.
Another important point to remember is that Nintendo talking to third-parties about NX at E3 could be about Nintendo moving to ARM. If I am Nintendo I am talking to EA about their mobile business and their ROI in mobile vs. their ROI in large ticket products like console games. Console makers are like suppliers for developers. They supply them with a piece that they need to make their games. The change in relationship has changed the way they have to approach third-parties. In engineering you have to approach a client and either give them a product that competes with an existing product at a lower-cost, a product that gives them extra performance that they need for higher-end products, or you offer them a product that fills a gap in cost vs. performance. Right now there is a huge gap in the gaming market between smartdevice gaming cost and console gaming performance. Indie developers and publishers prefer the low-cost of making smartdevice games, but their current client base doesn't take smartdevice gaming seriously. The PC crowd is the luxury number crowd and they will spend a ridiculously large amount of money for needlessly large performance numbers and they aren't going to deviate from that view. Console gamers, however, are more casual and will buy entertainment before performance. Nintendo is going to try to supply a product to developers that helps them bridge that gap and move their casual console players into the low-cost realm of ARM-based gaming. They aren't using Android, but ARM can easily be confused with Android so I am sure there was validity to that rumor as well.

@darth2d2 Always nice to have an intelligent conversation and you certainly seem to know what you're talking about.

But first a small tip: if you make giant walls of text (something I myself am also frequently guilty of) then it would make for a lot easier reading to put some spaces in between the text. I don't know if this works for everybody, but simply selecting the edit button for your comment and then saving the text again without changing anything should add spaces automatically...

As for your comment on ARM vs x86: I suppose this could definitely work, I was just trying to work out all the rumors pros and cons towards them using either one and/or Android. The Android one was already debunked after a day. First this article was posted: http://www.engadget.com/2015/06/01/nintendo-nx-android/
And the next day, Nintendo themselves were very quick to respond: http://www.forbes.com/sites/insertcoin/2015/06/02/no-nintendos-nx-will-not-be-running-on-android/

Then there's this and similar articles where the x86 suspicions come from: http://venturebeat.com/2015/07/16/more-hints-that-amd-is-building-nintendo-nxs-processor/
This one is a bit more elaborate, although it also makes the wrong assumption that it will be a combo of x86 and an Android OS, but it still offers some useful points: http://www.computing.co.uk/ctg/news/2418579/nintendo-to-go-with-android-and-amd-for-make-or-break-console
Then there's this two page article that sums up all the rumors and things that are more or less confirmed: http://www.techradar.com/news/gaming/nintendo-nx-release-date-news-and-rumors-1289401

Also, like I already suggested in the discussion that I linked to, why would any third party that is significant enough for Nintendo for them to try and get them back by showing them their new concept be enthusiastic for yet another alien architecture, or a hybrid or even a handheld one?

I really struggle to wrap my commercial head around that one, so in my mind it MUST be something that is similar or something that at least offers third parties some real opportunities to once again make money on a Nintendo platform, and that equates to a platform that is easy to develop for, easy to port to and one that has a good chance of selling like hot cakes so they can definitely make a profit on their games and make more than just a return on investment.

Could ARM be that solution? I don't know and I also don't know if that is what would make third parties go "Yes! Welcome back, Nintendo. We will make games for you once again" unless they can tick all the boxes that I just mentioned.

As for emulation: have you ever tried the Dolphin emulator? It runs like a dream, even on a modest PC (anything from Core Duo, 2,4Ghz CPU, 8Gb RAM approximately. I even got it running on 4Gb, although choppy)
Besides that it gives you the option to upscale GameCube and Wii graphics, and there are also a lot of mods with high texture packs available making games look very close to Wii U games.

Something like that could be an option and Dolphin runs on Android too, so it could also run on ARM, I suppose.

I agree with you that x86 would definitely not be good for a handheld so if it is supposed to be a hybrid/two-in-one system then that could be a bottle neck. But there are options to make an OS that is compatible with two kinds of hardware. Then again: Iwata did say that the new OS would mean that both handheld and console would be like brothers, so that once again points to one architecture to me.

But will that architecture be strong enough and competitive enough if it isn't similar to the other two? If not then we will once again have the third party problem and the danger of another failed console, something that they could still survive but obviously shouldn't go for.

All that keeps bringing me back to the similar architecture train of thought and where does AMD come into the story if they are making them a custom chip set (although AMD obviously also makes ARM processors).

The Venturebeat article provides quotes that point to both (x86 and ARM) being used, so that could be x86 for the console and ARM for the handheld part, but your elaborate story has made me doubt that to some extent. (as if my head wasn't already hurting enough from all these damn rumors and confirmed or denied articles)

Patience is normally my strong suit, but in this case I definitely wouldn't mind fast forwarding six months or so...

@TheRealThanos Sorry about the wall of text. Still have not adapted to the way the forum formats the comments.

The Android thing makes me think Nintendo is leaning toward ARM because Nintendo specifically said "We are not using Android" which is obvious because Android is an OS on top of ARM. However, Nintendo didn't take it a step further and say "We are not using ARM and so Android is out." That makes me think Nintendo is using ARM for at least the portable side.

For third parties ARM is a better solution because it is cheaper to make games for. Rockstar and EA already have a catalog of original and ported games for ARM architecture that are doing quite well without the investment of a X86 quality game.

Dolphin is interesting, but you must remember that people invest time to port games to that type of solution. While looking for a reason that Nintendo didn't port Pokemon titles to the Wii U I found an article addressing the cost of porting. It is easy to forget in the odd world of free roms and mods that someone is actually doing the work of making those items for free. Apparently porting can take a lot of time for a studio and in Game Freaks' case Nintendo would prefer they use those resources to make new Pokemon games instead of porting old ones.

ARM is actually stronger than X86. Processing power per nanometer in ARM is ridiculously larger in comparison. The problem is that it has been a rather expensive technology until the past year or so. NVIDIA's K1 technology is running 1080p games with advanced shader technology with proprietary texture compression software to improve loading times. A lot of engineers disagreed with Sony's move to X86 because of how dated and limited the technology is even compared to Sony's Cell Processor architecture.

As far as AMD's claims I like to remind people that it is in AMD's best interest to use Nintendo's silence to build hype about their portfolio. You may have noticed in that article that AMD is claiming that they have two major design contracts. AMD also has an ARM server chip coming out in 2017 which would more likely be used for cloud computing solutions. If they have big contracts it is more likely that they are going to be with Steam and Gamefly as Steam needs a Linux-friendly solution for Steam OS (which AMD is) and Gamefly needs a budget solution for their game streaming servers.

Nintendo would be foolish to use AMD for a portable anyway because AMD is years behind Qualcomm and NVIDIA in solving the problems of portability. In fact AMD is generally late to the ARM architecture side of things and in R&D terms a few months are enough to lose a patent and years of development. The AMD rumor all-around doesn't make sense because it also puts the breaks on releasing in China because under the current law the product still has to be produced in China to be sold in China. Nintendo had an easy-in with Foxconn made chipsets and I doubt they are going to let that go. In fact it would seem that Nintendo's general console release schedule change with Wii U almost perfectly aligned Nintendo's next console release with China's new policy on gaming devices. They look like they will be in China with a new console before Sony or Microsoft.

As for a hybrid of X86 and ARM I doubt that will happen just because it requires porting for developers. Nintendo will want developers to be able to use the portable for Off-TV play and the big screen for high resolution or possibly second screen uses. I think Nintendo is going to capitalize on Sony's failed attempt to do the "Take the game on the road" thing that they did with the Vita. Part of the Vita's problem was the cost of porting a PS3 game to the Vita. They expected the consumer to bear the burden of the cost by purchasing two full-price versions, one for console and one for portable, and $100.00 on one game was just too much. Nintendo will solve that by having a single architecture across the portable and the home console so one game can be used on both systems.

I think Nintendo has been building up to this so I am pretty confident we will at least see a hybrid system. They were working on it with the Gamecube, then they developed motion controls with the Wii, then they merged a motion-controlled portable with a console with the Wii U. The past three generations of Nintendo consoles are like public release R&D systems. A big part of it was waiting for the technology to come down in price so they could execute this without taking a risk with a loss leader.

Either way I guarantee that the NX will change the entire way people think about the entire industry. Recently the writers of popular publications have been butchering the business and engineering aspects of game consoles and have in turn hurt the industry by making it murky. Honestly I can't think of a single industry that applies the term "generation" over an entire industry. In the auto industry (and just about every other one) the term generation is used to describe a significant change in a model of a product that continues carrying the same badge. For example the Volvo S40 had a first generation through 2004 and a second generation through 2012, but that doesn't mean that BMW also released a new M1 at the same times. It is ridiculous to do that with gaming and I appreciate Nintendo for deviating from the expectations of the lazy and uneducated game journal media. It is almost as if every Senior Editor for these VG media sites happened upon an episode of "Top Gear" and thought "oh, that is how you run a consumer report journal". I digress, but I think it is time Nintendo, if not someone else, took the industry and shook the nonsense out of it with a message of "this is how you make a console for people that love to play games." I am hoping the NX will be that shake. If it is it will worth the wait.

@darth2d2 No need to apologize; I had to get used to editing my walls of text as well.

Well, you achieved at least one thing: ARM is now firmly nestled in the forefront of my brain as a very likely candidate.
I also like your idea of a Nintendo version of Sony's failed attempt to do the "Take the game on the road" thing, I really wonder if they would be able to pull that off successfully, seeing as Nintendo's handhelds are always a huge step behind their home consoles.

In the case of Dolphin, their is no need for porting: all you need is a rip of the original on a disc or in an iso format on your PC, so if Nintendo would go for emulation, all they would have to do is stick the original game on a disc or make it a downloadable iso on your NX's hard drive and it could then be loaded into the emulator, since that program in itself takes care of providing the right environment for the NX so it could read the disc.

And like I said: Dolphin runs on x86 as well as on Android so whichever solution Nintendo will choose, it will definitely be a possibility. It could also be interesting if Nintendo bought the company that made the program, adds some changes to prevent piracy (like making a newer version of the program that is not compatible anymore with the older ones).

But knowing Nintendo they would rather make their own program if they are still planning to provide for backwards compatibility, and a small part of my brain even reserves the possibility of another system on a chip, although that will probably not happen because of the decline of PowerPC technology.

Or they could solve that with ARM, since that still has some ties to the whole RISC architecture...

As far as Sony and Microsoft are concerned: you make it sound like them going for x86 is more of a quick fix than a solid solution, so that would possibly mean that if they will make another dedicated console after this that they will go for something else as well.

The AMD story still needs some fleshing out and that will probably happen in the coming 5 to 6 months, and then we may know a bit more. I can't imagine them making a chip for the Amazon box, they were hinting at a real console, and to me the Amazon thing doesn't qualify and neither does the Steam Box. And AMD = Steam? I didn't get that one. I remember reading something somewhere about Steam enabled games running on AMD but other than that...

Interesting point on the public R&D thing that Nintendo seems to do with its consoles. They do indeed have a tendency to reuse a part of the technology that they had in their next consoles. But it is a bit more nuanced, because sometimes that tech is also left unused. A nice example is the GameCube having a 3D chip that was going to be implemented in some way but in the end that never happened, even though the chip was never removed.

The technology also wasn't used in the Wii and in the end, the first time we ever saw 3D tech (not counting the Virtual Boy) again was in the 3DS, so they transferred the idea from the home console to the portable one.

And the whole generation thing continues to baffle me too. For me the term next gen simply always pointed to something new, unseen, interesting. so a next gen console should offer you all these things, but then somewhere along the way someone decided that next gen was supposed to be HD, Dolby 5.1 and super realistic graphics so even though the Wii was indeed something new, unseen and definitely interesting, it didn't "qualify" as next gen because of the SD graphics, the wacky controls and the kiddy games. So apparently we can change the meaning of words or a label at will. Go figure...

And I fully agree with you that the industry needs a kick in the behind so let's hope that Nintendo does indeed come up with something exciting.
They did say it would once again change the way we play and how we think of consoles, but I do hope it's not too alien again or else we will be stuck in the same hole again for another "generation"... (sorry for that, the word seems to be carved into my brain, maybe we should replace it with "console run" although that also sounds rather lame... )

And what's with that emoji? is that a monkey? I wish we would have stuck to smileys, nowadays there are so many of these things that I hardly know what some of them mean anymore...

@TheRealThanos hahaha, the emoji is apparently the "see no evil" emoji. I used it as there isn't an appropriate "wait and see" emoji.

The AMD making a Steambox chip is my assumption based on the fact that Steam OS is actually a modified Linux OS and not Windows. Nvidia favors Windows and Direct X technology while AMD tries to straddle the fence. With the failures of several attempts at a modular Steambox I would expect that Gabe Newell is going to have someone (probably AMD) make a closed-box solution. It is a long shot, but if AMD won the Steam Wars I think it would have a larger impact than winning Nintendo.

As far as Gamefly I just thought it made sense because AMD is gambling big on a major ARM-based server chip they say will be ready in 2017. Server chips aren't a home consumer product. Without a corporate account ready to consume a large amount of servers I can't imagine AMD spending so much money on something it doesn't seem there is a lot of demand for. I know a lot of Information Managers and most companies haven't made the switch to blade servers, so a new technology offering convenience for cost seems odd without a client ready to buy a bulk of them.

That being said, maybe AMD is make an ARM Server that will be cheap enough to make a home server solution? Maybe the two halves of NX will be an AMD-made portable with an AMD home server? That might be interesting.

@darth2d2 Hm, who knows? (Nintendo, obviously)
But while I mull that over for a bit, here's a little something for you to pass the time with. A friend sent it to me and I thought it might add something to our talk since the article couldn't be more relevant even if it tried...
http://gamingbolt.com/nintendo-nx-hardware-specs-games-third-party-support-and-everything-you-need-to-know
And in the meantime I'm also trying to find the time to watch this 2,5 hour documentary (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Z4ou9rOssPg) that Kirk shared with me in the Nintendo dismissing Chris Pranger article, since I am apparently one of the very few ones that is willing to try and have a normal conversation with him, even though he is slightly negative minded...

@TheRealThanos " since I am apparently one of the very few ones that is willing to try and have a normal conversation with him, even though he is slightly negative minded..."

To be honest, it's understandable why others didn't want to discuss with him. He was being very rude and emotional in his discussion. You really are probably one of the very few people who can handle carrying a discussion like that.

@Aromaiden Must be something that comes with age. I am not so quick to be angered anymore, once I am, it's the other way around as well, but that's another story. As for the topic at hand: for starters, let's change "very rude" to "very passionate" (and a little unaware of other people's toes) and that'll go a long way to stay calm and continue to be able to communicate instead of starting to become angry yourself. Everyone of us is a different person, so you simply cannot expect everyone to act like you or have the same morals and values.

@TheRealThanos That's a nice way of putting it, but it sounds a bit like your sugar coating it (no offense intended). In reality I never expect anyone to share my beliefs, values, or ideals considering it's relatively impossible in a world as large and as diverse as ours. Although I do expect a reasonable person to show respect for the ideals and beliefs of others.

@Aromaiden Not to be smart about it, but although I get you, you will know the difference once you start to get around my age, or somewhere in your thirties. Although I also know some younger people that are more thoughtful, it is usually something that I only find in people of my generation.

And I've always been very social to begin with, so I'm even more relaxed now, so I wasn't sugarcoating, it is exactly how I feel and how I see it. Another thing that came to me with age: seeing no reason whatsoever to beat around the bush but just say what you mean and mean what you say. I don't feel the need anymore to pretend or to show off, I'm just me.
And I think no matter what age, most of us can agree that there are WAY more important things in life than getting frustrated or irritated over some comments on a gaming website, yet another reason to not mind people acting the way they do sometimes, be it online or even in real life. Have a good one, I'm off to bed...

@TheRealThanos Have a good one.

@TheRealThanos It was an interesting article from Gamingbolt. There were some issues with the writer's technical knowledge. Playstation 3 for example is not PowerPC, but rather a modified and proprietary RISC architecture that uses a PowerPC chip.

Also their reference regarding Iwata denying a hybrid system you will notice that he doesn't deny it at all.

"In this perspective, while we are only going to be able to start this with the next system, it will become important for us to accurately take advantage of what we have done with the Wii U architecture. It of course does not mean that we are going to use exactly the same architecture as Wii U, but we are going to create a system that can absorb the Wii U architecture adequately." Architecture at the base level is all about how a system's pieces communicate. The most important part about the Wii U architecture that they would need to "absorb" is the two screen functionality with a touch screen controller. Essentially to minimize porting a game the hardware on two platforms have to mimic each other's user input and output. A lot of programmers ran into this issue when porting their Google Play games to the Ouya because the user input was different (controller vs. capacitive touch) and output was different (horizontal vs upright).

"When this happens, home consoles and handheld devices will no longer be completely different, and they will become like brothers in a family of systems.
Still, I am not sure if the form factor (the size and configuration of the hardware) will be integrated. In contrast, the number of form factors might increase."

This is misleading because Nintendo has never limited itself when it comes to form factor. The 3DS had a completely different form factor than the 2DS and a slightly different form factor than 3DSXL.

"Currently, we can only provide two form factors because if we had three or four different architectures, we would face serious shortages of software on every platform." This actually supports a hybrid system. A hybrid system is a system that shares architecture so not only can they easily port software, but also easily communicate between each device simply. If I have an A-button input on my portable and my home console has an address for A-button communications it is possible to not only use my portable as a controller, but also stream my games from my console to my portable.

"To cite a specific case, Apple is able to release smart devices with various form factors one after another because there is one way of programming adopted by all platforms. Apple has a common platform called iOS. Another example is Android. Though there are various models, Android does not face software shortages because there is one common way of programming on the Android platform that works with various models. The point is, Nintendo platforms should be like those two examples. Whether we will ultimately need just one device will be determined by what consumers demand in the future, and that is not something we know at the moment. However, we are hoping to change and correct the situation in which we develop games for different platforms individually and sometimes disappoint consumers with game shortages as we attempt to move from one platform to another, and we believe that we will be able to deliver tangible results in the future."

This wraps it up in a nice, vague bow. He pretty much says that he wants the systems to share the same OS and the same input/output schemes. However he doesn't elaborate on the issue of hardware differences between different Android and Apple devices, with many apps suffering from bugs and crashes post-release because of hardware differences. What is more vague is the fact that he leaves the possibility of only a single device depending on consumer demand.

The only thing we can draw from Iwata is that they want, essentially, an OS that acts like middleware. They want an OS that makes porting to multiple devices very easy. IOS is actually driven by a modified version of the C-programming language and it makes porting more difficult than it needs to be. That approach would alienate third parties. Middleware support has really helped support software catalogs across both IOS and Android, but the drawback is middleware is limiting and inefficient because it is an additional layer of code over two other layers of code.

Despite all of the things that Iwata said and these publications report, Nintendo never does what is expected. Market analysts are usually wrong and rumor mills more so when it comes to The Big N. I look back to what they have done rather than what they say they will do. They have been working on a portable meets console solution for too long to ditch it. They are diversifying their portfolio with Quality of Life products which they have built a knack at doing with Wii and Wii U Fit, essentially removing those peripherals from their core gaming demographic. They guard licensing with Disney like tenacity. The Gameboy in all it's iterations is the best selling console in history, with Tetris being the best selling game partially because it was bundled with the original Gameboy.

If business sense prevails Nintendo will make a gaming dedicated handheld that pairs with a television solution. It will be multiplayer focused and will integrate a social platform. It will deviate from Sony and Xbox because Nintendo probably feels that the traditional 16 button input with two analog sticks is too complicated for a large market. The architecture may be a modified version of ARM made specifically to work well with their OS. AMD will not be making the chip for the handheld because Nintendo will not need a large amount of graphic processing on a small handheld screen. AMD might make a GPU for their TV solution. Nintendo will probably release several cross-licensed titles at launch because they are baiting third-parties to make exclusive software for Nintendo products with Nintendo licences. They will also have a lot of prominent indie devs talking about the accessibility of developing for the NX during the next E3. The largest draw will be pricing. It has to be cheap for Nintendo to sell and cheaper for Nintendo to make. I am going to guess it will release with a price of about 120 Euro/$135 US. Because it is a portable they will stay below the $150.00 mark. They might sell a TV solution for $200 to $250 USD or $230 Euro, with portables doubling as controllers to make local multiplayer seem more accessible in price. They ultimately aim for the portable, TV solution, and Quality of Life products to create a line of products to fit every member of the family.