Slightly Mad Studios recently launched Project CARS on next-gen consoles and PC to positive reviews and encouraging sales. A truly unique racing title, it was crowdfunded by the community in a process which pre-dated the now-popular Kickstarter approach.
The route to market has been a long one, and along the way the proposed PS3 and Xbox 360 versions were dropped. However, the Wii U version remained on track - although it was stated that it would launch after the other editions of the game.
This week, a bombshell was dropped on the official forums for the game. Slightly Mad Studio Head Ian Bell posted a comment which appeared to cast doubt on the Wii U edition; Bell revealed that performance problems were impacting development and suggested that the team would be waiting on any E3 announcements surrounding the Nintendo NX system before making any further commitment.
Predictably, this caused something of an uproar among Nintendo fans, many of which felt aggrieved at the fact that this much-delayed game - which Slightly Mad has repeatedly maintained is still coming - may never arrive on the Wii U. Some also pointed out that Slightly Mad should refund those who funded the game in the expectation of getting a Nintendo version.
Bell has since been in touch to set the record straight regarding the Wii U version of Project CARS, and is keen to point out that funding took place when it was only confirmed for the PC, and therefore nobody should have pledged money in the expectation of a console release:
Project CARS/Weapons of Mass Development opened funding initially as a Free to Play PC only Racing game. This is when the bulk of the funding arrived. Funding was closed late 2013.
By vote of the members, it changed to a boxed product PC/Xbox 360/PS3 and 'maybe Wii U' game. It was always 'maybe' as we had no knowledge of the system.
It was again changed, by vote of the members, to a PC/Xbox One/PS4 next gen game with still 'maybe Wii U' and Steam OS. The funding, as I said above, was closed long before this.
We still haven't given up on Wii U 100% but if we can't make it work we will move to the next Nintendo machine.
So there you have it - the Wii U version was always 'maybe' rather than a dead certainty. Do you think we'll ever see the game on the console now? Share your thoughts below.
Comments 278
... sir, I stand utterly disappointed.
I'm expecting them announcing the Wii U version being cancelled in around a month.
This communication line is so weak. These guys need to take a PR lesson from Mercedes F1 - You made a massive mistake, fess up, cancel the game, then we can all put the whole mess behind us and move on ASAP.
It's just not happening then, funny how they somehow think NX is being announced at e3 and released next year. Uh, nope! Doubt it
Uh, what? It was never a 'maybe'. It was a promise. The Wii U version was the most wanted version. People funded it so that they could play it on their Wii Us.
"Please, understand."
At least disclose that you have that amount of knowledge on the system.
Though, that said, Nintendo should've approached them too.
After playing on PC, I can see how sadly the WiiU would do this game no justice, we don't even have analog acceleration/braking, it would be no fun at all for a simulation racing game.
Also, refund.
Just refund if you aren't going to give a Wii U version. They paid for a Wii U version, they're supposed to get a Wii U version.
A partial refund would be fine in my book.
I thought the Kickstarter was for both PC and Wii U??? If so, then that's not a maybe. That was a certainty.
I'd say it's slightly more likely we'll get Tomb Raider, Mortal Kombat, Grand Theft Auto V, The Witcher III, and Call of Duty: Black Ops III on Wii U.
More succinctly, no, I do not believe Project Cars will ever be released on Wii U or any other Nintendo platform. It is dead.
Unfortunately I doubt people will see a refund.
Perhaps if they hadn't spent months and months talking up the Wii U version, talking up their commitment to it...and spent more time being honest and saying it might come, that the Wii U version was a maybe...perhaps people would feel less betrayed and pissed off.
@BinaryFragger
That's what bugs me about this too. Sometime last year they also said they were committed to making the Wii U version just as good as the PS4, XB1 and PC versions....
I love the GT series on PS so I was excited when I first heard about this game, when it was initially slotted for Wii U. I felt uneasy about it being delayed beyond the other versions but still optimistic. Now I'm sure that it's DOA, Nintendo has already stated that at this year's E3, they will not even talk about NX at all.
Doublespeak kills customer faith. They won't see a penny of my money now.
None of you guys would have bought this game anyway so quit acting like spoilt children
I never cared about this game. No NX talk this E3 so that makes no sense to wait.
Ichiban: You understand that people can have an opinion on a game without being interested in purchasing it right? What we're discussing is more the politics side of SMS treatment of the Wii U version and how it ties in to the wider discussion on third party treatment of the Wii U.
So it's looking very iffy for Project Cars coming to the Wii U and imo if it doesn't come to the Wii U then it probably won't happen for NX either because by that point it will just be too late for anyone to care.
Hopefully they have learned from this and will be more open and honest during their next projects. Dissappointing, but what more can we do? It's not gonna happen now. And I don't want to buy an expensive PC for this, nor a PS4/XBone. Would defenitely have gotten it on Wii U.
@Ichiban I could bring up the poll on their own website, but you know what? Whether they would've bought this game or not is quite frankly irrelevant. A developer flat out lied and deceived potential customers and Kickstarter backers. This is the bottom line
Ffs!!! They never once said maybe!! It was "we know Nintendo fans are desperate for this new racing game cos there's none like it on the system so we're going to take our time and make the best game possible" not MAYBE!!!!!!!!!!
Just hurry up with the NX and put the wii u out of its misery.
@Savino
That your computer can't handle their game--which has an 84% rating on Metacritic by the way--does not mean they're lazy. That is a false dichotomy.
While this is no doubt disappointing to the Nintendo fans, it's time to face reality: The Wii U is already in decline, 3rd parties were overwhelmingly ignored by the Nintendo fans, and the console is not going to pick up in sales. It's time to let this one go. This E3 will have a couple surprises, but Nintendo's very clearly stated goal with that recent Direct is to focus on DLC over new games as the system lingers for the next year and a half until NX launches.
It's not like this was going to be a big sales success on the Wii U anyway. It doesn't have Mario, Link, or Pokemon in it.
@Folkloner That was a tad harsh I admit, sorry if I offended.
@TheWPCTraveler
they say they plan to move it to NX if they can't get it to work on WiiU, I believe it's just a ruse, "hopefully they'll forget about it by then? Then we won't have to refund them!"
I understand why everybody is angry but quality of Project Cars on Wii U would be seriously compromised. Worse graphics, worse framerate and worse controls than on other current gen platforms. Maybe it's for the better. Hey, at least they don't say something like "haha, screw Nintendo" but look to the future to support the next console with what can become the best version of the game. And every Wii U fan will eventually buy NX anyway.
I ain't even...
"slightly mad".
Badum-tss.
I hope they hold it off for NX and NX is announced for November 2016.
Wii u is done and dusted apart from first party which is more than enough to sustain information another 18 months. Investing into anything huge on wii u now is pointless. Investors will just not see a worthwhile return as the userbase is too small. Edging things on 12 months and launching NX with an unbeatable launch line up is the best business strategy and will provide the best possible product to the consumer
@Kirk Wrong. A reworked version launched on day one of NX would sell and sell well.
If third parties are already sniffing at the NX then this is a killer turning point for Nintendo. Especially if they can launch in November 2016
@Quorthon alright negative Nancy, this article is about a developer changing their story/outright lying. At no point did the developer even mention sales but you are constantly bringing this up in every conversation."The Wii U is dead move on" well I'd suggest you take your own advice and move on. If you dislike Nintendo as much as you come off, you really should just drop them for your own sake. This kind of negativity can't be good for you and I for one could do without it. It'd be one thing if you had constructive criticism, but dude, don't get your panties in a bunch about a company you seemingly have little love for.
I did not read their original comment on Kickstarter, but if they did say "maybe" Wii U, then it should be subject to the funders to gamble whether it would arrive on Wii U or not.
Month and months ago I stated that I didn't believe this was anywhere complete as nothing was released to prove otherwise. No screen shots, no gameplay footage. The only WiiU video on YouTube was PC emulating WiiU settings.
This was never and will never be seen on WiiU or the next Nintendo system (whatever it will be called in 2017/18) as by then the game will be dated and likelyhood Slightly Mad studios will not exist having been bought up by Microsoft etc.
Had this on Pre Order since the date is showed as available on WiiU. Cancelled now.
The worst thing is the lies, but of late all developers of AAA titles allegedly coming to WiiU are guilty of this. Ubisoft for example with Watchdogs.
@Beechbone if the PS3 can pull off GT 5 and 6 graphics I'm sure the Wii U can at least do that kind of visual fidelity. Of course it won't be on par with PC but neither the XB1 or PS4 can say that either.
@DiscoGentleman I suppose that they could've worked with Nintendo to figure out what could be done with the optimization of their game.
It also comes off as a lost opportunity to me that this could've been a Wii U exclusive after the PS360 cancellations, oh well.
That's funny, Ian Bell is the name of an English Cricketer...
I wish this would put an end to all the kickstarter/crowdfunding articles about so and so getting a Wii u stretch goal and all this foolishness, If you haven't seen gameplay for a Wii u game then it shouldn't really be mentioned on these sites. It's just free advertising and these companies add these "stretch goals" without ever having the intention of making the game for Wii u just so they can get the attention of Nintendo fans (most of which will have the system that it IS coming out for). Stop giving free advertising and see the problem disappear.
@DESS-M-8 I'm not convinced.
"We still haven't given up on Wii U 100% but if we can't make it work we will move to the next Nintendo machine."
Ian,
No one wants your crummy 3 to 4 year old port on the NX. You failed on the Wii U and you will fail on the NX. Stop making excuses and just admit your talents are not good enough at this time.
I would love to see where exactly he said "maybe on the WiiU".
@theberrage There's no chance the NX is releasing later than 2017. Holiday 2016 seems most likely.
@firstnesfan
Being able to face reality has nothing to do with positivity or negativity.
You can either face reality or not. The game is struggling on the limited hardware, the sales are worse than the Dreamcast, and Nintendo fans have not been supportive of 3rd party efforts. Better for them to cut their losses.
Thinking positive is all well and good, but when one is doing it against reality, then one risks becoming delusional.
rekt.
@theberrage
Their talents created a game with an 84% average on Metacritic. The Wii U simply isn't robust enough to benefit the game they made.
What's sad is as much as I hate the comments here if it did release I still would be day one. I love the genre and haven't played it in years so this would've filled a nice void. I'm beyond disappointed at this time to complain any further.
@TheWPCTraveler
How would that have ever been a benefit to them? Being an exclusive didn't help ZombiU, Bayonetta 2, Wonderful 101, and it arguably didn't help the Sonic games. You're basically saying that they "missed an opportunity" to sell far fewer copies on a system notable for failing to support 3rd parties.
I don't buy it at all. Just another BS excuse to avoid owning up to the fact that they don't think they're up to meeting the promise they originally used to help generate hype.
@Folkloner Nailed it.
Wow - at least with Nintendo we get a "please understand" before we get an announcement of doom.
@Ichiban I doubt that it would have sold well. But dang I wanted it.
@dizzy_boy why are you commenting if it's obvious that you didn't bother to read the article.
These guys have no excuse, they were one of the first developers to receive a wii u dev kit. Just last year they were making grand statements about it such "If anything i think it'll showcase [the game] the hidden power that the Wii U has.". People who funded it definitely deserve there money back.
@Quorthon.
Wait until e3, and then tell me wii u wont sell more copies. Im willing to bet Nintendo has some surprises in store.
@Savino
Countless games made for consoles have struggled on PCs in recent years for a variety of years. I'm not a PC gamer, and even I know GTA had issues on there. Patches also take time to churn out--that is not some kind of magical overnight fix. They have to identify the problems, track the problems, create a fix, and test the fix, and then probably do that two or three more times.
I'm not judging you here, but gamers sound like entitled brats when they act like this stuff is freakin' magic that can just be done in a matter of days. Yes, it sucks sometimes that there are issues with some games, but this one is still a well-regarded, highly praised title, and PC gamers have been used to this kind of thing for two generations now, at least. Have a little patience.
Yeah, the "always maybe" comment is bs. They've talked up how great it was running on WiiU and how it would be a showcase for the hardware. Never did they make it sound like it wasn't coming other than it would be later than the other versions.
Can anyone show where Slightly Mad said "maybe" before this latest attempt at what appears to be revisionist history?
Why do people keep bringing up "NX" like they know it's a Wii U successor and that it is going to launch anytime soon?
@Grumblevolcano - "Holiday 2016 seems most likely."
Does that mean Zelda U becomes Zelda NX? I can't see Nintneod doing a dual release again like they did w/ TP, and I don't see them releasing a new console w/ Zelda alongside it for an old console. Wii U still has some more games to get before it goes offline in 2017.
And what @Ryno said, is NX even a home console? NX really needs to be a portable w/ TV out via dongle or wireless HDMI or something. No money to be made in home consoles.
Well, they just lost me as a potential costumer. Slightly Mad Studios - gotta look out for that brand from now on.
@hobthebob
E3 will have a few surprises, but nothing that will reverse the fortunes of the system, magically return 3rd parties to the company, or sell the console to regular gamers or new audiences. Nintendo's biggest titles, and strongest hardware-movers are Mario Kart and Smash Bros. Neither of those reversed the ill fortunes of the console. No matter what Nintendo brings to E3, it will not magically make the Wii U a success.
The system is in decline. It is very obviously already in it's final spiral, and since Nintendo announced NX already, development resources are going to be moved away from Wii U, very obviously, over the next year. This is the way Nintendo has operated since the N64. Once the new console was announced, the current one was fairly quickly moved to the backburner.
There will be stuff at E3 to make some Nintendo fans happy. But there's no way anything they show is going to suddenly change the fortunes of the Wii U. That ship has sailed. And it's sinking.
lying, telling the truth, whats the difference.
it was ALWAYS maybe for Wii U. ?>>?
jah! tell that to the backers who donated because of the wii U logo.
what are the developers, politicians? tell the truth losers ;///
@Warbeard
Sure a lot of Siths in the ranks of Nintendo fans these days.
@Savino I very much doubt you have a PC that plays GTA5 on max setting in 4k. PC Gamer built the most expensive gaming PC they coukd around 3 months ago, just to test 4k gaming. The very best they managed to get was around 15FPS. Even Nvidea has said 4k gaming at minimum of 30FPS is a year and a half away.
I too have a gaming PC. 4th gen i7, 32gb base ram, 16gb grapgics ram, and 2x 780ti graphics cards. I have tried 4k, and you simply cannot get near a steady 30FPS.
@Folkloner The REAL waste of time was, spending months getting the game to run in 12k mode on PC's. Absolute waste of time and money.
@Quorthon: Where did you get all this information on "NX?" Do you work for Nintendo?
@rjejr
Why "can't" you see Nintendo doing for Zelda U what they did for Twilight Princess? The circumstances are even identical--the current system is a sales dud, the next system might not be, and they'll want to make their money back on Zelda.
It makes perfect sense for Nintendo to move Zelda U to NX, or to do another dual release. Right now, they don't even have notable 3rd party support to help the NX take off. That system is going to need all the help it can get after the fiasco defining the Wii U. Launching NX with Zelda may well be the smartest move Nintendo could make.
And no, the brief period where Nintendo fans are upset won't mean a thing. Nintendo fans have showing that, no matter what, they will always buy more Nintendo hardware.
@Quorthon Nintendo lost an opportunity to profit, however slightly, from having another selling point for the Wii U at Slightly Mad Studios' expense
Have I made myself clear enough yet?
@Ryno
Nintendo has revealed that NX is in development. It will be revealed early next year, or maybe even late this year depending on how well or poorly they perform at E3. But the system has been announced, and for the most part, Nintendo does not spend more than 18 months between announcement and launch of new hardware.
NX has a high probability of coming out November 2016. Nintendo is clearly not focused on creating new experiences for Wii U, as they are implementing a policy of "lots more DLC" to just keep you guys playing the same few games until NX is out. The Wii U has very little on the horizon, and almost no 3rd party support outside of ports of X360 kids' games. The Wii U does not have the support or momentum to survive into late 2017. Nintendo needs to get NX out far sooner.
Given that they expect to "return to Nintendo-like profits" by the fiscal year end of March 2017, that would seem to indicate a strong move into both mobile and new hardware launching before then.
NX will most likely be out next year.
@TheWPCTraveler
Yeah, and that sounds awful. I wouldn't want an exclusive deal with Nintendo under those terms, either. Especially knowing full well that other exclusives largely failed at retail.
"Sure Nintendo, take advantage of us to our detriment."
That is hardly a winning scenario. And again, Nintendo fans would actually have to care about something other than Mario, Zelda, and Pokemon for this to have any value at all.
I seem to remember Slightly Mad stating that they would showcase the true graphical power of the Wii U with this game and how they were going to blow minds and blah blah blah and now they're saying we never actually promised you this game. Sounding more like a politician every time they speak.
I also find it funny that Nintendo Life dared to put "Exclusive" at the header of this article, when multiple other sites reported it first. Yesterday.
@Quorthon GameCube wasn't a sales dud. It still made a profit, it just wasn't a hotcake.
Good thing I didn't contribute to this project. I guess I can cross this game off my "wanted" list.
The Wii U's launch line up was filled with a bunch of last gen ports and that played a big part in murdering interest in the platform. It would be a mistake to repeat that. Interest in games like this is incredibly fleeting. People will never again care about this game as much as they do right now. Whatever chance this game had in getting the attention of Nintendo fans will have vanished by the time the NX is out.
Well, this is why you never back a Kickstarter if the campaign doesn't include your platform of choice with 100% certainty. It's too bad, and these guys have been handling this whole ordeal in quite an unprofessional manner.
Maybe?! So they're liars and stole Wii U pledgers money to make the game on other platforms. There's no sugar coating this.
Yeah , I was going to buy it for Xbox one; However now I won't buy any version. Blatant lie that it was a maybe. So many Wii U owners put money into their kickstarter to only be hit with lies and excuses. They could make the game run on wii u, it doesn't need to be 1080p , even though they lied and said game was running smooth when it obviously never was. I mean hell they could cut graphics on external parts probably increase fps
@LunaticPandora
It was a dud. It landed to retail with a thud. It was not hot, it was not popular, it was not a major seller. That Nintendo eeked a profit out of it does not mean anything. It was still a dud.
Even Nintendo does not look fondly on the poor GameCube, once stating that if the Wii sold worse than the GameCube, they would consider it a failure.
By the way, the Wii U is selling worse than the GameCube... and the Dreamcast.
@Quorthon Yes, and I simply don't care for either party in this situation. Both of them can lose for all I care, Nintendo for screwing up with their dev relations and marketing, Slightly Mad Studios for focusing on graphics over accurate car simulation.
(At this point, I'll go slightly off topic, but I can't think of anywhere else to get this off my chest.)
I'm honestly pissed at you for referencing the M-Z-P trio at this point, but what can I do about it? On the Wii U, the only games I care about are published by Nintendo (and the ones that aren't happen to be walled behind a region lock). On the 3DS, I'm stretched thin trying to go through the JRPG backlog, but again, I'm just one person. I have my circle of friends with 3DSes, sure, but they play on multiple platforms too.
Off the top of my head, the games I have yet to buy are Etrian MD, SMT: DS II Record Breaker, A-Train 3D, Lord of Magna, and EO II Untold, as well as that Hatsune Miku game.
But, there are 50 million other 3DS units, and at an attach rate of slightly less than 5 games a unit, well, you can't really make much of an impact.
@CaviarMeths
That is literally the way every new platform launches now--and it's been this way since the Dreamcast. The difference is that Sony and Microsoft consoles still sell, and the gamers who buy those consoles still support the games.
When you want to blame the Wii U's ills on "launching with last-gen ports," you now need to explain why the XBO and PS4 sold, despite launching in exactly the same way.
In the end they scammed Wiiu owners cause they funded a Wiiu version not a PS4 and Xbox one version. They didn't say maybe a wiiu version can come,they said it will. If it couldn't happen they should have refunded everyone and cancelled it. But nope they kept going screw you guys,now i know why they never showed anything of the Wiiu version.
Ladies and gentlemen THIS is exactly why we need to stop pre-ordering anything and everything in the gaming world. More times than not, these crowd funded games simply don't live up to expectations or promises. I can only think of a few examples ( I'm looking at you, Shovel Knight!) that totally blow us away but generally, games from KIck Starter are overhyped, ask for way too much money and ask us to wait way too long.
I agree they should refund the ppl that backed it thinking it would come to the Wii u. On the other hand, let this be a lesson to ppl: don't give money to companies like this on kickstarter, they're just taking your money and giving you the middle finger in return
@Quorthon - "Nintendo fans have showing that, no matter what, they will always buy more Nintendo hardware."
We've covered that, you on the handheld side, me on home consoles, and Nintneod's downward trend of console sales means fans don't buy their consoles, or the fan base is becoming too small to be profitable, certainly on the home console side. Why make another home console when they can only project out 7-8mil sales? (I still think 35m handhelds is a worthy endeavor before going 3rd party.)
Why would NX sell any better than Wii U? Only 1 reason I can think of, leave out the Gamepad to make it more cost effective (the ghost of Mahe will return some day). BUT, Zelda U is being made from the ground up for the Gamepad, no Gamepad, no Zelda U. Tacking on Wii motion controls to a Gamecube game is easy, removing all the functionality of the screen and gyro aiming from Zelda U for NX would destroy the game. Ergo no Zelda U on NX.
I could be always be wrong, but that's my reasoning, and it seems sound.
@Quorthon So you would support a developer that's that much lacking in integrity? All of their communications with the community would easily fall into any definition of lying, deceit, and deception.
They should have "set the record straight" a longgggggggggg time ago.
Then again this is why I don't trust crowdfunding.
@firstnesfan Fair enough. But GT was designed for PS3, just like Forza 4 was desinged for X360, and just like Mario Kart 8 was designed for Wii U. Each of these titles looks and runs great on their respective systems but to port them over would require some serious work because each system uses very different architecture. They clearly were building Project CARS for PC and new consoles share a lot of similiarities with modern PC's. They probably didn't think about how their code would translate onto Wii U and now it's too late to achieve similar effect on all systems. Even if they downgrade the visuals it will still run at 30 fps, which is half of what ideal performance on PC/X1/PS4 is.
@Savino - I don't think what you own should even be called a "PC", needs more than 2 letters. My parents Dell w/ Win XP, on board graphics and 512MB of RAM is a PC.
@TheWPCTraveler
Be pissed all you want, but this is the reality that Nintendo and the fans have made for generations now--if it has Mario, Link, or Pokemon on the cover, the game sells. If not, it's a crapshoot at best, a failure more likely. Why do you think Nintendo churns out 3~6 games per year, every year with Mario glued on the cover? Why do you think they have annual Pokemon releases? Why do you think they actively work to plant Zelda at retail, in some form, almost every single year? These are, far and away, the things their fans will spend money on, and little else. Hell, Link is the only reason Soulcalibur II sold on the the GameCube.
This is the sad reality Nintendo has to deal with, and Nintendo fans are all to happy to cultivate. Over the past several months that I've been on here, I've seen fans routinely, and often very ignorantly, attack 3rd parties for any discretion, no matter how minor, female dogging when 3rd parties walk away, but constantly justifying never actually supporting those third parties. But, oh look! Another 3DS model! Better spend money on that!
The Project Cars guys are in a bind. They had a goal of bringing their high-rated game to the Wii U, but it's not working. The system is too weak, and the audience is too small and too uncaring towards 3rd parties to make porting the game worth their time. It sucks, but seriously, I can hardly blame them.
Most of the people here complaining were never going to buy it anyway. Just like they didn't buy ZombiU, Wonderful 101, and Bayonetta 2.
The Internet ruined the wii u. If something like this came out when people couldn't female dog about EVERYTHING in an open forum, I think it would hAve done a lot better.
Lol, a lot of salty people on here..Damn at least be happy that the Damn game is coming out for NX.
@Ernest_The_Crab
I at least bother to understand the developer's viewpoint instead of hauling off on a whiny fanboy tirade. Yeah, it sucks, but guess what? This is a business, and they need to make the best decisions for their business and their employees.
And let's face facts: The audience that's upset here, is the absolute smallest audience that the game was maybe going to appeal to. For them, it's like looking out at a crowd of 100 people, where they can please 95 of them easily while 5 of them may get burned. Nintendo fans are sitting here demanding that they satisfy those 5 to the detriment of the company. That's just not realistic.
So they lied about what was promised and now make excuses for it. Companies need to be honest about they can and can't do and not make BS promises that will only make consumers distrust them.
"We still haven't given up on Wii U 100% but if we can't make it work we will move to the next Nintendo machine."
... maybe.
@rjejr
I haven't seen anything that makes me think Zelda U is made from the ground-up for the GamePad. It was being used as a map and little else thus far. That's relatively easy to translate to just popping up a menu instead of streaming to the GamePad.
No, there's no guarantee that the NX is going to sell better--in fact, I think at this point, it is far more likely to sell worse simply because it's going to be that much harder to get 3rd parties back on board. Nintendo's fans are happy to buy and re-buy hardware--particularly portable, but I think the fanbase is shrinking.
I've joined the ranks of Nintendo fans who does the vast majority of his gaming elsewhere. I'm always interested in the company, but they simply don't offer much of anything that I want. I see the hardware as a hurdle now. I would prefer them to go third party--the games would sell far better on platforms with a high number of adopters.
However, I think it's likely Nintendo looks at the Wii U, increasingly, as a lost cause. That last broad-ranging Direct cemented this hypothesis as they are focused on keeping their players playing Mario Kart and Smash Bros for as long as possible with DLC packs. Since Nintendo likely looks at Wii U as a lost cause, they may simply think it better to walk away and take the gamble that NX might sell better if Zelda launched with it. They had no idea the Wii was going to take off like it did, but they still stacked the odds by pushing Twilight Princess over to it.
That's why I think it's likely. Nintendo has routinely shown an odd over-simplification to their understanding of the industry these days. I have little doubt that their talks center on "last time we had a console that sold bad, we moved Zelda over to the new console, and that console sold. We should do that again."
Remember, Iwata recently stated that "people bought the Majora's Mask remake. So we'll do more remakes."
They are that f**king simplistic.
@Quorthon So you consider a sensible and legitimate business practice to lie and deceive your consumers in exchange for their money?
Fact #1 Slightly Mad Studios made a formal promise to develop a Wii U version.
Fact # 2 Slightly Mad Studios received money from their costumers with the intent of delivering said version.
Fact # 3 Slightly Mad Studios did not deliver said version.
I'm sorry if don't bother trying to understand their angle. So you pay for something and then you may or may not have it? They don't owe you anything, though luck chap, it's plain economics. That's it?
As it stands now, Slightly Mad Studios are a bunch of liars, and if they do not refund people they'll become a bunch of thieves. It's not business, it's theft. Maybe even racketeering.
@Quorthon I very much still believe that they should've set the record straight a long time ago, however. But, since we're sticking with the Pandora's box we both opened up...
...I'll be honest, I bought The Wonderful 101 before I bought my Wii U.
I'll be honest, I bought my 3DS because my brother and I love Fire Emblem.
Unfortunately, I'm just that - part of a niche. A very small niche.
To be honest, I'm fine with the release schedule of the 3DS, but I can't deny that third-parties make up that entire lineup I care about.
(I'd also find it easier to care about my Wii U if I had a good SRPG for it that was out now, something that Code Name STEAM should've been for, just a thought. But who cares, right? America doesn't care, Europe doesn't care, Japan doesn't care.)
When the website for this game opened, they clearly stated all the home consoles and PC after the vote. In fact, Wii U came second in the pole and was only just beaten by PC if i recall correctly. No "maybe" about it. If memory serves me well, they were even bragging about how great two screens were because the gamepad could work as a back window with a mini map on the top screen to compensate.
Bottom line is they promised something and can't deliver it. Why promise it when they didn't have the dev kit in the first place? I'll be first to admit this is not my kind of game but i feel gutted for those who put money in that were lead to believe there would a Wii U version as well as PS3 and XBox 360. People who backed it with those consoles should ask for their money back as they've been mislead. Slightly Mad Studios promised this on those consoles and failed to deliver breaking their promise. If they have any decency left, they'll now just can the game and move on. Stop leading people on and do the decent thing.
@TheWPCTraveler
Well, it can be hard to be straight early on, but these companies have to juggle over-promising and risking falling short. Promise too little early on, and no one pays attention. Promise too much, and people get their panties all twisted if they don't deliver.
This is a hype-driven industry, so it can be difficult to measure that or figure out how to do it well. On the one hand, yes, perhaps they should have been more reserved early on, on the other hand, they may have needed that hype to garner attention to get the game made.
It can be a helluva crapshoot.
@Quorthon
Please please learn to read. This is not the story from yesterday, this is a statement made to Nintendo Life from the developer. It is therefore exclusive.
Please take your troll drivel elsewhere.
@Samurai_Goroh
Calling them liars and thieves borders on slander, particularly when you are going to also sit there and adamantly refuse to bother to understand the situation.
That's like me seeing you pick up a $10 bill from the ground and put it in your pocket, and then I rush over and call you a thief, and when you deny it, a liar--even though you dropped the money yourself and I didn't see it. You have chosen to be ignorant of the situation, but are still being judgmental. There is not an ounce of maturity in that scenario.
@Samurai_Goroh That's called fraud in the legal world.
Lying Jon Snows. Quote;
'The Nintendo fans we've got are crying out for a game like this. They don't really have that experience currently, and there hasn't really been anything like it on Wii previously. It's not our job to disappoint those guys. So when we say the Wii U version is delayed in 2015 because we need a little more time, that's all it is. We just want to make sure it's of the same standard of all the other games. To do that, we just need a little more time. I've seen the Wii U version, I've seen it quite regularly. It's got dynamic time of day, weather - it looks phenomenal. And the actual console itself is quite good.'
Refund your Wii U backers and screw off. Hate people like that.
Every day I find it harder and harder to connect with Nintendo fans, some of you should take a look at your comments & realise how ridiculous they sound. Do you really even deserve this game? I'd say nope!
Excuse the rant, but man as a gamer for many years it saddens me to see how gamers have become over the last few years...
Way to go nintendo. Always releasing weak hardware for profit. What's the point if no one wants or can't even make current gen games on it? I regret buying wii u day one because well the 3rd party games are lacking.
@Quorthon I'm not slandering anyone, I stated facts. The money the pledgers gave SMS was not dropped on the street's cobblestones. It was consigned with a specific purpose, not to be forfeit.
Thank god I never gave them a penny! I would be talking to an attorney, instead of you right now if I had.
First off, I'll start by saying I've only had a passive interest in this game since I've owned a Wii U--I liked the idea of a racing sim on the console and saw its potential, but wasn't too sure if I'd buy it day one, for example.
With that out of the way, I'm very disappointed by the way they're handling this now. At this point, I'm used to third-party games not coming to Wii U. It's no shock to me anymore. The console hasn't sold terribly well and the user base is small. If developers don't want to bring their games to Wii U, that's their choice. They're a business first--they have to make money in order to keep going and all that.
However, don't turn it around back at us, Slightly Mad. It wasn't always a maybe. Ever since I could remember, you talked of bringing Project Cars to Wii U, like it was a for-sure thing. I remember all the articles where you'd tout how great it's looking on the console. Heck, don't believe me, do a search on this very website, I'm sure they'll pop up. It's your word against your own word, not ours.
If you want to shelve it until NX, that's your deal. But I promise by then I'll probably have forgotten about Project Cars. It'll be up to you to find some way to sweeten it enough to make it worth the interest. Good luck.
@HappyMaskedGuy Thanks for the exact quote. I remember them clearly stating multiple times how awesome the game looks and runs on Wii U. And now they act as if there never was a Wii U version to begin with? Well, that might just be the truth. Either way - don't lie to your customers like that.
The internet wayback machine calls BS. The Weapons of Mass Development page for Project: Cars did state while in Beta no platform for the project ( http://web.archive.org/web/20111014201455/http://www.wmdportal.com/projects/cars/ ) and did only include PC initially ( http://web.archive.org/web/20120410071653/http://www.wmdportal.com/projects/cars/ ). However, just a month later ( http://web.archive.org/web/20120512155649/http://www.wmdportal.com/projects/cars/ ) it was advertising the game as being on PC/PS3/360/Wii U.
That was quite early in the development, and plenty of time for the developer to figure out that the console couldn't work. Given the specs given just a month earlier there was no reason for it not to work other than they allowed bloat and feature creep to invade the project.
What a load of bullsh*t.
@kereke12 lol like the Wii U?
Anyway, it hasn't been confirmed for NX. Heck, we don't even know if the NX is a new console/handheld/digital platform.
Guys, calm down. Slightly Mad couldn't have said it was coming to the Wii U because the Wii U is not real. That black box that you think is sitting below your television? Smoke and mirrors. Like, seriously think about it. Wii U? What the heck does that even mean? It's just some letters that you put together. You've been duping yourselves and therefore only have yourselves to blame. If anything you should be thanking SMS for snapping you out of your sheeple haze. They are the real heroes here.
@Stu13
Smart. Give Wii U owners the false impression you were going to 100% release it on there, and with that Wii U backers pony up the cash to get it on their console. Some years later, you have to say “Oh yeah, about the Wii U, we were never 100% sure. Too bad, your loss”.
Genius, just genius. sarcastic applause
@Mewtwo21 in the quote from Ian Belle he states that he said the WiiU and OS were a maybe, go read it again yourself.
I'm just saying where exactly did he say that. Other than the recent press release, it would be nice to know during the entire development time, when did he say the WiiU was a maybe like he's trying to claim.
Maybe I should have rephrased what I said earlier, and you would have unserstood a little better.
@Quorthon - "It was being used as a map and little else thus far."
Guess I'm hanging my entire argument then on the "thus far".
I wonder if Wii U could survive all of 2016 w/ just Zelda U, HD remasters and Super Mario Galaxy 3?
Games I still think could extend Wii U's life another year - it's done in 2017 regardless - Pokemon version of the new arcade cabinet game, Animal Crossing, an amiibo version of Nintnedo Land, some type of Mario sports game, Paper Mario. And not that I think it will happen but a Retro Metroid game b/c some poeple think ti will still happen.
So yeah, I think the old Wii U has some life let yet. Heck the thing has been out for 2 1/2 years and still hasn't gotten a price cut (cheapest price has always been $299, ditching the higher price point isn't a "cut"), it could sell a few more at $199 next to a budget "Select" line of hits. NX in 2017 for me.
@FragRed There was never a kickstarter, it was crowdfunded through their own website by means of early adopters on PC, who received beta versions of the game as well, which is why you can see so many gameplay videos on YouTube: all are different versions but all are on PC. These beta testers are also what helped the game get to where it is now gameplay wise. Hence the moniker Project CARS, Community Aided Racing Simulation.
But having said that, I'm VERY disappointed about this. They made a lot of promises and Andy Tudor was always VERY positive about the Wii U version. Some people will remember this interview as another reason to become enthusiastic about this arriving on their "humble" Wii U:
http://nintendoenthusiast.com/interview/slightly-mad-interview-andy-tudor-project-cars-wii-u/
I have had some email correspondence with them a few times. Real friendly and polite guys, and Tudor, like I said, seemed genuinely enthusiastic, also about the gameplay options for the GamePad.
Then they started to develop another tire model, WAY more advanced and to such an extent that it's even troubling the Xbox One and PS4, who's versions don't even come close to the current PC version. Frame rate issues, anti-aliasing and what not. A lot of effects are quite different on console versions. This is a very good comparison video for that:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mZfCkRvhkg0
Then Bandai Namco came into play and all the bad news slowly started to come out bit by bit.
The older version could have been kept to let all consoles run a smooth, 60fps version, and they could have reserved the new model for PC only, since they can be modified to the customer's (or the games') needs.
With the hardware of the Wii U in mind, there have been some that tried to make a realistic assessment of what it could have looked like (also keeping in mind what Tudor said about it running very smoothly, even with weather effects on). Obviously it's only theoretical, because it's taking PC specs and modifying them to Wii U's specs to virtually reproduce it, but still. Have a look:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=N2uxa_OOzA0
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mwKxWtXrWYU
In the end it all just comes down to economics; if the Wii U had sold 20 million times, then there would have been far less developers complaining about how difficult it is to develop for or that the Wii U version of their game will "unfortunately" be cancelled. They would have just invested the extra time needed and made the damn games, because there would have been (sufficient) profits to gain...
@Ichiban what on earth are you gibbering on about? A crowd funded developer goes back on its financial promises, and the game's backers and others who believed them are disappointed to find they have been misled- and what, you find their reaction surprising, or inappropriate? Huh? :/
I'm reading a lot of Kickstarter comments.
You guys realize this game didn't have a Kickstarter, right? They crowd funded the game through their own website.
@Grimlock_King To N's credit, I don't think Nintendo released the console because they wanted to save money. But they spent too much money on the heavy gamepad that it did not work. They could have scrabed the gamepad to make a more powerful system, but they wanted to release an innovative piece of hardware and made more innovative games, jUST like what they did on Wii.
They also wanted backward compatibility. Therefore, they relied on a PowerPC CPU that was largely incompatible with Intel CPU. But that means, it will be difficult for PC programmers to port their games from PC to Wii U. Probably Nintendo did not forsee this issue at the beginning.
@Quorthon The GamePad would have been used for far more than a map. Andy Tudor has repeatedly stated that it could also be used as an F1 wheel, with all the dials and buttons displayed on there, just to give you one example.
Here's an official overview:
http://nintendoenthusiast.com/wp-content/uploads/2015/03/project_cars_wii_u_details.jpg
I also find it very strange that all of a sudden this Ian Bell is coming out of the woodwork to discuss Project CARS instead of Andy Tudor, who has been doing almost all of the communicating up till now. He is also the one that has tried and approved the original Wii U version that they had running on the older tire model.
That just doesnt line up with all the updates they kept giving about the WiiU version. One of their developers even said it was running well on the system a while back.
Then when this whole thing began a couple of days ago, Ian Bell opens up with "OK I'll come clean" which already pins him as being purposefully dishonest for the sake of keeping KS backers in the dark.
It's just really bad handling of the situation and Ian Bell is only making it worse.
And yet you still put the Wii U logo on promotional stuff. Not very wise if it was always a "maybe".
I think it's clear the people whining have no idea what's going on. Did anyone here fund this project expecting a Wii U version? That poll people refer to wasn't part of the development process, it was just a thing on their website to ask which version people are excited about. Not only was the total votes only a tiny fraction of the backer numbers, but we all know Nintendo fans flock to any poll to make their system look good. You didn't even need backer access to vote! The FUSS over this seems to be on Nintendo sites like this, and not on the backer only forum. It suggests that's there isn't an load of people out there that funded this and expect a Wii U version. PC owners funded it, then they announced a Wii U version.
@BertoFlyingFox You're right about it running well on Wii U, I posted an interview stating exactly that in comment #128, but there was never a kickstarter.
They crowdfunded the game through their own website, by means of letting PC gamers buy in to receive a beta version of the game.
Wii U owners that jumped in, could have known that, since it is very clearly written on their site.
Not that I approve of this whole turn of events, because I'm very disappointed, but I'm reading a lot of comments based on misconceptions here.
If it was always a maybe then why promise it in the first place.
there is a discussion in their forum
http://forum.projectcarsgame.com/showthread.php?27717-Information-on-Nintendo-versions-of-pCARS-%28some-wailing%29/page3
Meh the actual game wasn't that impressive anyways.
@Peach64 Which they failed to delivered. If they knew they aren't gonna be able to handle the Wii U, why even announced a port? Now the expectation for the game is high and then this happen.
Can nobody remember the n64 and the ps1? N64 was way more powerful than the ps1 but people still developed games for both systems they just made them work,so it can be done they just cba,just more rubbish about the wiiu not being strong enough! Bet Nintendo could make a better looking game no problem!
@rjejr well it was also said early on that some Gamepad features were built with Zelda U in mind so, your argument has more merit. At this point, talking about what game will realise on what platform, like the what the NX us, everything we say is pure conjecture.
@Quorthon, who's to say that Nintendo doesn't already have 3rd parties lined up for NX (whatever is ends up being) or at least in the process? Perhaps is why it gives the appearance of little effort on Nintendo's part? Concerning 3rd parties, it would certainly be of little benefit for them to release any substantial titles on the Wii U, for one because of the tired argument of install base, and now you have a new platform on the horizon. But once again, conjecture.
POSTS FROM IAN BELL ON THIS FORUM
Ian Bell wrote:
@RCMADIAX
Namco did not become the publisher until last year. They were working all in their own while looking for a publisher the entire time.
I know that funding was done when it was only a PC game, but didn't they already express interest in Wii U before 2013? Anyway, I don't remember any promises and it seems the Nintendo fanbase have absolutely no idea what they're complaining about as no one has done any research. I doubt many people here were even following the game until these recent articles.
The main target for this game was PC and their main audience is PC gamers. They entertained the thought of a Wii U version as Nintendo-only fans have no other realistic racers they could play and they thought that Wii U might be an unexpectedly good market for them as well.
I'll repeat what I said yesterday - all of these indie developers should just say "We're releasing for PC, (in size 1 print) and maybe (back to regular font) Xbox One, PS4, Wii U, Atari Jaguar, Super Nintendo, Sega 32x, TurboGrafx-16, Sega SG-1000, 3DO, Apple Pippin, and NeoGeo Pocket Color." Clearly Slightly Mad has proven that as long as you claim you said "maybe," you can make whatever promises you want and break them whenever things get difficult.
Would it have been a stellar, blockbuster version on Wii U? Of course not. Neither were any of the Call of Duty releases on Wii, but all of those sold well enough and made a profit for Activision. The same would have been true of Project Cars. It would never have outsold the PS4, Xbox One, or PC versions, but I'd bet my left kidney they'd have made a profit.
@TheWPCTraveler SMT x FE is still coming...so your wish for a niche SRPG on Wii U will be fulfilled
Ian Bell wrote:
Source
Well, I guess that's that.
@rob955
Except PS1, while 32 bit, wasn't that much weaker than the N64.
The difference between the Wii U and PS4/XBone is nearly a generation's worth. It's the exact same situation as last gen.
@T7L3RB
Except the video shows that it's a Persona 4 style JRPG, not an SRPG.
@Quorthon When has Nintendo needed third parties to consider their consoles a success? Nintendo has had limited 3rd party support since as far back as the N64, and yet each one of their systems has been profitable up until the Wii U more recently. Now that the Wii U is finally contributing more significant sales numbers, and sales have increased, all Nintendo needs to do is release more 1st and 2nd party titles, and I believe that the Wii U will be considered a success.
Success is a relative and highly subjective word. Certainly it can be argued that Wii U is more of a success than Ouya was...
Oh, and as for Wii having massive third party support? That may be true, but honestly, who bought a Wii for the third party games? It was always about 1st and 2nd party games for 80-90 percent of Wii owners.
"It was always 'maybe' as we had no knowledge of the system" What about all the things they said?!
Links: https://www.nintendolife.com/news/2013/12/wii_u_more_than_capable_of_providing_the_core_project_cars_experience_says_developer
https://www.nintendolife.com/news/2013/03/wii_u_gamepad_screams_innovation_says_project_cars_developer
https://www.nintendolife.com/news/2013/04/project_cars_dev_making_sure_wii_u_doesnt_get_a_crappy_version
So intact they were never seriously working on the Wii U version until recently?
forum user Godnimon - "And answer me, have you been overpromising with the WiiU version all this years? Because that is a fact that I´m definitley not ignoring."
Ian Bell - "Yes."
Even the head developer admits that he promised more than they're delivering. Regardless of any "maybe" they insist on, the guy in charge of the whole thing admits they promised a product they're not delivering. That's unethical business practice.
@Quorthon show me 1a public statement prior to today where they stated the wii u version was a "maybe".theyre full of crap stop attempting to deflect from their lack of integrity by blaming nintendo fans.nintendo fans didn't force them to ANNOUNCE a wii u version which they did they didn't suggest it or say they'd look into it and get back to us they announced it and up until this week were acting as though nothing was wrong,and are now back-pedalling to justify it.whether you believe it would have sold well or not is irrelevant to how piss poor these guys have acted.
Statements from Andy Tudor of Slightly Mad Studios...
Tudor wrote:
Tudor wrote:
Tudor wrote:
@AVahne well dang...was hoping it would take more inspiration from FEs battle system...
A "maybe?" What? I thought they confirmed a Wii U version. Ah, well. You can never rely on developers these days anymore. What a shame. What a shame.
Thank god I wasn't drinking at the time I read this or else I would have seriously done a spittake. They are straight up lying now and trying for damage control. This game was NEVER a maybe. It was full on confirmed several times. I was fully willing to wait and not buy the PS4 version so I could get it on Wii U, but like every other third-party studio out there, they have absolutely no respect for Nintendo fans. It's clear they never did any work on the Wii U version until just now, which flies in the face of everything they've sad before. Like...
"I've seen the wii u version, i've seen it quite regularly. It's got dynamic time of day, weather - it looks phenomenal. And the actual console itself is quite good."
Now they claim the total opposite and say it's crap and that they won't bother trying to make it run. Shameful. Utterly shameful.
Thank god I wasn't drinking at the time I read this or else I would have seriously done a spittake. They are straight up lying now and trying for damage control. This game was NEVER a maybe. It was full on confirmed several times. I was fully willing to wait and not buy the PS4 version so I could get it on Wii U, but like every other third-party studio out there, they have absolutely no respect for Nintendo fans. It's clear they never did any work on the Wii U version until just now, which flies in the face of everything they've sad before. Like...
"I've seen the wii u version, i've seen it quite regularly. It's got dynamic time of day, weather - it looks phenomenal. And the actual console itself is quite good."
Now they claim the total opposite and say it's crap and that they won't bother trying to make it run. Shameful. Utterly shameful.
@AVahne the games ads had a wii u logo slapped down the bottom unless they had a microscopic fineprint saying "maybe" next to that,then it's pretty much false advertising.at the absolute best it's misleading.when 360/ps3 versions were dropped they could have turned round and admitted the wii u was in doubt.
@kyuubikid213 Ouch. Thanks for posting that interview, he's a liar.
So much epic failure that Im not even mad....well slightly.
@wisdomsprince I totally agree with you on this.
utter drivel. they strung us along from the start.
This kids, is what we call a dirty filthy liar.
@kyuubikid213 Between that and the archive.org pages for their own crowdfunding site (which show support for Wii U within a month of leaving beta and less than a year of starting development) clearly point to either a huge deception or incompetence on their PR department.
@Peach64 why would someone announce a "maybe"?.thats basically false advertising.thats like a festival sticking a bands name on the poster when they've not actually got them booked.
@Quorthon That however does not change the fact that their PR was repulsive in nature. Any company that mistreats people that badly in any other industry gets burned pretty badly (barring those in a monopoly or oligopoly).
I hope the studio goes under now, if they are just going to lie to their fans...then screw them.
Joke will be on Slightly Mad Studios when I don't even buy next Nintendo machine. I have sworn off being early adopter to Nintendo consoles.
I don't care about enough of the Nintendo games to make the console truly worth getting for me. Just sits there collecting dust except for 1-2 games per year, if that.
On the discussion the NX, I always thought that was going to be Nintendo's "smartphone" or something along the lines of that, or even perhaps an alternative to the 3DS. Not a new home console.
Also, even if Nintendo were to announce their next home, I wouldn't expect to see an official announcement until next year's E3, at the earliest.
@ElkinFencer10 Heck, just give us that "yes", Ian. Say that you thought you could do it but it isn't working and you don't want to compromise the game.
Retract that "maybe" line. We know we're down on horsepower on this system.
I know it's been stated by members prior to my two cents, but people should not be at all shocked by this. The Wii U cannot be expected to run a PS4 or X1 game. Nintendo's console is simply not powerful enough, period. Nintendo wonders why they have pathetic third party support - maybe stop creating underpowered consoles that can't run the games that the rival consoles can.
I'm not a hater as I enjoy my Wii U, but I'm sorry, I'm smart enough to not expect third party games to appear on the system, and I'm not outraged when they don't. That's why I also have Sony consoles.
@larry_koopa
I agree with you on just about everything you said for the most part; most games designed for PS4 and Xbox One shouldn't be expected to run on Wii U. My exception to that is when a game series has proven it works VERY well with the gamepad's gameplay - the Arkham series, Call of Duty, or the Warriors series, for example. I would like to see those games released for Wii U, even if they're graphically dumbed down, so to speak (think Call of Duty for Wii; watered down versions of those games weren't ideal, but they worked fine).
What DOES piss me off, however, is when a game is released on weaker hardware (PS3 and 360) or - as is the case here - has already been promised for Wii U (as has been said before, they put the Wii U's logo on the ads; that takes it from a "maybe" to a promise as far as I'm concerned).
Isn't the Wii U GPU made by AMD? Interesting...
Hilarious that NL is doing PR for Slightly Mad on this by attempting to help them in their spin job. That's pretty pathetic guys, as we all know that SM is now lying through their teeth and you do a tremendous disservice to your readers--and your credibility--by swallowing this nonsense and then passing it on to your readers as the new, fully revised, reality.
As for the rest of you missing the point: the problem here is they LIED, not that the WiiU suddenly, at this late date, can't handle it*, even though SM has been saying for years now that the U rev was coming along well--stop being patsies and being so easily spun by some obnoxiously insulting revisionist history.
(Moments like this make me realize how it is politicians get away with constantly, incessantly, lying through their teeth because their media enablers--and their readers/viewers/listeners--will help cement the lie as conventional wisdom. How utterly pathetic and predictable, tho, given where we are as a culture.)
@larry_koopa If they said that they weren't sure about the WiiU hardware from the beginning instead of telling us from months earlier, "Yep, we got this bad boy running on the WiiU awesomely, No problems whatsoever!" Then this would've been justifiable. Now they've come clean and admit that they can't, then it called lying. That's a problem.
@kyuubikid213 not being funny but he said the Wii U version looks phenomenal.
He never said anything about how it runs though. SMS have been upfront and said that the framerate is a problem and for them to get it a decent standard the phenomenal stuff like dynamic weather etc will have to be cut back.
I think some people just want a Wii U version even if it runs like crap.
@Quorthon the only reason bayonetta was made at all was because nintendo payed for it. How did it not benefit from being an exclusive? It's sold about 700,000 copy's to date and still has a year or two of sales to go. The mighty playstation with 80 million units sold barely broke a million with the first bayonetta. it is clear platnuim made monney and ninty was happy with the final product so tell me how that didn't help
I was really looking forward to this, it's a shame that the devs may not deliver...
not sure about this "maybe"...all project cars teasers and trailers featured the wii u logo :/ I still want this game.
So basically we wont get the WiiU version, or it'll end up terrible like Watch Dogs. It's inevitable now people, give up on this. No one will even remember this in a few months after another Forza or Gran Turismo comes out, your arguments mean nothing. The bros and f-boys who buy these games mostly aren't looking at sales or which console needs more games. "ITS ON XBOX WHO CARES" is already the logic. Even if they manage to produce a WiiU version you KNOW it'll be trash. Pure and simple. They keep delaying it and devs admit they don't know what they're doing. It's done with.
Lol you know people are blind with anger when all they can say is "BUT BAYONETTA ON WIIU!!", just be quiet you wannabe expert and go get your WiiU preorder refund.
I guess they let in run on quite a while which is bad, but I dunno, I wonder how many of the outraged folk would have actually bought the game on Wii U.
Many were talking up Need for Speed Most Wanted, but it sold pretty bad on Wii U, and Nintendo have never really been a go to for fans of realistic racing simulation.
Seems like another investment / projected profit issue to me.
Game looks good, will try it if I get a PS4 at some point.
The next Nintendo machine...lol. That will be a pretty late release, I guess.
Pffffffffffft. I ain't even Slightly Mad. Glad most everyone (except for "people" like Quorthon) see this statement for what it is, after all the promises. I got no maybes in those older interviews.
@kyuubikid213 There they are. The quotes that I was thinking of, right there for all to see.
To go on an aside about Quorthon, I can only assume named himself after the legendary man behind Bathory, which, given his obsessive, unrelentingly hateful behaviour, I consider an insult to the real Quorthon; I will say, though, that his comments do remind me of the kind of nonsense spouted by your typical elitist Black Metal fan, so maybe it's a more appropriate name for him, but I still hate seeing it.
One benefit to skipping the Wii U and being a launch title for Nintendo NX is being an excellent racing sim, launching along side new hardware, and damage control by giving Nintendo NX owners an even bigger roster of cars all for $29 or $39.
The cheaper price and extra content can be seen as doing what EA should of done with it's Wii U line up.
Darn, I had been looking forward to this one on the Wii U. I'm definitely worried that developers are giving too much hype to the NX platform with too little idea of what it is actually going to be.
@ecco6t9 That's great and all, but by then the game will be 2-3 years old and no one will care if it's coming to the NX or not...and on top of that, we don't even know what the NX is.
If the NX is a home console, yipee, it gets a game no one cares for anymore.
If it's a handheld, then yipee, the game comes out on the Wii U (or not) and it either A) ends up being a sub-par version just to shut the "wailing" Wii U owners up or B) comes out so much later than the other versions that it's the Watch_Dogs situation all over again.
Well, if I get the next Nintendo machine, I certainly won't buy a title for it made by SMS.
No maybe about it.
They keep saying that like Nintendo is going to release their next console soon. Even though they said it may be revealed next E3 it may not even be out that year or the next. People would lose interest by the time that happens, they shouldn't give up after coming so far
@ecco6t9 nobody will care about project cars come the time Nintendo release a new console.
Game will be irrelevant.
Viable option for the next nintendo system: forget 3rd parties, just focus on making it an affordable 2nd or 3rd console add-on for gamers who want to play nintendo content, VC and indies. £150 max. If it sells 100m, watch third parties become interested again
Worked for the Wii...
This is bull, these guys are liars. So much for this coming to Wii U. So much for Day 1
I find it hard to believe that with so little information surrounding two letters 'NX' that the assumption is that this is a new console.
I'm sure I read somewhere that Nintendo's future outlook was for a handheld and home console that works together and the duel screen handheld formula will not be used in the next handheld.
Maybe the 'NX' is a cross device operating system that would run on console, handheld and mobile? Not hardware at all?
The fact is until Nintendo make a detailed public announcement no one will know for sure and those that do know are so tied down with legal non disclosure agreements that you'll never know that they know.
@Shiryu I feel discontent with their comments as well. I personally feel if they really wanted to get this on the wii u they could. I wouldn't even care if they lowered the specs. With that said, it's a bit unnerving with the whole "we'll probably wait for the next gen Nintendo console". It's comments and articles like these that push me more and more to the idea of purchasing a ps4. Doesn't help most of my friends have one. I love my wii u but it's starting to get to a point where I feel I'm missing out on too many next gen games...
Yeah I mean I never once saw the Wii U logo in any trailers or anything promoting the game. Wait a dog gone second, yes I did!
@Reznor52 I will remain disciplined, I will hold onto the Wii U till the very last day. One home console per generation. Yes, I will miss out on a lot of games, but it will allow me to have a complete collection and have more free time to make music. This whole affair is incredibly distasteful, I don't like to feel like a second class gamer just because I only own a Wii Uand episodes like this one just make me sad, but unbroken because I know it's all money , marketing and strategy talking big on their side.
@McoobabWATP Yeah, they've clearly been working on a Wii U version, so that's why the logo was on trailers and stuff. This guy is saying that nobody gave them money based on it coming to Wii U, as the originally crowd funding was to raise money for a PC version only. Seriously, yet to find anyone that backed this and only wants a Wii U copy. The outrage is not coming from backers. Nobody has been short-changed.
@retro_player_22 They announced a port because they were working on it. Companies announce games all the time that never get finished. Even Nintendo do this. If the fuss was people being upset that it's not coming, then it's fine, but look at all the comments here saying 'People gave them money for a Wii U version', when there's no evidence of that happening at all. People gave them money for a PC version. SMS have been about as honest as they can be. They definitely have been working on a Wii U version, but the console just can't handle it, so they're PROBABLY shutting down the project. Why should they spend time and money trying to optimise it when it's more than likely it will be an utter sales flop on the console anyway? If people had paid for it, then yeah, but as has been stated over and over... this wasn't a kickstarter, there were no console versions during the funding process, so nobody has paid for a Wii U version.
@Laxeybobby Well, the WiiU is dead in the water, the 3DS is pretty old by now, if Nintendo want to have any hope of still being relevant in consoles either handheld or at home, NX had better be a console of some sort...
@Peach64 but within a month of going public with their World of Mass Development Project: Cars (as in before it became specifically Project: Cars) they were advertising the Wii U as a console. This was back with the initial specs for the game was in Junior Build mode (April 2012) and the specs were as follows:
MINIMUM SPEC
CPU - 3.0GHz Dual-Core, 2.4GHz Quad-Core
GRAPHICS - nVidia 9600 GT 512Mb, ATI Radeon HD 4750 512Mb
MEMORY - 2Gb RAM (3Gb-4Gb recommended)
CONNECTION - Continuous Internet
It was a mere month later (May 2012) that they advertised:
PROJECT CARS represents THE ULTIMATE DRIVER JOURNEY...
-FRANCHISE MODE allows you to carve out a personalized career starting in the Karting world and then progressing on to whichever motorsport specialization you prefer including Rally, Touring Cars, Open-Wheel, GT, Le Mans, and many more!
-Play CO-OP with a friend as Driver/Co-Driver
-FULL TEAM MANAGEMENT... Have a large number of friends? Create, manage, and compete together!
-Experience the excitement of PIT STOPS like you've never seen before!
-Revolutionary PIT-2-CAR RADIO gives you the strategic advantage
-DYNAMIC Time Of Day & Localized Weather make every race unique and challenging
-10+ GAME MODES covering every form of motorsport
-CLOUD-BASED SOCIAL NETWORK allows you to connect with friends, compare times & scores, compete and challenge each other, and share content
-USER-GENERATED CONTENT - Create your own liveries, decals, tuning setups, and even events! Then share them with the world - either for free, in-game credits or even real money!
-PUSHING TO THE LIMITS - Advanced physics, lighting, and AI
PROJECT CARS is due for release on the following platforms...
Wii U PC PlayStation 3 Xbox 360
So you are telling me that between May of 2012 and May of 2015 they couldn't figure out that they couldn't manage a functional build on the Wii U, but found time to migrate their game to newer consoles offered by Microsoft and Sony?
Well, guess I'll get the pc version. Based off of comments in the past about how the Wii U was a 'powerful system' and development was going good on it, one would think development was coming along smoothly. Oh well, I WAS holding out for the Wii U version but that's bollocks now!
@Darknyht
The Wii U doesn't even have the minimum RAM necessary according to those requirements. The Wii U has 2 GB total, but only 1GB of RAM is used for gaming. The rest is OS.
@ Darknyht I'll do ya one better: I read this article about how the Wii U does have some juice under the hood but it's up to the developers to optimize their games based on what it gives. Here's a quote from the article: “I can’t detail the Wii U GPU but remember it’s a GPGPU. So you are lifted from most limits you had on previous consoles. I think that if you have problems making a great looking game on Wii U then it’s not a problem of the hardware.” http://www.nintengen.com/2014/02/wii-us-gpu-is-highly-efficient-not.html
@hobthebob
Each of Nintendo's systems has sold worse than the one before, sans the flukes of the Wii and DS, which are quite clearly statistical anomalies in all of this. Nintendo has always needed 3rd parties--as has every successful console maker since the NES. A big part of the diminishing sales can be lumped directly onto the lacking 3rd party support and sales.
And funny that you should name the N64, since it had 3rd party games on the damn box:
Or do you think Nintendo owns Star Wars?
By the way, being generally profitable is not the same thing as being successful. After all, the PS2 was also profitable--and successful.
Here's another one I recall reading from Slightly Mad studios: http://mynintendonews.com/2013/12/23/slightly-mad-studios-says-wii-u-is-more-than-capable-of-providing-core-project-cars-experience/
sounds like to me another developer that promised nintendo games seen xbox 1 and ps4 and gave nintendo the finger...this gen is nothin but shooters on shooters..ive seen nothin impressive...reharsed assasans creed 3 they put out is the same ol junk..smash bros is fun but what new did it bring...ea has there usual roster update relases..2016 will havevthis player but plays like 2015 and below...o look it call of duty for the 21st time ..its got a new gun and turn right instead of left and designed like levels in the past...or this time they will have to fish move out of the way when u get close....tell me when someone has somethin thats not rehsrshed..this gen of consoles stink..
@Ernest_The_Crab
Uh no, gamers--particularly Nintendo fans for some reason--take these things overwhelmingly personally and get butthurt over relatively minor things. Why do you think EA tops "worst companies" lists in the face of corporations who are doing actual harm to people and/or the environment and/or the economy?
It's because gamers apparently, by and large, have no understanding of the world outside of gaming, and go out of their way to be whiny crybabies about way too many things. EA is far from the worst company out there. But that's all gamers understand.
Again, a lot of you guys here are getting personally offended by a company that has to reverse a position on the Wii U. Maybe try not being emotionally invested in a game console.
And another where they say the Wii U won't be the crappy version... http://mynintendonews.com/2013/04/23/project-cars-developer-is-making-sure-wii-u-doesnt-get-the-crappy-version/
@JudgeMethos From that article you quoted: "It also gives developers who design exclusively (not happening much right now) for a system designed like Wii U more possibilities for growth and further efficiency the more they make games for it. However porting x86 code over to the PPC, while possible, is not something most game developers are going to spend extra development time to do for the Wii U in it's current sales situation. "
It's a two-part issue: WiiU is underpowered for "conventional" programs, and rewriting them to be optimized for WiiU is a lot of work for a system with the WiiU's install base.
@ MysticX yeah, I read that but the quote I posted was what caught the ol' eye balls!
@Sir_JBizzle
I think it's fairly safe to say that NX probably doesn't have 3rd party support lined up for the following reasons:
1. Third parties have largely abandoned both the Wii U and 3DS.
2. Nintendo is still terrible at dealing with them.
3. Even after the "success" of the Wii, Nintendo could barely get 3rd parties on board the Wii U.
4. In order to build confidence in the new hardware, Nintendo should be building confidence now on the Wii U--the way Sony did after the disastrous launch of the PS3. They worked so hard to get 3rd parties back on their side that the PS4 launched like a greyhound in it's prime at the track.
I don't think the support is going to be there. There will be kiddie games from Activision, a couple ports of PS4/XBO games to test the water (that Nintendo fans will, as usual, ignore) but that'll be about it.
I don't have confidence in the NX at this point, based largely on how Nintendo is attempting to do things now.
They're buttering us up for the inevitable cancellation. I'd put money on it if I were a betting man.
@rjejr
I agree that the Wii U is done by 2017 regardless. But given the slimming support, even from Nintendo, I would expect it in 2016--to be replaced the same way the GBA was.
Nintendo is at a point where it could deliver 5 of the best games ever made over the next year and a half, and the system would still be dragging it's ass to the grave. It's done. Nobody wants this thing. Not outside of hyper-dedicated Nintendo fanboys and those of us lingering fans hoping something good will happen.
Even when 3rd party games do arrive, they sell terribly. Nintendo fans do not even want to support this thing, or they'd buy a damn 3rd party game or two every now and then. Instead, they bitch and moan about $20 for a game while buying another 3DS or 20 more Amiibo to add to the pile.
Nintendo fanboys are very, painfully, clearly blind to not realize this. Outside of sites like this that deal exclusively in Nintendo and articles on more games skipping the console, everyone else considers it dead. The system is a tired has-been, and that's not exactly easy for me to say, as I defended it adamantly for that first year and a half. But it is getting easier to say, as I am not blind to reality. Because eventually reality sets in. It's not selling. It won't sell. Hell, HD remakes of GameCube games are not even coming to it. Nintendo fans adamantly call the Vita a failure--and it's still sold better than the Wii U, and has way more games coming to it.
Nintendo, it seems, is a company that has passed beyond irrelevance, and now stands on the brink of total obsolescence. They are outside the curve, and outside the industry, and outside the norms. Boring as norms can be, it's how you appeal to a mass audience. Ironically, this is always Nintendo's goal, but they are frighteningly bad at doing it. But Sony did it. They delivered exactly the game console people wanted. No crazy gimmicks, streamlined, yet familiar. User friendly and robust.
I've explained my reasoning a dozen times at least. So I'll just make this reminder: I expect NX to launch in 2016, and I would not be surprised to see Zelda U become Zelda NX. This follows the way Nintendo has done things before. Project Cars for Wii U will be canceled, and there will be no title that causes a new, notable reversal in sales for the console.
@JudgeMethos Ah, i just thought i'd provide that bit for the developers' perspective
All things considered, the different architecture is the WiiU's biggest weakness, it takes a lot of dedication (And potential profit) to rewrite a game for a port, and that's quite a hurdle for any console to handle...
@ Quorthon, First, the Wii U has sold more units than the ps vita which was sold a year earlier. PS Vita= Fail. I don't disagree with your time line of the wii u lifespan, 2017. It won't be 2016 as the NX won't come out any earlier than 2017; though, I won't agree that Nintendo may begin to flush out the wii u by mid-late 2016. Between myself and my roommate we have both the ps4 and the wii u. We consistently play the wii u much more than the ps4. ps4 is fun if your into the milked genre of FPS but honestly, everyone knows FPS are best left on the pc along with graphics.
FOR CRYING OUT LOUD!!!! JUST GIVE IT TO US ALREADY!!!
@HappyMaskedGuy Yeah so carrying on like a bunch of kids on red bull is the right way to go about things then?
Acting like rational adults? Out of the question it seems. That's what my gibberish is about.
My post is the only one here that even matters as it showcases how huge of a liar Ian Bell and his associates are:
"What we´re going to make sure is that the Wii U version is not the worst one, it won´t be a crappy version. We want people to get the game and say `Holy s***, that looks amazing!´"
https://www.nintendolife.com/news/2013/04/project_cars_dev_making_sure_wii_u_doesnt_get_a_crappy_version
December 2013:
"The Wii U is more than capable of providing the core Project CARS experience. Sure, some super-high-level graphical effects may not be possible but in comparison it also offers a unique interaction experience via the GamePad controller, with the second screen potentially becoming your track map overview, rear-view mirror, telemetry, or simply mimicking a real race car steering wheel whilst you use the gyroscope to drive."
Source: https://www.nintendolife.com/news/2013/12/wii_u_more_than_capable_of_providing_the_core_project_cars_experience_says_developer
September 2014 :
"Tudor said he sees the game regularly and he's impressed with where it's at. "It's got dynamic time of day, weather--it looks phenomenal," he said. "And the actual console itself is quite good."
""It's not our job to disappoint those guys," he added. "So when we say the Wii U version is delayed in 2015 because we need a little more time, that's all it is. We just want to make sure it's of the same standard of all the other games. To do that, we just need a little more time."
Source: http://www.gamespot.com/articles/project-cars-wii-u-delay-theres-no-conspiracy-dev-/1100-6422143/
@DESS-M-8 3rd Parties were "turning" to the WiiU as well when it was announced. Look how that turned out. Unless the NX sells like Wii or DS 3RD parties aren't going near Nintendo again unless Nintendo Funds the Games like W101 Bayo2 and Devils Third.
And it doesn't even matter. Fans will always complain anyways. To me the Xbox1 has one game I care about, PS4 has 2 maybe 3
The PC has the Rest and WiiU I already have a lot of games and looking forward to some more. It's all tastes, advertisements and Sales Figures.
@Quorthon I'm sorry, WHAT?!
"When you want to blame the Wii U's ills on "launching with last-gen ports," you now need to explain why the XBO and PS4 sold, despite launching in exactly the same way."?!
Okay, you know what?
THAT IS A FLAT OUT MOTHERF#$%ING LIE.
They did NOT launch in the exact same way.
The PS4 and XBone released with Remasters and ports THAT FEATURED ALL OF THEIR CONTENT ON TOP OF PROPER OPTIMIZATION.
Ports of games like COD Ghosts, Sniper Elite V2, and plenty of others on Wii U, DID NOT GET THEIR FULL RANGE OF CONTENT WHEN THE SYSTEM COULD EASILY HAVE SUPPORTED IT, which DEVALUED them so badly that it caused the system's launch IRREPARABLE HARM.
Don't you even DARE try to claim there was equal treatment between the three system launches from third parties.
THERE WASN'T.
@Quorthon you're a funny person.
Never speak in absolutes.
NX could be: Next generation Nintendo console, a peripheral hardware for the ps4 or and xbox one: where nintendo makes next gen games for them acting as a secondary game developer/console company. Or, NX is a gaming Mobile software or and hardware. I want answers!! lol
@Quorthon though the difference with Sony PS3 situation is that they never really lost 3rd parties... at least not the ones that really mattered. The worse thing that happened was MS got the lion's share of timed 3rd party exclusives, (if I'm not misremembering) and lost a few as people preferred to program on the 360 because it was easier and their online infrastructure was better. Sony's biggest problem out the gate was they almost priced themselves out of the war. PS1 and 2 were rousing successes, so I honestly think not as much confidence was as lost as folks like to make it. Really the PS4's primary success came from the PR nightmare surrounding the XB1. And great marketing. Something that if done correctly by Nintendo, they'd be sitting on little more than the what - 9.5 million units that are out in the wild?
Concerning the Wii U, I don't even know what the world they can do to build 3rd party confidence at this point. All but very few have jumped jumped ship and I'm sure they have no intention of jumping back on. Pretty hard to build confidence on a machine that no third party has an inkling of interest in for every reason under the sun. The only move I think Nintendo has at this point, and I've said this before, is listen to the third parties in what they would like to see in the NX and find that healthy comprise between Nintendo's innovation (read: different) and approach in hardware philosophy, and the power and ease of programming that 3rd parties seem to be comfortable with. For all we know that could be going on behind the scenes right now and we're not privy to it because of NDAs and aren't figureheads of any of these establishments. But my guess is every bit as valid as yours. The best thing Nintendo can do now is continue churning out whatever games/DLC they have left slated for the Wii U, move a few more units and move on.
Though my main point is we can say this and that about what's going to happen or what's not going to happen, but despite any opinions you, me or anyone else have, I still think it's fair to say it's all conjecture, as none of us have crystal balls, so all we're doing is spouting predictions.
Oh for the record, I would have been one of those Nintendo fans (and have been) that buys third party games on their platform (within reason). You can't lump us all into the same category, granted I will concede that there's probably very few of us.
@tysonfury didn't nintendo open a big research centre in Tokyo a year or 2 back? With the increase in developers your idea is certainly feasible.
The Wii-U will collect more dust. What a shame. Back in the old days they would have just released it running at 15 Frames per second. I'm glad they came out and let everyone know it may not he possible
Let's all just buy Need For Speed most wanted U.
90s Arcade Racer, here's a shot!
@firstnesfan Wii U's CPU just isn't good enough to handle the graphical effects that the game uses.
@FJOJR The port is very underrated. In fact, I would say that Need For Speed: Most Wanted U is the most definitive and stellar version of the game.
I'm just going to say that I paid $60 for watch dogs on wii u and didn't mind. If I bought it day 1 for PS3, same price. I am enjoyed it on my gamepad. Worth it for that reason. I was looking forward to cars, but i guess not. I won't be getting this for my ps since I've already got gt5 and I just don't see the point if I can't use my gamepad to play.
Everyone needs to always remember how much of a liar Ian Bell is. Remember with your wallets in the future. We should never again support or believe anything that comes out of Ian Bell's mouth and his ship of fools at SMS. Pathetic.
@BLPs Good call. You'd be on the floor already otherwise.
@kereke12 Did the funders fund a NX version of this game? No! They funded a Wiiu version! So yeah they're mad they took the funders money! People like you should read more about the subject before they talk.
@Ichiban What about the people who funded this to get a Wiiu version? Nah screw them right? They don't deserve the game they funded,you should really read more about this before you call people spoiled.
From an article in this very same site posted on December 2013, these are the words of SM's Creative Director Andy Tudor:
"The Wii U is more than capable of providing the core Project CARS experience. Sure, some super-high-level graphical effects may not be possible but in comparison it also offers a unique interaction experience via the GamePad controller, with the second screen potentially becoming your track map overview, rear-view mirror, telemetry, or simply mimicking a real race car steering wheel whilst you use the gyroscope to drive.
Plus there are great possibilities to extend our existing WMD community into the Mii Community with discussion and sharing of content and ideas. There's no realistic racing game on the Wii U currently yet, and we hear the fans crying out for one. Project CARS provides a Forza or Gran Turismo-like experience for those gamers and it'll be something to really show off what the system is capable of. From our internal playing, it's looking extremely promising."
For everyone claiming that Wii U gamers funded this, I could have sworn I read that funding closed before this was anything other than a PC title. Sure, there was a poll, but I know WMD ran afoul of the authorities for group investment procedures. I don't think anyone funded expecting specifically a Wii U version.
gameers do u self a favor play wii,xbox 360 ps3 and previous gen...stop lettin devolpers cheat u and filin u full of crap...android and apple is better than this garbage...mobile is the future...stop payin high prices for reharsh...consoles is over rated washed up...
@SneakyStyle Right analog stick... it's how people played Gran Turismo for years.
So, you're saying there's a chance.
While I'm not familiar with the timeline of the funding, anyone who pledged for a wii u version should get a refund! Simple
What a bunch of scumbags.
No, Wii U was never a MAYBE. The platform was official before funding closed.
Dont buy into the lies people. This game is never coming to the "NX". They know as well as we do that system is years away. But they want to play dumb and take us for stupid by pretending that they believe the system is right around the corner, making new false promises of another version we'll never see.
That's okay. Take your money and get out. They say what goes around comes around, and I've got a feeling that one day this is definitely going to come around for them
weren't the Nintendo fans the ones that Kickstarted this thing? you have to feel really bad by them... but again anyone who really expected a third party AAA title not related to Lego or Sklyanders to make it to the Wii U in 2015 was being unrealistic
It's disappointing that the Wii U port is probably not going to happen. Oh well, I guess I will have to stick with Need for Speed: Most Wanted U
@Quorthon Those are the PC operating requirements which for better or worse have to be capable of dealing with a wide variety of hardware and a bloated OS consuming at minimum 1 GB or RAM in the background. At that time (May 2012) it was slated for two consoles with less specs than the Wii U.
Well, I think I remember these guys saying that they´ll show the real Wii U power, or something like that, and I don't really remember about they saying "maybe Wii U", they were always saying that it would launch on Wii U, too. Well, I was hoping to play this, but now I think I won't even buy it on PS4. Anyway, I think that's better than making a nasty trick like ubisoft did with watch dogs, launching it months later and I think at full price with no extras.
@Quorthon
Sir or Madam, pictures of two 3rd party games on a box doesn't by any stretch of the imagination equate to "3rd party support", at least not if you're comparing it to the ps1, ps2, and even the ps3's levels of 3rd party support. The n64 was as 3rd party-less as the gamecube, which sold enough to be considered a mild success.
Tell me again how exactly two video game consoles, both the Wii and DS can be considered statistical anomolies? Not one, but two? Throw into the mix the fact that Nintendo has been raking in the cash with Amiibo, and is now making money MAKING, not LOSING money with the help of the Wii U (not in spite of it) and you've lost me. Also, look at the 3ds. Is that also a statistical anomoly, which although selling less than the original DS still sells in significantly larger numbers than the vita and PSP?
The fact is, Nintendo systems have sold in varying numbers over the years, and sometimes systems like the original gameboy only hit their stride once mega blockbuster games came out for them (like pokemon). It's not as simple as "If nintendo doesn't get more 3rd party support they fail", because they're making money as a company, and yet 3rd party support is still virtually non existent. If Nintendo makes more 1st and 2nd party games, go try and tell any Wii U owner that it was a failure. You'll get some laughs.
@hobthebob The Wii was abnormal compared to the rest of Nintendo's system's. A large percentage of users where people who had no interest in console gaming. People who didn't purchace Mario or Zelda and where content with the pack in Wii sports and maybe Hannah Montana's crap fest Mini games extravaganza.
I'm sort of surprised NintendoLife is happy to just accept this when it flies in the face of everything they've said for years up to this point.
@Superryanworld The Wii was abnormal, but then I guess the DS was as well, right? And the 3ds is also abnormal, because that is also an undisputed success, right? Whether the Wii was abnormal is not of any consequence. What matters is profit, which is happening. If Nintendo has to rely on abnormal successes ala Amiibo, DS, Wii, and the original gameboy (because the gameboy was not Nintendo's first hand held, but was a surprise success), then so be it. It'll still get by, and lesser successes such as Wii U and Gamecube will do little more than urge the company to change and adapt to the changing gaming landscape.
@JustinH This isn't an opinion piece - NintendoLife is just reporting on what they heard.
So I wonder, what did this guy think every time Nintendo Life posted coverage of P Cars over the past many months? Did he ever consider writing in to the editors to say the game barely worked and was an afterthought and that there were no guarantees? And as for Nintendo Life, why did they trumpet what was essentially a hypothetical with so little substantive proof of existence? I guess this site is journalism, except when it isn't.
Well if not Wii U, then maybe the next system.
@smashbrolink Dude... chill out. You're raging out over something that's incredibly petty.
It is certainly interesting though how the PS4 sold right out of the gate without a score of great games alongside it. I would argue that it sold so well because Sony learned how to properly communicate with their audience. Sony's announcement of the PS4 was nothing short of perfect. Gamers and developers both knew exactly what they were getting their hands on, specs, features, and so on. Then at E3 2013, Sony blew Microsoft clear out of the water; they made fun of Microsoft's DRM policy, always-online hardware, and high price tag. Microsoft eventually corrected themselves and their image, but the damage still hasn't been totally undone; the console's sales (as opposed to Sony's) are a pretty good indication of that.
Nintendo has shown no such dexterity at communicating with an audience. The Wii U announcement at E3 2011 was such a muddled mess that few people knew what the hell the Wii U even was after the announcement. And with Nintendo's storied history of being difficult for third parties to work with, it's no surprise that some of the third party games that showed up on Wii U were ports with missing features. Nintendo fans like to blame the third parties themselves for not releasing certain features in their games, but fans never consider that maybe Nintendo (or the hardware) made it too difficult to include those features.
Even sadder is that many of the third party games that came out on Wii U weren't missing features and in some cases had additional features, and yet Nintendo fans still didn't buy them.
Looks like Slightly Mad just made everyone Hella Mad
@hobthebob The Wii and DS were anomalies to the extent that they hit right when casual gaming was on the rise, the "Soccer mom"-bracket discovered that games could be fun and bought Wii and DS in droves, but that market is all but gone now, Facebook and mobile games have taken that spot up quite nicely.
So it's time for Nintendo to address the core gamers again (The people who will buy dedicated gaming devices instead of playing mobile games on their phone/tablet), making the new device easier and thus cheaper to port games to would be a big plus, too
@smashbrolink Exactly, Wii U had the proper setup to allow things like all CoD DLC, Mass Effect Trilogy and many other 3rd party complete offerings but those 3rd parties were like no way and then released gimped or incomplete versions. For example why would you buy Mass Effect 3 if you hadn't played the first 2 games or didn't have the option to transfer your data from those.
Next time I'll need an excuse I'll begin with "By vote of the members..."
Please, less personal insults.-Morpheel
PSA: saying female dog is just as bad, or worse, than using the word you intended to use. The word you intended to use has been largely de-gendered. We all know what word you are trying to use, but now you are directly tying it to gender. Not a good look.
@MysticX Hey, you have a good point. The Wii and Ds were marketed toward a very different crowd. The only thing is, you have come to the conclusion that that crowd moved on and is a lost cause. Nintendo may not (and probably wont) have to cater to core gamers just to make a buck. They just need to cater to the same audience they got with the wii, with a console that is relevant to people like that. Although I agree, it might not be a bad thing to see Nintendo cater to core gamers with more powerful hardware, I am as yet unconvinced that Nintendo cant find their own niche within the gaming space, and dominate that.
We will have to see what e3 holds.
More lies? Ok, then. If I did fund it, though, I wouldn't be ok with it.
@hobthebob
Aw cripes, if you aren't going to pay attention, what's the damn point? I and another poster here have both gone to great lengths to illustrate how, why, and indeed that the Wii and DS were statistical anomalies. Since the NES and Game Boy, Nintendo has been on a gradual sales decline only broken by the Wii and DS, and immediately after the Wii and DS, their hardware continued on the exact same downward trajectory.
These numbers are extraordinarily easy to look up.
The GameCube, by the way, had better 3rd party support than the N64 precisely because for once, Nintendo delivered hardware on-par with the standards of the generation, which you'll note is exactly the opposite of the N64, Wii, and Wii U. However, even Nintendo largely considers the GC a failure, as Iwata very clearly stated that selling less than the GC would be considered such--a failure.
The GC was ultimately profitable, but it was not a success, and to pretend it was is borderline delusional. It sold worse than the Xbox and way worse than the PS2. Nintendo even resorted to trying to sell the GameCube as a companion console to the PS2 or XB rather than a competitive machine on it's own.
However, the GameCube did manage far better third party support than the N64 and the Wii U. But again, it was because it was the only post-SNES hardware Nintendo made that was actually, largely, equivalent to the generational norms of the time.
Is the 3DS a statistical anomaly? Hell no, because it falls right back into the trend that was moving before the DS launched. The GBA/Micro line sold worse than the Game Boy/Color line, and the 3DS is selling worse than the GBA/Micro line. It is continuing the downward trend.
It makes perfect sense that the Wii and DS would be anomalies at the same time. One helped boost popularity of the other, and they shared similar design sentiments that got lucky and struck a chord with consumers at that time. After that, though, the evidence that they were nothing but anomalies, fads, or trends is that--as has been painstakingly noted by more than just me on this site--the 3DS and Wii U returned to the downward trend.
By sales:
NES > SNES > N64 > GC < Wii > Wii U
GB/Color > GBA/Micro < DS > 3DS
The Wii and DS were anomalies. The pattern is still one of ever-decreasing market share and hardware sales numbers, and the Wii U and 3DS continue the trend that was followed by the previous generations. Because the Wii U and 3DS didn't just fall to "below Wii and DS" numbers, they actually fall below pre-Wii and DS numbers.
It is actually like this:
NES > SNES > N64 > GC > Wii U
GB/Color > GBA/Micro > 3DS/New
In every way, the Wii and DS were anomalies. Flukes. Fads. Trends. A temporary lucky strike. After which, Nintendo returned to their "normal" which is, unfortunately, a lengthy history of gradually becoming irrelevant.
And the point about the games on the N64 box was to directly address the deliberate stupidity that Nintendo "never relied on 3rd parties." Yes, yes they totally did. They relied on 3rd parties to the point of promoting the games on the damn box for the console. Without revenue from sales of 3rd party games, Nintendo's strength and reach is severely hampered.
@JaxonH
I don't think NX is years away. I expect to see it launch next year. However, I agree--this game isn't coming to it. They're not going to sit on this game for another 6~10 months waiting for Nintendo to get the necessary information on NX out and then hope to release it again in late 2016 or early 2017.
Right now, they're trying to do some damage control, but I think they should just cut their losses.
@Quorthon
They should just say it and be done with it instead of beating around the bush
@Sir_JBizzle
I don't lump all Nintendo fans together--as you said, there are those of us who do buy 3rd party. I didn't play Call of Duty until I bought the Wii U. After three years with the series, though, I recognize whey they're popular, but I want something different (hooray for Bloodborne!) to me. But I recognize the general Nintendo audience and the over-arching trends. When I generalize that "Nintendo fans don't buy 3rd party," I am noting the wider market trends, which completely support this statement. For every one of us that buys a 3rd party game, there's a couple thousand who don't. Third parties are profitable on other consoles, but not on Nintendo.
Nintendo fans love to cast the blame to the 3rd parties, but the problem is actually from Nintendo and the fans. Nintendo's gimped hardware prevents 3rd parties from getting the most out of the system. Would you want to sell gigabytes of DLC on a console that has almost no storage space? No, that's a huge freaking gamble. Then the fans naturally ignore games that aren't from a few key Nintendo franchises--a behavior found only in Nintendo fans, and not in Sony or Microsoft fans, who are just as likely to buy 3rd party as 1st.
While I note that Nintendo should be repairing those 3rd party relationships now, I do agree with you that there may be no way to do that with the Wii U. At this point, I think the longer the Wii U is out, the worse things are going to be for Nintendo.
I use the PS3 analogy because it was Sony's major misstep. Kind of like the Saturn was for Sega. Nintendo's decisions now are critical--the NX can either be their PS4 (a return to form) or their Dreamcast (their last hurrah). Going by what we know, I expect it will be the latter. And I've reached a point now where I'm starting to prefer that.
@JaxonH
I'm sure they're in a tough spot. They don't want to just have to scrap all the hard work they've put into the Wii U version, but at the same time, it may not be financially feasible to continue. It's probably a tug-of-war in that office of "do we just drop this or not?"
While Nintendo stated "No NX at E3," I think these guys are still waiting for either E3 or TGS to see if NX information arrives, and if it doesn't, they'll pull the plug completely. I think they're sincere in that they don't want to give up on the Wii U, but this is a company with lots of employees that they need to pay and care for. They may have to make a tough decision to save the company over delivering to a small group of people.
We forget as gamers how big this industry really is now. How much money and expense and time is involved. When I tested games for Activision, I worked 72-hour weeks for the bulk of that time. There's so much to consider in these things. And the decisions cannot be made quickly or easily.
@Quorthon
I refuse to believe that two consoles simultaneously hit a "lucky strike" as you put it. Whatever the numbers say, they do not tell the whole story.
Numbers, like the ones you posted, only prove that Nintendo has had fluctuating hardware sales over the years, with a notable but temporary rise in sales during the Wii/Ds era. That in itself does not mean anything. In fact, if you wanted to look at it from a different perspective, the Nes and original Gameboy were at the top of the curve, which inevitably dropped due to something called regression toward the mean. They were the anomolies, as were the Wii and Ds, which were outliers, extreme, and yes, even lucky. Due to lucky breaks such as the NES, Gameboy, Wii, and Ds, Nintendo continues to make millions of dollars, even when it sells fewer cosoles than the supposed competition. In fact, looked at from this perspective, the smaller sales numbers of SNES, N64, Gamecube, and Wii U, although showing an obvious decline, are not as drastic as you make them seem. Nintendo isn't failing, and the Wii U wasn't a failure, it's just struggling a little to gain a foothold.
You can't call the Wii U a failure for selling 10 million units, because it still serves to buoy the company, which can't be said for Sony's Vita, as the company just discontinued support for it. Relatively speaking, 3ds has been a huge success, if you take the PSVita into account.
Relatively speaking, the Wii U has been a huge success, if you take the Ouya into account, and if you look at the numbers from a different perspective.
at least they tried to make a Wii U version, unlike a lot of these so call "AAA" company's who just say "we can't make a Wii U version"
@hobthebob They just need to cater to the same audience they got with the Wii.
The casuals are gone for good and are not coming back. That crowd hardly contributed to software sales and would never be as reliable as the core gamer.
@Superryanworld I understand your position, and I agree that in a traditional setting, the casual gamers are not a reliable source of income for Nintendo or anyone else, but all I am saying is that Nintendo is traditionally nontraditional, and may have something up their sleeves.
@Project_Dolphin
The preferences of Nintendo fans are one of the reasons Nintendo is in the situation is is in today. How you spend your money matters, and when you spend your money on Zelda remakes while ignoring new games or 3rd party titles, you create an environment where Nintendo has now churned out 3 Zelda remakes in 4 years.
It's less about "blame" as it is a causal relationship. And how Nintendo fans choose to spend or not spend their money greatly affects the hardware and the bottom line of the company as a whole. It can be said that since the general Nintendo consumer wants nothing but a few primary franchise games and little else, they want Nintendo to just make Mario-Zelda-Pokemon games, and to stop making hardware.
@hobthebob
That you refuse to believe something does not change the facts or reality or the statistical understanding of the systems.
The Wii and DS were the right systems at the right time. They found an audience that was ready for them. But they had no longevity, and they pandered to people following trends or fads--which means they pandered to a temporary audience, and the evidence is in the Wii U and 3DS, which--yet again--fell to below pre-Wii/DS sales levels. Which means the Wii and DS were, in fact, flukes.
Nintendo has not had "fluctuating" hardware sales over the years unless you have no idea what the word "fluctuating" means. Fluctuating would be more along the lines of sales that go up and down and are different every generation. This has not been the case. Instead of actually fluctuating, they have been dropping, and you can believe foolishness all you want, but the numbers will prove you wrong. Nintendo's hardware has been on a downward trend since the NES and Game Boy--and it has never fluctuated, it has always gone down--with the exception of the two anomalies.
The rest of your post is absurdly sad special pleading. You again pull the old Nintendo fanboy rant of "Vita failure" while magically calling the Wii U "not a failure." Again, the Vita has sold better than the Wii U and has more games coming to it in 2015. There is also no news at all for Sony discontinuing the Vita, which is a lie you have just completely made up. If you have to invent things to back up your point, your point was wrong to begin with.
"Relatively speaking, the Wii U is a big success.... compared to Ouya."
This is the dumbest thing I've read online in a long time--and again, this is the internet. Nice try, kid, but you should've quit while you were ahead. You stepped over a line: Obvious troll is obvious.
@Superryanworld
You just said they should appeal to the casual audience, then explained why they shouldn't.
@Project_Dolphin
Per the fans, actually, yes they are doing something different concerning how they buy games. Sony and Microsoft fans actually buy 3rd party games. That's why they have them.
@Quorthon I was quoting an earlier comment. I guess proper punctuation would have helped.
@Project_Dolphin
Everything in this first post, about Nintendo doing software only is blind assumption based on nothing. The Wii proves that if Nintendo's games are on popular hardware, they will have sales. Well, Nintendo's hardware isn't popular, but Microsoft's and Sony's are. They would make a fortune on those machines. You're basically saying Nintendo will somehow do better selling games on the Wii U, with an audience of less than 10 million, than they would on the PS4, which looks very likely to easily top 100 million. That consoles don't make a profit is pointless in this, unless you want to recall that Nintendo has been losing money on the Wii U--while Sony has been profiting on the PS4. Which is another good reason for Nintendo to go third party.
As per gaming preferences, yes, Nintendo fans are still doing things very differently. Nintendo fans are the only group that has a clear and ever-present adversarial relationship towards third parties, frequently taking personal offense to the decisions of game corporations. Nintendo fans also notably ignore 3rd party games, which is not something you find with MS or Sony fans. Their buying habits are very different. If you look at the top selling games on any console, you'll find a mix of first and third party on MS and Sony machines, but almost only Nintendo titles on Nintendo machines. Regardless of quality, third party games are seemingly deliberately not supported by the influential majority of Nintendo fans.
@Superryanworld
Gotcha.
@Quorthon I'm not the one throwing around insults. That person is you. If you can't debate in a civil manner, you should probably stay off the internet. I found your language to be offensive and your tone to be intentionally inflammatory. I don't name call, and I don't treat others harshly. Maybe you should grow up.
@Quorthon You have openly admitted in NL news comments that you hate Nintendo games. Most 3rd Party games are Multiplatform. So you probably buy them on PS4. Yet you slag off people here for not buying 3rd party games on Nintendo platform. Hypocracy at the highest level
@hobthebob
What a coincidence, I don't name call either. I do, however, address post content for what it is. For instance, comparing the Wii U to the Ouya and saying that "relatively speaking, it's a big success" is incredibly ridiculous. The Ouya bombed hard, unfortunately, after launch. That's like saying the Atari Lynx was a great success compared to, say, the Virtual Boy--one of the most ill-conceived game systems ever made. Surely, that is trolling. I refuse to believe anyone is so daft as to think that was an intelligent thing to say. I have a little more confidence in humanity than that.
Frankly, if you can only call the Wii U a "success" by comparing it to a major flop, then the Wii U itself is a major flop. That's like saying a rock-solid, ant-covered donut I find in a dumpster is "pretty good food" compared to the maggot-infested raccoon carcass lying next to it. Relatively speaking, sure, that donut is still pretty good food. But in reality, no, that's not what I would call good food.
"The Wii U is a success relatively compared to the Ouya." Okay. So is the Saturn.
@Project_Dolphin
I really don't know how long you've been reading comments from gamers online, but I've been on here for the better part of a year now and on GameInformer since 2006 or something. Nintendo fans have long made a very clear distinction--they will buy "anything MZP" first and foremost, over anything else.
When 3rd parties do not make games for Nintendo systems, Nintendo fans have a long history of attacking those third parties. Nintendo fans do make this distinction. And they have for years.
And I used to be one of that crowd.
How dare Nintendo fans not spend their money on poor quality ports and instead buy games that are actually good! Shame, SHAME! /s
@Quorthon Sir or Madam,
To quote you, "Obvious troll is obvious."
That is indeed name calling, and trying to skew, bend, or break the truth of the matter does not change that fact. You're good, but not THAT good.
Second, by comparing the Wii U to the Ouya, I am simply comparing one money making video game console to one that failed to make money. I never compared the Ouya to the Virtual boy, or any silliness such as that, because that would be ridiculous.
Why compare two consoles that never made any money, and probably cost their producers a whole ton of money? Your logic is called false equivalence. Wii U is making money, and ultimately assists Nintendo. Ouya did not, and neither did the Virtual Boy or the Saturn.
Also, take a look at the term "regression to the mean" and you'll likely see that my assessment of your numbers is valid. If you look at the NES, Gameboy, Wii, and DS as outliers or exreme scores, then Nintendo's fall from grace has been far less severe than you posit. Your point of view is as much a subjective interpretation of a set of numbers as mine is, which incidentally, is my point. Numbers won't tell you anything. Statistics will. Go take a course in statistics, and then come back so we can chat.
Honestly, I would have bought this day one, but, let's be real here people. The Wii U simply isn't powerful enough to run this beast. I think Slightly Mad overestimated their ability to port such a "dense?" game onto such a technologically limited system. Doesn't give them excuses to pocket the wii u kickstarter cash, but there are disclaimers (is there not?) that say donate at your own risk. So ultimately, people have no right to complain.
Oh well, no big loss; ima get Project Cars for PC.
@Remisio when we're 3rd parties "turning" to wii u? All this next gen is rubbish. Nintendo have taken a total miss step with Wii U. Xbox, I wouldn't have one given and I have a ps4 and NO games cause there's none worth the money. I have a ps3 which makes more than 90% of the Ps4 library redundant. I have LOADS of games for wii u and I personally rate it as best console ever. But Nintendo aren't supporting it properly and it's library is really under delivering on its potential.
N64 gamecube and assorted (saturn dreamcast) other consoles should have been on VC from day one. Metroid, FZERO and zelda should have released in year one. There has been no real big bang on wii u at any point.
NX has the potential to make some real noise as the first true next gen console and delivering on software, hardware and infrastructure. All other current next gen arenonly delivering on 1 out of those 3
I only cared about this game because it was coming to the Wii U and they positioned it as Nintendo's only serious racing sim.
I would have liked it but since this is now not coming to the Wii U I don't care about it I mean Microsoft have Forza and Sony have Gran Turismo.
This game is going to be forgotten as soon as Microsoft and Sony release their big hitters.
@DESS-M-8 I agree with what you said 100% next gen rubbish compared to last gen when consoles were the main place for gaming.
Now you have companies like Konami jumping ship for mobile gaming.
All this talk of power and the PS4 and Xbox one are barely mid level last gen PCs.
Nintendo release schedule is in reverse they position their handheld as their main gaming platform so all of the games I would have loved on the Wii U.
Like Pilot Wings , Starfox , Zelda Ocarina of Time, Majora's mask.
All on 3DS with no mention of console versions at all.
I mean I must be going back a bit but I remember when big titles were released on consoles first and hand held versions later.
I guess Nintendo like other games developers go where the money is.
@FlaygletheBagel
While I agree that Nintendo's representation of the Wii U, from opening year of first party games to ongoing advertisement, was pretty crappy, at the same time, you know as well as I do that NO amount of sales success would have made those third party ports sell on Wii U.
Period.
And if by "many third party games came out without problems", you mean " a very small minority" then you would be correct.
Of them, I'd say POSSIBLY Need for Speed and Deus Ex, but even they were late ports.
Go ahead and try naming a third party port on Wii U, and I guarantee you that in 99% of examples, I will be able to point out to you why not only Nintendo fans, but also third party game lovers, were convinced, by those very third party games themselves, to avoid third party multiplats on the Wii U, and how they could have avoided the issue and made profits off of the Wii U instead, like Platinum did with Bay 2, like Capcom did with MH3U, and like indies have most recently been doing thanks to the first ever console humble bundle.
Oh, and do not call my complaints petty, especially after all the support I showed to third party multiplats during the first year and a half of the Wii U's life.
Yeah, I'm ticked.
And as a paying customer who is used to seeing these third parties do so much better with their games, even on last gen consoles like PS3, I have every right to be.
Especially when dealing with an apologist ( not you) who claims that third party's treatment of Nintendo's fans was "exactly the same", when anyone with any lick of sense knows that it was NOT.
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