As I mostly just have my Wii connected to my CRT I acually don´t have a problem right now but I´d like as most of us.. throw it out and make room for a phat Plasma For the fun of it I will try the wiimote/nunchuk buttons. Does somebody happen to know what buttons to press? When I think about it, wasn´t this some workaround to allow users to play vc games through their expensive component cables?
nintendo: "Some Virtual Console games default to displaying 240 lines of video. Some HD TV's are unable to display a signal with only 240 lines. Try the steps below to set the Wii to output 480 lines of video, which may solve the problem:
While on the Wii Channel Menu (main screen of the Wii), connect a Nunchuk to Wii Remote.
Select the Virtual Console game from the Wii menu, then select "Start" to begin the game.
When the game starts, press the Home button on the Wii Remote. (In many games, the music can be heard when the game starts.)
Select "Operations Manual" from the Home menu.
Press the Z + A + 2 Button simultaneously (the Z Button is on the Nunchuk). A sound will be heard if the button combination has been entered correctly.
Close the Home menu. The game should now display correctly. Note: You will not have to do this the next time you play, as the Wii console will remember these settings."
No Lag, No upscaling, perfect Color, Black levels(Almost) and Motion. Oh how I love my Dinosaur heavy Sony 32" Wega FlatScreen 480i CRT SDTV. using Component Cables if course
If only it were Widescreen and ProgressiveScan, than I'd be blowing my wad. But as it is, it's still amazing for the Wii. I've seen 480p 32" FullScreen CRT's, even one on Craigs list at the time...I was so tempted just to get that extra(and awesome) Progressive Scan. But eh, it would be a pain in the lugging that heavy best into my place ect ect.
Okay, I'm annoyed by the LCD bashing. 1. Lag - there is no noticeable lag on my LCD TV. I believe the response time is ~5 ms. If you tell me you can notice that, you are wrong. 2. Upscaling - The issue isn't with the number of pixels on screen, it's simply the size of the screen. Giant pixels are not better than more pixels. Unless the TV does a bad job with anti-aliasing. If you had a 90" 480i CRT, I guarantee it would not look better than a 90" 1080p LCD TV, even if the game is rendering in 480i resolution. 3. Black levels - Good LCDs have good black levels. 4. Motion? LCD TVs provide output at 60Hz, 120Hz, and 240Hz, depending on the TV (mine is 120). The human eye can process 50 images per second (50 Hz).
I wish everyone would stop clinging to their CRTs and open themselves to the beatiful world of HD. I've played Twilight Princess on a 32" CRT and a 46" LCD. One of them provided a much better experience. New Super Mario Bros. Wii was incredible on the 46", as are Bit.Trip Runner and Cave Story.
There is no game I've played that I felt was better (or would be better) on a CRT than on either of my LCDs.
I wish everyone would stop clinging to their CRTs and open themselves to the beatiful world of HD.
Actually, the real problem isn't a low adoption of HD sets. The problem many of us are lamenting is that HD was adopted far too early across the board, long before the tech even came close to catching up to CRTs in a number of crucial areas. Yes, there are now many higher-end LCDs with good black levels, low lag, more acceptable upscaling, and smoother motion, but the fact remains that the vast majority of HD sets sitting in living rooms across the nation make standard-def content look far, far worse than it did on the CRTs that those sets replaced. I see this all the time when I go over to someone's house and play their Wii on their LCD set (most of these sets having been bought a couple years ago, or just a little more recently than that). People were wowed by the higher resolution in the stores, and the manufactures needed the next-big-thing to push sales again, but the tech wasn't ready yet in so many important ways if you really care about image quality beyond mere resolution.
On the particular bits you're talking about: 1. Lag - The lag is low on many models now, but you have to be extremely careful to research before buying an HD set, or you may have considerable lag. However, you are correct that this issue is fading into the past.
2. Upscaling - "Unless the TV does a bad job with anti-aliasing" - nearly all of them do. I'll never forget how horrible LoZ:4 Swords (GC) looked when I brought to a friend's apartment to play on his new HD set, which wasn't very different in size from my CRT at the time. Everything looked so pixellated it pretty much ruined the beautiful 2D graphics of the game.
"If you had a 90" 480i CRT, I guarantee it would not look better than a 90" 1080p LCD TV, even if the game is rendering in 480i resolution." I beg to differ, I see this all the time. The edges are smoother on the more natural look of a CRT (when running at standard-def resolutions). Everything looks jagged on many HD sets. Not all, because some have better upscaling, but it's a widespread problem nonetheless. Even with a large CRT, you won't see the oft-mentioned Wii "jaggies" at all, but with many of the large LCD sets, you'll barely be able to look past the jaggies long enough to get immersed in the game. Again, I've played GC and Wii on large CRTs, and it looks smooth.
3. Black levels - definitely improving on newer high-end models, but I walk through the local electronics stores regularly, and the majority of the more budget-priced LCD sets (that sell like hotcakes) have awful black levels that you can spot from across the room.
4. Motion - don't talk about those "enhanced" refresh rates, they're a god-awful invention. I first encountered those on Samsung sets that called it "Movie Plus," where it would essentially splice in extra frames, supposedly to smoothen out the film experience. In fact, it was really just a correction for the motion blurring inherent in those sets; since keeping each frame up for the usual time span caused a blurring effect in those pixels (a problem completely foreign to CRTs), they had to bump up the refresh rate. Since the film you're watching doesn't have those extra frames, the set would add them programmatically. What it resulted in was the absolute worst film experience possible, giving everything a sped-up feel that killed the natural motion of the film itself.
Now that feature (which, again, was only to correct an inherent flaw in LCDs) has been pushed farther and offered as a bonus. For sports or something of that nature, I might be able to see the purpose, but it still makes films look horrendous, by giving the motion an unnatural look and by speeding up the film so that it starts to look like it was shot on a different type of camera. You can't take a classic film which looks beautiful in its original 24 frames/sec and then just magically bump it up to a higher refresh without making it look ridiculous.
By the way, my primary TV is now a Panasonic plasma, and while I'm mostly satisfied with it, I have many complaints. There's no question that my old CRT was better at some things. Mario Galaxy looks great on the plasma, but RE4 looks a hundred times worse than it did on my nice CRT, no matter how much I tweak settings. Is it so much to ask for the newest generation of tech to wait until it has truly surpassed the last gen in all ways, rather than being a compromise where you get a couple flashy features but lose others?
Again, as you point out, you can buy LCD sets now that have solved pretty much all the problems, but they're more expensive, and the LCD market is still pushing sub-par tech into countless homes, making me cringe when I go over to houses of acquaintances and see how bad their viewing experience is.
Twitter is a good place to throw your nonsense. Wii FC: 8378 9716 1696 8633 || "How can mushrooms give you extra life? Get the green ones." -
Again, as you point out, you can buy LCD sets now that have solved pretty much all the problems, but they're more expensive, and the LCD market is still pushing sub-par tech into countless homes, making me cringe when I go over to houses of acquaintances and see how bad their viewing experience is.
It does bother me when, during Black Friday sales, I see people pushing their cart out of the store with an Olevia, Polaroid, or Westinghouse (though the latter is not as bad as the two former) LCD TVs. Those look horrrrrible. But in comparing a (somewhat) high-end LCD to a CRT, I see only advantages in the LCD. The 60Hz vs. 120Hz vs. 240Hz is kind of an odd phenomenon. If the human eye can only process 50 images per second, why does a TV need to output 240 frames per second?
And when I said "everyone", I of course don't mean everyone. HD TV sets are pretty widespread. I mean the people in these forums that love their CRT and proclaim that they will always hold on to one for retro gaming. Also the people that are recommending old CRT sets to other people because LCD is horrible for gaming and Plasma is only slightly better. For $1000 you can get a really, really nice LCD TV that will enhance your gaming experience, even on the Wii.
Now, I know not everyone has $1000 to spare. But there's really no use in comparing high-end CRTs to low-end LCDs. If someone is considering an LCD, maybe they actually have the money to buy a nice one and don't need to hear recommendations for a 32" Sony WEGA that will only hold them back from viewing movies, TV, and HD games the way that they should be viewed.
neither plasma nor LCD are going to evolve beyond the problems they have now, mainly because at this point it would be simpler just to invent a better tv type than tweak the same flawed designs each year. OLED takes everything good about LCD a step further while ditching every problem they have, so with any luck they'll be the first 'perfect' hdtvs; i just hope that they don't neglect to improve SD performance along with the HD, but the way things are going, you may not even be able to connect anything that's not HDMI.
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Topic: Why do LCD TVs cause pointer lag but not button-press lag? Answer: They don't
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