Hate to burst someone's bubble, but didn't Sakurai basically say he wasn't continuing Kid Icarus? I mean, it follows logic. This is a guy who hates sequalizing his creations. The reason he keeps doing Smash is because he can't imagine a Smash without him, but Kid Icarus was around before him and will likely continue to exist afterwards.
@Rexcalibr: I think it's because Tomodatchi Life was a 3DS exclusive that they did that, like Lumiose City and the Golden Plains stage. Gotta give some stages exclusively to the 3DS version, and I think they've done a good job. The one I'll always be miffed about is Magicant though, why you no give us HD Magicant Sakurai?
I just put it on there for a few 1v1's and it told me I have to wait 10 minutes for disconnecting from the last match.My last match was yesterday and I never disconnected as far as i can remember.Even if I had,surely the 10 minute ban doesn't carry over till the next time you want to play?
@OorWullie I've had that a couple times... No clue how it happens, I think both times I was also spectating the day before I tried to go online.
I also hate how now in my records it says that I've purposely disconnected from 2 matches.
Now here's something interesting. There's a guy on GameFAQs that claims to have been working for a 3rd party marketing company doing market research for Smash 4, and he claims that he got access to the Ballot results, among other information.
Apparently Bayonetta being #1 in Europe and "Top 5" in America were only after non-picks were excluded. In terms of raw data, Bayonetta was #9 in America, and #3 in Europe.
For DLC, they had decided to only include one Melee vet and one Brawl vet, and after an internal vote, they decided on Lucas and Roy. Due to this, veterans were dismissed completely from the Ballot, unless they did extremely well in multiple regions, which didn't happen.
The characters that placed above Bayonetta in America (in no particular order) were Snake, Goku, Sora, Banjo Kazooie, Isaac, Shovel Knight, Wolf, and Inkling. Snake, Goku, Sora, and Banjo were considered completely unrealizable (obviously due to legal reasons). The others either didn't do well in other regions or were placed on lower priority.
Apparently characters considered "Impossible" were outright ignored: Non-video game characters (Goku, Shrek), already deconfirmed characters (Ridley, Ice Climbers), certain 3rd party characters (including most indies and opposing console exclusive characters, though this is a gray area), and real people.
The other category was "Irrelevant characters". These characters weren't outright ignored, but were placed on the lowest priority because the dev team couldn't rationalize their inclusion over other choices to Nintendo's corporate heads and some investors. This primarily consisted of characters that weren't deemed to have an immediate future in Nintendo marketing. This is where characters like King K Rool, Isaac, Inkling, and the veterans were placed. In Inkling's case, the character was initially deemed "irrelevant" due to Splatoon being too new to properly gauge interest, but they then reconsidered. However, Inkling was deemed too cost inefficient due to needing to change the game's engine to properly portray the ink mechanic.
Another factoid was that Mewtwo was initially planned for the base game, but then both him and Lucario were soon planned to be DLC to test the waters. A small group had worked on Lucario on the side though, and were therefore able to get him in the base game. So yes, Sakurai essentially lied. DLC was planned from the get go in some sense, but at the same time he didn't lie because Mewtwo wasn't worked on until the base game had finished development and was on the production lines.
TL;DR: If this guy is to be believed, various characters didn't get in because of various reasons.
Here's the rundown:
-Mewtwo, Lucario: Both were moved to be DLC, but Lucario was secretly being worked on by a small group and was finished in time for the base game.
-Lucas, Roy: There was to be one Melee vet and one Brawl vet for DLC (other than Mewtwo). After an internal vote, they decided on these two.
-Corrin: It was determined that they wanted a character from a recently released or upcoming game. Sakurai's staff convinced him to pick Corrin, and he's arguably more marketable than the likes of Elma or even Impa.
-Bayonetta: Ballot winner.
-Wolf: Veterans were deemed irrelevant after Lucas and Roy were chosen through internal voting. Didn't receive enough worldwide votes for them to reconsider.
-Young Link, Pichu: See Wolf.
-Snake: Not even considered - deemed impossible due to legal issues (**** Konami)
-Banjo & Kazooie: Deemed impossible - legal issues, Microsoft ownership despite what Phil Spencer said.
-King K Rool: Not been used in a long time, so he was deemed irrelevant. North American fanbase was vocal enough to warrant a Mii costume though.
-Isaac: Irrelevant due to poor sales of Golden Sun.
-Inkling: Initially considered irrelevant due to Splatoon being brand new, was then reconsidered. Ultimately deemed to be cost inefficient, so it got a Mii costume.
-Ice Climbers: Technical issues, already deconfirmed.
-Ridley: Already deconfirmed.
-Shovel Knight, Shantae: Indies were apparently disregarded, and deemed "impossible".
-Rayman: Probably legal issues, not enough votes.
-Dixie Kong: Not deemed irrelevant, but probably didn't receive enough votes.
-Shrek, Goku, John Cena, etc.: Impossible - not video game characters.
-Sora: Deemed impossible - legal issues with Disney.
Funny thing: Vote for Shrek, Spongebob, John Cena, etc. weren't considered to be legitimate votes, and were tossed out. Votes for Goku on the other hand were actually considered to be legitimate votes.
So yeah, it's pretty interesting if true. Take it with a grain of salt though. It seems pretty believable though.
Not surprised by the characters chosen above Bayonetta, though some of them do surprise me that they choose over Bayonetta like Inklings(especially considering how big Splatoon has gotten). So it kinda makes this a bit sketchy. I can see them choosing Bayonetta due to the surprise factor(not many people actually expected her)
Also if it's true that Isaac was actually one of the top characters I will cry, he was a character I wanted the most
-Mewtwo, Lucario: Both were moved to be DLC, but Lucario was secretly being worked on by a small group and was finished in time for the base game.
I figured that because Lucario was from Brawl, he'd be easier to work on, so it makes sense
-Lucas, Roy: There was to be one Melee vet and one Brawl vet for DLC (other than Mewtwo). After an internal vote, they decided on these two.
Sounds like Mewtwo was a character considered since the game began, and considering Roy's competition, he got lucky. And I guess the folks really love Mother
-Corrin: It was determined that they wanted a character from a recently released or upcoming game. Sakurai's staff convinced him to pick Corrin, and he's arguably more marketable than the likes of Elma or even Impa.
Corrin's game will probably be out by the time he's released, so they're probably hoping to gauge interest whereas Elma and Impa's games have been out for a while
-Wolf: Veterans were deemed irrelevant after Lucas and Roy were chosen through internal voting. Didn't receive enough worldwide votes for them to reconsider.
-Young Link, Pichu: See Wolf.
Unlike Pichu and Young Link, I'm still surprised Wolf didn't come back, as he seemed like a shoe-in, especially with a new game coming out(and he's confirmed to return in it
-Snake: Not even considered - deemed impossible due to legal issues (**** Konami)
Ballot started around the time Konami went crazy. Good to know I can still blame Konami for this
-Banjo & Kazooie: Deemed impossible - legal issues, Microsoft ownership despite what Phil Spencer said.
I doubt Phil Spencer has much of a say in it, as much as I hate to say it. They'd still have to get through the corporate heads at Microsoft
-King K Rool: Not been used in a long time, so he was deemed irrelevant. North American fanbase was vocal enough to warrant a Mii costume though.
aw snap
-Isaac: Irrelevant due to poor sales of Golden Sun.
Did they really have to get rid of him as an assist trophy though? Now his complete omission on top of this feels like a swift kick to the balls of Golden Sun fans
-Inkling: Initially considered irrelevant due to Splatoon being brand new, was then reconsidered. Ultimately deemed to be cost inefficient, so it got a Mii costume.
yet they had no problem including Corrin. This post alone makes this guys claims really sketchy to me. To me it still feels like a huge waste of not to capitalize on Splatoon's success
As much as I hate to admit it, I think we need to move on from Ridley
-Shovel Knight, Shantae: Indies were apparently disregarded, and deemed "impossible".
From a business standpoint this makes sense. While Indie devs were perfectly happy with getting their characters in Smash(Yacht and Wayforward had entire campaigns for Shantae and Shovel Knight for f***'s sake), they likely wouldn't have gotten a strong enough reaction or interest to make money, especially compared to the likes of Ryu and Cloud
-Rayman: Probably legal issues, not enough votes.
Also pretty sketchy considering he got a lot of support and the fact that he already has a trophy in the game
-Dixie Kong: Not deemed irrelevant, but probably didn't receive enough votes.
It's possible they could have thought she would've been too similar to Diddy Kong
-Shrek, Goku, John Cena, etc.: Impossible - not video game characters.
Shocker
-Sora: Deemed impossible - legal issues with Disney.
People need to realize that Square doesn't own the character so they don't have much of a say on his chances. Nintendo would have to go to Disney and Disney would probably rather include The Mouse himself instead(and Disney is as stingy as Nintendo when it comes to how they treat their characters and IPs
Funny thing: Vote for Shrek, Spongebob, John Cena, etc. weren't considered to be legitimate votes, and were tossed out. Votes for Goku on the other hand were actually considered to be legitimate votes.
So Isaac had no marketing future.. but we got Duck Hunt... which, just got a VC release.
Where was this logic when Ice Climbers were added in Melee? Their original game was bleh, and they only have that ONE game to their name.
Nothing against those characters, mind. But this just seems to be more "rules" that have blatent contradictions. At this point, it's confirmed that there are only two rules; character in question has to have originated in a video game, and they or their franchise has to have been featured on Nintendo's systems. Every other "rule"? Horribly bent with Cloud's reveal, and obliterated with Bayonetta's. We really don't have any more excuses for why any given Nintendo character CAN'T be in Smash, and I'm not sure we have many (or any) for 3rd parties who fit the above two criteria.
And who knows when those last two rules might get thrown out. Now THAT'LL be something to watch.
Any "rules" that have existed have began losing meaning ever since Snake was included in Brawl. I think that the only rules relevant now are 1) Video Game character 2) appeared on a Nintendo console 3) Sakurai feels like it
To be completely fair, it's hard to verify this guy, if not impossible. Not sure if I can necessarily trust the guy. Still interesting nonetheless.
@DarthNocturnal I imagine most of these business logistics and "rules" only apply because it's DLC. The base game roster wouldn't have business logistics holding it down anywhere near as much.
@Megas75 Well, the guy didn't address Rayman specifically as far as reasoning goes. He did say that Rayman was 10th in North America. What I put was actually more speculation on my part. The character was probably just unlucky.
As for Inkling, he claims that the character was deemed irrelevant at first due to the franchise being too new to properly gauge interest. This was before the game's breakout success. It was reconsidered, but they decided that it was too cost inefficient - as in, it wasn't worth spending the time to heavily modify the game's engine to be able to properly portray the ink mechanics. So, it was a combination of technical issues combined with a lack of time. Seems plausible to me. Even if this guy isn't legit, he's probably right about Inkling.
If this guy's claims are true, then Wolf had some horrible luck. That's about all I can say there.
Another thing: Apparently Intelligent Systems staff were brought in to work on Corrin conceptually, and they had been pushing for more anime-like influence to be used than Smash normally uses for humanoid characters.
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