Topic: Xenoblade Chronicles 2

@Matt_Barber @Knighty_IX Thanks for the help. That was really useful. Some of those things I would never have guessed.

Happy anniversary to the game!

Unfortunately today someone mentioned the scene with Rex and Mythra, you know THAT scene, and didn’t exactly leave me in mood to celebrate. It’s so unbelievably cringe...I HATE IT I HATE IT I HATE IT. I want to @ whoever wrote that scene on Twitter and BEG them to speak to a real human woman their age...but on the other hand that would mean a woman would have to interact with HIM and wishing that on anyone would be misogyny.

@horizonisland Happy anniversary too, and that is an unfortunate predicament.

@theJGG lollllll maybe so. I still love the game though, even if it has its...quirks.

@horizonisland I said this on Unpopular Gaming Opinions but Xenoblade 2 feels derivative of 1 in terms of scope, and setting. Fan service is strange, and the anime tropes are very inconsistent...

@theJGG Those are all valid complaints. 2 was my first Xenoblade game so I was in awe of things like the scope and the setting, but it wasn’t until I played (but not finished) 1: Definitive Edition earlier this year I could see how it was similar and how the 2’s locations are not as fully developed. That said, I still love Uraya and Leftherian Archipelago despite the flaws in their map design. I 100% agree with you on the anime tropes and fan service..There are some very dark elements in the 2’s story later on and juxtaposing them with the “jiggle” physics and suggestive camera angles and all-around anime cringiness makes it very inconsistent and almost frustrating...I do think the story pulls through but most of that was due to Lora and Jin and the Torna backstory (and subsequent DLC). They are all things you just have to deal with the game and it IS irritating that you have to in the first place...

@horizonisland basically I think the writer of Xenoblade 2 needs to take some time out, to meet an actual woman. The way all of the Xenoblade games are written seem to be from the perspective of someone who has never been in a relationship.

So you get prolonged awkwardness instead of characters developing a normal relationship.

Things that would have made Xenoblade 2 an infinitely better game.
-Delete Tora, I don't think theres any need for him. His defining character trait, is grooming a sexbot with a child's personality. Thats creepy and weird no matter how you spin it. He should at the very least be portrayed as a villain.
-Make Rex 5 years older, so the relationship between him and Pyra/Mythra seems more believable.
-Redesign Mythra/Pyra's standard outfit to look a little more appropriate. She's meant to be a warrior, she's dressed like a stripper. I've got nothing against showing a bit of skin but have it make sense in the context of the scene and the character.

All of them? XC1 and XCX are not like that at all.

@Wargoose XC2 had terrible relationship writing, no doubt (though, I was genuinely impressed by almost all the main story content outside of that...) It also had absolutely terribly written side content (notably the majority of the Rare Blade quests).

But yeah, bad relationships is more of an XC2 thing than a whole series thing. Just look at how Shulk and Fiora act around each other at the beginning of the first game, that was better than anything in XC2 basically.

@Dezzy Xenoblade X doesn't really have a relationship. Xenoblade has the tried and true JRPG love triangle, where I don't get the vibe that any of the participants have ever been on a date before. I prefer X and the original, but neither showed me the writer was particularly good at writing relationships.(Is it the same writer?)

To be honest it's an issue with JRPGs as a whole. There are very few I can think of, that do relationships well. I think if more RPGs went the route of final fantasy X, and actually had the characters get together halfway through the story. You'd eliminate a lot of the odd scenes that populate the genre.(FFX has some super weird dialogue as well, but at least they moved past awkward glances in a timely manner.)

@link3710 It definitely was a lot better. Xenoblade Chronicles story telling was a lot better as a whole. Especially in the first half of the game.

I've got issues with the 2nd half of the game, but that was mainly because I thought the game was going in a certain direction and then it didn't.(and I shouldn't really judge a game based on what I thought was going to happen.)

@Wargoose

Nah, Final Fantasy has some of the best romances in the entire history of gaming. Locke and Celes, Zack and Aerith (sorry Cloud), Squall and Rinoa, Zidane and Garnet, Tidus and Yuna.
Those are all really great relationships. Way better than most of the examples in western RPGs.

Things that would make Xenoblade 2 a better game?

• More intuitive combat
• A better compass/less confusing geography in the landscape
• Better handheld mode optimization
• Tether rare blade acquisitions to quests/story progression.
• Rethink side-quests.

The majority of my issues with XC2 are addressed in Torna. Really, really love that game.

@Wargoose I 100% agree with all those suggestions. I think you’re right about how the Xenoblade games are written too, though I think that’s a problem with a lot of JRPGs as a whole. But, yeah, smart suggestions.

@Ralizah Torna is SUCH a good game. I remember reading in an interview that they wanted to make Torna more “adult” and I think it’s that sort of seriousness that the main game is missing at times that makes it so good. The ending of Torna, even though you know what’s coming, still managed to make me feel so many emotions.

To address another point that was brought up earlier in the page (about Pyra/Mythra's outfit not being realistic for combat), I think that's just a really lazy argument when it comes to addressing sexualization in JRPGs.

Don't get me wrong, it's absolutely fine to take issue with sexualized female character designs and critique that aspect of the game (or genre as a whole), but if we're being honest, JRPG character design in general is style over substance, and while male characters generally aren't sexualized to the degree that female characters are, their outfits don't tend to be any more battle appropriate (for what it's worth, back when I played FFX on the PS2, my father referred to it as "Final F**asay", probably because Tidus & Wakka bared their midriffs? I dunno), so I don't think that argument in itself holds much water.

If you do want to get technical regarding the world building of XC2 though, I think it's best to remember that Blades aren't human (which includes no way to traditionally die, and have high speed damage regeneration), so what they see as appropriate or necessary would differ quite a bit from more mortal beings (then again, Pyra/Mythra's life was tied to Rex's, though I think she only does if he dies?).

@RR529 I think you can spin the narrative that way if you want, but it sounds like you're trying a little too hard to justify a developers love for maids and mammaries.

@horizonisland It really makes me wish Monolith would make more of these smaller RPGs. The main Xenoblade games FEEL bloated, whereas Torna's smaller amount of content is still satisfying (took me 30 or so hours to beat the game), but everything felt meaningful. I've never played a Xenoblade game where the sidequests almost all felt like they were worth engaging in (sans that stupid green barrel one...).

And yeah, I guess because it's a prequel, Monolith was willing to go tragic for the ending, and I absolutely loved it. Especially after Chronicles 2 pulled its heftiest emotional punch at the very end.

@horizonisland That's why I didn't really care for Pyra or Mythra when I played it. Nia on the other hand, she's absolutely amazing in every way!

@Wargoose, again, taking issue with female character sexualization in JRPGs is a perfectly fine critique, I never said otherwise.

I only ever took issue with the specific argument that they need to be dressed more appropriately "for battle", which is something that almost no one in the genre is dressed appropriately for, sexualization or not.

It's perfectly valid to say "Hey, I'd like this or that design better if they covered up some cleavage or put on some pants, and think it'd be great at drawing in a wider audience that way" and leave it at that, because being "dressed for battle" doesn't seem like something they take too much into account for any character.

I'd think the argument is more that, in contrast to the females, most of the male blades do appear dressed for battle. The only real exception is Floren and he also happens to be the token effeminate one.