Topic: The Nintendo Switch Thread

I don't think we hear anything about Switch 2 in March. That's way too early.

Cause they're not doing a summer release. That makes no sense (except Sept which is technically summer, but I mean June, July or August). And an announcement will slow sales of Switch immediately.

I expect March to come and go, routine and business as usual.

With Switch they had nothing to lose announcing 6 mo prior, and everything to gain. And needed time to sell the concept. With Switch 2, they have everything to lose and nothing to gain by announcing that early. The concept is already sold. So what advantage would a March announcement bring vs waiting until summer with a 3-5 month lead time? I can't think of any.

@JaxonH If it's launching this year, they'll mention it by early May at the latest because of the fiscal year shareholders meeting. Even if it's just something as vague as "Project [insert codename] is launching this fiscal year, more info in the future".

The proper reveal however, who knows as we're entering completely new times. This is the first year since 1994 that companies won't be preparing at all for E3 given the event was permanently cancelled last year. We may get a situation where gaming news this year is all over the place.

If the proper reveal is in March, I think Nintendo would pull the 2020 trick. Namely let the big game release (ACNH back then, Princess Peach Showtime now) and then do a Direct the following week.

@JaxonH
I'm not super convinced they'd be too worried about impacting sales over that period. If you were to slice hardware sales evenly across the entire year into 3 you'd get Jan-Jun, Jun-Nov and Nov/Dec. That's how heavily skewed sales are to Nov/Dec. You're talking here about going for something like a July announcement as opposed to March. Sure that's four months but in in terms of sales you're talking here about what's basically the equivalent to 1/5th of the year. 6 months mid year isn't even remotely the same as 6 months from October they did for Switch. Not sure it's much of a concern

Also, there are positives to announcing earlier. My view is that if they announce early and have something good to say about backwards/forward compatibility that gives existing owners more confidence to buy games on Switch. And at this stage in the game I think game sales for Switch matter more. It also gives them more time to establish their message about why this is a thing people want. If there are cross-gen games they can build up hype for those titles and attach that message to the new hardware. It also means that third parties can start throwing that Switch 2 logo on their trailers which allows Nintendo to have some of that hype brush off on them

To be clear, I'm not betting the house on March, I'm not sure at all how this plays out. But I think a March announcement for a release in September/October makes more sense than, for example, a June announcement for the same. And it makes even more sense if the release is July/August. And with E3 dead and rumour mongers talking March? I'm down for March, as good a month as any

@JaxonH exactly that why a summer anouncement(june/july), would be ideal and launch the console in septembre/octobre or spring 2025(march/april).

Ok, so I've been wondering this for awhile:

Why does everyone seem so certain that Nintendo is doing lots of cross-gen games between the Switch and Switch 2? I know we have a couple big-time examples from the past like BotW on Wii U and Switch, Twlight Princess on Gamecube and Wii, and there have been some smaller games that a quick Google search turned up... but in general, when Nintendo releases a new system, it's new system time and there's no looking back.

I mean, they can still release Switch 1 games, sure, and maybe a couple "special" ones will be cross-gen, but I don't see this playing out any differently for Nintendo than it has before: Switch 1 was massive and will definitely get releases for another year or so, but in general the new "big" games will be coming out for Switch 2 and Switch 2 only.

Unless I missed something big? Or if we're just going based on what Sony and Microsoft have been doing the last couple gens (doing it waaaaaaaaay too much, in my opinion - geez, I feel like they still haven't moved onto the PS5 lol).

Edit: And the whole upscaling/re-releasing Switch 1 games for Switch 2 thing especially puzzles me. I know they used to do that a lot with VC/eShop stuff before NSO, but big games of consecutive generations? They just haven't really done that before, and I don't see them starting to do it now.

@rallydefault One obvious candidate for cross-gen is third party games. If they are not games which require massive resources, why not have them be cross-gen for a while? But what you said is basically what everyone is expecting for Nintendo itself - the big games (e.g. next 3D Mario) will be Switch 2 exclusive as a way to get people to upgrade. Smaller Nintendo games and ports? It would make sense for those type of things to be on Switch 1 also for at least a year — time will tell whether this cross-gen time will be one year or several years (re: PlayStation) for those smaller games. It may depend how fast the massive Switch userbase is upgrading since Nintendo wants to keep selling software to everyone. Also however, 'what Nintendo has always done' is not necessarily what we should be thinking about since they have screwed up generation transfers before and we know they will be especially careful this time.

@rallydefault They supported 3DS for 2 years after the Switch launched (final 1st party release was Kirby's Extra Epic Yarn in March 2019) and so if Switch 2 has backwards compatibility, Switch 1 being treated the same after Switch 2 launch would essentially mean a load of games playable on both.

@rallydefault
Two reasons: the architectural similarities and the fact that Nintendo has both the infrastructure and account system to be able to do this. Anything before 3DS/Wii U there wasn't the infrastructure to make this even remotely possible. And for Wii U/3DS to Switch obviously we dramatically switch architecture. Arguably they could have used the optical drive of the Wii U to verify Wii purchases but the gap between SD and HD was.... significantly more than a simple patch away....

With Switch everything is fairly locked down. Yes there is piracy which can make it look like you have the cartridge but it's possible to identify specific cartridges and impose restrictions on accounts. And with game fidelity where it is and the architectural similarities? It makes sense that they'd allow "Switch games" to open up on "Switch 2"

We're not, or at least I'm not, talking full asset reworks here. When I say "enhanced" what I mean is when you boot into TotK on Switch 2 it runs at 4K/30 or 1440/60 rather than 900/30. Possibly having HDR turn on or now outputting Dolby Atmos rather than 5.1PCM. Stuff along those lines. Same game, same assets just running better

It's less about it being "cross gen", it's more about a large sub-section of games not really needing the additional hardware to be playable. If backwards compatibility is transparent there will be a lot of games that could, and should, run on both. But just because it can run on both doesn't mean it has to run like a Switch game on Switch 2

.....all speculation at this point obviously but I don't really see any downside to doing it this way

Persona 5 Royal on Switch OLED in HANDHELD MODE running with overclocked CPU, GPU and RAM, with a native res mod that locks it to 720p handheld (and 1080p docked), and even a 60fps cheat though I disabled that cause I felt I was pushing it hard enough locking native res without dropping a single frame. But it was running 60 despite all that pretty well, with a few drops into the 40s when running past busy crowds turning the camera.

And we have DOOM Eternal on Switch OLED in HANDHELD MODE running with overclocked CPU, GPU and RAM, with a resolution mod that increases the minimum dynamic res thresholds for handheld and docked, and increases the maximum dynamic res thresholds for handheld and docked. There's a 60fps cheat as well but I'd rather take all the resolution I can get with a butter smooth 30.

Next is Monster Hunter Rise mod for native 720p locked in handheld and 900p docked (it can't quite hold 30fps with 1080p even maxing overclocks, so someone edited the file to cap docked at 900p instead- good call).

@skywake
Interestingly enough, I just posted about running Switch games with an overclocked CPU (1785 docked, 1581 handheld, stock is 1020 docked/handheld), GPU (921 docked, 614 handheld, stock is 768 docked and 307/384 handheld), and MEM (1600 docked/handheld, stock is 1600 docked/boost and 1331 handheld).

Obviously that's nowhere near what a Switch 2 would offer, but it does highlight what can be improved out of the box, and what would require an update.

For games with dynamic resolution scaling, Switch 2 would lock it at its maximum threshold. But if the threshold is low (such as Doom Eternal which uses a 0.68 multiplier on native res docked, aka 720p) then all the power in the world won't raise it above that cap. So any game with dynamic res would benefit. How much would depend on the game itself. Monster Hunter Rise and Persona 5 Royal are locked at 540p handheld (MH might be slightly higher but it's around that range). It takes a mod to raise the cap to native res. Super simple and easy- just a config file with the settings in it, but those are the games which would nonetheless require the developers to push out an update to take advantage of max resolution... and framerate, which I'll address next.

Switch 2 would lock any game running at 60fps to 60fps without drops. It would also run games with uncapped framerates at 60fps without drops (I think the system itself prevents higher framerates than 60). But games capped at 30 would remain at 30, unless the devs pushed an update to raise the cap. Again, super simple and easy to do. But will they do it? Some will. Many won't.

Even so, at the very least it would be a 100% guaranteed automatic fix for framerate drops across the board for every Switch title. It wouldn't run 30fps games any higher, but it would ensure they don't drop a single frame. And that alone is a huge win. Add to it maxing out resolution for any game with dynamic scaling, and you've got a fairly compelling out of the box bonus.

I just paid $120 to get increased res and framerates on Switch games. And yes, I can use mods to raise resolution and framerate caps while Switch 2 would require game updates, however, Switch 2 would be able to do 60fps and max resolution for certain games with caps that allow it, whereas a modded Switch is typically going to have to choose between max resolution or 60fps. Going for both proves a bit too much in most cases.

So ya, if Switch 2 is BC, it makes our entire library of Switch games playable at their best coded framerates and best coded resolutions, all the time. Not one single Switch game would ever drop below 30fps. And not one Switch game would ever drop below 540p in handheld or 720p docked (since I don't think there's any games with a maximum res lower than those numbers).

That alone would be worth every penny imo, even if it didn't play Switch 2 games.

@JaxonH Personally I don't care much about frame rate, but super long loading screens loading new areas in games has slowly started to drive me insane. I would love it if Switch 2 fixed that issue for some older games.

@JaxonH
Pretty much and as a side note that also kinda explains what my expectations are for "enhanced versions". I'm not expecting asset reworks. I'm expecting some developers to do stuff like make
_resolutionCap = 720;

Instead read:
_resolutionCap = IsSwitch2() ? 1440 : 720;

That sort of tier change

@FishyS
That's one of the best understated benefits of a modded Switch. Doubled GPU and 50% more CPU drastically speed up loading times.

Doom Eternal used to take forever to load to 100% on a fresh load in, now it zoomed by like woah...

@skywake
I don't think that's asking too much. But it seems some dev teams just never touch their game again once released. Let's hope at least Nintendo does, and worst case scenario we still get the baseline benefits outlined above.

It's a W nomatter how the cookie crumbles.

I'll look forward to the bizarre bugs that sort of simple change occasionally makes that then has to be repatched (I'm looking at you Pokemon Violet). 😝

@FishyS
Pokemon Scarlet/Violet are so beyond hope. Nothing less than a full remaster on Switch 2 will suffice.

Even if the framerate is fixed and resolution remains stable, the game has pop-in draw distance of like 10 feet in-game. You'll be riding along and suddenly... poof! A cluster of 3 pokemon appear out of thin air right in front of you.

And they have animation framerate for objects tied to distance, which normally is fine (even Monster Hunter World employs this technique), the problem is the distance is far too short and the frames far too few. You'll see a windmill turning at literally, I kid you not, 3 frames per second (not hyperbole, it actually turns at 3fps beyond a certain distance). And it's not some tiny, distant far off object where you won't notice. It's only 50 feet away!

But the pop-in is the biggest issue for me. I can't play when you can't see the pokemon until they're right under your nose. It's so distracting and takes me out of the experience.

@FishyS
Nah, it'll be fine, just fix it on prod

@Grumblevolcano
Oh yea, I fully expect Switch 1 to still be getting new exclusive games for another year or so. I'm just talking about specific cross-gen games and Switch 1 games getting enhanced.
@skywake
Ok, yea, the account system being in place these days makes sense for that argument, I can see that.

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I just realised why I'm not winning at fortnite this season. Weapons are difficult to upgrade, so it's harder to get an opponent

Noticed this video scrolling by and although the video itself is neither here nor there, I had never thought of the idea of a 3D Yoshi game and now I really want one. 😆