Nintendo takes the security of its consoles very seriously, and puts a lot of effort into making sure they're as hard to hack as possible. However, in the case of the Switch, we've seen exploits and vulnerabilities appear quite swiftly in the system's lifespan - it's now possible to hack the console to run homebrew code, including emulators.
Hacker SciresM - a member of the ReSwitched group - has spoken to a member of the GBATemp forum about the current state of Switch security, and the message is a mixed one. On the one hand, SciresM praises the hard work Nintendo has undertaken to keep the Switch secure, but points out that the current revision of the console is "completely compromised" due to its reliance on Nvidia's Tegra hardware:
I think that software-wise, Nintendo has done a really great job. Their operating system, Horizon, is a new, updated version of the OS on the 3DS -- with all of the hardening that has come from the 3DS's years of security issues. There have been a few unfortunate mistakes on their part, but by and large HOS is extremely secure. We've still not seen even one traditional exploitable vulnerability in the HOS kernel, which I think speaks well of the investment Nintendo has been making into securing their platform. I think that the Switch's biggest weakness, security-wise, is that it's running on (and has to be designed around) the Tegra X1 hardware.
When asked what degree of control hackers currently have over Switch, SciresM replied:
The switch has been completely compromised.
All current hardware can be compromised. They can mitigate vulnerabilities in newer units, though, either via a hardware revision or updating the bootrom patches written at the factory.
...they're currently in the process of doing so with a new SoC called "Mariko". I expect this will be a "silent revision", where newer units will start being sold using the newer hardware without any special marketing.
SciresM is keen to stress that the ReSwitched group isn't interested in piracy or anything inherently harmful; instead, the team wants to foster a healthy homebrew community around Switch:
We want to create an engaged homebrew scene and do our best to foster a good, healthy community around it.
My personal goal is to continue hacking Pokemon games on the Switch (adding support for save editing via PKHeX, enable custom ROM hack content, etc).
He's also critical of Team Xecuter's modchip project:
I think it's irresponsible of them to try to profit off of a bootrom 0-day vulnerability that affects more products than just the Switch, and I don't think they provide anything of value to the community.
What do you make of these comments? Do you support the work of hackers like SciresM, or do you think all of this activity should be shut down as soon as possible? Let us know by leaving a comment.
[source gbatemp.net]
Comments 281
Sombra?
Go to prison, hacker scum!
"We want to create an engaged homebrew scene and do our best to foster a good, healthy community around it."
Yeah... promoting the download of illegal roms always creates a healthy community. What a load of s***!
Well, at least it's good that they're open about what they're doing and try to create a healthy homebrew community instead of making a lot of money. At least that's what the message is... But you never know.
Personally I just want my Switch to be original, even after the guarantee ends. Just want to buy a good game once a month, and there are plenty of those coming out. I also like to play the same games a lot instead of not-really-playing a whole lot of games. Also not using it for other apps.
Oh, gosh....
What an irony...
I might pick up a new switch to keep in the press for a few years until it's completely hacked.
I'll buy my games brand new for the next few years as usual.
It’s nice to know that we live in a world where people are determined to destroy absolutely everything good and wholesome, with not an ounce of mercy.
@Malcrash Boop
@Rika_Yoshitake What makes things even worse is that he is saying that he wants to hack open the switch just to cheat at Pokémon. If I were to hack my switch, I'd like to play PSone and PSP games on it. Though I wouldn't really bother with it.
That's sad to hear..
Hopefully the emulator scene is up and running soon. At that point I'll buy a second Switch for new games and hack my current one for some ROM-y goodness.
One day, at the end of my Switch's life, I'll hack it and see what potential these pirates can release.
If you want to hack and create a homebrew scene. Go and do it elsewhere. Use laptops or something. Leave us gamers alone...
This coming Summer, all Nintendo Switch games will be pirated. Yes all Switch can pirate games and there's nothing Nintendo can do, no firmware patches can fixed it. No stability bullpoop can stop it.
I wonder how much Nvidia is going to compensate Nintendo for this. Btw hackers found out about the exploit from hacking Nvidia Shield. Nvidia even provided developers with toolkits that hackers used for finding the exploit. That's why using off the shelf chip is always a bad idea for console.
@SanderEvers Reporting on something doesn't denote support for something.
Otherwise, every newspaper would be "supporting" shootings, murder, suicide, etc.
Piracy is one thing, and I think it's fair to argue, that while it tends to be an obvious byproduct, it's hardly the intent of most crews doing the ground-work on these kinds of hacks, as there is still the matter of duplicating the software itself, and bypassing any protection in this regard. "Cheating" on the other hand ... that is imho a different story, as I feel that sits uncomfortably close to that original intent of e.g. "hacking Pokemon games on the Switch (adding support for save editing via PKHeX ...)". I think it's much harder to argue, that no one never ever even remotely intended for their hacks to be used for any kind of manipulation of what is commonly refered to as cheating.
@HappyMaskedGuy Destroy how? They can access the hardware and software in interesting ways, I don't see how this harms anyone or anything. While the work of hackers is legally ambiguous, it can still do some good, like point out flaws Nintendo may not be aware of.
Also I like to hear that the OS itself is secure.
Although I am not 100% happy about something with a wifi access and usually credit card info being "completely compromised".
@Spectra Exactly: give people a legal way to have these games on Switch and you'll have fewer people interested in hacking.
@SanderEvers Would you rather not know? You could see it as a warning.
The future looks bright.
He's also critical of Team Xecuter's modchip project: mmmm pot kettle black springs to mind.
I delved into Homebrew before with the Wii. It was an awesome time and experience...if you're doing it yourself and not relying on other people's work. I did a bunch of Hello Worlds here and there. That said, any activity that ultimately leads to piracy, whether the hacking was done in good faith, will never be "healthy", regardless if you own the tools or ROMs and rip them yourselves or whatever.
IMHO it was never a community, just a 'scene'. 70 to 80% of the "community" might not even know how to code and just takes advantage of a group's hobby. If you wanna hack then learn to code. Don't give the tools for free also. That's where the problem comes in. Hard mods are a different story.
At the end of the day, hacking, particularly Homebrew isn't illegal (or bad, depends on the goal). But the possible implications/consequences are which is piracy that we all know is not a good thing. Yeah, hardware sales might benefit, but official software from big developers to smaller ones wouldn't no matter where you look at it.
I also think that these things shouldn't be reported as well considering it's a mainstream Nintendo site. You're welcome to argue. If one wants to learn these things then I'm pretty sure they wouldn't need a headsup from Nintendo Life. Just sayin'
Hackers, crackers, homebrewers, and pirates are not all the same thing people.
@Anguspuss He is releasing the CFW this summer (on purpose) to counter Team Xecuter's mod chip. Since CFW is free, most people won't be bothered with a mod chip that cost money.
This happens no matter what Nintendo does to stop it. It’s no use complaining. Just enjoy the harmless aspects of it, like running home brew and Linux.
Only time I might look at this is when a randomizer eventually comes out for switch pokemon games I love playing randomized pokemon games especially on the actual console
Wow the anti hacker police are out in force today. The idea that Nintendo life shouldn't report on the latest switch hacking scene is laughable
Excuse me while I go hack off.
Hackers...Angelina Jolie ♡...1995...I miss that year. What memories. Power Rangers, Mortal Kombat, Jim Carrey as The Riddler.
Sorry, got off topic.
@cfgk24
Gamers exist on laptops/PCs too.
@Rika_Yoshitake
Its also for people to play their legally made roms which increases the use for the users. (Which I know its a mix bag but you can't have the good without the bad)
We don't give a damn what hackers say and STOP promoting their illegal practices with a new article almost everyday. It is very unprofessional.
"Don't want to do anything harmful", immediately mentions hacking Pokémon and allowing PKHex to work on it; an illegal tool that has been extremely harmful to the competitive Pokémon community. Right.
I'll be glad when Nintendo produces enough news of its own that dross like this doesn't get any coverage.
So long as you don't cheat in multiplayer and don't pirate games still for sale/in production, I don't see anything wrong with hacking.
I have been saying for a while, if Nintendo fails to deliver an official virtual console on the Switch, then once we have a solid homebrew OS on the Switch with emulators, I am gonna buy a second Switch and go to town.
@Damo they are though, shooters do it for the fame and the news is BY FAR the biggest problem with gun violence after guns.
https://youtu.be/3LnsmSCkWUk
Watch that and educate yourself. Then realise how you’re doing the same only with hacking.
@kobashi100 ya the hacker police are a cute group, OK with Nintendo ripping them off with full priced ports but not ok with people trying to add things to the Switch that are not even provided to them by Nintendo (emulators)
I wouldn't pirate games still in stores but thats not the only reason for homebrew
@Rika_Yoshitake I hate totaly ignorant people like you. This group is ANTI PIRACY. They are getting HARRASED by piracy grupes. They are concidering implementing stuff to PREVENT piracy and yet some peoople apparently dont get it...
@Damo aren't you guys meant to be an embassador of a brand though ? In this case Nintendo? Surely reporting on underground stories like this only serves to harm that brand in the grand scheme of things. I must admit, like quite a few others here, I'm getting tired of the persistence to keep posting about hacking the console, will you carry on when we invariably get to the point where this testing the water type phase becomes an R4-like product for the Switch?
Why keep writing about it when clearly it's not Nintendo Life's finest hour, and going by the comments the last time, people that don't want to read about this, out weigh those that do. I get that for many it's interesting about what can be done here but what starts as an idea to better gaming lives fast becomes a slippery slope - either way it's exploiting and this sort of thing shouldn't be on a main stream website like this man.
@Cosats T H E R E I S N O T H I N G I L L E G A L A B O U T H A C K I N G. Nintendo might not like it, you might not like it for some reason, but that doesn't mean its bad
@SanderEvers More like 98% piracy. I have a large collection of legal ROMs that I ripped myself, but I'm sure for every person like me there's 20 people who downloaded all their's off the internet. Regardless, it isn't inherently illegal to mess with ROMs, it's how you obtain them that can be illegal.
@RichardZ Hahahahaha. You must be joking, right?
Guys, let's stay away from illegal hacking / homebrew / whatever, please.
Let's support Nintendo by purchase their OFFICIAL & GENUINE softwares and hardwares.
If you LOVE Nintendo, show your Support to Nintendo.
Happy playing.
@Damo Every newspaper IS supporting suicide, shootings, bombings and so on though. Whether that is the intent doesn't really matter, because people do it for attention. Attention is what they get. Which supports them. Simple really.
This is precisely the same case, as reporting on the progress and prowess of hackers and hacking tools creates awareness regarding said subjects, which leads to more people researching it. End result is more hackers and/or more people who will cheat and/or make use of/buy hacks. Which means you're supporting them regardless of intent.
I don't care much for whether people report on such things or not, but don't claim you're not supporting something by reporting on it in depth, specifically mentioning the people and resources people can seek out. It's supportive of their cause, even if you condemn them while writing it.
@SanderEvers they are not. Do you have the slightest idea what a bootROM is?
@Cosats It's not illegal and there isn't an article about it every day. Maybe once a month if there is news about it. They can write about it if they want. It's called journalism. Also, they are not condoning it, they are writing about it.
I suppose all other news outlets that are writing about the acts of violence that happen every day should stop?
@Cosats nope. Piracy is illegal. Hacking!=Piracy. if piracy was illegal why hasn't Nintendo sued the hackers?
I'm hoping the Switch can run emulators up to PSP and PS1, i would buy a second Switch just for that.
@SanderEvers Hacking it is completely legal. Distributing it is illegal.
@Tokiwa There is no question it can. It's just a matter of time.
@RichardZ Piracy =/= hacking at all! Piracy is stealing copywritten software and distributing it. Hacking it modifying software to function differently. It's no different than buying a car and modifying the engine to get more power, or installing a new radio.
@RichardZ @Heavyarms55 Hacking any game on a Nintendo console is against Nintendo's terms of service, both for their software and their hardware. There is a reason hundreds of people and their 3DSs bricked when they Sun and Moon came out, and more when they cracked down on hacked Pokémon on the GTS.
@Heavyarms55 yeah, thats my point. != means same as =/=>
@RichardZ
Hacking is STILL considered as illegal, no matter how do you defend your argument.
For me, i Will NOT Hack my Nintendo Switch to play pirated games or doing something illegal.
Just play and treat the machine Just The Way It Is !
@Danpal65 yeah it's against terms of service therefore they can ban you. Doesn't mean it's illegal.
@RichardZ Well here is some legal precedent to go along with it. Violating terms of service, whilst voiding your right to continue using the service, may not be illegal, the process of bypassing code-based structures can fall under computer-crime laws. (https://www.eff.org/deeplinks/2010/07/court-violating-terms-service-not-crime-bypassing) I know this is in America, but still there is some precedent that this IS NOT a good thing to be doing.
"We want to create an engaged homebrew scene and do our best to foster a good, healthy community around it.
My personal goal is to continue hacking Pokemon games on the Switch (adding support for save editing via PKHeX, enable custom ROM hack content, etc)."
Nooooo.... You filthy frikkin hacker - stop trying to normalize this whole thing. You're just making it easier for other filthy hackers to jump right in and ruin pokemon like in previous generations. No one's playing Gen 7 anymore because of people like you!
@FourBs
"aren't you guys meant to be an embassador of a brand though ? In this case Nintendo? "
Eh? No. This isn't an official site or affiliated in any way.
Who the hell cares what these people do to their Switch? Putting a few emulators on a hacked Switch isn’t going to harm you.
@RichardZ
"yeah it's against terms of service therefore they can ban you. Doesn't mean it's illegal."
Think about peoples who worked for Nintendo and game developers. They worked so hard for feeding their families. Will you dare to take away their rights to get proper salary as the sales from selling Genuine copies fell down because a lot of peoples downloading the hacked illegal ROMs for Free ?
Is taking away people rights will entertain you for self pleasure ?
Please, consider the other peoples who have to work hard for progression of video game industry.
Support them by BUY Their Original products, NOT by Hacking or Cheating just only for Selfishness and Self pleasure.
@TheDragonDAFan It is more of the implications for the future. This can have long lasting repercussions for online play and competitive play in some games as well. Just look at what hacking has done to the competitive Pokémon scene. no one wants to join or play anymore and the top tier hackers do not understand why so few people play anymore. It is all down to hacking and PKHex.
Let's be honest, there are a lot of SNES and PS1 games that would be absolutely awesome on the Switch. That's why they should look at remaking some 90s and 00s classics with upgraded graphics to combat piracy. If a mid gen Switch comes or Switch pro or Switch 2, when I upgrade my system I'll be hacking my original Switch straight away for Retroarchemulator or something similar.
On another note, Switch badly needs PUBG as well... I've been playing PUBG on my mobile more than playing my Switch lately, and that's not what I'd prefer to do.
@Danpal65
I feel sad for some gamers that like to hack Pokemon games just ONLY for their self pleasure, their Selfishness.
They thought, cheating / hacking could made them felt like a Real gamer.
Oh, gosh...
They might lost their Kindness toward other peoples. Just only think about themself, never care what other peoples feeling.
@electrolite77 I'm well aware of that.
@DizzyDee81
Tsk tsk tsk....
Hacking is not piracy guys.
Reverse Engineering can also be considered hacking but it is not and is completely legal.
@Anti-Matter
"I feel sad for some gamers that like to hack Pokemon games just ONLY for their self pleasure, their Selfishness.
They thought, cheating / hacking could made them felt like a Real gamer. "
Well I have bought the games (well except the 3rd gen) and I will download rom hacks of pokemon games that I have to give myself a different experience with that game. Either with a completely new story and layout or just play the base game with random encounters so I can nuzlocke it.
Pfft, all these people getting in a snit. "Piracy" has saved the majority of games released for Nintendo systems from being irrecoverably lost. Not that it matters in this instance, because hacking isn't "piracy."
Hacking isn't illegal. It is against terms and conditions, so if the hacker ends up getting their device bricked then they have no right to complain.
Piracy and distribution is illegal.
Let's not get the two mixed up. I mean, don't forget that Ms. Pac-Man was a hack to have a harder version of Pac-Man.
@SilentHunter382
Hacking is still considered as illegal activities no, matter what you said.
Hacking the games = you don't appreciate people's work.
You forced to change with heart desire contents to satisfy the Selfishness.
I will never want to do it.
I will play the games Just The Way It Is.
No hacking, No cheating, No whatsoever illegal activities.
I personally don't really care about homebrew, as that seems to be original games people distribute on consoles without putting it on the eshop, but I am very much against piracy.
@Anti-Matter
Then what about mods (which is kinda reverse engineering). Those should be considered a no go for you also.
Example Dark Souls on pc is a broken mess and is really unplayable even to this day but someone modded the game to make it playable. So you are telling me you wouldn't download a mod to help the game play better.
Also people have made mods which the developers have later supported but to you that is still "illegal" so the developers are in the wrong for supporting "illegal" activities.
@SilentHunter382
I will keep play the game Just The Way It Is, Plain Vanilla, No modding, No Forced Changing whatsoever.
Because i give Respect for the games i play.
And... i don't play PC games anymore.
I quit from those world, moving on to Handheld / Console gamers.
@Anti-Matter
I know your first language isn't English, and even if you are using the word "illegal" correctly what you are putting under illegal is incorrect.
Hacking is against terms and conditions of companies. If you hack your device might be bricked or not allowed to access the internet, etc.
Duplicating Super Mario Bros. and then distributing it for free you at a cost is illegal which means you can be sued, fined, or even do prison time.
Hacking is not piracy.
Hackers created optifine for Minecraft. Optifine makes Minecraft run better on computers and it is not illegal.
I can’t say if this person is a black hat, white hat, or grey hat but what I can say is that if Nintendo watches this person closely, or those like him/her, then they can stay ahead or even patch those vulnerabilities. Go ahead! Find those exploits! Nintendo will be right beind you!
@RusevDay You've invoking Jim Sterling to win an argument? Ahem.
@Anti-Matter
I know that you moved away from PC gaming but with modding it can help a game breath new life. When the developer dark souls releases the game that 90% of people can't play and don't do anything to fix it how can you respect that game if you are one of those people affected.
By modding it to play it then you can begin respect the game for what it is cause you can then play it.
@Blizzia You've totally and utterly misunderstood what the concept of "news reporting" is.
Back in the 1940s, had the crimes of the Nazis not been reported, how would anyone have formed an opinion on the topic? How would global opinion have formed against Nazi Germany? Should newspapers have hushed-up the news of Holocaust, just in case it gave the Nazis the attention they obviously wanted?
News reporting is done so people can be aware of things happening in the world around them. For example, someone at Nintendo will no doubt be reading reports regarding hacking on Switch and, I dare say, will be galvanised into making sure the console is even more secure moving forward. The reports will trigger positive action, just as they may well encourage some users to hack their systems. You can't have one without the other, but reporting does not condone either standpoint - it's just reporting.
To say that if you report on something you support it is perhaps the dumbest thing I've read on the internet in a LONG time, and there are some monumentally dumb things being posted online these days, so that's really saying something.
@Damo don’t stop. I love these comments on the topic
Why???
The only feature I want is save backup. If Nintendo can't get this basic feature implemented, it's hacking time for me. It's criminal that our saves are being held prisoner to a single device. Yea I know there's a save transfer feature but that's practically useless if my Switch dies.
I find the massive amounts of ignorance on these types of topics extremely funny.
Was this article even necessary? Last thing Switch needs is to appraise hacking, which we all know won't be used for legit purposes most of time. Not that I am surprised NL is engaged in reporting this of course.
@Rika_Yoshitake I have many complete rom collections, but I still buy and support new games all the time and won't be hacking my switch until I have the newer beefier version coming out. Games that are 15-20 years old and on unsupported hardware are all fair game IMO.
@YamAsereht The thing is a lot of people won't hack their systems because you risk getting your Nintendo Account banned if you try to play online. So if you decide to hack your system you are basically forgoing anything online because they will get you and blacklist your console and ban your account.
@Xaessya Sorry, I missed out the words 'Nintendo console ecosystem'. Gamers. 😊
@NapalmPsalm hacking is a crime because it is an invasion of ip or privately owned property. That is the facts.
if the guy's personal goal is to hack Pokemon games than maybe he should do so on the GameBoy, not the switch.
and why would he even want to hack the Pokemon games to begin with? most of them are way to easy.
"the ReSwitched group isn't interested in piracy or anything inherently harmful; instead, the team wants to foster a healthy homebrew community around Switch:"
Sure, of course. I also just use Bittorrent to download Linux distros, as well as read playboy just for the articles...
Even if this one individual or the group speaks truthfully, they have to be aware their work isn't going to be used like this by their community as a whole. So I'd rather they'd just owned it and call it what it is.
It's s a shame that Nintendo has to put aside a budget to combat the hacking of their console system. They could otherwise put that money into games development...
@Spectra all Arcade, Neo Geo games and the like no good?
@SilentHunter382 Hacking is a crime especially how you do it. The problem is the term "hacking" has been mangled to cover any type of digital manipulation, change, "reverse engineering" or something that alters the original manufacturers design. A person can buy a product and reverse engineer or or install home-brew on it if they like and it is technically legal under the current DMCA. When you offer this to others as a free or paid product then you have crossed the line.
The true meaning of Hacking is when one hacks into a remote computer/server/data station by bypassing security for personal enjoyment. At that time it was not illegal. When people starting damaging and altering the code/software and causing problems the government stepped in and "reverse engineered" the legal code to lock your but up.
If this means I will be able to backup my saves, then any feeling sorry for Nintendo has been cancelled.
@Spectra of course they'll bring virtual console to the switch.
@gloom Keep crying
@SanderEvers And yet here you are reading the articles
I’ve hacked the comments section to be comment #100
Wooohooo
@Damo You can't use the Hitler card and expect to automatically win an argument. Worse than that, you attacked a good percentage of the community with that last paragraph, because a lot of people here think these kind of articles only support piracy. Not to mention, comparing mere console hacking to nazi atrocities is distasteful.
But I personally liked the article. It was interesting to hear about the strengths of using custom hardware (which I'm a big supporter of), the fortitude of the 3DS OS the Switch OS was built upon, the steps Nintendo is taking to prevent further hacking, and it was nice to see a hacker bash another hacker group whose goal is to profit from the sale of modchips.
@Zidentia You are correct. I've done some research now and when I was saying "hacking" the real word I should be using is "modding" which is different to an extent but follows a very thin line and also can be illegal. Even my Pac-Man to Ms. Pac-Man example is a little false. The modding of Pac-Man was perfectly legal, but down the road there was legal trouble with royalties and what-not.
Thanks for correcting me.
Post 81 is great.
The 'dont report things and hopefully they'll go away' school of thought is very foolish. If it's Nintendo-related news, a Nintendo site should report it.
....Well at least custom music on Smash Switch can still be a thing now....
@Galenmereth If people really, really want to hack and pirate games on their Switch, they'll do it regardless of this article - just as a great many of people who have commented on this piece have stated that they're against piracy. I can't imagine reporting on this kind of thing is going to have much impact on Nintendo's bottom line, as people who wish to avoid paying for games will do so without encouragement.
However, it should be noted that hacking is something that happens with every piece of technology and is often (unfairly) automatically lumped in with piracy. Hacking has a lot of benefits, such as this:
https://www.eurogamer.net/articles/2018-04-10-how-one-enterprising-fan-brought-demons-souls-back-to-life
Admittedly, I did install the Homebrew Channel on my Wii at one point. But I'm being 100% honest that it was never about piracy. I wanted to do things like backup ALL of my savegames (Nintendo had a stupid rule that you couldn't back up to SD any savegames from games that had online play), and to play around with the random, quirky, cool and useful homebrew apps people came up with. I had a lot of fun with it.
Point being: homebrew and hacking has legit purposes, and not everyone is interested in piracy. A lot of you all are way too knee-jerk with your attitudes towards this.
The amount of salt here is hilarious
Homebrew has always been an interesting scene. Sadly, we'll always get folks running copies of things they simply do not own. I'd be happy installing custom themes/backgrounds, but that's about it.
You know, when we're kids, we're trained that you should follow the rules, work within the system, and even without the threat of direct punishment, we're trained to simply CHOOSE to behave ethically in any and all circumstances, simply because it's right, not because we're afraid we'll get caught.
At what point did the majority of the adult population lose all that training and education in behavior and choice, and instead do whatever they can get away with because they want to, and the world is their personal plaything to exploit for their own amusement as they see fit so long as nobody is likely to immediately punish them for doing so?
And how has Japan lost that behavioral training less than the rest of the developed world?
hacking pokemon games isn't considered harmful at nintendolife? that's literally all sciresm is interested in.
@NEStalgia I don't know about you, but Japan is considered one of the most unhappy countries in the world.
I did install homebrew on my Wii to rip my Gamecube and Wii collection. After reading an article about rotting discs, I couldn't stop myself. If Switch homebrew lets me make a backup of my save files and games, I would do it in a breeze.
People blow my mind in these comments.
One one hand, you have a bunch of self righteous do-gooders who curse and insult anyone and anything who would dare "destroy" with their hacking, many of which take this stance out of envy.
On the other hand, you have a bunch of self-justifying thieves who curse and insult anyone who would dare oppose "their right" to hack, many of which take this stance out of a desire to pirate.
And lost in all of this are the few remaining level headed people in the middle, who curse neither side, who understand there ARE negatives to this but there ARE benefits as well (especially when used responsibly). And maybe they lean one way or the other, but they're not flying off the handle about it.
@Galenmereth lol post the link to your Nintendo news website and teach me how real journalism works mate.
@Damo This might just be the tamest defense mounted ever regarding news reporting. I have not misunderstood the concept of news reporting whatsoever. You, however, have manipulated my words to form a narrative that so brilliantly supports you, but falls short when you reread what I wrote to you.
To brief you on some simple English: To be supportive of something and to support something is not the same. I never stated you were supportive of hacking (or nazis for that matter, nice comparison there mate). I stated that by reporting on the progress and prowess of hacking on the Switch (aka console hacking, which is totally something new and unprecemented like the nazis and the whole situation in ww1-ww2 was in their time during the age of the physical newspaper, which not every person was capable of reading let alone obtaining) you are supporting their cause. Because you are. Not necessarily because you want to, as intent is completely out of the equation.
I also like how you can report that the console is completely compromised, yet argue that this article would galvanise Nintendo to increase security... The product is compromised. Fully. Security should have been there from before it was compromised, not now. Not to say that it isn't still important, but... The whole point of it was kinda to avoid being compromised.
Lastly, I know you won't change your opinion, but the majority of your community hates hacking, hackers, cheating and cheaters, and comment on every single article you write on the subject (ESPECIALLY REGARDING SWITCH) that we do not want this kind of news, and that it is the opinion of several people vocal enough to dare assume they actually care about this website and this community... Yet you still continue to make sure not a single step in the progress of compromising the Switch goes unnoticed. Stuff like compromised sensitive data is one thing... but we literally (I use we because I can safely point out several comments in agreement) tell you flat out we don't want to hear about switch hackers and how they open up the console for cheats and hacks.
As a side note: Your reply to me was downright embarrassing. Honestly, the Nazi card? For having apparently written one of the dumbest things you have seen online in a while, I dare say your reply was one of the most embarrassing and unprofessional rebuttals I will see in my lifetime. Good day to you sir
I am just kind of hoping for some cool mods, things like purely cosmetic mods for Smash Bros(music, stage background changes, more creative alt colors that change the 3D model etc) or things like that. Breath of the Wild already has some mods on the Wii U, I would love to try those without buying the game again on the slow and noisy(external hard drive) Wii U
@YamAsereht Reported or not, it's something that is due to happen sometime. If you're not interested, then you are free to skip this article because I sincerely don't believe any of your input has some sort of impact on the topic.
@SamuFinland I thought the BotW Wii U mods were on Cemu and not the Wii U. Correct me if I'm wrong.
I have much less of an issue with articles like this than the ones by anonymous "staff" trying to promote affiliate links. Not sure how rational that is.
@Blizzia "We literally (I use we because I can safely point out several comments in agreement) tell you flat out we don't want to hear about switch hackers and how they open up the console for cheats and hacks"
This article is comfortably the most read one on the site today. People clearly do want to hear about this sort of thing.
@Devlind
There's mods on the Wii U too
@Blizzia as @Damo pointed out, articles like this get the clicks. That's all that matters at the end of the day, never forget that.
@cfgk24 I'm with you on this. If he thinks he is very creative and smart, he should create his own console and games, instead of messing with other's creations. I don't believe in "healty homebrew community".
@RedMageLanakyn @Galenmereth We tried running a site which no one visited and strangely, it didn't work 🤔
@Spectra yes, but I don't want to see the same trickle effect starting SMB (NES) working upwards. It's been far more interesting the 'retro' games we've been seeing on the Switch. Something like a Mario collection of games (for example) may swing it, from SMB all the way up to Sunshine perhaps?
@Damo There's plenty of sites out there I visit that are getting by just fine, with their integrity intact
This place is like Nintendo TMZ
@RedMageLanakyn Yet you keep on coming back... 😘
@Damo Yeah, guilty pleasure, no denying that. Everyone has their vices
@Damo Keep sniffing that view count if you want. It clearly has nothing to do with nothing else of note being reported on, does it now?
Keep your shallow view if you want, I don't really care. You're gonna end up losing readers on it. You might gain some other readers, sure, but it's not going to be because you're reporting on hackers/hacking.
It's going to be because you're writing articles on Nintendo games and lovely Nintendo stuff such as reviews, soapboxes, videos, previews, features and all the other brilliant stuff you guys do.
...
It seems I am in luck today, since I managed to catch a reply you posted to RedMageLanakyn and Galenmereth just before. In all the time I've been visiting Nintendolife (which is quite a long time actually, long before I even made an account), the website has had plenty of visitors and a decent to great community (huge compliment, considering most communities tend to be toxic).
Now, having checked out quite a few other articles in different genres, including news related to hacking, it seems like these articles don't really generate much attention, other than when it's about hacks being closed, exploits being removed and other good stuff.
Anyway, might as well come with a suggestion, though you're probably not going to even attempt to relay it to someone: Add a way to completely blacklist certain tags (like hacking ) so that people can tailor their feed more. The current following/reordering system doesn't really do anything.
@RedMageLanakyn If a website solely goes for the clicks, they're bound to destroy themselves. 'Nuff said. Integrity is everything nowadays, and one way you don't get it is by ignoring your community, so I guess NintendoLife is doing brilliantly on that front.
@Alto It's a hardware problem. How do you patch hardware?
@Blizzia I'm glad you think we cover so much good stuff. In all seriousness, we've been covering hacking since the DS and Wii days, so it's not like it's a new policy. Nothing has changed.
@Damo It's not that anything has changed, it's that I (and apparently others too) have been wanting that change since the DS and Wii days. And we still do. There's no other way to tell you than to keep reminding you
The idea of protecting something by keeping people ignorant of certain information is a flawed concept at best. Support that notion, and the wicked will gladly use it against you. Be glad for the press.
@Blizzia I 100% agree, and is part of the reason I tend to come here as a guilty pleasure and not for my main source of Nintendo news.
@Damo I personally hope that you continue to cover things like this. I'm interested in what hackers are up to with regards to the Switch and indeed other consoles. I myself dabble in modding and creating custom content for games and while I have no intention of hacking my console, I am intrigued by what others are doing. Here's hoping that these hacks don't lead to any form of piracy. I don't wish to see the game creators harmed by this sort of thing. However, I do enjoy homebrew and used to love some of the little games people would make for the Wii back in those days. The head tracking demo was really something special.
Most people in this page probably live in a country that reports on drug addiction stats, the drug trade and other such affairs. Would they also argue that being aware of drug addiction gives drug dealers customers? Would they prefer to live in a society where the government forbids any reporting of drug use? In fact, there are oppressive regimes that do this very thing, suppress any reports of the drug trade. Maybe they would argue in favor of such ignorance...
@Devlind "Happiness" metrics aren't terribly scientific. Who is interviewed, when, where, how, and why, and what was the nuance of their replies? Last I checked the US and UK don't rate so highly on those metrics either. Meanwhile North Korea is ubiquitously happy as though nobody could even conceive of the idea of saying they weren't. Go figure.
But the concept of ethics isn't really very questionable in Japan. Umbrella sharing is a common feature. It's not a worry. You KNOW people will return their borrowed umbrellas. Want to try that in Manhattan or Manchester? (Or, since I just checked your profile after assuming US or UK out of laziness.......Juarez....shudder)
@Damo "We tried running a site which no one visited and strangely, it didn't work 🤔"
Well, that wasn't an actual planned attempt on your part. The WiiU just kind of happened...
@NinChocolate If that news company reported on the locations and times the drug dealers operated in their area it possibly could be like that.
A story like this is basically providing helpful information to help people bypass the security of Nintendo Switch. It's stating the current version compomised, its suggesting what Nintendo is going to do and when. It'd be like if someone reported when you accidentally left the backdoor of your house is open and along with the times you're at work. Except in this case somebody is actively trying to unlock the back door of your house without your knowledge.
"My personal goal is to continue hacking Pokemon games on the Switch (adding support for save editing via PKHeX, enable custom ROM hack content, etc)."
Good to know people out there are thinking of the competitive players
@Cinaclov seriously, until gamefreak decides to fix IV mechanics, competitive players will still use Pkhex, sadly.
Hacking seems to mean anything that can be defined as adjusting any sort of software to operate in a way it wasn't supposed to. We're probably just a few steps away from Devs patching their works and being accused of "hacking" their own games.
I'm generally against it as a whole. I see the good, mainly for giving people access to really old games that don't have any means of being played. I can see mods adding to the fun of a game, but I've never seen them as anything to kill for. If anything, the work people put into things like patches and games like ASMR makes me wonder why they just don't make their own games. Nintendo isn't the only one stingy about copyrights, their just most infamous about it.
As far as I'm concerned, there are a lot more problems with this, mainly when it's done on hardware that's on the market-people are pirating games that can be played. Whether or not it's on the system you want it for, it's still available, and you're ripping off the dev for not paying for it (I know there's an argument for buying one game constantly, which makes sense, but I lean towards just sticking with the older console for it if it's not worth buying again). Along with the obvious pirating, the absolute WORST thing that can happen is when people screw with multiplayer games and ruin the community. Online shooters are just the biggest example, specifically because of how open online gaming is. Consoles may be more limited, but I attribute that to the reason hacking in online games isn't as much of a headache
@NEStalgia That's correct but their culture also is quite different. You can see everyday over there parents punishing their children physically (and they are very open to hit you if you do something bad, even as an adult), something that American people don't like (lawsuits incoming). Men cheating their partners is almost a rule, and their wifes are usually ok with that. Let's not go deeper with child related stuff. With this, sharing an umbrella doesn't seem like an incredible feat, at least not as an example of ethics as a whole in a culture.
@JaxonH I kind of see hacking as something easily abused to mess with online games. I'm neutral on it as long as it revolves around older games that can't be purchased by modern means, it's when it impacts current sales (available to anyone) and active games that the problems arise.
TBH, I avoid it mainly because I'm paranoid about it screwing with my system. Putting sketchy software on the consoles I invested hundreds of dollars in? Yeah, sure.
@Dr_Lugae you don’t think families want to know where in their city drugs are being peddled and used? Such things are commonly known and reported on. In my city I can give you street names where the drug trade exists, and not because I’ve ever been down them or been a user. I know it from news reports. Reports I appreciate and bring me awareness, bring city council awareness so they can dedicate resources.
@Findonovan95 Thanks 😀
...and ? Who. Cares.
@Devlind I think we're getting far off "Japan = orderly, rules based, ethical society; Rest of the world = Slipping more and more from that standard by the decade".
The cultural differences in child rearing are related to a point, the marriage structure not so much.
That said, physical punishment is only recently removed from US households and schools. And it's not ubiquitously disliked, there are not insignificant segments of society that wish it returned (nor has it disappeared entirely, it's a regional/cultural thing now.) But it was once essentially universal here....dare I say even in my own lifetime (sits on rocking chair), and contrary to modern "safe space" thinking, most kids didn't end up traumatized and developed into respectable adults.... There were more severe cases, of course, "belting" of kids approaching flogging in some corners of society, and the Catholic school nuns with rulers to the knuckles...probably a bit more corporal than is a good idea, but even within the psychiatric world there's intense debate over the merits or harm of physical punishment (it does appeal to the animal part of our brains and probably does cement necessary "do bad thing, get bad result" wiring in our brains the soft teaching clearly isn't solving, otherwise we wouldn't even be having this conversation! Not saying corporal punishment is the link to orderly society, there's more at play that coincides at the same time, but my point is, hard to condemn Japan for something that was only until recently standard most places and seemed to work just fine and is still a topic of study and research in serious behavioral study. There's a difference between child abuse and intended "train the brain against bad behavior" feedback (the same way getting burned trains a kid touching the stove is a bad idea....) The trouble in the past was that line wasn't drawn and abusive parents and teachers would then justify abusing their kids. Instead of drawing the line, hysteria went the other way and said to remove the physical feedback entirely and simply tell kids "don't do that again" would fix it.
And here we are on an article about hacks and piracy with a mountain of people justifying theft as their right because they can rationalize it in their mind and have a low likelihood of repercussions.
My point isn't that "beating kids solves piracy!" but since you mentioned it as a "negative" about Japan, I wanted to point out, that that may in fact be a "positive" in relation to a conversation about behavior of adults.
As for the sanctity of marriage in Japan...well that's a whole other thing tied to culture and such (and as you say, wives are often OK with it, which makes it different beast as well.) (Though on the contrary, adultery is excessively common everywhere else, even when the spouse is NOT ok with it....so that, again, is a really unrelated conversation.....or perhaps related after all.)
@Galenmereth I’m from Canada so let’s talk about Marijuana. Sale of the substance is currently illegal. I’m against the sale of marijuana myself. But the laws are changing as we speak. There is popular demand for this drug even though it’s harms are documented. Some would say its benefits overcome those harms, some would say it has no place at all in society.
It’s like hacking: some legal protection, some benefits, some criminal attractiveness, some harm to society. Do I oppose very detailed reports of the makeup of marijuana and it’s chemicals and effects good and bad? Do I oppose knowing where the dispensaries are both legal and illegal? No. That knowledge is fair for reporting and makes everyone aware of what is happening and can happen, good or bad.
@CorvoRevo Sycophants do, apparently
Good majority of this community is SOFT. Not a fan of @damo but half you clowns are ignorant. Because he reported on something going on in the world, that makes him a part of the problem?... Guess all this police brutality shouldn't be reported either. Don't like it, don't do it. Read the articles and shutup. Think you can do better? Go create softnintendolife.com
It's been a while since an NL forum has been this salty. Didn't that win the Splatfest?
@NinChocolate It's possible to give enough information abut something for someone to be aware or wary of something or enough to avoid certain areas.
Recklessness with information can end up causing more harm or help spread the very thing they're trying to avoid or help against.
@NinChocolate
"The idea of protecting something by keeping people ignorant of certain information is a flawed concept at best. Support that notion, and the wicked will gladly use it against you. Be glad for the press."
Excellent post. More people should pay attention to this.
@Galenmereth specific illegal pot dispensaries in my city have been reported on by our local news paper. They are known by the city and are being dealt with in the wake of changing laws. I’m not sure where the gross scandal is here? Do you favor government censorship and broad secrecy?
@Blizzia
"Lastly, I know you won't change your opinion, but the majority of your community hates hacking, hackers, "
The majority eh? You may want to do some polling before stating things like this as fact. You certainly don't speak for me or all the posters in these comments supporting the article and finding it interesting.
@electrolite77 there are so many examples of suppression of information (good or bad, that’s how life comes, right?) today that it’s hard to believe even a handful are so myopic about the underlying concepts
@Dr_Lugae I don’t believe in “recklessness with information” if it is the truth. That’s a phrase for manipulative forces.
If Nintendo doesn't release the Virtal Console for the Switch, I will just hack/mod my original Switch console to play the Classic games on it. And purchase another Switch for online play, and for retail and eshop games.
@Galenmereth apparently not. Explain your views on drug information and government censorship if you care...
Well I got nothing to say, but i'm against hackers, because it does not feel right to hack to get something imo, because their is no point tbh. Does not make it better at all, so yeah...... because once you get it, you want more, than you will get bored and don't know what to do.
@NinChocolate Do you see publicly reporting the current location of an abused spouse in a protection programme as not reckless?
@NEStalgia I think we got out of track here. You seemed to praise how Japan lost that behavioral training less than the rest of the developed world, so my point was that some things over there are not ok in the US too, and so, they could say the same about Japan.
Returning to topic, I say that hacking is ok while you own everything. Let's say, you have DK Country 2 and 3 cartridges, but Nintendo didn't put them on the SNES Classic. I believe you can add them without any remorse since there's no other option to do so. As I said before, if homebrew lets me backup my save files, I'd install it in a breeze since Nintendo hasn't given me the option. The same with emulators if you own the games.
Of course, there're some people that'll use that to get thousands of free games (from every country, more or less), even if they can afford them, but we can't really do anything about it.
@NEStalgia
And yet, as kids, we constantly test the boundaries of what we can get away with and sometimes some of us take pleasure in stepping outside the boundaries. We also question everything as we look to establish our moral code, something that fades as adults when many people simply follow others take on mortality.
If a person is trained to only stay within the rules no matter what, it lays them and their society open to manipulation by those who wish to define what the rules are and what morality is, e.g. The governments of the former Soviet bloc.
@Dr_Lugae please keep the argument limited to information appropriate for public access. I have. I’m unconvinced by your goals here regarding this news story and my support of it.
Edit: and by “appropriate for public access” I do mean widely agreed upon values for freedom to information of major democratic institutions. Just to get ahead of that argument.
@Dr_Lugae
Wow! Not even close to a valuable argument. Try another angle, bud.
To bring peace to anyone’s mind: I don’t support the hacking of the Nintendo Switch. It’s not interesting to me and hopefully not interesting at this time to many others. Thank you.
@BARSAMAN I suppose it's nice that they are just stupid instead of greedy.
I have very mixed feelings on this. On one hand homebrew can lead to cool game mods like Project M. On the other hand it opens the floodgate for piracy which is not good. Hopefully this doesn't screw over games that normally don't have amazing sales.
@NinChocolate The wicked are going to use it whether we use it first or not. We are just holding back .
@NinChocolate That's incorrect. What you want to say is that you don't "want" to support switch hacking. However, you just did and are doing it right now.
Where have I supported it? Certainly not in the support and defense of this news story broadly? There is a distinction here.
@NinChocolate You did say you don't believe in recklessness with information as long as its the truth.
My example was extreme but to being it back to the topic. That makes the difference between being able to bypass the Switch's security on a hardware level and not? Hacks for games like Pokemon that help ruin multiplayer for the majority of players so that certain players can have an unfair advantage?
Is broadcasting stuff that promotes poor sportmanship and cheating in gaming really not being reckless with information for a gaming website? If it was possible to evade a ban in a Nintendo game should Nintendolife being reporting how to do it as long as it works?
@SilentHunter382 Hacking isn't piracy but these hackers are directly supporting piracy by opening the switch up to homebrew.
@RichardZ IT's not illegal but unless you want to pretend it's not directly supporting piracy it's definitely bad.
@Dr_Lugae none of my examples were extreme. Everything in extremes would unravel human existence, right?
@Heavyarms55 Nothing wrong with hacking. Nothing wrong with someone running a program on their switch.
However, when you know the specific thing you're doing is going to open a system up to piracy early in it's lifespan then you are objectively a piece of [removed]
My god, the salt around this article.
It's just a news article, they're not directly supporting anything! And even if they were, there's nothing inherently wrong with modding. Objectively.
@Rika_Yoshitake What I believe he's talking about is the ability to be able to run game backups on the Switch. Which would mean ripping from a Switch, 3DS, etc cartridge that they own and playing it on the Switch via homebrew. Which is kind like voiding the warranty on the console but not strictly doing anything illegal unless they redistributed the backup.
There can be many benefits to having that option if the installed version of the game runs faster or you want to seamlessly access your game catalog without loading a cartridge.
At least I think that's how all this works. I'm not good with all the CFW and homebrew lingo if anyone would like to correct me.
Always interesting to see the 'you forced my hand' argument. 'I bought this console knowing it did not have a VC. Your failure to provide a feature which you did not promise is forcing me to act in a manner that may be or is illegal.' I feel like this may be a form of victim blaming. Nintendo, if you would stop trying to make a profit, I would not need to download ROMs. Your pricing is forcing me to steal.
@SanderEvers
You're a subscriber to Nintendolife, eh?
You're supporting damo, eh? Theoretically, you're supporting piracy since he broadcasted this article.
So much salt, think of the poor snails.
Sorry but not sorry to all the haters, I hope Nintendo life continues reporting on this. Playing my Vita recently, with a 200 GB micro SD card in an sd2vita adapter, filled to the bym with games I bought, both on the store and carts, plus homebrew ports of games I legally own on steam, I say eff you, I want 'hackers' to keep up the good work. I want to be able to play quake 2 or half life on the switch too one day.
And, AFAIK, breaking the encryption of stuff you legally own in on itself is legal in the EU. I can make as many copies of encrypted games I own as I want, as long as I don't distribute them to others.
Cya
Raziel-chan
@Octane @Meowpheel So how come if I was to post a thread about this in the forums it would be locked and I would be told I can't discuss this here. Gotta love double standards huh.
@HappyMaskedGuy
I hope you aren't depending on corporations to preserve games. Maybe you could talk Nintendo into reprinting your favorite NES/SNES/N64 cartridges but I doubt it.
@SanderEvers I'm pretty sure I'm good, I only have home console titles. Sad to hear that the Switch has copy protection though.
@electrolite77 Hey there Captain Obvious, make your own poll where you make whoever does want more awareness about hacking and hacking (as well as the inevitable piracy that always follows hacking, even though they're not the same) on Switch vote if you wish. I'm speaking for myself and the ones who had similar comments to mine, not you, obviously.
As I say with every article about hacking: do whatever you want on your own device, as long as you keep your shenanigans away from the online multiplayer. The moment I see invincible opponents in Smash or the entire map being inked one team's colour at the beginning of a Splatoon match, I will be very mad.
I make almost all of my money reselling old games to new hardware because, to be quite honest, I have stopped making new games. Please do not back up your games or I will be out on the street wondering why.
@davincim I'm amazed that all these obviously talented coders don't just put their efforts towards creating something original like setting up their own games company. Look at the Korg software on 3ds..brilliantly programmed to work with the hardware. Yet not a game...
Wow
@dereq Terrible use of language here. Poor taste. Engaging in a debate does not require it to be dragged down into the gutter.
It makes me so happy to see the PS logo on the switch. Would be awesome if we could have emulators on the powerfull X1 soc...
@lethal01 lol "objectively a piece of [removed]"? yeah, right. If I buy a new Ford Mustang I can modify it however I like. If other people copy those modifications in order to somehow steal other Mustangs, how is that my fault? I didn't steal anything. THEY are criminals, they are the ones at fault.
The only way the hackers in this case have any culpability is if they specifically work to enable piracy and then distribute those hacks to people.
This back and forth on the morality of reverse-engineering is so tiring so I am just going to list several reasons why it's important. The reasons are listed in increasing importance.
Without reverse-engineering:
...you wouldn't be able to play Mother 3 in English.
...you wouldn't know how to IV train your Pokemon.
...there would be no Virtual Console.
...there would be no ports.
...there would be no industry standards.
...there would be no safety standards.
...there would be no generic medication.
...there would be no generic anything.
...there would be no doctors.
...there would be no humans.
@RichardZ Oh, sorry about that then.
Hacking is hacking, enough with the robin hood [removed].
This is where a lot of people lose their bearings by claiming a moral high ground all the while doing an act which undermines the ability of Nintendo to support its customer base. These aren't fans, or Nintendo gamers, because there are plenty of outlets for those people to do their emulation on PC. We don't need every hardware platform to be an enthusiast playground, not the way I see it anyway.
@KainXavier ...but the game industry deserves special protections because gamers care more about corporations making money than they do about consumer rights and/or preserving games.
My advice for All of you :
Let's play and Support Original Softwares and Hardwares.
Stop thinking about Hacking and whatsoever.
Manage your Desire to NOT to be Greedy.
Better follow the rules rather than nreaking the rules.
Can we be a Good people ?
I believe we can.
Happy playing, keep your head cool.
@Anti-Matter I don't think you understand, supporting hackers who preserve games doesn't mean we are stealing games. I would say that we just don't care as much about Nintendo's bottom line as some people do though. Consumers need not concern themselves with enriching corporations but should be concerned about things that help consumers.
@KainXavier yup imagine how boring smartphones would still be with all the ideas from the jailbreaking community.
People just think hacking means cheating at multiplayer or pirating software
Damn, didn't realize I needed a bag of popcorn for this comment section!
@BensonUii lol, try linking to any sort of rom on gbatemp, see how fast you get permabanned.
Ruining Pokémon. What a noble goal.
@Tasuki To be frank, I don't like it either. I've asked about this more than once in the past few years, but I haven't really gotten a solid response. I'm glad Ant reworked the rules so that everything regarding last gen is allowed. I'd like to see a system where people can also discuss current gen (provided they don't link to illegal software < and that's the biggest issue preventing all of this I think).
@Galenmereth
Archiving is a perfectly valid reason, it's easier to maintain a complete collection by archiving a title when it's released, rather than wait for the console to be dead and risk something going missing.
@Crono1973 I don’t believe that most hackers have only the intention of preserving old games.
Come on now, that’s not realistic.
That’s more like a by-product of piracy, than anything else.
@shaneoh But it isn’t yours to archive. You don’t own anything about it, therefore you have no right to archive it.
I could steal priceless art from the Louvre because I believed that I should be the one to preserve it, because I didn’t trust the French for some reason (I like the French, by the way) and the Mona Lisa was my favourite picture ever (it isn’t).
But would I have the right to do so?
Then again, what was the creator’s intention? If they gifted it to the Louvre, because that’s where they wanted it to be, then definitely not.
By the same token however, the artist, or creator on this instance, sold their work. Therefore they relinquish all control as to it’s ultimate destiny. If the Louvre bought it, then it is theirs, fair and square. The private ‘curator’ would still just be a thief.
Discuss
@HappyMaskedGuy How can you compare archiving a legally purchased copy of a product to stealing the only original copy of art?
@SimonMKWii Because it doesn’t matter how many copies there are- it matters who legally owns it, because they’ve ponied up the dough for it.
The Louvre can sell prints of the same works, sure. But they still own the IP, or the image copyright.
@HappyMaskedGuy That's literally my point.
Once you buy something, you legally own it.
You don't hold the copyright for the item, but you have a legal right to do whatever you want with it for personal use.
As long as you don't distribute it, it's 100% legal to backup, hack, etc.
Half of my ZX Spectrum collection was copied tapes. Not sure how this contributes but that’s my two cents. 😊
@SimonMKWii So you’re saying that most hackers buy a copy of a game, then, and only then, do they back it up and duplicate it, with no intention of distributing it whatsoever?
Aaahhhh, pull the other one!
@Fandabidozi You have been reported to that number which comes up for FACT (Federation Against Copyright Theft) that’s on all my VHS tapes.
You fund terrorists and drug dealers. For shame.
I’m turning my back on you now.
@HappyMaskedGuy
Nor is it right to allow a piece of art to be lost to time because people can't or don't want to make money off it. It would be criminal if Goldeneye for the N64 was only playable on a few aging, and slowly decaying consoles because the distribution rights are a complete cluster.
Your example of stealing art is in no way the same as creating a digital copy of a game. If you were to go in, make a copy of the artwork that appeared to be the same, but is blatantly a copy if a person were to subject it to the basest form of scrutiny, then you'd have a valid analogy. The copies don't hold the value of the original, they're only worth the materials they're made out of. The Louvre keeps the Mona Lisa, and people who have no hope of seeing it get an opportunity to.
Hacking is awesome. I don't need a multinational company telling me what I should do with the hardware I bought. Cry me a river.
Some cool hacks from the past years:
Stop telling other people what they should do. You don't like fun? Then don't hack your device and keep quiet. Sshhhhhh
My device, my games that I bought, piss off with your problems with what I do with them. I have the right to do with them whatever I want, as long as I don't distribute them to others.
If this will make it possible to install mods on Switch Skyrim, then eff yeah, go hackers!
Cya
Raziel-chan
@Godlike_Virus This is the comment of the day, as far as I’m concerned!
I don't respect the n00bs that are anti hacking. Those are the kind of people with an Acer laptop with the stickers still on the palm rest. The kind of people with a Hotmail email address. The weird people who were still buying CDs when you could download every song. They type Google in the search bar of their browser and click on the first result.
@FinalFrog not if you're older than 65
@dereq Mind your language!
@OptometristLime @lethal01 You two as well. Mind your language!
@MagicEmperor Always a comfort to know someone else who lived through those times have a similar admiration of the same things that were going on then.
Meh, emulated games usually run janky so I never saw the point in doing it on anything else but a PC for retro games.
Good for these folks I guess......so they can finally cheat at playing pokemon? Lolkay.
@shaneoh Whether you think it is right or wrong is totally irrelevant.
It’s not your decision to make.
If you don’t own an IP, you have absolutely ZERO say in what does or does not happen to it. Your moral sense of duty is worth nothing.
When you buy a game, that copy us yours. But the IP, and what happens to it, is not your decision unless you pay to own it.
If Mario disappeared because Nintendo chose to get rid of him, it would be a huge loss. But surely it’s their decision to make, because it’s their property?
I hacked my 3DS only to play GBA games because Nintendo refused to sell them to me on the system. Sometimes people don't hold ill will here, people
@HappyMaskedGuy Priceless art is one of a kind, hacking computer hardware that you paid for and that there are millions of isn't comparable.
How do you feel about people modifying cars?
@BigKing Okay, Mr Elitist.
Well, I’m going to write to my local MP about this outrage.
@Crono1973 If you modify a car, you lose the warranty, don’t you?
I think the problem here is that hackers generally do not simply archive games that they have already bought. They duplicate it, and share that product with others who don’t want to pay for it. Which is piracy.
If you wanted a copy of a rare game, surely you could track one down? And if not, then feel free to buy the rights to said game. Then you could morally reproduce it.
@HappyMaskedGuy That's a decision you choose to make when you mod your car, same goes for your game system. Doesn't change the fact that modding cars isn't some awful, shady practice.
All pirates are hackers, but not all hackers are pirates. Yes, hacking can open the door for piracy, but it doesn't mean all hackers are pirates.
Also, holy crap man, sure let's drop millions of dollars for the rights to a game. Hyperbole much? Also, tracking down a used copy of a rare game doesn't support the developer in any way whatsoever. The sale that produced them money has already been made, you're just pumping money into the aftermarket. I don't condone piracy of actively sold games, but you went into another area here, and it's not a good one for your argument. If I want to play a really old game that would cost me hundreds of dollars to play on original hardware, without the benefits of potential translation patches, and I want to play that game on my PSP Go (or Switch in a few years when I feel that losing my repair support from Nintendo doesn't outweigh having a beautiful 6" tablet with physical controls to emulate on), then darn it I'm going to play it. No one suffered from me doing this, the game has been off the market for years. I just wish people weren't so staunchly against all forms of hacking ever. It's not all bad, even if there are some bad seeds out there sharing game files of products you can still buy new at your local game shop.
@Devlind True but comparing the cultural norms between the two is beside the point. The point was adherence TO the particular cultural norms, where Japan mostly does, where the West increasingly flaunts them in favor of "I'll do what I want, screw everyone else" mentality. Effectively, a child-like mentality.
As for carts, I do have more sympathy toward the gray area of bypassing copy protection to simply utilize hardware and software you already do legitimately have. Though while that is valid debate in the retro world, people don't notice in the digital age we've moved from having access to any product we "own" due to dependency on the "cloud" for all things. But I do agree, it's valid debate about breaking copy protection security to simply move content you legally own from one piece of hardware to another. Similar to copying DVDs/BDs to a home media server. Technically playing them from the server is illegal, it requires decryption of the content that's been broken by the player. Yet it's commonly done because that really makes no sense, where you can legally copy music of a CD in the same way and there's no fundamental difference.
Modern content won't even get this debate...we never had the content in our possession to begin with.
@electrolyte77 As kids.... That's the point. It took adults to monitor and correct those tendencies to produce adults capable of doing the same, and at some point the adults apparently stopped doing so, and the result is generations of adults that behave a children....and that's very dangerous for whole civilizations. (Now that I think about it, If we were to really go back and trace it I'd say it's a bi-product of WWII and the Depression.....parents were so bent on making sure their kids had the happiness they missed out on, they failed to instill a sense of ethics-at-the-cost-of-moentary-joy mentality. Not all, but a greater than normal percentage which produced ripple effects in subsequent generations. )
Though your example of the USSR as an example of rigidly adhering to the rules is deliciously ironic. The Bolshevik Revolution was not a case of rigid adherence to rules, but a largely youth-based (as it always is, as would be dictators know the idealistic, inexperienced youth with the tendencies to question rules and follow contrarianism make great catalysts) violent rejection of them. Yes the Czars had failed and grown apathetic and unresponsive to their population, but the USSR was carved by a violent and hostile takeover of the state by a rebelion....not exactly adherence to the rules. What followed wasn't adherence to the rules by choice of ethics, but by fear of knowing the consequences of not doing so. That's the opposite of what I was referring to. Ethical behavior isn't behavior achieved by coercion and force. It's behavior one chooses of free will to engage in out of a sense of equality and respect of everyone else, even when doing otherwise is more self beneficial. Ultimately "ethical" behavior means equal importance, equal respect from each to each individual within the relative norms of the culture. The inverse is effectively unrestrained self serving with no, or self justified limits.
Of course, one could self-justify everything from piracy to genocide within the context of their own world-view, and through history everything from piracy to genocide HAS been self-justified by individuals or groups of individuals. And every human with a pulse will gladly try to do so wherever they have something to gain. Thus the importance of learning self-imposed will to not do so. Whether the impulse be on the scale of pirating Donkey Kong, or the extermination of a population, the same self imposition of "Is this right?" should be a trained reaction. Sadly, it seems that no longer is so in much of civilization. That same thinking is reflected in the way corporations are managed, with bottom-line thinking rather than growing stable fixtures. "What benefits me the most right now" takes precedence over "What's the best outcome?"
@DragonbornRito
How is piracy not a valid argument here? Of course it is!
You may want to play an old game that is out of print and impossible to find, but you are not entitled to play it.
Besides, cars don’t work in that analogy anyway- it isn’t exactly easy to print a copy of a modified car that I can give to thousands of strangers. Totally different.
If you do not own the rights to the game, you do not have the rights to duplicate and distribute it.
Whether you agree or not is irrelevant. Also, there is never any victimless crimes. Somebody out there will own the rights to that game you harmlessly copied without buying. Surely it is up to them when they choose to distribute and sell their products?
Seems that theres a little bit of an entitled mentality surrounding this topic.
@HappyMaskedGuy I'm sorry, but being able to make your own games and applications without needing to buy an expensive dev kit is not equal to piracy.
The exploits were only ever searched for with homebrew, save backups, game backups and game modding in mind.
If someone uses it for piracy, it's their problem, they did the wrong thing, but the developers do not intend for it to be used as a piracy tool.
Although you're probably gonna pull the "enabling piracy" BS on me.
Which, I have a counter-argument for that too.
iTunes allowing DRM-free downloads enables music piracy, CD drives for computers enable music piracy.
There's a whole bunch of stuff that "enables" piracy, but it doesn't mean it needs to necessarily be used for that purpose.
@Blizzia
You claimed to be speaking for the majority. Your words. Post 116. It's on you to prove it.
I just went to a bookstore, grabbed a book and took photos of every page so I could read it on the airplane to Tokyo. I bought the ticket with the money I saved by pirating.
Piracy rules.
@Galenmereth
"Are you actually equating lawful morality with communism..?"
Read my post again. I'm questioning the existence of a proscribed morality whether it be handed down or a perceived majority decision. Things change, and they change because people question them. It doesn't necessarily relate to this but the general principle stands.
I see a lot of noise, but ultimately the issue is this is a Nintendo site, this is Nintendo-related news and they're right to report it.
@electrolite77 Nope. It's on you to disprove it. Have fun mate!
@HappyMaskedGuy If you modify your game console you void the warranty too. Your response didn't answer anything but I'll assume you are ok with people modifying their car.
Do you like the option to buy a song instead of a whole CD? Thank hackers. Do you like the Virtual Console (or PS1/PS2 classics)? Thank hackers.
It's not all about piracy, it's also about filling a whole that corporations will not. Corporations would prefer to sell you select remakes at full price and if it weren't for hackers creating emulators I doubt the corporations would even be offering things like the Virtual Console. It's my guess that emulation on PC proved to these corporations that there was a market for classic games being played via emulation.
As for music, Napster changed the music world for the better.
You know what's interesting about the game industry? Corporations are supposed to develop a product that they think people will like and then try to convince people to buy it but with the game industry we have gamers begging for products and even paying for them in advance before they can even be reviewed. It's backwards and quite frankly, it's sickening.
@Galenmereth I was responding to people who pick only the negatives. Why is it ok to pick only the negatives?
@Crono1973 Do the negatives outweigh the positives? I’m just more concerned about the long term impact of the negative effects.
And a lot of the positives you list were responses AGAINST hacking.
Also, modifying cars is in no way equatable with hacking and game copying.
I can’t exactly modify a car, then stick it in a photocopier to distribute to thousands of strangers can I?
@HappyMaskedGuy Nope and I don't accept the premise that consumers are to blame for the type of DRM a publisher chooses to use. I also don't accept the premise that YOU can't mention the positives because you think the negatives outweigh the positives.
Corporations are quick to use piracy to justify not offering refunds to consumers but have no problem selling consumers a game before it is even finished and can be reviewed. I don't understand why gamers are so willing to come to the defense of corporations.
@Crono1973 Oh don’t get me wrong, most corporations are just as bad.
I’m just speaking from more of a legal, easy now, point of view.
There will definitely be positives to hacking, in terms of consumer rights. I suppose there isn’t even any point in debating it- hacking is here to stay anyway.
@HappyMaskedGuy Corporations have far more influence when it comes to making laws than consumers do. Hacking is here to stay and while I don't support pirating games that are currently available from the publisher, games that are out of print are fair game in my opinion. I won't give a game shop $200 for a loose SNES game.
I forgot to respond to this:
I can’t exactly modify a car, then stick it in a photocopier to distribute to thousands of strangers can I?
Modifying a Switch doesn't mean you can mass produce those either.
@Crono1973 Yeah, it’s clearly not a black and white scenario. Its a shame that the benefits of hacking are so entwined with the negatives, like piracy.
I will admit to getting more than a little impatient with Nintendo’s non existent policy regarding HD remasters and Virtual Console availability. Its easy money, too.
@HappyMaskedGuy It is easy money and the thing about the Virtual Console is that people get frustrated waiting on the game they want to be released and it's especially frustrating when you see that Japan gets alot more VC games than anyone else. Japan getting these VC games shows that they CAN be released without technical issues but they just aren't being released outside of Japan. Why wouldn't people just say 'screw it' and emulate the game they want to play.
@Octane It just looks bad that's all. It's kinda of like a cop busting you for speeding then they do it and it's ok. I mean how can you expect people.to be happy when a mod locks their thread discussing hacking/emulation of the Switch and then hey look there's an article on it. I understand people are going to talk about and I understand it's news but to say one thing and then do another, just doesn't look good man.
@Tasuki It's not something I can do a whole lot about unfortunately.
I usually let is slip through the fingers if it's not a ''How do I hack my Switch?'' thread.
There are boons to hacking, save data backups for one, but the banes such as pirating eshop titles are unacceptable. Unfortunately I think if enabled, pirates will use these exploits to get free products.
Now I have downloaded ROMs before, so I'm not pretending like I have a self-justifying leg to stand on. I'm just as at fault here.
@JaxonH on point as usual.
Most of this hate is misdirected, in my opinion. SciresM is not the scum here, it’s the people who make emulators and upload the ROMs. I think it’s OK to for example rip music from games and listen to it as long as you already own the game.
@Anti-Matter I know you think it is best to buy the games legally and make sure the developers get the money they have earned and I agree 100% with you but:
What about cases where it is not possible to do that anymore? Take the Wii Shop. That has been discontinued now. (The shop is still up but you can no longer add funds making it impossible to buy anything anymore.) There are dozens if not more WiiWare games that never got released on another platform. If you want to play that game, what do you do? You have to pirate it because it is not possible to pay the developper anymore, it is not possible to buy it. Same with lots of the Virtual Console games on the Wii - they never got released on Wii U and of course we know Switch Virtual Console doesn't exist (yet).
And then there are even older games that go back to the 90s, 80s, and even 70s that people want to play but the developer no longer exists, the platform to buy them on no longer exists. Is it wrong to pirate these games?
I think it is very wrong to pirate current games but once games reach a certain age it is OK simply for their preservation for future gamers. I want my kids in 2030 or whenever to be able to play the same games I can now in 2018. I don't think it's fair to tell them they can't play a game just because they were born too late and it's no longer for sale.
People are getting upset because the hacker gloated?
While Nintendo puts an unusually large amount of effort trying to stop people from playing ROMS on the Switch, hardware that can't be hacked doesn't exist, and it's not like Nintendo is dying because a very small group of people are playing ROMS in the Switch instead of their PC.
@Crono1973 Just thought I’d say, thanks for the good discussion on this subject. Very interesting points raised on such a polarising topic.
Seems like people need to be more aware of the ways in which hacking can be of benefit to both consumers and games developers. Where is the middle ground legally and ethically? Who decides?
If people such as myself don’t participate in the hacking community, then it is difficult for us to claim to know much about the moral boundaries it may or may not be trespassing with regard to piracy.
Will need to educate myself.
@cfgk24 That's because programing talent and other virtues do not necessarily come in the same package. There are other skills in life they do not possess.
@Galenmereth
I never used the "archiving" card in my previous post but yes, understanding how the underlying hardware and software work would further the cause of software and hardware preservation. I don't see that as a bad thing.
You may think it's ridiculous to compare generic medication to homebrew software but the people behind both of those things share the same drive to understand how something works. I'd even go as far as saying it is human nature to want to understand how something works.
Is piracy an outcome of reverse-engineering the Switch's operating system and making the knowledge public? Yes, but there are so many other positive outcomes that we cannot possibly foresee.
For instance, I think the Switch would make an amazing office presentation device. You could work on the slides in tablet mode and then pop it into the dock during meetings. The Joycon can be easily detached and used to advance slides too.
This is the kind of thing that reverse-engineering would enable me and other curious minds to do.
@TheLobster
Oh, about that.
Well, like i have ever said on other thread, we are as human need to learn how to control our Desires.
Indeed, we have so many Desires and Wants, including Desires to possess something.
But, if we can't possess something due to some circumstances, we need to Let Them Go.
By doing so, we also able to manage our Desires and not to get carried away by our feeling when we can't get something.
For me, i'm also want to play some interesting NES / SNES / WiiWare games. But, if i don't have any chance to play, i will let them go, i will not try to use illegal ways or hacking the system just only to able to play those games.
I can straightly looking for illegal NDS ROMs from website and download No$GBA emulator if i want to play NDS games, but i decide to NOT to do that. I realized that was violate the law. I wil not feed my Desires to get satisfied by playing the games even by illegal ways. We need to manage our Desires. Don't let our Desires and Ambitions take over our logic and humanity. Besides, we still can live even without playing those specific games. Yes, it will feel so hard to let them go due to our bond feeling with some games if we like certain games, but sometimes we must to move on. We can play other games that similar with older games we have ever knew, perhaps a better way to heal our feeling after we let something go.
Life is sometimes Unfair, but we have to face it. I know i have some Conservative mindset on certain things, but at least i know what is right things to do. For the preservation in the future, we can introduce our future generations the old games that we've ever played on our era. We need to educate them to manage their Desires and Emotional feeling to Not get carried away when they want something that will never been come true. So, i hope by doing so, they can be tough and will not tempted about hacking and pirating something.
For my case, Nobody taught me about how horrible is hacking the system illegally & playing pirated games. I got educated by my own will, when i realized my past habits were so wrong. Since then, i built my mindset to not tempted by hacking or pirating the system. I was so lucky to have a chance to Start from New again, fixed my past. And i want to share my experiences to someone who need a chance to fix their mistakes in the past.
Well, that's all my confession from my perspective. Pardon if i still pretty Conservative on certain things.
@Jokerwolf Bless your heart buddy but you're in the minority most people just pirate games if they can... and it's a damn shame.
@Anti-Matter I guess that's a fair mindset to have. I just feel historical preservation is an OK reason to pirate. People preserve old books, movies, music, etc. Why not old games? With those other things, they have fallen out of copyright before they have started to be preserved. But games as a medium moves so quickly that often they don't have a chance to fall out of copyright before they are at a risk of being lost forever. In fact I don't know if any game has yet fallen out of copyright at all. However, one day these old games WILL be out of copyright and pirating them will be legal. They will be free, like copies of Shakespeare or Mark Twain that you can read on the internet for no charge. But that won't happen if they aren't preserved now.
Like piracy, homebrew is still illegal. As the hardware manufacturer and rights owner, Nintendo has final say as to which games and applications can be used on their systems.
@TheLobster Video games can be preserved without piracy by legally dumping the ROMs directly from legally obtained physical copies of the game or by making data backups of legally obtained digital copies, as is already being done by many people. Once the point hits that they do become public domain, then those collectors can freely distribute the copies they've saved (which would technically be privateering rather than pirating). Nintendo's digital-only games could be tricky to distribute at that point, but by then Nintendo may recognize the need to release a special DSiWare/WiiWare system that can play copies of those games with no restrictions, although keep in mind we're still looking at decades into the future.
@BulbasaurusRex Or Nintendo and other companies may pull a Disney and just keep extending copyright ad infinitum so that the question never comes up. Anyway it's an interesting question because at SOME point Mickey Mouse has to become public domain and at SOME point Mario has to become public domain too. But either of those may not be until long after we are dead, but game backups are still important up until that time.
@TheLobster Agreed, but like I said piracy isn't necessary for preserving them when people are already doing the job legally.
@BraveBiT Emulated games run janky? You can play Goldeneye in hi-res widescreen 60fps if you want. Mario Galaxy in 4k. Most of the N64/GC/Wii games look worse on the real hardware.
@BulbasaurusRex Homebrew isn't illegal,, now you're just making stuff up. Besides, companies do a terrible job at preserving games. And then there are games like Bound High for the Virtual Boy, Propeller Arena and Half-Life for the Dreamcast: unreleased games that were finished and leaked.a
Hacking a console give you the best of both worlds. You can still buy games legally or try before you buy. And then it also opens up a whole new world of possibilities. Even piracy has it's uses. You expect people to buy a second Wii U from Japan just to play Puyo Puyo Tetris or Taiko no Tatsujin? Or American Dreamcast owners to buy a second DC just to play Shenmue 2?
Hell naw. Pirates have more fun.
> My personal goal is to continue hacking Pokemon games on the Switch
Which is exactly what I fear the most.
Can I have a Pokémon game I can actually play normally without having to worry about the million hackers who're going to ruin the online experience day 1 even ONCE in my life please?
@BigKing I don't blame you for skipping over the terms and conditions pages of tech products you purchase, but any video game system is clearly stated to only be licensed for use with officially licensed products. Breaking a licensing agreement (on either end) is illegal.
Maybe the companies themselves are bad at preservation, but individual collectors are not. There are plenty of people out there who are tracking down copies of rare retro games for the purposes of dumping the carts for preservation.
Sure, pirates have more fun by stealing. If a game isn't officially released or available in your region, that's just too bad. You'll simply have to go without, as you're simply not entitled to free entertainment for any reason unless actually given away by the rights holders. Besides, the Switch is region free and also allows you access to foreign e-shops simply by making an additional account with a different country setting.
Hacking could be used as an extensive demo system, but temptation is simply too strong for many gamers to actually purchase games after they try them. It's why the Shareware system for '80s PC games failed until it was adjusted for use as an episodic structure in the '90s.
@Crono1973 While you are legally allowed to archive and/or modify your own legally purchased copy of the game, and you can even legally distribute mods as long as a non-dristrubuted copy of the base game is required to run the mod; you are not allowed to modify licenced hardware (or its internal software) or to distribute the archived game or any other licensed ROMs to facilitate the distribution of such mods, nor are you allowed to archive anything that was not legally purchased. Emulators themselves are legal but only to play independently released freeware or games dumped directly from legally obtained cartridges or CDs. That's where the legal line is crossed.
Something like "Project M" is the one gray area I can think of, as there is no system modification and requires an original copy of "Super Smash Bros. Brawl," but you are technically still using your Wii (or Wii U) to play a non-licensed product.
@BulbasaurusRex Breaking a licensing agreement is not illegal, it just does that: it breaks the licensing agreement. So they can block you from their services or brick the console. Maybe it's different in the States, but here in Europe it sure as hell isn't illegal.
Besides, pirates don't steal, they copy. Stop using nonsensical metaphores. It's not the same.
And remember, if you don't get caught it's not a crime /Jadakiss
@BulbasaurusRex The law says that farmers can't even work on their own farm equipment because of the software license agreement. Which is why I really don't care much about what is legal and illegal under the DMCA.
https://www.wired.com/2015/04/dmca-ownership-john-deere/
Next it will be your car, your television and your smart home that you won't actually own but rather have a license to use. Stop defending this BS.
How far are we, as consumers, going to let these corporations go before we stop defending them?
@RegularGameFan No, praising their EFFORTS is not the same as praising their SUCCESS.
@Tasuki you do know we didn't make the rules, right?
Anyway, it's not like we delete any mention of hacking. We usually only chime in when things get too specific.
At the end of the day there will always be people who don't want to be locked behind the will of a company. I'm not talking in terms of piracy, I'm talking when it comes to creativity.
People like to tinker and create and if you have the know how, it's a challenge to see what you can do with a piece of hardware that is essentially locked down.
Personally, I've used jailbreaks in the past, but this was NOT to bypass the monetary reward that is the right of hard working developers.
On the Wii for example, I am able to play No More Heroes 2 on my PAL system using home brew. NMH 2 was never released in PAL so it's a great benefit.
On the iPhone, I was able to use features that weren't implemented into iOS yet like being able to switch Wifi and Bluetooth on and off from the main screen, etc.
So long as home brew doesn't revolve around hacking brand new games and taking food from the mouths of the countless amount of people involved in making them, I'm all for it.
Some people curse emulation but its a fantastic way to preserve and enjoy decades old games - some that weren't even available in my country for example.
It's also great to see people like this come forward and offer advice to Nintendo from an outside perspective. If he / she was an evil criminal intent on plundering the coffers of developers, do you honestly think they would be coming forward publicly with this information?
@BigKing Maybe it's not technically illegal, but it is a big no-no and like you said it allows Nintendo (or whoever) to fudge you up in return.
Pirates do steal, because they take away money from the people they would've bought the game from legally, even if it's just a used game shop or failing to drive the bidding up further on an auction site. If the price is extremely high to the point you never could've afforded to buy it, the price wouldn't be that high in the first place if the demand weren't there due to most people illegally downloading it for free instead. Only in the small minority of cases where the product is otherwise absolutely unavailable can you make the argument that no stealing is involved, but you're still not entitled to free entertainment just because there are no other options.
@Crono1973 I'm not defending that kind of BS. I've already agreed that you can do whatever you like to your own legally acquired software. You just can't acquire it illegally, distribute it in illegal ways, or use it in an unauthorized way.
Besides, it would be pretty stupid for a farmer who's not also a programmer to mess with the computer code inside his/her tractor. If it's a simple hardware issue, then they're allowed to fix it themselves if they can. Otherwise, they should either hire a professional or buy a new one. There are good reasons for a lot of those kinds of rules.
@BulbasaurusRex Hiring a professional should not be limited to authorized service technicians. Also, what these corporations want is that even a simple hardware issue can't be fixed by anyone other than authorized service technicians because the software exists. The idea that you don't own anything you buy that has software is the direction we are heading and you are defending it. This disease is spreading outside of the game industry and consumers shouldn't be supporting it.
If the price is extremely high to the point you never could've afforded to buy it, the price wouldn't be that high in the first place if the demand weren't there due to most people illegally downloading it for free instead.
This isn't how supply and demand works. Downloading Earthbound increases supply of game copies and decreases demand for the physical cartridge in return. On the other hand if nobody downloaded and everyone was buying the physical cartridge supply would decrease and that would cause prices to skyrocket.
@Crono1973 No, I'm not defending that. If it's just a hardware issue, then that's just stupid that the license would include that as part of the software license. If that actually is part of the license (which may just be people overreacting rather than accurately interpreting the license agreement), then people are right to complain about that kind of thing.
However, we're not dealing with hardware issues when discussing the rights involved with digital software (such as video games) ownership and distribution. Don't confuse one legitimate issue with another illegitimate issue that may or may not be occurring on a slippery slope. Just focus on getting people to separate hardware from software in how they apply the DMCA.
As for your "Earthbound" example, you just reworded exactly what I said! That you for supporting me on that. Piracy drops the demand and therefore the prices, which means the sellers are making less money on their sales due to the pirates indirectly stealing that extra money from them. "Earthbound" itself is a bad example, though, as it's now available cheaply on the Wii U Virtual Console, which means the pirates are stealing the money more from Nintendo now instead of the used games sellers and have even less of an excuse to just buy the game legally.
@BulbasaurusRex Nintendo values Earthbound at $10 so retro sellers trying to get $200+ out of it do not have my sympathy.
It's not just pirate downloads that lower demand, it's also VC downloads. The retro bubble needs to burst anyway.
@Crono1973 Like I said, "Earthbound" was a bad example. Those sellers don't have my sympathy either. Having these old games available again at a standard reasonable price is good for everyone, as long as people actually use the services instead of continuing to pirate the games.
However, it's a different situation when a game is legitimately rare, in which case sellers should be getting as much as the demand allows them to get when selling them.
@BulbasaurusRex ..and without pirating (and VC) Earthbound would be much rarer than it is now. In this case piracy is the consumer response to ridiculous prices.
everybody is over-exaggerating.
we don't live in the age of commodore 64 or amiga.
back then piracy was harmfull and systems easy to hack.
nowadays most people don't care about modding they dont like to mess up their warranty.
btw it helped sony for the psx to be very succesfull, new people will buy the switch for this. maybe only 10% of the total sales in the switch last cycle wil do this.
most of them use it for emulators, because is you use it for nintendo games the system becomes boring, its not like you have so many great 3th party games. i used to mod my systems myself, why? because it was possible!
but n-systems are not worth it like hacking ps4 wich have everything.
i quit doing this because it did not gave me satisfaction anymore in gaming. you play a little bit of rhos and a little bit of that, but dont finish games. and then there are updates, patches. no i decided to suport a system because it was far more satisfying to have a legal collection.
and why on earth do i want to play old crap. i game 35 years, i have played emulated psx n64 games for like a decade ago.
i can't stand the shitty graphics anymore.
@Rika_Yoshitake Any software that is more than 10 years old is fare game IMO, and if I own it on a past platform I have the right to use it on any future hardware regardless of how I do it in my eyes. 10 years is more than enough to make your money on something you created anyone who thinks otherwise is kind of being ridiculous.
Would you care to elaborate on the picture of the Switch running a PS1 emulator, Damien?
Here's the thing you agreed to Nintendo's EULA. Regardless if you read or didn't read at the time of purchase. For the rest whom just want to enjoy NS gaming we won't go there. Unless someone is going to pay for a $300 replacement unit of which I doubt any hackers or home-brewers would pay the disgruntled NS owner whom tried to home-brew and failed. So those hackers stop talking like it's a one off - once it screws up there's no going back and you hackers obvious won't help them fix their devices. So unless you willing to OUT yourself to fix problems your home-brew caused don't even talk about home-brewing a NS.
and now hes banded from all the special stuff on the switch lol
@Anti-Matter That's cute to assume that piracy and hacking are the same thing, but you do you.
First off, homebrew have done a lot of neat things in the past, like when SSBB sucked on the Wii, homebrewers brought in Project M, which was a Melee remake on the Wii. If Nintendo makes poopy products, they should be punished for it by alternatives from the community.
Also to assume that homebrewers will be hitting the same game markets as Nintendo is incredibly naive. If people want games actually on the Switch (BotW, Souls, etc) Then they wil buy them. This is for people who want games that are not being produced for the Switch, or when NIN sorely misses the mark like with Brawl.
@Mando44646 I bet u don't have that 2ds because its bricked lol
@Roosterneeb lol. Shows how dumb you really are lol.no matter what you say those people and what they stand for and people who aid them are trash lol
@Slim1999 still have the 3DS. Gave it to someone who doesn't need online access
@Slim1999 Yup, I'm absolutely dumb for having a different opinion than you. Just saying that these people are trash, when what they are doing affects you in no way, shape, or form, and then giving no justification for it makes you look like five year old here.
You do you bud.
He paid for his Switch, he can do what he wants with it. What he does with it is none of your business. Nobody is putting you at gunpoint and forcing you to use homebrews, but they're there as an option for people who want it, and People OBVIOUSLY want it, because it's still being improved and developed.
I know this is old, but I have to chip in here.
Apple tried to enforce a policy against the home brew community on the idevices. It was thrown out of court. On top of this, a lot of the hackers that opened the firmware have been credited with finding exploits that have now been closed.
From my personal experience things like this can be really useful. I didn’t have any pirated games on my PSP, but thanks to the home brew people I could back up and store games I had paid for. It also meant I could store multiple games on a memory stick, this meant I had a lot less stuff to carry around with me.
I had no interest nor will to overwrite the PSP firmware, that changed after an update. I had downloaded the additional Wipeout Pure tracks and discovered I could no longer play these, as the firmware stopped the ability to read these files from the memory stick. So I looked into custom firmware as a result of this.
@gloom These people are going to hack the Switch because it is lacking a lot of features, no web browser, no emulation of retro games. (Gamecube, N64, ETC) If Nintendo doesn't do these things the hackers will. I'm not going to hack my Switch but I certainly can see why people would hack it.
@HappyMaskedGuy How does the Switch being hacked destroy it?
@dunnyone I agree, there is a lot of potential for the homebrew scene. It would be incredible for the games it can run Gamecube stuff.
That's pretty impressive if you ask me!
I hate those people who try to flame the fu<k out of the homebrew community and don't even know what and who they're flaming. For all you r3tards out there:
1. Homebrew ≠ Piracy
2. Homebrew allows people to create their own, beautiful games for e.g. the Switch.
3. Homebrew allows people to emulate their favourite games from other platforms to run on the Switch.
4. Homebrew may, but must not enable Piracy.
5. Homebrew = good. Piracy = bad. Those are different things!
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