Topic: Is the pro controller d-pad terrible?

@Yorumi No, no, no, no no. Why do you want your controller to be the wrong way? You and @ralizah. Pfft. Looney, the both of you! (I seriously loathe the PS stick layout. Loathe, loathe, loathe.) Microsoft at least got that right (and Nintendo aped it beautifully.)

@OorWullie Elite controller lets you change the D-Pad to a few different pad styles, and lets you change the stick stems/heads with different size ones. But you can't change the position, the analog mount can't really be moved...it's large inside (on all controllers.) Elite's sticks and buttons are the same as the stock controllers, but it also shouldn't be less durable (though Xbox sticks have always been fragile little eggs...I went through like 4 X360 controllers.)

@NEStalgia The D-Pad being positioned lower and further in on the controller than the analog stick makes it less comfortable to use when playing 2D games. Also, aesthetically, the dualshock controllers are beautifully symmetrical, whereas the odd design of Xbox and Nintendo controllers make the right stick look out of place, like a third nipple or something.

Just look at how elegant that is.

I'd also like to point out that Playstation controllers have iconic shapes to distinguish the buttons, whereas Nintendo and Xbox controllers use letters, which can easily get confusing when the two companies don't use the same layout. Is B on the right or on the bottom of my controller? If I'm going between an Xbone and Nintendo pad, it's hard to keep straight. But X is always on the bottom of a dualshock controller.

Face it, Playstation perfected traditional controller design.

@Ralizah 2/10 too many nipples -IGN.

PS controllers are sure pretty to look at! Having to use them makes me want to play board games instead. You're right though, for 2-D games it's worse....but that's kind of the point, proving that the top upper position is the best position for your primary control......PS assumes most games play like LBP and SF. MS/Nin assume Halo/Odyssey are how most games play. The offset design literally puts the main input (the stick) where you say the best place for the main input should be located. Of course if you're mostly playing fighters that's bad. Most modern platforms seem designed for stick input primarily. I've found VC games need the D-Pad but newer games (Rayman, DKCTF etc.) respond best with the stick. I resisted....but I caved. (Of course I played on a full on arcade stick back in the day so who am I to judge? )

Shapes...meh. I learned A & B on the NES. ABXYRL on the SNES controller. Every other layout is WRONG! I don't actually care much about the printed indicators actually. What drives me nuts is the POSITION reversal of ok/cancel between Nintendo/Sony-XB. Of course the diamond design is Nintendo's so theirs is right by nature.) Sony only used the shapes because the letter/diamond was too patent infringing back then But I DO feel like a noob every time I switch consoles....wait...."why did I just accept that dialog to delete all my saves? Oh, stuff it! The ok/cancel are swapped! " That's at the top of my gaming pet peeves.

I've never met a Sony controller I didn't hate. The PS3 controller reigns supreme as worst controller ever. Even my Nykos were better, and they were really bad! PS4s is at least better than that low water mark. But the stick placement (and height/range of motion) is still terrible. At least my Razer Raiju feels less awful even if the sticks are still wrong. I'm even willing to put up with a cable to play with a less awful controller! That's the only thing that lets me not hate playing PS!

Trust me, I never credit Microsoft for ANYTHING.....but they sure nailed controller design (if not build...)

@Yorumi Ahh, that's better. I haven't much used "single joycon"...though I love dual joycon.

@NEStalgia Well, here's the thing: the sub-optimal placement of the left analog stick is offset by it protruding out further than a D-Pad, meaning it's easier to reach with your thumb. The Playstation layout is better for controllers with both sticks and D-Pads, as it makes them both fairly comfortable to use. I CAN use the D-Pad on an Xbone controller, but it doesn't feel... quite right.

As I understand it, O means confirm and X means cancel in Japan with regard to dualshock controllers. For some reason, we reversed that in the West.

Single joycon play sucks on its own. I have some accessories that make them feel more like normal controllers, but they're still suboptimal at best.

Dual joycon is wonderful, though. More comfortable than even the best traditional pads, because I can play with my hands in any position I like, which is very comfortable.

@Yorumi LOL. I happen to like two separated Joycon one in each hand, but my experience with sideways single joycon bothered me a lot (snipper clips.) Odyssey OTOH was a blast to play with separated detached joycon. You can lean back with arms at comfortable positions rather than going all hunchback like normal controllers demand. I tend to feel "normal" controller position in my back after a while, scrunching the shoulders forward for long periods. The sticks are a little short travel, but the buttons are fine (used to 3DS and Vita.) A game like Splatoon I need the Pro, but for more laid back games, I prefer Joycon separation when I can get away with it.

@ralizah I suppose the PS controller layout is better for using both (often), I'll give you that. But I'd also say it's compromising the PRIMARY input in order to do both "well enough" rather than making the primary optimum. If you're not playing 2D games (that don't work ideally on stick like Rayman for example does ) that can be an issue. I find 90% of the time the D-pad is a menu navigator and nothing more, for me these days (actual ports of actual retro games being the rare exception that really need the digital input. As well as fighters, but I wouldn't touch a fighter without an arcade stick, and even USFII portable, I found myself using the joycon stick more than wishing I had a dpad.)

Ohh, interesting....so the buttons are reversed in purpose on Japanese models? I seriously need to import Japanese Playstations from now on instead.... That makes sense. "O for cancel" never seemed right (though it's red which makes sense.) I wish they'd let us reverse that in the menus.

Joycons: This is the one controller on which we speak the same language

@NEStalgia I can see liking the asymmetrical layout if you don't really play a lot of 2D games. For someone like me, though, who plays indies as often as I play "top shelf" 3D games, it's a big deal. And, you know, I've never really been bothered by the left stick placement on Playstation controllers to begin with. I still find them comfortable to use.

Yeah. The X is deeply, implicitly associated with negation in the Japanese consciousness. So when Western games go to Japan and the button mapping is still the same as it was in the Western releases, it causes confusion and annoyance.

@Ralizah Yeah, I don't play too many 2D indie games that need a D-pad anyway (I'm into into the whole "SNES-inspired!!" thing), though 3D indies are great, and most of the "higher shelf" 2D indies are really meant for stick play as well (2D=D-pad I still feel is a mythology built from the retro days when most games were just keyed on the 8-directions of the arcade stick gate.) Modern games that take analog control into account play as well or better when played with a stick. Even 2D games. (Shantae may be "indie" or not depending on view...I wouldn't use a D-Pad for that...) Personally I'd rather have both the ideal controller for 3D (Xbox style) and the ideal controller for 2D (HORI HRAP!) And not bother with "it's kinda sorta good for both" like DualShock. Split joycons are the exception because they offer ergonomics.

The X is deeply, implicitly associated with negation in Western conciousness, too. That's why "X for OK" was always mind fumblingly confusing. (I mean even PCs have an "X" at the top of every window to close it.....not a circle to close, and an X for an OK button. ) I always thought they did it that way to not patent infringe Nintendo, but if they didn't do it that way in Japan, it makes me wonder.

The Sega Genesis, Playstation generations, SNES and NES have the best d-pads imo and I'd instantly buy a custom modern controller with the Genesis d-pad if it ever became a thing since it functions so smoothly.

@NEStalgia Not necessarily. Not implicitly. An X mark can have affirmative or negative associations for those of us living in Western civilizations. It's sometimes interchangable with the checkmark, for example.

The circular shape also has an implicit association with affirmation in Japan.

Refer: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/O_mark

Consider that the same is not as true in the West.

Imagine if clicking the checkmarked answer on an online agreement canceled it out. I think this is probably what it is like for Japanese gamers to use X to affirm a choice in a game.

@Ralizah X implies negation in MOST situations here. An X interchanged with a checkmark isn't actually contrary to that, as the X (or check) is also interchanged with punching out multiple choice options with a punch which was common not so long ago. "Negating" that box with an X (or removing material, removing that box) as a means to select it actually makes sense, though mostly it's done for readability.) Circle with an X through it in signage, green checks and red X's for dos and don'ts in signage, etc are all normal, common recognizable symbols for negation here. It's not used for affirmation, though occasionally used for selection. Circle has no meaning here in that context. But X really does always negate (or select.) X-affirmation is not much less wrong in the west than it is in Japan. It really makes no sense that they changed it, here, form the layout that makes 100% sense in Japan and 98% sense in the West to one that makes 0% sense in Japan and 2% sense in the US Then again Sony went and made circle red.....because it should be maximally confusing.

It's not TERRIBLE but I much preferred the original 3DS D-Pad. (Not the New 3DS D-Pad) People point to the others like NES, SNES, and Wii, but the 3DS D-Pad is my most loved D-Pad ever. I love that it strikes a balance between stiff and freeform, so you can never ever make a mistake like you can occasionally do with the Switch D-Pad.

Joy-Con D-Pad, on the other hand, are pretty nice... for certain games. Shovel Knight, great. Sonic Mania, great. Xenoblade 2? Joy-Con D-Pads are literally built for RPGs with menu navigation. Blaster Master Zero? Nah, aiming is terrible. It's to the point where I prefer some games with the Joy-Cons over the Pro Controller.

ill sprinkle some of my ogo dust on em and turn everything into humor.
thatl teach em

I don't like the Swith Pro Controller d-pad. It feels very stiff and it sticks out too far from the housing. It's a launch day controller, so maybe newer controllers have better d-pads. But it's up there with the DSi d-pad for awfulness IMO.

@sarethums Do you mean you use your Mayflash as a way to use the Xbox controller on the Switch?

Anyway, I've been interested in Mayflash F300 for some time now, and I don't know how it can be linked to the Switch if I don't have a Pro Controller. I have to decide if I get a Pro or a Mayflash arcade stick, mostly for fighting games on Switch and especially the Xbox 360 and One. And I don't know what to do. But won't buy both.

I got my pro controller day zero... Day before switch came out...
D-Pad sucks so bad.
I really only noticed it when playing Tetris/Puyo

@sarethums I remember your post from a few months ago and came here to comment. Just got a brand new official Pro Controller about a month ago, and so far it seems the D-pad is working perfectly. I admittedly haven't thoroughly tested it but so far I haven't experienced a single incorrect input yet. Maybe the newer Pro Controllers have the D-pad issue fixed? Worst case scenario if you end up with a Pro Controller that has a D-pad issue, just tell Nintendo Customer Service and they should be able to fix or replace it free of charge I think.

It DOES however feel a bit stiff, and there's an audible clicking noise that I hear when I press to the right. But otherwise the D-pad works great.

@shadow-wolf cheers appreciate that

@ReaderRagfish from what ive played its fine, i was having more problems with shmups.

The D-Pad is working great for me for shmups and street fighter...purchased mine only a couple of months a go, I don't know if there's anything to the launch version.....Switch Pro Controller is awesome IMO