Sony Hardware Takes Charge of Japanese Charts With Flurry of Releases

Sony are killing it lately. Come on, Ninty!

I bet they would be killing it here to if they translate Digimon and Phantasy Star Online 2

@Moon Not too surprising really. It's a bit of a doldrums right now on the Nintendo front, and anyone who thought that Sony wouldn't have a good week with all the AAA titles that dropped in the past couple of days was fooling themselves.

Nintendo has a strong line-up starting next month with Xenoblade Chronicles 3D, and really ramps up with Splatoon in May leading into what I'm predicting will be a very hype-filled E3 (more info on the games from last year, like Zelda U for instance).

It's just been a slow March. (Pun unintended)

I'm surprised Type 0 sold so much when it's been available on PSP over there for almost 5 years! I hope Bloodborne does well next week, but I still think those games are pretty niche.

I think it's stretching to call those Wii U sales modest too. 20k or so would be modest in Japan. It was doing almost 10k a week this time last year, and 12k a week this time in 2013. It's doing as bad as it's ever been, sadly. 110k for the whole year so far. When the PS4 and Xbone double or triple those figures each month in the US alone, it really paints a picture of the Japanese market being so small it's irrelevant. It's why Japanese studios are either making games aimed at the West or making games for mobile these days.

At least Xenoblade is coming soon to give the Wii U hardware numbers a boost for a week or two.

Seems like the 3DS family needs a boost, no? Xenoblade Chronicles 3D can't come soon enough. What's the nearest 'blockbuster Wii U title' to release in Japan, anyway?

Yikes, Battlefield and Minecraft are beating all of Nintendo's staples. And even Dragon Quest (albeit a spinoff that launched a couple weeks ago). Japan is truly losing its soul it seems.

@Peach64 Actually, it paints a picture of the US market being the largest in the world by a big margin. The Japanese market is still the second largest in the world when it comes to overall sales, unless the UK has surpassed it in the last few months (which I doubt).

We really need a Direct soon. I guessed we'd get an announcement for one today. I was wrong...

I think it's pretty interesting that, when added together (PS3 and PS4 versions), Battlefield and Resident Evil come out on top. Also nice to see the Vita finally making some strides.

It's kind of depressing to see that the best Nintendo can apparently do is remakes, ports, and derivatives. No wonder they so rarely bother to make new games.

Sounds like typical Nintendo; offer little to nothing start of the year through autumn, empty your bank account at the end of the year with a tidal wave of titles.

Is it just me or does the girl holding the 3DS in the image at the top of this article have what looks suspiciously like a PS plus logo in her hair?

@ricklongo

Europe as a whole tends to be counted as one, despite the individual countries. That is the second largest, after North America. Japan is a distant 3rd, possibly 4th. But I think that region that encompasses Australia is 4th.

@Quorthon Well, see this chart for example: http://www.statista.com/statistics/308454/gaming-revenue-countries/

It takes Europe's five main markets (Germany, UK, France, Italy, and Spain) to even match Japan's numbers. So even if Europe as a whole surpasses Japan, it's not "distant" in any way.

overall 3ds is still outselling the vita.

Smash Wii U just got kicked!

And these numbers don t consider Bloodborne... best game of 2015 so far aiming for GOTY

Sony sold their game division to Daybreak Game. No more Sony.

Nintendo's last few games werent very big and with Club.Nintendo shuttered, they're going to lose lots of attention. Sony is pretty much striking while the iron is hot, so much software has been good and their Spring Fever program is awesome.

wwwwooooowwwww Sony!!! Awesome!

@letsplay Wasn't that just their online game division though?

Also what are people buying on the vita (not a dig because I'm looking for games but its pretty dry in NA).

Poor Nintendo. I guess that's what they get for announcing mobile games. Sony is doing good.

Pushsquare keeps running "PS3 is dead" articles yet PS3 sales have been in spitting distance of Wii U of late. So what does that say about Wii U?

Hopefully the XCX bundle will sell some Wii U end of April. I'm not sure how much an unknown IP like Splatoon will boost hardware sales.

Vita only got Minecraft now in Japan? Makes me not feel as bad about it not appearing on any Ntineod hardware.

@Yorumi I am getting toukiden but for the ps4 (so it is going to sit on a shelf until I buy the system but I'm trying to stock 10 ps4 games before I buy one).

PS games may be dominating the charts this week, but the numbers are relatively small compared to when 3DS games are dominating.

I'm sure from April Nintendo software will rise up again after this little slump.

@ricklongo

The infographics on that site won't even load for me for some reason. I wish Wikipedia would update their stuff, but even the incomplete numbers here seem to indicate that--at least for console sales--Europe is well ahead of Japan.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/History_of_video_game_consoles_%28seventh_generation%29#Sales_standings

Australia is way at the bottom, and I'm not even sure why Canada is listed separately since Canada and the US tend to share all that stuff.

It's possible that the gamer demographic referenced in your article is wider-ranging, including phones and PC, whereas this just looks at consoles. It also clumps together Japan with other Pacific-Asian countries, so getting an accurate read there is difficult.

In consoles, at any rate, Europe tends to sell a distant higher number over Japan--which makes sense. Japan is one country. Sure, one packed country with 126 million people, but Germany has 80 million by itself and the UK has 64 million which puts those two ahead of Japan in sheer available gaming population.

That is too damn many people.

competition is always good.

@CTs_Lieutenant

Why? What's coming out in April that would make Nintendo sales suddenly go up? Sony is getting Mortal Kombat X and the Dark Souls 2 update.

Crap, Tropico 5 also comes out in April. It's going to be a busy month.

I wonder who bought those 300+ xbox one? Americans in Japan?

Type-0 and Bloodborne are all I'm going to get for my PS4 this year. The rest of the year really doesn't look that good for Sony, let alone Microsoft. In addition to that, if Treyarch doesn't deliver on the next Call of Duty on the Wii U, I'm going to pass on the franchise indefinitely.

Zelda U vs Bloodborne... Hmmmm...

@Quorthon Dark Souls II was loudly bemoaned by most of the hardcore Souls playerbase for being too accessible, and most of those fans would rather be playing Bloodborne. As far as Mortal Kombat goes, it will pale in comparison to Xenoblade Chronicles X when it releases in Japan next month. And Tropico? Doubt it'll affect those who indulge in the console market exclusively.

@Quorthon That probably has to do with the Japanese market's preference for handheld hardware. In that same wikipedia page you linked, if you scroll down a bit, you'll see how the numbers for the DS and PSP in Japan dwarf other countries, even the United States.

Good for Sony

@6ch6ris6

Good luck playing Xenoblade Chronicles 3D on your regular 3ds.. Please stop with the pissing contest. Normally Nintendo rules the hardware chart but whenever they come second place Nintendo fans get wind up.. Just buy them games and enjoy them.

@Quorthon - Crap huh? It says "from April", you know April, May, June...etc.

But lets stick with April, the 3DS has Xenoblade, Bravely Second and Puzzles & Dragons amongst others. These three, however, have real chances or being major successes.

Sony has Mortal Kombat X and the Dark Souls 2!! That's nice for Sony, but what has that got to do with Nintendo sales...

Did anything important come out for the 3ds recently? Cause I find it slightly odd if there wasn't and the 3ds still manages to outsell the vita.

@kensredemption

I never said anything about Tropico 5 being a major seller, now did I? No, I just realized it's coming out as I have been looking forward to it.

And you seriously think Xenoblade will be a bigger seller than Mortal Kombat? Xenoblade is a wonderful game, but one thing it certainly did not have was sales, especially in Japan. With any luck, it'll get some attention due to it being portable, but to act like Xenoblade is somehow a bigger title than Mortal Kombat is just flat-out absurd.

Even Nintendo fans didn't support that game the first time around. In the meantime, Mortal Kombat has been one of the highest-selling fighting franchises for ages.

@CTs_Lieutenant

Xenoblade Chronicles was not even a major success the first time around. Now it's releasing to an audience that didn't care about it on the Wii, exclusively to a new platform very few (in gamer terms) people own. Nothing says "huge sales" like a game people ignored once on a platform very few own.

Puzzle and Dragons, maybe. Nintendo fans will buy anything with Mario n the cover.

The 3DS still has the fewest games of all dedicated game systems for 2015. It's sales will most likely continue to slide.

Frankly, I hope both Xenoblades do well this year, because I'm a huge fan. But realistically, Nintendo fans didn't care the first time around, and the audience is too small for either game to garner massive sales. In XCX's favor, however, is the notable fact that it will likely have no competition at all when it launches.

@ricklongo

Right, which is why the mobile side may be what is weighing the Asian markets so heavily. Different markets, different flavors. Console sales? Go to North America or Europe. Portable? Pacific Asia. WoW goldfarming? China.

@Quorthon agree, xcx is even more niche than any Souls game.... I think Persona is much more mainstream rpg.

Mortal kombat... Cmon even my granny knew about that game

@Quorthon I feel this generation will sell less hardware overall than the previous generation. The market share is now smaller without the many casual gamers in the last generation. Software numbers will most likely be higher though as most of the console gamers this time around will be dedicated gamers.

It really doesn't look good on the console makers if the market gets smaller as it simply means any sales this time around were mostly made from taking them from another competitor. At the end of the day this isn't sustainable so hopefully someone actually does something to expand the market again.

@arnoldlayne83

I really want Xenoblade to become a main Nintendo franchise. But given their treatment of it so far, the relatively poor sales (had that game released on the PS3, it would've been a million-seller, easy), and the lackluster way Nintendo treats so many non-Mario/Zelda/Pokemon (sometimes Kirby) games, I just don't see it taking off. XCX has got to have run up a price tag of over 50 million by itself, and that's aiming low.

I don't see it making back it's budget. I expect it to be treated like Bayonetta 2 upon release--lots of talk beforehand, and then a marketing budget of pennies and hardly a care from Nintendo when it hits stores. I would love nothing more for this franchise to be a solid #1 seller at launch.

I just don't think it'll happen.

@Ernest_The_Crab

Prior to the launch of the XBO and PS4, I'd have agreed with you. I was certain console gaming was shrinking. And the lackluster launches of the Wii U, 3DS, and Vita did not exactly fill me with hope.

But then the XBO and PS4 launched, and both consoles are selling better than all their previous incarnations. Think about that for a second. The Xbox 360 managed over 80 million in sales. The PS2 managed nearly 150 million (for a time, I thought the DS would overtake it, but it didn't).

And both the Xbox One and Playstation 4 are selling better than those machines. Even more amazing, according to an analysis I read over at Kotaku (I think), the X360 and PS3 didn't really take off until years 3, 4, and 5--those were the strongest years of those consoles. If the PS4 and XBO follow suit, things are only going to continue to improve.

I think console gaming has one more generation in it at least. And this one is looking pretty damn good. Well, except for the Wii U. At this point, I would not be surprised at all to see the XBO and PS4 hit 100 million each. Hell, the PS4 sole 20 million in around 14 months.

That's nuts. That's 1.4 million PS4's sold per month. If this keeps up for 8 years, the PS4 will almost match the PS2 and remember, it's biggest sales era is likely a year away.

If this generation does sell less, it'll be because there isn't a Wii padding the numbers with people who aren't going to stick around. But the XBO and PS4 will prove there is still ample life in console gaming.

I don't disagree with you that the market needs to be expanded. But I think the way to do that is to do away with Nintendo, MS, Sony making dedicated consoles. I think it's time for a unified format that MS, Nintendo, and Sony all support. I have it pictured, and how it would work is more detailed than this, but essentially, the industry will only grow when home gaming is sold and understood by consumers as easily as selling a Blu-Ray movie.

That's providing the sales numbers stay like that. This seems a little early to call it either way yet. Also, another problem that needs to be factored in is essentially the death of the Japanese console market. That market was still relevant back during the ps2 era. That will definitely hurt the numbers.

Here we go again..... Sony is better than Nintendo.........Nintendo only care about 3 franchises.........IT'S GROUNDHOG DAY

Surwly we have to hitting the point where everyone who wants a 3DS in Japan has one. It amazes me that it keeps topping the hard ware charts

While I'm sure pricing has something to do with it I'm a little shocked at the 3ds/3ds LL sales.

@Quorthon completely agree on what u said in ur last posts...

Nintendo has the luck/misfortune to have grown, year after year, its own user market. Users who cares mainly about mario, zelda and whatsoever games related to them (see the sales number of the 20th 2d platform like nsmbu or compare normal musou sales on platform with hyrule warriors). User base that like to complain about lack of novelty in gaming market and the refuse to buy gems like xenoblade, wonderful 101 and bayonetta... at the moment, only hardcore nintendo fans stand with the company (u can see it also from the tone of certain posts here). Everyone else is long gone, and i don t really see how they could win them back...

@Ootfan98 no, it is not Nintendo. It is the majority of its userbase. Check sales number for software, you ll see.

@Yorumi very nice analysis, congrats

Ya, Sony had a really good run lately with some great releases- they earned their spot this week. After all, FFXV is consistently Famitsu's most anticipated game voted by readers. And the demo just dropped with FF Type 0. And it's actually really good too.

But as for the Vita, well, that I never understood. Even for Japan, it's lineup is unappealing at best. Then again, 3DS is reaching market saturation and there's plenty who don't own the Vita so...

@arnoldlayne83 I was referring to posted comments

Nintendo really just needs a new Direct to show off upcoming spring/summer games. Ninty has been pretty quiet for awhile.

@RainbowGazelle Exactly what I was thinking. We don't have a solid release date for any upcoming Wii U game. That's kind of sad.

Im surprised that Battlefield Hardline beat the first week sales of Mario Party 10. Does this make the Japanese a bunch of 'dude-bro' gamers now?
As for the PS4's dominance, well deserved. Its really getting some great games lately (there are 4 games I currently want for it)

@Yorumi I'm not making that assumption as the data itself seems like it's skewed. All of the hijinxes during the launch e3 and the respective marketing blitzes from both Sony and Microsoft to steal market share from each other makes me suspect that this generation will be extremely front heavy, more so than previous generations. I believe there will be a very noticeable decrease in sales either this year or early next year.

@Shyguyanonymous

I don't know if it's that alarming. I was surprised at first too but several friends have told me there's actually a decent fanbase for Battlefield in Japan considering it's an FPS and when you look at DQ's overall sales they're not terrible, especially since as you mentioned it's just a spinoff. The next main DQ will probably be a big-time seller.

@Ichiban
Yeah, Japan's had a really nice stretch here for PS4. Even in the U.S. the last few weeks have been probably the best stretch the console has had with DmC Definitive, RE Revelations 2, FF Type-O, Borderlands, the killer exclusive that is Bloodborne and next week, Toukiden: Kiwami. I wish there was more in the way of new stuff but Revelations 2 and Bloodborne are great and should get me through to Mortal Kombat X and The Witcher 3.

It's okay, nintendo more than makes up for it with amiibo!

Pretty sad the PS3 is selling almost as well as the Wii U.

@Quorthon Puzzle & Dragons will be a big hit in Japan because it's Puzzle & Dragons, not because of Mario. Mario isn't as much of a big time seller in Japan, with the exception of Mario Kart. Zelda is even worse - Yokai Watch 2 outsold ALBW's worldwide sales, and yet that was before the franchise even turned 1 year old and only in Japan.

Also Nintendo can only put out remakes? There's only 5 remakes on Wii U and 3DS, unless you count DKCR3D and Xenoblade 3D as remakes. Even then, at least those remakes are actual remakes and not some lazy remaster where all they did is essentially put the game on higher settings like a user could on a PC version of a game.

Sony and Microsoft fans, including myself, are absolutely pissed at them and the third parties for all these bloody remasters that wouldn't exist if the systems had backwards compatibility. If the trend continues it WILL come back and bite them in the *** later down the road.

As for Xenoblade, I fully expect it to outsell Zelda in Japan. Zelda is niche there. Xenoblade can take off as a franchise considering the first one sold more than every Fire Emblem not called Awakening. So yeah, I wouldn't worry about the franchise being killed off.

On a side note, Tomodachi Life sold more worldwide than either OoT3D or ALBW.

Anyone here surprised at all??
Problem 1: no retail games to speak of. One 1st party Nintendo game every 3-5 months is not going to cut it!! Xone & Ps4 average 2-3 retail games a week! I find it hard to believe that a company Nintendo's size with $20 billion in the bank that this is the best they can do! Baffling to say the least!!
2: the wii u eshop while decent will soon be overwhelmed by the content coming to xbox live & PSN!! Which those stores average 4-6 games a week, plenty of dlc, 2 free games a month to choose from, huge sales weekly and plenty of movies as well!! The eshop? 2-3 games a week including our 1 weekly vc game!!
3: the virtual console could be such a great thing for wii u but Nintendo is screwing this up as well!! The drip feed of 1 game a week continues and japan has 100+ more vc games than we do and the US is the bigger market!! The classics should be flooding the eshop weekly but no dice!! Terrible!! I figured the wii u vc would blow the wii shop vc outta the water but nope! No Genesis no turbographx 16 no Neo Geo no master system no VIRTUAL CONSOLE ARCADE no NINTENDO 64!! All are absent from the wii u!! No GameCube either which we all thought would be added to the service!! Nothing! Nada! Zip! Zero!! Zilch!! It's just unbelievable to me!! I'd love to know just what the hell is the problem??
These are the main reasons folks that sony & Microsoft are handing Nintendo their own donkey!! Btw, you don't see them jumping into the mobile market do you?? NUFF said!!

@Ryu_Niiyama "(so it is going to sit on a shelf until I buy the system but I'm trying to stock 10 ps4 games before I buy one)." That's actually a pretty good idea. I seriously need to start doing that before I buy new systems...

One of my friends and I have been talking for a while now about how consoles in general are going downhill, while PC and mobile are climbing. This has been the weakest console generation sales wise since the 4th console generation. (As great as that generation was, it didn't break many records sales wise.) Neither of us see any reason for the PS4 or Xboned's existence, since they're just low end x86 PC's in a box, while actual PC can provide everything they can; and with a few exceptions like Bloodborne, we can't justify the investment. (It'll probably get a PC port like the other Souls games.) This is the first generation where console tech and price-performance ratio is dwarfed by that of PC right off the bat; traditionally it takes an entire console generation or two for either of those PC ratios to match a generation's console ratios. Sony's portable only took off in their home base, while Nintendo's portable struggles to keep up with their competitors and predecessors.

Don't get me wrong, there's some awesome stuff here and there, but my friend and I have mostly become PC and retro gamers. (I use my Wii U and 3DS every day, but more for photos, media and internet browsing than gaming.) The future of all consoles is looking bleak, and the public no longer has any idea how much software sells, because digital sales are proprietary corporate information that is bought and sold, instead of manditorily revealed for public auditing. Physical stores are starting to go the way of the dodo; many malls and Gamestops have shut down as of late.

Brace yourselves, folks, we're in for a rough ride. Either Nintendo turns things around with the NX, or consoles fade into obscurity after the 9th console generation.

@PlywoodStick Wouldn't be surprised if Bloodborne eventually made its way to PC. What's sad is that it's not like it's just the high end PCs that dwarf the PS4/XB1 - plenty of mid range PCs dwarf them as well. With all of the remasters, broken games, overhyped games, and increasingly abusive DLC practices (looking at you, Evolve), eventually people will get fed up. I've already seen people comment that they'd be shocked if there isn't an industry crash by the time 9th gen rolls around at the rate these companies are going.

To be perfectly honest, if this stuff keeps up I'll welcome a crash with open arms and a round of applause. The companies will have brought it upon themselves. Also wouldn't be surprised to see Sony and MS's inevitable push for 4K on their 9th gen systems blow up in their face because they tried to push 4K before the market is ready for it. Hard to tell if 4K will catch on to the widespread market as fast as HD did.

I start to hate Sega for not porting Yakuza games to the Wii U US console. It is generally believed that Wii U is not a platform for hardcore games such as Yakuza or Watch Dog.

Unfortunately, Yakuza, Watch Dog and Assassin Creed were both sold poorly on Wii U. That really mean no more games like those on Wii U.

@GreatPlayer There's Devil's Third coming up.

I wish the US would get the Dragon Quest game for PS4...that would give it more momentum over here. If the Wii U had the third party support with exclusives being made for it from them, I could see it doing a lot better in Japan and over here, to where it could compete. The Charts already show that Microsoft is not even in the run in Japan, so at least nintendo has a strong lead over there, but in the US, it's just a turn to where Microsoft is in nintendo's place. Once nintendo gets that next system up and running, has Zelda, Star Fox and Xenoblade out for the Wii U, I think the sales will pick up more...even over here, but I still don't see the Wii U being a strong seller. If they announce that their next system is comparable with the Wii U games, I think they may ruin the system as selling at all, and the games selling to people who would wait it out...just my opinion and thoughts though.

@Sanquine i dont want to play xenoblade. im not into jrpgs. if nintendo releases a metroid prime game for the new 3ds then i might consider buying one. even though i am sure we are not far away from the next gen handheld anyway. and that will surely be backwards compatible.
i dont get wind up. nintendo has sold more 3ds/2ds units than sony sold vita (tv) units.

Xbox one had 344

@joey302 Actually yes I do see them in the mobile market:

http://us.playstation.com/playstationmobile/
http://www.windowsphone.com/en-us

Funny you should mention that

@PlywoodStick

I'm not sure where you got your ideas, but both MS and Sony have noted that the Xbox One and Playstation 4 are selling better than all their previous game hardware. It's not going downhill. It appears to be stronger than ever.

Only Nintendo is going downhill. And when they finally go third party, whoever they side with will have untold extra power. I don't expect Nintendo so "spread the love" the way Sega did when they supported MS, Nintendo, and Sony generally equally.

@IceClimbers

Devil's Third will have crap sales. Even Bayonetta 2 didn't sell particularly well. Nintendo fans have shown that they prefer colorful Saturday-morning-cartoon games over anything else.

This is an audience that thinks Splatoon looks fresh and new and exciting when it's largely built on similar 3rd person shooter mechanics that Nintendo fans in general tend to hate.

I also think Splatoon looks great, because it looks fun. But I'm losing interest based on the lack of voice chat and the apparent lack of multiplayer on one console.

Devil's Third isn't going to sell well. It's another Bayonetta 2, Wonderful 101, Eternal Darkness, Geist, Xenoblade Chronicles, Sin & Punishment: Star Successor. A title Nintendo is funding and publishing that does not feature Mario, Link, or Pikachu (or Kirby), so it will not find sales. Everything Nintendo fans, by and large, seem to love to complain about on other platforms is embodied in Devil's Third. Nintendo barely even talks about the game.

I'll get it. And so will, maybe, 50 other Wii U owners. But it's not going to do well.

@IceClimbers

I didn't say Nintendo only puts out remakes (I'm responding in reverse order, sorry), but they do way more than anyone else. Yes, Sony spearheaded the unnecessary "HD remaster" concept, which was annoying, but at least they did that in full sets for budget prices, not redoing one game and selling it for, essentially, full price again. Nintendo released 3 Zelda remakes in 4 years--all for full price, and 2 of them were still available on existing Nintendo hardware.

Iwata even stated that "fans loved the Majora's Mask remake, so we'll make more remakes." They are actually expecting to support their hardware by reselling the same things over and over. And while MS and Sony release ports and HD upgrades, they never hinge the success of their platforms on them or use them as a primary selling point--Nintendo does. Nintendo used N64 games to sell the DS and 3DS. There has only been one special edition Wii U console--and it was for a GameCube game.

I get the criticism about the lack of backwards compatibility in the other machines--particularly the XBO. A good case can be made for PS4 because it has saner architecture than the PS3's overly complicated and oddly-limited Cell processor. Emulating something like the Cell probably isn't easy. At the same time, though, what's Nintendo's excuse? They're rereleasing and reselling the same Virtual Console games again on the Wii U (and sometimes the 3DS) as on the Wii, but without cross-buy. Hell, those Wii VC games are fully available and playable on the Wii U, but Nintendo chose to have their console backwards-compatible in the most asinine and cumbersome way possible--almost like it was on purpose so they could resell the exact same VC games again.

Nintendo clings to remakes, ports, re-releases, and derivatives more than anyone else. And most (note: not all) of their own titles in the top sellers are precisely those.

There is not a single original game from Nintendo on that list. Two remakes, three sequels to long-running, barely changing franchises. This gives the impression that the best Nintendo can do, is what they already did.

Okay, to be fair, those Mario vs Donkey Kong games do change up their formula more frequently than Mario Party or Smash. Still. Not one original title.

I am, however, glad Tomodachi Life did well. I didn't get it myself, but my girlfriend still fires it up now and then. That is, when she isn't playing her Xbox One--which is always on.

@Ernest_The_Crab

Oh, I don't expect Sony or MS to continue with these sales forever, but there's a good reason they could: They have shown that their consoles maintain relevance for a long time, and the strong user accounts will keep players hooked. They have successfully turned Xbox and Playstation into household names, highly recognizable brands that appeal to a wide range of people.

Nintendo is stuck right now. They have no brand. Consumers recognize Wii, but they recognize it as a throw-away fad that was fun at the time and had no longevity. Much like any other fad. The Wii branding is now irreparably damaged, and Nintendo is once again trying to work from zero, attempting to build a brand from scratch in a market where Xbox and Playstation aren't just fully established, they are now the norms.

As Nintendo fans, we need to face facts: Nintendo is not one of the big boys anymore. This isn't the 3rd or 4th Generation where is was Nintendo vs Sega. Gaming now is Microsoft vs Sony (and Valve is the Commodore64 or Apple 2, while mobile is an entirely new entity). Nintendo is a non-factor. And now, when they sit there trying to "reinvent" things that weren't broken (and there is plenty with modern gaming that is broken and could stand to be fixed), all they do is further marginalize themselves.

Consumers are brand-driven. Think about it. How many people do you know that refer to their phone as an "iPhone" instead of a "phone?" People frequently refer to their cars by name. I refer to mine as "Jeep," though it's more out of laziness in my case. "SUV" is cumbersome, and it's not a car or a truck. Nike, Adidas, Samsung, Verizon. Brand recognition.

Nintendo does not have that recognition. Consumers remember "the Nintendo" (the original NES), and the Wii--and the NES was in the 80's and the Wii was a fad. When MS and Sony started from scratch, they worked extremely hard and spent boatloads of money on marketing and getting software for the consoles. They were building a brand--and then they worked to sustain that brand.

Nintendo threw the Wii out there hoping to capitalize on kitchy names like "iPod" and "Droid" and that partially worked. But they did nothing to build or maintain that brand. So now that brand is damaged, Nintendo is marginalized, and they are back to square one with whatever the hell NX is.

This is the other reason I think the PS4 and XBO will be bigger sellers (now) than the X360 and PS3. Those brands are now iconic, recognizable, and trusted (yes, even after the 40% RRoD failure rate of early-gen X360s). Nintendo is for kids. Nintendo is retro. Playstation and Xbox are for gaming and entertainment.

This is a general perception Nintendo is facing, and they seem to either be unaware of it, unaware of how to fix it, or they just don't care.

@Quorthon Wasn't really saying Devil's Third would sell well, was just pointing it out as a recommendation. Bayonetta 2 supposedly sold faster than DKC Tropical Freeze did.

Ok, I definitely didn't include the VC. Granted, most people don't pay attention to it, and it won't make Nintendo look bad to anyone that isn't an owner.

To be fair, the other companies are relying on long running franchises as well - Halo 5 and Uncharted 4 are the biggest games for the other two systems respectively. Then there's Street Fighter V, Persona 5, Forza 6, LBP3, etc. Pretty much every company relies on established franchises.

@GreatPlayer To sega's credit they did port the first two yakuza games to the JPN Wiiu. It didn't sell. So they abandoned any further ports.

@Superstick Saves me from having buyer's remorse (I had that really badly with the vita for a while). I have a PC that keeps me in the multiplats so at this point the one and ps4 are exclusive only machines. So rather than buying two paperweights I stock games first to justify the purchase. Often when I do this I end up getting the system cheaper than launch price anyway.

@Peach64 You might want to look at Japanese sales, before you make wild assumptions. Japan is still one of the largest markets for video games, and often matches or bests Europe's entire sales for a particular game. Also, the Souls games sell more in Japan than Europe alone.

@IceClimbers

Yeah, there's a lot of sequelitis these days.

I don't have a problem, per se, on relying on established franchises--they're easy money makers. But here we had to wait until year 3 for Nintendo to pull out a new IP for the Wii U (Splatoon), and while not every new IP or experiment works, at least Sony and Microsoft launched with new stuff, and are banking as much on new games and experiences. Knack and The Order fell a little short (haven't played Knack, the Order is decent, but just not differentiating itself in any meaningful way), and Bloodborne--in less than a year and a half. Even if the new games didn't perform well, at least there was an effort to actually make them. My girlfriend was obsessed with Sunset Overdrive.

We're at a point where it looks like the Wii U will be the "least new and original" game console in Nintendo's history. The only new franchise made for it appears to be Splatoon. And in that, I don't think Devil's Third counts, unless Nintendo took up ownership of the IP--but it appears that Valhalla Studios owns the trademark.

So, one new franchise.

"We're going to change the way you play. Well not really. And we're not changing the games either. Here's more Mario and Zelda. But with a wacky controller! See? Different, sort of!"

Furrow brow, facepalm.

But I don't think this is entirely Nintendo's fault. Their core fans have a tendency, with rare exception (like Tomodachi Life), of only supporting a few key franchises and little else. That doesn't leave Nintendo with a lot of options. At the same time, as I noted before, Mario, Zelda, and Pokemon do not create new Nintendo fans. That can only be done by being competitive and delivering new and unique titles like Splatoon and rare titles like XCX.

@Quorthon The thing is Apple's brand would not be a good comparison in terms of brand strength.

Apple's brand is so strong at the moment, it eclipses both the second and third place brand values (Microsoft and Google). To give you an idea of how strong that is, Sony and Nintendo both don't show up the top 100 highest valued brands. With Apple I wouldn't even bother using "fans" as the descriptor anymore, it would be closer to "fanatic." Frankly, their brand is so strong that I'm slightly afraid that if they entered the home console market NOW it'd probably spell the end of at least 2 of the big 3 (at least in that market).

That means out of the 3 existing competitors in the market only one of them has a brand that is remotely close to Apple's. I seriously doubt it's going to play as big of a factor as you make it out to be (it's still big just not enough I think to surpass the PS2's or the Wii's sales).

We also have to factor in that the current generation's consoles are capped at a certain sales growth pattern due to the fact that none of them would be considered a "radical" innovation in the gaming market. They are all incremental.

The PS2 had a number of different factors to compensate for it (more than the current generation). It had brand coming off of the PS1, it had the trust of the 3rd party developers (Nintendo screwed up horribly before), it wasn't space restricted (at the time) due to its format, and quite frankly it didn't have any real competitors in that generation when it first came out (and really no real competition after as well due to it being Microsoft's first foray into the market). This includes the Sony marketing campaign that ultimately ended Sega's run in the console market. Also, the Japanese market at the time wasn't dead console market-wise.

It makes me wonder what the Wii's sales would have been if they actually had better marketing, as it would have been classified as a radical innovation at the time of its release.

Anyways, there seems to be too many factors involved that would skew the end results. I'm not going to make that assumption with such shaky ground to stand on.

EDIT: Some grammatical errors were bugging me

@Ernest_The_Crab

For now, the PS4 is outselling the PS2 during this same point. That's still notable--particularly when you point out the fact that the PS2 had no real competition.

And the last generation was also, in many ways, an incremental update--refine controllers (well, not Sony--I've always disliked the pre-PS4 Dualshocks), update hardware, improve performances, etc.

The thing is, that's what consumers really wanted. A recognizable, incremental, familiar update. I have long hypothesized that the proper time to do experiments in gaming is every other generation--that's when the major leaps should occur, with the following generation being the incremental improvement, the perfection of what came last gen.

3rd gen, big innovations (modern controller basics, multiple genres and franchises created).
4th gen, improvements.
5th gen, big innovations (first disks and 3D)
6th gen, improvements.
7th gen, big innovations--most of which were in online, indie, user profiles, Achievements, etc. Some big experiments with Wii Remote, Kinect. Still, it was mostly incremental, but it was when innovations were likely to be more accepted.
8th gen, improvements.

A part of me thinks one of the factors behind the failure of the Wii U is that it was simply the wrong generation to be experimenting. On the other hand, consumers are perfectly fine with gradual improvements as we see with PCs, modern phones, and the like.

Again, the only part of gaming hardware that is guaranteed to do worse this generation is portable machines, which have been replaced by phones and tablets, by and large.

On the console front, there is ample reason to suspect that it may sell about the same or more. If it's less, it'll be because there isn't a fad console like the Wii "artificially" inflating numbers. But I fully expect both PS4 and XBO to outsell PS3 and X360. In that regard, the industry and console gaming will still have plenty of life left in them. PS4, especially, will outsell the PS3. It's already 1/4 of the way to matching those sales--in less than 18 months. The PS4 should be able to match or outsell the PS3 in 5 or 6 years.

I still don't think Apple could do a "proper" game console. And I don't think they want to, and I think they know they can't. Apple isn't known as a place to play "serious" games (if you will), it's known as a place to play simple mobile games, and I don't think that's enough to help them deliver a truly competitive console. I'd expect them to do better than Nintendo (and would probably eat away their remaining public attention), but really only the pre-converted to the Cult of Apple would look at the device as a serious game machine. Rather like how only the pre-converted are really standing by the Cult of Nintendo these days.

I view the fans of both companies to behave in eerily similar, pseudo-cultish manners.

Finally, the Wii had great marketing. It was brilliant, it struck a chord, and it appealed to people. What it didn't have was the hardware power or options to bring the attention of major developers or gamers. Had the Wii been as powerful as the X360, and had all the same multiplatform games and online features, I think Nintendo would be standing on the strongest brand in gaming. Instead, they screwed up so much, it's the worst brand in gaming.

@Quorthon Whenever I go into various Gamestops, there's more PS3 and 360 titles on the shelves than PS4 and XB1 titles, and there's more overlapping ports than ever. (In every previous generation, stores would have made way for the new consoles after 2 years on the market.) PS4/XB1 don't have the specialized boards of their predecessors to make them stand out from PC (which used to ultimately redirect sales away from PC).

They've only sold as well as they have because people continue to tolerate their increasingly restrictive and disrespectful practices, while being greatly influenced by PR campaigns and convenient voice chatting. Sooner or later, people are going to stop tolerating those practices, and move over to PC, since the price performance ratio between those consoles and PC has already been matched, and games are either no different or even enhanced versions of what consoles have available.

Digital sales are proprietary information, so we really have no idea how well current console software is selling overall. Since almost all PC software is digital, this can give the impression that PC software doesn't sell as well as that of consoles. (The sales shown here are only physical sales.) In reality, there are exponentially more people with PCs than consoles, and various services available, giving far more opportunities for different types of people to buy a wider variety of games at more affordable prices than consoles.

Raw sales numbers also belie the fact that many current gen console titles, especially AAA titles, are not as profitable today as in the past. It's not uncommon for studios to lose money on high value productions these days, even with relatively high raw sales numbers. There are also less people willing to spend $50+ on individual titles up front than in the past. (Although microtransactions are highly profitable, PC boasts far more varied and intelligent use of microtransactions than console titles tend to have.)

Only the Wii U really stands out as offering something markedly different from PC in this generation of home consoles. Unfortunately, both Nintendo and the physical storefronts have made huge blunders in marketing presence. Hopefully, DeNA will serve to pick up the slack where Nintendo and the physical storefronts have faltered. (Don't forget all the physical storefronts being shuttered due to increased digital presence and ruthless restructuring practices!)

@Quorthon While it's probably true that the Wii would have been like the second coming of the PS2 if it's specs were comparable to the 360's, we have to remember that every console costing more than $350 up until the 7th generation met with abject failure. The Wii would have had to be sold for $450 minimum, instead of $250. Nintendo didn't take the risk, and it was an honest mistake at the time to have misjudged the public's substantially increased willingness to pay outrageously higher prices on consoles compared to past generations. (Especially for the 360 degrees of Red... Good God, people were fooled out of millions on early 360 models...)

@PlywoodStick

The Wii wouldn't have had to be sold for that much. Based on what? The cheap motion and pointer controls? Sony added similar tech into the Dualshock 3 for almost no extra cost.

The Wii reportedly only cost $160 to produce, and part of that was wasted cost was on ensuring they could plug GC controllers and memory cards into it. http://www.xbitlabs.com/news/multimedia/display/20061215092033.html

It would not have raised the cost. It would have been comparable to the X360. Possibly a middle-ground between the X360 and PS3. Nintendo simply didn't want to take the effort. It was a deliberate decision to run from the competition.

@PlywoodStick

I don't disagree that everything has become kind of samey, and the financial issues that face many developments (making unique titles higher risks than ever). But, consumers clearly love the Xbox and Playstation brands, and even many computer-savvy people (I'm, like, halfway one of those people) may simply not be inclined to play on PC. I have a Steam account, but I just flat out don't like playing on my laptop.

I like the smooth way modern consoles work, I grew up with consoles, and I'm adapted to console gaming.

Though it sounds like you're making a "I don't see why anyone plays consoles, because PC master race" argument. If that's your thing, then by all means, go for it. For a lot of consumers, if they want Call of Duty, they want it on a console.

The rising development costs is something I've found worrying for a long time, and I think the solution is to move toward a unified platform future, where games are sold like DVDs--every platform can play every game, every game is just scaleable, and, say, the ESA sets a new minimum standard every 5 years. There's a lot more detail to this I don't want to get into here, but I think the dedicated machines need to go away.

And I think Nintendo will be the next to exit making consoles. Frankly, given how badly they make consoles these days (the last one that was even close to belonging in it's generation was the GameCube), I'd rather they go 3rd party and shake up the industry that way rather than thinking these stupid "play different" ideas are the way to go.

If you want to take a billion-dollar idea, and gimp it so it can only be a million-dollar idea, there's no better teacher than Nintendo.

@Ryu_Niiyama

You are correct. Just the online subscription games.

@Quorthon you may feel that it would be better if Nintendo goes third party, you may even feel that it's inevitable. However I will respectfully disagree as I neither think it's inevitable or a step in the right direction. With all the cash that they have in the bank and the absence of debt their hand won't be suddenly forced like Sega's was and Sega hasn't been the same since they went third party. At first they released dreamcast-like games on sixth gen consoles but by the end of the seventh gen most of the games they were publishing were games that they got other studios to develop. And for every Bayonetta or Madworld there was a Sonic Boom or an Alien: Colonial Marines to muddy the water. You might like the idea of Nintendo games on playstation or xbox but I certainly don't if there's a risk of standards dropping the way Sega's did. The way I see it Nintendo's console games are meant to be played Nintendo's consoles or not at all.

@Quorthon you may feel that it would be better if Nintendo goes third party, you may even feel that it's inevitable. However I will respectfully disagree as I neither think it's inevitable or a step in the right direction. With all the cash that they have in the bank and the absence of debt their hand won't be suddenly forced like Sega's was and Sega hasn't been the same since they went third party. At first they released dreamcast-like games on sixth gen consoles but by the end of the seventh gen most of the games they were publishing were games that they got other studios to develop. And for every Bayonetta or Madworld there was a Sonic Boom or an Alien: Colonial Marines to muddy the water. You might like the idea of Nintendo games on playstation or xbox but I certainly don't if there's a risk of standards dropping the way Sega's did.