Video: Is ARMS a 'Hardcore' Fighting Game?

If you expect something hardcore from Nintendo, you should probably get out. They aren't hardcore and never will be.

@ieatdragonz
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lhckuhUxcgA

No /thread

This topic has can of worms written all over it...

It looks like it has the depth required to make it "hardcore".

It all depends. Was Wii boxing hardcore

Due to the variance of arms and arm weights it has the chance and depth of being hardcore, but it will never be viewed as such.

I don't think it's hardcore.

@SLIGEACH_EIRE how did you get on in the Testpunch?

You know what, if you need the infamously cheap A.I. from Mortal Kombat to be hardcore, then being hardcore is not something I can possibly care about.

The problem is the definition of hardcore vs. (I'm assuming what we mean here) casual and what a specific gamer defines themselves and their style as.

For example, a game like Smash Bros might be played and seen as casual to someone who chooses to play it that way. Whereas, it might be considered hardcore to another who takes it super competitively and plays it that way.

@Switch81tch I don't think that's a bad choice. Games are getting easier and easier nowadays. A challenging game for the really hardcore gamers isn't a bad thing just because casuals have a really hard time with said game. If someone finds a game too hard, they just shouldn't buy it and should buy something easier.

As for ARMS, I think it's definitely one of the more accessible fighters out there, but there's enough depth there for people who do want to play it hardcore.

Well, in my experience motion controls tend to add an extra layer of difficulty, but I don't think that's really what you meant...

@AlexSora89 I think hardcore is a pathetic term myself, surely the best way to put it would be does it have the depth to be competitive? Virtua Fighter looked pretty empty on face value and that turned out to be a very deep game.

"Hardcore" is such a nebulous and person-specific term that this topic was only ever going to cause petty arguments anyway. CARRY ON!

@ieatdragonz said the idiot who think call of duty is hardcore.

Alex, I'm impressed with how long those matches were. Does the full game not have a default timer on matches unlike the testpunch matches?

@Switch81tch Dark Souls is based entirely on its difficulty. The games would get kind of bland if there were an easy mode and you could just slash your way through everything. The game is fun because there is so much strategy and skill involved. I don't think a lot of people would enjoy it nearly as much if it were easy. The Souls games aren't really plot driven or anything, after all.

In a nutshell, if Dark Souls were easy, the game would be boiled down to "run through the levels, press attack when near bad guys". Not really worth playing IMO.

Call of duty is the most hardcore game!

@Switch81tch American, I don't know enough without extensive googling to have an opinion

Hardcore is just another term for a insecure idiot. Is childish. They love to feel compounded with stuff like this.

@Alexprime that's rude... I applaud Nintendo for not being hardcore! It makes their games accessible to everyone.

@Switch81tch I suppose it wouldn't hurt.

Hardcore or not. My kids will enjoy this game for a few days

Is ARMS Hardcore or Not ?
Depend on player's skill.
Like DDR, the game is for Everyone from Beginner level until Challenge level.
The newbies can enjoy the games as the Expert does too.

@Alexprime
Excuse me ?!
Watch your words !

@Switch81tch yea games were harder but times were different.
I find games are getting shorter and easier

Were games really that much harder back when we were younger? Or was game design/limited technology a contributor to certain aspects of a game being more challenging than by actual design?

What a fun alternate way of saying "Am I better than you?" What is "hardcore" other than "difficult, challenging, or perhaps intricate/complicated"? And in a competitive game "balanced for competitive play-ability for people who obsessively study the game."

It probably is, though I tend to cringe when a game becomes competitive/hardcore.....I think the obsessiveness involved with becoming competitively great at a game involves the same kind of dedication and focus as learning to create music, or art, or feats of engineering, yet doesn't actually result in you having created something. And a competitive game kind of compels you to put that time in to hold position in an ever improving player base and kind of requires intentionally pulling yourself out of that feedback loop or risk running too deep into it.

@UmbreonsPapa Spot on. And games were simply less fair at the time, having been designed mostly by arcade designers who were used to cheap tricks to add difficult to make the machine generate more money, and the fact that games were small due to the tech so they had to cheaply restrict progress as there few places to progress to so it would artificially extend the game. You weren't meant to see the end in most games back then, at least not for a long, long while.

Based off of what I played, it highly depends, if you're experienced and you're fighting other experienced players it could potentially be hardcore to a small degree, but if you're just playing the game for fun, I would say it's more of a casual game that anyone could come and join

@UmbreonsPapa Spot on.

Since then there's been a lot of work into making games more and more accessible. Granted that we have good and bad cases of that all over the industry, but at the end of the day, I'm really happy with Nintendo's approach to most games: usually easy to learn, but there's a lot of depth in there if you're interested in getting really good at it.

@crackafreeze yea lol. I should of added that to my finishing sentence

I'd rather know if it can be played as a proper, serious, fair, and skill-based fighting game, or if it's just going to end up a lot of random waggle a load of the time. I mean, no matter how much you want to imagine it is so, Wii Boxing can't be considered a proper, serious, fair, and skill-based fighting game. Street Fighter (pick a number), however, can be thought of as a proper, serious, fair, and skill-based fighting game. So, I just want to know where ARMS lands. It looks like it's maybe half way between the two, which means casuals are going to be fine but maybe proper competitive players might not take it seriously enough to count up their with the other tournament fighting greats. Although, I don't give a flying crap about it being a game only pros can really play, but I really don't want a game with any obvious "waggle" issues either. I just want a fun fighter that makes me feel like I'm actually using skill and talent when I beat or lose to someone else, as opposed to some button-bashing and randomness-based luck on either player's part.

I'm hard pressed to ever spend money on fighters besides Smash. They usually lack content that I'd traditionally want to spend money on. Only reason Smash gets a pass is because of the roster.

Arms looks boring.

Alex looks like a child playing this. So yes, it's gonna move copies in the millions this game. Whohoo. ^^

What I love about Nintendo is they are the masters of creating accessible games where you can go as deep as you want: Smash Bros, Mario Kart etc.

I think it will sell amazingly, top the charts for at least a week. Pro Tournaments will pop up, as soon as some balances can be made.
The casual tournament scene will be massive, birthday parties, library clubs, all of that. Casual players will be much more prominent than in Splatoon, but Splatoon 2 will definitely give more to the competitive players. Matchmaking may end up hard for casual players if Nintendo doesn't have a good matchmaking system. As for myself, I think I'll be a casual/competitive mix.

@AlternateButtons thank you.

The game is crazy fun. Easy to learn, yet could spend a lifetime trying to master.

That's the best kind of game there is.

The term "hardcore" has very little objective meaning anymore.

@WiltonRoots
Same goes for Smash. I feel the urge to punch in the face whoever has the gall to call it "casual".

I think All games can be played on Hardcore level. Even some Kiddy games like Animal Crossing New Leaf can be so Damn Wonderful gaming experience. In Casual player's hand, they build Mediocre city but in Hardcore player's hand, they can build So Complex city with very Gorgeous design. It depends who is playing the games. The Casuals or the Profesional one ?

'Hardcore' in gaming terms, I believe, also involves a time element in addition to a player's attitude towards a game. Semantics aside, those folks who are looking to get more out of ARMS in a skill-bsed fashion will play the Ranked mode, I mean that's what it's for. Those people that take the time and effort to learn and appreciate the ins and outs of a game will usually come out as an expert player (though, that's true about a lot of games). Splatoon was the same way with it's ranked mode, you will not be able to hold higher ranks or even be able to contribute if you don't take your game to a higher level.

Party Mode in ARMS, the format for the Global Testpunch, I find more than twice as enjoyable as Turf War in Splatoon because it's WAY less likely your teammate can screw you over. Though things can go south if you accidentally hit each other in tethered matches.

@impurekind Yes, in-between would best describe it. It all depends on if you play Party Mode or Ranked. As for competitive players taking the game serious enough, that we'll have to see as time goes on. Don't forget, ARMS was on the ballot for the Player's Choice Tournament of EVO, with little more than the reveal trailer available at the time of voting (which I think is crazy) so there were already people in the fighting game community willing to take it seriously. And for "wagglers", they can be beaten with skill, tactics, and keeping distance away from them. Usually, jumping or dodging and counter-attacking is enough to win. Unlike Wii Boxing, you can't punch fast in ARMS, and that's what makes this game unique. Think of your Arms as guided missiles, and in this game that's sometimes literally. You have to consider your Arms' travel time, what special abilities your opponent has, and anticipate what your opponent's intentions are in order to out-think and exploit their weaknesses, kind of like real boxing but slower. When using a heavy character like Mechanica (who can take a hit or two before getting stunned), I like sending out my heavy arm, the Whammer, to see what my opponent does, then a split-second later send out my medium arm, the Revolver, to deal with the outcome (just not too soon after, otherwise I'll have no defense against a throw for a moment). The idea is that the heavy Arm, or charged Arm, can only be deflected normally by another heavy or charged Arm, or with multiple hitting Arms like a Revolver. So, the opponent is either going to dodge, if they have a heavy Arm they can counter, or they can block, but if they're close enough that may leave them open to be thrown while in block stun (just like Street Fighter). If you're playing against a Min Min or Twintelle, you'll have to be more alert. Min Min deflects punches while she dodges, and Twintelle slows down punches in mid-flight while she dodges. Worse, a Ninjara disappears while dodging. It's best to hold your punches and time them to hit when Ninjara reappears, which can also be done to Min Min and Twintelle as they come out of a dash.

I'll take a game seriously if I enjoy its mechanics enough to write about every little detail like this.^^ I'll throw out this link again for one of my sessions last weekend if anyone want's to check out ARMS gameplay from someone trying to push his ARMS game higher.

Doesn't surprise me at all. Wii Sports Boxing became insanely difficult (against the CPU) starting at around lvl 1500 (lvl 2000 was the maximum). I really digged that game and tried to get to the top, but I think I gave up at ~ lvl 1800 or 1900.
I think those people who called it a casual game never really played it for more than a few matches.

@Switch81tch lol are you paid by Nintendo to say this?

Seems like they've been trying to heat up for a competitive market over this past console cycle. Mariokart 8 introduced the music box to deter blue shells, Splatoon broke off into a ranked mode where strategy played a greater role and Sm4sh eliminated tripping and did what it could to restrict the random chance. I expect Arms to be following in that tradition.