423 Blocked

You have been blocked for security reasons. This server understood your request, but will not service any requests from your IP address.

Forums

Topic: Nintendo Music App

Posts 2,961 to 2,980 of 2,983

Polley001

Robot99 wrote:

GCN got nothing in the first half of the BCP, and there's heavy indication that Mushroom Bridge was planned but scrapped for it. (Granted, Moonview Highway is the better track anyway, lol.)

The whole "Mushroom Bridge was planned" thing people like to claim is a surface level and just kind of inherently flawed observation. The circumstances surrounding the scrapped GCN course actually make it quite obvious that it was Mushroom City that was initially planned.

To make a long story somewhat short, what appears to have happened is that Mushroom City was going to be paired with Athens Dash due to it being the least city-like Tour city course. As they were reworking the lineup in early 2022, they ended up moving Athens into the Feather Cup alongside Daisy Cruiser, which should make the reason it was replaced rather evident I should think. People mostly dismiss this due to Mushroom City not being in Tour but timeline-wise there really isn't any issue with the idea that the Tour developers simply stopped making it in favor of Moonview Highway (occasionally I also get resistance to the idea that the Tour developers would do this at the BCP's whim which is just a hilarious misreading of Tour's final two active years).

So basically, it's arguably an even worse situation lol (though I personally don't mind it much given that the Moonview Highway arrangements are both really really good).

@squiddu-real Really cool spreadsheet. I was going to point out that Fire Emblem Awakening and Yoshi weren't marked but you literally edited them as I was writing this so good work lol. You aren't forgiven for the date format though since it did trip me up for a good bit smh. (Edit: Probably evident but I hadn't noticed that AJWolfTill pointed those issues out already).

[Edited by Polley001]

Check out my Nintendo Music resources:
Information Database
Playlist Database

Bluesky: polley001.bsky.social

squiddu-real

@AJWolfTill thanks for pointing those out, they should be fixed! i recall looking up awakening yesterday, so somehow i saw it was on there and yet still put no. some weird short-circuit in my brain i guess.

remember; your chicken parm is not safe around me!

nso classics spreadsheet (click here!)

(she/her)

Switch Friend Code: SW-7976-4656-5576

Robot99

@Polley001
I'm not understanding why you're saying this was necessarily supposed to be City and not Bridge? Mushroom Bridge randomly showing up in Wave 5 or 6 would've been totally consistent with some of the nonsense course order decisions they had going on in BCP Wave 1, lol. I do agree that it easily could have been City that got canned though, which would be an infinitely more tragic omission!

[Edited by Robot99]

Super Mario Maker 2 ID: 0DV-9NP-WXG
Nintendo Music "Elite Beats" playlist
"Did someone just page the king of awesome?" ~Bowser

Polley001

@Robot99 Such as? I actually find the BCP extremely well-structured so I don't really see how you'd come to that conclusion. Even some of the odder placement choices have easy enough explanations (it'd be a bit lengthy to explain the evidence for this but Sunset Wilds being in Wave 5 for example was evidently them buying time to try to implement the sunset mechanic). The prefix leak itself has some oddities but those really just amount to placements within cups, the overall selection and thought process was quite sensible and Wave 6 in particular seemed very fleshed out (though I realize that might also require a good bit of explaining to get across).

Check out my Nintendo Music resources:
Information Database
Playlist Database

Bluesky: polley001.bsky.social

Robot99

@Polley001
We might just have to agree to disagree on this point lol, but I'm mostly looking at difficulty curve when I'm talking about the order being weird in BCP Wave 1. Toad Circuit as anything but course #1, Paris in the cup before Tokyo (a much easier and simpler track), dramatic difficulty spike from Sky Garden to Ninja Hideaway, probably a couple of other oddities I'm forgetting. I understand why the order was done this way (cities always first, Japanese courses for Lucky Cat Cup, Paris is a better first impression than Tokyo, I suspect that Toad Circuit was made for the BCP purely as a test track, etc.), but later Waves were mostly careful to avoid issues like this, so it kinda stands out to me.

[Edited by Robot99]

Super Mario Maker 2 ID: 0DV-9NP-WXG
Nintendo Music "Elite Beats" playlist
"Did someone just page the king of awesome?" ~Bowser

Grumblevolcano

@Robot99 I think they picked Toad Circuit because the first and last tracks were generally the most commonly picked tracks online back in the days of being able to pick whatever track however often you wanted. Plenty of times I experienced in MKWii online that Luigi Circuit would be played like 5 times in a row in the same lobby because people kept picking it for example.

[Edited by Grumblevolcano]

Grumblevolcano

Polley001

[Edited by Polley001]

Check out my Nintendo Music resources:
Information Database
Playlist Database

Bluesky: polley001.bsky.social

N00BiSH

squiddu-real wrote:

here's that spreadsheet none of y'all ordered! it covers the first 20 pages of this thread, though i could do more since they thin out a lot after page 5 or so.
everything should be (somewhat) in order but let me know if there's anything accidentally duplicated or incorrect.

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1lWSpv6REr88S6doE-Vtfb...

Skimming through this and I can't help but notice the glaring omission of Donkey Kong Jungle Beat. I'm a little insulted, I bring that game up like every other week and yet it ain't cool enough to be in your little fancy-pants spreadsheet? SMH my head/j

"Now I have an obligation to tag along and clear the area if Luigi so much as glances at a stiletto."

Robot99

@Polley001
TIL that this site has an "expand post" function 🙃

Yeah, I already know/agree with much of what you said. The only point that I didn't really consider is Ninja Hideaway being seasonal - it was still somewhat cold and snowy here in the US when Wave 1 released, so I forget that it was technically a Spring release lol. I do understand the difficulty of only having two Tour originals to choose from at that point, with one of them being very obviously fit for a holiday release despite creating difficulty curve issues. (Although I'd also argue that they could have also chosen Sky-High Sundae for Wave 1, as that clearly wasn't ready for release when they actually released it anyway lmao. Really obvious in hindsight that it was made for World first, it doesn't make sense with the mechanics of either game it debuted in.)

The thing about Wave 1 being rushed though is that it wraps back around to my point about Mushroom Bridge - the prefix leak would've also been a rudimentary rush job, they could've easily just put Mushroom Bridge in there as a placeholder because that's what they were working on at the time. Moonview Highway likely didn't start development until after that data was created, they probably weren't sure if it was going to be ready on time.

I get what you're saying about the overall BCP difficulty curve, and I largely agree, but I'm not so sure about Wave 4 being a "reset" from Wave 3. I'd say that it's overall actually a bit harder, outside of the cities. Nothing too strange about that though, the general idea still fits. (Wave 5 would be the bigger problem spot in this regard, but that I suspect was the result of certain other development choices that you probably already agree with me about.)

I get that they probably wanted circuits to appear in certain spots throughout the BCP, but the only circuit that actually felt necessary imo was DS Mario Circuit. Maybe also Daisy Circuit. The other circuits felt like they were trying to meet some kind of unnecessary quota - Toad Circuit could have easily been Daisy Hills (a much better track) if they didn't insist on having a starter circuit somewhere, and I get inserting a basic SNES track for the 30th anniversary (and because it was a simple port job for the early waves), but it feels really awkward in hindsight with both a much better Mario Circuit and a much more exciting SNES remake in Waves 4 & 6 respectively. As well as the course showing up yet again in World!

Apologies for derailing the thread y'all, I'm just pretty passionate on the subject of game design & development lol

Super Mario Maker 2 ID: 0DV-9NP-WXG
Nintendo Music "Elite Beats" playlist
"Did someone just page the king of awesome?" ~Bowser

Grumblevolcano

@Polley001 I think the reasoning of the wave 1 timing is that Nintendo wants to always keep Mario Kart or Smash in focus as those are the 2 biggest multiplayer focused Nintendo franchises. MK8 Deluxe happened and was given some space, then the first general Direct of 2018 announced Smash and the Smash cycle continued for the next 3.5 years (ending with Sora in October 2021).

The next general Direct (February 2022) announced the BCP with the cycle continuing for nearly 2 years (wave 6 released in November 2023) which would've been followed with announcing the Switch 2 and MK World in early 2024. MK World runs its course and then Smash 6 gets announced, the cycle repeats.

Switch 2 and MK World reveal got delayed about a year but I think the general strategy will remain the same. I'd imagine Smash 6 would be announced around 2029 considering Kirby Air Riders was released in 2025.

Grumblevolcano

squiddu-real

i think super large posts tend to scare me away, as much as i do also like to discuss game design and find it interesting there was any sense to what tracks were picked. i usually don't have the mental strength to read several paragraphs on a forum board lol

@N00BiSH for one, i had a (sorta arbitrary) thought process about what i actually included, mainly trying to keep track of what was actually a wish and what was just a prediction (both of which were mixed together way more often back then), and i think when viewing your first mention of dk jungle beat (it's post #373 on page 19!), i deemed it not close enough to a real wish because you said we were "due for a dk addition", and also because its sorta kinda a joke.

...however, it's been going on for so long that i feel inclined to add it now. i also forgot that the ost is actually pretty good, so... enjoy! <3

remember; your chicken parm is not safe around me!

nso classics spreadsheet (click here!)

(she/her)

Switch Friend Code: SW-7976-4656-5576

N00BiSH

@squiddu-real And thus, order was restored to the world.

"Now I have an obligation to tag along and clear the area if Luigi so much as glances at a stiletto."

Polley001

Check out my Nintendo Music resources:
Information Database
Playlist Database

Bluesky: polley001.bsky.social

squiddu-real

i think people just prefer that there be an extra reason as to why the mk8 port of sky-high was so jank and off-feeling compared to the world version, when the real answer is probably closer to "nah it was just a jank port of a tour course"

anyways, @Robot99 i don't recall that post so can't wait for the funniest thing ever

i wonder how many posts in this thread are from me alone...

remember; your chicken parm is not safe around me!

nso classics spreadsheet (click here!)

(she/her)

Switch Friend Code: SW-7976-4656-5576

Polley001

@squiddu-real Sky-High Sundae in 8 Deluxe is kind of funny. I think pretty much everyone can tell the anti-grav is sort of shoehorned in but I think most people fail to realize SHS doesn't really work in 8 Deluxe without it. The rails being tangible would be terrible and without the floaty physics you'd have no control over your movement in the air so the alternate paths would be practically unreachable.

Check out my Nintendo Music resources:
Information Database
Playlist Database

Bluesky: polley001.bsky.social

squiddu-real

@Polley001 i recall watching silokhawk's videos on the booster course pass, and i wonder how many times he deems the antigrav "useless" actually have a purpose.
not that i blame him, when the gimmick used to be entirely marketed for the sake of driving on walls.

remember; your chicken parm is not safe around me!

nso classics spreadsheet (click here!)

(she/her)

Switch Friend Code: SW-7976-4656-5576

CaleBoi25

Leader of the #HashtagGang
sus ->
YubTub

Switch Friend Code: SW-3225-4369-7994 | My Nintendo: KaleChip

Please login or sign up to reply to this topic