While video game music has always had its fans, the appreciation for game soundtracks and the people who create them has arguably never been higher. Part of this is due to the incredible nostalgia attached to some of gaming's most iconic tunes, but it's also because video game music is close to reaching the same level of fame and respect as music created for movies and other mediums.
Red Bull Music Academy has done some excellent work in popularising some of gaming's most talented composers, and ran a radio and documentary video series entitled Diggin' in the Carts not so long ago, which focused on classic music from classic games. Season two of this series is currently in progress, and we were lucky enough to sit down with host Nick Dwyer to talk about how the series was conceived and why he's taking it on the road with a world tour.
Nintendo Life: What inspired you to create Diggin' in the Carts?
Nick Dwyer: The music of video games was definitely an early influence in my life. Growing up we had a Commodore 64 in our household and then when I was around 10 my brother moved to Japan and bought and sent back to New Zealand a Super Famicom (Japanese SNES) for me. At that time in my life we had a lot of Japanese home stays and when it was young boys they would always bring with them the latest Final Fantasy or Dragon Quest game, assuming that everyone in the world had a Super Famicom also. They were lucky they came to the one household in New Zealand that had one! I remember being really blown away at the time by the depth of the soundtracks for those Japanese Role Playing games and that lush, ‘not-quite-orchestral’ sound of the Super Famicom sound chip was super impressive to me. Fast forward many years later and I was presenting a TV series about music culture around the world for the National Geographic channel and when it came time to do the Tokyo episode I interviewed Nintendo legend Hirokazu Tanaka and Street Fighter II composer Yoko Shimomura for the series. I was really blown away with how wonderful they were and also how incredible their stories were. I guess my starting to research the era began there. Around the same time I was also working on a music project and I would travel to Tokyo once or twice a year to, amongst other things, go to vintage games stores to go ‘digging’ for Japanese only 16-bit games that I could sample. Naturally I wanted to learn more about the composers who made all this incredible music I was discovering for the first time and I could find very little information about them. I kinda started to realise that I needed to make a documentary series to tell their story and thankfully the Red Bull Music Academy got it and jumped onboard. I really have to thank Torsten and Many at RBMA for believing in it because without them we wouldn’t be here today.
Were you pleased with the response for the first season of the Diggin' in the Carts radio show?
Nick Dwyer: Absolutely. I started working in radio when I was 14 down in New Zealand and presented radio nearly every day for more than 20 years. I love radio and it’s been the greatest to have Diggin’ In The Carts evolve into a radio show. Basically all my life all I’ve ever loved to do is to dive right into new music or new old music and then present my findings to an audience and the audience that has been following the series are super passionate about the genre. A lot of very cool things have been happening within the sphere of video game music since we launched the series now with a number of legendary soundtracks being pressed and released to vinyl for the first time, we now have a Diggin’ In The Carts tour taking Japanese composers who have never performed before all over the world and of course we have just released a compilation on Hyperdub, which is one of the world’s most forward thinking record labels. So I think it’s a great time for that era of video game music being realised as this incredible electronic music, outside of the context of a video game.
Can you tell us a few highlights from this new season - what parts of it were especially enjoyable for you from a personal standpoint?
Nick Dwyer: Off the back of all of the research for the documentary series, the first season of the radio series and for the Hyperdub compilation, I thoroughly listened through the entire history of Japanese video game music from the 8-bit and 16-bit eras, including Japanese PC systems like the MSX and PC8801. However, aside from owning and playing the Playstation and N64 when I was younger my musical knowledge of the fifth generation of consoles was pretty limited. So, I did what I did the last time and sat down and, over a period of 4 months, listened through the entire history. Every system, every game, every track. So to be honest the biggest highlight was just getting through it all. There was definitely a lot more music to get through in this era! In terms of discoveries, I found some really really incredible music that was released on the PC-Engine CD-ROM and a system called the FM Towns which was a system released by Japanese company Fujitsu. Music that was found on games that never left Japan and yes, you’ll have to listen through the new series to hear those finds!
Who would you say are your favourite composers working in the field of video gaming, either past or present - and why?
Nick Dwyer: In terms of composers, there’s so so many and all of the composers you’ll hear on the series are my favourites, people like Tamayo Kawamoto and Sizla Okamura. I think though that my favourite discovery since embarking on this project has been discovering the music of a composer called Manabu Saito who we highlight in the second episode in this new series. He composed music for a company called System Sacom for systems like the Sharp X68000, PC-8801 and the FM-Towns. His music has a quality that I’ve rarely heard in video game music, this sadness, this melancholy. I would go so far as to use the Portuguese word ‘saudade’ to describe his music. Sadly he passed away at the age of 22 and so the world didn’t really get a chance to hear his genius and I have no doubt in my mind, should he have lived on, he would of gone on to become one of the greatest video game composers to come out of Japan.
Do you ever find that some of the musicians you interview are surprised by the level of fame they have in the west?
Nick Dwyer: Pretty much all of them! Aside from say Final Fantasy composer Nobuo Uematsu, most of the composers really had no idea that what they did back then was even thought of and appreciated as music let alone a significant inspiration on millions of young people around the world. It’s only really been in the past decade with the advent of the internet and also with a number of these composers jumping on social media that their fans have had an opportunity to reach out to them. In addition to that I think what the video series of Diggin’ In The Carts showed was just how much of an influence Japanese video game music had been on so many of the worlds most established names in contemporary electronic music. Take for example Yuzo Koshiro. He had some inkling that the music of Streets Of Rage was enjoyed by young kids in the west, but I think it took the series to show him to what level it had influenced people. Since then the series has now been pressed to vinyl and released and, alongside Motohiro Kawashima, the music of Streets of Rage is now being performed live, exactly how it sounded in the game, all over the world. That first show in Los Angeles I think the guys were a little bit unsure if anyone would turn it up at all, but we had a huge crowd going absolutely nuts to their music. And man, it sounded so so incredible hearing those original tracks loud.
How have these people influenced the modern music makers you've spoken to?
Nick Dwyer: In so many ways. As was pointed out in the documentary series, video game music was for so many of us our introduction to electronic music. It was listening to those loops that filled our living rooms day and night that prepared us for a future of listening to electronic beats. In the case of something like the Streets Of Rage soundtracks, those soundtracks were directly responsible for introducing house and techno to millions of kids worldwide. Even moving up a generation there is so much of this lush ambient sound found in a tonne of games in the next generations, be it Michiru Ohshima’s epic work on the ICO soundtrack or even the N64 music created by Mario and Zelda composer Koji Kondo which I think has played a big part in shaping the sound palette of a lot of internet-based electronic music scenes of the past decade. And then there’s sampling, I think 8-bit sounds have infiltrated almost every mutant sub-genre since the birth of sample based culture.
Video game music has arguably never been taken more seriously than it is now; could we eventually see these musicians reach the same level of acclaim as Hollywood composers?
Nick Dwyer: I think that there’s already a lot of crossover happening with US video game composers and Hollywood already with people like Hans Zimmer composing now for video games like Call Of Duty so there’s no doubt as to whether the industry is getting taken seriously or not. In terms of whether Japanese video game composers could achieve the level of fame, I think so. In the past few years the annual top 100 that Classic FM do has been filled with the works of Final Fantasy composer Nobuo Uematsu and various other Japanese composers over the years. So yes, as a generation who grew up with video game music comes of age, it will only be taken more and more seriously.
What logistic challenges have you faced bringing together artists for the global live show, and what's the reaction been like so far?
Nick Dwyer: Video game music being performed around the world is not a new thing at all but traditionally it’s been orchestras bringing the music to life. The aim of these events though, is to bring the sounds, vibes and era of this music that was created so many many years ago to the live stage in it’s original form. I guess this has never really been done before so the biggest challenge was convincing the artists to perform this music for the very first time and get on a plane and do so all over the world! Luckily Yuzo was a big fan of the series and trusted us and agreed to do so. From there it’s been a lot of months deciding on what the live show will look like and then rehearsing which we were doing right up to launch event in Los Angeles. I think everyone was a little nervous going into it but Yuzo and Motohiro smashed it completely and it sounded incredible. We really can’t wait to take this show to even more places around the world throughout 2018 and we’ll be bringing other composers from Japanese with us also.
What's next for Diggin' in the Carts? Can we expect another season and are there are composers or games you'd like to feature?
Nick Dwyer: We have the Hyperdub album coming soon, so trying to let as many people know about the compilation as we can and also building on the live concept so we can hopefully bring the Diggin’ In The Carts show to as many festival stages and venues around the world as possible. But right now, it’s all about getting the second season of the radio show heard by as many people as possible. With regard to a new season, as I’ve just finished the second season I haven’t even had the opportunity to think about the next season yet. But it will be back and no doubt will involve another deep plunge into some all new depths of video game music history!
Comments 17
Cool read, even though i love the modern orchestrations, original chiptune is still right up there among my faves to listen to, the 16 bit music god that is Yuzo Koshiro, and Streets of Rage 2 in particular, is one of the very best.
Such an incredible performance!
It is a shame I am unable to attend the London concert, I doubt I will ever have a chance to see both Yuzo Koshiro and Ken Ishii on the same stage.
Cool project, but a little insufferable that the dude takes the tone that he's "discovered" any of this. I can appreciate the work, but on the other hand he's talking it up like he's the composer and not just the booking agent/archivist.
Granted maybe he's got some real fire that's been hidden for 20-30 years but, like, I can just YouTube FM Towns music. The only difference is I can't book the composers to play in my studio lol
Dang, I was hoping they were gonna discuss the various tribute bands being the keepers of the flame of awareness for some of these composers.
I look at the old musicians-turned-programmers from back in the day the same way I look at members of old Heavy Metal bands like Jaguar. Both are rad in similar, yet different ways.
For anyone who doesn't know but may be interested. Diggin in the carts is a play on Diggin in the Crates. Which isn't only the term used for record shopping but also the name of a hip-hop crew that originated in Harlem. Big L was the standout emcee and had one solo album before his death. He largely was responsible for beginning the use of unique compound rhyme schemes and influenced major artists like Eminem and Jay-Z. It's nice to see a real audiophile like Nick Dwyer let his background love for different types of music shine through in the original work he's doing. A real solid cat.
@damo Awesome article. It's not the kind of article that gets the hits/clicks, but it's articles like these that are the most important for recalling history and learning from it.
By the way, for anyone interested, here's a collection of tunes composed by or involving Manabu Saito:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GwfkByezcqE
Jump up super star! Is probably one of my favorite songs of all time
@PlywoodStick Than you for that link!
@World Hey man, Nick here from Diggin' In The Carts. Definitely in no way am I trying to imply that I 'discovered' this music and that it was hidden and locked away. I'm using the word 'discover' as in personal discovery. It was all new discoveries for me as I'd never heard this music before. The only reason I've been able to find all this music is thanks to the many many many people that have uploaded this music to youtube. This project is all about pushing the composers forward so not in any way trying to take credit or put myself in front of these incredible men and women and their work.
I hope you can enjoy the video series or radio show : )
Excellent article.
I would like to again plug my YouTube channel "The Mackeral Jack Show," which features hiphop music sampled from 8-bit video games. I am posting a link to a song about sneezing, which samples a song from Final Fantasy for the NES.
https://youtube.com/watch?v=ntpn3-35QrA.
@NickDwyerDITC I didn't even know about the existence of Manabu Saito until just yesterday, myself. So it was a very nice personal discovery for me as well. A few searches on Youtube will show you that almost no one knew about this guy outside of Japan, maybe a few thousand people at most. (And only Japanese people, immigrants, or visitors who could afford or knew about the X86000, PC-88, or FM Towns would have been even remotely likely to know about his work. e.g. Fujitsu Ten FM Towns Car Marty was $3000 without adjusting for inflation back in 1994.)
More or less, his work really is like a hidden treasure trove locked away in the sands of time, so I don't think the allegory is inaccurate. Doing some web engine searches, many forum posts highlighting his work only date back to just recently this year. He's one of those guys whose work remained largely unappreciated until a while after they've passed on.
@PlywoodStick yeah his work really is like nothing else.
The soundtrack for 'Evolution' is so incredible and in particular this track
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xlNpb9ivMuk&t=979s
@NickDwyerDITC I was able to drag the 163k version out of there, absolutely incredible for 1989. The sound quality is a generation ahead of it's time, and perfectly depicts rushing through a foreboding, hostile environment. Too bad the game it was attached to was so bland and boring.
The track you highlighted in particular is amazing because it took years before mainstream consoles could reliably get percussion and choral vocals to sound that good, since their limitations forced them to use compressed instrumentation. (Although a few exceptions, like the tracks recorded into PCM files used in the Lunar series on Sega CD, were also notably ahead of their time.)
@NickDwyerDITC I was probably going to check this out either way, but I appreciate you giving a little more background on your thoughts. Interviews aren't really the easiest way to get some things across for sure. Sounds to me now like you're just as in awe of these guys as some of us who also grew up with them are! Very cool, and all the best on the project.
I am a HUGE fan of video game music, and always have been. In fact, my tastes in music outside of VGM have a tendency to run so parallel to it that I have a hard time "telling which is the chicken, and which is the egg". In other words, did my love for the non-VGM stuff give rise to my love of VGM, or did my love for VGM cause me to love these kinds of musical experience instead? I legitimately have absolutely no idea. I only know that there are great parallels in both and that both bring me tremendous joy.
VGM has also had an interesting evolution over the course of its life. Beginning as a mere tool of simple beeps and noises, into a simplified reflections of certain genres using really basic PSG synths to not so simplified reflections using more advanced FM, Wavetable, and basic ADPCM synths, to non-simplified, often non-synthesized reflections using Redbook audio, and eventually, high end ADPCM systems. Over the course of that time, a gulf began to form between Eastern and Western compositional and sound design styles, which initially widened out quite far before eventually beginning to narrow again a bit.
Over time, we began to see VGM moving away from the melodious to the ambient and then to the outright atmospheric before finally settling into a world that embraced them all. And we've now reached a point of maturity (not just in VGM, but in video games in general) where cutting edge, envelope pushing, technical marvels and soaring epics - usually from major developers - co-exist beautifully with the simplest, most basic, overtly retro, pixel-style game with old-school controls and chip, chippy, or chippish music (all of it blanket labeled, and often times INFURIATINGLY mislabled as "8-bit") - usually from smaller developers.
We live in a present where past and future live together in relative harmony. And that reflects in VGM as well. Leaving us with a scene that includes...well....everything. The biggest, most rousing orchestra pieces, blistering rock and metal, space ambient, club beat, hip hop, Trip-Hop, and J-Pop, Jazz, Jazz Fusion, Progressive Rock, all manner of electronica, simple atmospheric soundstages, and every level of chip complexity - plus any and every possible combination of the above. All sounding convincing and respectable for their respective genres, while also still possessing something uniquely video gamey.
And that's just today's VGM. That doesn't take into account the past 40yrs of gaming history and all its pivotal epochs, and timelessly irresistible offerings.
In fact, arguably my favorite era of all time for VGM was the 4th gen (SNES, Genesis, TG16, Neo Geo, etc). Why? Because by this point, the sound tech had become advanced enough that they were able to do some really deep, expressive, diverse, and complex music - BUT - still rudimentary and limited enough that you couldn't take anything for granted, but had to earn every little thing you got, learn the sound hardware inside and out (ESPECIALLY on the more "traditional synthesis" "old guard" FM and Wavetable - which in general, I actually prefer over the rudimentary first steps into the brave New world that the SNES' SPC700 admittedly amazed us all with) rather than just dump your Casio action onto the system.
And now, VGM has gone on to become less informed and influenced by mainstream music and more informer and influencer of it, with more and more musicians citing it as something that has shaped their musical worldview and has impacted their works.
Yes, I love VGM! No, I LIVE VGM!
Cheers!!!
You know, I suppose if ever there were a time to shameless plug my own podcast on Nintendo Life and have it not be totally inappropriate, it'd be now!
I have a video game music podcast that I do - not surprisingly, called "Nerd Noise Radio". Actually, its full name is not "Nerd Noise Radio", but rather "Nerd Noise Radio - Channel 1". Why? Because I envision a future where there's a "Nerd Noise Radio - Channel 2", or a channel 3 or even 4 or 5. Shows that are all video game related, but separate shows that exist independent of each other, besides that they're all under the umbrella of the NNR banner. Some would be pretty much all music and virtually no talking, some would be roughly 50/50 talking / music, and some would be pretty much all talking.
Channel 1, the one that exists presently, is pretty much all music, with virtually no talking. Short, standardized into, completely uninterrupted music block, and then standardized housekeeping outro. Tracklists are given at the end, and are also included in the show notes. They're not actually shared in the intro itself for three reasons: a) to get me off the stage so the music can take over more quickly, b) to leave it up to the listener to decide whether they want to follow along in the show notes, or whether they want to be surprised as they go along, and c) to not follow too closely the format of the non-video-game-related radio program which is my inspiration, and to which my show is my "love letter" - NPR's "Hearts of Space". There's a fine line between the flattery of imitation and the theft of plagiarism, and I want to stay on the safe side of that line - especially considering my outro is basically in lock-step with it.
Some of my episodes are just soundtracks or albums, and in those cases, I just play them in order, so the following doesn't apply for those: but in general, the most important thing for me in creating an episode is not track selection, but track order. Since it's an uninterrupted music block, the idea is to not just throw you a bunch of tracks, but to create one seemless, compelling "sound story". I try to have a clear reason for every single track transition that I make, and make every single track "work" with the others. Sometimes it's like track for like track. Sometimes it's something completely opposite. Sometimes it's a gentle transition, sometimes it's a jarring one. But it's always by design. So the actually ordering of the tracks is far more important to me (and something I take more pride in) than which tracks are actually included.
Where applicable, I try to include a mix of the newest VGM, the oldest VGM, the most "chip", the least "chip", the most iconic, and the most obscure. Thus far, the newest track I've featured in an episode is the title theme from ARMS (Episode 16), and the oldest track I've included is "Theme of the Grid" from Ballblazer on the Atari 8-bit computer / Atari 5200 / Atari 7800 (Episode 1). So, if you like the full spectrum of VGM, then you'll like it here.
Anyway, if you check it out and don't like it, thank you for checking it out. But hopefully you'll at least check out an episode or two. My most recent episode (Episode 17) is a soundtrack episode. So if you wanna hear something where track ordering is a factor, check out Episode 16, which is a free-play episode, Episode 15, which is a focus on Sega CD music, or wait til this coming Friday when Episode 18 comes out, which will be my first "Face-off" episode (a playlist featuring multiple versions of multiple tracks).
There is a dedicated "Channel 1" feed out there, but it's lower fidelity, only goes back a few episodes, and won't feature content from any future "channels" - lastly, if my total monthly output of content exceeds 2hrs, I'll have to create alternate "trimmed down" versions of the episodes for that feed. So the link I'm including instead is to the "All Channels Feed", where none of the above are true. It's still not exactly "hi fidelity", but at least it's original fidelity, plus it goes all the way back to Episode 1, will always be the full-length episode, and will also include the full content of any and all active channels, whenever the other channels go online.
In any case, here ya go:
https://nerdnoiseradio.podbean.com/feed/
Lemme know if you check it out and what you think of it if you do. For those who like engaging conversation, and getting to hear interesting facts about tracks or composers, or "getting to know" your host, then Channel 1 will not be for you, and will seem flat and empty. I have a future channel just for you, but it's not active yet. However, if you're the kind that likes to listen to music while you work, or work out, or clean house, or game, or whatever, then Channel 1 is -PRECISELY- what you're after. Uninterrupted music bookmarked by standardized intros and outros. Unubtrusive, and good tunes! I know some like the one and some like the other, which is why I intend, in time, to offer both. But this one is where it begins.
The format itself of Ch1 episodes never changes, but the fidelity gradually does - as in, Episode 17 is higher fidelity than Episode 1 - so keep that in mind if you start at the beginning. Episodes 1 and 2's music blocks are in mono, but the rest are stereo (where applicable).
Cheers, all!!
Excellent article and a brilliant read. There's a couple of points i'd like to add a comment to, mainly in the section where you guys talk about whether video game music composers could achieve the same acclaim as movie composers in the future.
The part where Nick talks about an annual poll by Classic FM that has featured the likes of Nobuo Uematsu and Yoko Shimomura in recent years, that is the annual Classic FM Hall of Fame and it is actually a poll of the top 300 pieces of orchestral music voted for by the station's listeners, whether those pieces are from classical masters such as Mozart and Beethoven, film & TV composers including John Williams (Star Wars, Jurassic Park, Indiana Jones) and Howard Shore (Lord of the Rings, The Hobbit), and in the last few years a variety of VGM composers. Last year's top 300, which is broadcast over the Easter weekend, included scores from 8 different video game series (Viva Pinata and Banjo Kazooie by Grant Kirkhope, The Elder Scrolls, The Legend of Zelda, Everybody's Gone to the Rapture, World of Warcraft, Kingdom Hearts and Final Fantasy).
Also on Saturday nights until December 9th, Classic FM is currently airing a series called High Score, which is the UK's (and possibly Europe's) first and only series on national radio dedicated to video game music. The series runs for 6 episodes (the first two have already been aired on 4th and 11th November, but you can catch up with them online on Classic FM's listen again service) and is hosted by Jessica Curry, who is a VGM composer herself and won the BAFTA Games Best Music Award in 2016 for Everybody's Gone to the Rapture.
The main reason for mentioning this is that I co-run an account on Twitter called @WeLoveGameMusic, which campaigns for the wider recognition of VGM. We discuss anything to do with VGM, including soundtracks for upcoming and recently released games, live video game music concerts and shows, podcasts, media articles and interviews with composers, and we are hoping that not only we will be able to attend the Diggin In The Carts' World Tour when it comes to London on November 30th, but that we can persuade other VGM fans in and around London to consider going as well.
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