Jools Watsham Explains Why his Latest Game Didn't Release on Nintendo Platforms

Didn't pick up Moon Chronicles and probably never will, but I did pick up Mutant Mudds and Xeodrifter seems worth looking into. Almost forgot about that one.

Ok that's why moon chronicle never released in europe. I hope someday they released it in europe.
And xeodrifter is a really great game.

I really appreciate most of this studio's work, but I don't get how they don't sell well. I feel like every time I check the eShop, at least one of their games is featured.

The reason Xeodrifter didn't do well is because gameplay wise, its flawed. Yet despite porting to other platforms, that shows that the game performed even worse than just the 3DS and Wii U.

Observe Pirates Curse. Yes it later on became on Steam as well but that game had quality and its the best Shantae game period. Games that Renegade made don't reach up to those standards despite them being nearly identical to that of wayforward.

Remove the brutal punishments and your games will do well. Is it so hard to do that?

From that image I thought that was the latest game from the Shooty Skies & Crossy Road dev.

Xeodrifter released with zero fanfare over here. It was months after the hype of the US release and they just snuck it out under the radar. I'd been hyped for it and didn't even know it was coming, I chanced upon it in the eShop.

I'd love to play more of their games, but they don't release them here and when they do they don't tell anyone.

I think the problem may be partially the fact that they don't release their games simultaneously world-wide. Europe is still waiting for Moon Chronicles and the months-long delays between releases in the NA eShop and the EUR eShop has made some fans feel - if not cheated - at least like they are second class citizens.

The problem gets bigger when you give your European fans a release date, yet fail to release the game in the regions years later said date. It shouldn't be strange that the games don't sell well when you make a market group feel like crap and then never say anything regarding the release ever again.

Like, I would be happy if Renegade Kid just told us Europeans that they are not going to release Moon Chronicles in the European eShop ever. Now the latest news regarding its release is that it's coming out "Holiday 2014".

Well I appreciate their honesty. I wish more companies just told it to us straight like this.

@MitchVogel
From a neutral point of view, they're not interesting nor appealing, or they didn't offer anything new and that they're not marketed well. It doesn't mean they're a bad game.

Also Mutant Mudds' protagonist have a character. It has defining traits. You can see his face, etc. Xeodrifter did not and I think the character was too small. As for Moon Chronicles, do we really want a scifi 3rd person shooter on a handheld at this time?

@Nego This. I don't buy their games (if they actually release here), because there are other devs who actually care about Europe.

It's a long time we've got some Renegade Kid games in EU so it would not be a big loss.
I don't expect very much from Renegade Kid since they left EU behind...

The new game is really dull as well. It's not a fit for 3DS.
To be honest, I feel as thought Renegade Kid is a little overambitious as to what they can achieve at this stage. They do 2D well, but there's a certain blandness to their 3D releases that's hard to escape with such a small studio. Very corridor-y levels and unimpressive art. This is despite their excellent technical skills at getting the things running in the first place.

Is Moon Chronicles even fully released yet? I only saw anything about the first episode. Is it in the UK yet? I haven't seen its release anywhere other than the US. That's a big problem in itself - I'm a pretty dedicated Nintendo consumer and I don't feel they've communicated themselves well to me; following Jools on Twitter shouldn't be the best way to keep up with their games. With the internet, you're also marketing towards the whole world at once, not just the US. If you can't release simultaneously, of course you're going to lose a lot of momentum when it gets released elsewhere.

As for Xeodrifter, that hasn't been communicated super-well either. I got a copy for free on PS Plus, knowing it's been well-received by enthusiasts, and it didn't even register that this was the game that Renegade Kid had been working on. It's a boring "X" name without much to sell it in its logo or screenshots.

I hate saying all this because I love Renegade Kid, and Jools genuinely seems like a lovely guy trying to do his best in a tough market. I hope the best for them, I really do.

@RainbowGazelle I still buy their games when they interest me since I know they make quality games that I enjoy playing. But it still does not mean I'm not salty about the way they treat Europe.

Hmph. Rewarded as a traitor deserves.

@Nego Fair enough. None of their games interest me, so that doesn't help...

@Nego this. You can't expect tremendous sales when you only release your games in one territory. I imagine that many people initially interested in the studios games in Europe are now not interested as there is little chance anyone will see them

Why don't you guys buy games like Mutant Mudds, and Dementium ReMastered, and Xeodrifter, and Moon Chronicles? All great games, and buying will support them!

I like Renegade Kid games but we need more in Europe tho, we are missing out and that sales they are missing out on.

Hopefully Dementium will get released in europe. I've been really looking forward to it but can't say I'm very optimistic it will ever reach us.

Just make better games. Third parties, especially western publishers, have to learn that the Nintendo market simply does not tolerate the laziness and bullcrap that the pull on PC/PlayStation/Xbox/Mobile.

@WebHead
The lesson I would take from that statement, if I would be a developer/publisher is not "make better games" but "dont make games for Nintendo".
Nintendo is in no position to "not tolerate" anything from third-parties...they can be lucky if they get them on board at all.

I've bought and played both Mutant Mudds and Moon Chronicles, and I must say that both felt extremely lacking in personality and turned me off their work completely, especially given how much attention games like Mudds have gotten, as if they were something special. I've played tons of stellar indie games, but their work feels really generic to me, enough that I don't have much interest in anything they put out. I wouldn't be stunned to learn the same is true for lots of other folks; thus, a market that once seems healthy no longer is due to a lack of continued interest in their games. I can only speak for myself, but that's definitely my experience with their work. I wish I liked their games more, but I simply can't.

I wonder how the dementium remaster is selling so far. Well, hopefully Totes the Goat will get more exposure and garner the needed sales on iOS to stay viable and maybe build up anticipation for a potential eshop release. Nothing wrong with that strategy...well, that's if it sells well on iOS. I guess you can always blame the market for low sales.

Edit: I'm curious what the probability of having a successful release on iOS compared to the eshop. I'm not talking angry birds sales and obviously there hundreds of millions more idevices in the wild, but enough to gain revenue to green light other projects. I'm just saying, it seemed like xeodrifter was getting 'front page' exposure on the eshop for a while and included in nindie sizzler reels. I have an iPhone and a 3DS - I check the eshop exclusively for games, but the last time I went on the apps store was months ago and that was to look for a free compass. So, I was more wondering the proportion of idevices owners who seek out games. I know my wife and mother in law are not and they probably represent a big portion of the imarket

Personally I get all hyped up for their games which then get released in the US but since we don't get them close to the same time in Europe I just get disappointed & forget about the games & look forward to other stuff.

I picked up the first episode of Moon Chronicles and skipped the latter three. Wasn't really feeling the game much. I am definitely going to pick up Dementium though. I snagged a copy of Xeo-Drifter on 3DS too. Suprised that didn't do well for them. I have yet to play it.

that sucks. renegade kid has some of the best games on the 3ds. i hope dementium sells well to give them a boos for the future.

Nothing against them (as they do make good games) I just can't get into any Renegade Kid game. From the combination of demos, playing my friend's games, and that humble bundle I have never been to impressed with them and as a result never bought from them. They seem like nice people and like 90% of the internet loves them which is great that they managed to find an audience I just guess they are not for me.

I guess treasurenauts will not be coming out anymore? That game is at least a year behind its original release date. Their ports of the DS games were likely doomed from the start and have been panned critically. That genre and subpar reviews aren't going to net too many sales on 3DS too be honest.

I do hope they are successful though because I don't want to seethed fail as they seem to actual put a lot of effort into their work.

I don't really use my 3DS much but I have Moon Chronicles and it seems interesting. I was interested in their kickstarter Wii U horror game but the goal was so high, it was almost destined to fail before it started.

Jools seems like a good guy and I genuinely wish success for them, so maybe a few Totes the Goat style games can help them fund larger experiences.

They pumped out 2 remasters of games that were not too popular in the first place instead of focusing on the brand new game that everyone seemed genuinely excited for, Treasurenauts. As for Xeodrifter, that game was fantastic, scratched a Metroid itch for a lot of people and was heavily featured on the eShop so I have no clue how it didn't sell.
Also, buy Bomb Monkey if you don't have it.

@HalloHerrNoob I'm not so sure about that; I'm currently playing Steamworld Heist, it is amazing, Xenoblade Chronicles X and Fast Racing Neo. None of those are currently available on non-Nintendo platforms. I feel like I can afford to be pretty picky when it comes to buying games and, just for me personally of course, nothing renegade kid has done lately has felt like something I need to own.

Hmm seems expensive to port games over to the Wii U. Hopefully the NX will fix this issue!

To be honest, I kinda thought of Mutant Mudds as just a massive anamoly with its sales. Most of their games are quite average. The only one that's really appealed to me was Xeodrifter but I didn't buy it in the end cos people were saying it was quite short. Which doesn't sound like a good feature of a metroidvania game.

I think being episodic killed moon chronicles.

Making a really short remaster episodic(and poorly handling it at that) is a REALLY bad idea. It took so long for them to even mention what was going on with the next episode that I lost interest in finishing and never bought the rest.

I was really 'into' Renegade Kid when Mudds first came out and I was hyped for Moon Chronicles and Xeodrifter and Treasurenauts but the games either haven't made it to Europe, came out but with very little marketing to encourage a purchase or haven't released at all.

To be honest, I feel the failed Kickstarter has something to do with their lack of success right now. I feel like that deflated them somewhat.

I got Mutant Mudds and that was pretty much the only game I played on my 3DS for a time. I already had Dementium on DS and Moon Chronicles just...doesn't hold me.

I was excited about the other game they were planning on doing for the 3DS, but that one didn't work out, right...? Cult County...?

Maybe the delayed european releases for those games might have something to do with that. We dont have either moon or dementium yet and xeodrifter was quite heavily delayed and priced quite highly on release if I recall.

I will accept his reasons as credible when Moon actually comes to Europe.

Moon Chronicles felt like a subpar Metroid for DS game, glad the way I got it was from that Nindies Humble Bundle cause I would've been disappointed if I wasted money on it otherwise.

Haven't tried out Xeodrifter but I've heard it's really short so I'd rather not bother. Mutant Mudds also doesn't interest me, feels like it plays out too slow imo.

@Dezzy I personally think that Mudds did well because its concept was easy to grasp, it was arriving at a time when 3DS sales were well on the rise, it was a good display of the 3D screen and, well, it is a rather good game.

Well according to Steamspy his games did worse on Steam than on 3DS.
Also they bombed on PSN too.

His games haven't done well on any platform to date.

Maybe mobile will work out better for him.

I guess my issue is while I enjoyed mutant mudds, moon chronicles, and xeodrifter ( they are solid games) I didn't love any of them. They are good but not great. If you have a 3ds and a wiiu in America there are simply much better indie games to buy. It's a shame, I really like the guy.

I bought the first episode of Moon Chronicles and loved it, and am planning on buying the rest shortly. I am also still waiting for Treasurenauts!

I agree with faint, their games are all good, but that's it. Just solid, functional games lacking a real appeal. Plus, I absolutely loathed Mutant Mudds, yet that's their most revered game.

I love all of RK's games and am surprised to read this. Makes me sad.

@Artwark "Remove the brutal punishments and your games will do well. Is it so hard to do that?"

Ugh. I think the newer generation of gamers raised on hand-holding is one of the primary causes of the lack of sales. No, adding an easy mode isn't that hard, but when you're an oldschool gamer who loves a challenge, it can be difficult to design your games to cater to both parties, especially a game like Xeodrifter..

@TeeJay

Many do, and Nintendo fans just get their panties in a bind over it. The sad truth remains unchanged--with rare exception, Nintendo fans do not support 3rd parties. Nintendo's platforms do not have longevity anymore (not since the SNES and original Game Boy line).

Looking over the comments here, as usual, I see a lot of excuses tossed about about "why" Nintendo fans didn't support the games. Oh, they're too hard. Oh, they didn't promote them enough. Oh, blah blah.

Nintendo platforms are only good for Nintendo games and they aren't really good for much else. It's the single best argument for the company to go third party. They can't seem to offer a strong, sustainable platform for 3rd parties, and their first party efforts are overwhelmingly lacking in growth.

@Dezzy You can complete it in a few hours, it's not long at all. But it is really fun and not bad for the price. It's basically a micro Metroid, I'd recommend it for a fun distraction one evening.

Personally, Moon left a bad taste in my mouth after spending $8.99 on the first episode. It's one of the few times I felt ripped off with an eShop title. I didn't buy the rest of the episodes cause of it and tend to be avoid RK titles now.

Don't blame me. I bought both "Xeodrifter" and all the episodes of "Moon Chronicles," which are both very good games. Sure, the graphics are pretty bland in both titles, but they get the job done next to the excellent gameplay.

@Kilroy "Xeodrifter's" difficulty isn't that bad, but "Mutant Mudds" is really brutal, and then they went and made an even harder version! I couldn't even finish the demo of MM since it was so difficult, and then they think it shouldn't be easier but even harder?! What are these guys smoking?

Well, I'm not surprised Moon didn't sell well, the first episode is expensive for the tiny amount of content it offers.

Honestly this really disappoints me since I absolutely loved both Mutant Mudds and Moon Chronicles and I plan on buying Dementium Remastered soon. They are a very talented group of people who without a doubt deserve success and it sucks to hear that they haven't had as much as they would like. I am crossing my fingers for their next game to be a big hit!

@BulbasaurusRex I don't know I have been playing platformers for a long time and I had little trouble 100%ing the game. Sure the final stage in the game was tough but it was meant to be, though the ghost version of that stage was absolutely masochistic. The granny levels were a breeze compared to that one though.

@BulbasaurusRex To each their own skill level, but the Mudds games have clearly built up to the difficulty level of the ghost stages. Yes, the demo was hard, but if you can beat prior Mudds games, then practicing the harder ones should eventually give you the skill to beat them. Mudds doesn't have the type of difficulty where you can either beat it or you can't; you can learn from past deaths and devise different strategies to proceed.

@Dpishere I hope once Treasurenauts is finally released that it hasn't lost all the momentum that it gained when Jools originally unveiled it. I'm not doubting its possible quality, just the timing of it. Really looking forward to it.

@Kilroy Heck yeah I have been waiting for that one for what seems like forever. After earning my trust through their other games I am willing to say that Renegade Kid is one of the best developers on the E-Shop, and Treasurenauts looks to be another excellent game from them.

I loved Mutant Mudds and Xeodrifter!

@Dpishere Well, you're on the high end of the skill level scale for platformers, so of course you could do it. The average gamer on the other hand has immense trouble with the game.

@Kilroy I have to disagree. I don't know how far into the game the demo takes place, but I'd never be able to beat it. I tried the section I got stuck on several times and never even got close to beating it, and it wasn't just from silly little mistakes that I could avoid in the future. If that level isn't indicative of the game as a whole, Renegade Kid really should've picked one of the easier levels to showcase in the demo.

I bought their games but they can make better efforts. Mutant Mudds is just too difficult to be fun. For me its unplayable. Shovel Knight was fun beatable etc and that's the level of difficulty I like.
@BulbasaurusRex its not the demo... Game I agree is practically broken for most players.

@Quorthon what I gathered from the article renegade kid did really well at first on the 3ds but now are not doing so hot. This implys that people did buy their games and now no longer do. This is not a Nintendo fans don't support 3rd party games thing. This is a costumers not coming back a second or third time thing. The issue is quality

@RCMADIAX I guess your last few games tanked huh. That's what I gather from all of your posts this month.

@RCMADIAX I agree with everything you have said here. This is a much better comment than the simple Nintendo fans only buy Nintendo games argument. I own block drop you and tho I have had disagreements with your approach I stand by that being a solid effort. It looks like robo mouse will be the same. I do wish indie titles sold better it is nice to see at least three in the top 20 most downloaded non vc software on the USA eshop. Gunman Clive HD was also made by a solo dev and I personally think it has criminally undersold.

@BaffleBlend You sound stupid please stop

Honestly for Moon Chronicles it took way to long for the other episodes to come out

@kyuubikid213 Cult County was the alternative to dementium if they didn't get the rights back, but they did.

This is disappointing. However, most of the "Nindie" group is not completely exclusive to Nintendo platforms. At some point, they need to make money so I am on board with them staying in business and supporting Nintendo in the future. As for feedback, I would say first, they need to stop with the vaporware projects like Treasurenauts. I agree with a previous poster that RK is overambitious and does not market the games well. They could really benefit from partnering with another studio like Choice Provisions or Curve Studios to publish their games. Second, they should stop focusing on remakes and concentrate on new IP. On 3DS, they remade ATV Wild Ride, Moon Chronicles and Dementium, all games that came out for DS. Third, they need to make a new game with existing IP rather than expansion packs of previous games. With Mutant Mudds, we got Mutant Mudds, Mutant Mudds Deluxe and Mutant Mudds Super Challenge. So these games are being viewed by the community as expansion packs and are subject to diminishing returns, especially when each iteration is more difficult than the preceding one. I am not a video game dev and little experience in this area, but I think if RK had a solid marketing/publishing partner and focused on getting quality new games out the door, they will be around for a long time.

To be honest if i was a dev. I would be very leary about publishing games for the Eshop. Especially for the Wii-U eshop. The Wii-U shop seems to be a place where most games go to die, hence all the crapware we get in the Wii-U shop. If I was going to do something the 3DS would be the place I would want to publish for. However even some decent games have gone there to die. I cant blame renegade kid which is a wonderful ompany for publishing other markets. I wish our market was stronger and would attract some better games and companies who make them but there are just not enough interested people, especially on Wii-U. I love the 3DS Eshop and im thankful Renegade Kid have given us some great experiences there. I hope NX changes all that expecially if its going to be download only. It better be a special experience or its going to die a quick death like the Wii-U has. I have this feeling that the NX will have the Googleplay Market available to it and then Nintendo will also have its own Market or might just start publishing its games on googleplay. Just my gut feeling since NX is supposedly running Android. I think Nintendo will try and run their own shop alongside googleplay. We will see I really dont know.

Could it be that their games blend in with the other 8 billion indie games doing the rounds these days perhaps?

I think that after the holidays, the people that own a wiiu is doubled.

ah well, get on the ps4 where all mainstream games are,... wise choice ^^

Eh, I've played some of their games and just thought "meh." None of them didn't really have much character. Mutant Mudds just kinda felt like all the other "wow it's retro but it's 2015 lol" indie games that came out around the time, but I could let that slide if it wasn't so slow-paced yet also unforgiving. Moon Chronicles... I don't know. I couldn't get very far in it because the aiming is dreadful with the C-Stick.

I don't have anything really against them as a studio, of course, but they don't really stand out from other developers, especially on the eShop.

@RainbowGazelle This is not devs not wanting to release a game in a certain region, if you could sell more why wouldnt you want that? The thing is that Nintendo of America is working as if Nintendo of Europe was their enemy and viceversa. You can see how different they are from each other, almost like two different companies, NoE releases games phisically that NoA doesnt, games that are already ready to release are released on one region and months later in the other, they create hype in a region, paying for promotion that inevitably reaches the other region generatin hype there too but when the game actually arrives to the second region, that hype is gone.. so yeah in every article I kinda comment on the same, cause I see a problem that afects fans, the almost non existent group of devs who actually support them, and even nintendo themselves, but they dont seem to be doing anything to solve that..so sad.. for everyone..

@Quorthon This.
Really, the Wii U is just like a Nintendo Box sadly (For me at least)
Perhaps I should browse the eShop, as I haven't opened it for months now.

I do my other gaming in PC as IMO, is the superior platform compared to console versions of the games as pretty much everything is released on PC/PS4/XBONE, and now, I don't see any exclusive from PS4 or XBONE to drag me in. Even if they go 3rd party, I think I will use the consoles the games are on as a Nintendo Box again though :v

Jools Watsham is not even releasing this mobile game on Android so Android seems to be his "Europe" this time.