Topic: The Nintendo Switch Thread

@JaxonH

I think Socar is goading you into an argument just for the hell of it. I'd add him to your ignore list and just move on. Just reading his posts of denial raises by blood pressure. "You can only lead a horse to water."

@Magician
True enough. Consider it done.

@Magician @JaxonH
You guys are incredibly quick to just write people off if their opinions differ from yours. Yea, he's sprinkled a few charged words in here and there, but he does back up what he's saying with some examples.

You're gonna turn this place even more into a pretty one-sided echo chamber.

And you could just ask him to calm down the rhetoric and see if he wants to continue the discussion. @JaxonH is doing his usual thing where he demeans them ("ignorant," "can you wrap your head around?" etc.) and then claims moral high ground. This place is never gonna grow if you guys keep doing this to people.

@rallydefault shhhhh, you can’t say anything like that out loud, they may just respond to you, I know, very bad. Aside from that, “switch pro” is gettin real out of hand, you either have the “ I don’t think it’s real”, or the “oh my god it’s real cause this one guy who said switch lite was coming says it’s coming!!! If you doubt believe it I’ll force it onto you!” It’s gotten even worse then the smash leaks (looking at you “Grinch” leak and every other supposed “leak” to date) I don’t know why we all can’t just be quit about it, and wait to see if it EVEN gets announced not when, IF or EVEN. End of my rant.

@Giancarlothomaz you sure do put a lot of videos on here. Not being mean, just find your determination for putting stuff on here pretty great

@rallydefault

I've no qualms about healthy disagreements. JaxonH and I ourselves have butted heads from time to time. But when someone just denies the mounting evidence that Nintendo is set move on from the LCD display as Socar has been expressing, it gets sickening to watch. All the leaks suggest Nintendo is moving to a cheaper, more energy efficient rigid OLED.

Nintendo makes a bigger profit margin per console sold and customers get a bump in contrast and battery efficiency. It's a win-win.

If you haven’t seen the latest Monster Hunter Rise trailer, you really should check it out. What a fantastic looking game.

@Slinkoy1
Nobody I’ve seen has been “forcing” anything onto anyone. The only thing that I have seen happen is people denying the report from Bloomberg from Mochizuki who told us all about Switch Lite and Mariko. Denying that a business deal has taken place for OLED screens.

Which, whether a person wants to believe a new switch is coming or not, I don’t think anybody particularly cares. The problem is when certain individuals start arguing with anyone who believes it is to tell them how wrong they are, sticking their head in the sand like an ostrich as if Mochizuki is just “some guy”. He’s not just “some guy”. He’s a mainstream media reporter with contacts in manufacturing, he’s proven to have reliable contacts as he told us about Switch Lite and Mariko long before release, and he’s now telling us he has confirmed a deal has been struck. People can believe it or not believe it- that’s up to them, but there’s no need to start arguments with anyone who has the common sense to understand this is happening to attempt to convince them it’s not.

Can’t speak to the “grinch leak” or anything else. I wasn’t a part of that. There’s fake leaks every single day that don’t pan out, and just because everybody believes something, that doesn’t make it more credible. What makes it more credible is the quality of the source the information is coming from. The grinch leak, as far as I remember, never came from a trusted source. People just chose to believe it anyways. That’s on them. But you can’t treat every single piece of insider information as if it all comes from the same source. I think that’s the #1 problem people make because they just don’t follow this stuff. They hear “leaks” and, in their minds, they just associate all of them as coming from the same Santa Claus Leak Fairy, and because some leaks are obviously wrong, that means the Santa Claus Leak Fairy is not reliable, and therefore, no inside information can ever be trusted, regardless of who the person is, even if it’s a proven, credible mainstream media investigative journalist telling us his contacts in manufacturing can confirm the deal has happened. It’s like people only have two modes- completely gullible or believe nothing (which ironically, believing nothing is just gullibly believing no source can never be trusted). I think people ignorantly buy into fake leaks because they don’t do their own research and don’t understand the source isn’t proven or credible, get burned, then respond by accusing everything of being fake so they don’t have to deal with being duped again. There is a better, more reasonable middle ground approach, but it requires effort (and a little common sense) looking into the source to see if it’s legitimate first, then assigning a probability, or likelihood of occurrence, based on the quality and credibility of that particular source.

But if someone still chooses to just deny everything, believe nothing, no matter how credible the information is, hey... they’re free to do so. Nobody is “forcing” them to believe anything. Nobody is starting arguments with them to tell them how wrong they are. We can co-exist peaceably. Just don’t harass people who do trust the source as if it’s your life’s mission to convince them otherwise.

@Magician
I really have no dog in this whole OLED/LC thing going on. I'm just saying that encouraging quick adds to your ignore lists is soon gonna find you in a very cramped range of opinions.

My further point was that @JaxonH gets away with a lot around here and we all know it. I'd wager he's chased away more than a handful of people; if you disagree with him, you get about one "good graces" post and then he's right on to calling you ignorant while simultaneously claiming he never insults anyone. It's not a fun situation for those of us who have been around for awhile, much less someone who just joined (though Socar's account seems old but I don't think they post much). There are so many times when it's just not even worth engaging with one of his posts because you never know what awful thing he is going to call you next. That's a horrible thing to think for such an otherwise-cool community.

I just want to see this place grow and encourage new people to speak back and forth without being instantly added to ignore lists or accused of just trying to start fights. Sometimes people disagree with you and just having a different way of typing that you may be interpreting wrongly. Who knows?

This place has been awesome to come to for Nintendo news for so many years, but some of the other old timers probably agree with me that things have devolved over the last year or so into pretty much the same people saying the same things. Discussion was much more varied and lively and included way more people when one or two posters weren't allowed to just trash people and get away with rhetorical murder. (Anybody else remember AlexSays? lol)

To each their own. Do what you wanna do, but I'd love to hear from a wider range of voices.

@JaxonH so now I don’t have common sense cause I don’t believe a rumor on the internet? And let me guess, you’re going to say “that’s not what I said” and edit your original comment, or you will say “Oh my god, it’s not a rumor, it’s facts cause the insider said so 😫!!!!” I wasn’t even responding to you, you CHOSE to respond to me, just to tell me I have no common sense. And why did you put don’t harass people? What did I do, make fun of the guy saying switch pro is coming, cause I don’t believe him?

@Slinkoy1
Sighs...

People really do look to take offense in anything. Anything to make themselves look like a victim to distract from the actual argument at hand.

I never said you didn't have it, I said it takes using it. The two aren't mutually exclusive. And it wasn't said as an insult. But you know that. You're just looking for a way out of responding a rational argument you have no rebuttal to.

Looks like I'm adding another one to the ignore list. I don't have time or patience for this type of petty nonsense anymore.

Invent being insulted to avoid the argument at hand- get blocked. Respond with aggression- get blocked. Harass others for believing something you don't- get blocked. Fail in any way to have a civil discussion without lashing out- get blocked. Underhanded jabs misrepresenting what others say without @ them in the comment, then complain when they respond- get blocked.

I'm done tolerating this crap. Either learn to have a civil, polite, friendly conversation, or get blocked. I’m not gonna waste my time with people looking for a hostile argument anymore. Life is too short to waste it away with people looking for a fight.

@JaxonH I’m sorry I misunderstood the common sense thing, I wasn’t even trying to start an argument I just voiced my opinion and you responded. I wasn’t looking for a way out of your argument( if I were a jerk I would say “I found a way to argue your argument”, but I’m not) I’m perfectly fine with being out on your ignore list, just understand I dint mean for my comments to come out mean.

Don't sleep on Gnosia, y'all. Fantastic game. Just beat it.

This might end up being my favorite Q1 release of 2021. We'll see. I can finally move onto Persona 5 Strikers now!

@Ralizah
I saw you were playing it on my notifications earlier. I still haven’t bought it because I saw the price was $25 and I wasn’t sure if I was ready to commit to that yet, but if I like it even half as much as you then it sounds like it’s worth a purchase.

Did it get repetitive doing the scenarios over and over? How many different times did you replay the scenarios up through completion?

Gnosia is the latest of recent one off Japanese games that I keep hearing good things about but don't know when I'll get to. There's that, Sakuna, 13 Sentinels, AI: The Somnium Files.

I feel kinda like a hypocrite for not buying any of them yet, since supporting niche Japanese releases might as well have been my personality online during the Wii era.

Yes, in a few years it'll be hard to find a new phone that isn't OLED given the benefits of OLED and the continued closing of the cost gap between OLED and LCD at small screen sizes. Hard to argue against this given Apple has already made this move.

@JaxonH Yes and no. There's definitely a pronounced (and deliberate) element of repetitiveness to it. Honestly, it's worst in the beginning, because your stats are low, you don't know any skills, so you're kind of swallowed up by the dynamics of the group.

Once things started changing, though, so did my appreciation of the game. It's extremely cleverly designed. Just on a purely mechanical level, once you keep learning new skills and raising your stats to the thresholds required to use them, the game goes from feeling very RNG-based to more strategic, where you'll have to start considering alliances carefully, planning out betrayals, and generally operating in such a way that you help to influence the direction of the group conversations without sticking out too much. Some characters will have to be approached more carefully than others (for example, there's a part of the game where you'll need to convince the group to put one of the characters, an icy young woman named Yuriko, into cold sleep in order to advance the plot, but using skills to try and sway people against her triggers her own reactive skills that often swing group suspicions back onto you; so, instead of brazenly voicing doubts about her the first chance you get, you have to start by using your support skills to back up criticisms other NPCs make toward her, and slowly start to erode trust in her that way).

Even putting aside elements of chance and RPG elements, though, the characters all have pretty vivid, consistent personalities, and you can actually make accurate deductions based on what you know about them. A kind character, for example, who sticks by his or her friends is extremely likely to defend other Gnosia if he or she is one, whereas more selfish characters, when cast as Gnosia, will happily betray their comrades in a gambit to stay alive and undetected as long as possible.

The real value of playing the loop over and over, though, is what you learn across them: the fascinating worldbuilding, the interesting scenarios that play out as you try different configurations of elements, and, most importantly, the very interesting science-fiction story that binds the experience together. I don't know if you ever played any of the Zero Escape games, but it reminds me of them in terms of the way it cohesively fuses narrative with game mechanics. The player IS the main character, and the way you loop and manipulate the game becomes part of the plot.

There can be long stretches of time where you'll loop over and over without really learning anything new or advancing the plot. Granted, this is never fully a waste, because you'll be able to use exp derived from loops to improve your stats, but it can get annoying if you're invested in the story and then go hours without any significant progress. In that respect, even though I played it over long sessions, I do think it's probably best if the game is played slowly.

I don't know if the repetition is really a flaw of the game. Series like Disgaea and Monster Hunter are also built around loops of repetitive tasks as well. I do think it takes a bit of time to really open up, though, and this will probably be the biggest impediment to the game's mass adoption.

It was made by a team of four people, and I'm just super impressed with how well it came together. The music, art, gameplay, etc. doesn't feel like something out of an indie title. It doesn't make me feel like someone made it in their basement, which even fantastic indies like Stardew Valley and Undertale often do. It won't be everyone's cup of tea, of course (in fact, it's quite niche and thus won't appeal to most people), but it's excellent for what it is and is one of those titles that people will be fingering in years to come when they talk about "hidden gems" on the system.

And for the record, I believe, by the time I reached the true ending, I experienced 161 loops.

@kkslider5552000 Man, I wish 13 Sentinels' Vita version hadn't been canceled. I've played all of Vanillaware's games on that system. I'd happily take a Switch port, though. Their games just feel very 'at home' on handheld systems to me.

@Ralizah
Wow, that’s a lot of loops! I’d say, like 25 hrs?

I totally get the comparison using MH, which does rely on repetition of hunting the same monster (though not nearly as much as it used to be in the old games- nowadays you’ll pretty much fight a monster once and move on, only ever repeating a hunt once in a while if you need to make the armor, which can now be done in just a couple hunts). Even so, I totally get it. Repetition isn’t necessarily bad. It’s only bad when it’s boring or no longer fun due to a feeling of monotony. But simply repeating something does not necessarily result in a boring, monotonous experience. It all depends on the game. To use the MH example, no two hunts ever feel alike, which is why I can hunt the same monster for 30 hours in the demo and still not be tired of it.

I did have some apprehensions about this game though since it’s just conversations in a 10 minute loop over and over, but ultimately you sold me on it, and I just bought the game. I also progressed to the point I finished my first loop and voted someone into cold sleep. It was only the first few minutes of the game but I at least wanted to get the ball rolling with a save file so I can hop back in it on either Switch via the cloud cross saves.

@JaxonH 25 hours sounds right. The approximate playtime seems to average between 20 - 30 hours for everyone. I'll know tomorrow, once the ten day time limit on not getting play activity data has lifted, lol.

Nice to hear you made the jump. I started playing it on my big Switch with the intention of going back and forth, but, honestly, after a few loops, I just left it on my Lite. It was originally a Vita game, and it really does look and sound better on a smaller screen.

I'll be interested to hear your impressions once things start changing. At the beginning, loops are extremely quick because of the limited cast, but the game will keep introducing new characters over the first few hours of the game. It'll take a while after that before it lets you deliberately manipulate variables as well.

@Ralizah
Ya, ever since getting the Binbok joycon (the slimmer model that's still super comfy but not so gaping wide so as to not fit in a case or feel like you're holding a 2x4), and after successfully removing the back cover and adding electrical tape to the backs of the buttons (I redid it with 3 layers of higher quality tape for better adhesion and thicker layer, it's SO perfect now, I love these joycon and may buy another pair and do the tape trick as backup just in case they ever stop selling them), I LOVE playing games on my v2 Switch handheld mode now. Especially with my Arctis 1 wireless headset which has a USB-C dongle.

Feels like holding a Pro controller, still has Gyro, rumble, wireless (which BTW, the middle grip is just a rectangular slab so it fits in the case, which means having a proper pro controller on the go also- default grip for official joycon was way to bulky to fit, and this actually feels like a real pro controller when assembled) and with headset audio it's night and day from previous handheld experiences on Vita and 3DS. Especially 3DS. Super tiny, not that comfy, missing buttons, basic audio, etc. But now But? It's like a true console experience as a handheld. But anyways, ya, it plays really well on the Lite. That's actually where I started playing it tonight even despite all that, because it just felt right on the tiny Switch Lite slab.

That's one thing I'm not sure about though- picking the variables. I'm not sure what to choose. Is there an option to just randomly select? Or is there incentive to add more Gnosia to level up quicker or something? Otherwise I'm not really sure what to pick. Analysis paralysis at work.

For the sake of the arguement lets argue about some of the points you've mentioned.

What do you mean forget WSJ? The guy whom you so seem to trust actually was there and he claimed that there would be two models for Switch in 2019 which turned out wrong. Even if he was right about the Lite, he claimed that it would be released in summer which it wasn't so he was wrong there as well.

https://www.wsj.com/articles/nintendo-to-launch-two-new-switc...

So get that fact out of the way that even he isn't 100% credible. And its very likely that he'll be wrong with this claim at bloomberg as well. So then you'll next say that forget what he said two years ago I assume?

If you're going to call out those who differ from you being ignorant then by that logic, you're being ignorant well as I've already given you a good example of your writer being inaccurate.

But this isn't about being ignorant. This is about being logical. For decades Nintendo has always stuck themselves using LCDs because that is what Nintendo has been using for like since Game and Watch existed. You saying that Nintendo should invest in OLED which has been expensive to manufacture and has defects that are not only permanent but are too expensive to manufacture.

Right. You're starting a rumor as fact rather than speculation which is already being dangerous on you cause your writer has been wrong once. WSJ and Bloomberg are inaccurate as I stated already since they kept on blabbering the same claim they made two years ago which means that they don't want their source to be uncredible. This is just how journalism works. makeup facts that seem credible only to end up being not so much credible just like all those Switch pro rumors we've dealt with for the past four years.

Let's assume that I'm wrong entirely and that the newer model is indeed OLED. So how can it be made in plastic? Cause you should know that Nintendo screens are generally made in plastic and that material is known for high level of durability..something that is true given the Switch can survive from 1000 ft.

Having done a bit of research, I've learned that OLED now is being made with plastic to avoid them being shatterproof. But from the ones that I've seen whether it works, none of them lasted more than one drop as they shattered. Their only other option is to opt for flexible OLED screens which are still in development and are more suitable for foldable phones which are far too expensive as of now. Given the technology is beginning, it is very unlikely that Nintendo would invest in this since they would want to incorporate plastic which OLED as far as I know isn't delivering their expectations.

But let's go further and assume that Nintendo would take that risk and do the OLED whether its plastic or not. It comes with price points and Nintendo depending on how they do this would range the newer model either 400-500$ assuming that they bundle it with its own dock, its own controllers and the console itself with the AC adapter.

So what incentive would Nintendo have to do to make people get into their product? And whether or not the price for it is affordable enough that anyone can buy(which isn't true as the Switch itself had to be 300$ for it to be bought by anyone). Adding exclusive games could work but then it comes down to how they can maintain their Switch userbase so at best they'd keep it as low as the N3DS where it becomes incredibly optional.

This would mean that it becomes more obsolete if all it does is just load games faster or somehow makes them perform better just like the N3DS, GBA SP, GB Micro etc. Suddenly out of nowhere, Nintendo will face people complaining about the burn in display and Nintendo would charge repairs for it which are too expensive. Suddenly, sales for the newer model become lower than that of the base Switch.

So to fix that, Nintendo alternatively revamps the newer model with LCD and disbands the OLED. Just like how Sony did with the Vita. This is what I strongly feel will happen and even if it doesn't happen this way, Nintendo would learn from this and just go back to LCD panels in the future.

I can end up being wrong in this and that maybe OLED could be what Nintendo is hoping to achieve. But the LCD technology is just as improving as the OLED so its not all doom and gloom for the former if Nintendo experiences problems with OLED. After all, it has to work with plastic which is still developing and not that many phones work shatterproof.

You can argue all you want but this is my stated opinion and I respectfully disagree with yours since you are giving claims that are not very accurate and that its being unrealistic since its not within Nintendo's level of interest at all..(I mean, they completely ignored adding even 4G on the Switch let alone 5G). And with that, I'm ending this. Any more and I'm just going to read and not respond.