Topic: Next Nintendo Direct?

@FragRed Mario Sunshine was disappointing when it released so don't feel bad lol.

@GrailUK Yep, it’s a game that shows why Nintendo are right, more often than not, to delay games until they’re up to scratch. If they just had a few more months to fix a few issues it could have been so much better. But I understand they desperately needed a Mario game in the wild.

@FragRed Indeed. Breaks my heart the Gamecube struggled. It was a lovely machine and felt like a successor to the Dreamcast more than the PS2 and XBox.

@GrailUK Imagine if the Gamecube hadn't been a failure- Nintendo may never have created the Wii and instead continued to compete with Microsoft and Sony.

@FragRed Yeah, there is truth in what you said.

@GrailUK Still feel Nintendo needs to do more in terms of funding and publishing games that are geared more towards the "hardcore" gamer. The odd game every year or two isn't enough in my opinion.

@FragRed I dunno. Hardcore to me is an adjective not a label. It's simply how much you play a game. I'm sure there are hardcore Animal Crossing players out there. I used to play World of Warcraft hardcore lol. When I'm chasing a high score for example, I'm not playing a game casually. They really are best making games for everyone...and letting folk be as hardcore as they want with them. (Is my philosophy that helps me sleep at night!)

Hmm, please define 'hardcore gamer', @FragRed ....? I suspect I wouldn't qualify, despite gaming for 100+ hours per week! Perhaps you have some examples of the odd game you're talking about?

@GrailUK @BruceCM Yeah wrong choice of words, not sure what you describe games such as Bayonetta or Astral Chain. Mature?

@GrailUK My dislike of the camera system was nulled by the addicting gameplay, and just how well Mario's moveset and fluidity holds up even now. Sometimes I growl whenever the camera acts up but it's a secondary problem and not a game breaking one

@FragRed Hmm...are you sure you aren't wishing Platinum Games were more productive hee hee

@theJGG That's a good point. Sometimes the camera isn't in the most comfiest position, but at least the direction you press is accurately portrayed on screen. Some games go all weird and you press right and your character moves left. Aye, controls are really important! In Sunshine, you could be holding forward, directly lined up with something, the camera moves abruptly and you miss. Like I said, it's infuriating as someone pulling the rug from your feet lol. Once upon a time, this was called gameplay mechanics. Nowadays, kids use it for features lol (grinds my gears)

@GrailUK Hee Hee while yeah I am. But also, maybe it's me and my nostalgia but I feel like during the N64 and GameCube days, Nintendo seemed to be able to fund and publish a more varied library of games that could cater to a much wider audience then they tend to do for the most part nowadays. I know Rare and Factor 5 were responsible for some of that and I know Retro were behind the Metroid Prime games which helped. Dunno, again its probably just me.

@FragRed Well, I'm sure Metroid Prime 4 and Bayonetta 3 will be worth the wait. I wouldn't want Nintendo to get all AAA on me. It's amazing how that stifles imagination and focuses creativity away from actual game design and more towards 'let's make the same game but this time set it in such and such a place / era / setting) which is nothing more than following zeitgeists instead of your own thing. I jest but sometimes I feel like all a new AAA game adds is more beards.

@GrailUK I mean, Breath of the Wild was delayed by three years and we got an absolute masterpiece. They haven't announced anything concrete, so this could be a shift in their attitude, to only reveal stuff closer to completion?

I've never really understood people who want Nintendo to compete in the same sort of fashion as Sony and Microsoft. Do we really need three companies that offer almost indistinguishable products? Nintendo succeeded with the Switch because it managed to do something wildly different that proved still popular with both the public and core gamers. It's a corner of the market almost completely disconnected from what the power consoles are going for. It's why, as long as Nintendo keeps releasing popular games, I don't think the PS5/XSX are going to slow down sales much at all.

Anyone who just wants a powerful box to play Western AAA games on can go buy one from the competitors.

@GrailUK That's funny. Other than a few cases, I've never had any issues with Sunshine's camera. It's actually pretty responsive!

64, on the other hand, has the worst third-person camera I've ever seen in a game. Full stop. It's more dangerous and aggravating than any of the enemies Mario encounters, and was the cause of the majority of the unfair deaths I experienced.

But then, in general, I've always really liked Sunshine and hated 64, so... shrug

@theJGG ...maybe, but that's one bit of realism I really didn't need in the game.

Hmm, well, I've only played Bayonetta of those 2, @FragRed .... But both are made by Platinum! So, you'd best come up with some other egs? Especially if it's really supposed to be 1st party games. Not at all sure if whatever deal got made with Bayonetta affected Astral Chain or not

@kkslider5552000 Bingo. I was fine with 3D Land because the handhelds hadn't really had a proper 3D game (we had 64 DS and that's it), so it was kind of a bonus that had nothing to really compare it to. 3D World, on the other hand, was supposed to be the next great 3D console Mario game, and to essentially make it a 3D Land sequel when past 3D Marios had been open sandboxes and/or ambitious new experiences made it a disappointment. When they teased that they were revealing a new 3D Mario game for Wii U that E3, I was expecting the next 64/Sunshine/Galaxy. Not a rehashy sequel of a 3D game trying to be a NSMB. Mario definitely went through a creative slump during the early 2010s, I pretty much put 3D Land and 3D World in the same boat as the NSMB, so we had a whopping 4 games in 3 years that were rehashy, generic Mushroom Kingdom (or in 3D World's case, Mushroom Kingdom-esque, don't try to tell me the Sprixie Kingdom is anything more than the Mushroom Kingdom in all but name) with no real new gameplay mechanics to spice things up and it got very tiring. That's why it makes sense for 3D World, despite being the better game in terms of size and scope and content, to be more hated. It's a combination of fatigue for the NSMB style of gameplay and failing to live up to past console entries.

Rare was a massive part of Nintendo's N64 library. I wanna say 1/4 of ALL the first party games on that system (at least released outside of Japan) were Rare games. Gamecube did have a lot more from Nintendo but also had no Rare after the one GCN Rare game. (though there were a handful of largely forgotten GBA games after that for some reason).

But in terms of 3rd party, there were definitely more interesting exclusives back in the day. But part of that is because of how cheaper it was to make games, so they could justify that more easily (though they can still make cheaper games now as well, companies just inexplicably decide not to bother sometimes).

@FragRed Nintendo was still in the "look how powerful this console is" phase back then of which certain types of games really showcase power.

F-Zero has been dead since Nintendo quit the power battle, Metroid has been mostly dead since Nintendo quit the power battle, etc.