For a decent amount of time Nintendo's been fielding questions about Unity support for the 3DS, and the answer's often been the same - it's being considered and it's a desired inclusion on the portable. The problem is the reality that the 3DS is derived of technology that was ageing even in Spring 2011 when it launched, and so the practicalities of running Unity are a challenge. The 3DS is powerful and wonderful in its own ways, in a very Nintendo way, but in the cold light of day engine suppliers like Unity don't care a jot about that if it can't deliver the raw specifications required.
The announcement that Unity support is coming to the New Nintendo 3DS / XL is certainly welcome on multiple levels, in that case. From an immediate gaming perspective it opens the door - potentially - to a raft of new games on the eShop. While quality varies, the Wii U eShop would be a sparce place without Unity support; it's simply a reality of the current-day download scene that a significant number of studios use Unity. For development studios it's affordable, reasonably powerful and has a sizeable community of users, all vital factors when making games on a budget.
Some truly excellent games have arrived on the Wii U courtesy of Unity, and this support could broaden horizons in similar ways for the New 3DS. Instead of the PC and rival console games that make their way to Wii U, we have the prospect of a number of titles originally developed for iOS, Android and even Vita being candidates for ports to Nintendo's latest portable. We suspect a number of small publishers and developers hoping to make their games go further and earn more will be considering their options once this support arrives, plus will no doubt be eager to see just how capable the New Nintendo 3DS is with the engine.
Of course, this influx won't happen without Nintendo showing similar levels of support as it has on Unity. Though porting within Unity will be on the table, developers still have financial and time-restrictive obstacles - dev kits, developer status with Nintendo, support with lotcheck and specific requirements of the eShop. All of that will mean, for better and worse, that developers will have to be confident of making a profit on the new system; with the Wii U Nintendo has alleviated risk with free licenses and - in some cases - loaned dev kits.
Another challenge is with the userbase. The 3DS family of systems may have shifted over 50 million units, but the New iterations only account for a relatively small percentage of that figure due to their recent arrival. The last official figures we were given were 1.84 million units sold in Japan up to 31st December 2014, and 335,000 units sold in Europe and North America over their launch weekends in mid-February. Not bad figures, of course, but it's a much smaller userbase for Indies to consider when weighing up their options.
We'll see just what impact this has, but it's an announcement that suggests we could be looking at a reasonable stint on the market for the New Nintendo 3DS, especially if it gets on a roll of eShop-exclusive releases not available on the older models. In light of some premature exclamations that the 'Nintendo NX' platform is bringing an early demise to the Wii U, in particular, this is a small reminder - potentially - that Nintendo can't simply hurry out its next generation, whatever form it'll take. The NX won't even be revealed until 2016, on current plans, so it's not exactly around the corner.
It is feasible, though, that this is simply another step in closing the gaps between the portable and home console spaces for Nintendo. We suspect the Unity-based libraries between the New 3DS and Wii U will be largely different - as highlighted in the likely sources of ports above - but it's another dividing line that's beginning to blur. The technical discrepancies between the systems are notable, but it's not inconceivable that long term Nintendo will look to simplify matters for itself and third-parties with scaleable and largely matching portable and home systems. We've suggested this already in the past, though it's only a theory.
It's a theory with legs, though, and this is just the latest step. Granted, Nintendo has been actively trying to support Unity to the 3DS family for a while, but it's interesting that the New model - with all of those similarities to the Wii U in control schemes, amiibo support etc - has been given that level of support. We've already seen some cross-over in games from Nintendo and even smaller publishers like Curve Digital between Wii U and all models of the 3DS, and this feels like another step down that road.
In any case, taking down boundaries will likely be at the core of this move, whether driven primarily by Unity alone or whether Nintendo offered a helping hand and provided a partnership deal, as it did with Wii U. We're curious about the minutiae of detail and a release window for this support, too - we've reached out to Unity to learn more. If this support is integrated promptly, 2015 on the eShop could potentially be a little busier and more diverse than we'd expected.
Ultimately, this writer's main feeling with the news is optimism; it could help to stimulate the eShop on the New 3DS with download games that were previously out of reach. One of the best things about the Wii U is its relatively vibrant Indie scene, and Unity can play a part in expanding that picture on the portable. Yes, it's late, and questions are inevitable over its viability on the New system alone rather than the broader 'family', but there's reason to be excited.
Looking long term, too, an increasingly strong relationship between Nintendo and Unity can only be a good thing.
Comments 79
I think this is 1 step closer to having 1 eShop where items purchased will be available to all Nintendo Gaming devices.
I wonder how far away we are from being able to play all the digital 3DS games on the Wii U?
I was just given a New 3DS XL (Majora's Mask edition) console from one of my friends for my birthday. So this is an awesome time to announce this news. There seems to have been so many weeks recently where there were very few releases for the regular 3DS (or anything interesting anyway). Here's hoping that this news can and will help to change the tide.
I don't know if developers are going to jump all over this or not. The majority of 3DS owners are those of the original model, creating/porting a game that will only be available to the minority of the owners might not be a smart move financially.
The N3DS needs a few more essential exclusives to get people to jump. I own Xenoblade and love it, but it's obviously a niche game. Put an exclusive Mario on it or a posh pokemon and theh you'll get more owners, and a more viable platform to exclusively develop for or port to.
Nintendo chose the path of PS Vita for the New 3DS: indie games.
Here's a list of games on wiki that run on the Unity engine. The only 1 I've played is Angry Birds Epic (which was good for free) so I don't see this being a big deal. It's good news, more games are better than less games, but I don't imagine anybody buying a New 3DS due to games on the list. Splatoon will sell more Wii U than Untiy sells new 3DS. (Seemed appropriate.)
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Unity_games
As @Nintendian beat me to the punch, it helps turn the new 3DS into a Vita.
I don't really think this equates to evidence for the unified future, so much as it indicates that Nintendo is working hard to ensure that the New 3DS stands on it's own for as long as possible, which more likely indicates that NX may indeed not be a portable.
@Nintendian I own a Vita and most of the time there is nothing but Indie games. That's not what I bought (a supposed) dedicated handheld for. Nintendo has continued to show support for their handheld, I believe they will continue to do so. Unity is just another option open to them now, which will be good for the times throughout the year when the game releases slow.
Amnesia 3D. Oooo.
@Yorumi - Well that's good to know as that list wasn't very impressive. Long, but unimpressive. Though in fairness the list was called "major titles" or "big releases" or something like that, so I knew it wasn't every game, but I thought it would include all the games that matter.
A unified future, not a unified platform. I just want to get that out of the way, it would be horrible.
Sony turned Vita into an indie platform so they can focus on PS4 titles, which is their cash cow.
I believe Nintendo is using the New 3DS to fill the gap of the next console, letting indie developers make games for it while they focus on their next big thing which could be a multi-platform system combining smart devices, portable, home console, all tied together with an online account system.
Considering Nintendo wont even allow the download of a digital purchase on, say two of the same system that you own, I dont see unified purchase across a number of platforms as a likely future for them. Would be good though.
I'm sticking with my launch 3DS and doubt I'll pick up the 'new' version. Good it has this support for those who do though.
Just implementing an actual proper account system like pretty much evey other digital platform would be a start.
Besides Unity, I am actually pretty unhappy about Nintendo rolling out a new platform NX even though my Wii U was only 1.5 years old. For earliest adopter it was only 2 years old. Nintendo is planning to launch a new console after its release of the console after 4 years?
@Quorthon I am still trying to get over it, but, I think for once, we agree on something.
Ever since Nintendo announced, and then went on to release the new 3DS, it was pretty clear, for me anyway, that the 3DS was here to stay for the foreseeable future. And as you say, it is more evidence to show, Project "NX" is more likely to be a HOME console, rather than a new handheld.
With something like a circle pad pro (with 2 controllers and all necessary buttons) add-on for smartphone, Nintendo can easily port their games to smartphone. Basically a controller plugin that games recognise on the smartphone and use automatically.
Many companies had built this type of thing but never catches on, but if it's made by Nintendo for their mobile games, it will be a success!
@akaDv8R
Given Nintendo's history, a portable seems the obvious choice, since they have a pattern of portable first, console next year. But the DSi prolonged the DS line by 2~3 years, and I think Nintendo is hoping the New 3DS will have a similar impact. While the 3DS is only selling about as well as the GBA (possibly a little worse), it's still doing way better than the Wii U, so it makes sense to replace that first.
Granted, I don't think NX will initially be released as a successor to the NX. I think they're going to pull the "No, DS is a third tier" thing again with NX and attempt to pass it off as a "third tier" to make sure it succeeds, and if so (all it has to do is sell better than the Wii U), they'll quietly retire the Wii U behind the scenes the way they did the GBA.
A system that was also out for only 4 years before being replaced.
@Nintendian I hardly think that the New 3DS will sell many units if Nintendo's idea is to have Indie games "fill the gap" while they work on a new handheld. If Nintendo really want to sell the system (which I believe they do), they will have to also churn out A+ games worth playing. I can't see many people wanting to or actually buying a new system if they don't. If one of the main things Vita had promised (when it was released) was Indie games, I never would have bought one in the first place.
@Nintendian
Your post epitomizes the Nintendo fan special pleading of "if Nintendo does it, it'll be good."
You could at least explain why you think that.
@Nintendzoey
The world has changed, making AAA games can't sell system anymore. Wii U has so many good games but it is not selling as much as PS4 (with so little good games).
Do you know that Candy Crush earn over a million dollars every single day? Simple mobile games like that only required a small development team but generate so much money, that's why big companies are now getting jealous and want a piece of it. You can't survive making good games to please people anymore, most gamers are stupid these days... they can't recognise the quality of Nintendo games.
@Quorthon
What do you mean? Nintendo makes the best games.
Hey, whoa. Binding Of Issac on New 3DS? Sounds cool.
@Quorthon
Millions and millions of people wanted Nintendo to make games for the smartphone, now it's coming true. If Nintendo made a circle pad pro type controller for the smartphone, of course people will buy it to play their games on their phone.
Nintendo will earn 10x more selling this controller than the amiibo.
Shantae: Half-genie hero port. called it!
@Nintendian There is still an audience who wants more than just the casual game though. Nintendo realises this, that is why they released Xenoblade Chronicles as an exclusive to the New 3DS - to try and sell the system. People are not going to want to buy a new system just for Indie games that they can easily play elsewhere (such as on a smartphone).
@Yorumi
To me game design is everything, graphics is just eye candy. Good graphics is just icing at the top, it's nice but if the game sucks then what's the point?
PS4's The Order is an example: really outstanding graphics but game is boring. Most of the PS4 games are only next gen in graphics but it's still the same game design. While you can argue that Mario Kart is same every generation, but Nintendo always add something new to the game mechanics and optimises it for their unique hardware (wiimote, touchscreen, dual screen, etc).
Zelda is Nintendo's best when it comes to game design, every one of them are creative and fun. That's the word: FUN. If games are not fun then what's the point of playing?
@Nintendian Ever since the iPhone released people have been trying to figure out physical controls for a smartphone and failed. I don't see how Nintendo would be able to solve that problem, and nothing they have said points to them intending to solve that problem. I think they will be smarter and focus touch based gaming to the phone and traditional gaming will stay on the hardware they make.
I think Unity is a good thing if developers will use it. Unity has been on Wii U for a long time now, but we don't exactly see a flood of games even when the gamepad could enhance the experience. I don't know if this is a Nintendo policy issue or a reluctance of developers to take the risk on the console. Hopefully this latest eShop push will encourage more, but the risk is a lot of these games coming have been out a long time elsewhere (and extremely cheap regularly now).
@Quorthon I don't agree with your proposed "third pillar" approach Nintendo might do in regards to NX and replacing Wii U.
When Nintendo did this back with the DS in replacing the GBA, it was a system looking to replace the biggest brand in gaming at the time: the GameBoy brand. If they failed with DS it could have been detrimental had they not handled the transition with white glove care, hence the "third pillar" approach.
In Wii U, it's the greatest failure sales wise and brand recognition wise since the Virtual Boy. I do not expect Nintendo to bat much of an eye in replacing it, with NX or anything else.
@Nintendian um, you do know PS4 is out selling the Wii U by more than double in half the time, right?
I'd say your opinion is hardly shared by many, if at all. And your assessment that gamers these days are "stupid" for it, is short sighted and immature.
I don't play PS4 games, I watch people play it on Youtube. ;P
@Yorumi and @Nintendain You would think The Order: 1886 would be better if you just watched it, sort of like how Dragon's Lair is a great B-movie to watch if someone good is playing it.
@Yorumi
One thing I like about Nintendo is the non-violence in their games. Even when they make a shooting game like Splatoon, it's not killing people. There's enough violence in this world, I rather relax when playing games. Xbox and Playstation games are mostly running around killing anything that moves.
That's the basic Xbox/PS game design for the last few generation:
1. Cinematic
2. Run and kill enemies
3. Solve some puzzle
4. Run and kill more enemies
5. Meet the boss and kill him.
Go back to no.1 and repeat.
@rjejr
Here's a link to a showcase of Unity games keep hitting load more at the bottom. There's a ton of variety.
http://unity3d.com/showcase/gallery/games
PS4 is the definitive console of this generation.
That should go to show how sub par this generation has been.
@TheYoshiMadhouse
Heck yeah. I hate how you hafta use a separate program just to setup controller support on Steam and that game would be dope on a portable. I have a Vita but I'd really rather have it on my 3ds fo sho.
@Yorumi
I do like some Sony games: The last of us, Patapon, Locoroco, etc. Sony did produced some outstanding games. I mean, when Locoroco was released people were saying it's the best game that Nintendo never made, but it's only once in a blue moon that Sony make a really innovative and creative game.
Btw, why isn't Sony making mobile games? I want Patapon and Locoroco on my phone!
This excites me, both as a consumer and a developer. I'm currently hoping Nintendo also announces NWF (Nintendo Web Framework) support for N3DS too. I'd love to start making games for a Nintendo handheld.
I am honestly surprised to see how few indies on Wii U are built with Unity. I could have sworn I've seen the logo on the system and I don't have Teslagrad. Giana Sisters?
Strange....
With New 3DS now having Unity support, it would be really cool if Smileboom developed a new version of Petit Cumputer for New 3DS with Unity support
That's great for developers that want to get their games on Nintendo.This can only help the New 3ds when it comes to game availability on the e-shop, but whats going to sell the new 3ds other than hardware is the retail exclusives. If the New 3ds doesn't have a good amount of AAA 3d exclusives, having Unity work on it isn't going to matter.
Established Indie companies that use Unity may hesitate putting their game on the system unless its a port, the user base will remain small for a while until NIntendo pushes out even more exclusives. That being said it does open up the opportunity to get up and coming developers a foot in the door, and games that were missed on the 3ds to come to the new 3ds.
I would just be surprised to see some thing that is New, Exclusive, and High quality coming out of unity indie games, just (based on the current user base) and the (slightly upgraded New 3ds power). It doesn't mean it can't happen, but if NX is the next successor to possibly both systems, game companies could look at the New 3ds as a stop gap similar to the DSi, unless NIntendo reveals during the E3 that the NEW 3ds is going to get hooked up with (serious AAA software) for more than a year.
I want to learn Unity, seeing as it's free out the gate and works across so many platforms, but every time I look at it the impression I get is that I'd need to learn not only Unity, down to a code level, but 3D graphics programs and possibly other stuff too just to even get started
Am I missing something or is it as easy to create a simple game in Unity as it is in the likes of Game Maker, which is what I currently use for Android/iOS development, for example?
I mean how easily and quickly could I get in there and build say a level from Super Mario Bros (in 2D) using Unity?
@Yorumi So if I can't PROPERLY program, not just the basic scripting I did at Rockstar and the GML code I use half the time in Game Maker Studio, it's probably an impossible task to get anything working on Unity?
Man, I wish I wasn't so bad/slow at learning new things
OR, I wish that either I had some money, so I could pay a couple of guys to work with me (an artist and a programmer), or that I just knew a couple of really talented guys (an artist and programmer) that wanted to work on some games with me for free initially and where it was practical doing so (like they were local or something).
I might still have to take a proper look at it because it's looking more and more like the best option available to someone like me at this time to create a game that I can get on multiple platforms, or at least that if I make it I don't have to worry too much about not being able to get on certain platforms for the most part.
@Yorumi Yeah, I've not used either of those other 3D engines so I have no real point of reference for how complex it all gets to be honest.
Damn this head of mine! Endless thoughts and ideas, I mean literally (my brain is on constant overload; to the point I can't just settle on doing something most of the time because I don't know what idea to choose and then just as I'm about to pick one another one pops into my head; from countless game ideas, to books, movie scripts, product designs to theories and [not really scientifically sound] formulas for the universe...and obviously if I pick one it means all the others get ignored), and yet I find it so hard to just sit down and concentrate for long enough to figure out what should be really simple stuff and then implement it in a practical way. Sometimes I wish I could just delete all the noise, keep a single thought/idea in my head and see it all the way through to it's perfect realisation. Doesn't help when I've got a crap short term memory, struggle to learn things that most people seem to think should be relatively easy (('m sooo slooow at learning) and when I do learn something I have to keep doing it over and over and over or else I basically forget how to do it a few months down the line and have to start the learning process pretty much all over again.
I just know that even using Game Maker has been a slow and painful process for me, many years so far, and I still can't even do some really basic stuff. I can make what look like half decent mobile type games to casual observers but in reality there's just so many restrictions on what I'm capable of that basically it's mostly just wasting my breath. I mean I can't even add basic stuff into my games like being able to let people post there scores and/or a comment to their Facebook/Twitter account because the code for it just seems to go right over my head. Sometimes I feel like I'm the robot, trying to learn the ways of humans, which is a pretty hard task for a stupid robot
@aaronsullivan - Thanks.
@gatorboi352
"And your assessment that gamers these days are "stupid" for it, is short sighted and immature."
Nintendian got right and its not so short sighted as you think/see.
Look at games now, look at games in past. Games now are easier because its "regular trend". Mature/older players got less time so games are shorter.
But still are some games that are difficult (Dark Souls?)
And to rest of the topic. Nice that Unity is finally somehow workable on portable nintendo console. Maybe more games? More options to devs?
Shame that they blocked homebrew. One option less.
@Yorumi I was making a joke. I happen to mostly agree with you, although I will say that Nintendo generally speaking understands couch and family fun better than most (and misses the boat entirely on online play). That said, I would never expect a Deus Ex, Left 4 Dead, Mass Effect, or Fallout from them. Occasionally they have had the brilliance to publish games like those that others developed, but themselves are a very much culturally Japanese (and Japanese focused) in their game design.
I prefer a Nintendo console because I found more family friendly gaming opportunities there than on the other two. Not saying there is not any on the other consoles, but it is a vastly underserved genre for them. That was something important for me as my kids stopped toddling around.
On Xbox 360 and from what I seen of the others (mostly Xbox One in this gen), most of the family games are multi-platform releases that are also on Nintendo consoles with a few exceptions (Double Fine Happy Action Theater and Viva Pinata are two that quickly come to mind). The Disney Fantasia game and the Zoo game looked interesting on XBO, but I've not really had an opportunity to try them outside of a demo in a store for the first.
You know that Super Mario 64 HD prototype? If people succeed in creating Unity homebrew games for the N3DS, we could see that being on a handheld..!
@Nintendian
Non-violence in Nintendo games?
Fire Emblem games cram as much violence and misery as they can into every Teen-rated outing. Awakening even featured a suicide very prominently. Eternal Darkness and Geist are also Nintendo games, and ED is one of the darkest, most authentically Lovecraftian games ever made. At least two Zelda games have ended with a visceral sword plunged into the skull of Ganon/Ganondorf. Majora's Mask packs enough bleak melodrama to churn out half a dozen Smashing Pumpkins albums. Kid Icarus was a shooter last we saw it, following the style of Sin & Punishment--which we should not forget is also a Nintendo title. Samus Aran commits wholesale extinction to every other species she comes across. Advance Wars: Days of Ruin was a staggeringly dark and violent title that had a character survival rate like a horror movie.
Your mindless bashing of everything "not Nintendo" is one of the things helping to damage this company as it is frequently judged by the merits of it's fanbase.
For that matter, it's a blatant ignorance of what else is actually out there. Peggle 2 and Zoo Tycoon were two of the titles MS touted to sell the XBO. You might notice, if you bothered to look, that neither of those fits your crudely formed stereotypes.
But to continue to give Nintendo a free pass and behave in this way is just baffling. "All you do in those games is go from one place to another killing things." Sounds like, oh, The Legend of Zelda, Super Mario, and Metroid. Pokemon is a kid-friendly dog fight.
I'm curious if you've ever defended Nintendo against the charges of being a "kiddie company," as now you are basically saying that's what's great about it.
@Kirk
If you aren't big on programming, you may want to try Unreal 4, which is free now a la Unity. Unreal has a "mini programming" engine within it called Kismet, and supposedly, Kismet is so robust now, you don't actually need any coding experience and you can make a reasonably impressive game.
I have it downloaded, but haven't had much time with it. I'm not a programmer, there are guys on my team to fill that role.
For the most part, using any engine, you must adapt to understand the basic concept of coding in order to tell the game how to behave--but different engines handle it differently. Unity is straight code. Construct2 uses a faux code--take [item] and when it touches [character] apply [set outcome]. Stuff like that.
By all means, give Unreal 4 and Construct2 a shot as well. There is another, but I don't remember the name.
@gatorboi352
That's a good point (on the third tier response), but Nintendo may still feel the "Wii" branding could be salvaged. In my opinion, it can't and it's already completed burned out. I'm not discounting your point, which is perfectly valid, but allow me to elaborate a bit on mine:
There are three primary notes I have which is why I think they're going to try the "third tier" approach.
1. The Wii brand. Nintendo may still feel there is value here. I don't think so, I think the brand is completely tarnished. But they may feel differently.
2. Ending a console early--following history, the NX seems set to launch, most likely, November 2016. Following the window of "initial official announcement" to "release," this timeline matches the reveal-launch of the GameCube, Wii, Wii U, and 3DS. In order to prevent "consumer burn" on putting the Wii U away early, they may use the Third Tier approach to smooth things over.
3. Resources. Third party support has almost completely vanished--and not just for the Wii U, the 3DS has also seen a staggering decline, leaving Nintendo to fill the gaps in the retail space by themselves. They have shown that they are unable to do this and, to quote another user here, it feels like "they're running around putting out fires," and trying to spread out the few titles they have over the widest possible space of time.
Suffice to say, Nintendo does not have the resources to support three platforms at once--something's gotta go.
Yes, indeed, the DS was a "third tier" largely to protect the Game Boy brand if something went awry. Even without the Wii U being a brand worth much, I think it's still feasible they will try this again--and the infographic they originally showed did attempt to list the NX as a third position. However temporary that will be.
HOORAH! More potentially good games are a-comin'!(hopefully )
It'll be interesting to see what games we'll get out of this
@Quorthon Cheers for the suggestions.
Looks like we got some console wars going on here! There is nothing wrong with preferring Nintendo games seeing as this is a news site dedicated to them but to outright call other games unfun or lacking of innovation shows some pretty clear bias and though I will say that I prefer Nintendo's games over the competition I have nothing against loading my 360 for a round of Halo or going on an adventure in a game like The Witcher 2. By limiting yourself to only playing one companie's games you are pretty much forcing yourself to only enjoy those, and I have to admit that even I have been there before to the point where I was almost Nintendo elitist. Times have changed though and now I can see the good in all games and trust me when I say that there has never been a better time to be a gamer seeing as the variety is staggering.
@GreatPlayer I'm tired of hearing people complain about the NX. Nintendo already stated they don't plan on showing the thing until 2016, which would likely put its release sometime in 2017. In the fall of 2017, Wii U will be five years old, the same age that the Super Nintendo, N64 and GameCube were when they were replaced. It's really not a big deal, and it's completely normal. People need to stop whining.
Its cool that more game engines are available, but that doesnt mean people will use it to make new 3ds games.
but I would love to know how much more powerful the new 3ds is compared to the original. Havent seen any real numbers..but when you see games loading it seems to be significantly better.
@Kirk
Unreal 4 has a weird dashboard that I've never seen a program use before. You download the 50MB or so dashboard and install it, and then through the dashboard you download the engine itself, open the engine, check for updates, find tutorials, and stuff like that. Kind of confusing at first.
However, Unreal 3 was always a default FPS title. Unreal 4 has templates for a large variety of genres right from the start, pre-set cameras and the like. I haven't had enough time to go through all the tutorial videos, but it's really exciting so far.
@thesilverbrick
Nintendo already announced the NX. Following the timetable of GameCube, Wii, Wii U, and 3DS, going from official announcement to release is always less than 18 months. Most likely, we're looking at a November 2016 release for the system, and if I had to guess, I'd peg the investor meeting next February as around when they'll time showing the hardware itself.
We didn't even know the name of the Wii until the E3 in 2006, a few months before launch.
Nintendo has lots of time over the next 18 months to get the system ready for launch. At the latest, I'd estimate March 2017 for release, but since Iwata is talking about returning to "Nintendo like profits" well before that point, November 2016 seems most likely.
@Dpishere
I hope more people read your post.
@jasonbrr Specs of old and new 3DS
http://3dbrew.org/wiki/Hardware#New_3DS_Specifications
@Quorthon I think you've got your dates mixed up a bit.
Wii was first unveiled as a prototype console and controller at E3 2005, under the code name Revolution and wasn't released until holiday of the following year.
Wii U was called Project Cafe until it first surfaced as a prototype controller and console at E3 2011, and it wast released until (again) holiday of the following year, 2012.
NX is still a code name, much like Revolution and Cafe, and if the system shows for the first time at next year's E3, if the past is any indication, we won't see it until holiday of the following year, 2017,
I'm not saying a 2016 release is impossible, but given the consistent trends we've seen so far, it's more than likely that NX will receive a new name at some point, be shown as a prototype next year and release in fall of 2017.
@CrimSkies97 Thanks.
@thesilverbrick
No, sir, my dates are not mixed up. I'm not going by hardware reveal, only the official announcement. Nintendo needs to seize on the timeframe they have now laid out for themselves.
This E3 will be focused on the final major hitters for the Wii U, they won't bring NX out here. But they have plenty of time over the next year to continue the development and get it ready for a major reveal early 2016--well ahead of E3, which I think it will be. All of those E3 reveals occurred when Nintendo was still doing press conferences--which they don't seem interested in doing anymore.
Also, per the other machines, we didn't know what the XBO or PS4 looked like until the first half of 2013--the same year they released.
Here's the thing, the cat's out of the bag. No matter what, Nintendo is on a timetable and they need to hurry the hell up and get NX out. The risks in waiting until 2017 are thus:
1. Longer wait means higher consumer apathy. People lose interest quickly, and Nintendo cannot risk allowing NX to feel like vaporware as they have for the Quality of Life platform.
2. Fast-track to irrelevance. Now that we all know Nintendo has something, it benefits them to get it out sooner rather than later and it's going to be difficult for them to control all the information forever. The longer they wait, the bigger the risk that they launch losing whatever unique strengths the system might have. It's part of why they waited so long to show the Wii Remote, and waited even longer to show what it was used for.
3. Speed of tech. The tech and gaming industry moves and evolves faster than ever. This is not a place to sit on technology for 2.5 years--think about that, two and a half years between now and November 2017. It's highly unrealistic for them to keep this from the public eye for over a year or to hold off on releasing it for a staggering 2+ years.
4. Investor pressure. Investors and shareholders will only have so much patience for this crap. Nintendo needs to appease them, and the longer Iwata makes them wait while the Wii U struggles, the worse it's going to be.
5. PS4 and XBO. The PS4 and XBO are likely to follow the last generation in sales (switching places, however), which means a major uptick will occur in 2016~2019, which is what occurred with the X360 and PS3, sales skyrocketed in years 3, 4, and 5. It's hard to believe that this year is the 10 year anniversary of the launch of the X360, but holy crap, it is. The thing is, in the fall of 2016, Nintendo may still have a decent chance of garnering consumer attention, but to wait until 2017, when the XBO and PS4 will be largely unstoppable will be a huge mistake.
6. If it turns out to be a console to ultimately replace Wii U, 2016 is the right time to release it. The Wii U has a very light line-up and it's pretty clear Nintendo is spreading around titles in order to stretch releases. We're on the third year and the console still has lengthy droughts between major releases and there is almost no 3rd party support. The Wii U isn't just on life support, it's been running on fumes for months already. The Wii U isn't going to "turn around." There is no title that can do that at this point, especially is Mario Kart and Smash Bros didn't do it. The Wii U is not getting better, it's actually getting worse. The Wii U does not have the steam left to continue to limp through 2017.
7. Look how much interest this has already generated. The longer Nintendo waits, the more intense the conversations and anticipation will become, even as consumers by and large lose interest or move on to something else. The speculation alone can create problems for them and even create negative perception of the device if they wait too long.
Time is the biggest factor here. We know NX exists. It behooves Nintendo to get that thing out ASAP before they end up shooting themselves in the foot with it. The clock is ticking and it will be ticking down quickly for them. Miyamoto has already hinted that games are in development for it--specifically the next Mario. Zelda U could be moving there as well, and it would be better to start a bold new console with Zelda and Mario than to drop Zelda on a system slowly burying itself.
If they wait until 2017, all they'll do is ensure failure. November 2016 might feel too soon for Nintendo fans, but for Nintendo, it's arguably the best option--do it before the generation gets too deeply ingrained. Do it before Sony and MS have total control. Do it early enough that they aren't ignored as some kind of lazy stop-gap, and do it quickly before the Wii U tarnishes their image any further.
I understand that Nintendo fans feel it's "too early," and it may well be. But those same people will buy it anyway "because Nintendo", and for that matter, a gut reaction of "too soon," does not ally with the known information. Nintendo does not wait more than 18 months between announcement and release, and the time they did was with delays to the N64, and those delays are part of what hurt that machine. However, once the announcement is made, as it has been, Nintendo cannot hold off on this for long--they need to look like they're moving on it and they NEED to move on it sooner rather than later.
@Quorthon There you go again with adding the Wii to your "18 month timeline." Flat-out wrong, I told you. Revolution was officially announced in 2004, during E3, and given press for the following 2 E3s to build hype. Everyone KNEW it was a console, and nobody knows what NX is, you might be right, but even a broken clock is right twice a day. Don't pat yourself on the back just yet.
So far my N3DS experience consists of me having a pink cartoon rabbit yell at me while I play a crane game, some other fun/nonsense from demos, and trying to guess what Luffy is yelling at me in Grand Battle X.
I've rather thrown myself into the deep end with learning Japanese.
Unity will be a good addition, much like the DSi Shop was for that portable, but I think those are just appetizers. I'd really like to see some GameCube titles remastered for this thing (give me PN03, Star Fox Adventures, and SSX 3 on it and I'd never shut it off), but they definitely need two or three exclusives or significantly superior versions of new titles to kick out some additional systems. Otherwise it's going to whither over the next two years.
Oh, and Boo faceplates=awesome.
@Quorthon Please don't take any of this the wrong way. I do appreciate your points on this matter, and my goal here is not to cause a dispute, but rather present an alternate set of reasons as to why it could be detrimental to Nintendo's image to jump ship on the Wii U earlier than is customary for one of their consoles.
You do raise some good points, but allow me to examine them, one by one.
First of all, I believe the only reason Nintendo has jumped the gun and announced NX so early in the game was simply to quell the fears that they were going to abandon hardware development after announcing their smart device plans in association with DeNA. Granted, anyone who knows anything about console life cycles knows that development on a successor starts almost immediately after a console is released. I think that Nintendo had no initial plans to say anything about NX, but felt they needed to when they did so as to reiterate that they're in console manufacturing for the long haul.
1. Consumer apathy? What would make the average consumer more apathetic than to see the console they've just bought lose support a year earlier than typical? Rumblings about the Nintendo Revolution were making their way around the Internet even before E3 2005, and the Wii launched to commercial and critical acclaim, despite consumers waiting nearly two years after first hearing about it.
2. Sorry, but just because we know about the NX doesn't mean the average consumer does. We happen to stay up to date on announcements like these, but the average consumer has no idea what's going on. Case in point, only now are people starting to realize that the Wii U isn't an add on to the Wii. I don't think a brief mention of a code name in an investors meeting in Japan is going to get the average consumer excited enough to demand that their new console get replaced faster than normal. And as for those of us who did catch the announcement? I've heard more worry than excitement, with most people lamenting the replacement of Wii U. So, the average consumer doesn't know or care, and the majority of Nintendo gamers are irritated. It's best to let the Wii U ride out its full five years in the interest of keeping the fans happy.
3. Speed of tech is irrelevant. It's likely the NX is more conceptual than anything at this point. Official specs and horsepower are usually settled later in development. Console development cycles have always been around five years. Why is that suddenly too short?
4. The investors haven't cared about Nintendo hardware for a while now. They really just wanted smart device games, and they getting them. I'd say they've been satiated enough for Nintendo to wait a bit to release NX.
5. Nintendo hasn't been trying to directly compete with Sony and Microsoft since the GameCube days. You think they're suddenly going to jump back into direct competition with them? Granted, I see the value in what you're saying, but Nintendo is perhaps best known for doing their own thing and not caring about other hardware developers. What makes you think they suddenly are going to change that?
6. As far as releases go, remember that we're having this discussion just before E3, when release schedules look driest across the board. Rest assured there will be announcements very shortly, and perhaps then we can revisit this topic. And I will agree that Wii U will never be a sales darling at this point, but Nintendo has slowly started to turn a profit again, and it would be detrimental to alienate Wii U users by abandoning their console earlier than necessary, seeing as these people stand the greatest chance of supporting NX if it's released a bit later. Nintendo is making money again, and so it's not unreasonable to conclude that they can ride it out until 2017, especially if this stuff with DeNA rakes in more supplemental cash.
7. Since when has building hype been a bad thing? And all they did was give us a code name; they didn't even tease anything about the hardware, controller or games. The code name Revolution was floating around the Internet as early as 2004, and that didn't hurt the Wii, now did it?
For every argument you propose (and they are well thought out, don't get me wrong), there are logical counter arguments. The bottom line is the consumer is who ultimately decides Nintendo's success, and releasing NX too early stands a good chance to alienate them, and Nintendo can't afford to do that. Sega was too quick to upgrade their consoles over and over again when they were less than successful, and that proved to do more harm than good.
Then again, you might be right in the end, but if industry trends (and particularly Nintendo's own habits) are any indication, NX won't be here until 2017.
@Quorthon I agree with you on Nintendo games being violent. The difference is that the enemies usually disappear in a puff of smoke and leave behind coins and rupees instead of blood and entrails. So it usually gets a pass and is labeled as comic mischief.
@NebulaGamer If by "dying" you mean "finally turning a profit", then yes.
@Nintendian
Well, there's their "free advertising" for ya.
UNITYYYY Dave Chappelle's Rick James voice
@Nintendzoey I envy you.
@thesilverbrick your comment seems to be as long as the article lol
Next up: New 3DS also supports GBA virtual console games.
Call me crazy, but it seems like Nintendo is trying to prolong the 3ds's life until the NX is ready to drop.
OKAY! Okay, Nintendo. You keep revealing more and more that is only possible on a N3DS, enough so that in the near future i will be buying one and giving my precious red and black XL to my best friend... But seriously, I am still not happy with the current N3DS colors in the US.
@Hy8ogen nope, not crazy. I think you're spot on
Games like Isaac are my nr 1 reason for buying a new 3DS so I would love to see more of those awesome indies ^^
Unity on the 3DS isn't going to prolong the system's lifespan. Sure Unity on 3DS means a lot of things like new games and ports, but that's just that.
Also, it seems the comment section has derailed a bit. Hilarious.
@thesilverbrick
Fair enough. However, investors do care about Nintendo hardware or they wouldn't be investors, and I believe to say otherwise was a very weak counterpoint. Yes, they care about the mobile stuff, but they clearly care about the hardware as well because their money is on the line in that.
No, I don't expect Nintendo to start competing with MS or Sony--which is going to continue to be a big part of their problems in the industry. I also don't think the Revolution name was tossed around in 2004--just murmurs of a new console being in development. I couldn't find confirmation of this either way. However, as the XBO and PS4 grow stronger, it'll be that much harder for Nintendo to make a dent or be noticed. Iwata sure likes to pretend they're in competition while doing an about-face to fans and saying they aren't. He attempted to use cherry-picked Metacritic scores to show how much "better" they are then MS and Sony during the last investor meeting. Too bad all that perceived quality didn't come with sales.
True, E3 hasn't arrived, but look at what we know--Nintendo has delayed games more for the Wii U than pretty much any other console ever. The last Nintendo direct featured zero new game announcements. If they have a lot of stuff in development for the Wii U, they wouldn't be shuffling these titles around like they are--they are pretty clearly spreading them out to cover the widest range of time with the fewest titles possible and to ensure that they have "something" for the important fall season.
On top of that, Smash Bros and Mario Kart did not move systems--that's a bad sign. If those didn't sell consoles, nothing else is really going to. Splatoon no longer has the opportunity to do that, since it's gimped in ways that should be selling points. Which really irks me. I was hoping for it to be Nintendo's Left 4 Dead, but instead they want to pretend that everybody in the world is bad online, that we're all children needing protecting, and that people on teams should not communicate with one another, while proving that they don't know how to make an online game.
Suffice to say, they are very clearly moving into the winding down phase for the Wii U already. They did this with the N64, GameCube, and Wii. Once the next system was announced, their output took a drastic and obvious nosedive on the current platform. This is because Nintendo has easily and quickly given up on old hardware as soon as the new stuff is announced, and they've been doing this since the N64. Sony and MS, in the meantime, continue to support their platforms and consumers well after the successor machine is out--which helps consumer confidence.
Speaking of which--it's not there. Nintendo has, I think, far more consumer apathy with the Wii U than if they waste time clinging to NX for two and a half years. Sure, there are those of us with Wii U's now, but so what? Mine is almost never on at this point already since releases dried up. We have Splatoon next month, then two or three totally vacant months until something drops in August--which my understanding is that it will be Devil's Third--a game almost no Nintendo fans are going to buy as it is precisely the kind of game regularly targeted for hate on other platforms. I have another reason to want the Wii U to survive, but as a consumer, my apathy is already here. My PS4 is on almost every day. My Wii U never is. Granted, that's a personal anecdote, but I was a huge fan of this system when it launched as I thought it might be a return to form--finally a Nintendo system where I could play Nintendo games as well as great 3rd party titles, but that ship sailed faster than ever.
Will there be new games at E3? Yes, new to us. However, I expect last hurrah titles, some exciting ones--as whatever Retro is doing will surely be there--but little that will sell the console. Last year's E3 was Nintendo's most important--it was make or break time, and they had a good E3, but ultimately went "break" instead. I expect to see XCX dragged to E3 for a third time. I expect to see Fatal Frame--a game already out in Japan--to be trucked out. I expect Devil's Third to be talked about for maybe 3 minutes and promptly ignored. I expect to see nothing of Zelda U at all, but if shown, I would not be surprised if they mysteriously didn't show any GamePad features, as I expect it to either jump ship to NX, like Eternal Darkness, StarFox Adventures, and Pikmin 3 before it, or to pull a Twilight Princess to help boost NX.
Supporting Wii U for Nintendo is a losing proposition. As noted, they only turned to "profitability" over the last quarter because of exchange rates favorable to them. Not because they are selling more games and hardware. Nintendo was quick to dump the N64 and GameCube, and I expect them to be even quicker in dumping the Wii U. They simply do not design or plan their consoles for longevity anymore. There has yet to be a single Nintendo console to even have the staying power of the Xbox360 (well, the original GB-GB Pocket-GB Color line did, but that was boosted with several revisions and Pokemon), which hits it's 10-year mark this fall, and is still selling about as well as the Wii U. Which is bad for the Wii U, but surprisingly good for the X360. Who seriously just bought one of those yesterday? I thought I was late to the X360 party when I bought mine in 2008.
Again, the biggest part of this is that we know about NX. Miyamoto has made comments about the "next Mario, next console." They are clearly not beginning development on any more major Wii U titles, and are attempting to pad out the current ever-delayed crop of titles to cover the longest possible period of time. E3 will have a few new games, but I also expect them to continue doing what they've been doing--dragging out several titles from last year's E3 again--XCX, Devil's Third, Fatal Frame. Games we've know about for ages.
I think "burning Wii U owners" by putting out new hardware "too soon" is the least of their worries. They didn't have a problem bringing out the DS when the GBA was only four years old, and they won't have a problem bringing out the NX when the Wii U is only 4 years old. If they are indeed after another "Blue Ocean," then the last thing they're worried about right now is appealing to the few of us with the Wii U. They're more interested in getting Blue Ocean money again, however short term that, once again, turns out to be.
@Quorthon Perhaps that was poor wording on my part. Investors, to a limited degree, care about Nintendo hardware, but at this point they've shown again and again that their priority is on smart device games. Maybe I've missed it, but I don't seem to remember even one instance where an investor insisted that Nintendo make a new console. The investors got what they wanted and the rise in Nintendo shares shows that they're happy. The cash that comes in from this DeNA deal will more than keep them placated.
If Nintendo is going for that "blue ocean" like you said, then why would they line up their console to compete with Sony and Microsoft? The Wii was their first attempt at going for that "blue ocean" and it succeeded largely because they dared to be different. And, for theory's sake, let's say Nintendo captures lightning in a bottle again and wins back their "blue ocean". Do you think the millions of kids, grandmas and middle aged parents know about the NX announcement last month? Nope. They don't know and don't care, much like the Wii. People bought it, not because of what or when they heard in an investors meeting, but because it worked and was fun, and the buzz surrounding it only really started after release, even though the code name Revolution was leaked about two years prior. You're putting way too much emphasis on the simple mention of a code name, which is all it really is. We know absolutely nothing else. This might even be a handheld, for all we know. It's really hard to argue that people are salivating for this console when we don't even know if it'll plug into a TV or not. And Miyamoto commenting on a Mario game in development for it? How is that news? He threw that piece of information out there because it's painfully obvious. A Mario game on a Nintendo console? That's a given. You're making this announcement out to be far grander than it really was. It was a simple mention to appease gamers who thought this smart device thing would be then end of Nintendo hardware. That's it.
You must've missed what I said before, so I'll say it again. The mainstream doesn't know or care, and the majority of Wii U owners are upset. So if Nintendo holds back the NX, the public at large won't notice and their loyal customers will feel satisfied that they got a normal console life cycle. Nintendo can make a slow and steady profit, only increased by the incoming DeNA games. Who loses there? But can you imagine people who just bought a Wii U if they see the thing dumped already? There's no way they'll take the plunge on new hardware, fearing it'll be abandoned quickly, as well. Sure, the diehards will still buy it, but diehards alone can't support a system, as the Wii U has taught us.
There's a level of expectation with console life cycles. People expect them to be around for five years or so. Nintendo stands to cause a huge upset if they dump the Wii U too quickly. They'll be like Sega, who again and again moved on very quickly when their consoles didn't perform as well as expected. And where are they now?
You keep pushing the fact that "we know about NX." Technically, didn't we already know a new console was coming eventually? And what do we know about NX that makes it so pressing? Oh, wait. We know nothing. There's a Mario coming, and this is surprising? If they showed a controller, discussed the concept, teased or demoed something or even made mention of a surprise IP for the console I could see your point, but they simply confirmed something we already knew. Of course a new console is coming; they started on it immediately after the Wii U was released. Anyone who knows the games industry could've told you that. That announcement was in no way the earth shattering bombshell you make it out to be.
And as for personal anecdotes, I play my Wii U nearly daily, but that's just me.
And as far as the DS and GBA are concerned, remember they originally billed the DS as a third pillar of sorts. Yes, it did eventually phase out the GBA, but marketing it like that was a clever way of appeasing GBA owners while bringing its replacement to market. There's no way they could convince people that the NX is a companion to Wii U if it is in fact a home console, so that strategy won't work here.
I do realize that you and I could likely go back and forth on this for a long time, and while I do greatly enjoy talking to someone like yourself who makes compelling arguments, uses good grammar and frankly, isn't an idiot, I concede that it's unlikely either one of us is going to convince the other to abandon his viewpoint. I see and respect your points, but I honestly believe it's not as simple as abandoning the Wii U quickly. Oh, well. To each his own.
Tap here to load 79 comments
Leave A Comment
Hold on there, you need to login to post a comment...