News Article

Ronimo Games: PS4 And Xbox One Are More Of The Same, But Wii U Is "Something New"

Posted by Damien McFerran

Developers behind Swords and Soldiers II shower praise on Nintendo

As we reported recently, Ronimo Games is hard at work on Swords and Soldiers II for the Wii U, a sequel to the popular Wii title.

Speaking to Nintendo World Report, Ronimo's Joost van Dongen and Thomas Pathuis spoke a little about why they picked Nintendo's console and what it has been like to work with the company. In particular, they spoke about the advantages the Wii U has over newer systems, and how Nintendo has been extremely helpful during development — a process which actually began some time ago.

Joost van Dongen: We started this project over two years ago and well before the launch of the Wii U. We got early devkits from Nintendo and we thought it was really great. We wanted to do something with it and well, Swords and Soldiers is five years old now. We really felt like coming back to it. It is a great game, it is a great franchise and we wanted to do new things with it. Take it in new directions.

Thomas Pathuis: Also, with the Wii U, you have the new controller. So you have the possibilities to have touch gameplay on there and we really make use of that in this Swords & Soldiers sequel as well.

Joost van Dongen: Nintendo is really good to work with of course. They are really enthusiastic about the game, so we hope that they give it a nice spot in the eShop and do some marketing for us. Their tech support is really good. If we have questions, we always get answers at the end of the day.

In general, we love the new controller. The other new consoles, the PS4 and Xbox One, from our perspective they are just mostly the same thing as before but much faster. While Wii U has something new, this controller with the screen on it and it has touch and all these things that really weren't there yet.

You can check out the first gameplay trailer for Swords and Soldiers II below. Are you excited by this new title? Let us know with a comment.

[via nintendoworldreport.com]

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User Comments (101)

Artwark

#1

Artwark said:

Don't we all know that the Wii U is different compared to PS4 and ONE?

arderin64

#3

arderin64 said:

Really like the look of this. It seems indie games such as this are the future for WiiU as more & more of the multi-plat franchises depart.

DJaa

#4

DJaa said:

I hope they put awesomenauts on U aftert the installbase flourishes behind mario karts release.

Ryo_Hazuki-san

#5

Ryo_Hazuki-san said:

i agree played a ps4 this weekend and feels like a ps3 nothing new xbox one i will never try just looks like a huge vcr lol and wii u from the wii is the only one that literally feels like a new fresh start...

mostro328

#8

mostro328 said:

Great...they are the same just faster shinier and pretty no innovation just more power

dumedum

#9

dumedum said:

The new consoles outdated controllers really do look pathetic compared to the capabilities of the Game Pad.

noctowl

#10

noctowl said:

More of the same or not, I'm just as excited for Infamous as I am for Smash. Which console they are on doesn't matter for me.

TruenoGT

#11

TruenoGT said:

Hopefully Nintendo can carve out a niche for these like-minded, creative focused developers. Wii U + PC all the way.

datamonkey

#14

datamonkey said:

I hope they add a bit more strategy to the sequel as I found the original a bit boring in that you just kept producing as many units as you could. There wasn't really any more than that to the gameplay so I found it quite lacking...

Dinosaurs

#17

Dinosaurs said:

No! All consoles need to have all the same features all the time so everything is the same so no one has to miss out on anything anyone else is ever doing! Lol

gatorboi352

#19

gatorboi352 said:

More of the same? Well, based on sales numbers it looks like "more of the same" is what everyone wants.

"Nintendo is really good to work with of course. They are really enthusiastic about the game, so we hope that they give it a nice spot in the eShop and do some marketing for us"

Cue the 'NINTENDO DOESN'T NEED TO BE SUPPORTING 3rd PARTIES, ITS THE JOB OF THE 3rd PARTY TO MARKET THEIR OWN GAMEZ!!1!"

eye roll

Dark-Link73

#20

Dark-Link73 said:

They're not really "more the same". They're bulkier and uglier, lol! But seriously though, it doesn't matter how much Indie developers praise the Wii U, it'll fall in deaf ears. Big developers concern is only about money, and what brings money the fastest? "more of the same".

Emblem

#21

Emblem said:

Any idea when release is? Looks like it shouldn't be far off q3 maybe?

kensredemption

#23

kensredemption said:

I liked their games. I played S&S on the PS3 and Awesomenauts on my PS4 constantly. Glad to know they're still in business - and on the Wii U no less!

gatorboi352

#24

gatorboi352 said:

@JtotheY My point is, MS and Sony are supporting (and MARKETING, very key point) ALL the 3rd party games they can. Nintendo treats many 3rd parties and their offerings as second fiddle to their own stuff, save for Skylanders. Mario Zelda and DKC sit atop the eShop almost permanently while 3rd party titles only frequent the front page for the week of their titles releases. Sure Wii U has Call of Duty, Assassins Creed and many other mature titles the other consoles thrive on. Do they want you to know that though? Not in the slightest.

Nintendo has this weird fixation on 'the child'. And 'family gaming'. The problem is, all of their fans GREW UP on Nintendo and are now in their 30s and older. And family gaming is pretty much non existent outside of Wii Sports.

Whatever, sales speak louder than anything else, and the lack of sales on Wii U as finally forced Nintendo's hand, as reluctant as they were in admitting it.

I look forward to the next home console offering, devoid of Wii branding and anything to do with Wii Fit crowd a.k.a. the anti-gamer.

gatorboi352

#25

gatorboi352 said:

@vamkar

How so? Have you played either of those two consoles? If they are overrated, then they have A LOT of people fooled, because sales are humming along just fine for both.

gatorboi352

#27

gatorboi352 said:

@Senario Yes, the troll. Someone with a difference in opinion than your own. So now I'm a troll. Never mind that I'm offering up completely competent, accurate discussion points and being totally civil.

Haywired

#28

Haywired said:

@gatorboi352
What I find strange about the "more of the same" accusation is that "more of the same" is pretty much Nintendo's bread and butter. Not that I use that as a criticism at all, but that's what they do; Mario, Zelda, Mario Kart, Donkey Kong, Animal Crossing, Metroid, Kirby, Pokemon, etc. and have been for decades, so I don't know where this moral high-ground has suddenly appeared for Nintendo fans regarding "more of the same". This thread will be full of people accusing other companies of producing "more of the same", then their next comments on the site will probably be like "can't wait for Mario Kart 8/Smash Bros!"

Warbeard

#29

Warbeard said:

The Wii U is the best console ever created - It has enough power to run great looking games, it has a focus on local multiplayer (by far the best kind imo), but can still run on-line, AND it has a focus on assymmetric gameplay, a true hidden gem in my opinion.
Also, I like the sound the monkey says in their logo.

unrandomsam

#32

unrandomsam said:

@Warbeard Doesn't even support the best type of local mutliplayer (Console each with link cables). No compromises. The hardware cannot even drive 2 Gamepad's at 60fps never mind 4 which would be an interesting prospect.

AVahne

#33

AVahne said:

And? Dualshock 4 has a clickable touchpad. It may not be a screen, but it's still a touch input.
Anyway, as someone whose owned a Wii U since launch, I've yet to see anything truly revolutionary with it. It was great in the very beginning, but the excitement drained away pretty quickly. Right now I'm only excited to play Mario Kart 8, X, and SMT x FE; games where I mostly only expect general gameplay and graphics improvements over their predecessors and not the type of games to prove that the Wii U's gimmick is something that's truly "must-have". (I could probably be proven wrong with X though. Probably.)

HylianJowiStaff

#34

HylianJowi said:

To be honest, I strike a balance between the two positions on this one. My opinion is that Nintendo's hardware (both console and portable, especially in the last two generations) has offered developers many unique ways to take advantage of the features in its platforms. I love Nintendo games, always have and always will. At the same time, they are well behind on crucial online features and simply will not offer some fascinating third party content I can play on other systems. If I hadn't purchased a PS3, I'd never be able to play Ni no Kuni, Catherine, the Persona series... So many great games. I think it's sad that we limit ourselves to supporting one console when each one does bring something relatively different--both interface and game selection--to the table.

AVahne

#35

AVahne said:

@Lance168
How so? For displaying alternative information, you could hook up another monitor (I've seen people do this for flight sims) and for streaming games off your PC, you could use the NVIDIA Shield or various other products and services and get much higher range than the Wii U.
The only advantage I can see, is that the Wii U will have Mario Kart 8, which isn't even out yet.
So what advantages does Wii U have over PC?

Daemonite

#36

Daemonite said:

Of course they praise the WiiU.... They're not gonna talk bad about it, right before the release of their game on that particular console! When it turns out it sold like ****, THAT'S when you'll hear their actual sentiments towards Nintendo!

DefHalan

#37

DefHalan said:

Companies work with Nintendo and Wii U = praise System and Company.

Companies don't do anything for Nintendo or Wii U = useless piece of hardware... I think more companies should make games for Nintendo and Wii U lol

Trickbaby14

#39

Trickbaby14 said:

I love the fact that so many people's opinions are swayed by how well something sells. If a lot if people buy it it's got to be good. Whether it's the Sony Xbox or the Microsoft Playstation or the Twilight movies or the Backstreet Boys, sales will determine what's good and what's not.

gatorboi352

#40

gatorboi352 said:

@Haywired

Bingo. Nintendo is doing nothing different than their competitors in this regard. The real difference? Xbox brand and PlayStation brand aren't largely irrelevant like the Nintendo brand has unfortunately become. Thanks in large part to their incompetent Marketing dept., Nintendo has all but fallen off the map of the typical consumer. Even the Wii Blue Ocean consumer. They just don't care. Nobody does anymore outside of die hard fans, like the folks that frequent sites like these. #Headinthesand

gatorboi352

#41

gatorboi352 said:

@unrandomsam

And that's what baffles me the most. How do you introduce a new console where the main input device can only be used 1 per system? I mean they can't even get two (2) measly Gamepads to work with the console! Nintendo! The pioneers of local multiplayer! Unbelievable.

The #1 question asked to me when I show anyone my Wii U: "Can it use more than one of these tablet controllers?" Uhhh... well here's the thing....

Wilford111

#43

Wilford111 said:

I'm just glad SOMEONE is willing to work for the Wii U. Granted, it isn't a physical game (which is fine, but no one seems to care for digital releases), but I'm very much looking forward to this one.

nungi

#45

nungi said:

Think a lot of developers kno what the U is capable of and if they made a game with some quality in it it should do well and have lots of control options that the other 2 could never have .right now industry is waiting on Nintendo to once again show these rookies how its done instead of porting from ps and Xbox and putting it on Nintendo console with no xperience in what they doing and cry its too hard to make games for U.look at Ea and some other idiots who decide to not make games for U if they brought madden to U it would be much better than psxbox.Given ea give u a new game instead of some 3 year old port and expect moni for poopiedoggieoopsie.if games came out when they were suppose to instead if waiting for the other two.these developers sabotage the U and say its not nex gen it don't have a lot of power and I don't know what to do with gamepad cause I'm dumb and all this premature behavior about why I can't come up with something or why they made that ugly tablet controller guess some people are still playing video games 12 years in the past with the same controller and what grafix still look like a video game to me

Profanity is not necessary here -Lz

MrWalkieTalkie

#46

MrWalkieTalkie said:

This is why I love the Wii U. It's different. I don't hate the PS4 or XBONE, they're both really powerful and impressive. But, when playing with them, they really do feel exactly how they did last generation. And it doesn't bring a smile to my face. Wii U stands out so much more with its unique features and new ways to play. It's different, and that's wha makes it so fantastic. And I know different doesn't sell, "more of the same" is what sells. But it's a hell of a lot better than doing the exact same thing as the competition! Because with multiple consoles all with identical specs and features is pointless! At that point its just about brand rather than features. Wii U is different, and that's why I love it. I don't care that it doesn't sell, and I dont care what others say. So long as it can continue to bring a smile to my face with its many ways to play, that's all that matters.

MrGuinea

#47

MrGuinea said:

Yes yes yes. That's why I love nintendo because they keep innovating whereas xb and ps only do what they know.

nungi

#48

nungi said:

Yeah know why people bought psxbox to shoot poopiedoggieoopsie.came out with only shooters.i think majority of these people would be happy if Nintendo made shooters and grow up quickly and put Mario on something else.guess they really want Mario that bad after all, those saying its just another Mario game I'm sure the elements in shooters are they same thing from the days of quake but they run out and give them their moni anyway and they been playing the same thing for years and even in the future.im putting my money where my mouth is and supporting Nintendo with the good fresh xperiences I get with each game meanwhile this game looks nice but plays like poopiedoggieoopsie and still say its better than something new you're not use to

Profanity is not necessary here -Lz

hydeks

#49

hydeks said:

Yes, if you consider making the 500th 2D Mario game innovative, or a big screen in the middle of your controller that no one has found a good use for, then yes, Nintendo is innovative.

Honestly people, Nintendo Sony and Microsoft all don't innovate, they all play it safe and just want to make games they know will make the quick buck that will pay for these over expensive game developments, its why Nintendo shoves Mario down our throats, Microsoft and Sony shove the M rate/shooters down our throats, they need the money, why the franchises that didn't make much money you don't hear from anymore (Star Fox, F-Zero, lots of Sony's PSOne franchises).

This developer should have just said the truth: we prefer Nintendo, just like you guys do, and they can't figure out why all the hate towards Wii U.

bmprsvz777

#50

bmprsvz777 said:

Just imagine world without Wii U, we have 3 "next gen" consoles on the market, all have 8-core AMD CPU and PC-like architecture, all have "classic controller", all have the same third party games... a bit boring in my opinion.
I have 2 small children and OFF TV feature is just perfect for this situation, gamepad is what makes Nintendo console different. I can still play even when children want to watch TV. Would there be PS4 Remote Play on PS Vita if there was no such thing on Wii U? I doubt it. So again Nintendo came with new idea which was just copied by others as before (e.g. motion control). Whether you like Nintendo or not you have to accept that they keep innovating and make gaming better even for gamers on other consoles.

Savino

#51

Savino said:

More of the same = 10 millions units in a few months.

Something new = 6 millions in more than a year.

Well......

@bmprsvz777 Would there be PS4 Remote Play on PS Vita if there was no such thing on Wii U?

Probably! Sony has been toying around with remote access since the PSP launch, so I really believe that they would implement this on vita anyways!

nungi

#52

nungi said:

The U is the better machine hands down in this generation and all that hardware spec poopoodoodoocacapoopledoopledoggiepoop that people are looking at like they know what that means and tell them translate all that power into making a new experience and they still come up with something that's been done over and over with a likle twist and want your moni.might as well play the original and forget about buying a port of a port
Please watch the profanity — TBD

MysticX

#53

MysticX said:

@Trickbaby14 I don't know about music or movies, but with game consoles more sales = better support (more games) = a console that's a better investment.

How good is innovation when it's something most people don't want? Are there that many games that do anything interesting with the WiiU semi-tablet? I'm honestly curious here...

Caryslan

#54

Caryslan said:

@bmprsvz777 Nintendo did not create the idea of off TV play. Sony did it years before with the Playstation 3 and the PSP with Remote Play. The only reason why we heard little about it was because it required two systems to use, and only a few PS3 games supported the feature.

But, remote play does allow PS3 owners to play dics-based PS1 games on the PSP.

So, Sony beat Nintendo to the punch with this idea. Although, I would say Nintendo took the idea, refined it and managed to make it a standard feature on the Wii U.

dumedum

#55

dumedum said:

Every time there's a developer looking positively on Wii U or people commenting positively about their love of Wii U you need the two or three people to come and say "but.... But.... More people buy the other consoles and websites told me that nintendo is gimmicky and childish.. Stop liking Nintendo stuff and yield before what other people say is more next geny.... "

Volke93

#56

Volke93 said:

Saint words. Also (for now) despite the low sales, Wii U has more quality games (New Super Mario Bros U+New Super Luigi U, Pikmin 3, Super Mario 3d World, Wonderful 101, Zelda Wind Waker HD and Donkey Kong Country Tropical Freeze) than PS4 and Xbox One (The only DECENT exclusive, PS4 has for now is Infamous and is even worse than the predecessor, while Xbox One for now has only Titanfall). And also, considering that the two console haven't retrocompatibilty with the predecessors' games while Wii U has it, I'm actually really surprised that they're selling more than Wii U (actually One, is not going so strong, PS4 on the other hand), those two systems are ridicously overrated....

Hy8ogen

#57

Hy8ogen said:

@Volke93 Same here. It just leads me to believe that people nowdays buy stuff based on hype alone. Over here in Vancouver you can already see people selling their PS4s on CL and Kijji. People should really think before they buy.

Volke93

#59

Volke93 said:

@Hy8gen: also.... Sony is publishing it's console pratically making fool of the people. I'm italian and in my country I found a commercial for Infamous that says (I traduce in english for you) "The best games are only on Playstation 4"...... seriously Sony? Your console has only 3 exclusives for now, two bad and one only ok, and you make a commercial like that? And the sad thing is that people believe it and they really buy the console.... poor world....

Caryslan

#60

Caryslan said:

@Volke93 That's not really a fair comparison, given the PS4 and Xbox One have only been on the market for a few months. Think about how sorry the Wii U's libary was until Pikmin 3 arrived in August of last year. All consoles have a period between their launch and the second wave of major games where there are only a few gems to play.

The Wii U has had a year and a half to build its library. Give the PS4 and Xbox One the same time before you play the "better library card"

And its not all people blindly buying a system based on hype and blindness. Look at what has already been announced for the PS4 and Xbox One.

Halo 5, Kingdom Hearts 3, Final Fantasy XV, Batman: Arkham Knight, Assassin's Creed Unity, Wolfenstien: The New Order, and Elder Scrolls Online.

Keep in mind, that's a short list and many of those games are not coming to the PS3, Xbox 360 or the Wii U.

People often buy a video game console as a investment. I'm sure there were people who bought a 3DS or Wii U due to the promise of eventually getting a Smash Bros, Zelda, or Pokemon game.

Many of those same people are buying a PS4 or an Xbox One now. Yeah, the library on both platforms is barren right now, but the major titles are coming pretty soon.

So no, I don't think people who are buying a PS4 or an Xbox One are being foolish. Were the people who bought a 3DS over the promise of Pokemon or a Wii U because the new Smash Bros game fools as well?

Honestly, why do people act like systems launch with all their major hitters and don't suffer droughts. Have people forgotten what the post launch of the Nintendo 64, PS2, Xbox, and Gamecube?

Those were just as bad(if not worse) than what the PS4 and and Xbox One are going through. It happens with every system.

Volke93

#61

Volke93 said:

@Caryslan But can I know what's the matter in you? What's the matter with ALL of you?! Why all you want Nintendo dead after all the things it made for over 30 years to us?!

QuickSilver88

#62

QuickSilver88 said:

Its funny how anytime any dev says anything positive about Nintendo or WiiU droves up people come out to diss them or the statement. When Shinen and Retro said WiiU had good power and grafx capability the trolls came out in droves. Yet both these companies have produced some of the best looking games in history...so yeah I want to believe the trolls instead of real developers with game credentials. Pathetic. Devs are entitled to their opinions. WiiU is an interesting box and already has some very unique titles. Iwata admitted Nintendo dropped ball on making the gamepad compelling....so lets see what happens now as Nintendo does have a track record of making adjustments and having success. Also to those raving about ps4/xb1 sales......PS4 has sold impressively but after a strong weak 1 in Japan it fell off a cliff. XB1 has already slowed a lot and has zero viability in Japan. Titanfall has not caused any mass increase is sales as most FPS fans buought the XB1 at launch and for that game. So keeping momentum is the trick and WiiU actually had a good Nov/Dec but has slumped since......I think we will see this for all the majors until more content is out and prices come down.

Bolt_Strike

#63

Bolt_Strike said:

In theory, it is something new. But in practice, many of the games being released are just more of the same. It's a shame, there are some actually unique ideas that can be done with it (ZombiU is a good example) if you're clever enough, but no one seems to want to give it a chance, not even Nintendo for whatever reason.

ikki5

#64

ikki5 said:

Well, the Wii U is really the only system that is not just an upgrade from the last. It has new potential experiences where as the other are just the same with better hardware than the last.

Caryslan

#65

Caryslan said:

@Volke93 Where in the world did I say that I want to see Nintendo die or be driven out of business? I own a 3DS and a couple of 2DSes, I have owned virtually every Nintendo platforms that has come out over the years. And contrary to what you think, I want the Wii U to be a successful system. In fact, I'm hoping to get a Wii U sometime this year!

But I'm not going to blindly praise Nintendo like they are the perfect company, nor am I going to spew venom at Sony and Microsoft for no good reason.

Don't get me wrong, I agree that the PS4 and Xbox One are not worth the money right now. I think they are very expensive systems that offer little over the PS3 or Xbox 360 at this point in tme. Now, my opinion will likely change in a few years after both platforms get their major titles. Just like my opinion of the Wii U has shifted.

Also, before anyone thinks I bash Nintendo only, let me say this. I have bashed Sony and Microsoft as well over the years. For Sony, I think their handling of the Vita has been pathetic, and they have done little to save their dying handheld. For Microsoft, I don't like some of their business polices.

So, I'm not hoping Nintendo goes out of business. I think Nintendo has a unquie place in gaming, and I think the market would be worse off if they got pushed out.

At the same time though, I'm not going to give them a free pass for everything they do either. They are a company that wants my money. I have every right to call them out as a consumer. But the same goes for Sony and Microsoft. None of the big three get a free pass.

Bolt_Strike

#66

Bolt_Strike said:

@ikki5 It almost is, though. It's basically an HD Wii with a tablet controller, there isn't that much it can do that the Wii, DS, and 3DS can't.

JaxonH

#68

JaxonH said:

@noctowl

I wholeheartedly agree that I get just as excited for a good game regardless of platform, unfortunately, rarely does a game on other platforms compare. I just received Infamous, and, well, it's about what I expected, let's just say that. I enjoy other games on other platforms, but Infamous and MGSV just confirmed what I've always believed- that even the most hyped games on other platforms can't come close to comparing to a good first party title. They're fun, and I'll play em, but when it comes down to it, pretty much every major 1st party title on Wii U has been more enjoyable.

BUT, there are those rare exceptions that I'm waiting for, like Witcher 3, Kingdom Hearts 3 and Final Fantasy 15. The few games that can actually rival Nintendo games as far as fun is concerned...

ICHIkatakuri

#69

ICHIkatakuri said:

@Caryslan I think most people on these pages could see you were being objective you shouldn't have to defend your opinion. I am an early adopter of the wii u (day one) and that drought this time last year was super sh!t, thank goodness for monster hunter. I'm currently thinking about getting a ps4 after the morpheus and gakai/psNow announcements it's looking promising. It's a pain when a new gen kicks off, a lot of waiting and speculation, about two years from now everyone's going to be shouting about it being the best generation ever again.

noctowl

#70

noctowl said:

@JaxonH yeah, for sure. As much as I enjoy infamous, uncharted and most of those sony exclusives, I almost always just play them one time. Beat the game and it goes on my shelf forever. I lose count of how many times I've replayed first party Nintendo games.

JaxonH

#71

JaxonH said:

@Caryslan

I like that you have insight, so allow me to provide some further insight on top of what you have already stated.

Yes, Sony did have the idea of remote play first with the PS3. HOWEVER, that's all it was- remote play, nothing more. Nintendo, on the other hand, has implemented something much more useful than just off-screen play- the controller can work in tandem with the TV screen to provide various new gameplay experiences, which we've seen a great span of in the library of Wii U games thus far. And THAT is something that Nintendo was doing with 2 screens long before Sony ever dreamed up Remote Play on PS3.

Nintendo was using this 2 screen concept with the 3DS before Wii U, and with the DS before that, and with Gamecube/GBA connectivity before that, and if you really wanted to, you could date it all the way back to Game & Watch in the 80's, when the dual screen concept was first born. So in truth, the Wii U gamepad is just fully realizing a concept they'd been running with for decades.

micronean

#72

micronean said:

Really, the PS4 and Xbox One aren't bringing anything all too different to gaming. The only "new" things they bring to the table are slightly more detailed graphics and options to stream your game. That's about it. Their strength lie in the NAME that backs those machines up, and the corporate 3rd parties that are drawn to them. but really, Sony and MS software is just what PC games were in the 90s that are played on a different platform.

Nintendo is no better though. but at least they do bring in a different interaction with their software, with remotes, touchscreens, and the balanceboard+pedometer. But, yes, they do somewhat seem to be held back by sticking to their legacy of family computing. That is where they are restrained by the reality of business and their OWN corporate identity.

Linkuini

#73

Linkuini said:

SWORDS AND SOLDIERS BEER AND RUUUUUUUM!

Sorry, what were you guys arguing about?

DRINKING FIGHTING HEEEERE WEEEEE COOOOOME!

Nevermind, I'll come back in a week when that song isn't stuck in my head anymore. ;)

eaglebob345

#74

eaglebob345 said:

@QuickSilver88 @dumedum People act like when someone is down, they have to keep kicking them, and if someone else says something nice it is wrong. Just because a few third party companies want to attack Nintendo and their fanbase with quite childish attitudes doesn't mean they're right in what they say. Just because Nintendo's fanbase doesn't particularly like yearly FPS, yearly AC, yearly sports games, gimped ports, ports of old games, and crappy half-a**ed games doesn't make us children. I think games like The Elder Scrolls, Bioshock, and Mass Effect could have done well on the Wii U (I have ME3, wish we had the Trilogy, but oh well, not worth another console to me), and I know FF and KH games would do well on the Wii U.

element187

#77

element187 said:

@gatorboi352 indies need the assistance. When he says marketing, he means having the banner for his game on the eshop so he can get some visibility.

But I don't see why anyone would expect Nintendo to take on marketing of a big time publisher like EA. EA has deep pockets, they can sell their own games.

element187

#78

element187 said:

@Caryslan ps3/ps4 + vita streaming has terrible latency, it kills the experience. The Wii U is near zero latency. Vita remote play on the same local network as the PS4 is a whopping 160ms. On a local network that should be 10ms. Wii U gamepad streaming has lower latency than many HDTV's

Edit: I thought the latency on the vita remote play performed better than it does, but I just googled it and its much worse at 160ms latency. That's completely worthless.

Nomad

#79

Nomad said:

Love the Gamepad. Say what you will about it but there's no doubt that it's fun to play with.

gage_wolf

#81

gage_wolf said:

I love that his feedback on the Wii U sums up to "Yeah, it's great, you can can use the touch screen...and...touch stuff. IT'S NEW."

gage_wolf

#82

gage_wolf said:

Also, the common sentiment around here that PS4 and Xbone aren't bringing anything new to the table while Nintendo is innovating up a storm with the Wii U, is kind of a joke. It doesn't matter what new fiddly knobs and accessories the consoles have, it's what the devs do with the games.

midnafanboy

#84

midnafanboy said:

this game looks interesting, i never played the first one though maybe i should try it when i have money.

midnafanboy

#85

midnafanboy said:

@Volke93 Well the ps4 is all about graphics so yeah people will buy it cause its next gen. Not caring about the story or anything else nowthats what i think.

Bizzyb

#86

Bizzyb said:

Bu-but the PS4 controller has a LIGHT on it and a touchpad AND a speaker! Also the Xbox1 controller has RUMBLE shoulders. That's next gen right there.

QuickSilver88

#87

QuickSilver88 said:

@eaglebob345

Yeah I guess kick em while their down is an old theory and it seems like a valid one for Nintendo's competitors. It just amazes me how gamers/trolls or whoever they are seem to have so much time to always come to Nintendo forums and dog Nintendo products. Like who cares what they think? I game on all systems (as many committed gamers do) and I can find pros/cons to all systems. In web sites supporting other systems I rarely see Nintendo people crashing and trashing like I do here and at other Nintendo centric sites. People either get Nintendo or they don't. I understand that as Nintendo attempts to be different and also has its roots in 2D gaming, so they may not appeal to some post-ps1 gamers. The strange thing is the haters never talk about what they like, what they find fun....they never consider 'fun' a factor as specs and blowing stuff up is all that matters apparently. Nintendo makes many fun/entertaining games and a good portion of them are very challenging. Completing DKTF has been a hell of a lot harder than beating Tomb Raider, Last of Us, Beyond Two Souls and many other 'mature' games I played last year. Most posters spewing hate about Nintendo games have likely never even played them so their opinions are uniformed tripe.

Action51

#88

Action51 said:

@gage_wolf said: "Also, the common sentiment around here that PS4 and Xbone aren't bringing anything new to the table while Nintendo is innovating up a storm with the Wii U, is kind of a joke. It doesn't matter what new fiddly knobs and accessories the consoles have, it's what the devs do with the games."

What the devs do with the games?

We've yet to see the PS4 and XB1 come out and do anything revolutionary with their games, but it's not Nintendo so the same criticism is hand waved. Even the mega hyped Titanfall is a decent...but pretty much typical MP shooter with no single player campaign...Nothing revolutionary.

Still...it's not Nintendo so the sequels and "more of the same" is okay!

@eaglebob345

" It just amazes me how gamers/trolls or whoever they are seem to have so much time to always come to Nintendo forums and dog Nintendo products."

It's not that surprising when you consider that quite a few are hired by marketing people, or "astro-turf" paid posters.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Astroturfing
Quite a few more are what is known as "hate dumb":
http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/HateDumb

Hate dumb is a cleverly named counterpart to "fandom". People who spend an inordinate amount of time and effort hating some celebrity or media in the same way an obsessive fan spends time praising them.

QuickSilver88

#89

QuickSilver88 said:

@gage_wolf
I hear what you are saying and I agree that it is not fair to say that Sony and MS are not providing platforms that allow developer innovation. What Nintendo does is provides a differentiated experience. I generally own and play all systems, and the truth is you can get largely the same experiences on PS/XB or PC. They each have their strengths and some exclusives, but they in large offer the same types of experiences. Since Sega bombed as a hardware manufacturer Nintendo is really the only player that offers something different. Obviously a lot of gamers don't care for that something different, and that is fine, but without Nintendo the gaming world would look awfully dull. IMO all the gaming companies are shying away from risk these days because the cost of failure is oblivion. In general more powerful hardware does lead to game innovations so lets wait and see what we get in the coming years with these PC knockoff consoles.

Action51

#90

Action51 said:

@QuickSilver88 well said.

As a PC owner, my last upgrade for well under the cost of a new PS4 or XB1 made my PC superior to them in specs for gaming and of course far superior as a streaming/social media machine.

I'm not saying anything is wrong with those new systems, but they are more or less a proprietary PC of medium to low horsepower with a few key exclusives. I'm just not that excited for games like Titanfall or Killzone.

gage_wolf

#91

gage_wolf said:

@Action51

Well I do think it's a tad early to start calling out the PS4 and Xbone, as they haven't been out in the wild very long at all. Regardless, I own a Wii U and since Nintendoland I haven't seen anything that I would call "innovative." I've played some great games,sure, but I wouldn't call very polished platformers "revolutionary."

And I think you should be careful with the "Sequels and "more of the same"" argument, as Nintendo are also very guilty of that as well. I would venture to say the PS3 offered just as many, if not more new franchises and experiences as the Wii did. Don't let the Killzones and Titanfalls blind you to a lot of great games that have hit the non-Nintendo systems, that's like somebody saying "Nintendo only has Mario!" Which we all know to be false.

gage_wolf

#92

gage_wolf said:

@QuickSilver88

I totally agree that Nintendo is integral to video game culture, but I also don't think that gives them a free pass for a pretty disappointing console launch and release library. I have no interest in really comparing the Wii U with the PS4 or Xbone, as I do think the Wii U is a different beast. But being different doesn't equal better. I've yet to see Nintendo use the game pad in a meaningful way that isn't a mini-game, ala Nintendoland or Wii U Party. Journey, for PS3, was one of the most unique experiences I've had in a game in some time, and I played it with a good ol' Dualshock. I think Nintendo is starting to assume that new / weird accessories make for new experiences, which I just don't think holds up over time. New games make for new experiences.

QuickSilver88

#94

QuickSilver88 said:

@gage_wolf
Not sure Nintendo got a free pass on releasing a disappointing console and launch library....they have been getting hammered pretty hard both by financial analysts and gamers. I also think Nintendo took a risk with Gamepad...I think they were foolish enough to believe the WiiU could provide a convergence machine for tablet and console gamers. The problem is they failed to understand Tablet gamers have little interest in consoles or deep games. Second screen gaming could be very cool if properly implemented and I hope they find a way to get there. I will give you 3 very viable game design ideas for WiiU and gamepad.

1. An NFL simulation game. You play as coach and use the gamepad to choose and design plays, manage rosters/subs and then perform audibles, line shifts and hot reads by touch before and during the play, while the action plays out like a real game on the big screen. Support of 2 gamepads would be ideal for local play so each coach has their own 'clipboard'. Madden has nearly ruined football as it has basically been the same damned game since the Genesis.

2. A Diablo/Champions of Norath type game....where 1-4 players use pro controllers and play hack and slash on the big screen while the dungeon master uses the Gamepad to control/create the dungeons. The DM sets traps, alters the maps, places random encounters and then plays as the bosses during the boss battles.

3. A Wing Commander type space opera.....mixed with an empire building SRPG with a trading component The player uses the gamepad to build ships/bases and such to manage and deploy their assets. Also the gamepad is used for the trading component. Then the space combat battles take place on the big screen ala wing commander. It would be open world but also story driven and then have an online component where players could fight for galactic domination.

Now those 3 game concepts could be implemented on WiiU and would have appeal to mainstream gamers. I am just a techie guy with a history in gaming going back to the first games in the late 70s.....I and others have 'envisioned' some very interesting uses for 2 screen gaming with gamepad.....my question is where the hell is this innovation in the gaming sector, why isn't EA, Ubi, and especially Nintendo thinking like this?

Others have said this and it is somewhat true which is for true async gaming like the games I am describing above it is going to require almost building two game engines....one for the gamepad and one for the big screen. This is going to take time, money and risk. I can understand 3rd parties not wanting to go down that road as the product would not translate well to other platforms and WiiU doesn't have the installed base to justify the risk. Still WiiU is Nintendo's baby and they should be designing these type games and taking the risk as they put the hardware out. If Nintendo would build this unique/must have experience and create some reason to own a WiiU (other than playing their great existing franchises) then maybe EA or Ubi or someone would say hey it can be done and there is a market for this type of experience. So far dual screen gaming has mostly been either an enhancement or a gimmick, but I don't believe it has to be and I think it could lead to an incredibly immersive experience if done properly.

Also....a comment on your response to Action51.....I agree that Sony has done more with new IPs than Nintendo. Nintendo hasn't really had any new IPs in years. Mini game collections and Wii Sports has been about it hasn't it? Pikman, ED, and Geist were new franchises on the GC. The frustrating part as a Nintendo fan is that they have all these great IPs and they let them rot. I want a new Metroid (2D and 3D), I want a new Startfox (traditional and Starfox adventures), I want a new WaveRace, Excitebike/truck, F-Zero. I want a new 3D Donkey Kong. I want a true Pokémon RPG on a console that has cross over features with 3DS. How about an advance wars on WiiU. I want GC and N64 on WiiU VC. It seems most Nintendo diehards want the same things, yet Nintendo seems to want to crank out more Mario and more platformers (which I love and Nintendo does best). My hope is WiiU gets some boost from MK8 and SSB this year and with a larger base Nintendo will then focus on these less profitable titles we all love. Even if WiiU only does 25-30mil units but gives us some of these great franchises and a truly worthy 2 screen game then I would be pleased and so would many other supporters.

gage_wolf

#95

gage_wolf said:

@QuickSilver88

"2. A Diablo/Champions of Norath type game....where 1-4 players use pro controllers and play hack and slash on the big screen while the dungeon master uses the Gamepad to control/create the dungeons. The DM sets traps, alters the maps, places random encounters and then plays as the bosses during the boss battles."

This. This is the kind of stuff I'd love to see happening on the U. The asymmetrical game play stuff was what really captured my attention in the first place. They gave us such as small taste of it at the beginning with Mario Chase, Ghost Mansion, and even ZombiU, but since then the game pad implementation has been pretty minor. I think you've really hit the point home that people should be seeing the gamepad as an outlet of creativity and new concepts instead of just... a portable version of the big screen.

If Nintendo is going to plow their own path, as they are seemingly determined to do. They need to go all the way, and lead the charge. Coming off the heals of the mega-successful game-changing Wii, I think Nintendo was amped up on the idea of further stretching the boundaries of console gaming, and for that I applaud them. Unfortunately, after the first launch titles it seems as though they changed course and opted to play it really safe instead.I still can't believe how minor a role the game pad played in Super Mario 3D World and the new DK. To me that sends a mixed message to not only the consumer, but also other devs - "Welp we can't really think of cool ways to use this really expensive bulky device we insisted would really change the way you played games a year back... but here's some great games we think you're fairly familiar with instead."

WebHead

#96

WebHead said:

Kinda true honestly. I doubt we'll ever see a game like The Wonderful 101 on PS4 or XBO.

Action51

#97

Action51 said:

@gage_wolf you managed to carefully and conveniently miss my point on almost everything. First off, the "more of the same" argument is constantly leveled at Nintendo...so yeah...I'm saying we're getting more of the same from other developers and publishers too. How many Assassins Creed, Arkham, Call of Duty, Forza, Uncharted, Splinter Cell, Need for Speed and so forth in how many years?

For the record, I LIKE some of those franchises and play some of them on PC...but they are churning out sequels and DLC faster then Nintendo with even it's core franchises. You might be able to make a case for Mario if you include 2D, 3D, and some spinoff franchises if you insist on making a comparison, but not much else.

You know it's been a little over a year for the Wii U, but the calls of doom started just mere months after it was released. Now we have Wonderful 101, Pikmin 3, Super Mario 3D world, Monster Hunter 3 Ultimate, Lego City Undercover, Donkey Kong: Tropical Freeze, Zombie U, and yes even New Super Mario/Luigi Bros U, and Windwaker HD to round things out.

That's a solid list of exclusives with a decent variety of genres that mostly managed to score very well on Metacritic. Some of those titles even manage to make special use of the gamepad and provide innovative gameplay.

I'm sure we'll have some innovative games come to XB1 and PS4...just as innovative games have come to the Wii U. We aren't hearing the same cries of "where's the games" and "where's the innovation" while they sport even less impressive launch line ups and face stints of game droughts.

On the other hand, you can always just ignore all the positives and do what you intend to do: bash Nintendo and hold them to standards you would never hold the other console manufacturers to.

I'm just calling it as I see it.

Action51

#98

Action51 said:

@QuickSilver88 you argue that Sony makes more new IP then Nintendo, then go on to bash Nintendo for not using enough of their old IP while ignoring the fact that Sony pushes it's successful IP like crazy when they can (Gran Turismo, Uncharted), but they simply don't have as many powerhouse IPs that are....get this...so consistently well crafted and well received as Nintendo franchises. Sorry.

Every major developer churns out games for their popular IP for exactly as long as the market supports them. Nothing more.

Proving my general point that too many "gamers" are simply never happy and thrive on finding anything to complain about, even contradicting themselves in the process.

QuickSilver88

#99

QuickSilver88 said:

@Action51

Funny but true....lol. Also by no means put me in the 'unhappy' gamer category. I am a very happy gamer. I have so many damned systems and such a huge backlog of games I will never be caught up. Also my arguments aren't totally contradictory as I am talking about two different companies that behave differently. Let me do the inverse.....Sony has pushed how many fricking ratchet and clank games, a series I like but am a little burned out on. Yet they only put out one sly game in the last how many years an have abandoned Jak and Daxter all together since ps2/psp.

So put it all down as observations and you tell me......wouldn't you like to see both some of Nintendo's unused IPs as well as something new from them?
In the end we all know the motivating force and that is MONEY. Companies push the IPs they can thrive off of and tend to ignore those that do less numbers. That is why Metroid and Fire Emblem and Starfox don't see the action that the plumber does. Nintendo is fairly consistent in that most their IPs do make it out each generation (with the exception of a damned 2D Metroid). Still don't mistake me as unhappy or a complainer.....I have it all in life and gaming is just one part of an overall excellent existence.

Action51

#100

Action51 said:

@QuickSilver88 I don't entirely agree, but you're coming from a reasonable point of view on that, so I can respect your opinions.

Too often we see the trend of people giving other developers and platforms a complete pass where they scream bloody murder at Nintendo.

One example is the hate Nintendo gets over "game droughts" that PS4 gets a free pass on. At this time in the Wii U's life it was being raked over hot coals for lack of new games and delays...while PS4 is going through the same thing right now with gaming media just hand waving it off. (I don't want to get into arguments over minutia regarding which platform has X title available when...they both had similar post-launch droughts and delayed releases)

Another example is the common "rehash" and "milking franchises" accusation. It's just not fair to single out Nintendo for something the entire industry does...and often times more blatantly and frequently then Nintendo.

Anyway, that's my rant!

QuickSilver88

#101

QuickSilver88 said:

@Action51
You also make some valid points and I don't consider it too much of rant. Really all new consoles go thru 'droughts' in year one and I told people dogging the WiiU that ps4/xb1 would be going thru the same thing this year. I am honestly surprised Infamous and Titanfall came out on time. As you said we have already seen many 2014 titles pushed back to 2015. I really wish more publishers would push back as launching something like BF4 was embarrassing and then taking a great old franchise like Thief, and bringing it back with a mess of a game just makes me cringe.

I also 1000% agree with you on the rehash/sequels point. Shiggy talked about this last year saying Nintendo doesn't believe you need new IPs to promote new gameplay innovations and that the fact is established IPs have recognition and a better chance of success. All you have to do is look at how Mario, Zelda, Metroid have morphed over the generations and games to debunk the 'cranking out rehashed crap' argument. I guess if you don't like a type of game then more of the same probably does feel like rehashing. I find COD or BF crap, but I don't like online/military FPS....while I loved the 4 Uncharted games even though the gameplay was pretty much identical because I like the characters, stories, and production values.

Nintendo just gets held to a higher standard and that is why they don't get any free passes. In many ways they are a victims of their own success because they have consistently put out more critically acclaimed games than anyone else. As long as they meet their own high standard I think we will all be in great shape. I am currently buried with content for the 3DS/WiiU. Some people must just play games 16 hours a game because I have a hard time finishing a couple games per month.

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