News Article

Talking Point: The Nintendo Network ID Creeps Ever Closer to Being Fit for the Modern Age

Posted by Thomas Whitehead

There's still some distance to go

Since the Wii U launched with its shiny new Nintendo Network ID system, we've been both pleased and frustrated with its implementation. The fact it's tied to the home console hardware has led us to be critical, on occasion, to the point where we once rather cruelly equated it to the abomination of its equivalent on the Wii and, until December, the 3DS.

Yet the term Network ID is only partly right: yes, it’s an ID that manages online interactions, which is excellent, but it’s also locked to one system. It’s not engaging with the cloud and opening up your Wii U experience, it’s chained to your console. If you want to be really, really harsh, you could call it a glorified Friend Code.

As we admitted, that's being really, really harsh, but there's an element of truth to the matter. Since those words were written we've had subtle reminders that the Network part of the name is indeed relevant, as it's used to login and use the rather neat web browser version of Miiverse; 32GB owners also have the Nintendo Network ID Premium promotion, essentially loyalty points that are turned into funds that, from December, will in theory be good for spending on the 3DS — though 3DS purchases won't accumulate these points, naturally (Update: as pointed out to us, this was the case anyway as it was a redeemable code. This joint funds system will simply add convenience). The ID and Wii U software of Miiverse and the Friend List make adding friends much easier than before, while we've seen improved online multiplayer gaming — compared to most examples on Wii — on occasions when developers have actually endeavoured to implement it.

So improvements have been creeping in, with the recent Nintendo Direct announcements of shared eShop funds and Miiverse on the 3DS finally bringing Nintendo Network IDs to the handheld device. Before we delve into caveats and what still needs to be done, let's consider the major positives of those two moves. For one thing, shared funds is ideal for those that still top up their accounts in blocks of money or through fund cards purchased at retailers; not all gamers simply buy each download with the exact funds on a debit card. It's a simple matter of convenience and simplicity that only one virtual wallet will need to be managed, and may indirectly boost sales of the higher value fund cards — after all, if you regularly buy games from both eShops and have the cash to hand, it may be tempting to whack $50 on the account rather than work up in smaller increments on each device.

The biggest news is clearly Miiverse, and this should be considered from the perspective of those that don't own a Wii U, in particular. As it stands the only way to use Miiverse properly — rather than gaze at the recommended posts on the front page of the browser site or follow URLs to specific pages — is to have a Nintendo Network ID, which necessitates a Wii U. With the ID and the bespoke network coming to 3DS — including communities specific to the handheld's library — this will be the first opportunity for many to participate in what is, to date, Nintendo's most innovative feature to get its gamers communicating with each other.

Consider the fact that, as of 30th September 2013, 3.91 million Wii U consoles had been sold; the equivalent 3DS figure, due to its strong run and longer term on the market, is 34.98 million. Even accounting for the fact that less actual 3DS systems may be in the hands of gamers (due to trade-ins, upgrades etc) we still have a significant number that'll join the service for the first time. There have been mutterings based on Nintendo customer services responses — which, in truth, aren't always 100% accurate — that it may not be possible to send friend requests or direct messages; this has been confirmed to us by Nintendo UK, so in essence the 3DS version will be the second iteration to lack those features, along with the browser based option. The service should nevertheless still be a welcome and valuable addition to the platform.

Ultimately, these two aspects coming in the December system update are notable improvements, while Nintendo is keen for all 3DS owners to setup an ID — or link to their Wii U equivalent. While buying 3DS eShop games will be possible without it, accessing demos and free content requires that login, and it wouldn't surprise us if a thoroughly tempting treat gets provided as a freebie to force 3DS owners' hands.

There are some caveats, as we suggested earlier, that show one of three things: Nintendo is still clinging to some old-school practices, this is the beginning of a phased period of evolution, or perhaps a mixture of both. As outlined in our handy guide to using a Nintendo Network ID on your 3DS, there are question-marks and limitations that could be bothersome. For starters, there'll only be one Nintendo Network ID allowed per 3DS; though the Wii U setup is really just there to allow multiple user profiles and independent save data, the handheld has always been — aside from the occasional workaround with eShop 'family' accounts — a single-user device. Save data, for example, is driven more exclusively by the software on the 3DS, whereas even single-save games on the Wii U — such as Toki Tori 2+ — can be worked around with each separate user having their own save data. That won't become the norm on the 3DS due to the single account rule.

What this also does is potentially frustrate those that share their 3DS with someone else, as posts to Miiverse — for example — will always be under the same ID; so if you share with a friend or relative they can only post onto Miiverse with your account. This naturally throws up a disconnect between Nintendo Network ID usage on the Wii U and 3DS, as home consoles are commonly shared between multiple users and applying that dynamic to the portable won't be possible. One argument is that this is the norm for portable devices, with smartphones utilising one login for activities; it's debatable whether that comparison works as a phone is a very personal device, perhaps unlike a dedicated gaming system within a family.

It's a tricky situation, as we're sure a number of families and partners may share a 3DS, while in the case of various members of the Nintendo Life staff family members typically have their own devices. For some this will be a nuisance, however, as Nintendo clearly drives users — especially with the inexpensive 2DS joining the market — to have multiple systems in a household. Whether this single account policy was a deliberate strategy or limited due to technical headaches and constraints, is only known within the walls of Nintendo.

What does remain the case with the upcoming December update on 3DS is the fact that the Nintendo Network ID will still be tied-down to the hardware in a borderline literal sense. As an online account stored on servers it is not, literally, a big N block with an engraved username and password that dangles from the system like an awkward keychain, but by 2013 'network' standards it is. The ID will make no difference, for example, to the system transfer process between portables; you still need to transfer all details wholesale with both consoles sitting next to each other, exactly as before. If the "target" 3DS happens to have a different ID on it, this will be removed when completing the transfer.

Therefore the network ID is as tied to hardware as on Wii U; the 3DS system transfer process will continue to be irrelevant if your original device is stolen, broken or unavailable for any other reason, as before. This is still an egregious issue on Wii U, of course, as even to this day there's no Wii U to Wii U transfer process of any kind — not for consumers, anyway, what Nintendo does with its repair and replacement services is different.

And so we have the greatest remaining weakness of the Nintendo Network ID setup, in that it doesn't utilise the Cloud in a meaningful way. If you take systems such as those employed by Apple and Android, it's a relatively simple process to switch devices utilising backed up data in the Cloud; you simply login to a new device and gain access to your purchased goods, with various means and methods to essentially recreate all of your data on a new handset. It's understandable that Nintendo won't allow multi-device support like Apple, for example — it wants players to either share cartridges or buy individual copies; that's a reality still prevalent in the video game industry. Yet in the event of needing to switch to a new 3DS device, having the ability to access purchased content by logging in with a Nintendo Network ID would resolve difficulties of not being able to utilise the local wireless transfer.

More and more data is in the Cloud now, and if Nintendo's systems could allow this cloud-style transfer and simply restrict content access to one device at a time — therefore disabling games on an old system when activated on another — it would avoid horror stories of lengthy customer services and repair sagas, or the fear of losing hundreds of pounds / dollars / euros worth of content if a device is broken or stolen. Sure, someone could in theory activate content on another device and simply keep another with original copies offline until the end of time, but worrying about those scenarios would really be an excessive case of paranoia, restricting progress due to the vague possibility of a tiny minority being mischievous. So much of the best of the 3DS requires wireless to be switched on, so those that manipulate that potential process for one extra set of content hobbles the system, and runs the risk of having that data disabled if they dare to take it online.

It'd need some serious behind the scenes work by Nintendo, but these are policies and practices expected in 2013, and have been standard for a good few years; it'd also, in one stroke, resolve the ludicrous scenario that if you want to switch Wii U systems but keep your purchases — even if it's just to get the lovely Wind Waker HD bundle — you, well, can't.

And so, welcome enhancements remind us that there are still areas where, in terms of network connectivity and user convenience, Nintendo is still behind many of its contemporaries. Caution is welcome to an extent, as we'd rather have systems and processes that work than a gaggle of disastrous implementations, but we certainly hope that Nintendo is still working towards giving us a truly accessible and useful Network ID system.

Yet to end on positives, Nintendo has stated that it will be looking at further improvements with Nintendo Network IDs across various devices, so in basic terms the company appears to have the goal of improving the service. The December 3DS update will also undoubtedly enhance the portable, along with providing greater eShop convenience to those with both the handheld and a Wii U. Millions of gamers are primed to join Miiverse for the first time, which could truly take the social network to a new level.

Miiverse is ready to take off.

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User Comments (97)

Blast

#1

Blast said:

Nintendo is slowly but surely making steps in the right direction. I really don't care about trophies or an achievement system but I strongly believe that a Nintendo themed trophy system would be incredibly epic, awesome, and adorable. That's the next step!

sinanziric

#2

sinanziric said:

miiverse and unlocking stamps is more fun than achievements. Stamps are in fact wiiu achievements of future

DarkKirby

#3

DarkKirby said:

When Nintendo stops with the ridiculous region locking nobody else does anymore and allows you to use your "unified account" to download games you purchased on multiple system you own they'll be "fit for the modern age". Not before then.

While they're at it Friend Codes are Tauros manure.

Kirk

#4

Kirk said:

Well I'm sure you all know my view on this by now so I'll not hammer the point home other than to say; You need to do a lot more and you need do it sooner rather than later, Nintendo.

Diz93

#5

Diz93 said:

@Blastoise-san How cool would it be if the trophies/achievements were like the trophies from Smash Bros. Little character models that we could look at and set up in a theater mode or something.

GuSilverFlame

#6

GuSilverFlame said:

@Blastoise-san it would be also awesome if achievements actually unlocked something new(like some new backgroud for the system menu or things like this) just getting an "achievement get" or whatever is boring...

childofacid

#8

childofacid said:

I have the new Wind Waker bundle. All I did was sync the Wind Waker gamepad to my old Wii U and sold the old gamepad with the new Wii U. ;)

Netto-kun

#9

Netto-kun said:

Looking forward to the day when I don't have to rebuy my Virtual Consoles for the xth time.

Senario

#10

Senario said:

Every step counts. But I don't often use mii verse or adding friends feature. So I can be patient. Besides, friend codes are not that bad. I have had no problems.

rodaco

#11

rodaco said:

Does anyone know how will this Nintendo ID merge workout different friends from the Wii U and 3DS? Will they be merged as well?

SuperCharlie78

#12

SuperCharlie78 said:

It can't be so difficult Nintendo, just allow us to tie our Dowloadable Content to one device only.
Want another one?
First deactivate your original system, log out with your PERSONAL ACCOUNT, log in onto the new system and activate it in order to play your stuff.
But they've got one big fear and one only, that you could sell your system, but this way they are losing money.

SuperCharlie78

#13

SuperCharlie78 said:

Anyway I suggest to tie your NN ID to your Club Nintendo account.
This way, aside from getting 50 stars per download, you will always be able to submit your purchasing history to Nintendo in case your system gest stolen or broken...

Sceptic

#14

Sceptic said:

That's a lot of text for something that's still half a decade or more behind the times. If anything, it underscores how they simply don't have a clue. Any current day gaming company would add an account system over the week end. What is so hard?

Not to mention Nintendo will remove any 'non region approved' currency from your account once you connect the two, which is kind of a glorified form of stealing. Presumably because they're too thick to work out exchange rates. Thats about the most favorable interpretation I can come up with.

No really. What in the world is wrong with Nintendo? This is very, very basic stuff these days, not rocket science. Every website has it.

rjejr

#15

rjejr said:

"For starters, there'll only be one Nintendo Network ID allowed per 3DS"

About 4 years ago I bought myself a PSP for my birthday. The next day I returned it due in large part to 1 account per unit, which really surprised me as it was supposed to be a sort of portable PS3. And it was a bundle w/ 3 games and every game had only a single save slot so we coudln't even share.

As far as I know this is still the case w/ PS Vita, so Nintendo is actually following the norm w/ this limitation. Though Android 4.3 (possibly 4.2.2) allows muliple accounts on a single tablet - not sure about phones - so the functionality is coming. Maybe the 3DU - Nitnedo's portable system that hooks up to the tv, replacing both the Wii U and 3DS - will allow it. :-)

As for NNID - I voiced all the same criticisms expressed above, but I do have 1 new positive to add. I sent in my Wii U for repair and Nintendo sent back a replacement minus all my Wii U saves and DL games and Miis. That part sucked, though my transfered Wii saves remained, somehow. When I hooked my Wi U back up to the network w/ my old NNID it found and redownlaoded my Mii. I wasn't sure if it did redownload or not so I searched all over the WiU best I could for other Miis but coudln't find any. I the did the same for my wife and kids and all 3 Miis re-appeared. So the network in that regard has an incy wincy part of cloud storage. Now I just need to retransfer the other 30 family Miis from our 3DS adn Wii systems, if I can. Think the Wii was wiped during th eWii U transfer though.

So NNID is becoming a network ID if 1 eShop wallet holds funds for both. It is a start.

dignifiedbeard

#16

dignifiedbeard said:

Just a quick note: the Digital Deluxe Promotion has always allowed you to use the eShop credits earned on the 3DS. When you redeem your points for eShop credits it gives you an eShop code that you can then use in either your Wii U or 3DS eShops.

datamonkey

#19

datamonkey said:

"If you want to be really, really harsh, you could call it a glorified Friend Code."

I don't think that's harsh at all because the ID as it's implemented now is basically exactly that...

Nintendo are so paranoid it has a negative effect on their consumer's user experience. It's about time they took a leaf out of Sony's book and gave their massive fan base what they want rather than dictating to that fanbase what they want us to have.

This has a negative effect on Nintendo's bottom line also. Personally I have stopped buying all eshop content (Wii U and 3DS) and will not buy anything else until there is a proper account system not tied to hardware. In the mean time I have spent a massive amount of money recently on my PS3/Vita via PSN (not to mention the Vita & PS3 themselves). I am sure at least some of that money would have gone to Nintendo if the NID was implemented properly as there are games I would like to buy on both eshops.

As it stands I find myself having less and less patience with Nintendo's business practices which I find really frustrating. The reason I get so annoyed is because they are my favourite gaming company and it baffles me how they can make the best games, yet make the worst business decisions and online infrastructure...

Falchion

#21

Falchion said:

Once they start charging for it, it will definately be ready for modern day. I am ok with it being a little behind because it is free...

Nntndo_1986

#22

Nntndo_1986 said:

@datamonkey I'm with you... I have been bamboozled again by Nintendo. I hear what some say about this move in the right direction; and if this was 2005 I would be all for it and positive. But it's 2013, WiiU has been in development/out for some time and I just can't, for the life of me, imagine that business table when they said no to NetworkId, groups chat (system wide), no mic slot on controller (wait I love 80 hour battery, but still I hate having a game pad on my lap), no achievements ( not in an Xbox/ps3 way but in a Nintendo trophy room aka Nintendo land interactive presents sort of way) , and other little trivial things that could have, potentially, got a larger crowd to buy into the system. I'm sure for some of these things they would have had to spend a little more on their back end infrastructure, but I wonder how many more units sold would be out there, anyway no way to know for sure but they compromised on the hardware to invest in game pad they could have striven for more and well whatever, I bought it and am happy for most part, waiting for my ps4 to arrive and we'll see (outside of major games) if I ever pick up the Wii u again.

StrawHatChopper

#23

StrawHatChopper said:

I don't get this thought that Wii U eShop purchases aren't tied to the Nintendo Network ID. If you want to get a new Wii U and have all your digital purchases available, it's totally possible to get your NNID unlinked from the old machine and log in on the new one. The real issue is that you can't unlink the account yourself. For example, my younger brother got a basic set Wii U last year, and he wanted to upgrade to the deluxe a few months ago. He got the new system, called up Nintendo, they helped unlink the account from the old unit, and he just logged in with his NNID on the new unit. Everything he bought on the eShop, his friend list, and all Miiverse data were immediately available on the new system. If that's not an account, then neither is any other account you've ever created. 3DS still needs work, of course, but it wasn't initially designed for the NNID, so that's to be expected.

Emblem

#27

Emblem said:

@rjejr Yep Vita is the same, its even worse than the PSP in a way as it's not really region free anymore due to the account system restricting you from visiting other countries PSNs without formating your Vita first.

That said the Vita thing is to limit people from abusing free/purchased game transfers so it makes sense. 3DS doesn't really make sense at all and is likely a technical limitation rather than a policy.

ferthepoet

#28

ferthepoet said:

@StrawHatChopper

If he's Wii U would have been not working, stolen or not available for any other reasons then that called would have gone very differently that's the problem

Seriously I don't see how this is an step up, they are basically screwing 3DS customers they give you the ability to share balance which is meaningless to 3DS users who do not have Wii U (Statistically the majority of us) and give a half-baked mii verse which offers nothing that the browser version doesn't...... in exchange of that they take away from you the possibility of changing countries taking their already ridiculous region lock to new levels... Can't Nintendo understand the very simple concept that people sometimes do move around to different places even across regions...

Also I don't think account system is something they are working on and that this is a first step..... they could have account system tomorrow if they wanted, they just prefer to screw their loyal customers instead of taking the risk that someone could have the content in two systems if one of the systems never go online.....

@rjejr in the Vita IDs are tied to memory cards you can have one ID per memory card, granted this is still a problem because of the hyperexpensive Vita memory cards but it's still better than what NIntendo is planning to do which is one ID tied to the system forever

Bliquid

#30

Bliquid said:

@datamonkey : Amen, brother.
And for all who say that it's a step in the right direction, well, it's not.
Stubbornly refusing to deliver a legitimate and functioning user experience and giving us a half baked trimmed down useless glorified friend code system that denies basic digital consumer's right is a step in the WRONG direction.
Until they do it right they aren't doing it at all.
Nintendo isn't an old man trying to get the hang of how a PC works.
Nintendo is a multinational enterprise with billions in its pockets.
Slowly but steady my donkey.

Windy

#31

Windy said:

I hate to say this but Nintendo has done Nothing to make their online service better. The way it's ran in fact seems very greedy. Sure the Eshop is better and has some nice budget software now. But, not having 1 account for all systems is rediculous. Not to mention that the Online services are confusing for some people and still complicated with Friend codes for online play. It's a horrible mess and makes for a bad Experience. I love my 3DS but was expecting a system with some great Online games Like Monster Hunter for starters. (boy was that messed up on 3DS) Great game! But better enjoyed with your buddys online. My 3DS really has become my favorite machine to play. But it's a single player experience especially now that swapnote was taken away. Mariokart and some of the other games are cool online, but it feels like something is missing when you play online with people.

StrawHatChopper

#32

StrawHatChopper said:

@ferthepoet Not really. Since it's an actual account on Wii U, and not games tied to a hardware ID (like on 3DS), they have no issue un-linking an account from a system (whether a system was lost/stolen, or you got a new unit). Like I said earlier, the only real issue on Wii U is that you can't unlink an account from a console yourself (at the moment). It's a total 180 from the old Wii/DSi "your digital games are locked to ONE machine forever" days. Thanks to that, I have no issues buying digital content on Wii U- since I know I WILL be able to get my games on a new system. They do need to get this all in place on 3DS as soon as possible, though.

Gerbwmu

#33

Gerbwmu said:

So amusing.....so Nintendo manufactured their products to be backward compatible.....even allowing me to transfer all digital purchases to my new system. If I buy a new Wii U or 3DS then I can call them and transfer my ID and all my eshop purchases and yet all I hear are complaints.....obviously most of you didn't live in the Atari age.....do they need to do something about region locking.....maybe....but I bet it's only a problem for 0.5% of you....the rest of you just want to be able to import games easier. As far as unified accounts....would be nice I guess....but I've never had to buy a 2 Nintendo Console as my originals all still work. I think its a lot of complaining about nothing....my biggest worry would be theft.....but that's why I have insurance. Seems to me they are making some positive steps to set up things properly to acheive what you are all asking for. Ehhh.....maybe I'm just too old to understand

Bliquid

#34

Bliquid said:

@ Gerrbwmu: in the Atari age you wouldn't have been able to post a comment like you just did.
It's called progress, and looks like even you have a use for it.
So please, don't dismiss other people as whiners just because they demand improvement.
Thank you kindly.

B_BIackNinja_N

#35

B_BIackNinja_N said:

Though Nintendo has started their Network I feel they do still have their ways to go. Small steps in the right direction are great but overall improvements need to be slightly sped up. Though if Nintendo needs the time to correctly get their networking correct I say go ahead and take the time. I would prefer the heads up that something is actually happing. On the other note of Nintendo's Networking I say we NEED A PARTY CHAT! PartyChat is on all new consoles and I feel it is a need.

ferthepoet

#36

ferthepoet said:

@StrawHatChopper

Is this truth? what I've heard from everyone is that digital games are as tied to the Wii U as they are to the 3DS

@Gerbwmu at least with the 3DS you can only transfer if you have your 3DS and its working, if its not you lost all your investment.... and at least for me this region locking thing is a problem, I am from Panama, I was studying in the U.S. where I got my 3DS and now I'm living in Australia for further studies cuz I got a scholarship here, since my U.S. 3DS can't play Australian physical games I buy everything from eshop (Canadian eshop since I don't have a U.S. debit card anymore)...... Now if I want to set up a NNID I guess I could set it to Canada... the problem is that once you set an ID apparently you are locked to it forever or at least can't change it without losing your games and I don't know what future restrictions they'll apply to the Canadian store... now I hope to move back to the U.S. an maybe work there after I finish here in Australia in a years time if my NNID is tied to Canada I won't be able to change it back to the U.S. so if for example, they lock the Canadian eshop from accepting international credit cards, I"ll be screwed forever....... Now you can blame for trying to cheat the system but I don't think I'm doing anything wrong I just want to enjoy games in a console I legally purchased in one country while living in other countries for legitimate reasons and in the process I've given Nintendo lots of money... I don't see what's so wrong with that that Nintendo needs to go out of its way to try to close any loophole that would allow me to continue to GIVE THEM MY MONEY....... see how stupid that is?

Gerbwmu

#37

Gerbwmu said:

@Bliquid - you maybe right. It is constructive to share opinions in an attempt to improve something. I also think we, as a community, tend to want exactly what we want and right away and usually that leads to mistakes that take years to correct. I expect that all the complaints will be handled in time when Nintendo finds the best solution to each issue and still protect its brand. I don't need things tomorrow....I need them to be done right when it's done

Gerbwmu

#38

Gerbwmu said:

@ferthepoet - You have a legitimate argument and are correct in what you are saying, I'm betting, and would hope that Nintendo would work with you to correct any issues you have. Good luck with your studies in Australia!

Bliquid

#40

Bliquid said:

@Gerbwmu : i see your point, and indeed people of the internet, and especially gamers, tend to think that what they want is what is needed as an absolute.
But what most people ask, in regards of the topic in question, is something that has been done right and tight a gazillion times before by a gazillion different services.
What we are asking is for Nintendo to open their window and check the weather outside, while they keep painting those same windows with colorful rainbows only they can see.
It wouldn't be such a shame for Nintendo to steal a page from other manufacturers' books in regards of online policy, even more so since fanbase has been asking for it for too long now.

StrawHatChopper

#41

StrawHatChopper said:

@ferthepoet It does appear that way on the surface, since you can't unlink a NNID from a console on your own (yet). However, it's completely possible to get it unlinked, which frees up your ID and lets you log in on another system. It's not the most convenient thing in the world, but it is a thing that can be done if needed.

MAB

#42

MAB said:

Everyone complained about lack of NNID & Miiverse on 3DS... Nintendo delivers... Now everyone complains again.

The 3DS is a lame system anyway

You can't just knock up a cloud system in 5 minutes especially when Nintendo has no infrastructure. They might be working on it for next year now that everything is starting to be tied together... Shiz takes time yo and I reckon it's better for them to take the time to do it properly instead of rushing something that could fail ;)

Wolfgabe

#43

Wolfgabe said:

@MadAussieBloke Exactly my point. The people moaning about this obviously have no idea of the technical stuff that goes into making unified accounts work. Not only do you need large dedicated servers to track millions of purchases in real time but you also need to know where to put those servers. If you think running and maintaining thousands or servers is cheap and free than I don't know what to say. I say one step at a time

Wolfgabe

#44

Wolfgabe said:

@Bliquid Explain to me how they are denying consumer rights. On 3DS if somebody is close by you can simply search for them and add them to your friends list without having to enter their code. How is the service not functioning?

electrolite77

#45

electrolite77 said:

@B_BIackNinja_N

Nintendo don't need time, they need to re-invest some of the huge profits they've made off customers back into services for their customers. Amazon, Kobo, Google, Apple, Playstation, Zinio (from my experience) have all managed to set up a proper Account system and provided a better experience for their customers. If they can do it so can Nintendo. No excuses.

sinalefa

#47

sinalefa said:

Although I normally don't care about this, as soon as I bought a second 3DS I have felt that if my retail games were digital instead of physical, I would not have been able to enjoy my games in either of my two systems, as I will be keeping both. It would also be a mess if I buy eShop games for both, since I may forget which systems have access to which games.

In that respect I do agree that being able to access games in two consoles as an account system is important. Until then I will buy all my games in physical media and download the eShop games in my old 3DS only.

Bliquid

#48

Bliquid said:

@Wolfgabe : i was talking about the purchasing of digital objects, dude.
Besides, it's pretty useless for me to explain something to people with eyes wide shut.
But allow me give you a suggestion.
Take a look anywhere else besides Nintendo, see how the present is.
And if you are still happy about Nintendo behaviour after that, lucky you.
I'm not, so i express my opinion.
And for the record, the theory about expensive servers and time is plain stupid.
Nintendo has money and resorces to do it in less than two weeks.

Wolfgabe

#49

Wolfgabe said:

@Bliquid What you fail to understand is Wii U and 3DS mark the first time Online has been a major focus for Nintendo so obviously they don't really have the infrastructure to support such a network at the moment but they are working on it. You must be daft if you think setting up a server farm can be done in less than a week. You have to order the servers, choose where the location is, set up the servers install the client, and test for problems. Its more complicated than it looks. And for your information Nintendo is relatively small compared to Microsoft and Sony so they need to prioritize more

B_BIackNinja_N

#50

B_BIackNinja_N said:

@electrolite77 Yeah Nintendo makes great games for their customers but they don't seem to put the money into any other means of product(s). They need to take a look at what we want, like they are doing with this next 3DS Update, but on the Wii U. The problem with a form of party chat for the Wii U I see is that Nintendo makes the Home button function as a pause to open other small Apps such as Friends List or The Internet Browser. Thus this holds the game in a certain position, not making the game run in the background such as on the Xbox 360/One and PS4 do. Maybe Nintendo needs to bring an update to change that.

ferthepoet

#51

ferthepoet said:

@MadAussieBloke

Come on Man how can you support this you are Australian, Aussies and Kiwis are among the people that are gonna be hit the hardest by this thing....

@Wolfgabe

What are you talking about Nintendo already has the servers in place, the cloud is there, all your information on balance, purchases ect is already on Nintendo servers... When your 3DS log into the eshop it accesses the club, the only problem is that instead of being a username and password you control the log in information the server checks for is a system id that is coded into the system (and not hardcoded since you can transfer it to other systems) the only problem is the policy decision by Nintendo not allow them to transfer the system id from one system to another without having both systems in the same place and working or to give us a portable id that we could use to log in from any 3DS instead of the system coded id..... Maybe there are coding issues involved I'm not a programmer so I don't know, but it's pretty clear that the physical infrastructure is already in place

MarioMan247

#52

MarioMan247 said:

@Blastoise-san
Exactly. Lots of horrible and mediocre games had a LOAD of achievements that made a game seem good when it really wasn't. Achievements should be like in brawl or tekken:
Challenging but the reword is not only worth it, but also enhances the game (like unlocking levels/characters)

MAB

#53

MAB said:

@ferthepoet You only care about this because you're into that rediculous 3DS like most of the users on this site... I will wait till next year when cloud crap might fall into place but for now I would rather they work on making WiiU successful and try to get more 3rd party support before they worry about extras ;)

ferthepoet

#54

ferthepoet said:

@MadAussieBloke

How dare you call the i3DS ridiculous, I may give Nintendo stick because of their ridiculous anti-consumer policies but there's no denying in terms of a game library 3DS is the most epic console ever or at least that no other console ever came close to having such a great and varied library in just 2 years in the market...... Wii U on the other hand is just a box that happens to play mario

MAB

#55

MAB said:

@ferthepoet For something that has sold well I'm still waiting for better games and 3rd party support on 3DS... Until then it is nothing but a SEGA VC device while I pinch off a poop ;)

Untitled

As much as people like to use the old 'got no games routine' you can't play Deus Ex, Batman AO(the better WiiU version), Assassins Creed, COD, Watch Dogs, Splinter Cell, Sonic LW (the better version) etc on 3DS. Animal Crossing & Pokemon just don't cut it... They're for young kiddies like Mario & Zelda games mate ;)

JebbyDeringer

#56

JebbyDeringer said:

Japan still doesn't understand the Internet. Yes Sony is doing "ok" but they have a big presence outside of Japan that doesn't involve monkeys.

element187

#57

element187 said:

@Netto-kun you really think Nintendo will ever allow that? VC is a cash cow, they want you to rebuy them for every console you purchase

Bliquid

#58

Bliquid said:

@MadAussieBloke : Erm, by the sound of it, you really should direct your attention on other consoles.
All the titles you mentioned besides Sonic LW are available on "last" gen.
If you dislike the 3DS "kiddy" library, which is quite an ignorant statement since it has excellent games( fyi, pokemon games meta statistics and competitive gameplay are way more intricate and "pro" than your average fps or moba), you basically dislike Nintendo's style.
But i should not be surprised, most of your statements on this site are dumb.

MAB

#59

MAB said:

You can't get Wii Sports Club on 3DS or PSBOX41 so there's no need for me to waste good money on those systems ;)

Bliquid

#60

Bliquid said:

@MadAussieBloke hahaha, sorry for being harsh before.
But dude, ain't there plenty of space in the Outback to play sports real life? :P
You don't need any console.

MAB

#61

MAB said:

Sure, I can always just ride my Kangaroo and smoke gum leaves with the Koala's ;)

Untitled

Bliquid

#62

Bliquid said:

While throwing boomerangs, no less!
And if you ever come to Italy, you may enjoy spaghetti, pizza and mafia. :)

MAB

#63

MAB said:

Give me a Didgeridoo any day of the week and it will be sweet as mate ;)

ferthepoet

#64

ferthepoet said:

@MadAussieBloke

Ace Attorney Dual Destinies, Senran Kagura Burst, Project X Zone, Shin Megami Tensei IV, Zero Escape VLR, Kingdom Hearts 3D, is that no third party support? Wii U will kill for support like that and all of those except VLR are exclusives am I"m sure there are other titles I'm missing

MAB

#65

MAB said:

@ferthepoet All fairly mediocre compared to the awesome games on WiiU plus there were more that I didn't mention. When you really look at the 3rd party support on 3DS you realise there isn't much for something that has been out for almost 3 years and is selling good... Nothing has pushed the system to its limits since Resident Evil and games like Animal Crossing and Pokemon could have easily been put on just the plain old DS ;)

AJWolfTill

#66

AJWolfTill said:

@GuSilverFlame
I really want to be able to unlcock MP3 tracks from the soundtracks. It was pretty pointless being able to access them from a menu in Kid Icarus but if it actually let you export them to the music software :D

Ultimatechris

#67

Ultimatechris said:

I think Nintendo dont want to do the login because if you did so, you could have one purchase shared with even 100 consoles so that is what they are avoiding.

eza

#68

eza said:

Here's the response I got from Nintendo when I asked them about my situation (I have moved between countries in the PAL region, own Nintendo consoles from different countries within this region, and am likely to move again):
"The country on your 3DS will have to match the country settings of the NNID that you wish to link it to, this is due to the currency used in different countries as the account balances are combined.

There are no announcements to indicate if there are any restrictions for using the console outside of its set country. Currently it is possible to use the 3DS eShop outside of the country it's set to.

In regards to your last question, your purchases are tied to the country of which the NNID is set."
(the last question I asked was "From the FAQ I understand that I will be forced to create or link an NNID on my 3DS when the update comes out, so I’ll have to decide which region I want my main account to be in.
So if I move countries again after making this decision, will I be able
to change the region associated with my NNID, or will all my purchases
be forever linked to the region that I set?")

So from this answer it looks like you will still be able to access another country's eShop from your 3DS when located in a different country.
(of course this is still limited by region - AU+NZ+EU / Japan / Americas)

It seems that the best course of action for anyone who wants to or has to use their 3DS in different country's eShop, is to not link the same NNID as you use on the Wii U, but to create a new one whose country is set to the country which has the eShop you want to access.

Personally, I'm going to hold off from updating my 3DS and wait and see what happens after the update comes out.
I have loads of games for it already, and haven't finished a lot of them, so I don't need to update straight away.
I recommend that anyone else in the same situation as me does the same.

ferthepoet

#69

ferthepoet said:

@eza

That's discouraging, did they say anything about what happens to the games you have already purchased which are from different eshops?

eza

#70

eza said:

@ferthepoet they didn't, no. But I would say that it's highly liked that those games would still be playable on your 3DS.

When the Wii first came out and I lived in Australia, I would switch between the Australian and UK Wii Shops, buying things that weren't available, or saving a few pounds with favourable exchange rates.
When Nintendo put a stop to this, I found you could still switch shops freely, but you'd have to spend all your Wii Shop Points before switching because they would be wiped.

All the games I bought in both shops are still playable on my Wii after they brought in the restriction. That Wii has had its country switched from AU to UK and back many times, then stuck with UK for a while, then changed to Spain.

When I took my Wii U to the UK last year, I had to create a new NNID to be able to use it online in the UK (my 'main' NNID is Spanish, and it won't let me use it online unless I'm physically located in the country) but I could still play the eShop games I'd bought with my Spanish NNID when using my new temporary UK NNID.

I haven't actually switched shops in the 3DS - I've just left it set to UK since I bought it there - but I can only assume that all your games will still be playable after the update, as they're tied to your 3DS' hardware ID.

Just make sure to keep a backup of the SD card, because even though you'll be able to play them you may not be able to re-download them again!

Netto-kun

#71

Netto-kun said:

@element187 Hey, I want to believe. Though I probably should've added some more CAPS and sarcasm in my previous post.

...or Nintendo could look at how Sony handled majority of the PS1 and PC Engine games on hardwares from previous generation. I can magically play most of the classic games on PS3/PSP (and PS Vita) without the need to rebuy.

Or maybe, I don't know, consider something similar to cross-buy? Flower (and some other games), a PSN game released in 2009, recently received ports for Vita/PS4. Everyone who bought the original version gets the ports for free even if you don't own the newer platforms.

Keep in mind I am not holding my breath that all the classic games (or PS2/PS3 backward compatibility, but that's a slightly different topic) I purchased will become fully playable on PS4 since Sony seem to be all over streaming and Gaikai...which will most likely mean additional fees.

element187

#72

element187 said:

@Netto-kun Sony has other avenues of revenue (other business, PSN, etc)while Nintendo only has a video games business (and Hanifuda cards). Nintendo does it because they know we will rebuy them. I think I purchased all the NES Zelda's and Mario's at least 4 times now (including when my parents purchased them for me when I was a kid)

eza

#73

eza said:

@ferthepoet
Just got another response from Nintendo - confirms that country changing is possible, but with a major downside! Can't see anyone going for this:
"In regards to your query, I can confirm you will be able to change the country for you NNID by contacting customer support team. Please bare in mind by changing the country setting this will wipe your eShop purchases that you may have on the console"

So, Nintendo are removing region locking like everyone wanted, they're just replacing it with country locking instead! ;-(

ferthepoet

#74

ferthepoet said:

@eza

No they are not removing region locking, region locking remains for physical games and now they have an additional country locking for digital ones.... there are no words to describe how much they suck... Microsoft announce anti-consumer policies, customers backlash and they fix things, Nintendo has anti-consumer policy, customers backlash and they retaliate with even worst restrictions..... Nintendo fans are the most devoted of all and they really don't deserve to be treated like this

eza

#75

eza said:

@ferthepoet yeah, I was pretty stunned to read that reply from them.
I've done all I can do: replied and politely requested that my concerns are forwarded to the relevant department.
Of course I ended it with a polite veiled threat: basically that a company that enforces such restrictions will not get my money in the future.

But yeah, why should I have to put myself through this nonsense again?
Something like an updated version of the GP32X in a few years' time would suit me just fine.

Until then I'll keep searching Google every few weeks for the magical keywords "3ds region free" - I like to think that it's only a matter of time before someone manages to do it...

Bliquid

#76

Bliquid said:

@ferthepoet : as long as people blindly buys their products and constantly defend their poor choices without EVER questioning them, i don't think it is going to change soon.
Or ever.
And because of this, i disagree with you: Nintendo fans DO deserve being treated like this, but to everyone its own.
I'll keep on wallet voting.
But i really wish Iwata or Miyamoto took a tour around the internet to read all of our different opinions.

Nico07

#77

Nico07 said:

@Netto-kun The PS4 is somewhat of a paradox in my book. Despite my personal preference for all things Nintendo, I also own a PS3, Vita and have a PS4 in the mail. I don't understand some of Sony's restrictive nature with its new console. Compared to the PS3 you lose backwards compatibility for apparently all PS3, PS2, and PSOne content at least for now. More disturbingly for me there is the loss of MP3 and video playback from USB drives or network shares. The PS4 is literally a game box with only Sony DRM capabilities. Last gen these PS3 feature were big draws for me that Nintendo did not offer in having a box that was a home entertainment hub. Sure the PS4 may adapt, but the advances from Nintendo as of late are big steps that make me glad to be a Wii U and 3DS XL owner.

D3athBr1ng3r187

#78

D3athBr1ng3r187 said:

@Nico07 LOL "big steps" thats funny bro I try to ask that to Nintendo again when they can UNLOCK DRM for Region Locking and have a proper account system and also have MORE Nintendo titles online besides 3rd Party titles and then I more than likely buy another Wii U but nope they taking "Big Steps" so I rather play my PS3/PS4 with all my properties for now until that happen which probably never.

ferthepoet

#79

ferthepoet said:

@Bliquid

Yes I see your point, I guess part of the problem is that the policies don't make a difference to Nintendo bottom line, 3DS is so awesome and has so many exclusives games not available anywhere else that people will still buy them no matter what and Wii U has so many problems like price, no third party support no power ect, that getting in the times with their policies would barely help sales improve so they can continue to screw their customers for lols without any real penalties

sevex

#80

sevex said:

@StrawHatChopper Nintendo actually allowed your brother to unlink his NNID? I called them to try and unlink my NNID from my roommate's console so I could use it to one I bought for myself and they totally refused.

banacheck

#81

banacheck said:

Nico07
Your comparing a almost 8 year console to one thats barely out, and by your comment i can already tell you didn't own a PS3 from launch. Please explain the DRM capabilities?

More disturbingly for me there is the loss of MP3 and video playback from USB drives or network shares.

I couldn't careless if thay didn't come back but sadly Sony will be adding them, it puzzles me why people want less capable gaming hardware and more pointless features that thay already own that has got nothing at all to do with gaming, casuals typical.

Nico07

#82

Nico07 said:

@D3athBr1ng3r187 I think you missed my point. Nintendo never had these things but is slowly adding some of them. Sony had things that I bought a PS3 for aside from gaming (namely video and music LAN and USB playback) that are no longer there.

electrolite77

#83

electrolite77 said:

@Ultimatechris

Not really, other companies (e.g. Sony) restrict the number of devices on one ID. Again, I'm sure if Nintendo thought paying customers deserved it, they'd do it.

electrolite77

#84

electrolite77 said:

@banacheck

He's a casual for wanting very basic media features included that you may think are irrelevant but he states are useful to him? Features that would not in any way make it a less capable gaming machine? Grow up fella.

electrolite77

#85

electrolite77 said:

@ferthepoet

"they can continue to screw their customers for lols without any real penalties"

Unfortunately I suspect you're right. It's also very short-sighted because customers are getting drawn into other ecosystems whether it be Sony, MS, Apple or whoever and getting a better service. Nintendo seem to prefer squeezing their fans for a few extra pennies now to building a long-term structure and encouraging brand loyalty. Very short-sighted.

MAB

#86

MAB said:

Nope, still no overnight 3rd party support on 3DS... I would prefer they sort out that problem instead of the one only a couple of users seem to care about ;)

ferthepoet

#87

ferthepoet said:

@Nico07

Backward compatibility is understandable they couldn't get it to work..... Although I still don't get why they are going witth the cloud for ps 1 and 2, ps3 I understand but ps1 and ps2 should be handled by local emulation....

About the video and mp3 yah that sucks, but at least they already backtracked and promised to add mp3 funcionality in a patch, probably video funcionality will come as well if people continue to complain..... On the other hand see how NIntendo acts, if these was Nintendo instead of acknowledging and addressing the complains they'll just ignore or even worst retaliate with additional restrictions as they are doing now.

Nico07

#88

Nico07 said:

@ferthepoet What restrictions are you talking about? Region locking has ALWAYS been a Nintendo (and most other console makers) thing. Let's look at what Nintendo has done recently with the Wii U.

1.Full game digital downloads, many that are day one releases. This didn't and couldn't happen on the original Wii, now it's a reality.
2.Digital content sales. Shortly after the Wii U released, games like Trine 2 and others went on sale something that never happened on Wii.
3.DLC. Sure some developers have left Wii U versions lacking, but it can and does happen now.
4.Miiverse. An online community where you can discuss with other Wii U owners games and strategy in a Nintendo operated forum.
5.TVii. It's not the greatest thing ever, but it is an attempt to unify video from multiple sources in one simple place. Write notes, share with friends. I tried it the other day and it was a blast.
6.Nintendo ID. A system to have a unifying account between devices. You can soon share balances and this is just the beginning. It won't be long before (hopefully) you can sell a system and login to a new system with your unique account and purchases.

Bottom line is Nintendo does things different than the competition. We wouldn't be happy if they were exactly the same. Who knows if this is the last generation Nintendo does region locking? Perhaps they will allow MP3 playback or video file playback in the future though they originally said that their goal was not to be a home media hub (ie no Blu ray, etc). The PS3 and Xbox did come out with this assertion that they wanted to basically be your all in one box. Playstation even had ads stating that Playstation "does" everything, music, movies, games, etc. Now they are retracting from that and I think it's wrong. Nintendo never had the things I mentioned above but is adapting (slowly) to new standards.

MAB

#89

MAB said:

You can't do much with your PS4 except return it to the store because it doesn't even boot up ;)

Windy

#90

Windy said:

@B_BIackNinja_N but they really don't take small steps even. I do believe they have no intentions of ever producing any kind of viable or flawless online service. They are so hung up on the Bad people who make up 2% of society and would do something bad to the other 98% of good people who use the software as intended. Really it isn't fair

ferthepoet

#91

ferthepoet said:

@Nico07

Country locking, granted the PSN IDs are country locked and Vita only accepts one but if you unlink your ID from Vita and wipe it out to link a new one you don't lose your content forever you can link your old ID again in the future..... I would not be complaining if the country locking came with the feature of being able to retrieve your games if your consoles gets stolen or lost or broken but Nintendo at this points is bringing all the drawbacks of an account system without any of the benefits and would require you to register an NNID to download demos and freeware for no other reason that because they do want their customers to get county locked

eza

#92

eza said:

@Nico07 all of those things that Nintendo have done lately are things that the 360 had seven years ago.
Only now are they catching up to what has been the norm for other platforms.
So they're doing the same thing as the competition but, in typical style, they're falling short with their implementation.
The good thing about the Wii was that it had great support from the homebrew community. People got really excited finding out what they could do with the hardware.
They quickly added DVD and other media playback features to the console. Features which Nintendo couldn't have done themselves without paying licensing fees (eg. to Fraunhoffer for MP3).
Once that happened I could stream music and video over the network from my PC to my TV through my Wii, and apart from having to reinstall the HBC every time Nintendo pushed a system update out, everything was great.

This generation feels like a step backwards in many ways for me.
The first DS was region free and it was wonderful. Well, it was the games as well as the console that didn't have region encoding in them: because the same great games I imported from Japan still work on my 3DS, but a UK-bought "DSi enhanced" game refused to work on my Japanese DSi.
Part of what made the DS so great for me and many others was that you could import and play anything you wanted to.

These days, if we even dare to go and live in a different country, we'll be lucky if they'll let us keep the eShop games we've paid for and downloaded.

The situation is all kinds of wrong.

Compare it to Steam. I can go anywhere in the world, to any computer with Steam on it, log in, and get access to all the games I've bought over the last eight or so years.
They've made it so nice and convenient that I'll buy old games that I have on disc again through Steam when they're really cheap, just because it's easier.
And now I can even authorise up to ten friends' computers, who will be able to play my games as long as I'm not playing them.

Remember the late 80s and early 90s, and the home computer wars?
We had the Atari ST, Amiga, and PC.
Everyone at the time was a fanboy for one of them.
Amiga's got better graphics!
ST's got the same graphics but better sound!
I was the only PC fan of my friends, and the best I could come out with was "Yeah but anyone can build and sell a PC, but only Commodore and Atari can sell the Amiga and ST... just you wait and see - the only thing around in a few years will be the PC".

I think the same thing will happen with the SteamBox. With anyone able to make them, with one of the (if not the) biggest games libraries and regular dirt-cheap sales, I think Valve have a long-term hit on their hands that will change the market as we know it...

Nico07

#93

Nico07 said:

@eza As great as homebrew may have been, it's main purpose was to allow the use of pirated games. Nintendo from a business standpoint was good to try and shut it down, though it may have opened up a few good features like DVD playback, that legally require a licensing fee that would have added to the Wii's cost. Nintendo should add some more features to the Wii U, but time will tell.

eza

#94

eza said:

@Nico07 yeah true, you're right. It's a shame that the two are so closely linked.
I've personally only ever used it for legal purposes, but I realise that I'm probably in the minority. I loved that it turned the Wii into a nice little low-power media centre and that it let me play imported (purchased of course) games :-)
But yeah, I know why we can't have nice things: because the irresponsible few spoil it for the rest of us. Such a shame :-(

elstif

#95

elstif said:

@Nico07
1- Full game digital downloads, yes that´s the most expensive way to buy a Nintendo game and you dont get a physical copy that could resale and It gets tide to the console so if you have any problems with your hardware you´ll be in trouble.
2- I´ll give you this one, first time they get some games on sale. Still full retail game download sales like "Assassins creed 3" we saw recently are still more expensive than the retail so back to issue 1
3-Not many but there´s some DLC now (not that important compare to other things)
4-Miiverse is nice but they still need to improve it
5- Tvii - After 1 year this is still an unused icon on the Wii U menu. If I hit it always says there´s no Tvii services in this REGION
6-Nintendo ID it is still useless. Progress will be the day they linked my ID with the games I purchased with it instead of the hardware. What about the ability to play VC games on both Wii U and 3DS. Wait there r barely any VC available on Wii U (unbelivable)
7- Now on top of Region Lock we have Country lock. New online games that should be open wordlwide (like Mario kart wii was) they are region locked too (Sport club)

ToxieDogg

#96

ToxieDogg said:

@Nico07
'2.Digital content sales. Shortly after the Wii U released, games like Trine 2 and others went on sale something that never happened on Wii.'
Perhaps, but the Wii had a far superior Virtual Console selection within a month of launch (one of the first games was Gunstar Heroes!) and a year later had quite a large library available across multiple systems (not just Nintendo ones). On Wii U VC, we've just had a tiny trickle of average NES/SNES games, the only one worth buying really has been Earthbound.

5.TVii. It's not the greatest thing ever, but it is an attempt to unify video from multiple sources in one simple place. Write notes, share with friends. I tried it the other day and it was a blast.
All that is to us Europeans is a useless icon on the screen, clicking it just gives the message 'Not available in your region yet'. I don't think it ever will be at this rate. A complete and utter waste of time and a constant reminder of the Wii U's massively failed potential.

Sir_Deadly

#97

Sir_Deadly said:

So will we be able to use the same NNID on the Wii U console with our 3DS? And if so, i hope it will let me except the new user agreement on my 3DS that way i can use the online features for my wii u seeing how my gamepad screen is cracked and i have to send it in for repair.

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