Wii U Virtual Console Forum

Topic: Can Wii U VC support Super FX games?

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Don

1. Posted:

Does anyone know whether the Wii U VC is capable of handling Super FX emulation of games like Star Fox and Yoshi's Island?

Don

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Captain_Toad

2. Posted:

Heh, Heh Only time will tell.
.
.
.But seriously it has to support SuperFx.

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Nintex

3. Posted:

i would hope so, but not sure.

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Ryno

4. Posted:

It's not a case of "handling" the FX chip.

The FX chip is a proprietary chip designed and made by Argonaut games.

Edited on by Ryno

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Tasuki

5. Posted:

The Wii can handle Super FX games. I believe its more of a licensing issue that prevents the emulation of the super FX chip.

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tudsworth

6. Posted:

Tasuki wrote:

The Wii can handle Super FX games. I believe its more of a licensing issue that prevents the emulation of the super FX chip.

Precisely. Argonaut created the architecture that the SuperFX uses; and the rights to the processor (as well as later chips using the same arcitecture) have changed hands so many times it is kind of ridiculous. I am not a lawyer, but I imagine that, to sell SuperFX titles on the Virtual Console, Nintendo would need to acquire a license to emulate the ARC arcitecture from Synopsys, the current owners of the architecture - and that wouldn't come cheap.

Or, they could just sell the GBA version of Yoshi's Island on the VC instead and call it a day, which is what they'll most likely do.

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SparkOfSpirit

7. Posted:

When the Yarn Yoshi community is put up I expect a lot of people asking for this.

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Tasuki

8. Posted:

tudsworth wrote:

Tasuki wrote:

The Wii can handle Super FX games. I believe its more of a licensing issue that prevents the emulation of the super FX chip.

Precisely. Argonaut created the architecture that the SuperFX uses; and the rights to the processor (as well as later chips using the same arcitecture) have changed hands so many times it is kind of ridiculous. I am not a lawyer, but I imagine that, to sell SuperFX titles on the Virtual Console, Nintendo would need to acquire a license to emulate the ARC arcitecture from Synopsys, the current owners of the architecture - and that wouldn't come cheap.

Or, they could just sell the GBA version of Yoshi's Island on the VC instead and call it a day, which is what they'll most likely do.

WOuldn't be a surprise if they did it that way. Didn't ambassadors get that on the 3DS?

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skywake

9. Posted:

It's not like there's not a precedent for legally difficult titles to appear on the VC. We're getting Earthbound, we got WaveRace modified to remove logos, we got obscure titles nobody would care about, titles that were never releaced outside of Japan and all sorts. What's so difficult about SuperFX?

If Capcom can justify the effort involved to get the licence for and remake Ducktales then surely Nintendo can justify geting SuperFX on the VC. Stunt Race FX, Yoshi's Island, Star Fox.. surely there is a market for these games on the VC.

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brooks83

10. Posted:

Just curious if anyone here actually has proof that licensing issues are keeping SuperFX games from being brought to the VC. I'm not saying your wrong, I just find that a little hard to believe. I mean, Square brought Final Fantasy IV-VI and Chrono Trigger to the PSX. Did they have to get the rights to emulate the SNES cartridge and system from Nintendo?

Edited on by brooks83

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SCAR392

11. Posted:

brooks83 wrote:

Just curious if anyone here actually has proof that licensing issues are keeping SuperFX games from being brought to the VC. I'm not saying your wrong, I just find that a little hard to believe. I mean, Square brought Final Fantasy IV-VI and Chrono Trigger to the PSX. Did they have to get the rights to emulate the SNES cartridge from Nintendo?

They didn't emulate the SNES cartridges. They still had the game files stored somewhere and just burned it to a disc instead of using a cartridge.
If they added anything extra, they just reopen the file and add the extras.
It's like how they retextured and improved Monster Hunter 3 Ultimate by using the Monster Hunter Tri game file from their database to improve the game without starting from scratch, then re released it on a high capacity disc for Wii U.
Changing formats does not automatically mean emulation.

Edited on by SCAR392

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brooks83

12. Posted:

SCAR392 wrote:

brooks83 wrote:

Just curious if anyone here actually has proof that licensing issues are keeping SuperFX games from being brought to the VC. I'm not saying your wrong, I just find that a little hard to believe. I mean, Square brought Final Fantasy IV-VI and Chrono Trigger to the PSX. Did they have to get the rights to emulate the SNES cartridge from Nintendo?

They didn't emulate the SNES cartridges. They still had the game files stored somewhere and just burned it to a disc instead of using a cartridge.
If they added anything extra, they just reopen the file and add the extras.
It's like how they retextured and improved Monster Hunter 3 Ultimate by using the Monster Hunter Tri game file from their database to improve the game without starting from scratch, then re released it on a high capacity disc for Wii U.
Changing formats does not automatically mean emulation.

I should have said emulate the SNES itself, because as far as I can tell that's what the games are doing.

EDIT: Actually, I guess they could have just ported the games without doing any emulating. Nevermind what I said lol.

Edited on by brooks83

brooks83

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SCAR392

13. Posted:

@brooks83
Hmmm... My guess is that PS1 was a similar build compared to SNES, since it was meant for SNES to begin with. The structure of the PS console was probably similar enough to not require emulation to run. I think that would be considered a port, not an emulation though.

EDIT: Saw your edit.

Edited on by SCAR392

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dizzy_boy

14. Posted:

I don't get why nintendo just doesn't buy the fx chip tech if the licensing is an issue. It would make things so much easier.

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tudsworth

15. Posted:

brooks83 wrote:

Just curious if anyone here actually has proof that licensing issues are keeping SuperFX games from being brought to the VC. I'm not saying your wrong, I just find that a little hard to believe. I mean, Square brought Final Fantasy IV-VI and Chrono Trigger to the PSX. Did they have to get the rights to emulate the SNES cartridge and system from Nintendo?

As has already been established, Squaresoft owns the rights to the code and are, therefore, free to port it to any system under the sun. The ports have excruciating load times due to the lower read speeds of the PS1 CD-ROM; but there is no actual SNES code in the PS1 ports of those games, so they would not need the rights to emulate SNES hardware.

As for my speculation that licensing is the issue - it's just that. The superFX was a joint venture by Nintendo and Argonaut; though Argonaut always owned the patents behind the technology. Of course, I could be wrong and Nintendo may still have a stake in the whole thing, which would make their decision to not release Yoshi's Island on the Wii Virtual Console at all even more baffling. Not so baffling in the case of Star Fox - Miyamoto has always preferred Star Fox 64.

Still as @skywake basically said - never say never. Nintendo have gone to frankly silly lengths to re-release legally difficult titles on the VC before, so they'll do it again.

Edited on by tudsworth

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KingMike

16. Posted:

The Square ports probably did emulate the SNES sound chip.
The sound emulation has suspiciously similar flaws to fan emulators of its day. (I remember it was kind of news when the most popular emulator got the wind sound effect reasonably correct, instead of sounding like TV static.)
Then again, the SNES sound chip was created by Sony, so maybe they had some say in licensing? (I remember the fact that Sony made the chip, is rumored to have been one reason Nintendo let the original Play Station SNES attachment live as long as it did. :D )

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Tasuki

17. Posted:

brooks83 wrote:

Just curious if anyone here actually has proof that licensing issues are keeping SuperFX games from being brought to the VC. I'm not saying your wrong, I just find that a little hard to believe. I mean, Square brought Final Fantasy IV-VI and Chrono Trigger to the PSX. Did they have to get the rights to emulate the SNES cartridge and system from Nintendo?

If thats the case well its a no brainer and this is kinda of a bad comparison for the Super FX. In this case Sony would have to pay Nintendo for the Super FX Nintendo would have to pay someone else. I am no dummy but I would sooner make a deal that makes me money sooner than I would make one that costs me money.

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PinkSpider

18. Posted:

This means star fox is never gonna get released :-(

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ChrisT99

19. Posted:

What is Super FX?

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Tasuki

20. Posted:

ChrisT99 wrote:

What is Super FX?

Ahem..........

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Super_FX

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