Wii U Forum

Topic: Wii U Fragmentation

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rdej47

1. Posted:

Hey guys first time post here, glad to have finally found a Nintendo forum. I've been thinking this ever since I saw the WIi U and just wanted to get some fans opinions on this. Is anyone here afraid of fragmentation with the Wii U? What I mean by that is when you look at all the available controller types: game pad pro, classic controller, Wii Remote (motion + as well), and then the GamePad don't you think this system will be even worse for lazy developers and not delivering the best Wii U experience.

We saw it time and time again with the Wii, the technology was there to do something innovative yet most developers would resort to using waggle motions with the Wii. The motion plus was hardly used with the obvious exceptions of Skyward Sword and Grand Slam Tennis. I feel like developers will get lazy with the GamePad and again resort to an inventory screen or a map screen on the GamePad which again isn't innovation to me.

I feel like with the number of control methods available Nintendo is making it difficult for developers to decide which control method to use. Obviously you want to use the GamePad if you can, but what if you want 4 player's? That's out the window because now you have to go back to Wii Remotes.

I've got way more on mind but can't organize it into a nice argument. Basically I really do want the Wii U to succeed, I've been a huge Nintendo fan but the Wii really left a solid taste in my mouth. It had so much promise but just dropped the ball. I think Nintendo would have been best off either really innovating with the GamePad or leaving out the GamePad altogether and refining the motion controls. If you look at Apple there's a very logical explanation as to why they still haven't allowed for a controller to be hooked up with the iPad, it would let developers fall back on old ideas rather then forcing them to think outside the box and make games with just touch and motion control.

What are your thoughts?

rdej47

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scrubbyscum999

2. Posted:

I too am a bit worried developers will get lazy again. The problem is the Big N can't control developers. Putting unique features with the Gamepad would also practically require the game to be exclusive. In the age of multi-plat, I don't know if that can happen. The problem here is that if the developers just see the Wii U as a another system to port games to instead of something unique sales will fall back on brand loyalty and exclusives. Nintendo doesn't want that fight, especially since the competition will be at least a little more powerful and may have similar app like features and maybe better integration into the household.

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brooks83

3. Posted:

The Wii U Pro controller is a stand alone controller that doesn't have to be attached to the Wiimote. I guess technically a developer doesn't have to use Wiimotes at all, they can just require extra Pro controllers.

brooks83

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Sjoerd

4. Posted:

Because a WiiU is backwards compatible, Wiimote are still supported, and probably because they want Wii-owners to buy one faster. The procontroller was designed for multi-platform purposes, the Gamepad will probably only be used when they can think of something usefull to do with it.
Lazy 3rd party dvelopers is one of my big concerns and it probably will happen. look at what most developers did with the second (3)DS screen.

Hopefully developers will be inspired by ZombiU, Rayman Legends and Nintendoland, which are probably the most innovative titles so far.
When the WiiU eShop turns out to be a solid platform, smaller yet brilliant ideas will lead to innovative games faster.

Games like Mighty Switch Force on 3DS eShop are great examples of simple ideas ending up in a wonderful game. Let's hope Nintendo won't end up scaring indies with their bureaucracy. I think WiiU could be a great Indie platform!

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LolWut

5. Posted:

tbh, I'd rather them not put too much emphasis on the new gamepad's screen. I prefer an old school, traditional controller. Yes, I know there's a pro controller and yes I will get one. What I'm worried about, is what happens when TOO much emphasis is placed on it? Will it get to a point where certain (more "mainstream"?) games REQUIRE use of it for certain actions (like certain Nintendoland mini-games)? And will people who don't care for it have to succumb to using it, whether they'd like to or not?

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Gamesake

6. Posted:

rdej47 wrote:

I think Nintendo would have been best off either really innovating with the GamePad or leaving out the GamePad altogether and refining the motion controls.

That's one of the reasons it's so great to have the Wiimote and Nunchuk compatibilty with the Wii U (besides not having to buy new controllers). Developers like Capcom have learned a lot from working on the Wii, they've said in interviews that if they could do it over, they would have a better idea of how to use motion controls. There's a good chance the next HD Zelda will have a Wii remote control scheme too. I'm hoping Black Ops 2 uses them like Black Ops did on the Wii. Motion controls get a second chance on Wii U. The Wii was like a rehearsal.

rdej47 wrote:

use the GamePad if you can, but what if you want 4 player's? That's out the window because now you have to go back to Wii Remotes.

Asymmetrical gameplay. You wanted innovation.

rdej47 wrote:

I feel like developers will get lazy with the GamePad and again resort to an inventory screen or a map screen on the GamePad which again isn't innovation to me.

That's a good thing. Multiplatform games shouldn't overuse the touch screen. You have to know when not to use it. I play too many DS games where I get tired quickly of all the touching because it feels forced.

Edited on by Gamesake

...in my pants.

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verymetal

7. Posted:

The original Wii gets picked on a lot. Did shovel ware plaque the system? Yes; however, Xbox and PS3 has a ton of shovel ware as well. The sad truth is that mediocre games will be on the system, so third parties can make a quick buck. This will never go away. As for the Wii U, I am excited about it. It is about time Nintendo finally started to gain consumer interest. I think it is a positive thing that there are so many different control options. The Wii was limited, that is why there was a ton of crappy games for it, and only a few dozen AAA games. With so many different control methods for the Wii U and the power of the console you really should see less shovel ware and more quality games.

verymetal

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rdej47

8. Posted:

I think Nintendo is hurting itself by even targeting multiplatform games. The nature of their system and controller doesn't make it work. I fear multiplatform will be mediocre on the Wii U for two reasons.

1) Xbox 720 and PS4 graphics: As we saw with the Wii, multiplatform games were ugly rushed ports that were never given the attention that their Xbox/PS3 counterparts shared. For example games like Star Wars Force Unleashed, looks gorgeous on Xbox then looks like an N64 game on the Wii. I feel this is a big mistake that Nintendo is making in launching so far ahead of the competition. Once Xbox/PS4 are released I think the Wii U will be stuck with multiplatform games that look like garbage compared to their counterparts and will probably control exactly the same as them i.e. Call of Duty 5 using the Pro controller with inferior graphics on the Wii U.

2) The controller: Again I love that Nintendo thinks outside the box, but not everyone follows unfortunately. NFC, Wii Motion Plus, Wii Fit board, touch screen, these are all new ways of experiencing games but with multi platform games developers are most likely to fall back to the most common control method: the traditional controller. This really sucks for the same reason that I stated above, you've got this innovative new controller but you don't use it because Call of Duty 5 on the Wii U uses the Pro controller because it's easier to port from other systems.

I really think Nintendo should have really strayed from the pack this generation if it wants to maintain it's edge. In trying to appeal to both crowds: motion control/touch control, and hardcore traditional games (controllers) they appeal to no one. They should have left insane graphics and basic controller to Xbox and Playstation, while they stick strictly to motion/touch control and create games that can only truly be experienced on the Wii U. To me graphics don't matter when the experience is unique (Wii Sports, very basic graphics but fun gameplay or Red Steel 2, great cel shaded graphics and FPS swordplay) but when I see a game like Star Wars Force Unleashed on multiple consoles and it looks and controls like crap on Wii then I move to other consoles. By doing just motion/touch that would force developers to get creative.

Apple has proven there is money to be made from touch based games and that there are truly unique experiences that can only be done with touch. The Wii U should be something that developers truly bring new ideas to, not something they try and shoehorn traditional experiences into and then try feed it to us as innovative (second screen maps/inventory) I know i've been hating on the map/inventory screen but give me a break.

rdej47

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19Robb92

9. Posted:

Nah, I'm not worried abou that.

Developers are gonna be forced to assume that every WiiU owner plays with the WiiU GamePad since that's the only controler that actually comes right in the box. So they're gonna develop games with the GamePad in mind every time. Which is exactly what they should be doing.

And when it comes down to usage, the Gamepad actually allows lazy developers to be lazy and devoted developers to do something special. A lazy dev can just port the exact same control mechanic of a Playstation/Xbox controller (since the Wiiu has the same layout now) and then just put the HUD on the controller. While the devs that actually want to take all the features in to consideration, can.

Every game doesn't have to be innovative or use all the features of the GamePad.

Edited on by 19Robb92

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Void

10. Posted:

rdej47 wrote:

1) Xbox 720 and PS4 graphics: As we saw with the Wii, multiplatform games were ugly rushed ports that were never given the attention that their Xbox/PS3 counterparts shared. For example games like Star Wars Force Unleashed, looks gorgeous on Xbox then looks like an N64 game on the Wii. I feel this is a big mistake that Nintendo is making in launching so far ahead of the competition. Once Xbox/PS4 are released I think the Wii U will be stuck with multiplatform games that look like garbage compared to their counterparts and will probably control exactly the same as them i.e. Call of Duty 5 using the Pro controller with inferior graphics on the Wii U.

Even if the Next X-box and PS4 will be 4K resolution capable, it wouldn't matter untill a good share of people on the market have TVs capable of showing it, which probably won't happen until halfway in the Wii U's life, if it does happen at all in the Wii U's life, as it stands, graphics difference probably won't play much of a role in this console generation, the next X-box and PS4 could easily have more processing power, and a lot of technical stuff that I have no idea what it's supposed to do, and thus be more powerful, but I doubt it's going to be profitable to try to push the limit of a console, if it's not much beyond the capabilitys of another, if they wanted to do that they would stop thinking about consoles and just make a way better version for PC since it will always be able to blow any console out of the water in terms of specs.

Edit: GAH! I'm getting too serious, NEEDS MORE TOUNG SMILEY. :P
(Also, inb4 some tech-savvy person decids to chew me out for my uninformed teenage opinion.)

Edited on by Void

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DarkNinja9

11. Posted:

you bring up a interesting point but for me i think it will depend since the gamepad is the main focus and everything and its suppose to bring a while new way to play they might try to focus on that and find a way to use the game pad some how besides just having it be used as a map like in them batman game for example you pick the items on the game game and you also search around with the game pad and do the puzzles on it

saying that though i still think its to early tell which way it will end up going once everyone gets there hands on the console and they see what its fully able to do then ideas of using the game pad or not should arrive :P

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