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Topic: Why would anyone go digital on the Wii U? And have you?

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8BitSamurai

81. Posted:

@skywake
All of the big 3's e-shops tell you right in the terms of service that these game's licenses can be revoked at will, and that you cannot do anything with them that they don't want you to (Selling, loaning, etc.), although Steam is more lenient to my knowledge. I take care of my games, and I expect to have them in working order 30 years from now, at least the vast majority of them. With digital, when the servers go down, your hard drive is just like a ticking time bomb to corrupt or fail. Not to mention retro game markets simply will not exist, unless you want to take somebody's whole system and their hard drive. There are too many different demographics that will always opt for the disc, many times exclusively, and unless they suddenly get abducted by aliens, they will keep physical as a significant player in games perpetually.

Edited on by 8BitSamurai

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rallydefault

82. Posted:

10000mario wrote:

rallydefault wrote:

I'm all-digital on the Wii U and it rocks. The digital deluxe promotion is awesome (constant 10% rebate on all purchases, basically), and if you wait for sales just like you do for a retail store, you can come pretty darn close to paying as little as some of the best sales I've seen. Sure, the eShop is no Steam when it comes to daily specials, so you do need a bit of patience. It's wonderfully convenient having all of my games in one place and not having to swap out discs all the time, and with so many smaller digital games becoming popular, it's not uncommon for me to spend 10 minutes or so on three or four different games in a single play session.

me too, I actually went out of my way and sold nintendo land and then downloaded it just cause I wanted all digital games. I think it's great, if there is a game coming out that I want then there is no need to preorder and then hope they have the game in the store on release day (that happened to me before, i didn't get the game for a few days later). I just stay up to midnight, buy, and go to bed. Then next morning, BOOM! Right on my home menu. Easy as pie... Or mayonaise...

Yea, the ability to get some of these games (Wind Waker comes to mind) MUCH earlier digitally is a huge plus, as well. As others have pointed out, YES, you will often pay a bit more - so it really comes down to convenience. Is the extra 10-20 bucks worth the convenience and sometimes early access for you? Or is it not? That's really the bottom line, and some people (like myself) have chosen to perhaps put out a couple more dollars every now and then to achieve a bit more convenience and ease of access.

rallydefault

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shingi_70

83. Posted:

I probably wont. I'll keep my consoles retail games and my handhelds full digital.

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skywake

84. Posted:

SCAR392 wrote:

@skywake
So PC physical copies are already basically dead, then? I understand physical copies will always exist at retail, but that's beside the point that PC has already been in a similar situation. The only difference is that people weren't throwing as much of a fit for PC.

The reason why Steam is so much cheaper is because it's a digital only platform. As you can see here, not everyone wants to buy digital copies from a home console because it can't compare to Steam pricing, but Steam is how it is now, because it gave up physical copies for the most part.

I don't see why you're asking the question, that's pretty much what I said. Piracy was worse on PC games and as I mentioned the platform has never relied on game shops for sales. People won't stop buying gaming PCs if they walk into EBs and see nothing on the shelf for PC. Whereas if Nintendo suddenly priced the eShop aggressively then people might start thinking that there are no games for their systems and not buy it.

8BitSamurai wrote:

@skywake
All of the big 3's e-shops tell you right in the terms of service that these game's licenses can be revoked at will, and that you cannot do anything with them that they don't want you to (Selling, loaning, etc.), although Steam is more lenient to my knowledge. I take care of my games, and I expect to have them in working order 30 years from now, at least the vast majority of them. With digital, when the servers go down, your hard drive is just like a ticking time bomb to corrupt or fail. Not to mention retro game markets simply will not exist, unless you want to take somebody's whole system and their hard drive. There are too many different demographics that will always opt for the disc, many times exclusively, and unless they suddenly get abducted by aliens, they will keep physical as a significant player in games perpetually.

They have the same licence agreement on physical copies of games, look on your boxes. They explicitly state that any unauthorised modifications may render the game/system unplayable. They even include firmware updates that are required to play the new game that have been known to brick modified systems. So you're already entering into that sort of agreement even when you buy games physically.

As for system reliability and the alleged inevitable failure of digital purchases. Well, where do I start? Since we're in the Wii U section it's worth pointing out that you can backup your digital purchases to a second drive and to the system itself. To my knowledge the same is true on most if not all other platforms including the 3DS. Steam in particular allows you to backup your game data to any media you can think of. Seriously, if they did shut down the servers without providing a more permanent imagine the outrage.

I can't see them not "solving" that "problem" before that day may or may not come. In many ways they already have, digital is far more secure than disks on Steam already and it's only insecurity on Nintendos platform is the risk of someone stealing your console. Nintendo is basically alone on that one although the NNID integration on 3DS is a good step forwards in that regard.

If you want to do the "in 30 years time" bit let me do my own. In 30 years I'm sure that people buying games will look at physical media in the same way that we look at newspapers and sneaker net. It may still exist but if it does we'll wonder why.

Edited on by skywake

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SCAR392

85. Posted:

Ya, but the argument is based on preferences that could clearly change based on the physical format. Physical games still need to be kept intact in cases of no internet and for the sake of retail, but digital would be the best option if you have that.

Nintendo maintaining a balance between their discs at retail and eShop is not the isuue here, although alot of people make it out to be. That's why I'm saying that a mainly digital future for video games wouldn't exactly be a bad idea, considering those that prefer Steam are opposing exactly what they have already supported, which is the digital format.

Correct me if I'm wrong, but that's the sort of attitude when it comes to physical vs. digital. Even Microsoft has tried pretty well at being a key player for home consoles. Also with Steambox... There's a trend for PC content to transition to home consoles if Microsoft and Valve are anything to go by.

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CaPPa

86. Posted:

I'll buy games that have a lot of hours play time digitally to save on drive wear (like Monster Hunter), or games that have good offscreen play so that I can just start it without having to get up (like NFS MW), or games that are just impossible to find in stores (like The Wonderful 101 or Splinter Cell), or sometimes just to get some DPP discount (Deus Ex).

There are good discounts sometimes too, like the Monster Hunter sale that they had (3DS for $20 and the Wii U for $30) or the RE Revelations one (3DS for $10, Wii U for $30). They also announced monthly eShop promotions, starting this month with Zelda titles.

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MAB

87. Posted:

I find that digital supporters are all round better people in life that help keep the industry alive ;)

MAB

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Reverandjames

88. Posted:

MadAussieBloke wrote:

I find that digital supporters are all round better people in life that help keep the industry alive ;)

Haha, you are a controversial one aren't you!?

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rockybalboa

89. Posted:

Love digital

rockybalboa

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8BitSamurai

90. Posted:

@skywake
How is "Unauthorized modifications may render the system inoperable" the same as "Games are licensed to you, not sold, you are not free to loan or sell the license. The license may be revoked at any time"? Not to mention I don't even see that.

Being able to backup to one more drive will only slightly delay the inevitable doom of digital copies, and always having to make sure you have your drives backed up or your games are gone for good is not cool. Physical media is an infinitely longer lasting solution. Even if, suddenly, all of my SNES carts went out for some bizarre reason, it would be as simple as eBaying more. With digital, games are essentially locked to one individual when the servers go down, there would not be any way to obtain retro games without buying somebody's whole system and drive. Classic games would become phantoms.

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skywake

91. Posted:

@8BitSamurai
and you can't backup your disks at all legally so surely they're even more sensitive to failure. I mean I have a pretty rigorous backup schedule for my data and even I have stopped using disks entirely for that. And I backup famly photos and videos so I'm much more concerned about them than I am about games, and I trust the 2X WD Reds in RAID. Odds are you do less and are happy with the level of redundancy. If you're that paranoid about losing your game data then there are much better solutions to that problem if you buy digitally. Not to mention the servers which you seem to somehow think are the central point of failure.

As for ownership perhaps you should look at all of your other physical media also. If you buy a CD you're told that you've brought a licence and that any unauthorised copying, reproduction, hiring, lending, public performance or broadcast is prohibited. So I think you're putting your head in the sand if you think this is a brand new thing that only applies to the digital purchase of games. It applies to basically all media.

Edited on by skywake

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Unca_Lz

92. Posted:

8BitSamurai wrote:

@skywake
How is "Unauthorized modifications may render the system inoperable" the same as "Games are licensed to you, not sold, you are not free to loan or sell the license. The license may be revoked at any time"? Not to mention I don't even see that.

Being able to backup to one more drive will only slightly delay the inevitable doom of digital copies, and always having to make sure you have your drives backed up or your games are gone for good is not cool. Physical media is an infinitely longer lasting solution. Even if, suddenly, all of my SNES carts went out for some bizarre reason, it would be as simple as eBaying more. With digital, games are essentially locked to one individual when the servers go down, there would not be any way to obtain retro games without buying somebody's whole system and drive. Classic games would become phantoms.

You forget one thing. Some of those said carts will be super expensive in the future. Look at some PS1 RPGs for example.

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8BitSamurai

93. Posted:

@skywake
I would much rather just have discs that are not prone to corruption and the likes of that, and if for some reason they go down on me, just get another one. Of course, I don't think that would be necessary, as I've never had any problems with any of my physical games that I've taken care of. If you really think that digital and it's backup methods are more permanent, then we'll just have to agree to disagree.

As far as ownership is concerned, of course you cannot reproduce, copy, or do whatever you might like to do with what is on the disc, as you don't own that specific piece of software. I am well aware of this, and it applies to all forms of media. What you do own when you buy a game, is that copy of the game, and unless you specifically agree otherwise, you can sell it, give it away, trade it, let your friends borrow it, whatever you want. When you buy a game digitally, you forfeit those privileges in the terms of service you agree to. These are two totally different things.

@DarkwingLz
Totally true, but I would definitely say it's a better option than not having any way to acquire them at all.

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Unca_Lz

94. Posted:

And what happens if that one breaks? Are you willing to drop yet another $150 on another one?

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8BitSamurai

95. Posted:

DarkwingLz wrote:

And what happens if that one breaks? Are you willing to drop yet another $150 on another one?

I think these kinds of games would be far more than $150 if they were digital only. It's having tens or hundreds of thousands of discs in circulation, or having the games on a limited amount of systems, and needing to buy the whole deal to get the one. I have also never had a game break since I started taking care of things.

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MAB

96. Posted:

Untitled
I foresee a future with systems that don't have disc drives... Soon you will be required to fall in line with the superior digital master race ;)

When this occurs next generation I guess all physical supporters are just gonna have to suck it up and ↓
Untitled

MAB

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skywake

97. Posted:

8BitSamurai wrote:

I think these kinds of games would be far more than $150 if they were digital only. It's having tens or hundreds of thousands of discs in circulation, or having the games on a limited amount of systems, and needing to buy the whole deal to get the one. I have also never had a game break since I started taking care of things.

Yeah, that's bull. If I wanted to play Earthbound legally in Australia before the VC release I would have had to track down a North American SNES (a good $100-120 including postage). Then I would have had to find a copy of Earthbound (another ~$180 including postage). So that's a good $280AU to play Earthbound the old fashioned physical copy way. Alternatively I could buy a 32GB Wii U with Nintendo Land, New SMB U and New Super Luigi U then get Earthbound and pay $440AU. If it was on the Wii VC I'd be paying about $80 to play it now if that. Just throwing that out there.

Also with a digital product scarcity is less of a thing. You're again making a big deal about servers dying and companies going bankrupt causing all licences to be revoked. This is the basis for your argument. In reality when a physical product doesn't sell they stop production and there's a low number of units in the wild. When a digital copy sells poorly they slash the price but keep it "on the shelves". So you can actually buy games that bombed years after the fact.

As for longevity well iTunes has been up for a good decade without any massive deletion of people's rights to purchased content. Nintendo's shops have been open since 2006 and stuff I downloaded on day 1 is still there for me to redownload if I want. Even stuff that has since been removed from the shop (just Donkey Kong Country) is still available for me to redownload.

Maybe a tad less sensationalism and a little bit more realism in your posts? Nintendo's eShop has problems (it's tied to the console, purchases on 3DS aren't recognised on Wii U) but the stuffs you're talking about are not the problems anyone should lose any sleep over.

Edited on by skywake

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Warruz

98. Posted:

sevex wrote:

I'm going totally digital on my 3DS, since it's real convenient to take all my purchases with me when I go anywhere, but my Wii U stays home, and it's only the 8GB model, so I'll likely be buying discs for that thing.

This is exactly what i am doing. For the 3DS having everything on hand all the time is a godsend for a portal device. My Wii U on the other hand isnt going anywhere and having discs let me trade with friends also.

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shingi_70

99. Posted:

MadAussieBloke wrote:

Untitled
I foresee a future with systems that don't have disc drives... Soon you will be required to fall in line with the superior digital master race ;)

When this occurs next generation I guess all physical supporters are just gonna have to suck it up and ↓
Untitled

Isn't that a bad thing though. I mean i'm a proponent of digital content, but all digital for gaming just isn't viable at all. We'd still need HDD sizes to go down more and internet just isn't there and for a few countries will never be unless the ISPs go over a severe reboot soon.

Even than the biggest downside is once we go all digital what's keeping the big three from going to DRM heaven. We're already seeing a ton of online only games, and once something becomes digital only you lose the right to complain if everything does online only.

Remember digital games on consoles didn't have an all encompassing third party that was able to curb DRM and prices like Apple, Amazon, and Vavle were able to do.

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Beetlejuice

100. Posted:

DarkwingLz wrote:

And what happens if that one breaks? Are you willing to drop yet another $150 on another one?

Hate to break it to you, but those high prices are due to rarity and because its a collectible.
If someone wants to own a physical copy that expensive, it's because they are a collector. All of those rare games can be obtained in minutes and played on emulators if their only desire is to 'play' the game. A digital file has no value.

Edited on by Beetlejuice

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