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Topic: Rayman Legends delayed

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Wonder_Ideal

281. Posted:

CanisWolfred wrote:

Their customers would've been mad no matter what they did. That's the part no ones realizing through all of this. If they released the Wii U Version first, their Xbox and PS3 customers would be mad. Especially the Microsoft customers if it doesn't come out on their system at all. Now they're only angering the Wii U fanbase - their smallest potential consumer-base. Again, it's the lesser of two evils. Granted, I hope the games get delayed until after GTAV and the other big games come out, because right now they really are screwed no matter what they do, but if it's out of they're control, there's nothing anyone can do.

I'm not sure why the Microsoft and Sony customers would be angry if Legends came out on the Wii U first. They wouldn't have been expecting to get the game until the recent announcement. I would expect that PS3 and 360 owners are happy that Ubi decided to make it multi-plat, but why would they be annoyed if it was released on Wii U when it was supposed to?

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shingi_70

282. Posted:

I think Nintendo and Ubisoft had a verbal contract for Rayman Legends being exclusive. Something happened and now its been delayed and no longer an exclusive of any kind.

I mean no one one complained that Splinter Cell Conviction was an Xbox exclusive.

Think this of a case of Nintendo not ironing out the deals with ubisoft.

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Everly

283. Posted:

Sony_70 wrote:

I mean no one one complained that Splinter Cell Conviction was an Xbox exclusive.

Perhaps you meant no one that matters complained.

Edited on by Everly

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Sean_Aaron

284. Posted:

Nice analysis Everly. I'd call it a post-mortem, but I don't think it's played out yet. I cannot imagine we won't hear anything further from Ubisoft come Monday. Everyone keeps bringing up this Microsoft statement like it's new, but that was reported in 2011, so no, I don't think "Microsoft is to blame" here. The only party which appears to be at fault is Ubisoft. The whole time it's been their declarations of exclusivity, their release dates and now their decision not to publish a completed game for a non-reason.

I cannot see any rational reason for not doing online distribution at a minimum on-schedule. Honestly if they cannot do this one simple thing, then they may as well just join EA and practically drop support for the platform altogether. I don't see the value in half-assing it with the odd port here and there. Wii U owners would be better served by Nintendo investing in more partnerships which result in the kinds of titles fans want, but where they'll have sufficient stake to ensure an appearance on their systems in a timely fashion.

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Everly

285. Posted:

Sean_Aaron wrote:

Nice analysis Everly.

Thanks Sean. I've enjoyed reading your responses and takes on the issues that are mentioned here on the forum. I sent a request to you through the Wii U system hoping to add you for whenever NoA decides to release Zen Pinball here in the States.

Sean_Aaron wrote:

I cannot imagine we won't hear anything further from Ubisoft come Monday.

I agree, I'm just not sure how they will be able to make it worse for themselves. But I am confident they will find a way.

Sean_Aaron wrote:

The only party which appears to be at fault is Ubisoft. The whole time it's been their declarations of exclusivity, their release dates and now their decision not to publish a completed game for a non-reason.

I agree, they didn't make Microsoft's policy, but they decided to capitulate to it in spite of the fact that it would fly in the face of the statements you are citing.

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edhe

286. Posted:

I've changed my mind. I will not buy Rayman Legends on release if it isn't released this month.

One of the reasons for wanting to stick with it was that I'll be getting it from a shop where I could earn double reward points for fulfilling a preorder, but I'm willing to take that hit and get it much cheaper.

I added my name to the petition as well. Ubisoft may not change their decision, but they must know that we cannot be taken for granted.

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Sean_Aaron

287. Posted:

Given my kid is now keen to get New Super Mario Bros. U I don't think I'll have any issues skipping Rayman come September. Getting the next Pokemon in October will be additional distraction, but she's never been a gimme gimme gimme kind of child. I'm not a person who's ever bought a Rayman game so my voice doesn't really count, but I'll feel better regardless.

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ShadJV

288. Posted:

I still think boycotting will do more damage than help, and not just Ubisoft. All third parties will see it as yet another third party title with poor sales and it could hurt the chances of the Wii U getting included in multiplatform titles. A logical boycott would be refusing to buy the 360 or PS3 versions. Still, I doubt this will get through to anyone, definitely will do no favors for the third party support (FYI most companies will not care the reason sales were low, they'll still see it as a reason to avoid the system).

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CanisWolfred

289. Posted:

Ideal_Hero wrote:

CanisWolfred wrote:

Their customers would've been mad no matter what they did. That's the part no ones realizing through all of this. If they released the Wii U Version first, their Xbox and PS3 customers would be mad. Especially the Microsoft customers if it doesn't come out on their system at all. Now they're only angering the Wii U fanbase - their smallest potential consumer-base. Again, it's the lesser of two evils. Granted, I hope the games get delayed until after GTAV and the other big games come out, because right now they really are screwed no matter what they do, but if it's out of they're control, there's nothing anyone can do.

I'm not sure why the Microsoft and Sony customers would be angry if Legends came out on the Wii U first. They wouldn't have been expecting to get the game until the recent announcement. I would expect that PS3 and 360 owners are happy that Ubi decided to make it multi-plat, but why would they be annoyed if it was released on Wii U when it was supposed to?

They wouldn't have gotten the game at all if it wasn't released on the same day. Unless you're talking about the reasoning for the policy itself, in which case, it's the same reason some people are mad that they're not getting Wii U versions the same time as everyone else - because it means they're recieving a lower quality of support than those with the other consoles, and one more negative to add to the list for the console they chose (and will probably be stuck with if they can't afford to get a different one).

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Sean_Aaron

290. Posted:

ShadJV wrote:

I still think boycotting will do more damage than help, and not just Ubisoft.

Maybe, but Ubisoft created this situation by setting expectations, so it's really their own fault. They still have the power to fix it by doing the right thing by Wii U owners - it's not too late!

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SirSmugleaf

291. Posted:

What Ubisoft should have done was release Legends later this February as scheduled, but then announced at a later date that it would be ported to 360 & PS3. ALL the fans would have (at least) been (more) happy then, and Ubisoft would have looked like a hero!
Although some may be a little annoyed that it wouldn't be an exclusive anymore, It sure hurt that at the same time for us they suddenly took it away from us so early from release, and it doesn't help watching the ads around November: "Coming at launch exclusively to Wii U!"

I've probably just repeated what everyone else has said in this thread, but that's just my thoughts.

Edited on by SirSmugleaf

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ShadJV

292. Posted:

Sean_Aaron wrote:

ShadJV wrote:

I still think boycotting will do more damage than help, and not just Ubisoft.

Maybe, but Ubisoft created this situation by setting expectations, so it's really their own fault. They still have the power to fix it by doing the right thing by Wii U owners - it's not too late!

Just because Ubisoft was in the wrong doesn't mean we should further damage third party support. If the Wii U version sells well enough, it proves to them that the system is worth supporting and they would likely start supporting it again. If it sells bad, they're likely to abandon the system entirely. Boycotting will almost certainly not accomplish what is intended.

As for Ubisoft fixing this, I doubt they'll suddenly bring the release date closer again for the Wii U version; I've never seen a release date change back after being pushed and besides, it's likely that they have no choice in changing release dates again due to Microsoft's terms for multiplatform releases on their console, and canceling the 360 version would give them even worse backlash at this point.

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Everly

293. Posted:

ShadJV wrote:

canceling the 360 version would give them even worse backlash at this point.

I honestly don't see a move they can make right now. The Facebook post about the demo has been a negative comment magnet this weekend with over 2,400 comments. When you look at previous posts they have made all the was back to December on all types of games and events people are commenting about this issue.

Ubisoft won't be able to make any annoucements about anything without being over run will enraged gamers. Their Facebook page is almost worthless to them right now as is the Uplay community in the Miiverse. It is all anyone is talking about in these communities and the longer Ubisoft is staying silent the worse it will end up being for them.

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Sean_Aaron

294. Posted:

ShadJV wrote:

Just because Ubisoft was in the wrong doesn't mean we should further damage third party support. If the Wii U version sells well enough, it proves to them that the system is worth supporting and they would likely start supporting it again. If it sells bad, they're likely to abandon the system entirely. Boycotting will almost certainly not accomplish what is intended.

Right and I helped elect Bush Jr. when I voted my conscience and ticked the box for Ralph Nader. You know at some point people have to do what they think is right and damn the consequences. If Ubisoft tanks as a result of people boycotting Rayman in September (and to be perfectly honest given how capricious gamers tend to be I'll be surprised if people stick to their guns on this), then it will send a message to other 3rd parties that if they want sales on the Wii U they have to take the Wii U userbase seriously. Of course Ubisoft won't likely tank and they won't likely feel like they can afford to ignore a console with x-millions of systems out there so they'll continue to publish Rabbids and Just Dance games or whatever on the Wii U just like in the past.

Realistically I think the worst outcome will be if Rayman Legends fails to wow on any platform it might mean the series takes a hiatus for awhile. I would like to think that something more will come of this event, but I rather doubt it, just like I rather doubt the Wii U is doomed.

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Cipher

295. Posted:

Sean_Aaron wrote:

If Ubisoft tanks as a result of people boycotting Rayman in September (and to be perfectly honest given how capricious gamers tend to be I'll be surprised if people stick to their guns on this), then it will send a message to other 3rd parties that if they want sales on the Wii U they have to take the Wii U userbase seriously.

Unfortunately, it's a very easy target for developers and publishers to take the "that console's owners don't like to be screwed over so we're going to treat them nicely" and turn a game's poor sales into "the userbase simply isn't interested enough in that genre to buy into it, so we made a conscious decision not to release that game on that console."

I'll still be getting the game - though not necessarily at launch, depending on what else is out around the time - because I feel sorry for the developers and because I still want the Wii U version of the game to do well. I just can't see a "poor sales" situation ending well, because we all know pretty much every publisher will take that as "userbase not interested" and we'll continue to be screwed over by far bigger forces than Ubisoft.

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ShadJV

296. Posted:

Sean_Aaron wrote:

ShadJV wrote:

Just because Ubisoft was in the wrong doesn't mean we should further damage third party support. If the Wii U version sells well enough, it proves to them that the system is worth supporting and they would likely start supporting it again. If it sells bad, they're likely to abandon the system entirely. Boycotting will almost certainly not accomplish what is intended.

Right and I helped elect Bush Jr. when I voted my conscience and ticked the box for Ralph Nader. You know at some point people have to do what they think is right and damn the consequences. If Ubisoft tanks as a result of people boycotting Rayman in September (and to be perfectly honest given how capricious gamers tend to be I'll be surprised if people stick to their guns on this), then it will send a message to other 3rd parties that if they want sales on the Wii U they have to take the Wii U userbase seriously. Of course Ubisoft won't likely tank and they won't likely feel like they can afford to ignore a console with x-millions of systems out there so they'll continue to publish Rabbids and Just Dance games or whatever on the Wii U just like in the past.

Realistically I think the worst outcome will be if Rayman Legends fails to wow on any platform it might mean the series takes a hiatus for awhile. I would like to think that something more will come of this event, but I rather doubt it, just like I rather doubt the Wii U is doomed.

Other third parties are too busy with their own games to pay attention to what Ubisoft is doing. If the sales do tank, a lot of them will simply use the game as another example why they should avoid third party development for the Wii U; consequentially, if it does well then they have a good reason to develop for the system. People are not looking at a large enough scope to see how these kind of things could affect third party development in general. Nintendo has hardly had third party support for a long time and other companies surely noticed Ubisoft's early support for the system. So what they see is someone finally threw a bone to Nintendo consumers and what happened? They through a tantrum when the company pissed them off and refused to buy the product. If I was in charge of a development company in our economy, I'd see that as a sign to simply not deal with the hassle of Wii U development. If Microsoft has any sort of requirements for multiplatform titles, they likely are confidential so Ubisoft can't say, "Microsoft bullied us into changing the release date". So, to other companies, it looks like Wii U development is all or nothing: if they support the system, they have to do so exclusively, else they walk on eggshells and risk upsetting a fickle fanbase. With how the Nintendo fanbase acts, it will be a long time before we have some good third party support. Ubisoft won't tank, and neither is the Wii U doomed, but if we want to be taken seriously by third party developers we need to be willing to accept multiplatform releases along with all the strings that come with them (simultaneous releases due to competitors' requirements), we can't get upset over not getting a game first. Ubisoft isn't run by idiots, though I'm also not saying they're perfect. But there very likely are things out of their control preventing them from releasing it to the Wii U ahead of the other versions, because they obviously know it would be more profitable for them to release the Wii U version now and let it start selling. Ubisoft is trying to treat Nintendo equally to its competitors, unlike most third parties have been doing for awhile, and all we're telling them with this boycott is that we insist to be treated better than Sony or Microsoft fans, in which case most third parties will continue to avoid us and our extra baggage.

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ShadJV

297. Posted:

Cipher wrote:

Sean_Aaron wrote:

If Ubisoft tanks as a result of people boycotting Rayman in September (and to be perfectly honest given how capricious gamers tend to be I'll be surprised if people stick to their guns on this), then it will send a message to other 3rd parties that if they want sales on the Wii U they have to take the Wii U userbase seriously.

Unfortunately, it's a very easy target for developers and publishers to take the "that console's owners don't like to be screwed over so we're going to treat them nicely" and turn a game's poor sales into "the userbase simply isn't interested enough in that genre to buy into it, so we made a conscious decision not to release that game on that console."

I'll still be getting the game - though not necessarily at launch, depending on what else is out around the time - because I feel sorry for the developers and because I still want the Wii U version of the game to do well. I just can't see a "poor sales" situation ending well, because we all know pretty much every publisher will take that as "userbase not interested" and we'll continue to be screwed over by far bigger forces than Ubisoft.

Exactly. Thank you, at least somewhere here seems to get it.

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ShadJV

298. Posted:

Everly wrote:

ShadJV wrote:

canceling the 360 version would give them even worse backlash at this point.

I honestly don't see a move they can make right now. The Facebook post about the demo has been a negative comment magnet this weekend with over 2,400 comments. When you look at previous posts they have made all the was back to December on all types of games and events people are commenting about this issue.

Ubisoft won't be able to make any annoucements about anything without being over run will enraged gamers. Their Facebook page is almost worthless to them right now as is the Uplay community in the Miiverse. It is all anyone is talking about in these communities and the longer Ubisoft is staying silent the worse it will end up being for them.

Truth is, right now Ubisoft is damned if they do and damned if they don't. They put themselves in a corner and even if they regret so now, any move they make will pretty much piss off someone. If they want to release the Wii U version they likely can't make it multiplatform due to terms the other companies have given, and so that option pisses off Sony and Microsoft fans. Keeping things how they are will piss of Nintendo fans. It's lose-lose, but the 360 and PS3 install bases are bigger so logically if they have to piss off someone, they're going to go with what makes less people upset. Yes, they probably messed up but there's no real way to remedy it now.

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Shrapmo

299. Posted:

This sums up my feelings pretty well:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KxpF7qlBdsU

Here is a new petition to get Metal Gear Solid Rising: Revengence on the Wii U!!!
http://www.change.org/petitions/konami-platinum-games-metal-gear-rising-revengeance-for-the-nintendo-wii-u

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CliffordB

300. Posted:

They say one of the hardest things to say is "sorry" and admit you've made a mistake, but, I don't see any reason why Ubisoft can't hold their hands up and admit they were wrong over the delay of Rayman Legends on Wii U and go ahead and release it this month as planned, all Wii U owners will then be happy, Ubisoft should also be happy as I'm sure the Wii U version will be picked up by many if it's released NOW!

& PS3/Xbox 360 owners can still be happy knowing that they will be getting a game they never even expected to get at a later date.

I see no reason/excuse why this can't be done, and I think the majority of people would be happy with this.

CliffordB