Wii U Forum

Topic: Nintendo should map the Wii U Gamepad to the Classic Controller Pro/Gamecube Controller

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WhereEaglesDare

1. Posted:

Nintendo was not adverse to modifying the Wii firmware enough that the Wii U tablet can act as a television and sensor bar (on the sides of the camera on top of the screen.) I see this as a logical next step because I really don't want to buy a Wii Gamepad Pro, which reminds me: Wii U Gamepad Pro's being mapped would be nice as well.

Who's with me...next update?

Edited on by WhereEaglesDare

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OdnetninAges

2. Posted:

I want to say yes, but I feel that would kinda dampen the point of having two separate Virtual Console services.
Not completely kill it, as the WiiUVC still has Restore Points, Miiverse Communities, and the ability to go to the HOME menu, but still...

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skywake

3. Posted:

They could add other features to the Wii U VC. Like being able to link purchases to the 3DS. Plus you already don't have to go through as many menus

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skywake

4. Posted:

The VC I don't mind personally, I'll be updating the ones I want anyways eventually. What I want to see this for are the titles that I won't be able to do that with. WiiWare and retail Wii stuffs that had CC support. Obviously Mario Kart and Smash Bros but also stuffs like Tatsunoku vs. Capcom.

Actually, come to think of it probably just Tatsunoku vs Capcom. Everything else I have outside of VC either never had CC support, is getting shiny new Wii U iterations or I don't really care about anymore.

Edited on by skywake

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TruenoGT

5. Posted:

Xenoblade would really rock for this. Tried it with the new update and it's ok, but since you aren't holding the pad, you can't get as close to the screen, so it's just too small for many games IMO.... but still really cool.

Regarding VC, I imagine there will be many games that don't make the Wii U jump (for example, will TG16 or Genesis ever come? Maybe a lot of 3rd party games?) so it would be nice to have this work around.

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DarkEdi

6. Posted:

Now Turbografx, Neo Geo, Master System, Genesis, N64 and Arcade games will be playable in the gamepad!!!

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skywake

7. Posted:

Atariboy wrote:

Also, the correct 4:3 output is possible where as the Wii U always stretches Wii mode to 16:9 when outputting in HD.

I believe this is solved in the recent update. If it is we'll know quickly because someone will create a thread complaining about how the new update makes their Wii VC games smaller :)

Edited on by skywake

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skywake

8. Posted:

Atariboy wrote:

There's been nothing that I've seen that suggests it has been fixed. Any idea where you were led to believe that?

Saw it mentioned on twitter, looked for image confirmation of it just then. Came up with this:
Untitled
If it's scaling correctly on the GamePad and others have said it's working I'm going to assume its fixed. Unless someone can confirm otherwise.

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WhereEaglesDare

9. Posted:

Still hoping :P

WhereEaglesDare

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ferthepoet

10. Posted:

I don't have a Wii U so I might be wrong, someone can probably explain this better but, if I understand correctly, the problem is that the Wii U is not really technically backward compatible with Wii, instead it is just powerful enough in comparison to the Wii that it can run the whole Wii OS in an emulator window, the problem with that is that because it is just emulating the Wii OS it can't do anything that the original Wii couldn't in Wii mode.

ferthepoet

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Kodeen

11. Posted:

Yes, the Wii U is running the Wii OS either through emulation or a virtual machine. However, Nintendo of course still has the Wii OS source code and can modify it to play better with I/O from the Wii U. They could emulate the classic controller, or they could even implement native support for the Gamepad inputs (not sure how they're dealing with the screen output, I think it currently happens outside of the Wii OS's awareness).

Kodeen

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WhereEaglesDare

12. Posted:

ferthepoet wrote:

I don't have a Wii U so I might be wrong, someone can probably explain this better but, if I understand correctly, the problem is that the Wii U is not really technically backward compatible with Wii, instead it is just powerful enough in comparison to the Wii that it can run the whole Wii OS in an emulator window, the problem with that is that because it is just emulating the Wii OS it can't do anything that the original Wii couldn't in Wii mode.

Kodeen wrote:

Yes, the Wii U is running the Wii OS either through emulation or a virtual machine. However, Nintendo of course still has the Wii OS source code and can modify it to play better with I/O from the Wii U. They could emulate the classic controller, or they could even implement native support for the Gamepad inputs (not sure how they're dealing with the screen output, I think it currently happens outside of the Wii OS's awareness)..

Wrong, allow me to explain.

Wii U is backwards compatible with Wii right down to the hardware. It's not emulating anything at all, even the 512 MB flash chip the Wii launched with is on the bottom of the Wii U's motherboard and isn't affected by the 8 or 32 GB you otherwise have on the top of the board. The SD Card slot on the Wii U is exclusively for Wii Mode use as well. Wii is completely sandboxed and isn't emulated, it's hardware-based right down to the design of the Wii U's CPU and GPU. That's probably why it's so near flawless.

One of the few changes is the Wii U upscaled the Wii image to your HDTV instead of the other way around, so it might look slightly better. Additionally there were no digital outputs on the Wii, the best you could get was 480p through component. Wii U can on the other hand output through HDMI at the resolution you've set in the Wii U menu, upscaled.

From a technical standpoint the Wii U is actually backwards compatible all the way to Gamecube, as are later Wii's that dropped Gamecube compatibility and ports.

EDIT: That said, I really doubt Nintendo will map the Wii U Gamepad or Wii U Gamepad Pro as Wii Classic Controller Pros, if it's even possible.

Edited on by WhereEaglesDare

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Unca_Lz

13. Posted:

I don't think it is even possible. You can't even turn off the Wii U with the Gamepad in Wii Mode. I just don't think they're compatible.

Keep in mind that the sensor bar itself has nothing to do with the Wii. The sensor bar is nothing but two infrared lights used by the Wii remote to detect movement. It's the Wii remote itself that sends the movement info to the system, not the sensor bar. This is also why the candle light trick actually works and why the Gamepad is able to become a sensor bar. Henceforth, the gamepad is still not sending any info to the Wii mode.

BanjoThreeie wrote:

From a technical standpoint the Wii U is actually backwards compatible all the way to Gamecube, as are later Wii's that dropped Gamecube compatibility and ports.

I don't think so. When my Wii stopped reading discs, it still read Gamecube games fine. This makes me think that the gamecube compatibility was separate hardware similar to the PS3's backward compatibility to the PS2. Keep in mind that the Wii remote also did not work for Gamecube mode similar to how no Wii U hardware works for Wii mode.

Edited on by Unca_Lz

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SCAR392

14. Posted:

@DarkwingLz

The would only be true for Wii U regarding a 2 in 1 laser, since Wii U discs are bluray alternatives and Wii discs are DVD alternatives. They may have had a 2 in 1 laser for Wii, but it wasn't necessarily required. It was probably just easier ti read the smaller disc.
There's already confirmation that GCN is playable on Wii U. It just isn't supported by Nintendo because there's no reason to support 2 gens ago worth of software code to read physical GCN games. That's why Virtual console exists as well, otherwise Nintendo would have put a cartridge slot which isn't practical at all.

The software for reading discs and controllers is probably the only only thing keeping GCN from working.

@BanjoThreeie
To my understanding, the Wii hardware is indeed built into the system, but it's fully integrated into what makes the Wii U as well. I'm not entirely sure, though. I haven't looked at a Wii U "gut" pic in a while. Also, SD cards aren't exclusive to Wii Mode. You can use it to upload photos on to Miiverse in the Animal Crossing community and I think they'll probably give it more use eventually.

Why ignore a quick memory access option with SD cards if it makes sense, right? Same thing with if they added a photo or music area to Wii U. The SD card would probably be the first thing they'd suggest for you to use. 3DS is already doing that stuff, so it wouldn't be surprising if Wii U did the same.

EDIT: Realized I contradicted myself and made the correction.

Edited on by SCAR392

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WhereEaglesDare

15. Posted:

SCAR392 wrote:

@DarkwingLz
Hmmm. Maybe they used a different laser or GCN games are just easier to read?

The same would probably be true for Wii U regarding a 2 in 1 laser, since Wii U discs are bluray alternatives and Wii discs are DVD alternatives.
There's already confirmation that GCN is playable on Wii U. It just isn't supported by Nintendo because there's no reason to support 2 gens ago worth of software code to read physical GCN games. That's why Virtual console exists as well, otherwise Nintendo would have put a cartridge slot which isn't practical at all.

The physical requirements regarding discs and controllers is probably the only only thing keeping GCN from working.

@BanjoThreeie
To my understanding, the Wii hardware is indeed built into the system, but it's fully integrated into what makes the Wii U as well. I'm not entirely sure, though. I haven't looked at a Wii U "gut" pic in a while. Also, SD cards aren't exclusive to Wii Mode. You can use it to upload photos on to Miiverse in the Animal Crossing community and I think they'll probably give it more use eventually.

Why ignore a quick memory access option with SD cards if it makes sense, right? Same thing with if they added a photo or music area to Wii U. The SD card would probably be the first thing they'd suggest for you to use. 3DS is already doing that stuff, so it wouldn't be surprising if Wii U did the same.

Didn't know about Animal Crossing, first use of it in Wii U mode then yes.

Yes, the Wii backwards compatibility is fully built into the CPU and GPU, it's not emulated in software. Wii U's Espresso and Latte are built on top of the existing architecture of the Wii's Broadway and Hollywood, and going back Gamecube's Gekko and Flipper.

I wish they kept the Dolphin name :P

Edited on by WhereEaglesDare

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SCAR392

16. Posted:

@BanjoThreeie
I was just tring to make it clear that the Wii chips still contribute to what makes the Wii U, as well. I know it uses a specific component, but the Wii U uses it, too.

This still doesn't explain how Windows 8 has full BC with Windows 7, though, which is then BC with other Windows legacy programs.

EDIT: I don't pay attention to how PCs work.

Edited on by SCAR392

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WhereEaglesDare

17. Posted:

SCAR392 wrote:

@BanjoThreeie
I was just tring to make it clear that the Wii chips still contribute to what makes the Wii U, as well. I know it uses a specific component, but the Wii U uses it, too.

This still doesn't explain how Windows 8 has full BC with Windows 7, though, which is then BC with other Wondows legacy programs.

Windows is just software. x86 is the applicable computer architecture (PowerPC in Wii U.) x86 is designed to be very backwards compatible. For example the Xbox One really should be able to play original Xbox games in the same way my PC can play older games.

Edited on by WhereEaglesDare

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SCAR392

18. Posted:

BanjoThreeie wrote:

SCAR392 wrote:

@BanjoThreeie
I was just tring to make it clear that the Wii chips still contribute to what makes the Wii U, as well. I know it uses a specific component, but the Wii U uses it, too.

This still doesn't explain how Windows 8 has full BC with Windows 7, though, which is then BC with other Wondows legacy programs.

Windows is just software. x86 is the applicable computer architecture (PowerPC in Wii U.) x86 is designed to be very backwards compatible. For example the Xbox One really should be able to play original Xbox games in the same way my PC can play older games.

That's what I was saying. When Microsoft announced that Xbox One wouldn't run Xbox 360 games, I knew it was only because they weren't going to program it to do so.

I thought every Xbox was based on PCs, but apparently some people had forgotten. Microsoft makes PCs afterall.

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skywake

19. Posted:

Do any of the people making these claims about how impossible it is have any experience in developing Wii U software? Even better any experience developing firmware for the Wii U or even just hacking the thing? If not then don't act like you know what is and isn't doable.

As I've said in other threads people used the same arguments to dismiss the possibility of playing games on the GamePad. The same arguments again to argue that a DS VC service is impossible. The fact is Nintendo have control of the whole system. If they want to allow a feature then they can. It's highly likely that it's just a firmware update away if they really wanted to enable it.

Problem is it's not really a feature worth pushing, it would just be a nice thing that the vast majority people won't care about very soon. I remember early in the Wii's life I desperately wanted similar features for Gamecube backwards compatibility. Within the first year I was into original Wii content enough that I didn't care anymore. Then later they killed backwards compatibility entirely in newer consoles and outside of Smash Bros Brawl controller support there wasn't much complaining going on.

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WhereEaglesDare

20. Posted:

DarkwingLz wrote:

I don't think so. When my Wii stopped reading discs, it still read Gamecube games fine. This makes me think that the gamecube compatibility was separate hardware similar to the PS3's backward compatibility to the PS2. Keep in mind that the Wii remote also did not work for Gamecube mode similar to how no Wii U hardware works for Wii mode.

No.

Untitled

Wii was at its heart essentially an overclocked Gamecube with some improvements. Only separate hardware was the ports at the top of the system and the optical drive being designed to accept Gamecube Optical Discs.

Some PS2's had problems playing DVD's but could still play DVD's, etc. It's annoying but it happens. At least early PS2 phats played PS1 games mostly in hardware, PS2 slims mostly in software. Both could have problems and remember some PS2 games came on CD's.

Untitled

PS3 had a completely different architecture than the PS2. Japan/NA launch PS3 had the PS2's CPU and GPU in the corner of the motherboard and even some PS2 RAM. Very costly and the CPU part didn't and IIRC the RAM didn't even last 'till European launch and by mid-2008 all PS2 components were removed. European launch PS3's and equivalent Japan/NA systems emulated the Emotion Engine (PS2 CPU) but still had the Graphics Synthesizer ( PS2 GPU.)

Edited on by WhereEaglesDare

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