Wii U Forum

Topic: Just got to get something off my chest...

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DefHalan

101. Posted:

CanisWolfred wrote:

@DefHalan Indies don't have to release big budget games on a yearly basis. They don't have to have hundreds of Staff learn the ins and outs of it, just a dozen or so at most.

True but if it was actually difficult Indies wouldn't waste their time as they do not have guaranteed paychecks. There are many different reasons why not to put something on the Wii U, difficulty of production is not one. Look at the PS3, at first it was said to be difficult to develop games on but now almost all 3rd Party games are on both the PS3 and 360.

http://dudehugespeaks.tumblr.com/post/44243746261/nickels-dimes-and-quarters
http://www.penny-arcade.com/patv/episode/why-console-specs-dont-matter
http://www.gamasutra.com/view/news/200271/Video_Don_Daglow_on_nextgen_transition_traps_and_treasures.php

3DS Friend Code: 2621-2786-9784 | Nintendo Network ID: DefHalan

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AlexSays

102. Posted:

DefHalan wrote:

I don't think the Wii U is as hard to develop for as the Ign article says or else how have indies been supporting it?

Nintendo is good about helping out indie devs

That article surveys a great deal of developers though, that number is coming from people that make games. Indie games have less choice when it comes to releasing their product because they don't have much money. Devs that release retail games have much more freedom to be picky, and the general consensus among them is that developing on the Wii U isn't worth the extra effort.

AlexSays

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SCAR392

103. Posted:

AlexSays wrote:

All of the specs can be changed my a firmware update? Ok I'm done here.

Game DVR = Mario Kart TV(similar use for other software possible)
Cloud = firmware, storage location may vary
Cross game chat = apparently that's Skype
Voice commands = possible
Subscription = possible

There's more to the success of a console than specs.

Edited on by theblackdragon

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AlexSays

104. Posted:

DefHalan wrote:

CanisWolfred wrote:

@DefHalan Indies don't have to release big budget games on a yearly basis. They don't have to have hundreds of Staff learn the ins and outs of it, just a dozen or so at most.

True but if it was actually difficult Indies wouldn't waste their time as they do not have guaranteed paychecks. There are many different reasons why not to put something on the Wii U, difficulty of production is not one. Look at the PS3, at first it was said to be difficult to develop games on but now almost all 3rd Party games are on both the PS3 and 360.

That was a much different situation. The architecture of the PS3 was really powerful, just awkwardly designed. Don't count on the Wii U sharing the same fate and getting a bunch of multiplat games.

Even if the Wii U wasn't awkward to develop for, the Ps4 and X1 are a lot more alike, therefore it makes sense to focus on making one game to accommodate two consoles opposed to just one. Devs aren't going to take games like The Witcher 3 and Battlefield 4 and dumb them down graphically and physically to fit on the Wii U. (Though according to SCAR, these games would look just as good if not better!)

AlexSays

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DefHalan

105. Posted:

AlexSays wrote:

DefHalan wrote:

I don't think the Wii U is as hard to develop for as the Ign article says or else how have indies been supporting it?

Nintendo is good about helping out indie devs

That article surveys a great deal of developers though, that number is coming from people that make games. Indie games have less choice when it comes to releasing their product because they don't have much money. Devs that release retail games have much more freedom to be picky, and the general consensus among them is that developing on the Wii U isn't worth the extra effort.

Right and for big companies the only thing that will make the Wii U "worth the extra effort" is a bigger install base.

AlexSays wrote:

DefHalan wrote:

CanisWolfred wrote:

@DefHalan Indies don't have to release big budget games on a yearly basis. They don't have to have hundreds of Staff learn the ins and outs of it, just a dozen or so at most.

True but if it was actually difficult Indies wouldn't waste their time as they do not have guaranteed paychecks. There are many different reasons why not to put something on the Wii U, difficulty of production is not one. Look at the PS3, at first it was said to be difficult to develop games on but now almost all 3rd Party games are on both the PS3 and 360.

That was a much different situation. The architecture of the PS3 was really powerful, just awkwardly designed. Don't count on the Wii U sharing the same fate and getting a bunch of multiplat games.

Even if the Wii U wasn't awkward to develop for, the Ps4 and X1 are a lot more alike, therefore it makes sense to focus on making one game to accommodate two consoles opposed to just one. Devs aren't going to take games like The Witcher 3 and Battlefield 4 and dumb them down graphically and physically to fit on the Wii U. (Though according to SCAR, these games would look just as good if not better!)

I am not expecting 3rd Party but I am remaining hopeful. I know Xbone and PS4 games would not be the same if ported to Wii U but I do think the difference will be a lot less than when porting from 360 to Wii.

Edited on by DefHalan

http://dudehugespeaks.tumblr.com/post/44243746261/nickels-dimes-and-quarters
http://www.penny-arcade.com/patv/episode/why-console-specs-dont-matter
http://www.gamasutra.com/view/news/200271/Video_Don_Daglow_on_nextgen_transition_traps_and_treasures.php

3DS Friend Code: 2621-2786-9784 | Nintendo Network ID: DefHalan

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AlexSays

106. Posted:

SCAR392 wrote:

Game DVR = Mario Kart TV(similar use for other software possible)
Cloud = firmware, storage location may vary
Cross game chat = apparently that's Skype
Voice commands = possible
Subscription = possible

There's more to the success of a console than specs.

You honestly think the Wii U can be updated to share the same cloud technology that Microsoft and Sony have incorporated into the hardware? And you think voice commands can just be updated into the hardware as well?

What drastic update did the Wii have that leads you to believe Nintendo is going to make miracles happen with the Wii U? Just once I'd like some support or evidence for 'facts' you're always posting.

Edited on by AlexSays

AlexSays

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CanisWolfred

107. Posted:

DefHalan wrote:

CanisWolfred wrote:

@DefHalan Indies don't have to release big budget games on a yearly basis. They don't have to have hundreds of Staff learn the ins and outs of it, just a dozen or so at most.

True but if it was actually difficult Indies wouldn't waste their time as they do not have guaranteed paychecks. There are many different reasons why not to put something on the Wii U, difficulty of production is not one. Look at the PS3, at first it was said to be difficult to develop games on but now almost all 3rd Party games are on both the PS3 and 360.

And there were developers who weren't supporting the PS3 at first because the PS3 was so difficult to develop for, and we saw inferior ports for a while. Then the PS3 was selling more and more, developers learned the ins and outs and came up with tricks to help things along, and now things are much easier. That's the thing, though, they had to learn it. As AlexSays has said, developers think that the Wii U won't be worth the learning curve.

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SCAR392

108. Posted:

AlexSays wrote:

SCAR392 wrote:

Game DVR = Mario Kart TV(similar use for other software possible)
Cloud = firmware, storage location may vary
Cross game chat = apparently that's Skype
Voice commands = possible
Subscription = possible

There's more to the success of a console than specs.

You honestly think the Wii U can be updated to share the same cloud technology that Microsoft and Sony have incorporated into the hardware? And you think voice commands can just be updated into the hardware as well?

What drastic update did the Wii have that leads you to believe Nintendo is going to make miracles happen with the Wii U? Just once I'd like some support or evidence for 'facts' you're always posting.

Spotpass is basically cloud. You can see Miiverse posts from the network in game. NSMB.U uses cloud via Spotpass. Same thing with 3DS using Swapnote. Your message is just floating around on the network until someone accesses it.
Also, there's a microphone in the GamePad, so ya, I think voice commands are possible.

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AlexSays

109. Posted:

Just yesterday this was posted on THIS site. Linky

SCAR, how can you read this from an actual developer supportive of the Wii U, and look at a survey of developers saying the Wii U is hard to develop for, and say for a fact the Wii U isn't hard to develop for and is dev-friendly?

Ubisoft is hesitant to release a game on the Wii U, and you think Bungie (who has never cared for Nintendo systems) is going to spend millions of dollars making a MMO work on the console?

AlexSays

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AlexSays

110. Posted:

SCAR392 wrote:

Spotpass is basically cloud. You can see Miiverse posts from the network in game. NSMB.U uses cloud via Spotpass. Same thing with 3DS using Swapnote. Your message is just floating around on the network until someone accesses it.
Also, there's a microphone in the GamePad, so ya, I think voice commands are possible.

There's literally no getting through to you. The cloud based technology for the X1 is shown as recording driving habits and configuring AI to challenge you in an entirely new way. Sony has mentioned streaming classic titles via Gaikai through the cloud.

What evidence do you have that the Wii U is capable of this, other than 'a message floating around'?

And having a microphone in the game pad automatically makes the console receptive to voice recognition? Tell me from a hardware perspective, how does the Wii U recognize voice controls without absolutely any programming?

Also, what was that update that did magical things on the Wii? I'm still missing that one.

AlexSays

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SCAR392

111. Posted:

AlexSays wrote:

Just yesterday this was posted on THIS site. Linky

SCAR, how can you read this from an actual developer supportive of the Wii U, and look at a survey of developers saying the Wii U is hard to develop for, and say for a fact the Wii U isn't hard to develop for and is dev-friendly?

Ubisoft is hesitant to release a game on the Wii U, and you think Bungie (who has never cared for Nintendo systems) is going to spend millions of dollars making a MMO work on the console?

Wii U ports cost under $1.3 to port. http://www.gamesindustry.biz/articles/2012-07-23-ubisoft-says...
They aren't investing money for Wii U games at all, unless it's exclusive. So a PS4 port would cost under $1.3 million to port.
The process costs the same either way.

Plus, Sony is requiring remote play. That's a feature Nintendo no longer has to push themselves. Sony did work for Nintendo by making that decision.

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Varia01

112. Posted:

I agree with you, people are complaining too early about the Wii U. It is just a matter of patience before Nintendo turns the tide of the competition. I highly agree with you on the benefits of the Wii U that th Xbox One and PS4 don't have. Backwards compatibility and free online are delivering major satisfaction to me. You can see in my signature that I still like to play Wii games. There are some Wii games I can't believe I sold and that I am unlikely to get back (Super Mario Galaxy 1 and 2, Skyward Sword, Super Smash Bros Brawl). I HATE paid online. I love Miiverse and I constantly post on it, so if Nintendo Network had to be paid for, I'd really hate it! The price drop this early is a seriously crazy demand. The Wii took a few years to drop in price, but the Wii U is already receiving price drop demands. Nintendo put a lot of hard work making the Wii U and deserves the money for how complex it is. I perfectly agree with post 1. Well said, man.

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Even though I have beaten many of the games I'm still playing, I play them not to win, but to have fun.

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SCAR392

113. Posted:

AlexSays wrote:

SCAR392 wrote:

Spotpass is basically cloud. You can see Miiverse posts from the network in game. NSMB.U uses cloud via Spotpass. Same thing with 3DS using Swapnote. Your message is just floating around on the network until someone accesses it.
Also, there's a microphone in the GamePad, so ya, I think voice commands are possible.

There's literally no getting through to you. The cloud based technology for the X1 is shown as recording driving habits and configuring AI to challenge you in an entirely new way. Sony has mentioned streaming classic titles via Gaikai through the cloud.

What evidence do you have that the Wii U is capable of this, other than 'a message floating around'?

And having a microphone in the game pad automatically makes the console receptive to voice recognition? Tell me from a hardware perspective, how does the Wii U recognize voice controls without absolutely any programming?

Also, what was that update that did magical things on the Wii? I'm still missing that one.

You're going to have to program voice recognition regardless. The hardware can handle voice recognition. The firmware is what applies voice commands.
So ya, Wii U can do voice recognition and cloud via spotpass. Whether Nintendo determines the importance of such features is a different story.

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AlexSays

114. Posted:

So putting Destiny on the PS4 is just as expensive as putting it on the Wii U?

Please show me this. For the millionth time, why aren't there more developers developing for the Wii U? According to you, there is no power difference and the Wii U isn't hard to develop for.

Please tell me what is stopping people from developing Wii U games. Or are there just hundreds of games in development we don't know about? I'm guessing GTA5, Bioshock Infinite, Destiny, Battlefield 4 are all in the process of being ported to the Wii U, correct?

And great, the voice recognition and cloud technology integrated in the other consoles can just easily be updated into the Wii U. Well thank the lord Nintendo is so far ahead of everyone else technologically.

Edited on by AlexSays

AlexSays

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SCAR392

115. Posted:

AlexSays wrote:

So putting Destiny on the PS4 is just as expensive as putting it on the Wii U?

Please show me this. For the millionth time, why aren't there more developers developing for the Wii U? According to you, there is no power difference and the Wii U isn't hard to develop for.

Please tell me what is stopping people from developing Wii U games. Or are there just hundreds of games in development we don't know about? I'm guessing GTA5, Bioshock Infinite, Destiny, Battlefield 4 are all in the process of being ported to the Wii U, correct?

In otherwords, it would cost $1.3 million to port a game to Wii U.
If Destiny costs, say, $25 million to develop, that extra $1.3 million won't keep developers from porting the game to potentially double their sales on one more viable platform.
Sonic Racing wasn't even originally a Wii U game. Sega ported it for roughly $1.3 million(according to Ubisoft), and got 25% of it's sales from the Wii U version.

EDIT: They don't have to develop a game for Wii U per se. All they have to do is port a game for $1.3 million, and that automatically opens more ways to make revenue on a console they didn't invest any real time into, besides the porting process.

Edited on by SCAR392

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AlexSays

116. Posted:

For the millionth and oneth time, if it is so easy and cheap, why is everyone not doing it?

AlexSays

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DefHalan

117. Posted:

SCAR392 wrote:

AlexSays wrote:

So putting Destiny on the PS4 is just as expensive as putting it on the Wii U?

Please show me this. For the millionth time, why aren't there more developers developing for the Wii U? According to you, there is no power difference and the Wii U isn't hard to develop for.

Please tell me what is stopping people from developing Wii U games. Or are there just hundreds of games in development we don't know about? I'm guessing GTA5, Bioshock Infinite, Destiny, Battlefield 4 are all in the process of being ported to the Wii U, correct?

In otherwords, it would cost $1.3 million to port a game to Wii U.
If Destiny costs, say, $25 million to develop, that extra $1.3 million won't keep developers from porting the game to potentially double their sales on one more viable platform.
Sonic Racing wasn't even originally a Wii U game. Sega ported it for roughly $1.3 million(according to Ubisoft), and got 25% of it's sales from the Wii U version.

The only problem with that is that it cost Ubisoft $1.3 Million to port it. Destiny and other games are made differently. It most likely is not as easy as writing a check for $1.3 Million and receiving a Wii U version of any game chosen. Are their enough Wii U owners to justify spending $1.3 Million? Of those Wii U owners will enough buy it on Wii U to justify spending $1.3 Million? Of those Wii U owners that would buy it on Wii U do they not have another console in which they would buy that game to justify a Wii U version? Nintendo needs to work on getting a bigger install base and Wii U owners need to show that 3rd Party will be supported on Wii U.

http://dudehugespeaks.tumblr.com/post/44243746261/nickels-dimes-and-quarters
http://www.penny-arcade.com/patv/episode/why-console-specs-dont-matter
http://www.gamasutra.com/view/news/200271/Video_Don_Daglow_on_nextgen_transition_traps_and_treasures.php

3DS Friend Code: 2621-2786-9784 | Nintendo Network ID: DefHalan

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SCAR392

118. Posted:

AlexSays wrote:

For the millionth and oneth time, if it is so easy and cheap, why is everyone not doing it?

3rd parties don't have anything in development besides PS4 and Xbox One games.
All they have to do is make a game for one of those platforms, then port it for Wii U for $1.3 milion.

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AlexSays

119. Posted:

SCAR392 wrote:

AlexSays wrote:

For the millionth and oneth time, if it is so easy and cheap, why is everyone not doing it?

3rd parties don't have anything in development besides PS4 and Xbox One games.
All they have to do is make a game for one of those platforms, then port it for Wii U for $1.3 milion.

And your excuse for games like Bioshock Infinite is? Metro Last Light? Why are games releasing in the past six months not being ported?

You realize GTA 5 isn't coming to the new consoles right? They're only releasing it on the PS3 and 360. Why aren't they making a Wii U version if its so easy and cheap?

Also I love how you think every game costs the exact same amount to port.

Edited on by AlexSays

AlexSays

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SCAR392

120. Posted:

DefHalan wrote:

SCAR392 wrote:

AlexSays wrote:

So putting Destiny on the PS4 is just as expensive as putting it on the Wii U?

Please show me this. For the millionth time, why aren't there more developers developing for the Wii U? According to you, there is no power difference and the Wii U isn't hard to develop for.

Please tell me what is stopping people from developing Wii U games. Or are there just hundreds of games in development we don't know about? I'm guessing GTA5, Bioshock Infinite, Destiny, Battlefield 4 are all in the process of being ported to the Wii U, correct?

In otherwords, it would cost $1.3 million to port a game to Wii U.
If Destiny costs, say, $25 million to develop, that extra $1.3 million won't keep developers from porting the game to potentially double their sales on one more viable platform.
Sonic Racing wasn't even originally a Wii U game. Sega ported it for roughly $1.3 million(according to Ubisoft), and got 25% of it's sales from the Wii U version.

The only problem with that is that it cost Ubisoft $1.3 Million to port it. Destiny and other games are made differently. It most likely is not as easy as writing a check for $1.3 Million and receiving a Wii U version of any game chosen. Are their enough Wii U owners to justify spending $1.3 Million? Of those Wii U owners will enough buy it on Wii U to justify spending $1.3 Million? Of those Wii U owners that would buy it on Wii U do they not have another console in which they would buy that game to justify a Wii U version? Nintendo needs to work on getting a bigger install base and Wii U owners need to show that 3rd Party will be supported on Wii U.

The porting process is different than building a game from the ground up. It doesn't matter how it was originally built if they can just convert it to a Wii U format for next to nothing compared to the money they spent to develop it in the first place.
The Wii U has a 4 million and growing install base, which will go up after 1st party games. 3rd parties would have to be fools to not invest $1.3 million or whatever to have an instant 4 million+ audience.

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