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Topic: HD Remasters

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CanisWolfred

161. Posted:

Emaan1 wrote:

@Mickeymac, so you consider games like Super Mario Bros. 3, Super Mario World, and Super Mario Galaxy overrated? :O

Yes, and I've stated this several times before. Super Mario Bros. 3 is just "not perfect", though. It's still pretty good, world 2 aside (How come I have no trouble with worlds 1, 3, and most of 4, yet 2 is freakin' impossible?!). However, I dislike Super Mario World with a firey passion. Such an obtuse and frustrating game. Super Mario Galaxy is just boring to me. It's too much like a 2D Mario for my tastes. I suppose if you like that, that's fine, but I expect a lot more out of a 3D Mario game, especially after 64 and Sunshine.

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Emaan

162. Posted:

@Chrono_Cross

Actually, Super Mario Galaxy is my favorite 3D Mario game, so I'm not blinded by anything. Super Mario 64 has its faults, but its not overrated at all. It deserves every amount of recognition it gets. You can dislike the game, but I don't see how you can claim its crap, which you had said earlier.

@Mickeymac

So, you don't like SMB3 because of how hard world 2 was for you? What? Same with Super Mario World, apparently its difficulty is supposed to take away from the experience? Somehow I don't see where that effects how good a game is. That's your opinion about Super Mario Galaxy, but many will agree that it was far from a boring Mario experience. I thought it was full of imagination, with really colorful visuals and an amazing musical score. Its such a fantastic game. I would go so far to say Super Mario Galaxy is perfect. I love it that much.

Edited on by Emaan

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Chrono_Cross

163. Posted:

@Mickey

How far did you get in Sunshine? Just wondering because I'm assuming you're better at 3D platformers than 2D, lol.

Emaan1 wrote:

@Chrono_Cross

Actually, Super Mario Galaxy is my favorite 3D Mario game, so I'm not blinded by anything. Super Mario 64 has its faults, but its not overrated at all. It deserves every amount of recognition it gets. You can dislike the game, but I don't see how you can claim its crap, which you had said earlier.

When compared to Sunshine, it is. Here is a definition for the word overrated so I don't have to keep repeating myself about what I mean by it. I've been on every Nintendo board on Gamefaqs since the GameCube days, and I've encountered many, many Mario fans and how their love burns for 64.

Edited on by Chrono_Cross

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Moorpheel

164. Posted:

I'm having the strangest deja vu right now.

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CanisWolfred

165. Posted:

Emaan1 wrote:

So, you don't like SMB3 because of how hard world 2 was for you? What?

I said the exact opposite of that. Look again: I said it's Not perfect. World 2 wasn't even the fault I was referring too, that just happened to be a very frustrating section. I don't think it's perfect because of some occasionally "off" level designs, some glitches I've encountered, and that last world is even more infuriating than World 2 at times.

Emaan1 wrote:

Same with Super Mario World, apparently its difficulty is supposed to take away from the experience? Somehow I don't see where that effects how good a game is.

Who said it was hard? I'm up to world 7 already, without using any shortcuts. I said it was obtuse and frustrating - the limited lives, having to restart the world every time I fail one lousy jump, and most importantly on every world there was something that I didn't know how to do, and had to look up online. What if it was 1992 and I didn't have the internet? What, was I supposed to get the Guide book if I wanted to have any hope of finishing this game?! Thank G-d for the internet, but I still hate asking for advice, and every time I did, I ended up cursing the developers when I found out it was something I could never figure out on my own! I hate that. That type of moon logic is the reason I gave up playing Point 'n' clicks for the longest time. The last thing I need is to find it in a platformer. That's strictly bad design in my book.

Emaan1 wrote:

That's your opinion about Super Mario Galaxy,

Did I ever say it wasn't? Oh right, I said the word "overrated" which people use to mean their opinion is better than everyone else's, when all it really means is that I disagree with everyone else. This is why I hate that word and will be using it very sparingly from now on.

Emaan1 wrote:

but many will agree that it was far from a boring Mario experience.

Good for them, and good for you.

Emaan1 wrote:

I thought it was full of imagination, with really colorful visuals and an amazing musical score. Its such a fantastic game. I would go so far to say Super Mario Galaxy is perfect. I love it that much.

That doesn't matter to me, of course, when most of the levels are extremely linear and basic outside of the occasional gimmicks, with extremely easy boss battles (granted, every Mario game have easy boss battles, but that doesn't stop it from disappointing me every single time). I honestly couldn't get myself to play more than one level per session, because I was so bored by the end of each one. As I said before, I expected a lot more out of a 3D Mario game.

Edited on by theblackdragon

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FonistofCruxis

166. Posted:

I know this is like a page behind now but I've never understood why everyone thinks that the original Super Mario 64 is so much better than the DS version. The DS version isn't ugly, (I think SM64 has aged really badly in terms of graphics) it has more levels, more characters, multi-player and mini-games. If its the controls, sure they would've been better if the DS had an analogue stick or a circle pad but I really didn't find them that much of a problem.

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Chrono_Cross

167. Posted:

Who said it was hard? I'm up to world 7 already, without using any shortcuts. I said it was obtuse and frustrating - the limited lives, having to restart the world every time I fail one lousy jump, and most importantly on every world there was something that I didn't know how to do, and had to look up online. What if it was 1992 and I didn't have the internet? What, was I supposed to get the Guide book if I wanted to have any hope of finishing this game?! Thank G-d for the internet, but I still hate asking for advice, and every time I did, I ended up cursing the developers when I found out it was something I could never figure out on my own! I hate that. That type of moon logic is the reason I gave up playing Point 'n' clicks for the longest time. The last thing I need is to find it in a platformer. That's strictly bad design in my book.

Way to single out Super Mario World as this applies to most games of that generation. Including games such as A Link to the Past, Super Metroid and Final Fantasy.

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shingi_70

168. Posted:

FonistofCruxis wrote:

I know this is like a page behind now but I've never understood why everyone thinks that the original Super Mario 64 is so much better than the DS version. The DS version isn't ugly, (I think SM64 has aged really badly in terms of graphics) it has more levels, more characters, multi-player and mini-games. If its the controls, sure they would've been better if the DS had an analogue stick or a circle pad but I really didn't find them that much of a problem.

Super Mario 64X4 on 3DS> Super Mario 64

Same goes for Metroid Prime Hunters

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Emaan

169. Posted:

@Mickeymac

Pretty sure you're still saying the difficulty is what you didn't like about the games. Unless I confused frustrating for something else. The difficulty in Super Mario Bros. 3 is what makes it fun, since so many newer Mario games are just too easy at times. Super Mario World's secrets are what a lot of people love about the game. Complaining about how frustrating it was to look up solutions to the game's levels is one thing, but calling it bad level design is another. Since when was you not being good at a game mean its bad level design? Don't blame the developer, blame the player, which would be you. SMB3 and SMW aren't even that frustratingly difficult or confusing by the way, I finished both when I was five years old.

Just saying we went from arguing over Twilight Princess, to Mario games, and this is a thread about HD Remasters....so yeah :|

Edited on by Emaan

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Undead_terror

170. Posted:

FonistofCruxis wrote:

I know this is like a page behind now but I've never understood why everyone thinks that the original Super Mario 64 is so much better than the DS version. The DS version isn't ugly, (I think SM64 has aged really badly in terms of graphics) it has more levels, more characters, multi-player and mini-games. If its the controls, sure they would've been better if the DS had an analogue stick or a circle pad but I really didn't find them that much of a problem.

well thank god we have a 3ds,enjoy!

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CanisWolfred

171. Posted:

FonistofCruxis wrote:

I know this is like a page behind now but I've never understood why everyone thinks that the original Super Mario 64 is so much better than the DS version. The DS version isn't ugly, (I think SM64 has aged really badly in terms of graphics) it has more levels, more characters, multi-player and mini-games. If its the controls, sure they would've been better if the DS had an analogue stick or a circle pad but I really didn't find them that much of a problem.

The camera controls messed me up so bad, it ruined the entire game for me. Those are very important in 3D platformers, and the reason I can't play too many old ones. With that said, while the one in the original N64 version wasn't perfect, they were a heck of a lot better than the DS version's, IMO - I had far fewer camera-related deaths on the VC. If they could do up a Wii U version with even better graphics, all the extras, and a camera that's up to modern standards, then the game would truly be perfect.

Chrono_Cross wrote:

Who said it was hard? I'm up to world 7 already, without using any shortcuts. I said it was obtuse and frustrating - the limited lives, having to restart the world every time I fail one lousy jump, and most importantly on every world there was something that I didn't know how to do, and had to look up online. What if it was 1992 and I didn't have the internet? What, was I supposed to get the Guide book if I wanted to have any hope of finishing this game?! Thank G-d for the internet, but I still hate asking for advice, and every time I did, I ended up cursing the developers when I found out it was something I could never figure out on my own! I hate that. That type of moon logic is the reason I gave up playing Point 'n' clicks for the longest time. The last thing I need is to find it in a platformer. That's strictly bad design in my book.

Way to single out Super Mario World as this applies to most games of that generation. Including games such as A Link to the Past, Super Metroid and Final Fantasy.

Not as bad as in Super Mario World. It was beyond tolerable for me, though I will admit if I had played A Link to the Past and Super Metroid without guides, I'd probably hate them, too. :P

Emaan1 wrote:

@Mickeymac

Pretty sure you're still saying the difficulty is what you didn't like about the games. Unless I confused frustrating for something else. The difficulty in Super Mario Bros. 3 is what makes it fun, since so many newer Mario games are just too easy at times. Super Mario World's secrets are what a lot of people love about the game. Complaining about how frustrating it was to look up solutions to the game's levels is one thing, but calling it bad level design is another. Since when was you not being good at a game mean its bad level design? Don't blame the developer, blame the player, which would be you. SMB3 and SMW aren't even that frustratingly difficult or confusing by the way, I finished both when I was five years old.

It's my reasoning. Not that you have to like it, but I'm certainly not gonna change it because you said so. So what if you could beat it while you were 5? I played it when I was about that young, too, and couldn't beat it, and after all these years, I'm still encountering the same problems. There's definitely something wrong here, if you ask me. And before you say I suck at platformers, I do just fine in other games, like Mega Man, Sonic, and Castlevania. And besides, as I said, this has nothing to do with Difficulty. Even an easy game can be frustrating.

Edited on by CanisWolfred

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Emaan

172. Posted:

@Mickeymac

I understand where your coming from. There's a lot of moments in those games that can be frustrating, but that in no way means bad design on the developer's part. You're entitled to your own opinion about whether or not you like the game because of that, but I just can't agree that the games were poorly designed.

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CanisWolfred

173. Posted:

I want an online enabled Star Fox: Assault, and maybe an online-enabled F-Zero GX somewhere down the line.

Emaan1 wrote:

...but I just can't agree that the games were poorly designed.

Then we'll just have to agree to disagree, now won't we?

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Emaan

174. Posted:

Consider us as agreed to disagree :p

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V8_Ninja

175. Posted:

@Mickeymac While I don't want to combat your opinion, can you give a few examples of "Moon Logic" mechanics in Super Mario World? The only thing I can think of that matches that idea are the Ghost House levels, which were just mazes.

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Emaan

176. Posted:

He might be talking about the levels in the Forest of Illusion (World 5) those had the multiple exits.

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RevolverLink

177. Posted:

Emaan1 wrote:

Didn't know everyone would get so TOUCHY over Twilight Princess and Skyward Sword. My God...

Find a game, any game, with even the most modest of followings, and you'll undoubtedly find someone (often multiple someones) with strong, divergent opinions on it. Cheese and rice, I was recently lambasted somewhere for saying I hated Quest 64.

And when you get to older, bigger series like Zelda or Mario, it can get really messy. My God, especially in Zelda's case. Put 10 fans of the series into a room and ask them to form a universal opinion on each game, and an hour later you'll wind up with a half-dozen burning effigies, 10 corpses and a few passive aggressive notes on a whiteboard. :p

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Emaan

178. Posted:

@RevolverLink, that's so true :p

Things got pretty heated in my "What's your favorite Final Fantasy?" thread I made.

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theblackdragon

179. Posted:

Mickeymac wrote:

I said it was obtuse and frustrating - the limited lives, having to restart the world every time I fail one lousy jump, and most importantly on every world there was something that I didn't know how to do, and had to look up online. What if it was 1992 and I didn't have the internet? What, was I supposed to get the Guide book if I wanted to have any hope of finishing this game?!

You have the option now, and that's what separates your current experience from what your experience would've been back then. Contrary to popular belief, you don't have to look anything up online or splurge for a Prima guide; you're just giving in to temptation. Own your weakness.

If you need extra lives, Super Mario World uses the same 1-up mechanics from the original Super Mario Bros. game (collect 100 coins, kill 8+ enemies with one shell/jump on 8+ enemies without touching the ground) plus more (carry an item past the finish line, win them in special areas, etc.) and actually makes it all easier for you to exploit with the 're-enter a level, get 1-ups, press start and select to exit, wipe hands, repeat' process. If I remember correctly, this was all explained in the instruction manual for the game when it originally came out, so there's no excuse for not having known these things, whether now (with the help of Dr. Internet) or back in the day.

Once you've got enough lives, exploring the levels is a piece of cake — Super Mario World even goes out of its way to make it easier for you with the saved powerup at the top of the screen, mid-level checkpoints, the red-marked levels denoting multiple exits, and the ability to re-enter beaten levels to pick up powerups and/or a Yoshi if necessary before entering a particularly difficult level. You not taking the time to explore the levels to their fullest is not the fault of the developers, nor does it make the level design 'bad' in and of itself.

If you're truly that bad at 2D Mario games, one tip I always like to pass on is 'just run'. If you're quick enough, you can run (or fly) through just about every level (aside from the underwater ones and the ones that automatically scroll, and in terms of flying there's a couple levels that have pipes that go all the way up and cut the level in half). After that, practice makes perfect. If you'd get into the right frame of mnd as opposed to trying to slog through it, hating every step, you'd probably get a lot farther.

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Odnetnin

180. Posted:

skywake wrote:

Wind Waker scales pretty well, would benefit from the Wii U controller and is crying out for 16:9

And here I thought Wind Waker was the only 3D Zelda game that couldn't be improved visually. Wow.

Edited on by Odnetnin

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